This deck seems far too much fun. Threw together a first draft below.
Not sure between Carrier Thrall and Sultai Emissery, figured I would try both and see what felt better.
Same with the spattering of various removal.
I really think that I will want more than 2 Rally but Im not really sure what I want to cut. Any advice would be appreciated
I have been messing around with four color a lot and this is hat I have come up with. The mana is actually pretty consistent, but it can be a little awkward trying to play something on turn one and turn two. I think there is probably a better way to get the mana dawn, but I am far from an expert on deck building.
Obviously the sideboard is very rough, but it is hard to build one with no idea what the meta will look like in a couple weeks. I've had some success with this so far, but I know it can be better and probably more focused. Let me know what you guys think!
So either wizards is making better decks or this may not be as solid as we hope considering this isnt far from the event deck lol. I too was thinking of just gb for consistency
Honestly im just going to run two color, all three color combinations have their own strengths, but until I know what the format will look like and how fast it will be it seems like a safe route. This is especially true considering the first few weeks everyone is testing all sorts of stuff
Adding red lands to your gb deck with make your mana more consistent, so why not throw in a red card or two? My original list was gb with a singleton Alesha
Ironically, couldn't you do something like manifest a Hangarback Walker, and then immediately morph it for another creature death trigger? Seems kind of funny, actually.
That would work. Kind of cute, but I would rather get value and creatures lol. Could be a fun trick during declare blockers step though, especially if you have the engine set up to draw that sweet card you scryed to the top
Some Quick Explanations
The Elvish Visionarys could either be Sultai Emissary or the Carrier Thrall or some split of them, they all do the same thing, they net you either +1 card or virtual card. I like the visionarys since I feel like our hand will empty pretty quick, but getting a second guaranteed body into play for free might just be better. The one drawback of the Emissary, is they you lose out on the ETB abilities of the manifested creatures when you morph them face up. The Visionaries are also nice since you can rally them back and get the card without having a Sac outlet to ensure a death trigger.
The Den Protectors are such a pet card of mine. I like them in there with the Jace's. But I could see an argument for them being something else that gives a 2:1 right away as opposed to waiting for more mana. I could see upping the Catacomb Sifter to a 4x since they are good in multiples. They could also be grim haruspex for the death triggers, especially with an emissary list.
Kiora, Master of the Depths Was kinda a thought out of left field. The +1 isn't all that relevant, but with Jace it could be really useful. The +2 is where she really shines. Drawing 2 cards and putting 2 into the yard sounds exactly in our game plan. She is another reason I like Den Protector here. I could see these being Gather the Pack as well since they accomplish similar roles, and are a lot cheaper to cast, and can be re-played with Jace's -3.
I feel like everything else in the list is pretty straight forward.
Mana Base
The mana is as follows:
14W sources / want 16 to cast Rally the ancestors on T5
12 U Sources / want 13 to cast Jace, Vryn's Prodigy on T2
13 G Sources / want 14 to cast Blisterpod on T1 (To be fair only 7 will come in Untapped on T1)
17 B Sources / want 13 to cast 1B on T1, and 19 to cast Liliana, Heretical Healer on T3
5 Lands will come in Tapped every time (4 tri-lands and the wilds)
3 Tango Lands will be dependent on the board.
14 sources for basics (6 basics, and 8 fetches (7 KTK and 1 wilds))
9 targets for 8 fetch lands (6 basics and 3 tango lands)
2 Pain Lands
So going 4 color does thin us out a bit, but I think that getting the extra angles of attack make up for it. I'd love to hear peoples thoughts.
I'm really coming to believe sultai emissary may be really good. I may only run two abominations and one haruspex though, I still think carrier thrull is very strong in the deck too. Maybe a three three split could work?
I guess ill give my 2 cents on the Emissary/carrier debate.
They are obviously both strong in this deck and both take up the exact same role as a two drop body that drops another dude. They way I look at it is that the variance makes Sultai Emissary the overall stronger card in a vacuum as getting a Catacomb Sifter off the top just feels so very good. The reason why you would run Carrier Thrall over it is if you actually value that extra point of power and hope to get them under 10 life as fast as possible. That is why I prefer Carrier in lists that have a bunch of creatures and just try to overrun the opponent in hard to deal with creatures. Also the Scion having the ability to sacrifice itself if I don't have a sac outlet on the field has actually pushed through the last 1-2 points for a win.
I think Hangarback Walker holds a very similar position as these sultai emissary and carrier thrall. The evasion of the token is probably not as good as the other two options, but it isn't much worse. The advantage of Hangarback, of course, is it has great top end potential. It takes very little to make it worth while and it is great at most points of the curve. I would almost always rather top deck a hangar back than the other two (although emissary is nice to possibly get you to a relevant creature at that point.
However, I have another question. What are your thoughts on Catacomb Sifter vs Grim Haruspex? I think Catacomb Sifter is more solid, but when you get a Grim Haruspex on board and the opponent can't remove it, the game is pretty much over. It also works really well with Sultai Emissary since it only costs B to flip. I think there are two ways to build this, either you go with tokens strategy and go with Carrier Thrall and Catacomb Sifter, or you go with creatures and use Sultai Emissary and Grim Haruspex. Thoughts?
I agree that Catacomb Sifter could be very good, however I feel like Haruspex and Sifter dont accomplish the same objective at all. I think of Haruspex as a source of pure card advantage and I believe the deck wants a CA engine. Maybe Smothering Abomination or Collected Company instead.
The more I think about it the more amazing it is how perfect Hangarback Walker is for this deck. Got a lot of spawn lying around? Sac them off, get a bunch of mana and a bunch of cutthroat triggers then make a huge Hangarback, sack him off and make a bunch more tokens to sac for even more triggers. And they decided to make this the event deck? Awesome.
I admit I'm getting a little lost with all the different variations are we looking at Sultai, Abzan, Mardu or 4 colour? I'd prefer to stick to three myself
I guess ill give my 2 cents on the Emissary/carrier debate.
They are obviously both strong in this deck and both take up the exact same role as a two drop body that drops another dude. They way I look at it is that the variance makes Sultai Emissary the overall stronger card in a vacuum as getting a Catacomb Sifter off the top just feels so very good. The reason why you would run Carrier Thrall over it is if you actually value that extra point of power and hope to get them under 10 life as fast as possible. That is why I prefer Carrier in lists that have a bunch of creatures and just try to overrun the opponent in hard to deal with creatures. Also the Scion having the ability to sacrifice itself if I don't have a sac outlet on the field has actually pushed through the last 1-2 points for a win.
I'd actually hate getting a Sifter off the top, as you're being denied the extra value of the Scion token, but you already have it in play and get to draw a card below it, so there's that.
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Not sure between Carrier Thrall and Sultai Emissery, figured I would try both and see what felt better.
Same with the spattering of various removal.
I really think that I will want more than 2 Rally but Im not really sure what I want to cut. Any advice would be appreciated
Creature (28)
4x Blisterpod
2x Carrier Thrall
4x Catacomb Sifter
4x Hangarback Walker
2x Liliana, Heretical Healer Flip
2x Merciless Executioner
4x Nantuko Husk
2x Sultai Emissary
4x Zulaport Cutthroat
Land (23)
5x Canopy Vista
2x Forest
3x Llanowar Wastes
2x Plains
4x Sandsteppe Citadel
2x Shambling Vent
3x Swamp
2x Windswept Heath
Instant (3)
1x Murderous Cut
2x Rally the Ancestors
Sorcery (2)
1x Bone Splinters
1x Ruinous Path
Enchantment (4)
2x Abzan Ascendancy
2x Vampiric Rites
3x Bloodsoaked Champion
4x Carrier Thrall
2x Drana, Liberator of Malakir
4x Endless One
3x Hangarback Walker
2x Liliana, Heretical Healer Flip
4x Smothering Abomination
4x Zulaport Cutthroat
1x Altar's Reap
3x Murderous Cut
Sorcery (6)
2x Bone Splinters
4x Ruinous Path
Artifact (2)
2x Ghostfire Blade
2x Blighted Fen
20x Swamp
2x Canopy Vista
1x Caves of Koilos
2x Cinder Glade
3x Forest
4x Llanowar Wastes
1x Plains
1x smoldering marsh
3x Shambling Vent
3x Swamp
2x Windswept Heath
4x Wooded Foothills
4x Blisterpod
3x Bloodsoaked Champion
4x Butcher of the Horde
3x Carrier Thrall
3x Catacomb Sifter
2x Hangarback Walker
3x Smothering Abomination
4x Zulaport Cutthroat
Enchantment (6)
4x Abzan Ascendancy
2x Evolutionary Leap
Instant (3)
3x Crackling Doom
2x Kolaghan's Command
1x Murderous Cut
3x Outpost Siege
3x Rally the Ancestors
2x Secure the Wastes
2x Sorin, Solemn Visitor
2x Ultimate Price
3x Unified Front
2x Vampiric Rites
Obviously the sideboard is very rough, but it is hard to build one with no idea what the meta will look like in a couple weeks. I've had some success with this so far, but I know it can be better and probably more focused. Let me know what you guys think!
Here is the tappedout link if you all want to copy it, playtest, or just give me some feedback!
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/23-09-15-4-color-aristocrats/
Edit:
+3 Wooded Foothills
+1 Smoldering Marsh
-2 Windswept Heath
-2 Sandstep Citadel
Modern: WURG Twin
Standard: Mardu Planeswalkers
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/standard-type-2/deck-creation-standard/661834-mardu-planeswalker?comment=1
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Charlotte/Greensboro area, NC
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Yeah, I already swapped out the citadels for 1 marsh and 1 foothills, but swapping the foothills and heaths was a good idea.
Modern: WURG Twin
Standard: Mardu Planeswalkers
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/standard-type-2/deck-creation-standard/661834-mardu-planeswalker?comment=1
Monthly Proxy Legacy
Charlotte/Greensboro area, NC
Pm me for details
Ironically, couldn't you do something like manifest a Hangarback Walker, and then immediately morph it for another creature death trigger? Seems kind of funny, actually.
1 Windswept Heath
3 Flooded Strand
3 Polluted Delta
1 Evolving Wilds
3 Sandsteppe Citadel
1 Opulent Palace
2 Llanowar Wastes
1 Canopy Vista
1 Prairie Stream
1 Sunken Hollow
3 Swamp
1 Island
1 Forest
1 Plains
4 Blisterpod
3 Jace, Vryn's Prodigy
4 Zulaport Cutthroat
4 Elvish Visionary
4 Qarsi Sadist
3 Liliana, Heretical Healer
4 Nantuko Husk
2 Den Protector
2 Catacomb Sifter
2 Collected Company
3 Rally the Ancestors
WALKERS (2)
2 Kiora, Master of the Depths
Some Quick Explanations
The Elvish Visionarys could either be Sultai Emissary or the Carrier Thrall or some split of them, they all do the same thing, they net you either +1 card or virtual card. I like the visionarys since I feel like our hand will empty pretty quick, but getting a second guaranteed body into play for free might just be better. The one drawback of the Emissary, is they you lose out on the ETB abilities of the manifested creatures when you morph them face up. The Visionaries are also nice since you can rally them back and get the card without having a Sac outlet to ensure a death trigger.
The Den Protectors are such a pet card of mine. I like them in there with the Jace's. But I could see an argument for them being something else that gives a 2:1 right away as opposed to waiting for more mana. I could see upping the Catacomb Sifter to a 4x since they are good in multiples. They could also be grim haruspex for the death triggers, especially with an emissary list.
Kiora, Master of the Depths Was kinda a thought out of left field. The +1 isn't all that relevant, but with Jace it could be really useful. The +2 is where she really shines. Drawing 2 cards and putting 2 into the yard sounds exactly in our game plan. She is another reason I like Den Protector here. I could see these being Gather the Pack as well since they accomplish similar roles, and are a lot cheaper to cast, and can be re-played with Jace's -3.
I feel like everything else in the list is pretty straight forward.
Mana Base
The mana is as follows:
14W sources / want 16 to cast Rally the ancestors on T5
12 U Sources / want 13 to cast Jace, Vryn's Prodigy on T2
13 G Sources / want 14 to cast Blisterpod on T1 (To be fair only 7 will come in Untapped on T1)
17 B Sources / want 13 to cast 1B on T1, and 19 to cast Liliana, Heretical Healer on T3
5 Lands will come in Tapped every time (4 tri-lands and the wilds)
3 Tango Lands will be dependent on the board.
14 sources for basics (6 basics, and 8 fetches (7 KTK and 1 wilds))
9 targets for 8 fetch lands (6 basics and 3 tango lands)
2 Pain Lands
So going 4 color does thin us out a bit, but I think that getting the extra angles of attack make up for it. I'd love to hear peoples thoughts.
They are obviously both strong in this deck and both take up the exact same role as a two drop body that drops another dude. They way I look at it is that the variance makes Sultai Emissary the overall stronger card in a vacuum as getting a Catacomb Sifter off the top just feels so very good. The reason why you would run Carrier Thrall over it is if you actually value that extra point of power and hope to get them under 10 life as fast as possible. That is why I prefer Carrier in lists that have a bunch of creatures and just try to overrun the opponent in hard to deal with creatures. Also the Scion having the ability to sacrifice itself if I don't have a sac outlet on the field has actually pushed through the last 1-2 points for a win.
I agree that Catacomb Sifter could be very good, however I feel like Haruspex and Sifter dont accomplish the same objective at all. I think of Haruspex as a source of pure card advantage and I believe the deck wants a CA engine. Maybe Smothering Abomination or Collected Company instead.
Modern: Storm
How much do event decks usually go for, and do you think this will drive down the price of hangarbacks?
I'd actually hate getting a Sifter off the top, as you're being denied the extra value of the Scion token, but you already have it in play and get to draw a card below it, so there's that.