I doubt anyone would recognize this thread as such, but wouldnt it be just spectacular if we could have a thread meant just for talking about this lovely casual deck, a place where we could all discuss our thoughts and ideas about the demon/ogre tribe. Who knows what amazing concepts we may come up. We can work together to make Demon/Ogre the next Ravager. If not maybe the next......Snake deck, or something. Either way, please give me the pleasure of posting here when speaking of such topics. Heres my awful attempt at a demon deck.
Many mock the Idols in the deck, but this deck needs a lot of Mana IMO. Plus the idols help for the 2nd turn Persecutes, or 2nd Turn Yukoras. And just generally add speed when needed, and little bits of extra damage.
But for the most part theres lots of things in the deck im unsure of, and I'd love to hear other peoples takes on the Demon/Ogre deck, or any suggestions and disscussion about said deck, that would be really nice, thank you.
Sorry, but in my eyes, bloodthirsty ogre is a very slow and ineffective ogre. In fact, I am not very impressed with ogres dependence on demons when it comes to black ogres. I myself would run red with their ogres since they have a little more versatility. Maybe red isn;t the best choice, I haven;t tested much. You need 4 yukoras. he's the best Ogres and Demons have to offer. As for wrencher and wrecker, I would stick with the one with trample, remove the fear one, and add another scourge of numai.
Red Ogres suck, it is just that simple. No Red, no splashing Red, no wasting space on Red, simply no Red because you want your effective 3-cost for 3 power Ogres. Red Ogres suck and the Red Demon makes Ogre Recluse look good.
Speaking of 3-cost... that's a very common theme around here, so where's the Aether Vials? And speaking of turn 1 drops, I recommend tossing 4 Moxes for 4 Wayfarer's Baubles. Your turn 1 and turn 2 plays are limited as is, so you may as well be getting lands into play. Drop the Guardian Idols... they are cool but a complete waste of space, and go up to 22 land. 18 Swamp and 4 Cloudpost sounds aboud right... you might get lucky and draw a 2nd or 3rd post, but if you don't then it probably isn't skin off your back and doesn't color-screw you like Urzatron.
Speed is nice, but this deck simply isn't going to be fast without lucky draws. Consistency > Luck. If you wanted a fast combo deck, you wouldn't BE playing Ogre/Demon... arguably the slowest deck in the block. Neat plays are cool, but there's combo decks for that.
With the mana fixes in mind... get rid of Mark of the Oni. God that card's bad. In fact, Persecute won't be fitting anymore without the combo stuff. Maybe side-in Mark of the Oni and Eradicate vs Tooth and Nail. (Or Cranial Extraction.)
Up the Blood Speakers to 4. Remember that Yokura is hardly the only cost-effective Demon out there... Seizan and Kyoki (not so much) have their virtues. Reiver Demon from Mirrodin may or may not be too slow to use. Certainly in theme, and certainly a game-winner.
Finally, Loxodon Warhammer should be considered. Nothing in your deck is under 3 power to start with... so 6+ and Trample with the life renewal can make even your crud Ogres into huge threats that generally must be blocked. Ogre Marauder and Villainous Ogre simply love this. Big Demons like Yokura and especially Seizan love it too... reducing their life brings them closer to death, while giving you a large safety net.
Hey, the principles somehow managed to bring my Ogre/Demon deck to an undefeated streak... though I still don't know how THAT happened. This deck isn't about speed, and doesn't start til turn 3 basically. That's why this deck is a casual deck. Some Ogres and Demons may make it into competitive decks, but Ogre/Demon is not competitive by any means.
i certainly found your idea of Loxodon Warhammer pleasureable, thank you. I can't understand how Mark Of The Oni is bad though. IMO its like the reason I chose to even bother with Demon/Ogre after seeing Betrayers, what is it you don't like about it? I understand it has the crappy stipulation of needing a demon out, but I usually do, and Mark has won me games.
The problem I had with Seizan was that the opponent gets to benefit from it first giving him this where he can just play crazy things before I can respond. I had Seizan but In, but I kept holding him in my hand not wanting to give my opponent such glee.
I like the idea of perhaps Baubles too, and cloudposts. Thank you, perhaps I'll try that as well.
I can't understand how Mark Of The Oni is bad though. IMO its like the reason I chose to even bother with Demon/Ogre after seeing Betrayers, what is it you don't like about it? I understand it has the crappy stipulation of needing a demon out, but I usually do, and Mark has won me games.
Heavy dependent situationality makes for a bad card 9 times out of 10. I can see how it might work to eliminate a blocker for 1 turn of nothing else, but I feel the Warhammers or straight removal is better suited for the task.
The problem I had with Seizan was that the opponent gets to benefit from it first giving him this where he can just play crazy things before I can respond. I had Seizan but In, but I kept holding him in my hand not wanting to give my opponent such glee.
Yeh, but you have a 6/5. Competitively speaking... bad idea, doom... casually speaking, it's not that bad. Plus, you can always Vial it at end of turn. If they play Iwamori, even better, suckers.
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-Blue Cosmos
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3 Yukora, The Prisoner
3 Gutwrencher Oni
2 Painwrecker Oni
3 Scourge Of Numai
4 Ogre Maruader
3 Takenuma Bleeder
3 Villanous Ogre
2 Bloodthirsty Ogre
3 Bloodspeaker
3 Rend Flesh
3 Echoing Decay
3 Persecute
4 Guardian Idol
4 Chrome Mox
18 Swamp
Many mock the Idols in the deck, but this deck needs a lot of Mana IMO. Plus the idols help for the 2nd turn Persecutes, or 2nd Turn Yukoras. And just generally add speed when needed, and little bits of extra damage.
But for the most part theres lots of things in the deck im unsure of, and I'd love to hear other peoples takes on the Demon/Ogre deck, or any suggestions and disscussion about said deck, that would be really nice, thank you.
Speaking of 3-cost... that's a very common theme around here, so where's the Aether Vials? And speaking of turn 1 drops, I recommend tossing 4 Moxes for 4 Wayfarer's Baubles. Your turn 1 and turn 2 plays are limited as is, so you may as well be getting lands into play. Drop the Guardian Idols... they are cool but a complete waste of space, and go up to 22 land. 18 Swamp and 4 Cloudpost sounds aboud right... you might get lucky and draw a 2nd or 3rd post, but if you don't then it probably isn't skin off your back and doesn't color-screw you like Urzatron.
Speed is nice, but this deck simply isn't going to be fast without lucky draws. Consistency > Luck. If you wanted a fast combo deck, you wouldn't BE playing Ogre/Demon... arguably the slowest deck in the block. Neat plays are cool, but there's combo decks for that.
With the mana fixes in mind... get rid of Mark of the Oni. God that card's bad. In fact, Persecute won't be fitting anymore without the combo stuff. Maybe side-in Mark of the Oni and Eradicate vs Tooth and Nail. (Or Cranial Extraction.)
Up the Blood Speakers to 4. Remember that Yokura is hardly the only cost-effective Demon out there... Seizan and Kyoki (not so much) have their virtues. Reiver Demon from Mirrodin may or may not be too slow to use. Certainly in theme, and certainly a game-winner.
Finally, Loxodon Warhammer should be considered. Nothing in your deck is under 3 power to start with... so 6+ and Trample with the life renewal can make even your crud Ogres into huge threats that generally must be blocked. Ogre Marauder and Villainous Ogre simply love this. Big Demons like Yokura and especially Seizan love it too... reducing their life brings them closer to death, while giving you a large safety net.
Hey, the principles somehow managed to bring my Ogre/Demon deck to an undefeated streak... though I still don't know how THAT happened. This deck isn't about speed, and doesn't start til turn 3 basically. That's why this deck is a casual deck. Some Ogres and Demons may make it into competitive decks, but Ogre/Demon is not competitive by any means.
-Blue Cosmos
The problem I had with Seizan was that the opponent gets to benefit from it first giving him this where he can just play crazy things before I can respond. I had Seizan but In, but I kept holding him in my hand not wanting to give my opponent such glee.
I like the idea of perhaps Baubles too, and cloudposts. Thank you, perhaps I'll try that as well.
Anyone else have any decklists also?
Heavy dependent situationality makes for a bad card 9 times out of 10. I can see how it might work to eliminate a blocker for 1 turn of nothing else, but I feel the Warhammers or straight removal is better suited for the task.
Yeh, but you have a 6/5. Competitively speaking... bad idea, doom... casually speaking, it's not that bad. Plus, you can always Vial it at end of turn. If they play Iwamori, even better, suckers.
-Blue Cosmos