Rogue and Haruspex are 2 different engines. Haruspex is a card draw engine. Rogue is a win con. I just think that husk is weak to removal in that engine. I know husk can be recurred with Lily, but having to swing seems less robust than triggers off cutthroat.
One thing I really do like about the the U/B rogue/husk engine is that it takes a very honey badger view of Anafenza. Plus you get Sidisi's Faithful to bounce a problem.
One concern I have looking at several recent lists is the number of taplands. Is the combination of 7-8 basics and some fetches on top enough to make battle lands reliable? Does it vary with color (can Esper afford to cut it closer than Mardu because of better fetches)?
I've been playing the abzan list with rally for a combo finish. Overall I've definitely been liking it. Has anyone who has been playing this version considered Sidisi 1.0? I just threw her in there but have only played 3 rounds and only saw her once and couldn't cast her (playing against RG landfall so at that point I was already dead). I figure she can be a solid way of filling the yard while still providing some ground coverage
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Modern: UWR Breach, UWB Esper control
Legacy: UW RiP/Helm, UR Sneak and Show
What would you say to running Abzan Ascendancy in the board against a heavy Dragons Meta?
I tried both Abzan Ascendancy and Mardu Ascendancy in some of my testing and I ultimately cut both cards. It always felt too slow and wasn't really advancing my board state or my game plan. I wanted to be playing cards like Liliana, Heretical healerCatacomb Sifter or any of my 3 mana removal instead. However if your playing some kind of Rally the Ancestors version of the deck I think it's a fine card. To answer your question more specifically about dragons in your meta, I think I'd try adding some more removal that can deal with those threats. I've yet to come across a Dragon deck that was running more than 6-7 dragons total.
Thanks for the comment!
Guess its time to play some magic! =D
I am unsure how to handle the 4color rally combo deck other than boarding in duress and Anafenza. They don't care about anything we are doing, draw more cards, and bounce anything relevant. Anyone else having trouble against them?
THIS 100X!!! If you don't agree with this then there is no amount of logic that will ever convince you that good, non-oppressive, combos should be allowed. If you don't agree with it then just don't play this game, and you certainly shouldn't feel entitled to make any comment on ban lists ever.
I am unsure how to handle the 4color rally combo deck other than boarding in duress and Anafenza. They don't care about anything we are doing, draw more cards, and bounce anything relevant. Anyone else having trouble against them?
Infinite Obliteration targeting Husk can just stop them dead that only leaves the Sidisi's Faithful left for them to sac stuff. Take all the husks away and they can't combo then rally just exiles all their creatures without a sac outlet.
Those Butchers and Champions need to be in the main butcher is one of the main reasons to go Mardu and you should have 4 Emissaries. Your list also has a lot of non-creatures I'd drop the utter end, bone spilters and the dragon fodder for some Fleshbag Marauder.
this is my first post. I wanted to share my version of a semi budget BG Aristocrats based on the Battle for Zendikar Event Deck Ultimate Sacrifice. Any advice appreciated.
Those Butchers and Champions need to be in the main butcher is one of the main reasons to go Mardu and you should have 4 Emissaries. Your list also has a lot of non-creatures I'd drop the utter end, bone spilters and the dragon fodder for some Fleshbag Marauder.
Agree, the Butchers are the whole reason to play Mardu. Personally I'd replace the Abominations, dragon fodder, utter end, and bone splinters with 4 Butchers and the 4th Haruspex and Emissary and the set of Marauders.
Played Calcano's UB version for Game Day this past Saturday (it had been rescheduled due to flooding). Went 2-2 to take third place in the event (only 8 people showed up).
Match 1 vs RG Ramp (2-0)
Game 1: Was able to build a good board and take him down before he was able to get anything but a couple Rattleclaw Mystics on the board.
Game 2: He boarded in Radiant Flames and drew two of them. Both times I was able to save Nantuko Husk through a sacrificed creature. Second time he was at 8 life and I top decked a Whirler Rogue. I was also able to keep him off of 10 mana by using Sidi's Faithful and a flipped Liliana to bounce his Rattleclaws every turn.
Match 2 vs Abzan (0-2)
Game 1: Never drew any husks or Cutthroats, lost to double Siege Rhino and Anafenza.
Game 2: Never drew any lands, was stuck on 1 the whole game.
Game 3 (for funsies): Didn't draw ridiculously bad hands and handily beat him with an unblockable 14/14 Nantuko Husk. I honestly think if I had drawn any of the pieces in the first game, or lands in the second I would have won this.
Game 2: Pretty much the exact same as Game 1. Got three Cutthroats on the board at one point in time, then played Hangarback Walker for 0, then brought him back for 0 with Liliana, draining him for 6 for 0 mana. Not bad.
I conceded the top 4 match, as it was against the Abzan player and it was getting late, plus there was zero prize support, so finishing 4th or 1st wouldn't make any difference besides the mat, which I was ok not getting. Of the top four players I had already beaten one in the first match, and knew I could beat the Abzan as long as I drew ok. The other deck was burn, so I think I might have fared ok against it as well.
I love the deck and all the interactions. One of the top players at the store watched my first match and said it made him want to play the deck because it looked so fun.
Greetings. This is my first post and it was motivated by this discussion. I've read very useful tips for this kind of deck (which i'm playing by now), thank you for that.
I'm playing the sultai version of this, but only whirler rogue from blue (it is kinda nice finisher). This is my list:
My deck is evolving every week, trying to fix what went wrong in last FNM. But i can't find a way to become a real deal, a threat. Someome said before, in this very discussion to other player: "you play many tricks, but very few threats". That phrase made a lot of sense to me because that is exactly how i feel and i don't know how to make this quicker, or more agressive.
My last incorporation was visionary. That draw engine helped me a lot to get what i need, but i still can't resist the pressure from decks like abzan (my worse match up, always losing 2-0), and keep losing my weak creatures, so nantuko doesn't have any sacrificial material and liliana, the great she is, can't resist that rythm and pressure.
Any suggestion please? How could i become a bigger threat? and, maybe more critical than that, what should i consider on my sideboard to play against abzan? what has worked to you? what do you consider is our weakness against that deck and how may we counter that difficult? because obliteration against anafenza, even though works fine, doesn't seems to be enough!
Thank you!
Edit: I removed 3 blisterpod, 1 whirler rogue and 1 murderous cut. In their place, i added +1 Catacomb sifter, +1 elvish visionary, +1 smothering abomination AND +2 collected company (this one rocks! it does exactly what i was asking. I'm considering to use the playset, but i only have 2 of them by now)
Hey I just got third place at my local FNM with my Sultai Aristocrats list. I really don't understand some of the card choices in these lists ignoring the most powerful cards in the strategy like Sidisi, Brood Tyrant and Evolutionary Leap which can singehandedly win control matches. Anyway here's my list.
I don't feel theres great justification to pick one splash over the other. Sidisi is insane in this deck. Opponents always seem to feel she's a must answer and leaving a 2/2 body behind is just pure value in a deck that maximizes value, think once in twenty games I had to wait until turn 5 to cast her because of mana. Evolutionary Leap is insane, I don't understand how people can just gloss over this card, it's so disruptive towards control I had it completely take over games against the big midrange decks with tons of removal.
Most my choices I'm very happy with. Smothering Abomination I've never been happy with. Always feels pointless to lose board presence for card advantage, and his static effect feels counter-intuitive. Like if you're sacing with husk it's usually for a kill, and sacing for value+sacing for his trigger can deplete your board fast, I don't know it just always feels like winmore and not particularly helpful. Brood Butcher I just have no idea, I've literally never drawn this card in a tournament. I'd like to cut the eldrazi stuff and a land to make the deck flow better, no way I'm cutting whisperwood though that card is amazing, figure two 5 drops isn't a major risk.
There's ton of choices if i cut those 4 cards, I mean I would like liliana and more hangarbacks but they're kinda expensive, might buckle down and get a third hangarback, i swear it gets exiled more often than not, though but it's truly unfair when you play it with evolutionary leap. Catacomb Sifter is definitely on my radar though I don't enjoy 2-power 3 drops, I prefer something stronger or something that leaves bodies behind. We definitely need insurance against sweepers as it's the best way to shutdown aristocrats.
Honestly I've never been happy with Nantuko Husk ever. I always feel like I don't have enough fuel to put them dangerously low or they're just waiting to value me when they kill it after i sac to it. I know it can just steal games but when you're facing down a rhino or something it feels like they have you in a bad position where rhino+kill spell sets you up to lose value.
Might cut a murderous cut for disdainful stroke, would appreciate suggestions for the 4 cuts I want to make.
Edit: great to see my entire deck on screen, helps with making changes. I'm thinking:
-2 Smothering Abomination
-1 Brood Butcher
-1 Land (not sure which)
-1 Murderous Cut
I'm thinking a few Infinite Obliteration in the sideboard since every week I lose to the same damn Bring to Rhino deck. And yeah maybe Transgress the Mind is better than Duress.
I think Sidisi's main weakness is that, at best, when she hits only creatures, she only gets you one body per card she mills. Rather than have those cards turn into single 2/2 Zombies, we'd like our Emissary/Thrall/Blisterpods to hit the board on their own, so that we get two bodies out of them. Getting the extra bodies when she ETBs is still great, though, and even if they're only singles, the risk of getting that value again makes her a prime kill target.
Evolutionary Leap is unquestionably good. It's a mana-efficient sac outlet (there's probably an argument for Vampiric Rites instead against aggro just for the life gain). However, that brings us around to Nantuko Husk: even if it never gets into combat, it allows us to pitch our creatures for free while a Zulaport Cutthroat is on the board. That's huge. Since saccing the creature is the cost, once we have both creatures on the board we can freely drain our opponent for as much life as we have creatures and they can't stop us or respond in any useful way. In your colors, you might try it with Whirler Rogue, too.
It's extremely unlikely for Sidisi to hit only creatures, and if she hits only lands thats 3 lands you didn't want to draw. This is an extremely common misunderstanding of how mill works. If she mills a creature, that doesn't stop you from drawing another creature, you're not losing value you're only getting free value. And when sidisi hits the board you are getting the extra value, 2 bodies for one card. I just, I hate seeing these mill arguments so much, it comes up every single time, it came up when she was spoiled, milling yourself doesn't interfere with your draws the same way milling your opponent doesn't interfere with their draws, I just don't want to explain it when it's been explained probably 1000 times on these forums.
AND if she mills bloodsoaked or despoiler that's just triple value.
I don't know if we're playing the same matches but relying on cutthroat is extremely dangerous. There's only 4 in the deck, if you don't draw him you need a reliable alternative to win, and even if you do draw him he almost never wins you the game alone. Think I've only ever won 1 game through cutthroat making a serious contribution, most people just kill him on the spot or the next turn so he can barely get any value. This idea he can just stop control, it has not been my experience, they have spot removal and counterspells, he's not just going to come down turn 2 or in pairs. It's like they kill him at the end of your turn then wipe your board, what's your gameplan then?
Sultai Emissary and bloodsoaked are far more instrumental in dominating a control deck, emissary is the real boardwipe insurance not a cutthroat.
Omg I can't even explain how much I want to stuff 4 rhinos in this deck and just be the most obnoxious deck to play against ever but Sidisi is so good in the strategy. I feel my deck just fires well because of the very consistent mana base and unified strategy.
I mean I really like Catacomb Sifter in this strategy but haruspex and executioner i really like for the 3 power aggression. Haruspex helps me against control and executioner against everything else and leap helps bring the kind of consistency that sifter does.
And I definitely want to experiment with Despoiler of Souls who might just be criminally underplayed in this strategy.
Hmm, I really like that list with Sidisi. It's definitely a different take on the deck, and I always loved using Sidisi before rotation. I'll have to give this a shot. I think I'll find a way to fit a couple of Lilianas in there, though.
Brood Butcher is a very underrated card in my opinion, and in certain matchups it's an easy card to side out, usually for Whisperwood Elemental.
Overall, I'm finding that the deck does an excellent job applying early pressure and then has cards (From Beyond, Whisperwood Elemental, Smothering Abomination, Brood Butcher, the flip walkers) that are excellent at providing enough late game to close the game. That was the biggest problem that I found with the Collected Company version was that often times I would fizzle out.
Right off the bat, I know the sideboard is complete nonsense on account of forgetting to order it. Ditto some some odd numbers in the main, either forget or can't afford.
First round was against mono-White control. Crackling Doom was a great answer against his biggest threat, Ojutai Exemplars. Aside from dealing with them flickering around, the match was mostly smooth, just long and grindy while I tried to find a Cutthroat and he stalled behind Secure the Wastes.
Second round was against a "black demon-y" deck. Takes a lot of the tricks and less-common cards we consider and rolls them into a midrange package: Priest of the Blood Rite, Merciless Executioner, some other warriors and Blood-Chin Rager. Game one came close thanks to a pair of 5/5 fliers he dropped on curve, but I had multiple Cutthroats on the board which enforced a checkmate on my final swing. Game two, he ran very heavy removal to try to preempt any board buildup, but found himself short on threats.
Round three started with a very close game against mono-Red aggro. Game one brought me down to 2 life before I was able to EoT Mardu Charm, drop Butcher of the Horde, and eat three creatures to pick up each mode of his sac ability to go up to 7. Took a few more turns, but he didn't have Firecraft to answer the Butcher and I was able to trade away most of his ground crew with my two-drops. Second game was actually very disappointing: he mulled to five and simply didn't have the power to push anything effective.
===
I'm definitely enjoying the Mardu colors. I find that I prefer the Butcher over Smothering Abomination, both because it provides an additional mana-free sac outlet and because the lifelink is substantial in stabilizing against aggro. Abom's card advantage is real, but conditional on having a sac outlet, and we've already got Grim Haruspex providing nearly the same. Mardu Charm is handy, and I think I'll keep if over the Dragon Fodders, but I definitely wished for harder removal against the demons in the second round (additional Murderous Cut already incorporated). I'd love another Liliana if budget or trades allow, but I did find a pair of Hangarback Walkers for now.
I'd like to ask for advice on the mana base, though. To hit the color balance I wanted, I ended up running the four Nomad Outposts, but they nearly killed me in the final round. How would others approach the problem of trying to hit Mardu Charm and Butcher on curve while trying to reduce the tapland count?
I assume your are not playing hangarback for budget issue but, if you can, I think you should try 2 chandra's parents (for 1 dragon fodder and one mardu charm).3 dudes for one card is broken. The ability to sac it can also close the game with Zulaport Cutthroat.
You will need Oath to remove some Nomad outpost with fect and the maybe W/B tango sadly.
In your SB Outpost siege and Rending volley want to be tested
Rending Volley is definitely on the to-do list; it was a planned sideboard card that I'd forgotten to order. I have some reservations about Outpost Siege with it being so high on the curve, but I'll ask: what do you expect it to be valuable against?
As for Pia and Kiran Nalaar, my only fear is that double-red cost. My mana base is tight, but diverse, and I'm not sure I can push it to reliably hit that early in the game (it's the same reason I don't have Hordeling Outburst). I'm at 18 black, 12 red, and 11 white sources, which is enough to reliably hit BB by turn 4, and WBR around turn 3-4 (though with this many taplands, WBR especially tends to get pushed back a turn). RR is asking a lot of this deck, and even if I find another fetch I can't see a good way to change that.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
So do Cut > Splinters and Haruspex > Whirler Rogue?
One thing I really do like about the the U/B rogue/husk engine is that it takes a very honey badger view of Anafenza. Plus you get Sidisi's Faithful to bounce a problem.
Legacy: UW RiP/Helm, UR Sneak and Show
Thanks for the comment!
Guess its time to play some magic! =D
Infinite Obliteration targeting Husk can just stop them dead that only leaves the Sidisi's Faithful left for them to sac stuff. Take all the husks away and they can't combo then rally just exiles all their creatures without a sac outlet.
4 Nomad Outpost
3 Caves of Koilos
2 Shambling Vent
3 Bloodstained Mire
4 Smoldering Marsh
2 Mountain
2 Swamp
3 Plains
CREATURES
4 Carrier Thrall
3 Sultai Emissary
4 Zulaport Cutthroat
3 Grim Haruspex
1 Liliana, Heretical Healer
4 Nantuko Husk
2 Smothering Abomination
2 Utter End
2 Bone Splinters
3 Murderous Cut
3 Mardu Charm
4 Dragon Fodder
ENCHANTMENTS
2 Vampiric Rites
3 Infinite Obliteration
1 Utter End
3 Erase
3 Complete Disregard
2 Butcher of the Horde
3 Bloodsoaked Champion
Those Butchers and Champions need to be in the main butcher is one of the main reasons to go Mardu and you should have 4 Emissaries. Your list also has a lot of non-creatures I'd drop the utter end, bone spilters and the dragon fodder for some Fleshbag Marauder.
this is my first post. I wanted to share my version of a semi budget BG Aristocrats based on the Battle for Zendikar Event Deck Ultimate Sacrifice. Any advice appreciated.
4x Jungle Hollow
2x Llanowar Wastes
1x Mortuary Mire
1x Spawning Bed
4x Evolving Wilds
6x Forest
7x Swamp
CREATURES
3x Blisterpod
4x Catacomb Sifter
3x Elvish Visionary
1x Grim Haruspex
2x Hangarback Walker
2x Nissa, Vastwood Seer
2x Smothering Abomination
2x Sultai Emissary
1x Tasigur, the Golden Fang
4x Zulaport Cutthroat
2x Bone Splinters
2x Complete Disregard
1x Evolutionary Leap
2x Murderous Cut
2x Ob Nixilis Reignited
1x Ruinous Path
1x Vampiric Rites
3x Caustic Caterpillar
2x Cranial Archive
4x Duress
3x Jaddi Offshoot
1x Languish
2x Ultimate Price
Link to deck @ TappedOut.net
Agree, the Butchers are the whole reason to play Mardu. Personally I'd replace the Abominations, dragon fodder, utter end, and bone splinters with 4 Butchers and the 4th Haruspex and Emissary and the set of Marauders.
Match 1 vs RG Ramp (2-0)
Game 1: Was able to build a good board and take him down before he was able to get anything but a couple Rattleclaw Mystics on the board.
Game 2: He boarded in Radiant Flames and drew two of them. Both times I was able to save Nantuko Husk through a sacrificed creature. Second time he was at 8 life and I top decked a Whirler Rogue. I was also able to keep him off of 10 mana by using Sidi's Faithful and a flipped Liliana to bounce his Rattleclaws every turn.
Match 2 vs Abzan (0-2)
Game 1: Never drew any husks or Cutthroats, lost to double Siege Rhino and Anafenza.
Game 2: Never drew any lands, was stuck on 1 the whole game.
Game 3 (for funsies): Didn't draw ridiculously bad hands and handily beat him with an unblockable 14/14 Nantuko Husk. I honestly think if I had drawn any of the pieces in the first game, or lands in the second I would have won this.
Match 3 vs Hardened Scales (2-0)
Game 1: Sidisi's Faithful paired with Liliana kept Time Walking him, bouncing his Managorger Hydras and Undergrowth Champions and letting Husk swing in for damage almost every turn.
Game 2: Pretty much the exact same as Game 1. Got three Cutthroats on the board at one point in time, then played Hangarback Walker for 0, then brought him back for 0 with Liliana, draining him for 6 for 0 mana. Not bad.
I conceded the top 4 match, as it was against the Abzan player and it was getting late, plus there was zero prize support, so finishing 4th or 1st wouldn't make any difference besides the mat, which I was ok not getting. Of the top four players I had already beaten one in the first match, and knew I could beat the Abzan as long as I drew ok. The other deck was burn, so I think I might have fared ok against it as well.
I love the deck and all the interactions. One of the top players at the store watched my first match and said it made him want to play the deck because it looked so fun.
I'm playing the sultai version of this, but only whirler rogue from blue (it is kinda nice finisher). This is my list:
4 Zulaport Cutthroat
4 Sultai Emissary
4 Elvish Visionary
4 Nantuko Husk
4 Liliana Heretical Healer
4 Catacomb Sifter
4 Smothering Abomination
1 Whirler Rogue
Spells: 7
3 Murderous Cut
2 Ruinous PAth
2 Collected company
7 Swamps
2 Forest
4 Llanowar Wastes
2 Yavimaya Coast
4 Opulent Palace
4 Sunken Hollow
1 Rogue's Passage
3 Transgress the Mind
3 Infinite Obliteration
2 Reality shift
3 Negate
2 Yasova Dragonclaw
2 Ultimate price
My deck is evolving every week, trying to fix what went wrong in last FNM. But i can't find a way to become a real deal, a threat. Someome said before, in this very discussion to other player: "you play many tricks, but very few threats". That phrase made a lot of sense to me because that is exactly how i feel and i don't know how to make this quicker, or more agressive.
My last incorporation was visionary. That draw engine helped me a lot to get what i need, but i still can't resist the pressure from decks like abzan (my worse match up, always losing 2-0), and keep losing my weak creatures, so nantuko doesn't have any sacrificial material and liliana, the great she is, can't resist that rythm and pressure.
Any suggestion please? How could i become a bigger threat? and, maybe more critical than that, what should i consider on my sideboard to play against abzan? what has worked to you? what do you consider is our weakness against that deck and how may we counter that difficult? because obliteration against anafenza, even though works fine, doesn't seems to be enough!
Thank you!
Edit: I removed 3 blisterpod, 1 whirler rogue and 1 murderous cut. In their place, i added +1 Catacomb sifter, +1 elvish visionary, +1 smothering abomination AND +2 collected company (this one rocks! it does exactly what i was asking. I'm considering to use the playset, but i only have 2 of them by now)
4 Bloodsoaked Champion
4 Zulaport Cutthroat
4 Sultai Emissary
2 Hangarback Walker
3 Nantuko Husk
1 Grim Haruspex
3 Sidisi, Brood Tyrant
2 Smothering Abomination
2 Whisperwood Elemental
1 Brood Butcher
Spells 10
3 Evolutionary Leap
3 Murderous Cut
4 Bone Splinters
1 Forest
7 Swamps
4 Opulent Palace
4 Bloodstained Mire
1 Cinder Glade
1 Sunken Hollow
4 Llanowar Wastes
1 Yavimaya Coast
1 Rogue's Passage
2 Duress
3 Ultimate Price
2 Negate
2 Disdainful Stroke
2 Warden of the First Tree
2 Caustic Caterpillar
2 Merciless Executioner
I don't feel theres great justification to pick one splash over the other. Sidisi is insane in this deck. Opponents always seem to feel she's a must answer and leaving a 2/2 body behind is just pure value in a deck that maximizes value, think once in twenty games I had to wait until turn 5 to cast her because of mana.
Evolutionary Leap is insane, I don't understand how people can just gloss over this card, it's so disruptive towards control I had it completely take over games against the big midrange decks with tons of removal.
Most my choices I'm very happy with. Smothering Abomination I've never been happy with. Always feels pointless to lose board presence for card advantage, and his static effect feels counter-intuitive. Like if you're sacing with husk it's usually for a kill, and sacing for value+sacing for his trigger can deplete your board fast, I don't know it just always feels like winmore and not particularly helpful.
Brood Butcher I just have no idea, I've literally never drawn this card in a tournament. I'd like to cut the eldrazi stuff and a land to make the deck flow better, no way I'm cutting whisperwood though that card is amazing, figure two 5 drops isn't a major risk.
There's ton of choices if i cut those 4 cards, I mean I would like liliana and more hangarbacks but they're kinda expensive, might buckle down and get a third hangarback, i swear it gets exiled more often than not, though but it's truly unfair when you play it with evolutionary leap.
Catacomb Sifter is definitely on my radar though I don't enjoy 2-power 3 drops, I prefer something stronger or something that leaves bodies behind. We definitely need insurance against sweepers as it's the best way to shutdown aristocrats.
Honestly I've never been happy with Nantuko Husk ever. I always feel like I don't have enough fuel to put them dangerously low or they're just waiting to value me when they kill it after i sac to it. I know it can just steal games but when you're facing down a rhino or something it feels like they have you in a bad position where rhino+kill spell sets you up to lose value.
Might cut a murderous cut for disdainful stroke, would appreciate suggestions for the 4 cuts I want to make.
Edit: great to see my entire deck on screen, helps with making changes. I'm thinking:
-2 Smothering Abomination
-1 Brood Butcher
-1 Land (not sure which)
-1 Murderous Cut
+1 Merciless Executioner
+1 Hangarback Walker
+1 Despoiler of Souls
+1 Grim Haruspex
+1 Disdainful Stroke
I'm thinking a few Infinite Obliteration in the sideboard since every week I lose to the same damn Bring to Rhino deck. And yeah maybe Transgress the Mind is better than Duress.
Evolutionary Leap is unquestionably good. It's a mana-efficient sac outlet (there's probably an argument for Vampiric Rites instead against aggro just for the life gain). However, that brings us around to Nantuko Husk: even if it never gets into combat, it allows us to pitch our creatures for free while a Zulaport Cutthroat is on the board. That's huge. Since saccing the creature is the cost, once we have both creatures on the board we can freely drain our opponent for as much life as we have creatures and they can't stop us or respond in any useful way. In your colors, you might try it with Whirler Rogue, too.
I'm coming around to agreeing with you on Smothering Abomination. For now, I'm running Butcher of the Horde instead in my Mardu variant.
AND if she mills bloodsoaked or despoiler that's just triple value.
I don't know if we're playing the same matches but relying on cutthroat is extremely dangerous. There's only 4 in the deck, if you don't draw him you need a reliable alternative to win, and even if you do draw him he almost never wins you the game alone. Think I've only ever won 1 game through cutthroat making a serious contribution, most people just kill him on the spot or the next turn so he can barely get any value. This idea he can just stop control, it has not been my experience, they have spot removal and counterspells, he's not just going to come down turn 2 or in pairs. It's like they kill him at the end of your turn then wipe your board, what's your gameplan then?
Sultai Emissary and bloodsoaked are far more instrumental in dominating a control deck, emissary is the real boardwipe insurance not a cutthroat.
I mean I really like Catacomb Sifter in this strategy but haruspex and executioner i really like for the 3 power aggression. Haruspex helps me against control and executioner against everything else and leap helps bring the kind of consistency that sifter does.
And I definitely want to experiment with Despoiler of Souls who might just be criminally underplayed in this strategy.
2 Whisperwood Elemental
2 Brood Butcher
1 Temur Sabertooth
2 Smothering Abomination
4 Catacomb Sifter
2 Liliana, Heretical Healer
2 Nissa, Vastwood Seer
2 Nantuko Husk
1 Ainok Survivalist
4 Carrier Thrall
4 Elvish Visionary
4 Zulaport Cutthroat
4 Blisterpod
1 Murderous Cut
2 From Beyond
1 Ultimate Price
Lands - 22
4 Jungle Hollow
4 Llanowar Wastes
7 Forest
7 Swamp
2 Whisperwood Elemental
2 Brood Butcher
3 Murderous Cut
3 Ainok Survivalist
1 Ultimate Price
4 Duress
Brood Butcher is a very underrated card in my opinion, and in certain matchups it's an easy card to side out, usually for Whisperwood Elemental.
Overall, I'm finding that the deck does an excellent job applying early pressure and then has cards (From Beyond, Whisperwood Elemental, Smothering Abomination, Brood Butcher, the flip walkers) that are excellent at providing enough late game to close the game. That was the biggest problem that I found with the Collected Company version was that often times I would fizzle out.
Let me know what you guys think of this deck.
Look for me on MTGO, sslater
Follow me on Twitter, @slatertheman
My youtube channel:https://www.youtube.com/user/sslater22710
3 Bloodstained Mire
4 Smoldering Marsh
4 Swamp
4 Plains
1 Mountain
2 Caves of Koilos
4 Nomad Outpost
1 Shambling Vent
Creatures (27)
4 Bloodsoaked Champion
4 Sultai Emissary
4 Carrier Thrall
4 Zulaport Cutthroat
4 Nantuko Husk
4 Grim Haruspex
1 Liliana, Heretical Healer
2 Butcher of the Horde
1 Crackling Doom
2 Murderous Cut
3 Mardu Charm
2 Dragon Fodder
2 Vampiric Rites
2 Utter End
2 Crackling Doom
2 Outnumber
3 Complete Disregard
2 Erase
1 Infinite Obliteration
1 Radiant Flames
2 Act of Treason
First round was against mono-White control. Crackling Doom was a great answer against his biggest threat, Ojutai Exemplars. Aside from dealing with them flickering around, the match was mostly smooth, just long and grindy while I tried to find a Cutthroat and he stalled behind Secure the Wastes.
Second round was against a "black demon-y" deck. Takes a lot of the tricks and less-common cards we consider and rolls them into a midrange package: Priest of the Blood Rite, Merciless Executioner, some other warriors and Blood-Chin Rager. Game one came close thanks to a pair of 5/5 fliers he dropped on curve, but I had multiple Cutthroats on the board which enforced a checkmate on my final swing. Game two, he ran very heavy removal to try to preempt any board buildup, but found himself short on threats.
Round three started with a very close game against mono-Red aggro. Game one brought me down to 2 life before I was able to EoT Mardu Charm, drop Butcher of the Horde, and eat three creatures to pick up each mode of his sac ability to go up to 7. Took a few more turns, but he didn't have Firecraft to answer the Butcher and I was able to trade away most of his ground crew with my two-drops. Second game was actually very disappointing: he mulled to five and simply didn't have the power to push anything effective.
===
I'm definitely enjoying the Mardu colors. I find that I prefer the Butcher over Smothering Abomination, both because it provides an additional mana-free sac outlet and because the lifelink is substantial in stabilizing against aggro. Abom's card advantage is real, but conditional on having a sac outlet, and we've already got Grim Haruspex providing nearly the same. Mardu Charm is handy, and I think I'll keep if over the Dragon Fodders, but I definitely wished for harder removal against the demons in the second round (additional Murderous Cut already incorporated). I'd love another Liliana if budget or trades allow, but I did find a pair of Hangarback Walkers for now.
In the side, I'm thinking to include another Infinite Obliteration and Radiant Flames. Erase did solid work in round one, and I'm inclined to keep Utter End as my planeswalker response rather than Ruinous Path due to its added versatility.
I'd like to ask for advice on the mana base, though. To hit the color balance I wanted, I ended up running the four Nomad Outposts, but they nearly killed me in the final round. How would others approach the problem of trying to hit Mardu Charm and Butcher on curve while trying to reduce the tapland count?
4 Blood-soaked Champion
4 Hangarback Walker
4 Nantuko Husk
4 Zulaport Cutthroat
3 Liliana, Heretical Healer
4 Carrier Thrall
2 Grim Haruspex
4 Catacomb Sifter
3 Elvish Visionary
4 Collected Company
2 Bone Splinters
4 Llanowar Wastes
7 Swamp
7 Forests
3 Jungle Hollow
1 Rogue's Passage
2 Vampiric Rites
1 Bone Splinters
1 Murderous Cut
1 Evolutionary Leap
3 Duress
2 Infinite Obliteration
2 Tainted Remedy
3 Altar's Reap
Here's the list I'm settling on for now.
Rending Volley is definitely on the to-do list; it was a planned sideboard card that I'd forgotten to order. I have some reservations about Outpost Siege with it being so high on the curve, but I'll ask: what do you expect it to be valuable against?
As for Pia and Kiran Nalaar, my only fear is that double-red cost. My mana base is tight, but diverse, and I'm not sure I can push it to reliably hit that early in the game (it's the same reason I don't have Hordeling Outburst). I'm at 18 black, 12 red, and 11 white sources, which is enough to reliably hit BB by turn 4, and WBR around turn 3-4 (though with this many taplands, WBR especially tends to get pushed back a turn). RR is asking a lot of this deck, and even if I find another fetch I can't see a good way to change that.