Molten Vortex + Crawling Sensation + Fevered Visions + Lots of Lands = lots of insects and damage. Splendid Reclamation brings all of your lands back and allows you to make a Prince or attack with manlands to win the game easily.
... I'm astonished... I'm stunned... This deck is probably one of the best ideas I've ever seen before!
However, this deck could really use Magmatic Insight.
Really nice job, I actually think I'm going to build this kind of deck for locals (thanks a lot for the idea).
I'm not totally sure that would actually win right off the bat, since, as far as I'm aware ''whenever a land enters the battlefield...'' counts Splendid Reclamation as a single instance: In other words, if they all come at the same time, it counts as one.
That would be amazing if it work(ed) though XD.
I piloted the deck to an 8-3 record on MTGO last night, including a 4-1 Friendly League and a 3-2 Competitive League.
I lost to 4-color emerge, and twice to thermo-thing. Thermo-thing is a bad matchup and the sideboard should be adjusted for it.
I agree with Magmatic Insight, seems strictly better than Tormenting Voice. I did think about Retreat to Hagra, but that would mean playing/splashing black. This is a good idea worth trying though. You often win games without casting Splendid Reclamation. Just Molten Vortex + Fevered Visions and 40 lands is enough to kill most opponents.
Also, I don't think you want to mess too much with the land count. You absolutely need somewhere around 40 lands for this deck to work properly. Otherwise your Vortexes and Reclamations become useless. Plus you need to hit Crawling Sensation every turn. (Sensation is amazing btw - remember that you can get it's ability on your opponents turn easily by sacrificing Foundry or Evolving Wilds, or pitching to Vortex)
Fairly certain that is how it works. If I recall correctly, someone did that to me on x-mage. They too were running Crawling sensation and the deck was strictly Golgari. It was a clever deck I thought. it would worth a double check.
Yeah, I think GRB is the best way to go for this. Fevered Visions is nice, but The Gitrog Monster will probably be better. With all the free card draw, you should be able to combo out. I also feel like Mina and Denn, Wildborn could be helpful too. Not only does it give Gitrog some much needed trample, but it feeds lands back to the hand so they can be discarded with Molten Vortex again.
Yeah, I think GRB is the best way to go for this. Fevered Visions is nice, but The Gitrog Monster will probably be better. With all the free card draw, you should be able to combo out. I also feel like Mina and Denn, Wildborn could be helpful too. Not only does it give Gitrog some much needed trample, but it feeds lands back to the hand so they can be discarded with Molten Vortex again.
Part of the advantage of this deck is that it blanks your opponent's removal for the better part. I beat A LOT of control decks the other night. Fevered Visions owns control. Gitrog Monster plays right into their game plan. Mina and Denn is interesting but it's probably going to die and trample is mostly irrelevant. Retreat to Hagra definitely fits the gameplan and I may try a version out with that if I can wrap my head around the exact build.
Edited to say that Fevered Visions is critical to draw you cards. Being that you have 40 lands, you are hungry for gas most games and welcome the extra draws. Especially while the extra cards are damaging your opponents.
I think a deck where you ramp him out or cheat him out could be incredible. I might see about getting a list together. I feel Eldritch Evolution could be the way to go. (mostly just because I want to throw that in something haha)
I'm not totally sure that would actually win right off the bat, since, as far as I'm aware ''whenever a land enters the battlefield...'' counts Splendid Reclamation as a single instance: In other words, if they all come at the same time, it counts as one.
That would be amazing if it work(ed) though XD.
It does work, the retreat will trigger for each land that splendid reclamation puts into play.
I feel Eldritch Evolution could be the way to go. (mostly just because I want to throw that in something haha)
Unfortunately my list has no other creatures to sacrifice.
I tried Retreat to Hagra - it was OK but not amazing. It kind of conflicts with Vortex because you can't both play your lands and pitch them too. It does work well with lands like Evolving Wilds and Blighted Woodlands and you can nickle and dime your opponent to death, but this is not really a winning line most games. You really want to drop Crawling Sensation or Frog+Vortex or Fevered Visions+Vortex.
Still working out the sideboard and whether or not the Jund version is better. The Jund version just might be better, the frog was surprisingly good and it forces your opponent to keep in removal spells which will end up being irrelevant most of the time.
I feel Eldritch Evolution could be the way to go. (mostly just because I want to throw that in something haha)
Unfortunately my list has no other creatures to sacrifice.
I tried Retreat to Hagra - it was OK but not amazing. It kind of conflicts with Vortex because you can't both play your lands and pitch them too. It does work well with lands like Evolving Wilds and Blighted Woodlands and you can nickle and dime your opponent to death, but this is not really a winning line most games. You really want to drop Crawling Sensation or Frog+Vortex or Fevered Visions+Vortex.
Still working out the sideboard and whether or not the Jund version is better. The Jund version just might be better, the frog was surprisingly good and it forces your opponent to keep in removal spells which will end up being irrelevant most of the time.
You are not trying to nickle and dime with Hagra. You do that with your other cards. You fill your graveyard with lands, cast Hagra, follow it up the next turn with Splendid Rec. Also Hagra stacks if you have more than one in play.
Ok, so this is what I came up with. Unfortunately, I couldn't get the land count higher than 30 without feeling like the combo is supported and protected.
I did go with Eldritch Evolution, but I'm not all that happy with it... I have 3 drops, and they work perfectly for getting Big G, but it doesn't work on a nice curve. I guess if I was aiming for a 2 drop, it would be better and all nice and neat. Oh well, beggars can't be choosers, and I think it will work out ok.
I really like Stoic Builder in this list. There are so many 1 and 2 drops in the deck that drop a land in the GY that he will always be able to snag a land from the GY as a little ramp.
There are plenty of cards to dig through the deck. Vessel of Nascency is a great card for going through the deck. It gets G-Monster, Molten Vortex and even Sinister Concoction, if we need some removal.
The way the deck plays is pretty simple. Get G-Monster out ASAP, dig to Molten Vortex, then burn your opponent out. Nearly every land in the deck makes red mana, so that makes sure you're rarely in a situation where you have unused mana.
Special Note about the lands - From goldfishing a few hands, for this deck (at least for my deck, maybe for the archtype), Shadow Lands seem to be better than Battle Lands. Until Molten Vortex comes down, it feels difficult, to rid your hands of lands completely, so you are almost always holding a Mountain in hand. However, since there are 20 non-basics vs 10 basics, you'll often find less of a reason to play a basic Mountain early and find yourself in a situation without enough basics in play for your Battle Land to ETB untapped. At least, that's my opinion with a few goldfished hands.
edit - Almost immediately decided the Drownyard Temples were offering no value. Dropped them for more Mountains.
You are not trying to nickle and dime with Hagra. You do that with your other cards.
Sure, but in reality you don't often Reclamation for more than 5-6. Crawling sensation comes down T3, and by T5-T6 you're ready to cast Reclamation to turn the tide of the game in your favor. You can't just hold Reclamation against many decks because:
A) They're running maindeck discard like Transgress or TkS
B) You need the lands in order to start making creatures
Testing shows that the Temur version is the clear winner. The Temur version is capable of beating Tier 1 decks such as Bant Company, and with the latest improvements doesn't just roll over to UR spells.
In the Jund version, Retreat to Hagra directly competes with Molten Vortex, and Molten Vortex is just a better card. It combines well with Fevered Visions and Frog to just beat your opponent down. Frog is more expensive than Fevered Visions, but has a better payoff. Too often the Frog is a victim of a Transgress the Mind, Ruinous Path, or Reflector Mage. It just isn't as good as Fevered Visions.
Temur has two manlands, Jund only has one. Fumaroles can attack for 4, this is very relevant many games.
One card that I did manage to break out and find was quite good in the deck is Warping Wail. The ability to counter a sorcery is very key since Languish and Tragic Arrogance are very good against the deck. Also, making a 1/1 or exiling a creature like a Selfless Spirit isn't horrible.
Also want to note that I swapped the Magmatic Insights back for the Tormenting Voices. Oftentimes, you want to be able to discard that extra Molten Vortex or other spell so you can draw more lands.
I'm really confused on how this deck actually works. Do you keep hands that are 7 lands? Odds are, you're going to draw 7 lands each game, do you just mulligan aggressively to get the cards you need? With out Molten Vortex this deck isn't really doing anything, and there are only 3 copies of it and no tutor. What happens when you never draw Vortex, do you just loose? What happens if you have to mul to 4-5 cards every game to get vortx in your starting hand, but then never draw fevered visions, do you just run out of gas? You say this deck is competitive against Bant CoCo, but there's literally only 3 cards in the deck that are even capable of removing creatures, am I missing something?
It seems like the deck relies more on Crawling Sensation than Molten Vortex. Vortex seems to be a way to get value from ditching the lands in your hand - especially on the opponents turn in order to create more insects. So, I think ultimately you want to go wide with Insects, ping with Vortex, and swing in with man-lands.
I just got done playing a match against RB Vampires and winning 2-0. Both games I was able to have Crawling Sensation in my opening hand (maybe just pure luck). Game 1 I was able to drop a Fevered Visions on T3 before my Crawling Sensation on T4 so I could keep filling my hand. The insects you get each turn were enough to slow down the aggro before I drew into a Vortex to be able to ping his guys and produce more blockers on the opponent's turn. Eventually I had enough 1/1s to flip Westvale Abbey and just forget about holding up blockers and swing in for massive damage. Game 2 was a bit more of the same thing - get Crawling Sensation up for blockers and just take damage or chump until I could get Abbey flipped. Both were fairly easy wins.
Luckily I didn't have to mulligan for my games but I imagine that you can't get too upset to see a land-heavy opener. I mean, its bound to happen when 2/3rds of the deck is Land. I think you just need to stay with a hand that gets you enough action to get going. I think in Game 2 my opening hand only had a Crawling Sensation and a Retreat to Kazandu (boarded in) as the only spells.
Again, this was my only game I played with it so I'm sure "results may vary".
I'm really confused on how this deck actually works. Do you keep hands that are 7 lands? Odds are, you're going to draw 7 lands each game, do you just mulligan aggressively to get the cards you need? With out Molten Vortex this deck isn't really doing anything, and there are only 3 copies of it and no tutor. What happens when you never draw Vortex, do you just loose? What happens if you have to mul to 4-5 cards every game to get vortx in your starting hand, but then never draw fevered visions, do you just run out of gas? You say this deck is competitive against Bant CoCo, but there's literally only 3 cards in the deck that are even capable of removing creatures, am I missing something?
Actually, your odds of drawing a 7 land hand are only 5%, so it doesn't happen that often. Yes, you mulligan a 7-land hand for sure. In order to win you need to draw a Vortex, Visions, or Sensation in each hand (or at least a Tormenting Voice). This makes me suspect that the deck should actually have the 4th Vortex and maybe another Voice, but it would come at the expense of Wails (maybe right?) Wail really helps the Thermo-Thing and GW tokens matchups, but it may be right to sideboard some copies of it. Keep in mind that while you are running 40 lands, a large number of those lands actually do something, such make tokens or attack.
While the deck can beat Bant Company (I've done it), G1 the matchup is bad. Radiant Flames helps a lot, especially since they're going to Spell Queller your Visions or Crawling Sensation. Crawling Sensation is the key to winning the matchup as it allows you to make lots of insects to block their guys with, while Vortex+Insects can take out their 3 toughness creatures, and Vortex alone can kill Selfless Spirit and Duskwatch Recruiter.
On the otherhand, most control matchups are near unlosable. Fevered Visions destroys their planeswalkers and slowly overwhelms them or you end up reclamationing for a whole bunch of lands which becomes lethal. Kitty-Pact is the exception, as their combo can come out fast enough to be a credible threat. You have the Naturalize in the board.
As pbharris3 posted, the key card really is Crawling Sensation, not so much Vortex. The ability to make 2 insects per turn (which is normal with your sac lands and Vortexes) while filling the grave for Splendid Reclamation, enables you to survive in order to overwhelm your opponent with all of your lands. It is not abnormal to have 18-20 lands in play with this deck, or to activate three Wandering Fumaroles in a given turn. There have been countless games where I've cracked two Foundry of the Consuls to make four tokens and then activated Westvale Abbey all in the same turn (this requires 18 lands), saccing the four tokens and the insect from Crawling Sensation. It is something to behold.
[quote]
The ability to make 2 insects per turn (which is normal with your sac lands and Vortexes) while filling the grave for Splendid Reclamation, enables you to survive in order to overwhelm your opponent with all of your lands.
You mean 1 on your turn and 1 on the opponents? I like the sound of this deck a lot, I wanted to play a 40 land deck back when origins released, but I just do not get how good crawling sensation can be. I guess I might have to play it before I judge.
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3 Tormenting Voice
4 Crawling Sensation
4 Fevered Visions
1 Burn Within
4 Splendid Reclamation
4 Wandering Fumarole
4 Lumbering Falls
4 Cinder Glade
4 Evolving Wilds
4 Foundry of the Consuls
3 Westvale Abbey
4 Shivan Reef
6 Mountain
5 Forest
2 Island
3 Retreat to Kazandu
4 Radiant Flames
4 Negate
2 Incendiary Flow
2 Confirm Suspicions
Molten Vortex + Crawling Sensation + Fevered Visions + Lots of Lands = lots of insects and damage. Splendid Reclamation brings all of your lands back and allows you to make a Prince or attack with manlands to win the game easily.
However, this deck could really use Magmatic Insight.
Really nice job, I actually think I'm going to build this kind of deck for locals (thanks a lot for the idea).
EDIT: this is the list I'll be goldfishing with
4 Evolving Wilds
3 Cinder Glade
4 Wandering Fumarole
4 Lumbering Falls
4 Geier Reach Sanitarium
4 Mirrorpool
5 Mountain
1 Forest
1 Island
4 Burn from Within
4 Tormenting Voice
4 Magmatic Insight
4 Molten Vortex
Green Magic (6)
4 Splendid Reclamation
2 Crawling Sensation
4 Catalog
4 Contingency Plan
C Long Live Eldrazi C
That would be amazing if it work(ed) though XD.
I lost to 4-color emerge, and twice to thermo-thing. Thermo-thing is a bad matchup and the sideboard should be adjusted for it.
I agree with Magmatic Insight, seems strictly better than Tormenting Voice. I did think about Retreat to Hagra, but that would mean playing/splashing black. This is a good idea worth trying though. You often win games without casting Splendid Reclamation. Just Molten Vortex + Fevered Visions and 40 lands is enough to kill most opponents.
Also, I don't think you want to mess too much with the land count. You absolutely need somewhere around 40 lands for this deck to work properly. Otherwise your Vortexes and Reclamations become useless. Plus you need to hit Crawling Sensation every turn. (Sensation is amazing btw - remember that you can get it's ability on your opponents turn easily by sacrificing Foundry or Evolving Wilds, or pitching to Vortex)
C Long Live Eldrazi C
Part of the advantage of this deck is that it blanks your opponent's removal for the better part. I beat A LOT of control decks the other night. Fevered Visions owns control. Gitrog Monster plays right into their game plan. Mina and Denn is interesting but it's probably going to die and trample is mostly irrelevant. Retreat to Hagra definitely fits the gameplan and I may try a version out with that if I can wrap my head around the exact build.
Edited to say that Fevered Visions is critical to draw you cards. Being that you have 40 lands, you are hungry for gas most games and welcome the extra draws. Especially while the extra cards are damaging your opponents.
C Long Live Eldrazi C
This means you get to draw a card for every Molten Vortex activation. Since your deck is 40 lands, the gas doesn't really run out very easily.
It does work, the retreat will trigger for each land that splendid reclamation puts into play.
Unfortunately my list has no other creatures to sacrifice.
I tried Retreat to Hagra - it was OK but not amazing. It kind of conflicts with Vortex because you can't both play your lands and pitch them too. It does work well with lands like Evolving Wilds and Blighted Woodlands and you can nickle and dime your opponent to death, but this is not really a winning line most games. You really want to drop Crawling Sensation or Frog+Vortex or Fevered Visions+Vortex.
Still working out the sideboard and whether or not the Jund version is better. The Jund version just might be better, the frog was surprisingly good and it forces your opponent to keep in removal spells which will end up being irrelevant most of the time.
C Long Live Eldrazi C
2 Dutiful Attendant
4 Stoic Builder
2 The Gitrog Monster
Sorceries 10
4 Eldritch Evolution
4 Magmatic Insight
2 Tormenting Voice
2 Grapple with the Past
Enchantments 10
3 Molten Vortex
3 Sinister Concoction
4 Vessel of Nascency
Lands 30
4 Cinder Glade
4 Evolving Wilds
4 Foreboding Ruins
1 Forest
4 Game Trail
12 Mountain
1 Swamp
1 Atarka's Command
1 Devour in Flames
Ok, so this is what I came up with. Unfortunately, I couldn't get the land count higher than 30 without feeling like the combo is supported and protected.
I did go with Eldritch Evolution, but I'm not all that happy with it... I have 3 drops, and they work perfectly for getting Big G, but it doesn't work on a nice curve. I guess if I was aiming for a 2 drop, it would be better and all nice and neat. Oh well, beggars can't be choosers, and I think it will work out ok.
I really like Stoic Builder in this list. There are so many 1 and 2 drops in the deck that drop a land in the GY that he will always be able to snag a land from the GY as a little ramp.
There are plenty of cards to dig through the deck. Vessel of Nascency is a great card for going through the deck. It gets G-Monster, Molten Vortex and even Sinister Concoction, if we need some removal.
The way the deck plays is pretty simple. Get G-Monster out ASAP, dig to Molten Vortex, then burn your opponent out. Nearly every land in the deck makes red mana, so that makes sure you're rarely in a situation where you have unused mana.
Special Note about the lands - From goldfishing a few hands, for this deck (at least for my deck, maybe for the archtype), Shadow Lands seem to be better than Battle Lands. Until Molten Vortex comes down, it feels difficult, to rid your hands of lands completely, so you are almost always holding a Mountain in hand. However, since there are 20 non-basics vs 10 basics, you'll often find less of a reason to play a basic Mountain early and find yourself in a situation without enough basics in play for your Battle Land to ETB untapped. At least, that's my opinion with a few goldfished hands.
edit - Almost immediately decided the Drownyard Temples were offering no value. Dropped them for more Mountains.
Sure, but in reality you don't often Reclamation for more than 5-6. Crawling sensation comes down T3, and by T5-T6 you're ready to cast Reclamation to turn the tide of the game in your favor. You can't just hold Reclamation against many decks because:
A) They're running maindeck discard like Transgress or TkS
B) You need the lands in order to start making creatures
In the Jund version, Retreat to Hagra directly competes with Molten Vortex, and Molten Vortex is just a better card. It combines well with Fevered Visions and Frog to just beat your opponent down. Frog is more expensive than Fevered Visions, but has a better payoff. Too often the Frog is a victim of a Transgress the Mind, Ruinous Path, or Reflector Mage. It just isn't as good as Fevered Visions.
Temur has two manlands, Jund only has one. Fumaroles can attack for 4, this is very relevant many games.
One card that I did manage to break out and find was quite good in the deck is Warping Wail. The ability to counter a sorcery is very key since Languish and Tragic Arrogance are very good against the deck. Also, making a 1/1 or exiling a creature like a Selfless Spirit isn't horrible.
Also want to note that I swapped the Magmatic Insights back for the Tormenting Voices. Oftentimes, you want to be able to discard that extra Molten Vortex or other spell so you can draw more lands.
My current list:
2 Tormenting Voice
4 Crawling Sensation
4 Fevered Visions
3 Warping Wail
4 Splendid Reclamation
4 Evolving Wilds
4 Foundry of the Consuls
3 Westvale Abbey
4 Wandering Fumarole
3 Lumbering Falls
4 Game Trail
4 Shivan Reef
5 Forest
2 Island
6 Mountain
1 Wastes
3 Invasive Surgery
2 Summary Dismissal
3 Radiant Flames
1 Naturalize
3 Retreat to Kazandu
2 Nephalia Academy
1 Orbs of Warding
I just got done playing a match against RB Vampires and winning 2-0. Both games I was able to have Crawling Sensation in my opening hand (maybe just pure luck). Game 1 I was able to drop a Fevered Visions on T3 before my Crawling Sensation on T4 so I could keep filling my hand. The insects you get each turn were enough to slow down the aggro before I drew into a Vortex to be able to ping his guys and produce more blockers on the opponent's turn. Eventually I had enough 1/1s to flip Westvale Abbey and just forget about holding up blockers and swing in for massive damage. Game 2 was a bit more of the same thing - get Crawling Sensation up for blockers and just take damage or chump until I could get Abbey flipped. Both were fairly easy wins.
Luckily I didn't have to mulligan for my games but I imagine that you can't get too upset to see a land-heavy opener. I mean, its bound to happen when 2/3rds of the deck is Land. I think you just need to stay with a hand that gets you enough action to get going. I think in Game 2 my opening hand only had a Crawling Sensation and a Retreat to Kazandu (boarded in) as the only spells.
Again, this was my only game I played with it so I'm sure "results may vary".
Actually, your odds of drawing a 7 land hand are only 5%, so it doesn't happen that often. Yes, you mulligan a 7-land hand for sure. In order to win you need to draw a Vortex, Visions, or Sensation in each hand (or at least a Tormenting Voice). This makes me suspect that the deck should actually have the 4th Vortex and maybe another Voice, but it would come at the expense of Wails (maybe right?) Wail really helps the Thermo-Thing and GW tokens matchups, but it may be right to sideboard some copies of it. Keep in mind that while you are running 40 lands, a large number of those lands actually do something, such make tokens or attack.
While the deck can beat Bant Company (I've done it), G1 the matchup is bad. Radiant Flames helps a lot, especially since they're going to Spell Queller your Visions or Crawling Sensation. Crawling Sensation is the key to winning the matchup as it allows you to make lots of insects to block their guys with, while Vortex+Insects can take out their 3 toughness creatures, and Vortex alone can kill Selfless Spirit and Duskwatch Recruiter.
On the otherhand, most control matchups are near unlosable. Fevered Visions destroys their planeswalkers and slowly overwhelms them or you end up reclamationing for a whole bunch of lands which becomes lethal. Kitty-Pact is the exception, as their combo can come out fast enough to be a credible threat. You have the Naturalize in the board.
As pbharris3 posted, the key card really is Crawling Sensation, not so much Vortex. The ability to make 2 insects per turn (which is normal with your sac lands and Vortexes) while filling the grave for Splendid Reclamation, enables you to survive in order to overwhelm your opponent with all of your lands. It is not abnormal to have 18-20 lands in play with this deck, or to activate three Wandering Fumaroles in a given turn. There have been countless games where I've cracked two Foundry of the Consuls to make four tokens and then activated Westvale Abbey all in the same turn (this requires 18 lands), saccing the four tokens and the insect from Crawling Sensation. It is something to behold.
You mean 1 on your turn and 1 on the opponents? I like the sound of this deck a lot, I wanted to play a 40 land deck back when origins released, but I just do not get how good crawling sensation can be. I guess I might have to play it before I judge.