I like the one mention of Sin Collector.
Anyone been brewing strait orzhov recently? I have been tossing around some ideas.
I have been thinking about it, but Sin Collector in a Junk Midrange/Junk Token deck seems like madness. Plus 3 color decks just seem to play smoother than 2 colors.
- as already noted, their circuit riders are resistant to change and development, and prior to the PT they rarely produce anything new (Wolf Run Ramp being a notable exception)
- watching Warleader's Helix being played right now on replays by a 5-1 deck, so I guess it's playable?
- the three big decks (UWR Flash, Junk, and Jund) stomped the rogue lists, so sub-PT level innovators failed to figure out how to move the environment
- holy crap 10 rounds. lotta people wanna play standard right now. maybe every block should be a multicolor block.
Replay right now, Jund vs Junk Rites, Junk player played two spells so Huntmaster flipped again bringing in a Wolf which attacked the same turn and Judge and Junk player were OK... :lmao:
He actually got a rules violation for that. It was also his second of the tournament at that time. It did get caught.
I find it so interesting how Junk Reanimator is still such a favorite. It simply has so much raw power in what it's doing, and it attacks along several axis. Case in point: Acidic Slime does amazing things when blinked, reanimated.
Reanimator wins again. I wish I could say I was surprised, but it just does so much right.
The more I see of Standard, the more I cannot wait for Innistrad to rotate. I'm ready... already. And DGM just got released. I want Sir Snaps-a-lot, GoST, Bonfire, Unburial Rites, Restoration Angel, and Thragtusk to rotate.
Unless something was super broken, everyone knew Jund or Reanimator were going to win. They are just solid decks with a ton of play and really powerful cards. Exactly what you want to be doing at the start of a format. When your not sure what your up against, Rock style decks with a smattering of different answers tend to be the best thing going.
Really surprised we didn't see more Jund Aggro lists a la Cedric Philips. They have the speed to punish Reanimator and the Jund Midrange match up is at least 50/50.
The pilots I did see playing the deck weren't very good however....
Really surprised we didn't see more Jund Aggro lists a la Cedric Philips. They have the speed to punish Reanimator and the Jund Midrange match up is at least 50/50.
The pilots I did see playing the deck weren't very good however....
Yep, they have a good win ratio vs. Junk Rites. I personally just like the Gr version better (no Aristocrat, but easier mana base).
No doubt Junk Reanimator is a good deck. There are decks that have positive matchups though: Bant Enchant, GW Aggro, Gr Aggro, and Ceddy's deck, which I believe he copied from an online player that he knew. The deck was a version of Kibler's Gr Aggro deck.
Actually, Aristocrats Act 2 has a positive win ratio vs. Junk Rites too.
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Legacy - Sneak Show, BR Reanimator, Miracles, UW Stoneblade
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/ Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander - Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build) (dead format for me)
1 event played -> omg the meta is going to suck. You don't jump to conclusions very often do you?
To the control is dead point. Control always takes time to build up nowadays,because it is reactive not proactive, but oh well.
Control is essentially Terminus or Verdict before turn 4 or die. Aggro is way too fast right now. Control doesn't have the tools Its counters suck, it has no deck manipulation ala Ponder or Preordain and outside of Sphinx, its card draw is crap.
Do you honestly expect control to make any dent in this meta when aggro has gotten all the tools and control has basically been thrown a couple of bones?
Control is essentially Terminus or Verdict before turn 4 or die. Aggro is way too fast right now. Control doesn't have the tools Its counters suck, it has no deck manipulation ala Ponder or Preordain and outside of Sphinx, its card draw is crap.
Do you honestly expect control to make any dent in this meta when aggro has gotten all the tools and control has basically been thrown a couple of bones?
I don't.
Then what about UWR which already has a large number of wins and T8s, especially in PTQs? What do you think of the hate not making too much of a dent yesterday?
Did you really expect a high amount of innovation? Even if there isn't a variety of control decks, you can't just call out saying there's absolutely no variety in the meta. Especially after one event. Barring a major rotation (like a block shifting out, or a banning), people usually will gravitate towards the previous best decks for events like this. Pros who did happen to show up weren't there for innovation when they have to work on block format for the PT in 2 weeks.
The only real surprise to me is the fact that there wasn't a good showing from R/G or Jund aggro decks, compared to how well they've done online the past few weeks. Yes the coverage was biased towards Jund and Reanimator, but it's hard to say that it was a complete dominance. This is still much better than some stagnant Standard formats.
Totally agree, and playing a deck full of farseek, tusk and restos doesn't feel like a control deck to me...
Now talking about the scg, is rest in peace not enought to stop rites? i never have troubles with that matchup, dissipate and rip.
If Rest in Peace was enough to stop the deck it wouldn't have dominated the past couple months. It can still play a strong game of fair magic, and all of those Acidic Slimes laugh at enchantments.
Honestly, isn't Jund "Midrange" pretty much control?
I play Jund almost exclusively and have since October, and it really feels pretty much exactly like a control deck when you play it.
Your game plan is, against aggro, just to stay alive until you high quality of cards wins you the game, usually with Olivia acting as a finisher.
Even against the other control decks, your plan is generally to fight them for hand advantage and to play the long game. That is a plan for control mirrors, I'd say.
Honestly, isn't Jund "Midrange" pretty much control?
I play Jund almost exclusively and have since October, and it really feels pretty much exactly like a control deck when you play it.
Your game plan is, against aggro, just to stay alive until you high quality of cards wins you the game, usually with Olivia acting as a finisher.
Even against the other control decks, your plan is generally to fight them for hand advantage and to play the long game. That is a plan for control mirrors, I'd say.
If Jund is a control deck then I'm quitting Standard. This is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard since somebody called Infect a combo deck.
Jund is Mid Range. Control is control. They are two very different decks.
Do you believe that only blue can be the control color?
Look, I know all about "Who's The Beatdown" and every deck being able to play aggressively or defensively and all that crap. That's not what I'm talking about and you know it.
Stereotypical and/or classic control just doesn't exist anymore. It can't because today's players hate it. So WotC has done what it could to nerf it as much as possible without totally killing it. Hard counters are now horrible. Card draw is marginal at best with the exception of Sphinx and even that card can't save you from being destroyed on turn 4 by a fast aggro deck.
Control isn't unplayable. It's okay. But it's not the same animal that it used to be. And with every new set and every new EtB or value creature that gets printed that's so far ahead of the curve that it's a joke, control gets more and more difficult to play competitively.
But if you think I'm wrong, keep watching the meta over the next 3 months and see how many UW, UWR and Esper control lists put up solid results at the major events. I'd be stunned if, in the top 32, we saw more than 2 control decks.
That is not the direction of the "new" Magic and I get it. Doesn't mean I have to like it. And it doesn't mean that I have to accept "Jund" as a control deck.
Look, I know all about "Who's The Beatdown" and every deck being able to play aggressively or defensively and all that crap. That's not what I'm talking about and you know it.
Stereotypical and/or classic control just doesn't exist anymore. It can't because today's players hate it. So WotC has done what it could to nerf it as much as possible without totally killing it. Hard counters are now horrible. Card draw is marginal at best with the exception of Sphinx and even that card can't save you from being destroyed on turn 4 by a fast aggro deck.
Control isn't unplayable. It's okay. But it's not the same animal that it used to be. And with every new set and every new EtB or value creature that gets printed that's so far ahead of the curve that it's a joke, control gets more and more difficult to play competitively.
But if you think I'm wrong, keep watching the meta over the next 3 months and see how many UW, UWR and Esper control lists put up solid results at the major events. I'd be stunned if, in the top 32, we saw more than 2 control decks.
That is not the direction of the "new" Magic and I get it. Doesn't mean I have to like it. And it doesn't mean that I have to accept "Jund" as a control deck.
Control decks are reactive so people won't want to play with it first in a new meta. Once people figure out what's good we'll see more control decks.
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The two top 8 players who are running Voice have really liked it.
http://www.starcitygames.com/events/coverage/1879_standard_open_top_8_profiles.html
Anyone been brewing strait orzhov recently? I have been tossing around some ideas.
I have been thinking about it, but Sin Collector in a Junk Midrange/Junk Token deck seems like madness. Plus 3 color decks just seem to play smoother than 2 colors.
- as already noted, their circuit riders are resistant to change and development, and prior to the PT they rarely produce anything new (Wolf Run Ramp being a notable exception)
- watching Warleader's Helix being played right now on replays by a 5-1 deck, so I guess it's playable?
- the three big decks (UWR Flash, Junk, and Jund) stomped the rogue lists, so sub-PT level innovators failed to figure out how to move the environment
- holy crap 10 rounds. lotta people wanna play standard right now. maybe every block should be a multicolor block.
He actually got a rules violation for that. It was also his second of the tournament at that time. It did get caught.
I find it so interesting how Junk Reanimator is still such a favorite. It simply has so much raw power in what it's doing, and it attacks along several axis. Case in point: Acidic Slime does amazing things when blinked, reanimated.
Currently Working On: Jund Ramp (RTR Block)
GR My Blog RG (Std)
Know what? I played Humanimator against a mill deck and still lost. RIP is a card.
And a damn annoying one at that.
Worst comes to worst, they board Sire out against Reanimator.
The more I see of Standard, the more I cannot wait for Innistrad to rotate. I'm ready... already. And DGM just got released. I want Sir Snaps-a-lot, GoST, Bonfire, Unburial Rites, Restoration Angel, and Thragtusk to rotate.
Currently Working On: Jund Ramp (RTR Block)
GR My Blog RG (Std)
=
"Sup dawg! I herd u like mountains so I equipped a mountain on your mountain so your can swing with land while you swing with land!"
The pilots I did see playing the deck weren't very good however....
Its not that aggro is supposed to dominate, its that control is supposed to be dead. Which it is -.-
---
BRG Prossh, Skyraider of Kher
WUB Sharuum, the Hegemon
UGEdric, Spymaster of Trest
Yep, they have a good win ratio vs. Junk Rites. I personally just like the Gr version better (no Aristocrat, but easier mana base).
No doubt Junk Reanimator is a good deck. There are decks that have positive matchups though: Bant Enchant, GW Aggro, Gr Aggro, and Ceddy's deck, which I believe he copied from an online player that he knew. The deck was a version of Kibler's Gr Aggro deck.
Actually, Aristocrats Act 2 has a positive win ratio vs. Junk Rites too.
Premodern - Trix, RecSur, Enchantress, Reanimator, Elves https://www.facebook.com/groups/PremodernUSA/
Modern - Neobrand, Hogaak Vine, Elves
Standard - Mono Red (6-2 and 5-3 in 2 McQ)
Draft - (I wish I had more time for limited...)
Commander -
Norin the Wary, Grimgrin, Adun Oakenshield (taking forever to build)(dead format for me)Yes, that was sarcasm.
Seriously though, where can I go to see the final results and when will they be posted?
Can't wait until the core of both those decks rotate out.
Landboysteve: http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/deckshow.php?&t%5BC1%5D=1&start_date=2013-05-05&end_date=2013-05-05&start=1&finish=32&start_num=25&start_num=0&limit=32
Those are the top 32 decklists at the event.
http://www.starcitygames.com/events/130504_somerset.html
So 1 control deck. The rest was essentially reanimator and Jund.
Yes my friends, we are going to have a diverse Standard meta the next 3 months.
Oh joy.
Control is essentially Terminus or Verdict before turn 4 or die. Aggro is way too fast right now. Control doesn't have the tools Its counters suck, it has no deck manipulation ala Ponder or Preordain and outside of Sphinx, its card draw is crap.
Do you honestly expect control to make any dent in this meta when aggro has gotten all the tools and control has basically been thrown a couple of bones?
I don't.
Then what about UWR which already has a large number of wins and T8s, especially in PTQs? What do you think of the hate not making too much of a dent yesterday?
Did you really expect a high amount of innovation? Even if there isn't a variety of control decks, you can't just call out saying there's absolutely no variety in the meta. Especially after one event. Barring a major rotation (like a block shifting out, or a banning), people usually will gravitate towards the previous best decks for events like this. Pros who did happen to show up weren't there for innovation when they have to work on block format for the PT in 2 weeks.
The only real surprise to me is the fact that there wasn't a good showing from R/G or Jund aggro decks, compared to how well they've done online the past few weeks. Yes the coverage was biased towards Jund and Reanimator, but it's hard to say that it was a complete dominance. This is still much better than some stagnant Standard formats.
If Rest in Peace was enough to stop the deck it wouldn't have dominated the past couple months. It can still play a strong game of fair magic, and all of those Acidic Slimes laugh at enchantments.
I play Jund almost exclusively and have since October, and it really feels pretty much exactly like a control deck when you play it.
Your game plan is, against aggro, just to stay alive until you high quality of cards wins you the game, usually with Olivia acting as a finisher.
Even against the other control decks, your plan is generally to fight them for hand advantage and to play the long game. That is a plan for control mirrors, I'd say.
If Jund is a control deck then I'm quitting Standard. This is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard since somebody called Infect a combo deck.
Jund is Mid Range. Control is control. They are two very different decks.
Do you believe that only blue can be the control color?
Look, I know all about "Who's The Beatdown" and every deck being able to play aggressively or defensively and all that crap. That's not what I'm talking about and you know it.
Stereotypical and/or classic control just doesn't exist anymore. It can't because today's players hate it. So WotC has done what it could to nerf it as much as possible without totally killing it. Hard counters are now horrible. Card draw is marginal at best with the exception of Sphinx and even that card can't save you from being destroyed on turn 4 by a fast aggro deck.
Control isn't unplayable. It's okay. But it's not the same animal that it used to be. And with every new set and every new EtB or value creature that gets printed that's so far ahead of the curve that it's a joke, control gets more and more difficult to play competitively.
But if you think I'm wrong, keep watching the meta over the next 3 months and see how many UW, UWR and Esper control lists put up solid results at the major events. I'd be stunned if, in the top 32, we saw more than 2 control decks.
That is not the direction of the "new" Magic and I get it. Doesn't mean I have to like it. And it doesn't mean that I have to accept "Jund" as a control deck.
Control decks are reactive so people won't want to play with it first in a new meta. Once people figure out what's good we'll see more control decks.