I wanted to bring together everyone's idea about R/G as a deck. Everyone knows it has potential to be amazing. The goal here is to establish some sort of skeleton to the deck, and then have people build on that idea with their own thoughts.
What? No spells other than creatures and planeswalkers? Fortunately there hasn't appeared to be any downside not running any. As long as you ramp up to big creatures quickly, you're golden.
I will post more information on the archetype as we proceed. As for now, comment, discuss, post your archetype, decklists, and talk about it. Let's make this a thing!
Thanks! It's great to here feedback. I'll look into the Hydra. I used one at my Prerelease and it seemed pretty powerful. Additionally, do you know of any good utility/advantage creatures in standard at the moment? Previously we have had Huntsmaster, Thragtusk, etc. This deck would obviously benefit from something like that, but I don't know of any.
Utility-wise, a lot of people are recommending Boon Satyr for the flash, 5CMC bestow cost (because it fits the same slot that way as thrag did), and a way to survive a wipe by plopping a dude back down.
Also, could use maybe some Arbor Colossus? Very useful against a varietyoffliers that should see even more play this season.
Edit: I'd cut either caryatid or druid... with xenagos, I don't think it would need that much ramping, maybe in favor of some lower cost aggressive creature for early pressure, like a Kalonian Tusker or somesuch. However, if you do want a bunch of ramp, then Savageborn Hydra should be in here, as you can keep using it as a repeatable mana sink.
And it's been running well, it's fun and it wins a lot, but lately I feel like i'm losing bte's value post rotation. My plan is to take away the wrecking ogres for 2 Stormbreath dragons and the bte and zhur-taa druids maybe for elvish mystics or sylvan caryatids. As mentioned before, spire tracer has worked wonders for me, but many say it's way too fragile, so it may have to leave too. I want to maintain the aggro aspect of this deck that usually wins around turn 5 because of all the bloodrushing, but I want to make it more competitive. I want to fit in some Kalonian Hydras, maybe some battledrivers (2 max). The thing is that I'm confused on what to take out and leave in, because the deck is all about buffing these little creatures and making the ones who aren't blocked utterly huge. Also, rubblebelt raiders has been great all the time, turning into an 11/11 easily. Of course I always have 2 or 3 mana free that i can use to bloodrush, and that helps a lot.
What i'm trying to say is that my list is completely different from yours and I feel that my cards are starting to lose value, so I wanna take out a few but not completely overturn the deck. I'm ok with letting the zhur-taa druids and wrecking ogres go for big things, as well as btes for elvish mystics and sylvan caryatids, and maybe enlarge for hydras and stuff (i really want the hydras XD), but overall i'm very confused with the quantities and such, so if you could help out that would be amazing. (I'll make the manabase on my own so don't worry about the lands, i'll fix that later)
EDIT: I really like Mistcutter Hydra so I wouldn't mind fitting 2 of those in somewhere, as well as our beloved satyr mr.Xenagos, the Reveler too (2 max)
Ok so this is what I posted in the other thread and I'm obviously gonna fix it soon As mentioned though, I need help on numbers and such.
BTE will lose a lot of value. You can lower your curve to make him more effective, but through testing, I've discovered that dropping big threat after threat turn after turn is really really effective. Stormbreath Dragon is so, so, so good. Ruric Thar is also extremely underrated; just to give you that idea.
Since you appear to be operating on a lower curve anyhow, I'd suggest filling out your low curve cards like Kalonian Tusker and such. More good cards for low curve agressive decks are Gruul Charm, Gruul War Chant, which is also underrated, and Hammer of Purphoros.
Not a final build or anything just what i've been brainstorming about.
I think Primeval Bounty is definitely a card to consider as a 2-3 of and one I don't see many other people running. With all the creatures you can drop this can double the size of your board in seconds.
Haha its funny you said that. I typed up a whole paragraph about how I disliked him. He is really expensive and his boardwipe ability isn't spectacular when we are splashing red. But I deleted it. And now here it is again much less articulately stated.
Both of these are bad. Sylvan Caryatid is bad because it can't attack. Zhur-Taa Druid is not as bad but still bad because it can't attack into anything. Satyr Hedonist on the other hand, attacks better. It lets you play huge monsters or go Monstrous turns earlier, attack then sac, block then monstrous another fatty, etc. and it also turns on Scavenging Ooze (not just in a Biblical way).
Mortars being in the board is bad. Smiter, Lion, even Blood Baron, are all issues when trying to kill your opponent, and all are handled by Mortars.
Domri is the best card in the deck, I would run 4.
I don't think Nythos belongs in this deck, but regardless, not running Burning-Tree seems like a mistake, as it blocks for Domri early, turns on Xenagos (probably in a Biblical way), and makes Nythos playable if you're set on it.
Polis Crusher seems out of place, since it has protection from Detention Sphere but isn't nearly as big a threat as Ember Swallower to decks that run Sphere.
Why not run the appropriate temple? Scry matters, it eases your mana a bit, and many of your accelerators are 2 drops, allowing you to turn 1 the temple and scry when you are missing an elf, or drop it turn 2 after an elf when missing the turn 3 Domri.
Ruric Thar and Mistcutter Hydra seem like sideboard cards unless your meta is very, very control heavy.
Something like the following looks much better to me:
He's super mana-intensive, but all of his abilities are relevant. Maybe as a 1-of?
EDIT: would Sylvan Caryatid be good as a sideboard matchup against aggro? 0/3 defender could be good early game blocking against 1 and 2 power drops from red, and would be immune to any burn they throw at it due to Hexproof.
The sideboard is still in flux, I've only tested the main deck. It feels very strong, there are a lot of crazy magical christmasland possibilities with this deck, but even when I don't ramp into a monstrous Ember Swallower or dragon, or 6-10 counter Reverent Hunter on turn 3, I still drop huge threats every turn. The planeswalkers all work very well together and usually bury opposing control decks with card advantage. Against U/W or Esper, I usually don't care if I see a Supreme Verdict. I just toss 3-4 guys in the GY and drop more threats the next turn. Also, Boon Satyr has been huge against them. Sylvan Caryatids, Polukranos, and the sideboard usually keep me alive to stabilize against fast agro decks. Once I get the sideboard finished, I'll probably be sleeving this up for the next standard tournament.
Well see? That's why you're here to introduce it to us! Haha. I like the hammer, I just didn't know where to squeeze it in. That seems to be the case for a lot of y cards though.
Hammer is a great card, but doesn't fit the curve of the deck all that well. Turns 1 and 2 you want to be dropping ramp or Domri, turn 3 or 4 you want to put fatties into play. It becomes better if you're heavily vested in Kalonian Hydra, but I don't think that's where you want to be much of the time. Against the majority of opponents, you want to put something that wins the game into play quickly, and in the case of Ember Swallower, 4 damage is less important than untapping and going monsterous with it. I've been considering it in the board against control, but it can interfere with the walkers/Ruric plan to beat them if you're topdecking later in the game. I wouldn't count it out, but I haven't run into a situation where I wanted to topdeck it more than just another dragon or planeswalker.
The ramp helps me go monsterous with my creatures quite quickly. The two drops also make BTE very effective in curving into Xenagos. Clan Defiance feels like it would fit in well here, I don't know if I want to keep the mana open for Monsterous or something with a X in its mana cost.
I also like Kalonian Tusker to replace one of the two drops in the decklist currently. Maybe replacing BTE since BTE can't help cast it.
Hammer is a great card, but doesn't fit the curve of the deck all that well. Turns 1 and 2 you want to be dropping ramp or Domri, turn 3 or 4 you want to put fatties into play. It becomes better if you're heavily vested in Kalonian Hydra, but I don't think that's where you want to be much of the time. Against the majority of opponents, you want to put something that wins the game into play quickly, and in the case of Ember Swallower, 4 damage is less important than untapping and going monsterous with it. I've been considering it in the board against control, but it can interfere with the walkers/Ruric plan to beat them if you're topdecking later in the game. I wouldn't count it out, but I haven't run into a situation where I wanted to topdeck it more than just another dragon or planeswalker.
You don't have to always cast it turn 3, its perfectly fine as a late game tool too
Not a final build or anything just what i've been brainstorming about.
I think Primeval Bounty is definitely a card to consider as a 2-3 of and one I don't see many other people running. With all the creatures you can drop this can double the size of your board in seconds.
I think themain issue with Primeval Bounty in a Xenagos deck is the speed factor. Your whole goal here is to put out a turn 3 Xenagos, the Reveler to ramp into a turn 4 Biggest-Thing-In-Your-Hand. Then on 5 you're either making it monstrous or dropping your second bomb. Would you rather play Primeval Bounty or Stormbreath Dragon on 4? Primeval Bounty or making him monstrous? I think you'd be better off with either a) defensive spells such as Ranger's Guile to counter removal or b) red removal of your own.
A comment on your creatures. I would main board Polukranos, World Eater and move Mistcutter Hydra into the side. Polukranos will clear out small blockers when he goes monstrous and is just the better all-around choice. Mistcutter is obviously the go-to against control decks. Ruric Thar, the Unbowed is a side board must also, to bring in against any type of control (black removal, red burn, blue bounce, etc).
I also prefer Garruk over Domri, but to each his own there.
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Here is my decklist.
4 Elvish Mystic
3 Zhur-Taa Druid
3 Sylvan Caryatid
3 Polis Crusher
3 Ghor-Clan Rampager
4 Kalonian Hydra
4 Stormbreath Dragon
3 Ruric Thar, the Unbowed
3 Mistcutter Hydra
3 Xenagos the Reveler
3 Domri Rade
Lands
4 Stomping Grounds
2 Nykthos
10 Forest
8 Mountain
4 Destructive Revelry
3 Mizzium Mortars
4 Scavenging Ooze
4 Magma Jet
What? No spells other than creatures and planeswalkers? Fortunately there hasn't appeared to be any downside not running any. As long as you ramp up to big creatures quickly, you're golden.
I will post more information on the archetype as we proceed. As for now, comment, discuss, post your archetype, decklists, and talk about it. Let's make this a thing!
Dunes of Zairo
SHANDALAR
Innistrad - The Darkest Night
~THE RAVNICAN CONSORTIUM~
A Community Set
Commander: Allies & Adversaries
Dunes of Zairo
SHANDALAR
Innistrad - The Darkest Night
~THE RAVNICAN CONSORTIUM~
A Community Set
Commander: Allies & Adversaries
Also, could use maybe some Arbor Colossus? Very useful against a variety of fliers that should see even more play this season.
Edit: I'd cut either caryatid or druid... with xenagos, I don't think it would need that much ramping, maybe in favor of some lower cost aggressive creature for early pressure, like a Kalonian Tusker or somesuch. However, if you do want a bunch of ramp, then Savageborn Hydra should be in here, as you can keep using it as a repeatable mana sink.
Avatar and Sig by Xen's Inkfox Aesthetics
GWLambs and LionsWG
GMono-Green BeatsG
Testing: BGRock VariantGB
GWBJanky JunkGWB
UWGMimic BantrolUWG
BWApostleypse NowBW
I put a fair bit of ideas in my post so if anyone wants to throw anymore of them at my specific list I think that would be great.
BTE will lose a lot of value. You can lower your curve to make him more effective, but through testing, I've discovered that dropping big threat after threat turn after turn is really really effective. Stormbreath Dragon is so, so, so good. Ruric Thar is also extremely underrated; just to give you that idea.
Since you appear to be operating on a lower curve anyhow, I'd suggest filling out your low curve cards like Kalonian Tusker and such. More good cards for low curve agressive decks are Gruul Charm, Gruul War Chant, which is also underrated, and Hammer of Purphoros.
Dunes of Zairo
SHANDALAR
Innistrad - The Darkest Night
~THE RAVNICAN CONSORTIUM~
A Community Set
Commander: Allies & Adversaries
2 Domri Rade
3 Xenagos the Reveler
Creatures 26
4 Elvish Mystic
4 Sylvan Caryatid
4 Kalonian Hydra
4 Stormbreath Dragon
4 Ghor-Clan Rampager
4 Mistcutter Hydra
2 Savageborn Hydra
4 Mizzium Mortars
Enchantments 2
2 Primeval Bounty
Land 23
9 Forest
7 Mountain
4 Stomping Ground
3 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
Not a final build or anything just what i've been brainstorming about.
I think Primeval Bounty is definitely a card to consider as a 2-3 of and one I don't see many other people running. With all the creatures you can drop this can double the size of your board in seconds.
My Trading Post
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=226506
My Trading Post
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=226506
Here are my thoughts.
-3 Zhur-Taa Druid
-3 Sylvan Caryatid
+4 Satyr Hedonist
Both of these are bad. Sylvan Caryatid is bad because it can't attack. Zhur-Taa Druid is not as bad but still bad because it can't attack into anything. Satyr Hedonist on the other hand, attacks better. It lets you play huge monsters or go Monstrous turns earlier, attack then sac, block then monstrous another fatty, etc. and it also turns on Scavenging Ooze (not just in a Biblical way).
Mortars being in the board is bad. Smiter, Lion, even Blood Baron, are all issues when trying to kill your opponent, and all are handled by Mortars.
Domri is the best card in the deck, I would run 4.
I don't think Nythos belongs in this deck, but regardless, not running Burning-Tree seems like a mistake, as it blocks for Domri early, turns on Xenagos (probably in a Biblical way), and makes Nythos playable if you're set on it.
Polis Crusher seems out of place, since it has protection from Detention Sphere but isn't nearly as big a threat as Ember Swallower to decks that run Sphere.
Why not run the appropriate temple? Scry matters, it eases your mana a bit, and many of your accelerators are 2 drops, allowing you to turn 1 the temple and scry when you are missing an elf, or drop it turn 2 after an elf when missing the turn 3 Domri.
Ruric Thar and Mistcutter Hydra seem like sideboard cards unless your meta is very, very control heavy.
Something like the following looks much better to me:
4 Elvish Mystic
4 Satyr Hedonist
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Ghor-Clan Rampager
4 Ember Swallower
1 Kalonian Hydra
4 Stormbreath Dragon
2 Xenagos the Reveler
4 Domri Rade
Sorceries
3 Mizzium Mortars
Lands
4 Stomping Grounds
4 Temple of Abandon
8 Forest
8 Mountain
2 Ruric Thar, the Unbowed
2 Mistcutter Hydra
3 Destructive Revelry
3 Burning Earth
2 Ratchet Bomb
3 Magma Jet
He's super mana-intensive, but all of his abilities are relevant. Maybe as a 1-of?
EDIT: would Sylvan Caryatid be good as a sideboard matchup against aggro? 0/3 defender could be good early game blocking against 1 and 2 power drops from red, and would be immune to any burn they throw at it due to Hexproof.
4x Sylvan Caryatid
4x Burning-tree Emissary
2x Reverent Hunter
4x Boon Satyr
3x Ghor Clan Rampager
2x Polukranos, World Eater
2x Ember Swallower
4x Stormbreath Dragon
1x Ruric Thar, the Unbowed
3x Xenagos, the Reveler
2x Chandra, Pyromaster
4x Stomping Ground
4x Temple of Abandon
5x Mountain
7x Forest
2x Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
1 Ruric Thar, the Unbowed
3x Mizzium Mortars
1x Polukranos, World Eater
2x Mistcutter Hydra
2x Electrickery
2x Destructive Revelry
4x Burning Earth
The sideboard is still in flux, I've only tested the main deck. It feels very strong, there are a lot of crazy magical christmasland possibilities with this deck, but even when I don't ramp into a monstrous Ember Swallower or dragon, or 6-10 counter Reverent Hunter on turn 3, I still drop huge threats every turn. The planeswalkers all work very well together and usually bury opposing control decks with card advantage. Against U/W or Esper, I usually don't care if I see a Supreme Verdict. I just toss 3-4 guys in the GY and drop more threats the next turn. Also, Boon Satyr has been huge against them. Sylvan Caryatids, Polukranos, and the sideboard usually keep me alive to stabilize against fast agro decks. Once I get the sideboard finished, I'll probably be sleeving this up for the next standard tournament.
Well see? That's why you're here to introduce it to us! Haha. I like the hammer, I just didn't know where to squeeze it in. That seems to be the case for a lot of y cards though.
Dunes of Zairo
SHANDALAR
Innistrad - The Darkest Night
~THE RAVNICAN CONSORTIUM~
A Community Set
Commander: Allies & Adversaries
Hammer is a great card, but doesn't fit the curve of the deck all that well. Turns 1 and 2 you want to be dropping ramp or Domri, turn 3 or 4 you want to put fatties into play. It becomes better if you're heavily vested in Kalonian Hydra, but I don't think that's where you want to be much of the time. Against the majority of opponents, you want to put something that wins the game into play quickly, and in the case of Ember Swallower, 4 damage is less important than untapping and going monsterous with it. I've been considering it in the board against control, but it can interfere with the walkers/Ruric plan to beat them if you're topdecking later in the game. I wouldn't count it out, but I haven't run into a situation where I wanted to topdeck it more than just another dragon or planeswalker.
4 Elvish Mystic
4 Sylvan Caryatid
4 Satyr Hedonist
4 Burning Tree Emissary
4 Ember Swallower
4 Stormbreath Dragon
3 Xenagos
4 Lightning Strike
2 Mizzium Mortars
2 Arbor Colossus
4 Rangers Guile
3 Clan Defiance
1 Mizzium Mortars
2 Flames of the Firebrand
1 Polis Crusher
2 Ruric Thar
The ramp helps me go monsterous with my creatures quite quickly. The two drops also make BTE very effective in curving into Xenagos. Clan Defiance feels like it would fit in well here, I don't know if I want to keep the mana open for Monsterous or something with a X in its mana cost.
I also like Kalonian Tusker to replace one of the two drops in the decklist currently. Maybe replacing BTE since BTE can't help cast it.
You don't have to always cast it turn 3, its perfectly fine as a late game tool too
I think themain issue with Primeval Bounty in a Xenagos deck is the speed factor. Your whole goal here is to put out a turn 3 Xenagos, the Reveler to ramp into a turn 4 Biggest-Thing-In-Your-Hand. Then on 5 you're either making it monstrous or dropping your second bomb. Would you rather play Primeval Bounty or Stormbreath Dragon on 4? Primeval Bounty or making him monstrous? I think you'd be better off with either a) defensive spells such as Ranger's Guile to counter removal or b) red removal of your own.
A comment on your creatures. I would main board Polukranos, World Eater and move Mistcutter Hydra into the side. Polukranos will clear out small blockers when he goes monstrous and is just the better all-around choice. Mistcutter is obviously the go-to against control decks. Ruric Thar, the Unbowed is a side board must also, to bring in against any type of control (black removal, red burn, blue bounce, etc).
I also prefer Garruk over Domri, but to each his own there.