For you not to realize that Mono Red is best deck in the format, if not first then most certainly top 2, you must not have been paying any attention to the meta game, online or paper tournaments..
If you truly believe that Mono Red looses to one Supreme Verdict, then I must assume your information comes from illegitimate sources, for example, only very bad mono red players loose to Supreme Verdict, sometimes it can't be helped, but anyone competent enough with am aggro decks knows how to work around wraths - Which is why, in this format full of Verdicts, Revelations and Thragtusks, Mono Red still reigns over them...
What does Mono Red get from Gatecrash?
Not much, but it didn't need to, what it did get was an Insane 3 drop in Boros Reckoner and skullcrack...
It could conceivably be very easy to attribute your victory over mono red, as simply playing a rogue deck...
I didn't come to this thread to flame anyone, I'm sincerely interested in the deck, but your information is misguided, don't get ahead of yourself...
When Mono Red is the best deck in any given format, you'll be surprised with how many archetypes in can single handily nullify and render useless
It prolly was a rogue Red deck, TBH. As a red player at heart, I am very excited about Reckoner and Skullcrack. However, moving forward, if you look at the control decks that are player playing 6-8 (maybe 10 if Merciless Eviction gets there) sweepers and red decks having no answers to them (Most red decks I've seen at the top tables are far more creature based than burn based), yes any red player can loose to wraths.
In fact, almost any creature based deck can loose to sweepers and lifegain spells. Do I think mono red or a red based aggro deck will be top tier? Of course i do! Do I think a very experienced red player can beat a control deck after a wrath? YES!
As for some cards that have been suggested to me:
-Thragtusk in the Sideboard! As good as he is, I haven't really found a way to justify him main deck next to Soul of the Harvest
-Prime Speaker Zegana She is really cool and really flashy, but I would want Soul at the 6 drop. He draws you more cards over more turns. I will test her out thought...I haven't have much playing experience with her, so don't quote me just yet.
Doing a lot of testing on draws and I must say I feel like this deck is just one good elf short of being competitive.
Relies too heavily on the Elvish Archdruid to get anything BIG going.
Biomancer is amazing obviously, but still doesnt get online till about turn 4 if everything goes to plan.
And in the mean time there aren't many ways to deal with agressive threats.
Biomancer doesn't really stabalize unless you can cast a bunch of cards after you cast him..
The decks "nut draws" are amazing but susecptial to disruption via removal.. and it's mediocre draws are quite bad.
Would like to try to fix that
Agreed. I do feel as though it does rely on Archdruid too much...but we need him for mana production...we don't have the luxury of a million mana dorks like Green Summer did last season. Deathrite Shaman would be sweet, but he's to slow for us. It's an option...
But I'm not about to cut the white. Splashing white for Gavony and Mikaeus have been awesome and I really think the future of the deck is Bant.
Tonight, I'll be testing PSZ over Mikaeus. Let's see what happens.
The deck does rely heavily on Archdruid, which is why I think running at least 2x of Clone is useful (some people in the other Elves thread are running 4x of it). Its very useful for cloning Biomancer as well.
I think Creeping Renaissance is also far superior to Faith's Reward. It is rare that early on you will have the mana to cast Faith's Reward on the turn they cast their sweeper. Creeping Renaissance can be cast any turn after that and its going to get you everything back but your Clones and Behemoth anyway. Its just a much more realistic option. I know it brings them to your hand instead of the battlefield, but if you don't have the mana to cast Faith's Reward its not going to do anything for you and constantly leaving open 4 mana from turn 4 on is tough with this deck. Renaissance also has flashback, giving you recovery from a second wipe with only the one card.
I have been running White for Mikhaeus, and it makes a big difference to this deck imo. He interacts well with with everyone, especially Zameck, which makes things difficult for me since I am still iffy on including Zameck. I have him down to a 2x for now, I am considering dropping him all together. He is an elf which is a plus, but I rarely have the mana to use his abilities early on when they count. My ramp is pretty good with 4x arbor elf/4x archdruid/4x farseek/2x Clone (sort of ramp since he can be a druid/elf), so I am thinking of throwing in 2x Garruk, Primal Hunter's. Still unsure. The deck isn't testing terribly, but it still needs some work to be competitive.
Trying to make this a strong and consistent decklist. I got rid of soul of the harvest for 3x Abundant Growth to improve my mana base to allow for my Abrupt decay / Golgari charms to come out when needed. I may add in 1 more Abrupt Decay to the mainboard.
X-post from my post over in the developing thread.
Been running something similar with pretty decent success. That being said I've found Zameck guildmage all but pointless and gyre sage is downright awful since most creatures aren't going to be triggering evolve. I was running her until someone pointed out that elvish archdruid will not trigger evolve, and makes it even harder for her evolve to trigger. Farseek in her spot has done far better for me.
Here's the list I've been tinkering with. I started a thread for it, but it, and a 3rd Simic/BUG Elf thread got burried about 3 pages in. So here we have it...
An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
There were tags around the other thread and I was being lazy. Sue me. There's like 4 or 5 threads for this same deck archtype.
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An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
Possibly. If you are already running Simic CHarmas a 4-off MB I wouldn't though. Simic Charm offers the same (or even more) protection; hexproof vs regenerate and is also open for other shenanigans.
Simic Charm doesn't offer half the necessary protection needed. Supreme Verdict, Bonfire of the Damned, etc are all dealt with with Golgari Charm not with Simic Charm. Golgari charm also nukes enchantments. Sorry, but Golgari Charm > Simic Charm in this build.
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An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
Simic Charm doesn't offer half the necessary protection needed. Supreme Verdict, Bonfire of the Damned, etc are all dealt with with Golgari Charm not with Simic Charm. Golgari charm also nukes enchantments. Sorry, but Golgari Charm > Simic Charm in this build.
This ^
I've swapped out gyre sages and zamek guildmages for thragtusks and clones. I dropped the abundant growths for farseeks. It seems this build really abuses master biomancer. I had 5 creatures on the field on turn 3 with 2 of the being 5/5 elves, 2 2/2 elves and 1 3/5. Pretty disgusting if the opponent doesn't have answers.
I've swapped out gyre sages and zamek guildmages for thragtusks and clones. I dropped the abundant growths for farseeks. It seems this build really abuses master biomancer. I had 5 creatures on the field on turn 3 with 2 of the being 5/5 elves, 2 2/2 elves and 1 3/5. Pretty disgusting if the opponent doesn't have answers.
Do you run Deathrite Shamans? I'm trying to figure out if they actually work as well as people think they might in this build.
Side note: Post 500. Wee!
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An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
My brother tried some of these elves lists, and it was not decent at all.
Which builds did he try? What decks did he test them against? Did he play cards he shouldn't have? A little more info would be helpful...
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An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
My brother tried some of these elves lists, and it was not decent at all.
Instead of posting some nay saying comment how about some constructive criticism? Which ones did he try? What didn't work? What did he think is missing? Don't be an ass and post crap like that up. We're trying to work together to make a decent deck list.
Here is the list I've come up with gonna play test it a bit tonight to see how it does;
Instead of posting some nay saying comment how about some constructive criticism? Which ones did he try? What didn't work? What did he think is missing? Don't be an ass and post crap like that up. We're trying to work together to make a decent deck list.
Here is the list I've come up with gonna play test it a bit tonight to see how it does;
Almost beat me to it. (The politely chastising him, that is. ) Haven't thought about the Clone route. Has that worked well? The more elves the better.
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An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
Almost beat me to it. (The politely chastising him, that is. ) Haven't thought about the Clone route. Has that worked well? The more elves the better.
Clone is the star of the deck for me. Cloning biomancers can get hilarious. Cloning Archdruid can allow you to hit the mana ramp you need, and keep your guys out of burn range. Cloning Thragtusks (if you have them in your list) can keep you going at the last minute. And best of all, sometimes the best answer you have to an opponents threat is cloning it (Boros Reckoner, Geist of St. Traft, etc.)
I haven't tried Clone yet but like zerokku said, and I also feel, its gonna be an all star in here. I only have 3 Thragtusk but I let my girlfriend use them in her G/W midrange so I have none for use in mine. But even having the chance when an opponent plays one you can answer back with your own will be a shenanigan. As for Biomass Mutation I've only put the deck together about 15 minutes ago after tweaking it on paper I'll be testing it a little later tonight. I'm really hoping this card allows for some surprise damage either early on in the game or following a Cyclonic Rift.
Look at this! I come home from a long day at college and dinner at my girlfriend's house and my deck has taken a whole new turn!
"Without deviation from the norm, progress isn't possible"-Frank Zappa
While I wanted to stay in the Bant range, BUG is looking more and more appealing, just for the ability for playing Golgari Charm. In my earlier posts about this deck list, I mentioned that Deathrite Shaman was too slow or wasn't really fit for the deck...it's all about quick mana ramp into a stupidly large 'Hoof and friends, or stupidly large guys from Biomancer. To me, he's just a bit slow on the mana accel (you need a land in either graveyard, which is hard to do now). Golgari Charm is an all star any day of the week.
Quick thoughts about last night's testing with Prime Speaker Zegana:
-Gyre Sage is really not very good here...as sad as it is to say. Sage and Archdruid don't mix at all. Only time I really benefitted off of a Gyre Sage was after I played a Biomancer, but at that point in the game, all my other guys were so huge and I was swings away from finishing.
-Prime Speaker showed up once in play testing and she just drew me 4 cards and attacked once before all my other guys outclassed her. Wasn't as back breaking as I thought she was going to be.
-While he has been slow, Zameck Guildmage has been great for me. I tried just straight up Elvish Visionary, but seeing has he as repeated card draw, is a 2/2 for 2 instead of a 1/1 for 2 and can pump all my guys, he seems like the better 2 for me. But that's just how I see the deck.
An interesting argument was brought up with regards to Clone. I love this idea. Being able to play 8 Elvish Archdruids or 8 Master Biomancer makes me so happy.
Yeva and Thragtusk? Hmmmm....
I'm not about to cut white from the equation for 1 card (Maybe 2 if someone gives me a good reason why I should play Deathrite Shaman other than "OMG SO BROKENZ BEST ELF EVAR"). Granted, we could just play a Farseek-able Overgrown Tomb ... but that would be going 4 colors...(head starts to hurt thinking about manabase)
I think going forward, Gyre Sage needs to be removed. She doesn't work well with any of the high end creature as well as Elvish Archdruid, the deck's "best card" and chief mana producer.
RedKid, did you mean you're not about to add white for 1 card? I'm really stoked for this deck. I just need my Biomancers to show up on my doorstep!
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An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
Golgari charm is a one shot deal. Against any control deck with multiple sweeps, or against any red/black deck with a lot of burn, the one or two Golgari Charms you pull aren't going to be as helpful. Terminus is a huge problem for this deck, but Simic charm at least allows you to save an archdruid/biomancer by putting it back to your hand. I run 2 Negates for this as well, but if I don't have one in my hand, getting an Archdruid/Biomancer back is about the best we can hope for. The Golgari charm might save you from one or two sweepers, but you will still likely run out of Charms before a control deck runs out of sweepers. It also doesn't help you against things like Oblivion Ring or being targets of abilities like Tamiyo's tap, Olivia's vampire control, etc., all of which are very prevelant in the current meta. Creeping Rennaisance allows you to recover even from multiple early burns and take it to the late game. Its especially effective with Tracker's Insight, which lets us pitch cards to the graveyard quickly. We can leave it in the gy until we need it and then cast it for the flashback cost.
I am not saying Golgari Charm is bad for this deck in any way. My only thought is that so far I feel that Bant is the stronger color scheme for Mikhaeus and Gavony to provide some late game reach.
That being said, some could make the argument that the Golgari guildmage is better then Mikhaeus/Gavony. I haven't tested it out yet, but some people on this thread seem to have had some good results with it.
It prolly was a rogue Red deck, TBH. As a red player at heart, I am very excited about Reckoner and Skullcrack. However, moving forward, if you look at the control decks that are player playing 6-8 (maybe 10 if Merciless Eviction gets there) sweepers and red decks having no answers to them (Most red decks I've seen at the top tables are far more creature based than burn based), yes any red player can loose to wraths.
In fact, almost any creature based deck can loose to sweepers and lifegain spells. Do I think mono red or a red based aggro deck will be top tier? Of course i do! Do I think a very experienced red player can beat a control deck after a wrath? YES!
As for some cards that have been suggested to me:
-Thragtusk in the Sideboard! As good as he is, I haven't really found a way to justify him main deck next to Soul of the Harvest
-Prime Speaker Zegana She is really cool and really flashy, but I would want Soul at the 6 drop. He draws you more cards over more turns. I will test her out thought...I haven't have much playing experience with her, so don't quote me just yet.
Agreed. I do feel as though it does rely on Archdruid too much...but we need him for mana production...we don't have the luxury of a million mana dorks like Green Summer did last season. Deathrite Shaman would be sweet, but he's to slow for us. It's an option...
But I'm not about to cut the white. Splashing white for Gavony and Mikaeus have been awesome and I really think the future of the deck is Bant.
Tonight, I'll be testing PSZ over Mikaeus. Let's see what happens.
"There are no two words in the English language more harmful than 'good job'." -Terrance Fletcher, Whiplash (2014)
I think Creeping Renaissance is also far superior to Faith's Reward. It is rare that early on you will have the mana to cast Faith's Reward on the turn they cast their sweeper. Creeping Renaissance can be cast any turn after that and its going to get you everything back but your Clones and Behemoth anyway. Its just a much more realistic option. I know it brings them to your hand instead of the battlefield, but if you don't have the mana to cast Faith's Reward its not going to do anything for you and constantly leaving open 4 mana from turn 4 on is tough with this deck. Renaissance also has flashback, giving you recovery from a second wipe with only the one card.
I have been running White for Mikhaeus, and it makes a big difference to this deck imo. He interacts well with with everyone, especially Zameck, which makes things difficult for me since I am still iffy on including Zameck. I have him down to a 2x for now, I am considering dropping him all together. He is an elf which is a plus, but I rarely have the mana to use his abilities early on when they count. My ramp is pretty good with 4x arbor elf/4x archdruid/4x farseek/2x Clone (sort of ramp since he can be a druid/elf), so I am thinking of throwing in 2x Garruk, Primal Hunter's. Still unsure. The deck isn't testing terribly, but it still needs some work to be competitive.
List:
4 Arbor Elf
3 Gyre Sage
4 Elvish Visionary
2 Zameck Guildmage
4 Elvish Archdruid
4 Master Biomancer
2 Yeva, Nature's Herald
2 Craterhoof Behemoth
2 Deathrite Shaman
Spells (9)
2 Garruk, Primal Hunter
3 Golgari Charm
2 Abrupt Decay
3 Abundant Growth
4 Breeding Pool
4 Hinterland Harbor
2 Cavern of Souls
2 Woodland Cemetery
4 Overgrown Tomb
2 Island
5 Forests
2 Dispel
2 Silklash Spider
1 Golgari Charm
4 Thragtusk
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Negate
2 Crushing Vine
4 Arbor Elf
4 Elvish Archdruid
4 Elvish Visionary
4 Master Biomancer
4 Clone
3 Thragtusk
2 Yeva, Nature's Herald
2 Craterhoof Behemoth
4 Farseek
Instants -
4 Simic Charm
Planeswalkers -
2 Garruk, Primal Hunter
Land -
4 Breeding Pool
4 Hinterland Harbor
4 Cavern of Souls
9 Forest
2 Island
4 Negate
3 Naturalize
3 Rapid Hybridization
3 Silklash Spider
2 Glaring Spotlight
4 Arbor Elf
4 Elvish Visionary
2 Mikaeus, the Lunarch
4 Elvish Archdruid
4 Master Biomancer
2 Craterhoof Behemoth
4 Farseek
2 Negate
2 Tracker's Instincts
2 Simic Charm
2 Blustersquall
2 Creeping Renaissance
4 Breeding Pool
4 Hinterland Harbor
6 Forest
3 Island
2 Clone
2 Gavony Township
4 Temple Garden
1 Plains
Edit: Added Biomass Mutation anyway
4 Arbor Elf
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Spire Tracer
4 Elvish Visionary
4 Elvish Archdruid
2 Golgari Decoy
4 Ivy Lane Denizen
4 Master Biomancer
2 Biomass Mutation
3 Negate
2 Descendents' Path
Lands: 23
4 Breeding Pool
4 Forest
2 Gavony Township
4 Hinterland Harbor
3 Island
2 Overgrown Tomb
4 Temple Garden
Lands (22):
Breeding Pool x4
Cavern of Souls x3
Drowned Catacomb
Forest x2
Hinterland Harbor x4
Overgrown Tomb x4
Swamp
Woodland Cemetery x3
Creatures (26):
Arbor Elf x4
Craterhoof Behmoth x2
Elvish Archdruid x4
Elvish Visionary x4
Gyre Sage x3
Kordoza Guildmage x3
Master Biomancer x4
Zameck Guildmage x2
Non-Creatures (12):
Biomass Mutation x2
Farseek x4
Golgari Charm x4
Simic Charm x2
An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
GP Vegas: It was once in a lifetime!
On Vault of the Archangel
There were tags around the other thread and I was being lazy. Sue me. There's like 4 or 5 threads for this same deck archtype.
An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
GP Vegas: It was once in a lifetime!
On Vault of the Archangel
Simic Charm doesn't offer half the necessary protection needed. Supreme Verdict, Bonfire of the Damned, etc are all dealt with with Golgari Charm not with Simic Charm. Golgari charm also nukes enchantments. Sorry, but Golgari Charm > Simic Charm in this build.
An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
GP Vegas: It was once in a lifetime!
On Vault of the Archangel
This ^
I've swapped out gyre sages and zamek guildmages for thragtusks and clones. I dropped the abundant growths for farseeks. It seems this build really abuses master biomancer. I had 5 creatures on the field on turn 3 with 2 of the being 5/5 elves, 2 2/2 elves and 1 3/5. Pretty disgusting if the opponent doesn't have answers.
Do you run Deathrite Shamans? I'm trying to figure out if they actually work as well as people think they might in this build.
Side note: Post 500. Wee!
An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
GP Vegas: It was once in a lifetime!
On Vault of the Archangel
Daretti
Ezuri
Captain Sisay (In work)
Hazezon Tamar EDH
Which builds did he try? What decks did he test them against? Did he play cards he shouldn't have? A little more info would be helpful...
An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
GP Vegas: It was once in a lifetime!
On Vault of the Archangel
Instead of posting some nay saying comment how about some constructive criticism? Which ones did he try? What didn't work? What did he think is missing? Don't be an ass and post crap like that up. We're trying to work together to make a decent deck list.
Here is the list I've come up with gonna play test it a bit tonight to see how it does;
4 Arbor Elf
3 Deathrite Shaman
4 Elvish Visionary
4 Elvish Archdruid
4 Master Biomancer
3 Clone
2 Craterhoof Behemoth
Spells (12):
2 Biomass Mutation
4 Golgari Charm
1 Cyclonic Rift
2 Simic Charm
3 Abrupt Decay
4 Breeding Pool
4 Overgrown Tomb
4 Hinterland Harbor
4 Woodland Cemetery
3 Forest
2 Island
2 Cavern of Souls
3 Rapid Hybridization
4 Witchbane Orb
Almost beat me to it. (The politely chastising him, that is. ) Haven't thought about the Clone route. Has that worked well? The more elves the better.
An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
GP Vegas: It was once in a lifetime!
On Vault of the Archangel
Clone is the star of the deck for me. Cloning biomancers can get hilarious. Cloning Archdruid can allow you to hit the mana ramp you need, and keep your guys out of burn range. Cloning Thragtusks (if you have them in your list) can keep you going at the last minute. And best of all, sometimes the best answer you have to an opponents threat is cloning it (Boros Reckoner, Geist of St. Traft, etc.)
2 deathrite shamans.
Such a powerful card, and an elf, I can't see why anyone would run elves without this, golgari charm and abrupt decay.
My current list:
4 Arbor Elf
4 Elvish Visionary
4 Elvish Archdruid
4 Master Biomancer
2 Yeva, Nature's Herald
3 Thragtusk
2 Clone
2 Craterhoof Behemoth
2 Deathrite Shaman
Spells (10)
2 Garruk, Primal Hunter
3 Golgari Charm
1 Abrupt Decay
4 Farseek
4 Breeding Pool
4 Hinterland Harbor
2 Cavern of Souls
2 Woodland Cemetery
4 Overgrown Tomb
2 Island
5 Forests
2 Dispel
2 Silklash Spider
1 Golgari Charm
3 Kraken Hatchling
1 Thragtusk
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Negate
2 Crushing Vine
"Without deviation from the norm, progress isn't possible"-Frank Zappa
While I wanted to stay in the Bant range, BUG is looking more and more appealing, just for the ability for playing Golgari Charm. In my earlier posts about this deck list, I mentioned that Deathrite Shaman was too slow or wasn't really fit for the deck...it's all about quick mana ramp into a stupidly large 'Hoof and friends, or stupidly large guys from Biomancer. To me, he's just a bit slow on the mana accel (you need a land in either graveyard, which is hard to do now). Golgari Charm is an all star any day of the week.
Quick thoughts about last night's testing with Prime Speaker Zegana:
-Gyre Sage is really not very good here...as sad as it is to say. Sage and Archdruid don't mix at all. Only time I really benefitted off of a Gyre Sage was after I played a Biomancer, but at that point in the game, all my other guys were so huge and I was swings away from finishing.
-Prime Speaker showed up once in play testing and she just drew me 4 cards and attacked once before all my other guys outclassed her. Wasn't as back breaking as I thought she was going to be.
-While he has been slow, Zameck Guildmage has been great for me. I tried just straight up Elvish Visionary, but seeing has he as repeated card draw, is a 2/2 for 2 instead of a 1/1 for 2 and can pump all my guys, he seems like the better 2 for me. But that's just how I see the deck.
An interesting argument was brought up with regards to Clone. I love this idea. Being able to play 8 Elvish Archdruids or 8 Master Biomancer makes me so happy.
Yeva and Thragtusk? Hmmmm....
I'm not about to cut white from the equation for 1 card (Maybe 2 if someone gives me a good reason why I should play Deathrite Shaman other than "OMG SO BROKENZ BEST ELF EVAR"). Granted, we could just play a Farseek-able Overgrown Tomb ... but that would be going 4 colors...(head starts to hurt thinking about manabase)
I think going forward, Gyre Sage needs to be removed. She doesn't work well with any of the high end creature as well as Elvish Archdruid, the deck's "best card" and chief mana producer.
Possible core for the deck?
This is something...I could get behind. Just for the Kraken Hatchlings...LOL JK. No serious, this deck looks really solid. Why the Hatchings, though?
"There are no two words in the English language more harmful than 'good job'." -Terrance Fletcher, Whiplash (2014)
An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
GP Vegas: It was once in a lifetime!
On Vault of the Archangel
"There are no two words in the English language more harmful than 'good job'." -Terrance Fletcher, Whiplash (2014)
Golgari charm is a one shot deal. Against any control deck with multiple sweeps, or against any red/black deck with a lot of burn, the one or two Golgari Charms you pull aren't going to be as helpful. Terminus is a huge problem for this deck, but Simic charm at least allows you to save an archdruid/biomancer by putting it back to your hand. I run 2 Negates for this as well, but if I don't have one in my hand, getting an Archdruid/Biomancer back is about the best we can hope for. The Golgari charm might save you from one or two sweepers, but you will still likely run out of Charms before a control deck runs out of sweepers. It also doesn't help you against things like Oblivion Ring or being targets of abilities like Tamiyo's tap, Olivia's vampire control, etc., all of which are very prevelant in the current meta. Creeping Rennaisance allows you to recover even from multiple early burns and take it to the late game. Its especially effective with Tracker's Insight, which lets us pitch cards to the graveyard quickly. We can leave it in the gy until we need it and then cast it for the flashback cost.
I am not saying Golgari Charm is bad for this deck in any way. My only thought is that so far I feel that Bant is the stronger color scheme for Mikhaeus and Gavony to provide some late game reach.
That being said, some could make the argument that the Golgari guildmage is better then Mikhaeus/Gavony. I haven't tested it out yet, but some people on this thread seem to have had some good results with it.