At my Nationals, people used Hallow as random anti-clasm tech. Apart from that and pro-red, there's not a lot we can do.
Eh, I've been quite for a while, but this merits comment. OMFG!!!!!111~!!!~! So let's do the math... Hallow targets 'clasm and I gain 2 for each creature on the field and saving them to boot??? How have people missed this?
@danial- i've tried r/w weenie before - its terrible, and the mana screw hurts alot sinse you don't run many lands to bgin with.
at pyroclasm- i dont have to worry about it - i actualy consider any redd deck an auto win because the 8 pro red guys plus auriok champion gains a ****load of life.
Pyroclasm is definitely less of a worry post 9th with the addition of paladin en vec, paladin + champion should almost always win through against red decks and black decks(esp. when you have hand of cruelty also).
Pyroclasm is definitely less of a worry post 9th with the addition of paladin en vec, paladin + champion should almost always win through against red decks and black decks(esp. when you have hand of cruelty also).
@Mindslicer: Actually no, you said you didn't have to worry at all about pyroclasm, i just said its less of a worry(it still hurts you alot if you don't have the pro red creatures or glorious anthem out). And you didn't point out anything concerning the matchup vrs. mono black decks.
Agreed... I don't know my meta just yet, but my gut tells me that MBC is going to start getting big sometime soon... people just don't know it yet. Regardless, pyroclasm is indeed very bad for you if you have no protection out on the field. But still... I'd advise getting ready for a MBC surge... I just feel it coming (then again I'm biased since I think it is one of the strongest decks in standard... but that's just my opinion).
Seriously, Mirrodin block has not rotated out yet, so don't treat it as though it has. You're shorting yourself on over 500 cards in that fashion.
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well I was about to edit and say that this is gonna be for after Mirrodin but guess I didn't...sorry, and also I have no money so things like Pithing Needle I can't get...so sad. I have a build right now with mirrodin cards and it does me good none the less I still need to think about the future which I don't know when Ravnica comes out but it prolly will be out before I start playing in tourneys.
I dunno.. personally I'm against Mindslicer's version in post 712... As much as I'd like it I think the rules prevent playing 7 copies of SoFI between the md and board.
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I dunno.. personally I'm against Mindslicer's version in post 712... As much as I'd like it I think the rules prevent playing 7 copies of SoFI between the md and board.
yaeh, i messed up - it 3 sofi md and 4 ligh&shadow sb...
the SB isn't really what I want it to be I just threw cards in there, tell me if there needs to be more tweaking please. My meta down here includes Muc and MBC so I have to watch out for those mainly, not much red if any
I think I'd want that last SoFi around.. maybe 3 md and 1 sb with only 3 L&S sb
SoFI is not all that powerful against the blue match up, sure it stops the three or four bounce spells they run (even though they can still bounce the sofi) and it doesnt stop shackles.
i have been testing different builds of ww for months, and i think this is the optimal build.
bikini chick- i run four MD because, well because its busted- you have so many creatures and it just get better in the agrro matchup (think beacon of creation), more life = more time to win.plus being pro red and black is just an added bonus.
pithing needle" target="blank">pithing needle- i run them MD because they shut down cards you lose to (shackles) and other random stuff.
wrath of god- i SB them because its good against T&N, and other agrro, you just hold back playing stuff slowly, then when they over extend, WHAM, clear the board, now you have many threats and they have an empty hand and an empt board.
They're all Artifacts, though. Sure, the Damping Matrix can shut down 4 pieces of equipment, but a Terashi's Grasp makes all 4 pieces of those equipment come back to life.
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Ive played ww at my local fnm along with one other and we always seem to place second or first. So i thought i might post my post 9th deck and see what everyone thinks. Once mirrodin rotates this deck wont be what it used to be.
Ive played a build like this at an fnm and took second with it except it wasnt post 9th. More testing will need to be done with this deck in order for it to win just like my other weenie builds. I see that most people or choosing to put the promise of bunrei in their deck. Its not a bad choice but its nothing that a simple kagemaro or hideous laughter wouldnt get rid of. If you did have to anthems in play they would live but by then i would have won the game. In stead of promise i put in the steelshapers gift allowing me to search for a jitte if i dont have one in play or i could search for a wargear which allows me to put the hurt on many decks. Its just a thought but once mirrodin rotates then my whole build will change again.
After some playtesting, and some debate among friends, it seems rather evident that White Weenie will be one of the current Standard decks to survive after Mirrodin rotates. It loses Blinkmoth Nexus, Grafted Wargear, the Swords, and Steelshaper's gift, if those were used. However, what we gain from Ninth easily can fill the void.
Speaking of Ninth, that is the reason I am posting here. I want to know what everyone thinks of fitting four Gift of Estates into WW. Before you dismiss the idea, let me say a few things about it.
Gift of Estates clearly isn't Tithe, but it does a few important things. First and foremost, it is an accelerant (sp?). Not in the way that Sakura Tribe Elder accels, but, it can single-handedly up the mana curve boundary for WW. Right now, WW's mana curve seems to stop at 3, while having room to fit in 2 Hokori. No one would even think about trying to fit in a 5cc card, unless it was unfathomably good. That is, not until Gift of Estates came along. The 5cc card I am thinking of? There are a few, but one of the best that comes to mind is Serra Angel in WW. It isn't unthinkable if you play Gift of Estates on turn 2 or 3.
If that isn't enough, the land-thinning the card offers is a huge help. Thin your library of 3 useless Plains? Increase your odds of drawing spells instead of lands? That is pretty good also, I hear.
If I get a positive feedback on Gift of Estates, I'll whip a decklist out. I think it is perfect for us, but I want to hear everyone else's thoughts as well.
I think Gift of Estates can find a place in a few WW decks, but mostly only in decks more tuned to control. If you are looking for speed, then wasting a turn 2 drop is never a good idea...
That said, i'd like to see what we could come up with for a decklist using Gift, and yes, 9th does add alot to it.
I don't know, the cards hate me so at about 2-3 land, I stop getting them, I think gift of estates might actually make it in my build cuz once again, the cards hate me Man.
In the short time when both Mirrodin and 9th are legal, Gift of Estates could significantly support Empyrial Plate.
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Would this work at all or is it too equipment heavy?
-Devin-
Well, two things. You need to decide on whether you're going to run jitte / empyrial or jitte / SoFI. Having three separate sets of equipments is a bad thing unless you reduce their numbers and use steel shaper's gifts.
However, do consider that the decks that you'll be facing at regionals will primarily be T&N, and secondarily the choice of MUC / RDW / MGA / Rats. You have to know your meta to properly figure out which will be "the second" deck of the choice.
But honestly, kusari is a weak metagame choice to begin with as it doesn't really do much on its own or without the opposing equipment on the field.
Also, it is my recommendation to include Hokori, the Dusk drinker in the main deck. This is the card that kept WW in T2 - because it specifially targets decks like MUC, T&N and even RDW who wants to do their spells at the EoT phase.
As for things that you missed out / should drop, you have to realize that charge across the araba is not viable in T2 for two reasons - if you are in position to have five lands in play, then you're most likely dead already vs T&N. Vs. MUC, you won't have enough creatures resolved or under your control to properly use it. Vs. RDW / MGA, they have faster kill cards that you really have no solution against.
Charge is an excellent card in the Block because the block is generally slower than T2. But in T2, it doesn't belong
You missed out on the best weenie that WW has - leonin skyhunter. You cannot forgo this and expect to win in any meaningful T2 tourneys (meaningful tourneys include Regionals, Nationals and the World. It does not include your local FNM or random MTGO tourneys) Skyhunter skirmisher is one mana too slow to be in this deck.
Lastly, if you're planning to run equipment WW, don't use glorious anthem - as they conflict each other's curve.
I didn't really want to spend time on the sb because it is late or late feeling to me, ugh....well here is another deck list to comment on see if this is more solid...God I hope it is....
Eh, I've been quite for a while, but this merits comment. OMFG!!!!!111~!!!~! So let's do the math... Hallow targets 'clasm and I gain 2 for each creature on the field and saving them to boot??? How have people missed this?
Thanks for the svg sideboard tech.
Retired MTGS Rules Guru
at pyroclasm- i dont have to worry about it - i actualy consider any redd deck an auto win because the 8 pro red guys plus auriok champion gains a ****load of life.
Machius proudly supports R_E's right to Rumour!
isn't that what i just said? :tongue2:
Machius proudly supports R_E's right to Rumour!
~Lands~
19 plains
1 Eiganjo Castle
~Creatures~
4 Lantern Kami
4 Suntail Hawk
4 Samurai of the Pale Curtain
3 Leonin Skyhunter
2 Isamaru Hound of Konda
3 Paladin En-Vec
4 Hand of Honor
~Other~
2 Charge across the Araba
3 Umezawa's Jitte
4 Manriki-Gusari
3 Promise of Bunrei
4 Glorious Anthem
any comments please?
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Seriously, Mirrodin block has not rotated out yet, so don't treat it as though it has. You're shorting yourself on over 500 cards in that fashion.
Which color are you?
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Random quote of the last time I updated my sig:
"...FOMG THE SCROLL LOCK KEY DOES SOMETHING "
-Devin-
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yaeh, i messed up - it 3 sofi md and 4 ligh&shadow sb...
-Devin-
Thanks to KrackkShott at Kracked Graphics for my special banner!
Come Join the War!!!
19 plains
1 Eiganjo Castle
~Creatures~
4 Lantern Kami
4 Suntail Hawk
4 Samurai of the Pale Curtain
3 Skyhunter Skirmisher
2 Isamaru Hound of Konda
3 Paladin En-Vec
4 Hand of Honor
2 Charge across the Araba
3 Umezawas Jitte
4 Manriki-Gusari
3 Promise of Bunrei
4 Glorious Anthem
3 Hokori
3 Karma
3 Sword of Fire and Ice
3 Wrath of God
3 Sword of Light and Shadow
the SB isn't really what I want it to be I just threw cards in there, tell me if there needs to be more tweaking please. My meta down here includes Muc and MBC so I have to watch out for those mainly, not much red if any
Deck tags in the future please... Thanks. - MiKe
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SoFI is not all that powerful against the blue match up, sure it stops the three or four bounce spells they run (even though they can still bounce the sofi) and it doesnt stop shackles.
i have been testing different builds of ww for months, and i think this is the optimal build.
4 pladin en-vec
4 skyhunter skirmisher
4 leonin skyhunter
4 auriok champion
4 weathered wayfarer
4 suntail hawk
3 lantern kami
4 pithing needle
3 umezawa's jitte
3 sword of fire and ice
3 glorious anthem
4 aether vial
4 chrome mox
12 plains
4 sword of light and shadow
4 wrath of god
4 kami of ancient law
3 worship
some "odd" card choices, explained.
bikini chick- i run four MD because, well because its busted- you have so many creatures and it just get better in the agrro matchup (think beacon of creation), more life = more time to win.plus being pro red and black is just an added bonus.
pithing needle" target="blank">pithing needle- i run them MD because they shut down cards you lose to (shackles) and other random stuff.
wrath of god- i SB them because its good against T&N, and other agrro, you just hold back playing stuff slowly, then when they over extend, WHAM, clear the board, now you have many threats and they have an empty hand and an empt board.
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Non-Judge - Comprehensive Rules Delver
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Random quote of the last time I updated my sig:
"...FOMG THE SCROLL LOCK KEY DOES SOMETHING "
[CARDS] 18 plains
3 blinkmoth nexus
1 eiganjo castle
creatures
[CARDS] 4 suntail hawk
2 isamaru
2 eight and a half
3 paladin en vec
3 samurai of the pale curtain
3 leonin skyhunter
4 hand of honor
2 hokori
[CARDS] 3 chrome mox
4 umezawas jitte
2 grafted wargear
4 glorious anthem
3 steelshapers gift
Ive played a build like this at an fnm and took second with it except it wasnt post 9th. More testing will need to be done with this deck in order for it to win just like my other weenie builds. I see that most people or choosing to put the promise of bunrei in their deck. Its not a bad choice but its nothing that a simple kagemaro or hideous laughter wouldnt get rid of. If you did have to anthems in play they would live but by then i would have won the game. In stead of promise i put in the steelshapers gift allowing me to search for a jitte if i dont have one in play or i could search for a wargear which allows me to put the hurt on many decks. Its just a thought but once mirrodin rotates then my whole build will change again.
Predigested Prayers Pluck Priests,
Pithing Polytheistict Purification.
After some playtesting, and some debate among friends, it seems rather evident that White Weenie will be one of the current Standard decks to survive after Mirrodin rotates. It loses Blinkmoth Nexus, Grafted Wargear, the Swords, and Steelshaper's gift, if those were used. However, what we gain from Ninth easily can fill the void.
Speaking of Ninth, that is the reason I am posting here. I want to know what everyone thinks of fitting four Gift of Estates into WW. Before you dismiss the idea, let me say a few things about it.
Gift of Estates clearly isn't Tithe, but it does a few important things. First and foremost, it is an accelerant (sp?). Not in the way that Sakura Tribe Elder accels, but, it can single-handedly up the mana curve boundary for WW. Right now, WW's mana curve seems to stop at 3, while having room to fit in 2 Hokori. No one would even think about trying to fit in a 5cc card, unless it was unfathomably good. That is, not until Gift of Estates came along. The 5cc card I am thinking of? There are a few, but one of the best that comes to mind is Serra Angel in WW. It isn't unthinkable if you play Gift of Estates on turn 2 or 3.
If that isn't enough, the land-thinning the card offers is a huge help. Thin your library of 3 useless Plains? Increase your odds of drawing spells instead of lands? That is pretty good also, I hear.
If I get a positive feedback on Gift of Estates, I'll whip a decklist out. I think it is perfect for us, but I want to hear everyone else's thoughts as well.
That said, i'd like to see what we could come up with for a decklist using Gift, and yes, 9th does add alot to it.
-Devin-
Thanks to KrackkShott at Kracked Graphics for my special banner!
Come Join the War!!!
Which color are you?
Non-Judge - Comprehensive Rules Delver
|| Autocard || My Latest Project ||
Random quote of the last time I updated my sig:
"...FOMG THE SCROLL LOCK KEY DOES SOMETHING "
19 plains
1 Eiganjo Castle
~Creatures~
4 Suntail Hawk
4 Samurai of the Pale Curtain
3 Skyhunter Skirmisher
2 Isamaru Hound of Konda
3 Paladin En-Vec
4 Hand of Honor
4 Empyrial Plate
2 Charge across the Araba
4 Umezawas Jitte
3 Manriki-Gusari
3 Gift of Estates
4 Glorious Anthem
3 Hokori
3 Karma
3 Sword of Fire and Ice
3 Wrath of God
3 Sword of Light and Shadow
Would this work at all or is it too equipment heavy?
-Devin-
Thanks to KrackkShott at Kracked Graphics for my special banner!
Come Join the War!!!
Well, two things. You need to decide on whether you're going to run jitte / empyrial or jitte / SoFI. Having three separate sets of equipments is a bad thing unless you reduce their numbers and use steel shaper's gifts.
However, do consider that the decks that you'll be facing at regionals will primarily be T&N, and secondarily the choice of MUC / RDW / MGA / Rats. You have to know your meta to properly figure out which will be "the second" deck of the choice.
But honestly, kusari is a weak metagame choice to begin with as it doesn't really do much on its own or without the opposing equipment on the field.
Also, it is my recommendation to include Hokori, the Dusk drinker in the main deck. This is the card that kept WW in T2 - because it specifially targets decks like MUC, T&N and even RDW who wants to do their spells at the EoT phase.
As for things that you missed out / should drop, you have to realize that charge across the araba is not viable in T2 for two reasons - if you are in position to have five lands in play, then you're most likely dead already vs T&N. Vs. MUC, you won't have enough creatures resolved or under your control to properly use it. Vs. RDW / MGA, they have faster kill cards that you really have no solution against.
Charge is an excellent card in the Block because the block is generally slower than T2. But in T2, it doesn't belong
You missed out on the best weenie that WW has - leonin skyhunter. You cannot forgo this and expect to win in any meaningful T2 tourneys (meaningful tourneys include Regionals, Nationals and the World. It does not include your local FNM or random MTGO tourneys) Skyhunter skirmisher is one mana too slow to be in this deck.
Lastly, if you're planning to run equipment WW, don't use glorious anthem - as they conflict each other's curve.
19 Plains
1 Eiganjo Castle
~Creatures~
4 Suntail Hawk
4 Samurai of the Pale Curtain
4 Leonin Skyhunter
3 Skyhunter Skirmisher
2 Isamaru
3 Paladin En-Vec
4 Hand of Honor
2 Hokori, Dust Drinker
3 Empyrial Plate
3 Umezawas Jitte
2 Sword of Fire and Ice
3 Gift of Estates
3 Steelshapper's Gift
3 Sword of Light and Shadow
4 Wrath of God
4 Karma
3 Circle of Protection: red
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
I didn't really want to spend time on the sb because it is late or late feeling to me, ugh....well here is another deck list to comment on see if this is more solid...God I hope it is....
-Devin-
Thanks to KrackkShott at Kracked Graphics for my special banner!
Come Join the War!!!