Basicly an revised version of Owl. Make everbody draw a ton of cards, Vortex or Impact your opponent to death. Or maybe just deck him if you really need to.
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GDS1 & GDS2 entrant. Former Rules Advisor & casual-level TO. Semi-lapsed player in general.
I don't think that URzatron should be the mana base for this deck, but I'd have to test it to see. Also, you NEED bounce to maximize the damage they take from sudden impacts. More importantly you need more counterspells than just Remand, otherwise you'll get walked over.
When I was young, the smallest trick of light,
Could catch my eye,
Then life was new and every new day,
I thought that I could fly.
I believed in what I hoped for,
And I hoped for things unseen,
I had wings and dreams could soar,
I just don't feel like flying anymore.
I don't think that URzatron should be the mana base for this deck, but I'd have to test it to see. Also, you NEED bounce to maximize the damage they take from sudden impacts. More importantly you need more counterspells than just Remand, otherwise you'll get walked over.
Why would you use Tron lands for this? Your curve is really low and your only X spell is Skyscribing, which I guess is a kill condition but it could just as easily be Blaze for the win. It seems like you're going to be getting color screwed 99% of the time. Also quite frankly this is a pretty bad deck for the meta, as everything is either a fast aggro deck, which will love you for filling its hand after it dumps its opening critters, or control which is far more dependent on creature kill and fatties than counterspells and raw card advantage like the UB Jushi of yesteryear.
Also, unlike the Honolulu decks which screwed control because it was hard to deal with a resolved Ebony Owl Netsuke, this deck... well, I don't really see how it wins against control at all. You're letting them draw all the counterspells they could ever dream of, but without an Ebony Owl, you have no way to make this a disadvantage for them. All they have to do is Mana Leak/Remand/Rune Snag/Hinder/Rewind your Sudden Impacts and Cerebral Vortexes.
And decking an opponent is unlikely at best. You have basically no way to stop creatures--no pyroclasm, no Wildfire, no Electrolyze, not even a maindeck Boomerang! And when your opponent DOES play threats, you have no answers to them except Remand, which while good, isn't a hard counter! If your opponent somehow cannot find a way to kill you before they deck, despite you having no defenses, they're either playing a horrible deck or 7 years old.
So basically, my advice would be to stop testing decks against 7 year olds.
To play all the spells you're drawing, as well as the massive Skyscribing.
Quote from milky »
Your curve is really low and your only X spell is Skyscribing, which I guess is a kill condition but it could just as easily be Blaze for the win.
The idea being that Skyscribing + Psychic Posession = more draws for you.
But yes some Demonfires are a good idea.
Quote from milky »
It seems like you're going to be getting color screwed 99% of the time.
If Izzetron doesn't get color screwed regularly, why would this?
Quote from milky »
Also quite frankly this is a pretty bad deck for the meta, as everything is either a fast aggro deck, which will love you for filling its hand after it dumps its opening critters, or control which is far more dependent on creature kill and fatties than counterspells and raw card advantage like the UB Jushi of yesteryear.
Also, unlike the Honolulu decks which screwed control because it was hard to deal with a resolved Ebony Owl Netsuke, this deck... well, I don't really see how it wins against control at all. You're letting them draw all the counterspells they could ever dream of, but without an Ebony Owl, you have no way to make this a disadvantage for them. All they have to do is Mana Leak/Remand/Rune Snag/Hinder/Rewind your Sudden Impacts and Cerebral Vortexes.
Now THAT is good constructive criticism of why Howling Owl works and - at least this version - of Howling Posession would not.
As far as it being bad for the meta, you have a good point that the meta is more aggro now. Depending on what Time Spiral brings it might very well remain that way post-rotation too, as Zoo & U/W Weenies & Orzhov Aggro all remain very viable without Kamigawa.
Quote from milky »
So basically, my advice would be to stop testing decks against 7 year olds.
Well, up to this point you were being very constructive.
I haven't tested this against anyone yet. It was an idea that I had that I thought to be interesting so I fleshed it out and wanted to see if it had any merit to go further.
Back the constructive train of thought:
How about Niv-Mizzet (triggers off all your draws) and/or Tidespout Tyrant (lots of card draw + mana to cast lots of spells = lots of bouncing threats) in the deck?
Alternately, what about eschewing Tron and changing from U/R to U/B for Underworld Dreams and removal?
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Drop the tron and put in niv. He will actually stand a chance of winning games for you. His casting cost is just to iffy for you if you are sold on using the tron set up. Perhaps a little bit of mindmoil to go with him would work out well for you. Also consider teferi's puzzle box.
To play all the spells you're drawing, as well as the massive Skyscribing.
With such a low curve 'Tron isn't really necessary to play all the spells you're drawing. I played the Honolulu-styled Owl deck for quite a while, and the only time I ever ended up discarding was when I mana flooded, since you're pretty much guaranteed to hit a land drop every turn and therefore play at least 2 or 3 spells (cards) per turn, plus the land drop. Honestly I never not once thought to myself "boy I could use some mana right now" when playing Owl.
The massive Skyscribing is kind of cool, but it's going to take quite a while to be able to do something like "Skyscribing for 13, then Impact for 20" (a total of 19 mana, which is quite a lot even for 'Tron lands).
If Izzetron doesn't get color screwed regularly, why would this?
Oh but Izzetron DOES get color screwed regularly! This is why even before SSS and the green splash became popular, Izzetron builds would throw in 2-3 Dimir Signets despite not using a single black mana symbol in the entire deck and sideboard.
Well, up to this point you were being very constructive.
Sorry, just some gentle ribbing.
How about Niv-Mizzet (triggers off all your draws) and/or Tidespout Tyrant (lots of card draw + mana to cast lots of spells = lots of bouncing threats) in the deck?
That's quite possible and would be make an interesting deck. Niv-Mizzet itself provides fantastic removal, and the symmetric card draw + howling mines would work very well. Tidespout Tyrant might also work.
Alternately, what about eschewing Tron and changing from U/R to U/B for Underworld Dreams and removal?
Could be interesting, though being able to consistently pull BBB early on would be a problem.
Looks much better! Maindecking Exhaustion was a good choice, I think. Though with Psychic Possession I would maybe throw in Vision Skeins instead of Compulsive Research, as it would essentially be a 2-mana Tidings at instant speed.
Looks much better! Maindecking Exhaustion was a good choice, I think. Though with Psychic Possession I would maybe throw in Vision Skeins instead of Compulsive Research, as it would essentially be a 2-mana Tidings at instant speed.
I cut Vision Skeins but I wasn't too happy about that.
I kept Compulsive Research in the list because its targeted. So w/o Posession you can use it on yourself and your opponent gets no benefit. And once you have Posession you can target your opponent, so you draw 3 with no drawback but they draw three and discard a land or two.
So Research is better before you get Posession but Skeins is better afterwards. I'd just as soon run both but I don't see the room...
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4 Steam Vents
2 Shivan Reef
4 Urza's Mine
4 Urza's Tower
4 Urza's Power Plant
6 Island
SPELLS (36)
4 Howling Mine
4 Vision Skeins
4 Izzet Signet
4 Remand
4 Compulsive Research
4 Cerebral Vortex
1 Reminisce
4 Psychic Posession
4 Sudden Impact
3 Skyscribing
3 Evacuation
3 Gigadrowse
3 Exhaustion
3 ???
3 ???
Basicly an revised version of Owl. Make everbody draw a ton of cards, Vortex or Impact your opponent to death. Or maybe just deck him if you really need to.
Sig banner by Xyre.
My MTG Blog (inactive)
GDS1 & GDS2 entrant. Former Rules Advisor & casual-level TO. Semi-lapsed player in general.
Sideboard needs Pyroclasm or Martyr of Ash.
Could catch my eye,
Then life was new and every new day,
I thought that I could fly.
I believed in what I hoped for,
And I hoped for things unseen,
I had wings and dreams could soar,
I just don't feel like flying anymore.
Also, unlike the Honolulu decks which screwed control because it was hard to deal with a resolved Ebony Owl Netsuke, this deck... well, I don't really see how it wins against control at all. You're letting them draw all the counterspells they could ever dream of, but without an Ebony Owl, you have no way to make this a disadvantage for them. All they have to do is Mana Leak/Remand/Rune Snag/Hinder/Rewind your Sudden Impacts and Cerebral Vortexes.
And decking an opponent is unlikely at best. You have basically no way to stop creatures--no pyroclasm, no Wildfire, no Electrolyze, not even a maindeck Boomerang! And when your opponent DOES play threats, you have no answers to them except Remand, which while good, isn't a hard counter! If your opponent somehow cannot find a way to kill you before they deck, despite you having no defenses, they're either playing a horrible deck or 7 years old.
So basically, my advice would be to stop testing decks against 7 year olds.
To play all the spells you're drawing, as well as the massive Skyscribing.
The idea being that Skyscribing + Psychic Posession = more draws for you.
But yes some Demonfires are a good idea.
If Izzetron doesn't get color screwed regularly, why would this?
Now THAT is good constructive criticism of why Howling Owl works and - at least this version - of Howling Posession would not.
As far as it being bad for the meta, you have a good point that the meta is more aggro now. Depending on what Time Spiral brings it might very well remain that way post-rotation too, as Zoo & U/W Weenies & Orzhov Aggro all remain very viable without Kamigawa.
Well, up to this point you were being very constructive.
I haven't tested this against anyone yet. It was an idea that I had that I thought to be interesting so I fleshed it out and wanted to see if it had any merit to go further.
Back the constructive train of thought:
How about Niv-Mizzet (triggers off all your draws) and/or Tidespout Tyrant (lots of card draw + mana to cast lots of spells = lots of bouncing threats) in the deck?
Alternately, what about eschewing Tron and changing from U/R to U/B for Underworld Dreams and removal?
Sig banner by Xyre.
My MTG Blog (inactive)
GDS1 & GDS2 entrant. Former Rules Advisor & casual-level TO. Semi-lapsed player in general.
Drop the tron and put in niv. He will actually stand a chance of winning games for you. His casting cost is just to iffy for you if you are sold on using the tron set up. Perhaps a little bit of mindmoil to go with him would work out well for you. Also consider teferi's puzzle box.
With such a low curve 'Tron isn't really necessary to play all the spells you're drawing. I played the Honolulu-styled Owl deck for quite a while, and the only time I ever ended up discarding was when I mana flooded, since you're pretty much guaranteed to hit a land drop every turn and therefore play at least 2 or 3 spells (cards) per turn, plus the land drop. Honestly I never not once thought to myself "boy I could use some mana right now" when playing Owl.
The massive Skyscribing is kind of cool, but it's going to take quite a while to be able to do something like "Skyscribing for 13, then Impact for 20" (a total of 19 mana, which is quite a lot even for 'Tron lands).
Oh but Izzetron DOES get color screwed regularly! This is why even before SSS and the green splash became popular, Izzetron builds would throw in 2-3 Dimir Signets despite not using a single black mana symbol in the entire deck and sideboard.
Sorry, just some gentle ribbing.
That's quite possible and would be make an interesting deck. Niv-Mizzet itself provides fantastic removal, and the symmetric card draw + howling mines would work very well. Tidespout Tyrant might also work.
Could be interesting, though being able to consistently pull BBB early on would be a problem.
Yeah, Underworld Dream's casting cost is just so prohibitive.
Here's a revised Tron-less version...
4 Steam Vents
4 Shivan Reef
10 Island
5 Mountain
CREATURES (5)
3 Niv-Mizzet
2 Tidespout Tyrant
SPELLS (32)
4 Howling Mine
4 Remand
4 Compulsive Research
4 Exhaustion
4 Electrolyze
4 Cerebral Vortex
4 Psychic Posession
4 Sudden Impact
4 Pyroclasm
4 Repeal
4 Flashfreeze
3 Gigadrowse
Sig banner by Xyre.
My MTG Blog (inactive)
GDS1 & GDS2 entrant. Former Rules Advisor & casual-level TO. Semi-lapsed player in general.
I cut Vision Skeins but I wasn't too happy about that.
I kept Compulsive Research in the list because its targeted. So w/o Posession you can use it on yourself and your opponent gets no benefit. And once you have Posession you can target your opponent, so you draw 3 with no drawback but they draw three and discard a land or two.
So Research is better before you get Posession but Skeins is better afterwards. I'd just as soon run both but I don't see the room...
Sig banner by Xyre.
My MTG Blog (inactive)
GDS1 & GDS2 entrant. Former Rules Advisor & casual-level TO. Semi-lapsed player in general.