Are you still deciding between UW and Esper pumpmonkey? I have really liked UW so far. The deck feels much stronger to me this season with Seal Away and Teferi, Hero of Dominaria. Lyra Dawnbringer can win games on her own and completely change the momentum of a game with her angelic 10-point swings. There's a lot to like.
The new counters I don't quite get; Negate and Disallow seem just fine to me.
A couple of pages back I wrote something like "We'll have to test it, but I don't think Teferi will be all that good."
Yeah...that was about the wrongiest wrong I've ever wronged.
Maybe just a little...
@Hobbits73 - leaning towards straight UW but have been playing just control without Approach. 2-3 Teferi and 4 Gearhulks so far have been very strong. I know this is an Approach primer, so may have to sit down and write one up for just UWx Control.
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Modern
Currently Playing UW UW Control/Miracles R Skred Red
A couple of pages back I wrote something like "We'll have to test it, but I don't think Teferi will be all that good."
Yeah...that was about the wrongiest wrong I've ever wronged.
Maybe just a little...
@Hobbits73 - leaning towards straight UW but have been playing just control without Approach. 2-3 Teferi and 4 Gearhulks so far have been very strong. I know this is an Approach primer, so may have to sit down and write one up for just UWx Control.
I have to agree. Going forward I believe approach will have to go towards some form of grave hate in 2 to 3 scavenging grounds to combat opposing 4x gearhulks.
In addition I think history of benalia is an excellent sideboard option for this new draw go style control. UW is definitely the deck to beat and I believe UWx approach has the tools to combat it
*EDIT*
Upon further review, first place decklist running 61 cards. This "new control" is breaking all the norms.
UCHIHA ITACHI FLOWCHART
1) Genjutsu before battle. Did it work? if yes go to 3 If not go to 2
2) Tsukuyomi if worked go to 7 if not go to 4
3) Attack the confused enemy. If it worked, go to 7, if not go to 2
4) Ninjutsu. If it worked go to 7 if not go to 5
5) Amaterasu. If it worked go to 7, if not go to 6
6) Susano'o. If it worked go to 7, If not go to 8
7) Itachi wins
8) Itachi loses
I love UW control. Have done since I got to play FoW and Kjeldoran Outpost and Approach is probably the best finisher we've ever been offered. I am not convinced putting the Approaches away is going to make us stronger. I already run two Gearhulks in the main, but I almost never even try to protect them. Abrade? OK. Bye GH. They really function as flashback on another spell I want/need and, if I'm lucky, an occasional block. Running more of them just turns on Vraska's Contempt and all the other nonsense cluttering up our oppo's hands. I don't want to fight them on their ground: creatures. Approach fights them on ground they aren't prepared for.
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Some people like to win MtG matches in the Red Zone. I prefer to win the way God intended: on the stack.
@kPal depends on the deck. If you are running a straight control deck with gearhulk/teferi, then it makes more sense, you can bounce/draw your dude to protect it or one of theirs to try and counter it later. In an Approach deck, I think just spot removal would be better, so far really liking Gideon's Reproach.
I hope you guys like playing control mirrors, SCG Classic Standard - Atlanta - 04/29/201. 7 of the top 16 decks were control. 3 were Approach decks, 3 were UW Control. It is going to be a very interesting Standard.
Also some super secret sideboard tech - Gideon's Defeat, something tells me this is going to become very relevant now. But don't tell anyone, it is still a secret.
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Modern
Currently Playing UW UW Control/Miracles R Skred Red
Wastes an opponent's turn, stalls their aggro game, stalls Sagas/planeswalkers, removes growing hatebears, can draws a card in mid/late game. I'm thinking of removing two essence scatters and putting two Blinks in there.
I'm running a UW Approach of the Superfriends deck that gets really bothersome when at least two of them (Karn, Gideon, Teferi, and Dovin Baan) resolve. I haven't tested it in a competitive format, but it looks promising. Though what I've done is run the original sideboard (a midrange deck that wins with Helm'd Regals, Lyra, or Nezahal) as the mainboard, then sideboarded into Approach of the Superfriends. I'm going to go to FNM some time soon and test it out. If anyone's interested I'll post the decklist here.
Hey guys, this deck looks like a load of fun and I am considering buying into it. Before I do so, I wanna ask 2 questions.
I see three types of UW running around, Control, Approach and Flash (with Raff). What are the main differences between the versions, which one is the best deck in your opinion? I am concerned only having 4 Gearhulks as a win condition in straight control, seems like this deck has trouble closing out the game, I guess this is an advantage of Approach?
What is the reason for including a card like History of Benalia? Is it a special SB tech, because a 4 of seems a lot, almost like a transformational SB plan.
Thanks for helping me out!
Hey guys, this deck looks like a load of fun and I am considering buying into it. Before I do so, I wanna ask 2 questions.
I see three types of UW running around, Control, Approach and Flash (with Raff). What are the main differences between the versions, which one is the best deck in your opinion? I am concerned only having 4 Gearhulks as a win condition in straight control, seems like this deck has trouble closing out the game, I guess this is an advantage of Approach?
What is the reason for including a card like History of Benalia? Is it a special SB tech, because a 4 of seems a lot, almost like a transformational SB plan.
Thanks for helping me out!
UW flash has a surprise factor because it is relatively new and people are still learning to combat it. It does have its flaws but it is strong. I feel flash should be esper because flashing in deathtouch Gonti is strong as hell. But Flash is in its infancy. Flash IMO trumps straight control but I believe has a disadvantage to approach.
UW control is very consistent but is surely. In the mirrors whoever casts gearhulk first and gets theirs countered usually loses so its a lot of draw go bluff. Will probably come down to Ip mill. Has decent game against approach but struggles against flash pressure. Requires patience and a poker face to play because you want have all answers and will have to bluff.
Approach imo is the best of the three. Fairly consistent gameplan with an win button. Some decks just can't do anything against it as well as you can go approach into approach without fear, and you have SB options on what you want to do when legacy and duress come in. Options are great
TLDR:
None are the strongest per se but requires knowledge of meta and your local scene. For me lots of aggro so I'll play flash so I can insta speed some Lyra and whoop ass. If I was going to a big tourney I would do approach UW or esper without hesitation
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UCHIHA ITACHI FLOWCHART
1) Genjutsu before battle. Did it work? if yes go to 3 If not go to 2
2) Tsukuyomi if worked go to 7 if not go to 4
3) Attack the confused enemy. If it worked, go to 7, if not go to 2
4) Ninjutsu. If it worked go to 7 if not go to 5
5) Amaterasu. If it worked go to 7, if not go to 6
6) Susano'o. If it worked go to 7, If not go to 8
7) Itachi wins
8) Itachi loses
Wastes an opponent's turn, stalls their aggro game, stalls Sagas/planeswalkers, removes growing hatebears, can draws a card in mid/late game. I'm thinking of removing two essence scatters and putting two Blinks in there.
I'm running a UW Approach of the Superfriends deck that gets really bothersome when at least two of them (Karn, Gideon, Teferi, and Dovin Baan) resolve. I haven't tested it in a competitive format, but it looks promising. Though what I've done is run the original sideboard (a midrange deck that wins with Helm'd Regals, Lyra, or Nezahal) as the mainboard, then sideboarded into Approach of the Superfriends. I'm going to go to FNM some time soon and test it out. If anyone's interested I'll post the decklist here.
UW flash has a surprise factor because it is relatively new and people are still learning to combat it. It does have its flaws but it is strong. I feel flash should be esper because flashing in deathtouch Gonti is strong as hell. But Flash is in its infancy. Flash IMO trumps straight control but I believe has a disadvantage to approach.
UW control is very consistent but is surely. In the mirrors whoever casts gearhulk first and gets theirs countered usually loses so its a lot of draw go bluff. Will probably come down to Ip mill. Has decent game against approach but struggles against flash pressure. Requires patience and a poker face to play because you want have all answers and will have to bluff.
Approach imo is the best of the three. Fairly consistent gameplan with an win button. Some decks just can't do anything against it as well as you can go approach into approach without fear, and you have SB options on what you want to do when legacy and duress come in. Options are great
TLDR:
None are the strongest per se but requires knowledge of meta and your local scene. For me lots of aggro so I'll play flash so I can insta speed some Lyra and whoop ass. If I was going to a big tourney I would do approach UW or esper without hesitation
Thanks for the answer! I don't really know my new meta yet but I am kind of more drawn to Approach. What do you think about History of Benalia as a sideboard option/plan? What matchups would you bring them in?
Hey guys, this deck looks like a load of fun and I am considering buying into it. Before I do so, I wanna ask 2 questions.
I see three types of UW running around, Control, Approach and Flash (with Raff). What are the main differences between the versions, which one is the best deck in your opinion? I am concerned only having 4 Gearhulks as a win condition in straight control, seems like this deck has trouble closing out the game, I guess this is an advantage of Approach?
What is the reason for including a card like History of Benalia? Is it a special SB tech, because a 4 of seems a lot, almost like a transformational SB plan.
Thanks for helping me out!
UW flash has a surprise factor because it is relatively new and people are still learning to combat it. It does have its flaws but it is strong. I feel flash should be esper because flashing in deathtouch Gonti is strong as hell. But Flash is in its infancy. Flash IMO trumps straight control but I believe has a disadvantage to approach.
UW control is very consistent but is surely. In the mirrors whoever casts gearhulk first and gets theirs countered usually loses so its a lot of draw go bluff. Will probably come down to Ip mill. Has decent game against approach but struggles against flash pressure. Requires patience and a poker face to play because you want have all answers and will have to bluff.
Approach imo is the best of the three. Fairly consistent gameplan with an win button. Some decks just can't do anything against it as well as you can go approach into approach without fear, and you have SB options on what you want to do when legacy and duress come in. Options are great
TLDR:
None are the strongest per se but requires knowledge of meta and your local scene. For me lots of aggro so I'll play flash so I can insta speed some Lyra and whoop ass. If I was going to a big tourney I would do approach UW or esper without hesitation
How easy it is to Sideboard switch among these different UW Decks?
So, I went to a big tourney on Sunday and in the new meta went 0-3 drop. It was the first time for me to play this deck in over a month, I haven't been to a store for FNM since sometime in March, also the past two weeks I've been addicted to mtg Arena and this deck is not one of the ones that I have on there to test play.
In the first round I lost to a B/G saproling deck, I just couldn't draw any Fumigates and only drew one Settle in two games and obviously 1 for 1 removal doesn't work against saprolings very well at all. That's not that surprising, also I was also mana flooded in game 1 too with about 9 lands and 5 other cards played in the whole game.
In the second round I lost to the U/W/B Esper approach, I won the first game but I lost the next 2. One reason is that my sideboard was a mess, I was testing a new idea and it didn't work at all. I did experience the opp's TEferi going ultimate and bouncing back all my permanents for the win. I believe main deck he was only playing Teferi and Lyra Dawnbringer as win conditions. It was not hard to deal with Lyra between seal away, settle and cast out and of course, essence scatter and other counterspells. However, I only had 2 cast outs in the deck as an answer to teferi so after he came down it was over.
In the third round I faced the mirror match again, a U/W approach deck and I won the first game again...my main deck is not changed since last month except for changing baffling end with seal away so that's why I was winning the first games in mirror matches. In the second and third games he brought in a lot of creatures, including Shalai, Lyra, and angel of sanctions as well as Gideon and Teferi. I again used my messed up sideboard so although I tried to hang on a long time, I managed to cast approach in the 2nd game, but the next turn he dropped Gideon and made an emblem and the turn after that he dropped Shalai to protect him and I was basically locked out of the game right there.
I didn't expect to face these decks in the first 3 rounds and since my sideboard was sketchy I'm not surprised that I didn't win the 2nd and 3rd games. What I did learn is that Teferi can be dangerous if you can't counter or get rid of him after he hits the board, of course, he was good against my control deck but I have no idea how he would be against an aggro deck.
As for Lyra Dawnbringer she didn't really get to hit me since the deck has so many ways to get rid of creatures, and of course she's good to drop against another control deck especially if she's protected by Shalai but against aggro I don't think she would do much.
I will, of course, keep playing this deck but I do need to rethink the whole sideboard, hopefully, when metagame gets settled it will be easier to figure out a solid sideboard, and I can change the deck to how I want it in September when Approach is rotating out. The deck really needs a stable metagame to shine so that we know what to play in the sideboard.
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Hey guys, this deck looks like a load of fun and I am considering buying into it. Before I do so, I wanna ask 2 questions.
I see three types of UW running around, Control, Approach and Flash (with Raff). What are the main differences between the versions, which one is the best deck in your opinion? I am concerned only having 4 Gearhulks as a win condition in straight control, seems like this deck has trouble closing out the game, I guess this is an advantage of Approach?
What is the reason for including a card like History of Benalia? Is it a special SB tech, because a 4 of seems a lot, almost like a transformational SB plan.
Thanks for helping me out!
UW flash has a surprise factor because it is relatively new and people are still learning to combat it. It does have its flaws but it is strong. I feel flash should be esper because flashing in deathtouch Gonti is strong as hell. But Flash is in its infancy. Flash IMO trumps straight control but I believe has a disadvantage to approach.
UW control is very consistent but is surely. In the mirrors whoever casts gearhulk first and gets theirs countered usually loses so its a lot of draw go bluff. Will probably come down to Ip mill. Has decent game against approach but struggles against flash pressure. Requires patience and a poker face to play because you want have all answers and will have to bluff.
Approach imo is the best of the three. Fairly consistent gameplan with an win button. Some decks just can't do anything against it as well as you can go approach into approach without fear, and you have SB options on what you want to do when legacy and duress come in. Options are great
TLDR:
None are the strongest per se but requires knowledge of meta and your local scene. For me lots of aggro so I'll play flash so I can insta speed some Lyra and whoop ass. If I was going to a big tourney I would do approach UW or esper without hesitation
How easy it is to Sideboard switch among these different UW Decks?
My SB is 4 hero of benalia, 3 Lyra, 3 negate, 3 forsake the worldly, 2 flash captain for historic (forget his name)
Against control I ignore Lyra but go 4 history 3 negate and 2 flash captain. Makes the deck more aggressive and an unanswered hero can win the game by itself.
Flash captain puts pressure and allows EOT Walker shenanigans. That's my plan at least
UCHIHA ITACHI FLOWCHART
1) Genjutsu before battle. Did it work? if yes go to 3 If not go to 2
2) Tsukuyomi if worked go to 7 if not go to 4
3) Attack the confused enemy. If it worked, go to 7, if not go to 2
4) Ninjutsu. If it worked go to 7 if not go to 5
5) Amaterasu. If it worked go to 7, if not go to 6
6) Susano'o. If it worked go to 7, If not go to 8
7) Itachi wins
8) Itachi loses
Do you guys ever side Approaches out postboard to surprise your opponent? Can we even afford to do that?
For sure, especially against decks that run black or blue. It's tough to resolve a 7-mana sorcery post-board, so getting the win through Caracals, Gearhulks, Gideon, or Ipnu Rivulet is much more feasible than Approaching. I usually keep at least 1 in for that instant-win potential, but I find creatures to be much more effective for the win.
I'm still muddling my way through the meta and different builds to see what feels best. Raff Capashen, Ship's Mage is a card that slipped under the radar for me during spoilers, but this past weekend's results demonstrate the power of operating at instant speed in ways that the meta might not be prepared for.
The cards that I'll be trying out (many of which shouldn't be surprising):
Search for Azcanta: flashing this in at EOT is just...amazing. It's always been good in Approach decks, and it's even better with flash.
Gonti, Lord of Luxury: I know I'm not the only one whose stomach churns when this is cast against me. There's a ton of power going around in decks lately, and Gonti allows you to access the power of your opponent's deck, and an instant speed deathtoucher is nutty.
Noxious Gearhulk: Kill a dude, get some life, have a 5/4 menace beater at your disposal at instant speed. Like it.
Liliana, Death's Majesty: She's not my favorite PW, but bringing back your good ETB dudes seems good.
The Mirari Conjecture: I think this has a ton of potential in the right esper build. Getting extra value from your counterspells, doomfalls, Cast Downs, etc., and then doubling them can be very powerful.
Rite of Belzenlok: could be more danger than it's worth because he needs to eat creatures, but it's only 4-mana, and 6/6 flample is no joke. Also, gumming up the board with little duders is a good thing.
Helm of the Host: You guys, this card is BROKEN in limited, and I think it should warrant attention in constructed. Especially when you can flash it in at EOT and activate it the next turn, ideally on one of the sweet ETB creatures on your board (Gonti, Noxious, Torrential, etc.).
Azor, the Lawbringer: The deck I envision is more UB than w (white is mostly for Approach and Seal Away with some artifact/enchantment hate in the SB), so I'm leery of a WW creature, but is a huge body and silences them for their next turn.
Urza's Ruinous Blast and Yawgmoth's Vile Offering: The former is a nonbo with Seal Away or other enchantment-based removal, but these two spells at instant speed are as good as it gets.
A couple final thoughts. First, it sure seems like 1-2 Sorcerous Spyglass main wouldn't be incorrect to combat all the Karns, Teferis, and Walking Ballistas out there. I'm so sick of Walking Ballista...
Second, if Karn or other artifacts become ubiquitous, Ceremonious Rejection will get a lot better and could warrant SB consideration.
My game plan is to bring in 2 Gideon, 2 Dawnbringer Angel, and leave in 2 Suns against UB based decks.
That sounds like how I "approach" the blue matchups. I am not sure though if I want to side out all aproaches and go all in on 4 History of Benalia, 3 Dawnbringer Angel and 2 gearhulks. Sounds like a good plan in theory, plus sideboarding becomes really difficult for your opp in game 3.
What kind of removal do you leave in against other UW decks? Settles and Fumigates definitely come out, right? I leave in some seal away and all Cast outs.
Wastes an opponent's turn, stalls their aggro game, stalls Sagas/planeswalkers, removes growing hatebears, can draws a card in mid/late game. I'm thinking of removing two essence scatters and putting two Blinks in there.
I'm running a UW Approach of the Superfriends deck that gets really bothersome when at least two of them (Karn, Gideon, Teferi, and Dovin Baan) resolve. I haven't tested it in a competitive format, but it looks promising. Though what I've done is run the original sideboard (a midrange deck that wins with Helm'd Regals, Lyra, or Nezahal) as the mainboard, then sideboarded into Approach of the Superfriends. I'm going to go to FNM some time soon and test it out. If anyone's interested I'll post the decklist here.
yes. We are interested. Post it.
And where the heck has Xman been?
It's not optimized and I want to change some things in it. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
I am not sure why people like History of Benalia. That card seems so meh to me. It occupies space in the deck that I think is better dedicated to Gideon and other wincons. Right now, if I feel the need, I run Sunscourge Champion. The casting cost is better as it only required W2 rather than WW1 and it can offer pretty much everything HoB offers. In fact, I think it offers significantly more, as the matchups I want it in, it gains me 6 life, while the HoB's top end bonus is to buff 2/2s that I won't be attacking with anyway. It's significantly better against aggro and control. Can anyone help me understand why HoB doesn't suck?
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Some people like to win MtG matches in the Red Zone. I prefer to win the way God intended: on the stack.
So, I see what you mean, by "it's not optimised." ;-)
I do have some initial thoughts for you.
1) You need more focus. You have a bunch of really odd quantities for your cards and in many ways UW is very forgiving of that, but the reality is that you will struggle for consistency. For example: You are better off running another Cast Out in the Invoke slot. Cast out hits artifacts/enchantments, but is more versatile. The lifegain is not relevant. What are you going to use it against? Bromat Courier? Ballista? Yeah, that's not going to do much for you. Heart is certainly a live target for you as is Harvester, but Cast Out is legit here and you should be running more Seal Aways for that anyway.
2) I'm not going to fuss about your counter suite. Counters are counters and as long as they are getting the job done, that's all that matters. I would run more Disallows over Unwind though, and prolly bump up Essence Scatter over Negate -- at least in the MD.
3) Your removal is a mess. In this format, you should have 4 Settles. Things are already looking very, very aggro. I already mentioned Seal Away. Run 4. You need to interact with aggro decks as soon as you can.
4) Helm of the Host: I get what you are trying to do here, and it's...cute. This card costs four to cast and 5 to equip. Is it amazing if you can make it happen? Sure. But IMHO this is a stunt best left in your EDH deck.
5) Zhalfirin Void: If you are going to run lands that don't produce coloured mana then they are either Field of Ruin, Scavenger Grounds or Arch of Orazca. Nothing else gets a slot. And you should probably not run more than 4 of these in any combination. You want UU of T3 for Disallow and WW on T4 for Settle. That doesn't leave a lot of room for lands that don't help you out with your colours.
6) Wincons: If you are going to win with dorks, then you are going to need some more of them. Lyra +1, Raff +2 and Gearhulk + 2. The reason the creature-based UW control deck is winning right now is because it does everything on it's oppo's turn and sits back on counters and removal for everything else. Your current list wants to survive for awhile and then cast a big, vulnerable dork.
7) Transitional Superfriends Board: There is absolutely nothng wrng with playing control G1 and then switching into Approach for G2. Most of us are doing this the other way round, so you might run into people who think you are playing approach and SB for that anyway (just because they didn't see it, doesn't mean they can ignore it) which will hurt you. The PWs are okay, but again, you need more consistency. Personally, I am a big fan of Dovin Baan. I played him in 4C cntrol last year and really liked him. He's not in my deck now only because Teferi and Gideon are much, much better and because 4 mana is an awkward CC in the current meta. So...more Teferi. Also...unless you are planning to do something with the energy...consider replacing the Glimmers with Hieroglyphic Illumination. Depends on how much you value the scry over the flexiblity of cycling if you are mana screwed.
Last thought: lands -- you need more W sources. Remember what I said about needing ww on T4 for Settle.
I hope this is helpful.
/M
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Some people like to win MtG matches in the Red Zone. I prefer to win the way God intended: on the stack.
So, I see what you mean, by "it's not optimised." ;-)
I do have some initial thoughts for you.
1) You need more focus. You have a bunch of really odd quantities for your cards and in many ways UW is very forgiving of that, but the reality is that you will struggle for consistency. For example: You are better off running another Cast Out in the Invoke slot. Cast out hits artifacts/enchantments, but is more versatile. The lifegain is not relevant. What are you going to use it against? Bromat Courier? Ballista? Yeah, that's not going to do much for you. Heart is certainly a live target for you as is Harvester, but Cast Out is legit here and you should be running more Seal Aways for that anyway.
2) I'm not going to fuss about your counter suite. Counters are counters and as long as they are getting the job done, that's all that matters. I would run more Disallows over Unwind though, and prolly bump up Essence Scatter over Negate -- at least in the MD.
3) Your removal is a mess. In this format, you should have 4 Settles. Things are already looking very, very aggro. I already mentioned Seal Away. Run 4. You need to interact with aggro decks as soon as you can.
4) Helm of the Host: I get what you are trying to do here, and it's...cute. This card costs four to cast and 5 to equip. Is it amazing if you can make it happen? Sure. But IMHO this is a stunt best left in your EDH deck.
5) Zhalfirin Void: If you are going to run lands that don't produce coloured mana then they are either Field of Ruin, Scavenger Grounds or Arch of Orazca. Nothing else gets a slot. And you should probably not run more than 4 of these in any combination. You want UU of T3 for Disallow and WW on T4 for Settle. That doesn't leave a lot of room for lands that don't help you out with your colours.
6) Wincons: If you are going to win with dorks, then you are going to need some more of them. Lyra +1, Raff +2 and Gearhulk + 2. The reason the creature-based UW control deck is winning right now is because it does everything on it's oppo's turn and sits back on counters and removal for everything else. Your current list wants to survive for awhile and then cast a big, vulnerable dork.
7) Transitional Superfriends Board: There is absolutely nothng wrng with playing control G1 and then switching into Approach for G2. Most of us are doing this the other way round, so you might run into people who think you are playing approach and SB for that anyway (just because they didn't see it, doesn't mean they can ignore it) which will hurt you. The PWs are okay, but again, you need more consistency. Personally, I am a big fan of Dovin Baan. I played him in 4C cntrol last year and really liked him. He's not in my deck now only because Teferi and Gideon are much, much better and because 4 mana is an awkward CC in the current meta. So...more Teferi. Also...unless you are planning to do something with the energy...consider replacing the Glimmers with Hieroglyphic Illumination. Depends on how much you value the scry over the flexiblity of cycling if you are mana screwed.
Last thought: lands -- you need more W sources. Remember what I said about needing ww on T4 for Settle.
I hope this is helpful.
/M
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Super helpful! Thanks! I have a bad habit of wanting to force things I like rather than things that work, so getting a more experienced player to correct that is always super helpful. A major reason right now I only have one or two of the bigger cards (Teferi, Gearhulks, Lyra, Seal Away, etc) is I don't have the money to buy more singles of them and I pretty much cracked them all out of a single box, but I definitely get what you're saying about getting rid of some things (invoke, helm) on place of others. I'll take a look through my stuff and post a revised list when I get the chance. If I do that I'll probably switch back over to Approach game 1 and midrange game 2.
As for the Glimmers, I really like the fact that they help filter answers and I value that over the cycling of Hieroglyphic, but I'm no means a pro player and if HI is objectively the more efficient choice I'll have to give that a try.
And I can relate to the financial pressures. This is not a cheap game to play. The Seal Aways and Raffs are uncommon so you should be able to find them for $1. Not everyone runs 4 Settles, but if you don't then move the Fumigate from the SB to the main. That card also only costs a couple of bucks so you could always consider going 3/3.
Also, if you got Lyra, Karn and Tef in your box then you did very well. Hopefully you got some other stuff you can trade for some of the pieces you still need.
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2 Karn, Scion of Urza
2 Teferi, Hero of Dominaria
Lands (26)
3 Island
7 Plains
4 Glacial Fortress
4 Ipnu Rivulet
4 Irrigated Farmland
2 Memorial to Genius
2 Scavenger Grounds
Spells (30)
2 Treasure Map
2 Cast Out
4 Seal Away
2 Thopter Arrest
4 Disallow
2 Essence Scatter
2 Glimmer of Genius
1 Hieroglyphic Illumination
4 Settle the Wreckage
1 Supreme Will
1 Search for Azcanta
2 Approach of the Second Sun
3 Fumigate
2 Authority of the Consuls
4 History of Benalia
1 Forsake the Worldly
1 Jace's Defeat
3 Negate
2 Lyra Dawnbringer
Modern
Currently Playing
UW UW Control/Miracles
R Skred Red
Retired
BU Faeries
RGW Naya Burn
BW B/W Tokens
Looks like he may have finished MTGO 5-0: https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/1061486#online.
Are you still deciding between UW and Esper pumpmonkey? I have really liked UW so far. The deck feels much stronger to me this season with Seal Away and Teferi, Hero of Dominaria. Lyra Dawnbringer can win games on her own and completely change the momentum of a game with her angelic 10-point swings. There's a lot to like.
The new counters I don't quite get; Negate and Disallow seem just fine to me.
Yeah...that was about the wrongiest wrong I've ever wronged.
Maybe just a little...
@Hobbits73 - leaning towards straight UW but have been playing just control without Approach. 2-3 Teferi and 4 Gearhulks so far have been very strong. I know this is an Approach primer, so may have to sit down and write one up for just UWx Control.
Modern
Currently Playing
UW UW Control/Miracles
R Skred Red
Retired
BU Faeries
RGW Naya Burn
BW B/W Tokens
I have to agree. Going forward I believe approach will have to go towards some form of grave hate in 2 to 3 scavenging grounds to combat opposing 4x gearhulks.
In addition I think history of benalia is an excellent sideboard option for this new draw go style control. UW is definitely the deck to beat and I believe UWx approach has the tools to combat it
*EDIT*
Upon further review, first place decklist running 61 cards. This "new control" is breaking all the norms.
UCHIHA ITACHI FLOWCHART
1) Genjutsu before battle. Did it work? if yes go to 3 If not go to 2
2) Tsukuyomi if worked go to 7 if not go to 4
3) Attack the confused enemy. If it worked, go to 7, if not go to 2
4) Ninjutsu. If it worked go to 7 if not go to 5
5) Amaterasu. If it worked go to 7, if not go to 6
6) Susano'o. If it worked go to 7, If not go to 8
7) Itachi wins
8) Itachi loses
C Long Live Eldrazi C
I hope you guys like playing control mirrors, SCG Classic Standard - Atlanta - 04/29/201. 7 of the top 16 decks were control. 3 were Approach decks, 3 were UW Control. It is going to be a very interesting Standard.
Also some super secret sideboard tech - Gideon's Defeat, something tells me this is going to become very relevant now. But don't tell anyone, it is still a secret.
Modern
Currently Playing
UW UW Control/Miracles
R Skred Red
Retired
BU Faeries
RGW Naya Burn
BW B/W Tokens
Wastes an opponent's turn, stalls their aggro game, stalls Sagas/planeswalkers, removes growing hatebears, can draws a card in mid/late game. I'm thinking of removing two essence scatters and putting two Blinks in there.
I'm running a UW Approach of the Superfriends deck that gets really bothersome when at least two of them (Karn, Gideon, Teferi, and Dovin Baan) resolve. I haven't tested it in a competitive format, but it looks promising. Though what I've done is run the original sideboard (a midrange deck that wins with Helm'd Regals, Lyra, or Nezahal) as the mainboard, then sideboarded into Approach of the Superfriends. I'm going to go to FNM some time soon and test it out. If anyone's interested I'll post the decklist here.
I see three types of UW running around, Control, Approach and Flash (with Raff). What are the main differences between the versions, which one is the best deck in your opinion? I am concerned only having 4 Gearhulks as a win condition in straight control, seems like this deck has trouble closing out the game, I guess this is an advantage of Approach?
What is the reason for including a card like History of Benalia? Is it a special SB tech, because a 4 of seems a lot, almost like a transformational SB plan.
Thanks for helping me out!
UW flash has a surprise factor because it is relatively new and people are still learning to combat it. It does have its flaws but it is strong. I feel flash should be esper because flashing in deathtouch Gonti is strong as hell. But Flash is in its infancy. Flash IMO trumps straight control but I believe has a disadvantage to approach.
UW control is very consistent but is surely. In the mirrors whoever casts gearhulk first and gets theirs countered usually loses so its a lot of draw go bluff. Will probably come down to Ip mill. Has decent game against approach but struggles against flash pressure. Requires patience and a poker face to play because you want have all answers and will have to bluff.
Approach imo is the best of the three. Fairly consistent gameplan with an win button. Some decks just can't do anything against it as well as you can go approach into approach without fear, and you have SB options on what you want to do when legacy and duress come in. Options are great
TLDR:
None are the strongest per se but requires knowledge of meta and your local scene. For me lots of aggro so I'll play flash so I can insta speed some Lyra and whoop ass. If I was going to a big tourney I would do approach UW or esper without hesitation
UCHIHA ITACHI FLOWCHART
1) Genjutsu before battle. Did it work? if yes go to 3 If not go to 2
2) Tsukuyomi if worked go to 7 if not go to 4
3) Attack the confused enemy. If it worked, go to 7, if not go to 2
4) Ninjutsu. If it worked go to 7 if not go to 5
5) Amaterasu. If it worked go to 7, if not go to 6
6) Susano'o. If it worked go to 7, If not go to 8
7) Itachi wins
8) Itachi loses
And where the heck has Xman been?
C Long Live Eldrazi C
Thanks for the answer! I don't really know my new meta yet but I am kind of more drawn to Approach. What do you think about History of Benalia as a sideboard option/plan? What matchups would you bring them in?
How easy it is to Sideboard switch among these different UW Decks?
In the first round I lost to a B/G saproling deck, I just couldn't draw any Fumigates and only drew one Settle in two games and obviously 1 for 1 removal doesn't work against saprolings very well at all. That's not that surprising, also I was also mana flooded in game 1 too with about 9 lands and 5 other cards played in the whole game.
In the second round I lost to the U/W/B Esper approach, I won the first game but I lost the next 2. One reason is that my sideboard was a mess, I was testing a new idea and it didn't work at all. I did experience the opp's TEferi going ultimate and bouncing back all my permanents for the win. I believe main deck he was only playing Teferi and Lyra Dawnbringer as win conditions. It was not hard to deal with Lyra between seal away, settle and cast out and of course, essence scatter and other counterspells. However, I only had 2 cast outs in the deck as an answer to teferi so after he came down it was over.
In the third round I faced the mirror match again, a U/W approach deck and I won the first game again...my main deck is not changed since last month except for changing baffling end with seal away so that's why I was winning the first games in mirror matches. In the second and third games he brought in a lot of creatures, including Shalai, Lyra, and angel of sanctions as well as Gideon and Teferi. I again used my messed up sideboard so although I tried to hang on a long time, I managed to cast approach in the 2nd game, but the next turn he dropped Gideon and made an emblem and the turn after that he dropped Shalai to protect him and I was basically locked out of the game right there.
I didn't expect to face these decks in the first 3 rounds and since my sideboard was sketchy I'm not surprised that I didn't win the 2nd and 3rd games. What I did learn is that Teferi can be dangerous if you can't counter or get rid of him after he hits the board, of course, he was good against my control deck but I have no idea how he would be against an aggro deck.
As for Lyra Dawnbringer she didn't really get to hit me since the deck has so many ways to get rid of creatures, and of course she's good to drop against another control deck especially if she's protected by Shalai but against aggro I don't think she would do much.
I will, of course, keep playing this deck but I do need to rethink the whole sideboard, hopefully, when metagame gets settled it will be easier to figure out a solid sideboard, and I can change the deck to how I want it in September when Approach is rotating out. The deck really needs a stable metagame to shine so that we know what to play in the sideboard.
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Mtg Lifestyle
My SB is 4 hero of benalia, 3 Lyra, 3 negate, 3 forsake the worldly, 2 flash captain for historic (forget his name)
Against control I ignore Lyra but go 4 history 3 negate and 2 flash captain. Makes the deck more aggressive and an unanswered hero can win the game by itself.
Flash captain puts pressure and allows EOT Walker shenanigans. That's my plan at least
UCHIHA ITACHI FLOWCHART
1) Genjutsu before battle. Did it work? if yes go to 3 If not go to 2
2) Tsukuyomi if worked go to 7 if not go to 4
3) Attack the confused enemy. If it worked, go to 7, if not go to 2
4) Ninjutsu. If it worked go to 7 if not go to 5
5) Amaterasu. If it worked go to 7, if not go to 6
6) Susano'o. If it worked go to 7, If not go to 8
7) Itachi wins
8) Itachi loses
For sure, especially against decks that run black or blue. It's tough to resolve a 7-mana sorcery post-board, so getting the win through Caracals, Gearhulks, Gideon, or Ipnu Rivulet is much more feasible than Approaching. I usually keep at least 1 in for that instant-win potential, but I find creatures to be much more effective for the win.
I'm still muddling my way through the meta and different builds to see what feels best. Raff Capashen, Ship's Mage is a card that slipped under the radar for me during spoilers, but this past weekend's results demonstrate the power of operating at instant speed in ways that the meta might not be prepared for.
It's early days, but my current project is an Esper build that harnesses the power of Raff to operate almost entirely at instant speed and looks to maximize powerful ETBs. The basic package would include 3x Approach of the Second Sun, 4x Seal Away, 3x Cast Down, 3x Vraska's Contempt, 3x Negate, 3x Disallow, 1-2 Teferi, Hero of Dominaria, 1-2x Doomfall, and maybe 1-2 Spell Swindle (I just can't quit that card).
The cards that I'll be trying out (many of which shouldn't be surprising):
A couple final thoughts. First, it sure seems like 1-2 Sorcerous Spyglass main wouldn't be incorrect to combat all the Karns, Teferis, and Walking Ballistas out there. I'm so sick of Walking Ballista...
Second, if Karn or other artifacts become ubiquitous, Ceremonious Rejection will get a lot better and could warrant SB consideration.
Edit: Added Urza's Ruinous Blast and Yawgmoth's Vile Offering...
C Long Live Eldrazi C
That sounds like how I "approach" the blue matchups. I am not sure though if I want to side out all aproaches and go all in on 4 History of Benalia, 3 Dawnbringer Angel and 2 gearhulks. Sounds like a good plan in theory, plus sideboarding becomes really difficult for your opp in game 3.
What kind of removal do you leave in against other UW decks? Settles and Fumigates definitely come out, right? I leave in some seal away and all Cast outs.
It's not optimized and I want to change some things in it. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
2x Field of Ruin
2x Scavenger Grounds
1x Zhalfirin Void
4x Irrigated Farmland
4x Glacial Fortress
4x Plains
8x Island
Enchantments
2x Authority of the Consuls
2x Ixalan's Binding
1x Cast Out
2x Seal Away
1x Gideon's Intervention
Spells
1x Fumigate
3x Settle the Wreckage
1x Farm // Market
4x Negate
2x Essence Scatter
2x Supreme Will
2x Disallow
1x Invoke the Divine
2x Unwind
2x Syncopate
1x Helm of the Host
Creatures
3x Regal Caracal
1x Lyra Dawnbringer
1x Azor, the Lawbringer
1x Nezahal, Primal Tide
Planeswalkers
2x Gideon of the Trials
1x Karn, Scion of Urza
1x Dovin Baan
1x Teferi, Hero of Dominaria
2x Search for Azcanta
2x Glimmer of Genius
1x Fumigate
2x Torrential Gearhulk
3x Approach of the Second Sun
So, I see what you mean, by "it's not optimised." ;-)
I do have some initial thoughts for you.
1) You need more focus. You have a bunch of really odd quantities for your cards and in many ways UW is very forgiving of that, but the reality is that you will struggle for consistency. For example: You are better off running another Cast Out in the Invoke slot. Cast out hits artifacts/enchantments, but is more versatile. The lifegain is not relevant. What are you going to use it against? Bromat Courier? Ballista? Yeah, that's not going to do much for you. Heart is certainly a live target for you as is Harvester, but Cast Out is legit here and you should be running more Seal Aways for that anyway.
2) I'm not going to fuss about your counter suite. Counters are counters and as long as they are getting the job done, that's all that matters. I would run more Disallows over Unwind though, and prolly bump up Essence Scatter over Negate -- at least in the MD.
3) Your removal is a mess. In this format, you should have 4 Settles. Things are already looking very, very aggro. I already mentioned Seal Away. Run 4. You need to interact with aggro decks as soon as you can.
4) Helm of the Host: I get what you are trying to do here, and it's...cute. This card costs four to cast and 5 to equip. Is it amazing if you can make it happen? Sure. But IMHO this is a stunt best left in your EDH deck.
5) Zhalfirin Void: If you are going to run lands that don't produce coloured mana then they are either Field of Ruin, Scavenger Grounds or Arch of Orazca. Nothing else gets a slot. And you should probably not run more than 4 of these in any combination. You want UU of T3 for Disallow and WW on T4 for Settle. That doesn't leave a lot of room for lands that don't help you out with your colours.
6) Wincons: If you are going to win with dorks, then you are going to need some more of them. Lyra +1, Raff +2 and Gearhulk + 2. The reason the creature-based UW control deck is winning right now is because it does everything on it's oppo's turn and sits back on counters and removal for everything else. Your current list wants to survive for awhile and then cast a big, vulnerable dork.
7) Transitional Superfriends Board: There is absolutely nothng wrng with playing control G1 and then switching into Approach for G2. Most of us are doing this the other way round, so you might run into people who think you are playing approach and SB for that anyway (just because they didn't see it, doesn't mean they can ignore it) which will hurt you. The PWs are okay, but again, you need more consistency. Personally, I am a big fan of Dovin Baan. I played him in 4C cntrol last year and really liked him. He's not in my deck now only because Teferi and Gideon are much, much better and because 4 mana is an awkward CC in the current meta. So...more Teferi. Also...unless you are planning to do something with the energy...consider replacing the Glimmers with Hieroglyphic Illumination. Depends on how much you value the scry over the flexiblity of cycling if you are mana screwed.
Last thought: lands -- you need more W sources. Remember what I said about needing ww on T4 for Settle.
I hope this is helpful.
/M
Super helpful! Thanks! I have a bad habit of wanting to force things I like rather than things that work, so getting a more experienced player to correct that is always super helpful. A major reason right now I only have one or two of the bigger cards (Teferi, Gearhulks, Lyra, Seal Away, etc) is I don't have the money to buy more singles of them and I pretty much cracked them all out of a single box, but I definitely get what you're saying about getting rid of some things (invoke, helm) on place of others. I'll take a look through my stuff and post a revised list when I get the chance. If I do that I'll probably switch back over to Approach game 1 and midrange game 2.
As for the Glimmers, I really like the fact that they help filter answers and I value that over the cycling of Hieroglyphic, but I'm no means a pro player and if HI is objectively the more efficient choice I'll have to give that a try.
And I can relate to the financial pressures. This is not a cheap game to play. The Seal Aways and Raffs are uncommon so you should be able to find them for $1. Not everyone runs 4 Settles, but if you don't then move the Fumigate from the SB to the main. That card also only costs a couple of bucks so you could always consider going 3/3.
Also, if you got Lyra, Karn and Tef in your box then you did very well. Hopefully you got some other stuff you can trade for some of the pieces you still need.