Having played this deck earlier in the season I can say that unless you meta is full of aggro this deck isn't really the place to be as it just dies to control and other midrange decks, esp esper, bant and jund. One board wipe and gg.
Disagree, most midrange decks try to trade you card for card in anticipation of a bigger mid game (their huntmaster vs your pig etc) but with this deck I find more often then not we get into a mode where they have a huntmaster but I have a wolfir and a bonded geist.
Now American control... that's a bad match up I'm not really sure what we can do about it. Unless Domri both comes down on turn unanswered it's going to be rough. However if that happens it seems pretty even, at the very least you match their card advantage.
The deck that I really feel helpless against is actually ghost pants, but for now I've decided to take the gamble I won't face it.
I ran an almost carbon copy this weekend at a ptq, (I dropped 2 - 2 got spanked by a ghost pants deck :/ and then lost a top deck war in game 3 to aristocrats (my wolfir came down to be stolen by their zealous conscripts for the win he had 3 life : ( )
My only changes were I put searing spear over slaughterhorn (I think missing on domri about 5-7% more often is worth the utility of searing spear in the deck vs the horn) and I had 2 huntmasters in the side instead of trackers)
Oh I also only ran a single gruul charm that coupled with main searing spears let me put in 2 big garruks and 1 little garruk in the side (for control match ups if garruk resolves it gives me a pretty good shot)
few notes, ground seal is better than crypt I've finally made up my mind on this, between arbor elf and gyre sage and BTE I like paying 2 mana for my gy hate rather than a single card.
I'm putting huntmaster in the main and maybe going up to 3, they're going to start taking up the hellrider spot for me. As kibler put it in the video hellrider tends to come down a turn late in the deck because of the double red (I find this very true). I think huntmaster is way to powerful to be in the sideboard (he pretty much can take on naya humans all by his lonesome if they don't have the nut draw)
The deck feels too top heavy, I think an even split between the thundermaws and silver hearts would be better than what it has now. I'd put the remaining thundermaws in the side so I could go up to as many big fatties as I need.
Notes on the wins, this deck has great game against aggro, you just sit back actually cast your gore clans and then start beating them up with a big monster (bonded ghor clan or a thundermaw works fairly well)
mid range is pretty even, you usually get to play the beat down for a couple turns while they durdle out farseek. Then you actually have dudes that go toe to toe with their thragtusk.
Junk is a decent match too, if they get angel down too early it's over, but you can go bigger than their stupid thragtusks, or over them with thundermaw.
The reslience they both have vs removal and sweepers is something I'd like this deck to have more of (but I imagine every one sleeving up r/g feels that way.
I'm unsure on whether I want strangleroot geist in place of wolfir avenger or not. The only problem I have with geist is he can't be cast off of emissary.
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Gyre Sage is great. However it isn't just about turning guys sideways. Legitimately it is too slow against like Naya Blitz especially on the draw. But it's a 2 mana investment for something that can become one of the best threats in the deck. If given a few turns it has the same punch as a 4 drop. The tricky part is that it can be awkward in multiples and doesn't really play with Arbor Elf all that well since if you have 3 mana on T2 you often want to be doing something better. I think the greatest benefit of Sage is not having to run so many T1 green sources perhaps but a deck like this runs them anyway. What eventually happens in non sweeper matchups and even against like Jund if they are too busy to deal with the Sage is you snuck in an extra 4/5 before they realized it.
Slaughterhorn is awkward in the deck because it doesn't really want Giant Growth.. it isn't quite aggro enough. I was thinking it would be decent in Blitz but Blitz has no incentive necessarily to run more creatures.. no Domri etc.. The problem is it basically is a conditional removal spell. You don't want to chance the 2 for 1 often and more likely all you are doing is killing their blocker with it and not getting in. It isn't like Ghor Clan in that sense. What I find interesting is how often you want to actually cast Ghor Clan as a 4 drop in this deck. That could be a definite boon. In my Jund version I have Aristocrat so Ghor Clan is usually a combat trick. It makes playing Silverheart that much sweeter though.
I do think Kiblers top end is steep but I think its the format that encourages it. I only run 4 5 drops main, but in some matchups against midrange decks that you don't have to really race too hard (UWR, Jund) since they won't just kill you I side into the extra 2 and go up to 6. It's a risk but basically you are playing the threat density game. A game that playing Gyre Sage and Domri basically enables. You might get land screwed in a sense but it means if you hit your lands your deck actually top decks better potentially which causes a matchup misalignment where the midrange deck technically should.
Personally I feel the black mana is almost necessary for the deck to be completely rounded but it isn't easy to support in the mana. Access to Aristocrat at 4 gives you an earlier flight to the air which alleviates Ghor Clans role a bit (but doesn't make it bad). Ghor Clan has the awkward bit of often just being a removal spell and some small damage. Aristocrat provides continuous damage and some resilience. The black removal is key giving practical answers to Reckoner a real pain and Tragic Slip which is about the best removal in a Domri deck (fight a guy, slip their best guy). Not to mention an alternate angle of attack against typically awkward matchups like UWR or sometimes control in cards like Slaughter Games. Don't need to play time sensitive cards like Skullcrack which you would never really play in those matchups (we win with creatures more than burn). I mean Esper can't really beat a Domri ultimate anyway, but no Sphinx Rev is big.
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Current Decks: GWUKnightfall Modern UWTempo Legacy UGRBurning Wish Cobra Vintage
I'm unsure on whether I want strangleroot geist in place of wolfir avenger or not. The only problem I have with geist is he can't be cast off of emissary.
Depends on your meta, mine is jund heavy and geist is awesome there. Wolfir has regenerating but you need to be able to both untap with him in play vs Jund (abrupt decay, ultimate price, searing spear all ruin my day) and then keep mana open, I'd rather use that mana on silverhearts.
I also like him more than avenger vs azorious charm since he comes back out of the gates.
I want avenger to work but I can't fit him in, for me he'd take either the slaughterhorn slot (which I prefer searing spear in) or the huntmaster/hellrider spot where he is outclassed by either card.
My meta is full of aggro and jund so huntmaster upgraded to the main deck. The open slot likely will become another garruk or possibly a triumph of ferocity, something to battle control decks (american more so, Esper isn't too bad it just depends on if they can answer domri, which is surprisingly not often.)
Not sure, pretty sure it would straight replace bonfire against esper (they don't have creatures, game goes long and every time they mill you, you get a chance to "draw" it)
I guess it is also a catch all so you don't just die to things like Angel, but I can't be sure. I'll have to test it once I pick up bonfires (I find it awesome they're here and wish I had thought to try them out)
Currently I am trying to figure out how good TMHK is in this deck but looking at decklists from the recent events it's apparently quite vital - nearly every deck is going 3/1
TMHK?
I also like the Shaman and Armed//Dangerous. I'd also like to try Ruric Thar, but that might be a pipe-dream
I also like the Shaman and Armed//Dangerous. I'd also like to try Ruric Thar, but that might be a pipe-dream
Those are the exact cards I intend to test. Also, I know this is the competitive forum, but since we're already suggesting cards, What do you all think about Gruul War Chant?, Pyreheart Wolf's effect was always pretty powerful despite it taking a turn to do its thing. In this case we can drop our creatures and top it off with Chant for an instantaneous effect and it will also buff our attackers.
I hadn't thought about Ruric! You can potentially get him out T4, T3 if you had the perfect hand. Gyre sage followed by a burning-tree emissary and flinthoof boar, then you have the mana for him the next turn.... Interesting.
What do you think about Thundermaw Hellkite and Bonfire of the Damned playsets in sideboard?
Wanted to try this deck but seriously need some advice about that two cards.
Actually since a month i'm playin classic RG Aggro, but dealin with the mass Thragtusks and Angel of Serenity is terrible, so wanted to try some new version
Personally, I don't run any bonfire of the damned in my 75, and I also run 2 Thundermaw Hellkite main because of how strong they are on the topdeck, which i assume bonfire would be as well. I like how you have it, But i would maybe try to fit 1-2 copies of each in you mainboard.
Having said that, what do you guys think of adding Armed (armed/dangerous), Blood (Flesh/Blood) (for the blood side only obviously), and Ruric Thar, the Unbowed. And what could we cut to add these?
Also lol how do you tag the split cards? I keep trying and they won't link
These are totally different animals.
The Gyre Sage/Wolfy list is on the early end of mid range, it uses silverheart to go over the top of opponent's just as they are about to stabilize.
That other list is interesting, it's much more aggressive.
PS. Are there any videos with this list? I'd like to see how it sideboards.
reference to reach on that thread makes little sense:
Corrected to: Finish an opponent 'with burn' spells?
Depends on your Meta, mine is filled with Jund and geist is too important. He makes murder, abrupt decay, and searing spear that much worse.
Disagree, most midrange decks try to trade you card for card in anticipation of a bigger mid game (their huntmaster vs your pig etc) but with this deck I find more often then not we get into a mode where they have a huntmaster but I have a wolfir and a bonded geist.
Now American control... that's a bad match up I'm not really sure what we can do about it. Unless Domri both comes down on turn unanswered it's going to be rough. However if that happens it seems pretty even, at the very least you match their card advantage.
The deck that I really feel helpless against is actually ghost pants, but for now I've decided to take the gamble I won't face it.
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Flinthoof Boar
4 Ghor-Clan Rampager
4 Gyre Sage
4 Slaughterhorn
4 Strangleroot Geist
4 Thundermaw Hellkite
2 Wolfir Silverheart
8 Forest
5 Mountain
1 Kessig Wolf Run
4 Rootbound Crag
4 Stomping Ground
2 Ulvenwald Tracker
2 Wolfir Silverheart
3 Ground Seal
2 Gruul Charm
2 Searing Spear
4 Pillar of Flame
I ran an almost carbon copy this weekend at a ptq, (I dropped 2 - 2 got spanked by a ghost pants deck :/ and then lost a top deck war in game 3 to aristocrats (my wolfir came down to be stolen by their zealous conscripts for the win he had 3 life : ( )
My only changes were I put searing spear over slaughterhorn (I think missing on domri about 5-7% more often is worth the utility of searing spear in the deck vs the horn) and I had 2 huntmasters in the side instead of trackers)
Oh I also only ran a single gruul charm that coupled with main searing spears let me put in 2 big garruks and 1 little garruk in the side (for control match ups if garruk resolves it gives me a pretty good shot)
few notes, ground seal is better than crypt I've finally made up my mind on this, between arbor elf and gyre sage and BTE I like paying 2 mana for my gy hate rather than a single card.
I'm putting huntmaster in the main and maybe going up to 3, they're going to start taking up the hellrider spot for me. As kibler put it in the video hellrider tends to come down a turn late in the deck because of the double red (I find this very true). I think huntmaster is way to powerful to be in the sideboard (he pretty much can take on naya humans all by his lonesome if they don't have the nut draw)
The deck feels too top heavy, I think an even split between the thundermaws and silver hearts would be better than what it has now. I'd put the remaining thundermaws in the side so I could go up to as many big fatties as I need.
Notes on the wins, this deck has great game against aggro, you just sit back actually cast your gore clans and then start beating them up with a big monster (bonded ghor clan or a thundermaw works fairly well)
mid range is pretty even, you usually get to play the beat down for a couple turns while they durdle out farseek. Then you actually have dudes that go toe to toe with their thragtusk.
Junk is a decent match too, if they get angel down too early it's over, but you can go bigger than their stupid thragtusks, or over them with thundermaw.
The only cards I haven't tested and are considering right now are Hound of Griselbrand and Wolfir Avenger
The reslience they both have vs removal and sweepers is something I'd like this deck to have more of (but I imagine every one sleeving up r/g feels that way.
Bant auras
Here's a list I'm considering for a IQ this upcoming weekend.
4 burning tree emissary
4 flinthoof boar
4 gyre sage
4 wolfir avenger
4 ghor-clan rampager
2 hellrider
3 wolfir silverheart
1 thundermaw hellkite
2 searing spear
3 domri rade
4 stomping ground
4 rootbound crag
9 forest
5 mountain
1 kessig wolf run
I'm unsure on whether I want strangleroot geist in place of wolfir avenger or not. The only problem I have with geist is he can't be cast off of emissary.
~Signature by Rivenor @ Miraculous Recovery Studios~
Slaughterhorn is awkward in the deck because it doesn't really want Giant Growth.. it isn't quite aggro enough. I was thinking it would be decent in Blitz but Blitz has no incentive necessarily to run more creatures.. no Domri etc.. The problem is it basically is a conditional removal spell. You don't want to chance the 2 for 1 often and more likely all you are doing is killing their blocker with it and not getting in. It isn't like Ghor Clan in that sense. What I find interesting is how often you want to actually cast Ghor Clan as a 4 drop in this deck. That could be a definite boon. In my Jund version I have Aristocrat so Ghor Clan is usually a combat trick. It makes playing Silverheart that much sweeter though.
I do think Kiblers top end is steep but I think its the format that encourages it. I only run 4 5 drops main, but in some matchups against midrange decks that you don't have to really race too hard (UWR, Jund) since they won't just kill you I side into the extra 2 and go up to 6. It's a risk but basically you are playing the threat density game. A game that playing Gyre Sage and Domri basically enables. You might get land screwed in a sense but it means if you hit your lands your deck actually top decks better potentially which causes a matchup misalignment where the midrange deck technically should.
Personally I feel the black mana is almost necessary for the deck to be completely rounded but it isn't easy to support in the mana. Access to Aristocrat at 4 gives you an earlier flight to the air which alleviates Ghor Clans role a bit (but doesn't make it bad). Ghor Clan has the awkward bit of often just being a removal spell and some small damage. Aristocrat provides continuous damage and some resilience. The black removal is key giving practical answers to Reckoner a real pain and Tragic Slip which is about the best removal in a Domri deck (fight a guy, slip their best guy). Not to mention an alternate angle of attack against typically awkward matchups like UWR or sometimes control in cards like Slaughter Games. Don't need to play time sensitive cards like Skullcrack which you would never really play in those matchups (we win with creatures more than burn). I mean Esper can't really beat a Domri ultimate anyway, but no Sphinx Rev is big.
GWU Knightfall Modern
UW Tempo Legacy
UGR Burning Wish Cobra Vintage
Depends on your meta, mine is jund heavy and geist is awesome there. Wolfir has regenerating but you need to be able to both untap with him in play vs Jund (abrupt decay, ultimate price, searing spear all ruin my day) and then keep mana open, I'd rather use that mana on silverhearts.
I also like him more than avenger vs azorious charm since he comes back out of the gates.
I want avenger to work but I can't fit him in, for me he'd take either the slaughterhorn slot (which I prefer searing spear in) or the huntmaster/hellrider spot where he is outclassed by either card.
4 Flinthoof Boar
4 Arbor Elf
4 Strangleroot Geist
4 Gyre Sage
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Ghor-Clan Rampager
3 Huntmaster of the Fells
4 Wolfir Silverheart
7 other spells
4 Searing Spear
4 Domri Rade
5 Mountain
8 Forest
4 Stomping Ground
1 Kessig Wolf Run
4 Rootbound Crag
1 Garruk Relentless
2 Garruk Primal Hunter
4 Pillar of Flame
4 Thundermaw Hellkite
1 Open Slot
My meta is full of aggro and jund so huntmaster upgraded to the main deck. The open slot likely will become another garruk or possibly a triumph of ferocity, something to battle control decks (american more so, Esper isn't too bad it just depends on if they can answer domri, which is surprisingly not often.)
Edit:
Another Good placing of a similar list
http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=54789
1 Borderland Ranger
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Flinthoof Boar
4 Ghor-Clan Rampager
4 Gyre Sage
4 Hellrider
2 Thundermaw Hellkite
2 Wolfir Silverheart
8 Forest
6 Mountain
1 Kessig Wolf Run
4 Rootbound Crag
4 Stomping Ground
4 Bonfire of the Damned
2 Thundermaw Hellkite
2 Ground Seal
1 Devil's Play
2 Mizzium Mortars
3 Pillar of Flame
1 Cavern of Souls
Decks starting to put up some numbers
60 cards
8 Forest
1 Kessig Wolf Run
6 Mountain
4 Rootbound Crag
4 Stomping Ground
23 lands
4 Arbor Elf
1 Borderland Ranger
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Flinthoof Boar
4 Ghor-Clan Rampager
4 Gyre Sage
4 Hellrider
2 Thundermaw Hellkite
2 Wolfir Silverheart
29 creatures
4 Domri Rade
8 other spells
1 Cavern of Souls
2 Devil's Play
2 Ground Seal
2 Mizzium Mortars
3 Pillar of Flame
4 Strangleroot Geist
1 Thundermaw Hellkite
~Signature by Rivenor @ Miraculous Recovery Studios~
Not sure, pretty sure it would straight replace bonfire against esper (they don't have creatures, game goes long and every time they mill you, you get a chance to "draw" it)
I guess it is also a catch all so you don't just die to things like Angel, but I can't be sure. I'll have to test it once I pick up bonfires (I find it awesome they're here and wish I had thought to try them out)
TMHK?
I also like the Shaman and Armed//Dangerous. I'd also like to try Ruric Thar, but that might be a pipe-dream
Those are the exact cards I intend to test. Also, I know this is the competitive forum, but since we're already suggesting cards, What do you all think about Gruul War Chant?, Pyreheart Wolf's effect was always pretty powerful despite it taking a turn to do its thing. In this case we can drop our creatures and top it off with Chant for an instantaneous effect and it will also buff our attackers.
I would not go above 2 copies though.
Personally, I don't run any bonfire of the damned in my 75, and I also run 2 Thundermaw Hellkite main because of how strong they are on the topdeck, which i assume bonfire would be as well. I like how you have it, But i would maybe try to fit 1-2 copies of each in you mainboard.
Having said that, what do you guys think of adding Armed (armed/dangerous), Blood (Flesh/Blood) (for the blood side only obviously), and Ruric Thar, the Unbowed. And what could we cut to add these?
Also lol how do you tag the split cards? I keep trying and they won't link