tenth edition gave red a lot of goodies in the form of incinerate and mogg fanatic. the question now lies in what is the strongest way to use these cards. will gruul still be on top or will there be a mono red deck that out shines it. will the deck be more creature or burn oriented. theres lots of options of what could happen.
plz post what you think the next big red aggro deck will. decklists welcome and appriciated.
Crit's? Something I forgot? BTW I think Lavaborn muse might actually be pretty good here against like tarmogoyf aggro, or some other aggro that can't remove it easily.
thats a hard call cause gruul lost kird ape which is a large hit but it gained troll but it costs 3 which is definetly not a replacement for kird ape but it got fanatic which is decent but not as good. All in all gruul lost a good amount of speed but gained some hard to answer beats. Where as RDW got alot of cheap burn back from 10th greatly increased its speed. Zoo lost like all its early game and gained only maybe fanatic it still will be decent but no where near as fast.
I have to agree with cripto nats will be a big tell tell sign of what is to come to be the meta difining agro factor.
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I will play what wins, not what is convenient. Personal preference is nothing, The win is all that matters. I will netdeck at every opportunity, but I will not let that stifle my creativity. Style points do not appear on tournament reports. A good deck with an incompetent pilot is nothing more than a dressed up match win. I will crush my opponent mercilessly, and expect no less from him. Victory is its own reward, The prize is just a bonus.
Legacy is dying
I will play what wins, not what is convenient. Personal preference is nothing, The win is all that matters. I will netdeck at every opportunity, but I will not let that stifle my creativity. Style points do not appear on tournament reports. A good deck with an incompetent pilot is nothing more than a dressed up match win. I will crush my opponent mercilessly, and expect no less from him. Victory is its own reward, The prize is just a bonus.
Legacy is dying
Why on earth would you play mono-red without tarmogoyf?
Because, it's called MONO-RED, not TARMOGOYF.netdeck!!!
Mono-Red doesn't need Goyf, it doesn't use Goyf, in fact, few red decks run Goyf. Goyf is his own deck. Don't confuse mono-red and Tarmogoyf decks, ok? Run along now.
Because, it's called MONO-RED, not TARMOGOYF.netdeck!!!
Mono-Red doesn't need Goyf, it doesn't use Goyf, in fact, few red decks run Goyf. Goyf is his own deck. Don't confuse mono-red and Tarmogoyf decks, ok? Run along now.
nice nice. Let's keep it "pure red" as opposed to running a card that makes it better in every single match-up. Your reasoning like "tarmogoyf is it's seperate deck" doesn't hold up against "if I play tarmogoyf I will win more games".
...Ok, what about this do you not understand? Tarmogoyf shines in a deck that can actually benefit it properly. Mono-Red is not that deck. Mono-Red with Goyf gives you what, a 3/4 Goyf at best? A real Tarmogoyf deck can produce 4/5 and 5/6 Goyf's on something like turn 2-3. Mono-Red's strength comes from consistancy, not from mere powerful cards. That's why it runs like 12 one drops, to ensure that it ALWAYS has a one-drop, since it needs one. Goyf is too little for too much in a red deck, and so has no place there.
I'm not going to argue this further. Go try it, and see why it's not nearly as great as say, more burn would be. If you still think it's SOO amazing, then actually ask someone else who plays the deck constantly (I do, by the way), and they'll tell you that it's not worth it.
Maybe it is the player not the deck. Goyf looks completely solid in this deck as a way to over power the more puny decks. With Spark Elemental turn one and more burn spells on turn 2 a turn 3 goyf could end up as a 3/4 easily by turn 4. Specially with Mogg Fanatic and Seal of Fire.
RDW has the arsenal to abuse Goyf, Mogg Fanatic, Scorched Rusalka, Keldon Marauders, Seal of Fire paired up with sorcery and instant butn will make goyf be a 4/5 very quickly, and you opponent can contribute to your goyf as well. There are 4 duals and 4 pains to help with the light splash, goyf could definitely work in this deck.
Yeah, its called "Red Deck Wins" beacause it is all red, even the sideboard. No splashing tactics at all needed here for "Neo Red Deck Wins". You don't need to splash green forKrosan Gripbecause ofPithing Needle. You effectively null all problems red has in standard by the printing of needle. Story Circle, Martyr of Sands, Bottle Gnomes are all toast thanks to needle. Granted you may have troubles playing against other players Needle but, RDW can still go the distance without its activated abilities.
Stop splashing green you guys! You are defiling RDW!
[card=Dismal Failure]"Two magi could trade spells all day and never crown a victor.
The real battle is not one of power but of will.
If your confidence breaks, so too shall you." —Venser[/card]
Aw... opting for Furnace Whelp over Dragon Whelp? Poor little guy... he's so cute you should be running him.
Anyway, even at 3/4, Tarmogoyf is still only 2 mana. You really can't beat that. Grull will continue to be competitive just thanks to 'goyf. Without him, I'd totally be agreeing with the purity of red. But, that is not the case. Green splash ftw!
Aw... opting for Furnace Whelp over Dragon Whelp? Poor little guy... he's so cute you should be running him.
Anyway, even at 3/4, Tarmogoyf is still only 2 mana. You really can't beat that. Grull will continue to be competitive just thanks to 'goyf. Without him, I'd totally be agreeing with the purity of red. But, that is not the case. Green splash ftw!
Yeah Dragon Whelp is nice but, 4 times only for a toughness more? Kinda steep asking price when you want to win with your flier. Personally I think it is a worthy sacrifice in favor of longer survival.
[card=Dismal Failure]"Two magi could trade spells all day and never crown a victor.
The real battle is not one of power but of will.
If your confidence breaks, so too shall you." —Venser[/card]
Not running tarmogoyf and runniong garbage like spark elemental is act the dumbest. Just the dumbest ever. Like, at worst goyf is a 2/3 for 2 and usually he'll be a 3/4 for 2 and sometimes he'll bne a 4/5 for 2. Not running him means you have a bad match-up against the rdw decks that do run him. OMG I just realized that none of you are running gargadon either. I'd prob put your deck's match-up vs sadin.dec at around 70/30 or 80-20 in sadin.dec's favor.
I like peebles' gruul deck today. I'd prob go down to just 2 villages though. It might even be the best non-sadin deck in the format.
Edit: Saying that splashign green defiles the purity of the red deck isn't close to an actual argument. If you think it is, than you prob shouldn't play in any tournaments bigger than an fnm.
Srdude no one listens to the splash of green arguements no matter how much better the cards are. I have been splashing the green for a while now and still to this very day people still argue with me over it.
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I will play what wins, not what is convenient. Personal preference is nothing, The win is all that matters. I will netdeck at every opportunity, but I will not let that stifle my creativity. Style points do not appear on tournament reports. A good deck with an incompetent pilot is nothing more than a dressed up match win. I will crush my opponent mercilessly, and expect no less from him. Victory is its own reward, The prize is just a bonus.
Legacy is dying
Goyf is not the only argument for splashing green. I might be mistaken, but...uh...isn't scab-clan mauler still legal? Isn't Troll Ascetic now in the format? And...uh...artifacts have become somewhat more viable post 10th, so wouldn't hooligan be a solid addition? Gruul never had issues with consistency either, so what possible competitive reason is there for keeping it mono red?
Edit: Saying that splashign green defiles the purity of the red deck isn't close to an actual argument. If you think it is, than you prob shouldn't play in any tournaments bigger than an fnm.
I agree. If I hear (read) that one more time, someone is going to get hit.
plz post what you think the next big red aggro deck will. decklists welcome and appriciated.
Radha, Heir to Keld, Vorel of the Hull Clade, Kemba, Kha Regent, Vela the Night-Clad, Kozilek, Butcher of Truth, Barrin, Master Wizard, Slobad, Goblin Tinkerer, Patron of the Orochi, Oloro, Ageless Ascetic, Thraximundar, Roon of the Hidden Realm, Prossh, Skyraider of Kher, Marath, Will of the Wild, Teneb, the Harvester
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It asks what red aggro build ;).
I haven't kept up with the pro build exactly, but I would go with something like this:
4 Keldon Marauders
4 Emberwilde Augur
4 Mogg Fanatic
4 Greater Gargadon
4 Giant Solifuge
4 Scorched Rusalka
4 Incinerate
4 Rift Bolt
4 Char
2 Demonfire
Land
19 Mountain
2 Keldon Megaliths
1 Pendelhaven
4 Pithing Needle
4 Blood Knight
4 Sulfur Elemental
3 Magus of the Moon
Crit's? Something I forgot? BTW I think Lavaborn muse might actually be pretty good here against like tarmogoyf aggro, or some other aggro that can't remove it easily.
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I have to agree with cripto nats will be a big tell tell sign of what is to come to be the meta difining agro factor.
Personal preference is nothing, The win is all that matters.
I will netdeck at every opportunity, but I will not let that stifle my creativity.
Style points do not appear on tournament reports.
A good deck with an incompetent pilot is nothing more than a dressed up match win.
I will crush my opponent mercilessly, and expect no less from him.
Victory is its own reward, The prize is just a bonus.
Legacy is dying
This is a burn heavy build every thing in the deck burns even the land.
4 Spark Elemental
4 Scorched Rusalka
4 Keldon Marauders
4 Emberwild Augur
4 Mogg Fanatic
4 Rift Bolt
4 Char
4 Incinerate
4 Seal of Fire
4 Browbeat
13 Mountain
4 Stomping Ground
3 Keldon Megaliths
Personal preference is nothing, The win is all that matters.
I will netdeck at every opportunity, but I will not let that stifle my creativity.
Style points do not appear on tournament reports.
A good deck with an incompetent pilot is nothing more than a dressed up match win.
I will crush my opponent mercilessly, and expect no less from him.
Victory is its own reward, The prize is just a bonus.
Legacy is dying
Why on earth would you play mono-red without tarmogoyf?
Because, it's called MONO-RED, not TARMOGOYF.netdeck!!!
Mono-Red doesn't need Goyf, it doesn't use Goyf, in fact, few red decks run Goyf. Goyf is his own deck. Don't confuse mono-red and Tarmogoyf decks, ok? Run along now.
Radha, Heir to Keld, Vorel of the Hull Clade, Kemba, Kha Regent, Vela the Night-Clad, Kozilek, Butcher of Truth, Barrin, Master Wizard, Slobad, Goblin Tinkerer, Patron of the Orochi, Oloro, Ageless Ascetic, Thraximundar, Roon of the Hidden Realm, Prossh, Skyraider of Kher, Marath, Will of the Wild, Teneb, the Harvester
If you did this, tell me and I'll credit you!
nice nice. Let's keep it "pure red" as opposed to running a card that makes it better in every single match-up. Your reasoning like "tarmogoyf is it's seperate deck" doesn't hold up against "if I play tarmogoyf I will win more games".
I'm not going to argue this further. Go try it, and see why it's not nearly as great as say, more burn would be. If you still think it's SOO amazing, then actually ask someone else who plays the deck constantly (I do, by the way), and they'll tell you that it's not worth it.
Radha, Heir to Keld, Vorel of the Hull Clade, Kemba, Kha Regent, Vela the Night-Clad, Kozilek, Butcher of Truth, Barrin, Master Wizard, Slobad, Goblin Tinkerer, Patron of the Orochi, Oloro, Ageless Ascetic, Thraximundar, Roon of the Hidden Realm, Prossh, Skyraider of Kher, Marath, Will of the Wild, Teneb, the Harvester
If you did this, tell me and I'll credit you!
Stop splashing green you guys! You are defiling RDW!
3 Keldon Megaliths
1 Ghitu Encampment
1 Pendelhaven
16 Mountain
Creatures (21):
4 Spark Elemental
4 Mogg Fantatic
4 Keldon Mauraders
4 Scorched Rusalka
3 Emberwilde Augur
2 Furnace Whelp
4 Rift Bolt
4 Incinerate
4 Char
4 Brute Force
2 Demonfire
Burn-Light version focusing on Brute Force reach rather then Seal of Fire. Seems to make more sense if Spark Elemental is on the list.
:symr::symu: Reality Bites
:symr::symu: Delver Cyclops
:symr::symu: Niv Control EDH
:symg::symw: Sigarda EDH
The real battle is not one of power but of will.
If your confidence breaks, so too shall you."
—Venser[/card]
Anyway, even at 3/4, Tarmogoyf is still only 2 mana. You really can't beat that. Grull will continue to be competitive just thanks to 'goyf. Without him, I'd totally be agreeing with the purity of red. But, that is not the case. Green splash ftw!
Sic Gorgiamus Allos Subjectatos Nunc
Yeah Dragon Whelp is nice but, 4 times only for a toughness more? Kinda steep asking price when you want to win with your flier. Personally I think it is a worthy sacrifice in favor of longer survival.
:symr::symu: Reality Bites
:symr::symu: Delver Cyclops
:symr::symu: Niv Control EDH
:symg::symw: Sigarda EDH
The real battle is not one of power but of will.
If your confidence breaks, so too shall you."
—Venser[/card]
I like peebles' gruul deck today. I'd prob go down to just 2 villages though. It might even be the best non-sadin deck in the format.
Edit: Saying that splashign green defiles the purity of the red deck isn't close to an actual argument. If you think it is, than you prob shouldn't play in any tournaments bigger than an fnm.
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Personal preference is nothing, The win is all that matters.
I will netdeck at every opportunity, but I will not let that stifle my creativity.
Style points do not appear on tournament reports.
A good deck with an incompetent pilot is nothing more than a dressed up match win.
I will crush my opponent mercilessly, and expect no less from him.
Victory is its own reward, The prize is just a bonus.
Legacy is dying
I agree. If I hear (read) that one more time, someone is going to get hit.