This is exactly what I am looking at right now. The W/g Humans deck I am building and testing isn't as low to the ground as W/r, but it offers an alternative to recovering from a board wipe, but with a similar outlook of not overextending your hand due to the reality of board wipes.
I can sideboard in bigger creatures for my 1-drops if I need to go long.
I can sideboard in more removal against creature heavy decks.
I probably need to add Hallowed Moonlight to my SB for CoCo instead of Gideon
If I am playing the mirror or a creature heavy deck I want to try a lifelink strategy of Lone Rider, Gisela, and Heron's Grace Champion to keep them from being able to kill me. This is also good in combatting a wipe, having 25+ life gives me time to recover.
I am a little concerned about curving out at 4CMC and only having 20 Lands, but I haven't had issues yet.
That looks like an interesting list, have you done any testing with it yet? It looks like you can't really attack with Lambholt Pacifist all that often since getting your creatures to 4+ will require at least 2 cards in that deck, so I'm thinking another creature might fill the slot better.
As far as playtesting, I haven't been able to playtest this build during this week, but I will be doing plenty this weekend. That's why I'm concerned about the mana base.
Also, I've decided to change the SB to (-2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar, +2 Hallowed Moonlight)
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Standard
Currently Playing: WGW/G HumansGW WUW/U SpiritsUW WGG/W TokensGW URU/R ProwessRU
On September 30th, Dragons of Trakir and Magic Origins rotate out, which means there will be no more Languish. This deck should be set up to do well post rotation. I'm thinking a Junk version, something like:
On September 30th, Dragons of Trakir and Magic Origins rotate out, which means there will be no more Languish. This deck should be set up to do well post rotation. I'm thinking a Junk version, something like:
Heron's Grace champion I have in the sidebaord, and for mainboard I just feel that Tireless Tracker and Always Watching are better 3 drops. Thalia is a lot better in modern than she is in standard.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Modern
JundBGR
RW Blood MoonRW
Pauper
Delver U
Elves G
Control B
Commander
Edgar Markov BRW
Captain Sisay GW
Niv-Mizzet, Parun UR
Tymna and Ravos WB
This is exactly what I am looking at right now. The W/g Humans deck I am building and testing isn't as low to the ground as W/r, but it offers an alternative to recovering from a board wipe, but with a similar outlook of not overextending your hand due to the reality of board wipes.
I can sideboard in bigger creatures for my 1-drops if I need to go long.
I can sideboard in more removal against creature heavy decks.
I probably need to add Hallowed Moonlight to my SB for CoCo instead of Gideon
If I am playing the mirror or a creature heavy deck I want to try a lifelink strategy of Lone Rider, Gisela, and Heron's Grace Champion to keep them from being able to kill me. This is also good in combatting a wipe, having 25+ life gives me time to recover.
I am a little concerned about curving out at 4CMC and only having 20 Lands, but I haven't had issues yet.
That looks like an interesting list, have you done any testing with it yet? It looks like you can't really attack with Lambholt Pacifist all that often since getting your creatures to 4+ will require at least 2 cards in that deck, so I'm thinking another creature might fill the slot better.
As far as playtesting, I haven't been able to playtest this build during this week, but I will be doing plenty this weekend. That's why I'm concerned about the mana base.
Also, I've decided to change the SB to (-2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar, +2 Hallowed Moonlight)
Got to playtest this deck a lot this weekend (Played a total of 10 matches and went 7-3, with most losses being mistakes that I made more so than shortcomings of the deck.) here's some takeaways I found:
1. Going -1 Thraben Inspector +1 Plains. With 20 lands I kept getting screwed, with 22 lands I had multiple floods. I am going to keep it at 21 and get a good amount of additional playtesting done.
2. Lone Rider is great in this deck. Drop this on T2, by end of T4 it has flipped, usually into a 6/5 Flying, First Strike, Trample, Lifelink, Vigilance. Single card beater that allows you to be conservative with the rest of your board.
3. This deck does its best with 3-4 creatures on the board (plus pumps.) I have learned that I like to keep 2-3 creatures in hand for Board wipes and Key spot removal so that I can recover fairly quickly. This deck is definitely not a clear your hand type deck.
4. When on the draw in Games 2 or 3 I liked to sideboard in Knight of the White Orchid. This allowed me to "ramp" a bit and have 4 lands on T3 with 2 open.
5. Thalia, Heretic Cathar was a card I was always happy to see. Creatures entering the battlefield tapped is great, because it allows us to go in for more damage. Also, being first strike usually allowed her to get damage to the opponent or they'd risk losing a creature they need without a trade. She often ended up being a T4 play though, because I wanted Always Watching down before I dropped her. This made her a 4/3 Vigilance First Strike, which deters a lot of ground attacks.
6. There are enough threats in the deck that spot removal isn't too crippling. Thalia's Lieutenant usually eats spot removal, as does Hanweir Militia Captain. This usually leaves Lone Rider and Thalia open to keep being threats. But Planeswalkers like Chandra and Sorin can get annoying against a bigger card, as they continue to be a threat after they remove your threat.
7. Heron's Grace Champion can win games. Flashing it in to ensure a lethal swing with your attackers. Dropping it on the battlefield in order to get a huge amount of life that your opponent just can't take down fast enough. Flashing it in while blocking to completely mess up your opponent's board and allow your creatures to survive or kill a more threatening opponent. So much utility and the 3/3 Lifelink body isn't bad, give it Always Watching or Gryff's Boon and it becomes a real threat itself.
Hi, I'm trying out the G/W version right now (similar to Premier N7's list) and really enjoying it. Been having trouble against Sultai control though. What do you think about 2-3 copies of Selfless Spirit ? at least in the SB.
Hi, I'm trying out the G/W version right now (similar to Premier N7's list) and really enjoying it. Been having trouble against Sultai control though. What do you think about 2-3 copies of Selfless Spirit ? at least in the SB.
What is you're having trouble with from Sultai Control?
Not sure what it is you need in order to give your creatures Indestructible.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Standard
Currently Playing: WGW/G HumansGW WUW/U SpiritsUW WGG/W TokensGW URU/R ProwessRU
Mainly the board wipes. I know Selfless Spirit would not help against languish, but I feel some kind of plan post board for board wipes (planar outburst) is worth looking into.
Part of the problem was also that I was overextending my hand, but I've won the last 2 matches against Sultai so I think I'll be fine from here on out.
I've also tested two other cards I'd like to talk about:
1. 2 copies of Anointer of Champions. She's been great for me, also helps to flip Lone Rider.
2. 1 (maybe 2 ?) Lunarch Mantle. Immediately flips Lone Rider into a 6/6 (!) and has the option of turning excess lands or clues into flying ability. Also puts him out of languish range.
What do you think ? I'm also considering Duskwatch Recruiter but he might be too slow, going to try 1-2- copies.
I'd also be interested how Gisela has been working out for you, when do you bring her in ? So far I've been lovig the deck !
Mainly the board wipes. I know Selfless Spirit would not help against languish, but I feel some kind of plan post board for board wipes (planar outburst) is worth looking into.
Part of the problem was also that I was overextending my hand, but I've won the last 2 matches against Sultai so I think I'll be fine from here on out.
I've also tested two other cards I'd like to talk about:
1. 2 copies of Anointer of Champions. She's been great for me, also helps to flip Lone Rider.
2. 1 (maybe 2 ?) Lunarch Mantle. Immediately flips Lone Rider into a 6/6 (!) and has the option of turning excess lands or clues into flying ability. Also puts him out of languish range.
What do you think ? I'm also considering Duskwatch Recruiter but he might be too slow, going to try 1-2- copies.
I'd also be interested how Gisela has been working out for you, when do you bring her in ? So far I've been lovig the deck !
Yes, I agree that this deck is susceptible to board wipes, but the one you'll see the most is Languish most likely. Planar Outburst is another (something I'd run in my G/W Tokens Deck) and a Avacyn flip is a risk too. But the question I've been asking myself, is what am I willing to side out for something like a Selfless Spirit and while the spirit does help me survive wipes, does it further my game plan and win condition (An argument could be make for both sides, its ultimately up to the pilot to decide what works best for them.) The best thing to do though is not overexert your hand. I still do it sometimes and I always regret it.
Anointer of Champions is an interesting choice. I might have to try it out because of 1-drops other than Kytheon have been serviceable but not great. Thraben Inspector usually has a good body for a 1-drop and the clue is nice. Town Gossipmonger can get big but isn't attacking until T3 usually. What I would give for a Champion of the Parish.
The biggest argument I have against Lunarch Mantle is that you're basically asking for that creature to get 2 for 1'd. Gryff's Boon doesn't give it as big of a buff (making it slightly less likely to be a removal target) and can be recast from the Graveyard so it doesn't really quite go away.
Also Duskwatch Recruiter is an interesting choice, might be a SB option instead of 2 additional Lambholt Pacifist. Probably has more value in a late game than Pacifist, but I'd probably want to keep Pacifist maindecked. I'd just be worried about it competing with our other 2-drops.
As far as Gisela, the Broken Blade goes, I bring her in if I need to go big or need to fly. Usually against mirror matches, G/W Tokens (where they don't have a lot of things that can block fliers) and things like U/W Spirits where I want to stall their fliers (because Spirits usually doesn't want to block). With Always Watching she can even come in and stall a flipped Archangel Avacyn (being a 5/4 First Strike)
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Standard
Currently Playing: WGW/G HumansGW WUW/U SpiritsUW WGG/W TokensGW URU/R ProwessRU
Sorry for intruding on this thread, but I have to ask somewhere : Where is the discussion for Bant Humans? The Bant Company thread doesn't seem to care for the Human alternative, and this thread seems a bit more focused on the W/r Weenies version, or W/G that doesn't play Company.
I started a thread for Naya Company in the Standard forum, and I really want to make this deck something before rotation (2 months?!?!). Was I right to start it there? Or should have I just inserted my W/G/r deck here?
Maybe it's time to split the Humans thread in 2 or 3 : Weenies (W, W/r, GW), Bant Human Company, Naya Human Company. It's otherwise quite painful browsing the 17 pages history to read about a particular build...
I agree that the thread should split, but I think that company / no company should be fine.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Some facts of magic:
-Terror is an emotion which, when experienced, results in death.
-The pox was a disease notorious for having killed one-third, rounded up, of Europe’s population. Smallpox, on the other hand, killed only a single person.
-A person riding a horse cannot be stopped by foot soldiers, large animals, walls, archers, or even catapults.
He is incredible when paired with many of the cards in my deck but specifically beside Lone Rider and Heron's Grace Champion. Odric and Lone Rider with a couple other humans on my side has been a game ender for my opponent more than a few times. I have him as a two of because of his cost and legendary status but I come across him more than you would think. Its really nice when I have tokens out and they get his ability sharing as well. I am also pondering on making room for a Tamiyo's Journal because I like the synergy it has with Tireless Tracker and the fact it can tutor for me.
He is incredible when paired with many of the cards in my deck but specifically beside Lone Rider and Heron's Grace Champion. Odric and Lone Rider with a couple other humans on my side has been a game ender for my opponent more than a few times. I have him as a two of because of his cost and legendary status but I come across him more than you would think. Its really nice when I have tokens out and they get his ability sharing as well. I am also pondering on making room for a Tamiyo's Journal because I like the synergy it has with Tireless Tracker and the fact it can tutor for me.
I was tempted to run Odric as a 1-2 in the side but I found his 4cmc too much, can you reliably cast him?
I only run two for that very reason. If I have one in opening hand I am ok with it but if I top deck him late game I am ecstatic lol. So far I have had no problems getting him down.
Here is my take on humans and it has done very well. I won 4 games at an SCG open with it with one victory being against bant humans
*Snip deck for space*
This version does look like fun to play; I'll probably give it a shot this weekend. (I've been wanting to play Oderic since he first spoiled oh so long ago. )
You don't have a sideboard listed; any tips for what you run for the sideboard and/or strategies against other decks?
So here is a Wr Humans list that i have been play testing, it is extremely fast and usually wins by turn 5 or 6 vs the eldrazi ramp and emerge decks the only time i really have a bad match-up is vs the BG delirium decks when they have back to back languish to wipe the board. i would like some input for possible tweeks and suggestions.
My sideboard has Hallowed Moonlight for CoCo, Gisela, Planar Outburst, Collective Effort, Blessed Alliance, and Not Forgotten to help against delerium decks. Not Forgotten is amazing for 2 mana. You get to take a card out of their yard and put it at the bottom of their library AND you get a 1/1 spirit token.
Want to make your opponent think twice about using languish or kozileks return on your humans? Answer is another human we can play named Zulaport Cutthroat. Hilarious in multiples and even 2 other humans or human tokens on our side
Want to make your opponent think twice about using languish or kozileks return on your humans? Answer is another human we can play named Zulaport Cutthroat. Hilarious in multiples and even 2 other humans or human tokens on our side
How would you want to splash black? Are you looking at a W/b Humans build?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Standard
Currently Playing: WGW/G HumansGW WUW/U SpiritsUW WGG/W TokensGW URU/R ProwessRU
I have been looking at that, I do like shambling vents. Of course if you didnt want to stray into black, pious evangel has the same ability as zulaport cutthroat
Things that allow Lambholt Pacifist to attack:
Thalia's Lieutenant when Pacifist is already on board (makes Pacifist 4/4)
Gryff's Boon on Pacifist (Turning it into a rather nice 4/3 flier)
Always Watching (makes Pacifist 4/4)
Dromoka's Command 1/1 Counter on Pacifist (makes Pacifist 4/4)
Heron's Grace Champion ETB when Pacifist is on board (makes Pacifist 4/4 Lifelink til end of turn)
A Flipped It That Rides As One (is a 4/4)
Gisela, the Broken Blade (should I sideboard her in) (is a 4/3)
As far as playtesting, I haven't been able to playtest this build during this week, but I will be doing plenty this weekend. That's why I'm concerned about the mana base.
Also, I've decided to change the SB to (-2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar, +2 Hallowed Moonlight)
Currently Playing:
WGW/G HumansGW
WUW/U SpiritsUW
WGG/W TokensGW
URU/R ProwessRU
4 Thraben Inspector
4 Hanweir Militia Captain
4 Thalia's Lieutenant
4 Hamlet Captain
2 Duskwatch recruiter
2 Veteran Cathar
4 Tireless Tracker
4 Courageous Outrider
4 Declaration in Stone
4 Always Watching
Lands 24
4 Fortified Village
4 Canopy Vista
2 Westvale Abbey
7 plains
7 forest
2 eerie interlude
2 stasis snare
2 Repel the Abominable
2 Heron's Grace Champion
2 Aligned Hedron Network
2 Watcher in the Web
1 Sigarda, Heron's Grace
1 Plated Crusher
1 Linvala, the preserver
JundBGR
RW Blood MoonRW
Pauper
Delver U
Elves G
Control B
Commander
Edgar Markov BRW
Captain Sisay GW
Niv-Mizzet, Parun UR
Tymna and Ravos WB
What about Thalia, Heretic Cathar and Heron's Grace Champion?
JundBGR
RW Blood MoonRW
Pauper
Delver U
Elves G
Control B
Commander
Edgar Markov BRW
Captain Sisay GW
Niv-Mizzet, Parun UR
Tymna and Ravos WB
Here's the new decklist:
3 Thraben Inspector
3 Kytheon, Hero of Akros
3 Town Gossipmonger
4 Lone Rider
3 Thalia's Lieutenant
3 Hanweir Militia Captain
2 Lambholt Pacifist
3 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
3 Heron's Grace Champion
3 Gryff's Boon
4 Always Watching
Instants (2)
2 Dromoka's Command
Sorceries (3)
3 Declaration in Stone
Land (21)
4 Fortified Village
4 Canopy Vista
9 Plains
4 Forest
2 Lambholt Pacifist
2 Knight of the White Orchid
3 Gisela, the Broken Blade
2 Hallowed Moonlight
2 Silkwrap
2 Stasis Snare
2 Collective Effort
Got to playtest this deck a lot this weekend (Played a total of 10 matches and went 7-3, with most losses being mistakes that I made more so than shortcomings of the deck.) here's some takeaways I found:
1. Going -1 Thraben Inspector +1 Plains. With 20 lands I kept getting screwed, with 22 lands I had multiple floods. I am going to keep it at 21 and get a good amount of additional playtesting done.
2. Lone Rider is great in this deck. Drop this on T2, by end of T4 it has flipped, usually into a 6/5 Flying, First Strike, Trample, Lifelink, Vigilance. Single card beater that allows you to be conservative with the rest of your board.
3. This deck does its best with 3-4 creatures on the board (plus pumps.) I have learned that I like to keep 2-3 creatures in hand for Board wipes and Key spot removal so that I can recover fairly quickly. This deck is definitely not a clear your hand type deck.
4. When on the draw in Games 2 or 3 I liked to sideboard in Knight of the White Orchid. This allowed me to "ramp" a bit and have 4 lands on T3 with 2 open.
5. Thalia, Heretic Cathar was a card I was always happy to see. Creatures entering the battlefield tapped is great, because it allows us to go in for more damage. Also, being first strike usually allowed her to get damage to the opponent or they'd risk losing a creature they need without a trade. She often ended up being a T4 play though, because I wanted Always Watching down before I dropped her. This made her a 4/3 Vigilance First Strike, which deters a lot of ground attacks.
6. There are enough threats in the deck that spot removal isn't too crippling. Thalia's Lieutenant usually eats spot removal, as does Hanweir Militia Captain. This usually leaves Lone Rider and Thalia open to keep being threats. But Planeswalkers like Chandra and Sorin can get annoying against a bigger card, as they continue to be a threat after they remove your threat.
7. Heron's Grace Champion can win games. Flashing it in to ensure a lethal swing with your attackers. Dropping it on the battlefield in order to get a huge amount of life that your opponent just can't take down fast enough. Flashing it in while blocking to completely mess up your opponent's board and allow your creatures to survive or kill a more threatening opponent. So much utility and the 3/3 Lifelink body isn't bad, give it Always Watching or Gryff's Boon and it becomes a real threat itself.
Currently Playing:
WGW/G HumansGW
WUW/U SpiritsUW
WGG/W TokensGW
URU/R ProwessRU
What is you're having trouble with from Sultai Control?
Not sure what it is you need in order to give your creatures Indestructible.
Currently Playing:
WGW/G HumansGW
WUW/U SpiritsUW
WGG/W TokensGW
URU/R ProwessRU
Part of the problem was also that I was overextending my hand, but I've won the last 2 matches against Sultai so I think I'll be fine from here on out.
I've also tested two other cards I'd like to talk about:
1. 2 copies of Anointer of Champions. She's been great for me, also helps to flip Lone Rider.
2. 1 (maybe 2 ?) Lunarch Mantle. Immediately flips Lone Rider into a 6/6 (!) and has the option of turning excess lands or clues into flying ability. Also puts him out of languish range.
What do you think ? I'm also considering Duskwatch Recruiter but he might be too slow, going to try 1-2- copies.
I'd also be interested how Gisela has been working out for you, when do you bring her in ? So far I've been lovig the deck !
Yes, I agree that this deck is susceptible to board wipes, but the one you'll see the most is Languish most likely. Planar Outburst is another (something I'd run in my G/W Tokens Deck) and a Avacyn flip is a risk too. But the question I've been asking myself, is what am I willing to side out for something like a Selfless Spirit and while the spirit does help me survive wipes, does it further my game plan and win condition (An argument could be make for both sides, its ultimately up to the pilot to decide what works best for them.) The best thing to do though is not overexert your hand. I still do it sometimes and I always regret it.
Anointer of Champions is an interesting choice. I might have to try it out because of 1-drops other than Kytheon have been serviceable but not great. Thraben Inspector usually has a good body for a 1-drop and the clue is nice. Town Gossipmonger can get big but isn't attacking until T3 usually. What I would give for a Champion of the Parish.
The biggest argument I have against Lunarch Mantle is that you're basically asking for that creature to get 2 for 1'd. Gryff's Boon doesn't give it as big of a buff (making it slightly less likely to be a removal target) and can be recast from the Graveyard so it doesn't really quite go away.
Also Duskwatch Recruiter is an interesting choice, might be a SB option instead of 2 additional Lambholt Pacifist. Probably has more value in a late game than Pacifist, but I'd probably want to keep Pacifist maindecked. I'd just be worried about it competing with our other 2-drops.
As far as Gisela, the Broken Blade goes, I bring her in if I need to go big or need to fly. Usually against mirror matches, G/W Tokens (where they don't have a lot of things that can block fliers) and things like U/W Spirits where I want to stall their fliers (because Spirits usually doesn't want to block). With Always Watching she can even come in and stall a flipped Archangel Avacyn (being a 5/4 First Strike)
Currently Playing:
WGW/G HumansGW
WUW/U SpiritsUW
WGG/W TokensGW
URU/R ProwessRU
I started a thread for Naya Company in the Standard forum, and I really want to make this deck something before rotation (2 months?!?!). Was I right to start it there? Or should have I just inserted my W/G/r deck here?
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/standard-type-2/deck-creation-standard/729875-naya-human-army?page=4
Maybe it's time to split the Humans thread in 2 or 3 : Weenies (W, W/r, GW), Bant Human Company, Naya Human Company. It's otherwise quite painful browsing the 17 pages history to read about a particular build...
1st, GP Toronto Sunday Super Series 2016 : Ally Company RWBG
Top 8, PPTQ Shadows over Innistrad : Boros Humans WR.
Use a hypergeometric calculator for your deckbuilding maths,
and use TopDecked to manage your decks and collection on your Apple or Android device.
-Terror is an emotion which, when experienced, results in death.
-The pox was a disease notorious for having killed one-third, rounded up, of Europe’s population. Smallpox, on the other hand, killed only a single person.
-A person riding a horse cannot be stopped by foot soldiers, large animals, walls, archers, or even catapults.
More facts of magic
I haven't been able to jam much standard lately
3 Town Gossipmonger
4 Thalia's Lieutenant
4 Hanweir Militia Captain
2 Knight of the White Orchid
2 Lone Rider
4 Tireless Tracker
2 Odric, Lunarch Marshall
2 Heron's Grace Champion
2 Sigarda, Heron's Grace
2 Stasis Snare
3 Always Watching
2 Declaration in Stone
4 Fortified Village
8 Forest
11 Plains
I was tempted to run Odric as a 1-2 in the side but I found his 4cmc too much, can you reliably cast him?
I
This version does look like fun to play; I'll probably give it a shot this weekend. (I've been wanting to play Oderic since he first spoiled oh so long ago. )
You don't have a sideboard listed; any tips for what you run for the sideboard and/or strategies against other decks?
3 Hanweir Garrison
2 Odric, Lunarch Marshal
4 Thalia's Lieutenant
2 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
3 Iroas's Champion
4 Thraben Inspector
4 Hanweir Militia Captain
2 Lone Rider
2 Gryff's Boon
2 Collective Effort
3 Incendiary Flow
2 Declaration in Stone
3 Always Watching
Land
2 Hanweir Battlements
4 Stone Quarry
9 Plains
5 Mountain
4 Battlefield Forge
How would you want to splash black? Are you looking at a W/b Humans build?
Currently Playing:
WGW/G HumansGW
WUW/U SpiritsUW
WGG/W TokensGW
URU/R ProwessRU