What matchups do you like Hall of Triumph in? I thought it would help punch through Courser/Caryatid decks' defenses, but our 2/1s still get stonewalled by Courser.
I recently played an event with 2 copies of Hall of Triumph mainboard and was a little underwhelmed by it. I may have just misevaluated and sideboarded poorly, because I kept it in against Jund Monsters thinking it would help my one drops fight through Coursers and Caryatids, but as I've already said it doesn't get 2/1s through Courser. Plus, eventually they just start playing 4 drops and 5 drops and Hall really isn't making your creatures fit to kill a Polukranos. My LGS is mostly UW, Monsters builds, and Monoblack, with some GW aggro. Do you guys think Hall of Triumph is what I want in a meta like this?
I top 2ed a little 5 round Sunday Standard tournament with this list. I felt like a had OK to favorable matchups all day, playing against a GR Nykthos deck, GW Heroic, and actual Monoblack Devotion. The Nykthos deck seemed like a really good matchup for a four Mogis's Marauder Monoblack Aggro list. The GW Heroic had some potentially scary draws, like Hexproof guy+lifelink aura, but once again, Marauder just invalidates their creatures if we keep our foot on the gas and don't stumble. True Monoblack Devotion doesn't have as robust a sideboard for a fast aggro deck like this, but one of our best cards, Mogis's Marauder, was at its worst here and running draws of Gray Merchant of Asphodel can still just end the game. Without Golgari Charm or Blood Baron of Vizkopa to punish us, Monoblack Devotion seems like a pretty decent matchup.
Boon of Erebos feels less necessary when we go all in on evasion, but it still can win early combats and blank removal. I can see cutting it.
So in an attempt make it faster I cut a land for a drum because getting flooded can lose you games so, drum can be cast of a hand with one vault, then excelerates you into bestow, and can draw you cards with pain seer. I think we need to keep seer because top decking marauders against non-black opponents steal games. Think we need to keep thoughtseize because we are so weak to wrath. Post board we bring in duress and erebos. Against caraytids and coursers we need to use bile blight and go wide to beat them.
I think blight is the best spell against other aggro decks and can even blow out an elspeth.
As far as master of the feasts I side him vs. Monsters and burn and naya because their removal is already taxed.
Cards that preform well are the assasin, scarhide, mutavault and zombie.
Yeah because courser is so strong we need to play the zombie, but he plays out really well.
The other option I have considered is pack rat for flooded games. And if people stay on sphereless control then yay
I like Pain Seer in theory, but in practice it proved to be ineffective for me if I was at parity or behind. A 2/2 for 2 can do very little by itself against other creature decks. When I went turn 1 one drop, turn 2 Pain Seer, turn 3 Mogis's Marauder, Pain Seer really made my good draw into a great draw, but it was often a removal magnet that rarely lived long enough to draw me a card. Being such a high priority for our opponents to answer may mean Pain Seer is best when paired with Master of the Feast. Pain Seer and Master put tremendous pressure on our opponent's removal. Master and Pain Seer aren't seen as auto-includes for a lot of MBA players, but I suspect they would work better together than they would without one another.
Thats a good point about master. I'm playing two in the side vs monsters because of dragon and pressure removal.
I moved to 4 assassin main with 3 seer and 3 returned. We are playing 2 boon of erebos main now to great effect. Full list tomorrow
4-1'd the competitive store in my area tonight! Highest I've ever gone there so I'm pumped for Chicago.
Played against Boss Sligh (x2), B/W Devotion, Jund Monsters, and Junk Constellation.
Absolutely love Deathrite Shaman. I was unsure of putting it in at first but I'm hooked. He either eats really early removal or gets in 2-3 activations on a stalled board. Bile Blight too; it did a lot of work when I had just two so I knew I had to put in a 3rd. I kind of want to go up to 4 heralds but I'm not sure what I'd remove... maybe go down to 3 Spiteful Returned?
My sideboard needs a lot of work. Thoughts? I haven't played against hexproof in the two weeks I've been playing this deck so Devour Flesh has been kind of useless. Haven't played against control either so Nighthowler hasn't been put in yet. I'm also not sure HOW to sideboard in most situations. How do you guys generally sideboard in each matchup? Also should I throw in a whip or Pharikas cure for burn? No one at my stores plays it.
I'm curious how you beat Boss Sligh. Faster aggro seems like a rough matchup for a deck with as many bad blockers as us. Junk Constellation seems like it could be scary as well. Doomwake Giant can be game over for us in certain situations and the Courser/Caryatid shell can be problematic as well.
I like Nighthowler against Black midrange decks like Monoblack Devotion and BW Midrange. Between Thoughtseize and removal spells, it gets enormous. It may be OK vs. decks relying on red removal like RW Burn or GR Monsters, simply because it can become too big to ever die to one removal spell.
I've gone 12-2 with this list over the last 3 events at my LGS. Green Midrange seemed favorable, even more so if they are straight RG. I have played Monoblack style decks 4 times and won 3 matches. Monoblack splashing green usually has better game against us, with access to Golgari Charm and Abrupt Decay, but any fast aggro deck should be able to win game 1 vs Monoblack. I have actually only had to play a Sphinx's Revelation deck once, last night at my FNM's top 4. It was UW Cleansing Control, which seemed like a more favorable matchup than traditional UW/x control, because they're tuned to beat stuff like Jund Monsters. Interestingly, I ran into Monoblue Devotion twice. It's an odd matchup because stuff like Master of Waves and Thassa, cards that most decks fear most from Monoblue, aren't what we really dread. It's their enablers like Frostburn Weird and Nightveil Specter that pose the most problems for us, because they are defensive creatures that dodge a lot of removal.
I'm not necessarily worried about the life loss. Lifelink is definitely a plus, but I use it as another form of evasion. It has worked really well for me to be honest. And I do like Pain Seer in here for sure. Sure, it's an easy target to get rid of, but that just means your other creatures will still hit, and I've ran out of fuel quite a bit in games and he's helped a lot to mitigate that.
In hindsight, the Doomblade should've been another Bile Blight, because there aren't too many creatures where you want Doomblade over Bile Blight in my deck (Stormbreath Dragon I guess?). I was looking up other recent versions of Mono-black aggro and there was one list that was basically mono-black devotion, but without the devotion cards. But still played Pack Rat, removal and Thoughtseize. I have been liking the version that plays 12 1 drops with 3 Boon of Erebos (maybe should be 4, but the jury is still out on that). The 2 Agent of Fates was the main thing thats different between my list and the one I linked a bunch of posts ago. I happened to have the card and wanted to try it, so it went in as a 2 of.
51 people showed up, which meant 6 rounds, cut to top 8.
Match one against... UWR?
Game 1 I mull to 6 and he mulls to 5 and he chose to go first. He plays a UW Temple and passes the turn. Ok, so I'm probably against UW/x control. I play a one of my three 1-drops. Figure that if I'm against control, the main thing is to not over extend. I could bestow one of the 1-drops and make Supreme Verdict less effective. Turn 2 he plays a Sacred Foundry. Ok... so he's UW/r control it looks like. I play another dude and pass the turn. Turn 3 he plays a mountain and Rageblood Shaman. I saw the 1RR mana-cost and assumed it was a Prophetic Flamespeaker and that this was some janky tempo deck. I'm not going to lie... I played this guy 2 games and I still don't know what his deck does. It was some spells that could trigger Heroic, Artisan of Forms, some other Minotaurs. I was able to crush the deck with my removal spells and evasion both games.
1-0 (2-0)
Match two against UW?
My opponent gets deck checked before the 2nd round. Recieves a game loss because he registered his deck wrong. So I got a free game 1 win. We go to game 2. Turn 1 he plays a UW Temple and at this point I wanna say it's UW control again... but after last match I'm a little hesitant to make the call. I play a 1 drop and pass. Next turn I play Spitefull Returned, which he Deicides. Ok, so it's looking more and more like UW control. And it became more and more obvious that this was the version without enchantments playing more maindeck removal spells. It hurts a little that some of my creatures are enchantments and that turns on those spells for him. It seemed like he was maindecking 2. It would've been an easy victory but my hand was very removal heavy, so I was playing with 2 dead cards in my hand. I get him down to 3, he plays Sphinx's Rev, then Aetherling and the game ended quickly after that. We go to the final game, I side out my removal and side in disruption. I remember looking at the typical UW sideboard and saw that some people were playing Fiendslayer Paladin to try and combat the new mono-red deck. That card also is really good against me and I was hoping he was playing Archangel of Thune sideboard instead. Sadly that wasn't the case, and turn 3 Fiendslayer happened. Followed by Jace. The sad thing about this game was, there were multiple spots where I could've drawn a bestow creature and blown this game apart. All I could do was poke at Jace with my 2/3 Thrill-Kill Assassin. So I was drawing blanks, but fortunately so was he. I got him all the way down to 3 before he could Rev for 6. I remember the game being back and forth. I forced him to Planar Cleansing the board. And my discard spells were able to make it hard for him to stabilize. He actually got there by chaining a few Sphinx's and draining me down with the Extort from Blind Obedience
1-1 (3-2)
At this point I'm a little sad that I technically haven't beaten a real deck. But I would consider that version of UW to be a pretty bad matchup for me so maybe it's not all bad.
Match three against Blue Devotion
Game 1 Master of Waves + no Removal = dead
Game 2 I play a bunch of small creatures. He stabilizes with his 1/4 Frostburns a little. Then I start bestowing and swinging at him with bigger things. He turns that guy into a frog. I eventually draw Herald of Torment and Bestow it. I can either Bestow onto the 3/3 green Frog or the 2/2 Mogis Marauder. I choose the 3/3 frog, and then immediately he proceeds to topdeck Tidebinder Mage and punish me. Fortunately I was way too far ahead to lose the game because of it. I draw removal and win 2 turns later.
Game 3 I hit him with Marauder swings twice.
2-1 (5-3)
Match four against Mono Black Devotion
Game 1 of this match reminded me of that scene from The Matrix where they try to save Morpheus and they walk in that military building. They walk through the metal detector and it beeps and the guard casually asks "Are you carrying any loose change or.." and then Neo interrupts him by revealing all the guns he's hiding in his jacket. I won the die roll, played a Cackler. He plays Thoughtseize and sees my 4 1 drops (1 of them being Boon of Erebos). The game ends with a concession 2 turns later. Sometimes you just have it.
Game 2 he plays Pack Rat and Mutavault (et tu, Pack Rat?). I'm very familiar with how good the card is against aggro. And being on the play he could just race me. My deck wasn't fast enough to beat it, and I drew no removal spells.
Game 3 My opening hand was 3 Swamp, Whip of Erebos, Agent of Fates, Herald of Torment, Hero's Downfall. No 1 or 2 drops, but it has my silver bullet card against mono-black in Whip. I've gotten myself into crazy situations against mono-black devotion before that I was able to pull out because of Whip. But at the same time, the lack of pressure made it a very questionable keep. I looked over to the side and see me from the future trying to give me a signal of some kind. First he held up 1 finger. Then pointed to his head. Then made a grasping motion with both hands. I didn't get what he was trying to tell me. So I kept the hand and played a swamp and said go. He played a swamp and cast Through Seize. Suddenly I realized that in fact that was a horrible keep. He grabs Whip of Erebos, and my hand suddenly becomes horrible. I definitely should've mulled to 6. The game wasn't technically over, but I wasn't putting pressure on him and eventually he just played cards that on average were better than mine. After he won the match we talked about how badly I just messed up.
2-2 (6-5)
At this point I'm wanting to drop. My round 4 opponent talks me out of it saying I might sneak into the top 8 if I win out. I had a feeling he was really trying to get me to stay for tiebreaker purposes, but I figured I would lose next round and then I could go.
Match five against Karttik playing Jund Monsters
I was matched up against someone that I played against 2 nights ago in a standard tournament at my LGS. He's actually a good player from what I can tell. I beat him in our match at the game store when the prize was 30 dollars in store credit for making the top 4. Despite me beating him in the first round, he also made the top 4 in that tournament.
So we shuffle up. He wins the die roll and goes first. I play a T1 dude, he follows it up with Sylvan Caryatid. I swing with my 2/1. He doesn't block because he knows about Boon of Erebos. He plays a second Caryatid, and then turn 4 plays a Stormbreath Dragon and swings (misplay?). He gets two swings in with it. Eventually I was able to swing with 5 dudes. He blocks with 1 of his Caryatids, I hit him with Boon of Erebos for the final 2 damage.
I forgot how I normally sideboard against GR/x decks. I knew that the 2 removal spells and 3 Lifebanes were probably a good place to start, but I didn't know what to take out. I tried taking out Herald of Torment. Figuring that if I"m adding 3 drops I should take out 3 drops and that was the weakest of the ones I had. The 2 Bile Blights left as well.
Game 2 I keep a hand with 4 Deathtouch creatures (2 Agents, 2 Assassins) and some removal... and 1 land. Risky keep, but deathtouch is really good against their 2/4s and 5/5s and 0/3s. He mulled to 6 and apparently kept a mediocre hand. It had acceleration and Domri. I was able to Heros Downfall that away, but he didn't have gas after that.
3-2 (8-6)
Match six against GR Monsters
Game 1 I lose the die roll. And find myself up against Courser of Kruphix, Domri and 2 Xenagos. Boon of Erebos does a lot of work getting damage on the planeswalkers. I was able to get rid of all the creatures, but then he overloaded Mizzium Mortars, put another 2/2 haste Saytr into play and I just couldn't catch up after that.
Game 2 I mull a 4 land hand. He mulls as well. My 6 cards were solid. I start out with some dudes and Lifebane Zombie. He starts out with Caryatid and Xenagos. Lifebane reveals 3 Skylashers (the 2/2 flash guys) and 2 more Caryatids (wow what a bad hand). I win shortly after.
Game 3 was back and forth. He didn't play any of his big card advantage generating spells other than one Courser which was short lived. He hit me with Anger of the Gods. I reloaded and put more pressure with Agent of the Fates and Rackdos Cackler. He stabilized with a hardcast Ghor-Clan Rampager. I had a Bestow creature that would trigger Heroic on Agent and clear his 1 blocker. But the turn before he plays Sessian Tactics making his Rampager and my Agent fight. For a second I thought that the card gave his guy indestructible as well. But when he informed me it didn't I reminded him that Agent of Fates had deathtouch. Ghor-Clan died as well, and he didn't have a follow up to my Bestowed Cackler.
4-2 (10-7)
I ended up getting 14th place. Not bad. I'm not exactly a veteran of these competitive REL tournaments, so I consider winning more than I lose to be a positive. But that bad keep in match 4 is going to haunt me for the next few weeks. I think I'm going to put an effort into going to more of these events too. There's another Standard tournament a month from now in Baton Rouge, LA. It would give me an excuse to visit my parents.
I ended up really liking how this deck played in this kind of environment. I'm not going to claim that it's the best deck in the format, but it has a game plan against a lot of the good decks. I do worry about the UW matchup especially if Fiendslayer Paladin becomes a thing because that's a card I can't beat. If that happens then I'm just going to switch back to my BW midrange deck.
I am on the fence between 2 and 3, but that is what I am doing. I am also going to test Sign in Blood. I am not sure, but I can see that card providing value while not always consuming an entire turn like Read the Bones.
Sorcery speed draw (Sign in Blood) does not really appeal to me, but let us know what you find. I have another SCG IQ this weekend and am determined to make this work.
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Decks I am playing:
taking suggestions (Legacy)
Elf Company GW (Modern)
Abbot Aggro R (Standard)
Maralen of the Mornsong B(Commander)
I get that. Nothing would make me happier than to see an opponent at 2 life with one in hand. I just feel I would rather draw a creature than this card. I think Sign in Blood is more suited for MBD than MBA.
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Decks I am playing:
taking suggestions (Legacy)
Elf Company GW (Modern)
Abbot Aggro R (Standard)
Maralen of the Mornsong B(Commander)
I get that. Nothing would make me happier than to see an opponent at 2 life with one in hand. I just feel I would rather draw a creature than this card. I think Sign in Blood is more suited for MBD than MBA.
I am going to test Sign in Blood out this weekend at what is an admittedly somewhat casual event at my LGS. I can see drawing this card on turn 4 and being disappointed because I want to be able to keep the pressure on. I can see drawing this card on turn 6 and being very happy as it will allow me to reload and cast something in one turn.* What I don't know is how it will play out in my opening hand. Will I be able to craft a different strategy because I know I can reload at some point?
Right now, when I have a Pain Seer in my opening hand, I typically craft two game plans - one where it triggers, the other where it doesn't. Sign in Blood always triggers so it seems simpler, but the opportunity cost is much higher. Pain Seer is a 2/2 and putting pressure on the opponent, which is the bread-and-butter of this deck.
* - 4 mana, cast Sign in Blood, draw Swamp and Pancho Villa, play the land and swing in the for win being the ideal situation. Hey, you got to have dreams, right?
The curve is pretty high with 13 three-drops, but 20 lands is where I feel the deck is still comfortable. After dropping your 3rd land you could really care less about the rest of your lands. I also heavily board against control because that's the deck that tends to give us the most problems game 1. Here are some main pointers I can share after running iterations of the deck for about two months now:
-I don't like running Urborg because I feel like it benefits my opponent's way too much.
-I don't like Pain Seer because he's weak, his inspired is nice but it also kills me faster than I'd like.
-I prefer Master of The Feast over Herald simply because Herald doesn't have enough bite, but a 3/3 split between the two is great balance.
-I prefer Ultimate Price over Doom Blade and Bile Blight because it hits more relevant creatures, especially in the late game. This card is also a meta call, though.
-I like to use Gnarled Scarhide as pseudo removal sometimes. And if the creature dies, we get it back.
-I like to bestow whenever possible, especially Herald and Spiteful Returned. It takes multiple spells to completely remove the threat.
-I like to use Sign in Blood as a burn spell 9 out of 10 times. I only cast it on myself when I'm up against a slower control deck or out of gas and flooded out, which doesn't happen often.
I am not surprised you don't like Pain Seer. The higher your average CMC, the worse that card is. If you are playing a lot of cards per turn and they cost less, the card draw is fantastic. If you are building up to bigger things, it is much less impressive.
I struggle with the Doom Blade vs. Ultimate Price question. If I go three rounds without seeing a black deck, I feel stupid for not having many Doom Blades.
I am heading to an IQ on Sunday and am very concerned about the rise of Green. As such, I am putting two Lifebane Zombie in my main and have moved Thoughtseize to the sideboard. They generally have a lot of redundancy so the one-for-one that Thoughtseize provides just isn't very good. This could be completely wrong, just sharing where my thoughts are. Furthermore, I am tired of losing to Jund Monsters and am setting myself up to be best in that match up. Again, could be wrong.
As you can see, I am heavier on creatures than you in every spot but the 1 CMC. I also run more 1 mana spells as a way to keep up tempo at the loss of power. I am tempted to cut a land at this point and jam back in a Rakdos Cackler or Tormented Hero, but I am not sure.
I am not a fan of Master of the Feasts. With the big standard there are simply too many powerful cards that can be drawn so the downside is too great, in my opinion. However, I don't claim to know it all, so I am interested in why you have the card in your 75.
I have master of the feast in my sideboard for MUs against G/R/x monsters and variations of monogreen or G/x devotion. It's more damage than lifebane, and those decks have a hard time answering master.
4x Tormented Hero
4x Rakdos Cackler
4x Gnarled Scarhide
2x Thrill-Kill Assassin
4x Spiteful Returned
4x Mogis's Marauder
4x Herald of Torment
3x Ultimate Price
1x Bile Blight
2x Boon of Erebos
4x Thoughtseize
19x Swamp
3x Mutavault
3x Lifebane Zombie
4x Duress
2x Doom Blade
2x Dark Betrayal
1x Erebos, God of the Dead
2x Master of the Feast
1x Whip of Erebos
I top 2ed a little 5 round Sunday Standard tournament with this list. I felt like a had OK to favorable matchups all day, playing against a GR Nykthos deck, GW Heroic, and actual Monoblack Devotion. The Nykthos deck seemed like a really good matchup for a four Mogis's Marauder Monoblack Aggro list. The GW Heroic had some potentially scary draws, like Hexproof guy+lifelink aura, but once again, Marauder just invalidates their creatures if we keep our foot on the gas and don't stumble. True Monoblack Devotion doesn't have as robust a sideboard for a fast aggro deck like this, but one of our best cards, Mogis's Marauder, was at its worst here and running draws of Gray Merchant of Asphodel can still just end the game. Without Golgari Charm or Blood Baron of Vizkopa to punish us, Monoblack Devotion seems like a pretty decent matchup.
Boon of Erebos feels less necessary when we go all in on evasion, but it still can win early combats and blank removal. I can see cutting it.
4 gnarled scarhide
4 tormented hero
4 Rakdos cackler
4 pain seer
3 spiteful returned
2 thrill-kill assassin
4 lifebane zombie
4 mogis's marauder
2 herald of torment
3 bile blight
1 heros downfall
1 springleaf drum
4 mutavault
17 swamp
So in an attempt make it faster I cut a land for a drum because getting flooded can lose you games so, drum can be cast of a hand with one vault, then excelerates you into bestow, and can draw you cards with pain seer. I think we need to keep seer because top decking marauders against non-black opponents steal games. Think we need to keep thoughtseize because we are so weak to wrath. Post board we bring in duress and erebos. Against caraytids and coursers we need to use bile blight and go wide to beat them.
I think blight is the best spell against other aggro decks and can even blow out an elspeth.
As far as master of the feasts I side him vs. Monsters and burn and naya because their removal is already taxed.
Cards that preform well are the assasin, scarhide, mutavault and zombie.
Yeah because courser is so strong we need to play the zombie, but he plays out really well.
The other option I have considered is pack rat for flooded games. And if people stay on sphereless control then yay
I moved to 4 assassin main with 3 seer and 3 returned. We are playing 2 boon of erebos main now to great effect. Full list tomorrow
Played against Boss Sligh (x2), B/W Devotion, Jund Monsters, and Junk Constellation.
Absolutely love Deathrite Shaman. I was unsure of putting it in at first but I'm hooked. He either eats really early removal or gets in 2-3 activations on a stalled board. Bile Blight too; it did a lot of work when I had just two so I knew I had to put in a 3rd. I kind of want to go up to 4 heralds but I'm not sure what I'd remove... maybe go down to 3 Spiteful Returned?
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Gnarled Scarhide
3 Tormented Hero
2 Deathrite Shaman
3 Herald of Torment
4 Spiteful Returned
4 Mogis's Marauder
2 Thrill Kill Assassin
3 Bile Blight
3 Hero's Downfall
2 Ultimate Price
4 Thoughtseize
Lands 22
18 Swamp
4 Mutavault
4 Lifebane Zombie
3 Duress
2 Doomblade
2 Dark Betrayal
1 Nighthowler
2 Devour Flesh
My sideboard needs a lot of work. Thoughts? I haven't played against hexproof in the two weeks I've been playing this deck so Devour Flesh has been kind of useless. Haven't played against control either so Nighthowler hasn't been put in yet. I'm also not sure HOW to sideboard in most situations. How do you guys generally sideboard in each matchup? Also should I throw in a whip or Pharikas cure for burn? No one at my stores plays it.
I like Nighthowler against Black midrange decks like Monoblack Devotion and BW Midrange. Between Thoughtseize and removal spells, it gets enormous. It may be OK vs. decks relying on red removal like RW Burn or GR Monsters, simply because it can become too big to ever die to one removal spell.
4x Tormented Hero
4x Rakdos Cackler
4x Gnarled Scarhide
2x Thrill-Kill Assassin
4x Spiteful Returned
4x Mogis's Marauder
4x Herald of Torment
2x Master of the Feast
2x Ultimate Price
1x Bile Blight
4x Thoughtseize
19x Swamp
3x Mutavault
4x Duress
3x Lifebane Zombie
2x Doom Blade
2x Dark Betrayal
2x Nighthowler
1x Erebos, God of the Dead
1x Pharika's Cure
I've gone 12-2 with this list over the last 3 events at my LGS. Green Midrange seemed favorable, even more so if they are straight RG. I have played Monoblack style decks 4 times and won 3 matches. Monoblack splashing green usually has better game against us, with access to Golgari Charm and Abrupt Decay, but any fast aggro deck should be able to win game 1 vs Monoblack. I have actually only had to play a Sphinx's Revelation deck once, last night at my FNM's top 4. It was UW Cleansing Control, which seemed like a more favorable matchup than traditional UW/x control, because they're tuned to beat stuff like Jund Monsters. Interestingly, I ran into Monoblue Devotion twice. It's an odd matchup because stuff like Master of Waves and Thassa, cards that most decks fear most from Monoblue, aren't what we really dread. It's their enablers like Frostburn Weird and Nightveil Specter that pose the most problems for us, because they are defensive creatures that dodge a lot of removal.
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Tormented Hero
4 Pain Seer
4 Spiteful Returned
4 Thrill-Kill Assassin
4 Herald of Torment
3 Mogis's Marauder
4 Thoughtseize
2 Doom Blade
2 Ultimate Price
3 Gift of Orzhova
Lands:
4 Mutavault
18 Swamp
2 Dark Betrayal
3 Bile Blight
2 Doom Blade
1 Ultimate Price
1 Gift of Orzhova
3 Hero's Downfall
3 Lifebane Zombie
Thoughts?
[EDH Non-Primers] Newzuri | Breya
3 Mogis's Marauder
4 Rakdos Cackler
3 Thrill-Kill Assassin
3 Tormented Hero
4 Gnarled Scarhide
3 Herald of Torment
4 Spiteful Returned
4 Mutavault
4 Hero's Downfall
2 Ultimate Price
4 Thoughtseize
2 Bubbling Cauldron
3 Festering Newt
2 Devour Flesh
2 Doom Blade
2 Erebos, God of the Dead
4 Duress
Are you using Gift of Orzhova to offset the life loss from Thoughtseize, Pain Seer and Herald of Torment? I have had problems with that life loss myself.
[EDH Non-Primers] Newzuri | Breya
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Tormented Hero
4 Gnarled Scarhide
3 Boon of Erebos
Two drops
4 Thrill-kill Assassin
4 Spiteful Returned
2 Bile Blight
2 Ultimate Price
4 Mogis's Marauder
3 Herald of Torment
2 Agent of Fates
3 Hero's Downfall
17 Swamp
4 Mutavault
3 Lifebane Zombie
1 Ultimate Price
1 Doomblade
1 Dark Betrayal
1 Erebos, God of the Dead
2 Whip of Erebos
4 Thoughtseize
2 Duress
In hindsight, the Doomblade should've been another Bile Blight, because there aren't too many creatures where you want Doomblade over Bile Blight in my deck (Stormbreath Dragon I guess?). I was looking up other recent versions of Mono-black aggro and there was one list that was basically mono-black devotion, but without the devotion cards. But still played Pack Rat, removal and Thoughtseize. I have been liking the version that plays 12 1 drops with 3 Boon of Erebos (maybe should be 4, but the jury is still out on that). The 2 Agent of Fates was the main thing thats different between my list and the one I linked a bunch of posts ago. I happened to have the card and wanted to try it, so it went in as a 2 of.
51 people showed up, which meant 6 rounds, cut to top 8.
Match one against... UWR?
Game 1 I mull to 6 and he mulls to 5 and he chose to go first. He plays a UW Temple and passes the turn. Ok, so I'm probably against UW/x control. I play a one of my three 1-drops. Figure that if I'm against control, the main thing is to not over extend. I could bestow one of the 1-drops and make Supreme Verdict less effective. Turn 2 he plays a Sacred Foundry. Ok... so he's UW/r control it looks like. I play another dude and pass the turn. Turn 3 he plays a mountain and Rageblood Shaman. I saw the 1RR mana-cost and assumed it was a Prophetic Flamespeaker and that this was some janky tempo deck. I'm not going to lie... I played this guy 2 games and I still don't know what his deck does. It was some spells that could trigger Heroic, Artisan of Forms, some other Minotaurs. I was able to crush the deck with my removal spells and evasion both games.
1-0 (2-0)
Match two against UW?
My opponent gets deck checked before the 2nd round. Recieves a game loss because he registered his deck wrong. So I got a free game 1 win. We go to game 2. Turn 1 he plays a UW Temple and at this point I wanna say it's UW control again... but after last match I'm a little hesitant to make the call. I play a 1 drop and pass. Next turn I play Spitefull Returned, which he Deicides. Ok, so it's looking more and more like UW control. And it became more and more obvious that this was the version without enchantments playing more maindeck removal spells. It hurts a little that some of my creatures are enchantments and that turns on those spells for him. It seemed like he was maindecking 2. It would've been an easy victory but my hand was very removal heavy, so I was playing with 2 dead cards in my hand. I get him down to 3, he plays Sphinx's Rev, then Aetherling and the game ended quickly after that. We go to the final game, I side out my removal and side in disruption. I remember looking at the typical UW sideboard and saw that some people were playing Fiendslayer Paladin to try and combat the new mono-red deck. That card also is really good against me and I was hoping he was playing Archangel of Thune sideboard instead. Sadly that wasn't the case, and turn 3 Fiendslayer happened. Followed by Jace. The sad thing about this game was, there were multiple spots where I could've drawn a bestow creature and blown this game apart. All I could do was poke at Jace with my 2/3 Thrill-Kill Assassin. So I was drawing blanks, but fortunately so was he. I got him all the way down to 3 before he could Rev for 6. I remember the game being back and forth. I forced him to Planar Cleansing the board. And my discard spells were able to make it hard for him to stabilize. He actually got there by chaining a few Sphinx's and draining me down with the Extort from Blind Obedience
1-1 (3-2)
At this point I'm a little sad that I technically haven't beaten a real deck. But I would consider that version of UW to be a pretty bad matchup for me so maybe it's not all bad.
Match three against Blue Devotion
Game 1 Master of Waves + no Removal = dead
Game 2 I play a bunch of small creatures. He stabilizes with his 1/4 Frostburns a little. Then I start bestowing and swinging at him with bigger things. He turns that guy into a frog. I eventually draw Herald of Torment and Bestow it. I can either Bestow onto the 3/3 green Frog or the 2/2 Mogis Marauder. I choose the 3/3 frog, and then immediately he proceeds to topdeck Tidebinder Mage and punish me. Fortunately I was way too far ahead to lose the game because of it. I draw removal and win 2 turns later.
Game 3 I hit him with Marauder swings twice.
2-1 (5-3)
Match four against Mono Black Devotion
Game 1 of this match reminded me of that scene from The Matrix where they try to save Morpheus and they walk in that military building. They walk through the metal detector and it beeps and the guard casually asks "Are you carrying any loose change or.." and then Neo interrupts him by revealing all the guns he's hiding in his jacket. I won the die roll, played a Cackler. He plays Thoughtseize and sees my 4 1 drops (1 of them being Boon of Erebos). The game ends with a concession 2 turns later. Sometimes you just have it.
Game 2 he plays Pack Rat and Mutavault (et tu, Pack Rat?). I'm very familiar with how good the card is against aggro. And being on the play he could just race me. My deck wasn't fast enough to beat it, and I drew no removal spells.
Game 3 My opening hand was 3 Swamp, Whip of Erebos, Agent of Fates, Herald of Torment, Hero's Downfall. No 1 or 2 drops, but it has my silver bullet card against mono-black in Whip. I've gotten myself into crazy situations against mono-black devotion before that I was able to pull out because of Whip. But at the same time, the lack of pressure made it a very questionable keep. I looked over to the side and see me from the future trying to give me a signal of some kind. First he held up 1 finger. Then pointed to his head. Then made a grasping motion with both hands. I didn't get what he was trying to tell me. So I kept the hand and played a swamp and said go. He played a swamp and cast Through Seize. Suddenly I realized that in fact that was a horrible keep. He grabs Whip of Erebos, and my hand suddenly becomes horrible. I definitely should've mulled to 6. The game wasn't technically over, but I wasn't putting pressure on him and eventually he just played cards that on average were better than mine. After he won the match we talked about how badly I just messed up.
2-2 (6-5)
At this point I'm wanting to drop. My round 4 opponent talks me out of it saying I might sneak into the top 8 if I win out. I had a feeling he was really trying to get me to stay for tiebreaker purposes, but I figured I would lose next round and then I could go.
Match five against Karttik playing Jund Monsters
I was matched up against someone that I played against 2 nights ago in a standard tournament at my LGS. He's actually a good player from what I can tell. I beat him in our match at the game store when the prize was 30 dollars in store credit for making the top 4. Despite me beating him in the first round, he also made the top 4 in that tournament.
So we shuffle up. He wins the die roll and goes first. I play a T1 dude, he follows it up with Sylvan Caryatid. I swing with my 2/1. He doesn't block because he knows about Boon of Erebos. He plays a second Caryatid, and then turn 4 plays a Stormbreath Dragon and swings (misplay?). He gets two swings in with it. Eventually I was able to swing with 5 dudes. He blocks with 1 of his Caryatids, I hit him with Boon of Erebos for the final 2 damage.
I forgot how I normally sideboard against GR/x decks. I knew that the 2 removal spells and 3 Lifebanes were probably a good place to start, but I didn't know what to take out. I tried taking out Herald of Torment. Figuring that if I"m adding 3 drops I should take out 3 drops and that was the weakest of the ones I had. The 2 Bile Blights left as well.
Game 2 I keep a hand with 4 Deathtouch creatures (2 Agents, 2 Assassins) and some removal... and 1 land. Risky keep, but deathtouch is really good against their 2/4s and 5/5s and 0/3s. He mulled to 6 and apparently kept a mediocre hand. It had acceleration and Domri. I was able to Heros Downfall that away, but he didn't have gas after that.
3-2 (8-6)
Match six against GR Monsters
Game 1 I lose the die roll. And find myself up against Courser of Kruphix, Domri and 2 Xenagos. Boon of Erebos does a lot of work getting damage on the planeswalkers. I was able to get rid of all the creatures, but then he overloaded Mizzium Mortars, put another 2/2 haste Saytr into play and I just couldn't catch up after that.
Game 2 I mull a 4 land hand. He mulls as well. My 6 cards were solid. I start out with some dudes and Lifebane Zombie. He starts out with Caryatid and Xenagos. Lifebane reveals 3 Skylashers (the 2/2 flash guys) and 2 more Caryatids (wow what a bad hand). I win shortly after.
Game 3 was back and forth. He didn't play any of his big card advantage generating spells other than one Courser which was short lived. He hit me with Anger of the Gods. I reloaded and put more pressure with Agent of the Fates and Rackdos Cackler. He stabilized with a hardcast Ghor-Clan Rampager. I had a Bestow creature that would trigger Heroic on Agent and clear his 1 blocker. But the turn before he plays Sessian Tactics making his Rampager and my Agent fight. For a second I thought that the card gave his guy indestructible as well. But when he informed me it didn't I reminded him that Agent of Fates had deathtouch. Ghor-Clan died as well, and he didn't have a follow up to my Bestowed Cackler.
4-2 (10-7)
I ended up getting 14th place. Not bad. I'm not exactly a veteran of these competitive REL tournaments, so I consider winning more than I lose to be a positive. But that bad keep in match 4 is going to haunt me for the next few weeks. I think I'm going to put an effort into going to more of these events too. There's another Standard tournament a month from now in Baton Rouge, LA. It would give me an excuse to visit my parents.
I ended up really liking how this deck played in this kind of environment. I'm not going to claim that it's the best deck in the format, but it has a game plan against a lot of the good decks. I do worry about the UW matchup especially if Fiendslayer Paladin becomes a thing because that's a card I can't beat. If that happens then I'm just going to switch back to my BW midrange deck.
Decks I am playing:
taking suggestions (Legacy)
Elf Company GW (Modern)
Abbot Aggro R (Standard)
Maralen of the Mornsong B(Commander)
I am on the fence between 2 and 3, but that is what I am doing. I am also going to test Sign in Blood. I am not sure, but I can see that card providing value while not always consuming an entire turn like Read the Bones.
Decks I am playing:
taking suggestions (Legacy)
Elf Company GW (Modern)
Abbot Aggro R (Standard)
Maralen of the Mornsong B(Commander)
I can't hate.
I get that. Nothing would make me happier than to see an opponent at 2 life with one in hand. I just feel I would rather draw a creature than this card. I think Sign in Blood is more suited for MBD than MBA.
Decks I am playing:
taking suggestions (Legacy)
Elf Company GW (Modern)
Abbot Aggro R (Standard)
Maralen of the Mornsong B(Commander)
I am going to test Sign in Blood out this weekend at what is an admittedly somewhat casual event at my LGS. I can see drawing this card on turn 4 and being disappointed because I want to be able to keep the pressure on. I can see drawing this card on turn 6 and being very happy as it will allow me to reload and cast something in one turn.* What I don't know is how it will play out in my opening hand. Will I be able to craft a different strategy because I know I can reload at some point?
Right now, when I have a Pain Seer in my opening hand, I typically craft two game plans - one where it triggers, the other where it doesn't. Sign in Blood always triggers so it seems simpler, but the opportunity cost is much higher. Pain Seer is a 2/2 and putting pressure on the opponent, which is the bread-and-butter of this deck.
Since the event is not competitive, I will likely just post the results of the test here - http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/standard-type-2/standard-deck-creation/548048-mono-black-aggro If you have any other testing thoughts for me, post them there please.
* - 4 mana, cast Sign in Blood, draw Swamp and Pancho Villa, play the land and swing in the for win being the ideal situation. Hey, you got to have dreams, right?
4 Tormented Hero
4 Rakdos Cackler
3 Gnarled Scarhide
4 Spiteful Returned
4 Thrill-Kill Assassin
4 Mogis's Marauder
3 Master of the Feast
3 Herald of Torment
4 Thoutsieze
3 Ultimate Price
2 Hero's Downfall
2 Sign in Blood
Land:
16 Swamp
4 Mutavault
Side:
1 Erebos, God of the Dead
1 Pithing Needle
1 Phyrexian
2 Doom Blade
2 Bile Blight
2 Brain Maggot
2 Nighthowler
4 Duress
The curve is pretty high with 13 three-drops, but 20 lands is where I feel the deck is still comfortable. After dropping your 3rd land you could really care less about the rest of your lands. I also heavily board against control because that's the deck that tends to give us the most problems game 1. Here are some main pointers I can share after running iterations of the deck for about two months now:
-I don't like running Urborg because I feel like it benefits my opponent's way too much.
-I don't like Pain Seer because he's weak, his inspired is nice but it also kills me faster than I'd like.
-I prefer Master of The Feast over Herald simply because Herald doesn't have enough bite, but a 3/3 split between the two is great balance.
-I prefer Ultimate Price over Doom Blade and Bile Blight because it hits more relevant creatures, especially in the late game. This card is also a meta call, though.
-I like to use Gnarled Scarhide as pseudo removal sometimes. And if the creature dies, we get it back.
-I like to bestow whenever possible, especially Herald and Spiteful Returned. It takes multiple spells to completely remove the threat.
-I like to use Sign in Blood as a burn spell 9 out of 10 times. I only cast it on myself when I'm up against a slower control deck or out of gas and flooded out, which doesn't happen often.
I struggle with the Doom Blade vs. Ultimate Price question. If I go three rounds without seeing a black deck, I feel stupid for not having many Doom Blades.
4 gnarled scarhide
4 rakdos cackler
4 tormented hero
3 spiteful returned
4 pain seer
4 mogis's marauder
3 Herald of torment
4 thoughtseize
3 ultimate price
2 bile blight
2 heroes downfall
Other (1)
1 Whip of erebos
Land (22)
16 swamp
2 urborg, Tomb of yawgmoth
4 mutavault
3 master of the feast
1 nighthowler
2 dark betrayal
2 doomblade
3 pharika's cure
4 duress
Any suggestions on changes I should make?
Here is my list right now (subject to change)
Magic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
4 Mutavault
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Radiant Fountain
15 Swamp
Creatures: 29
4 Gnarled Scarhide
4 Hearald of Torment
2 Lifebane Zombie
4 Mogis's Marauder
2 Pain Seer
3 Rackdos Cackler
4 Spiteful Returned
3 Thrill-Kill Assassin
3 Tormented Hero
3 Boon of Erebos
2 Crippling Blight
1 Sign in Blood
1 Ulcerate
2 Ultimate Price
2 Agent of the Fates
2 Bile Blight
3 Dark Betrayal
2 Doom Blade
2 Hero's Downfall
4 Thoughtseize
As you can see, I am heavier on creatures than you in every spot but the 1 CMC. I also run more 1 mana spells as a way to keep up tempo at the loss of power. I am tempted to cut a land at this point and jam back in a Rakdos Cackler or Tormented Hero, but I am not sure.
I am not a fan of Master of the Feasts. With the big standard there are simply too many powerful cards that can be drawn so the downside is too great, in my opinion. However, I don't claim to know it all, so I am interested in why you have the card in your 75.
Best of luck.