Basically, you need 9 mana source to start this, with a minimum of 6 - 7 lands, 2 being mountains. Cast Early Harvest, then cast Reiterate with buyback targetting Early Harvest, thus copying it, Reiterate goes into your hand, the copy resolves, you get 6 - 7 lands untapped, cast Reiterate again targetting the first Early Harvest, repeat. With 7 lands out, it's infinite mana, and 6 lands out, it's alot of storm copies for Grapeshot
Then I messed around with it some more, and came up with this decklist, which I basically just took from Heartbeat, and tweaked it such that it would fit post rotation:
We tested it against a bunch of what we think is going to be prevalent type II decks, mainly, Solar Flare without Dragons, but with other random big things, Zoo (which loses just Isamaru, so it was easy to fill in the gap), and Sea Stompy (which loses Ninja, not as easy to fix as Zoo, but close enough).
If played correctly, it usually go off on your turn 6 without disruption, and turn 9-10 if you were holding back stuff with Muddle and Drift (thus, not using them to transmute). It basically plays like a slower Heartbeat. Just wondering whether anyone could give some more suggestion for this deck? Definitely a fun type II deck, with hidden potentials.
Edit: Tweaked the deck some more, added Coiling Oracles and upped the Reiterates to 4.
I would think that coiling oracle would be better than birds, since you're worried about getting lands into play for the combo, and if you don't hit a land, at least you get a card.
Are there any 3 mana-2land fetchers left? The CA that k reach generated really helped.
Nope, No more 2 land fetcher's left, only mana fixers like Farseek and Rampant Growth. Coiling Oracle is a nice inclusion. Wall of Roots is a nice Defender early game and you can use for mana later. And another Tutor can be Mystical Teachings. Mystical Snake can be a safe inclusion as it can just stall till the combo is feasible to pull off.
He stated that in the original post, so yes, he does know.
It's interesting. Definetly slower than Heartbeat, so I recommend more early-game stall against aggro like Civic Wayfinder and the already suggested Coling Oracle so game 1 isn't an auto-lose. Hope it works out for ya.
I agree, since you will be playing four early harvests, if you have two, seven lands = win.
5 lands, leaving two of the same type untapped (preferably forests) then name green. early harvest once, then combo out.
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Quote from RanDomino »
I think you mean "PoN", but it seems to me that "PwN" is more appropriate
(the 'w' stands for 'win', I think)
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I think that WoTC felt that a lot of the players thought Standard was becoming mundane and a joke from all the nuked cards floating around. R&D took a vacation, and MaRo just started reprinting things.
Tried Gauntlet of Power, didn't work. Since when I could pull this off as early as with 6 lands, as long as I have 2 harvests, 2 mountains on board, 1 Reiterate and 1 Grapeshot. I can tap all my lands, harvest, that's 3 extra mana, tap all my land again, 9 mana, exactly I needed to finish. So Gauntlet wasn't needed, and it was 1 land less.
So I changed up the decklist a bit, Coiling Oracle was great, but I had to tweak my manabase a bit, I upped Reiterate to 4, since now I just hope to draw them, instead of having to tutor for both the Reiterate AND the Grapeshot.
Man, I really wish I had top, or some other things to manipulate my library. Right now, I'm just depending on Remand and Coiling Oracles to draw cards.
Maybe I could play other storm cards, but none seems like they are too good of a choice, Ignite Memories is too random for my taste, and Empty the Warrens is prone to Pyroclasm and a variety of other things, since the goblins dont have haste.
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In some sense. The only good fnord is a dead fnord.
considered Mirari? Less mana in one turn then reiterate, and was timeshifted.
Re-read Mirari. It doesn't work.
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"One skilled at battle takes a stand in the ground of no defeat
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Definately 4x Savage Twister Sideboard. I'd keep an aggro/control board with Kudzus, Whirling Dervishes PsiBlasts/Chars, etc. So in case you can't go off in time against a given deck (I'm looking at control here) You could always win through combat damage.
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Let's do that Time Spiral again!
Currently Running U Controlling Affinity U/W/G Skies
It's not going too well so far, but I'm working on a deck that abuses Reiterate alongside Early Harvest... Problem is, you need at least 9 mana in your pool and 6 lands in play for that to work... and the loss of Kodama's Reach is VERY hard to deal with. Terramorphic Expanse helps with the color-fixing, so a 3-color deck with only basic lands isn't a problem, but the slow acceleration is a problem... and I hear aggro decks are getting better.
Posted this on the "Neo-Heartbeat" thread about a year ago...
The key to this deck is MYSTICAL TEACHINGS... not only does it fetch EVERY part of your combo, but it allows you to instantly win once you've achieved infinite R mana... via Pyromatics. As long as you have infinited early harvests with an extra Red source, you've won... Hence why my list has 4 red sources:
The only thing I can say about the deck is that it's SLOW... it requires 9 mana + at least 7 lands in play, which means that it combos off on turn 6+... And teachings is sooo good in this deck, that i'm seriously thinking about throwing in a Swamp just to make it more consistant against control decks... still unsure tho...
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Cool, and here I thought my roommate was some kind of uber design genius, lol. Props to you for coming up with this earlier, like I said, we were just messing around, and didn't really think it was going to be Tier 1 TII right off the bat.
I'll take consideration of both of the Mystical Teachings and Weird Harvest into account. Except I try to use Grapeshot because it has Storm, and basically uncounterable. I have to playtest a bunch of things and tweak it a bit better, but for now, I have classes, and profs gets angry when you walk into their lectures late
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This deck was played in some tournament recently, champs I believe. Starcitygames.com deck database search reiterate and you'll see it, might have new ideas, not sure. Good luck making it take on other T2. (Lots of control to stop combo decks).
any deck in type 2 at the moment (meaning most decks in T2 right now) that runs even a minimal suit of counterspells can easily rip this deck apart. people on this thread are discussing aggro matchups, but it's control decks that this deck should be worried about. I played against this deck the other day online. I played izzettron and countered everytime he tried to play early harvest, i responded with a counter. even if this deck has counters, it wont be able to go off that turn even at ten mana. I am not trying to blast this deck but want to bring your attention to the tough time it would have against a control or aggro-control deck. btw, compulsive research is a good mill option in this deck to keep reiterating against martyr of the sands decks or if a deck sideboards COP:Red against your burn.
Early Harvest + Reiterate + Grapeshot or Invoke the Firemind
Basically, you need 9 mana source to start this, with a minimum of 6 - 7 lands, 2 being mountains. Cast Early Harvest, then cast Reiterate with buyback targetting Early Harvest, thus copying it, Reiterate goes into your hand, the copy resolves, you get 6 - 7 lands untapped, cast Reiterate again targetting the first Early Harvest, repeat. With 7 lands out, it's infinite mana, and 6 lands out, it's alot of storm copies for Grapeshot
Then I messed around with it some more, and came up with this decklist, which I basically just took from Heartbeat, and tweaked it such that it would fit post rotation:
9 Forest
7 Island
3 Mountain
4 Terramorphic Expanse
Creatures:
4 Coiling Oracle
4 Wood Elves
4 Drift of Phantasm
1 Rampant Growth
4 Search for Tomorrow
2 Weird Harvest
4 Muddle the Mixture
4 Remand
4 Early Harvest
4 Reiterate
1 Grapeshot
1 Invoke the Firemind
We tested it against a bunch of what we think is going to be prevalent type II decks, mainly, Solar Flare without Dragons, but with other random big things, Zoo (which loses just Isamaru, so it was easy to fill in the gap), and Sea Stompy (which loses Ninja, not as easy to fix as Zoo, but close enough).
If played correctly, it usually go off on your turn 6 without disruption, and turn 9-10 if you were holding back stuff with Muddle and Drift (thus, not using them to transmute). It basically plays like a slower Heartbeat. Just wondering whether anyone could give some more suggestion for this deck? Definitely a fun type II deck, with hidden potentials.
Edit: Tweaked the deck some more, added Coiling Oracles and upped the Reiterates to 4.
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I would think that coiling oracle would be better than birds, since you're worried about getting lands into play for the combo, and if you don't hit a land, at least you get a card.
Are there any 3 mana-2land fetchers left? The CA that k reach generated really helped.
If you added snow-lands you could use Into the North as Rampant Growth copies 5 thru 8.
[thread=61798]
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(^.^)
(> <)
U U
It's interesting. Definetly slower than Heartbeat, so I recommend more early-game stall against aggro like Civic Wayfinder and the already suggested Coling Oracle so game 1 isn't an auto-lose. Hope it works out for ya.
5 lands, leaving two of the same type untapped (preferably forests) then name green. early harvest once, then combo out.
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So I changed up the decklist a bit, Coiling Oracle was great, but I had to tweak my manabase a bit, I upped Reiterate to 4, since now I just hope to draw them, instead of having to tutor for both the Reiterate AND the Grapeshot.
Man, I really wish I had top, or some other things to manipulate my library. Right now, I'm just depending on Remand and Coiling Oracles to draw cards.
Maybe I could play other storm cards, but none seems like they are too good of a choice, Ignite Memories is too random for my taste, and Empty the Warrens is prone to Pyroclasm and a variety of other things, since the goblins dont have haste.
Check out my pauper cube!
and thanks to PurpleD @ [<--- Left Play Design <---] for making this awesome banner!
Limited is awesome, join us at [Limited]!
In some sense. The only good fnord is a dead fnord.
And so does not lose the enemy's defeat.
Therefore, the victorious military is first victorious and after that does battle.
The defeated military first does battle and after that seeks victory."
No Deck Needs 8 ***'s.
The Bible = Tech
Currently Running
U Controlling Affinity
U/W/G Skies
In the Works
G/W Cataclysmic Slide
Posted this on the "Neo-Heartbeat" thread about a year ago...
The key to this deck is MYSTICAL TEACHINGS... not only does it fetch EVERY part of your combo, but it allows you to instantly win once you've achieved infinite R mana... via Pyromatics. As long as you have infinited early harvests with an extra Red source, you've won... Hence why my list has 4 red sources:
8 Snow-Covered Forest
6 Snow-Covered Island
4 Snow-Covered Mountain
4 Terramorphic Expanse
1 Mouth of Ronom
Creatures(0):
0 Sakura-Tribe "Oh **** he's gone..."
Spells(37):
4 Early Harvest
4 Reiterate
4 Remand
4 Mystical Teachings
4 Into the North
4 Search for Tomorrow
4 Compulsive Research
3 Savage Twister
1 Muddle the Mixture
1 Pyromatics
1 Seething Song
1 Grapeshot
1 Boomerang
1 Reclaim
4 Gigadrowse(duh?)
4 Carven Caryatid
2 Muddle the Mixture
1 Seething Song
1 Savage Twister
1 Dizzy Spell
1 Demonfire
1 Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir
The only thing I can say about the deck is that it's SLOW... it requires 9 mana + at least 7 lands in play, which means that it combos off on turn 6+... And teachings is sooo good in this deck, that i'm seriously thinking about throwing in a Swamp just to make it more consistant against control decks... still unsure tho...
I'll take consideration of both of the Mystical Teachings and Weird Harvest into account. Except I try to use Grapeshot because it has Storm, and basically uncounterable. I have to playtest a bunch of things and tweak it a bit better, but for now, I have classes, and profs gets angry when you walk into their lectures late
Check out my pauper cube!
and thanks to PurpleD @ [<--- Left Play Design <---] for making this awesome banner!
Limited is awesome, join us at [Limited]!
how about this little list that ive been cooking for a while:
4 Snow covered Islands
5 Snow covered mountain
11 snow covered forest
1 snow covered swamp
4 terramorphic expanse
4 into the north
4 search for tomorrow
4 reiterate
4 early harvest
3 pyromatics
4 rampant growth
4 mishra's bauble
4 mystical teachings
4 skred
Extended: UBGIchorid Toolbox
Standard <retired>: WUR Enduring Ideal 31-7-8
I also have a few other tourney decks prepared...