Played at 2 game days with my build, got 2nd then won next. Thankfully guy I just could not beat didn't show at 2nd. He was running the fastest UG agro I've ever seen and never could get ahead of it. Even against really fast mono R or RG I've stabilized at 1-4 life quite a few times.
Most of your changes look pretty good Elesh. I still like to have access to an Angel of Serenity, it has won me to many games. I think 3 Obz is pushing your luck. He's really great against control match ups but only ok to good against agro. I went with 2 main and 1 side.
Not sure about the Sever or Orzhov Charm. Haven't had much need of either. Haven't tried Liliana yet. If I add the Lingering she definitely becomes playable so may try it.
It's not really that bad, but it isn't really excellent either. Games I win are usually t2 kill the champion and then drop a 3 drop. Both Lingering Souls and Loxodon Smiter are kinda difficult for them to get through, and really slow non-Rancor decks down. (Rancor sucks though, Ash Zealot just swings through Smiter and dgafs about Souls. By that point you get to start playing stuff like Thragtusks and Restoration Angel, which just outclasses what they are doing, along with efficient spot removal on their bombs. It's not easy cause Naya can still just explode and kill you, but it's certainly not unwinnable
My sideboard plan would be:
-3 Obzedat, Ghost Council
-1 Orzhov Charm
-2 Farseek?
-2 Unburial Rites
-2 Liliana of the Veil
Farseek is actually really bad in this match up. I'd much rather be casting a turn two removal spell like Abrupt Decay or Victim of Night, but I'm not sure if siding them out is the right play. I might just side the other two out and bring in an extra Sever and a Sigarda, just cause she's big and blocks well.
Obzedat, in my opinion is the crux of the deck. Even against aggro, he can just outrace them, if you have a decent degree of stabilization. And he just gives you free wins against Esper and Flash, which I think merits the as a 3-of. I agree that there are better options, but in my opinion, he's just too good for less than 3 in the main.
I do want to find room for Angel of Serenity. Lotleth Troll has been, by far, the worst card in the deck, so I am considering switching that around.
I do want to find room for Angel of Serenity. Lotleth Troll has been, by far, the worst card in the deck, so I am considering switching that around.
Early in my testing I cut Troll for Gyre Sage. He can get big quick and at worst eats some removal that they would have saved for one of your real threats.
Hmm. That seems interesting. What I was interested in is finding cards for the midrange match up, since that, too me, is what I had the most trouble with, so I was more interested in going over the top with Angel.
Early in my testing I cut Troll for Gyre Sage. He can get big quick and at worst eats some removal that they would have saved for one of your real threats.
He also has some sick synergy with Obze.
I've also been running Gyre Sage. She's wonderful early game and gets worse the longer the game runs. Unlike Lotleth Troll, however, she's easier to get big late game.
I often am seeing the Gyre Sage as a 4/5 and 5/6 can happen as well. I have found that the sequence of T2 Gyre Sage, T3 Loxodon Smiter, T4 Restoration Angel blink Smiter creates 4/5 Gyre Sages fairly consistently.
For those running Gyre Sage, has anyone thought about 1-2 Entreat the Angels? The mana ramp works with it, and the miracle is cheap.
When I brought in the Gyre Sage I initially looked for X spells to add. I completely missed Entreat the Angels. I'll have to try out the card. I have to remember too that on 4/4 Angel for 5 cc is still on curve most of the time, so the worst mode still isn't so bad. I'm not sure what I would side out for the card though, my 5 cc cards are pretty full.
I also want to talk to everyone about Farseek. All of the deck lists I'm seeing are playing the card, but with the faster aggro starts I'm finding that if I take time to play Farseek I'm dead soon afterwards. My best starts are playing a creature on 2 or playing removal. Has anyone else come to similar conclusions? What is the general consensus about Farseek? I'm going to do some testing without the card to see if a semblance of consistency remains.
I also want to talk to everyone about Farseek. All of the deck lists I'm seeing are playing the card, but with the faster aggro starts I'm finding that if I take time to play Farseek I'm dead soon afterwards. My best starts are playing a creature on 2 or playing removal. Has anyone else come to similar conclusions? What is the general consensus about Farseek? I'm going to do some testing without the card to see if a semblance of consistency remains.
Farseek to me is one of the most important parts of my Junk Midrange deck. The sooner I can start dropping Garruk/Thragtusk/Obz, the better off I am against most of the field.
If you're worried about removal against aggro, I would suggest siding out your farseeks after game 1 and putting in removal. But I run 4 Centaur Healers in my list along with 3 Nighthawks, which pretty much mitigates any early game damage I take (unless it's BTE ->BTE -> BTE ->Lightning Mauler). The combo of Healers, Thrags, and Restos in my build all but guarantees I can come back from early game damage.
Yeah it was today. It will be embarrassing if they post the decklist on their site. I'm new to MTGO and when I made the deck minutes before the daily started, I pulled cards out of my sideboard to my main deck thinking I had taken them out of the deck entirely. I was quite surprised game one when I had an opening hand with a card I thought I removed and 56 cards in my library still.
If you notice, there is 63 cards main deck. The 3 lingering souls were not supposed to be there. I pulled them out of my sideboard the last second and accidentally put them into my deck instead of removing them entirely.
2-0 Naya Blitz
2-0 RDW
2-1 Jund
2-0 Aristocrats
My loss against jund consistend of me getting stuck on 3 lands. I'm not sure if I would had won anyways because his draw was pretty good. If you want me to record a game replay and upload it I probably can at request.
Any questions just ask.
Edit: I did a second daily and was 1-0 beating aristocrats. I played Esper my second match. I won 1-0 pretty easily, got to game two and was milled with him getting down to 2 life. I accidentally conceded the match instead of the game (I'm new to MTGO lol) and ragequit the tournament. I'll play a few today and post my results. I'm expecting 3-1's at the worst.
I'm at my fiancee's right now. I'll be home in an hour maybe and then record a replay of of a few matches and upload them for you so you can see how the deck plays out.
I've really been enjoying the deck and so far I have yet to find a match-up that really just hurts. I need more testing against Esper (it seems aggro and these naya blitz decks are really hating them out).
Well, I would say in the meta then that junk should do fine. We have a lot of lifegain and removal. Against control I would think we would want some walkers that pump out tokens in my opinion. I really miss persecute=/
The two Oblivion Rings in my sideboard are back and forth. I've thought about witchbane orbs to shut out their planeswalkers (I have huge problems dealing with them sometimes since I play a lot amount of creatures and no burn or planeswalker removal) as well as 2 Garruks. The 2 garruks offer a reoccurring source of 3/3 beasts as well as draw. It might what I go with or at least try out for a while
witchbane orbs are great! They really help against esper and jund from what I have seen. I have been playing bant wolf run and it has won me the game a couple of times. I think garruk is great in this deck for the versatility of card draw and tokens. Sadly we do not have a lot of cards that offer card advantage. Garruk is one of our few sources and I think he should at least be a 1 of.
Witchbane Orb is fantastic against Esper. Also great against Jund if they run Rakdos' Return, Slaughter Games, Bonfire, etc. Another great use for Witchbane Orb is against this new wave of Blood Artist/Zombies decks. Sorry Blood Artist/Geralf's Messenger, no target for you!
I also have 1 or 2 Pithing Needle in the SB for Wolf Run (and possibly any planeswalkers). My biggest issue against Jund is Olivia. She can just absolutely take over the game. I would suggest some more removal...maybe Sever the Bloodline or even Murder in the SB. Sever takes care of any Lingering Souls you may encounter in Esper/Tokens lists as an added benefit.
I've been playing Junk since rotation, and I've always felt it had a really strong matchup against the field. To me, Obzedat has just pushed the deck over the top against control, our worst matchup.
I've tried not to post my decklist until I get it really tuned to where I'm comfortable (plus I'm just lazy), but one thing I would suggest playing around with is Wolfir Silverheart. The deck is already pretty heavy on 5 drops, but having Silverheart as a 2-of in conjunction with the 3 Nighthawks in my build is just an instant win in most cases. Swing 6 flying, gain 6 just off of Nighthawk. Worst case scenario in terms of interaction is swinging with a 9/9 Obzedat and leaving a 4/4 Silverheart behind on your opponent's turn.
FYI, I run Disciple of Bolas as a 2 of and he has been great. I have to spend so many turns 1 for 1 ing that once I can get close to stabilizing, thragtusk into EITHER resto angel or DoB is pretty much GG. 10 life a beast and 5 cards is crazy good.
FYI, I run Disciple of Bolas as a 2 of and he has been great. I have to spend so many turns 1 for 1 ing that once I can get close to stabilizing, thragtusk into EITHER resto angel or DoB is pretty much GG. 10 life a beast and 5 cards is crazy good.
I'm not going to go and say something ridiculous like "DoB is the black Sphinxes Revelation" because that's just silly. I will say however that I have gotten into some pretty silly situations against aggro where I have Resto Angel/Unburial Rites to make a single DoB gain/draw about 15 over the course of a game and it starts to feel almost unfair when you get that rolling. I only run him as a 1x but I could see bumping that up to 2-3 because he has great synergy with a lot of cards we like to run.
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Most of your changes look pretty good Elesh. I still like to have access to an Angel of Serenity, it has won me to many games. I think 3 Obz is pushing your luck. He's really great against control match ups but only ok to good against agro. I went with 2 main and 1 side.
Not sure about the Sever or Orzhov Charm. Haven't had much need of either. Haven't tried Liliana yet. If I add the Lingering she definitely becomes playable so may try it.
I am really struggling vs the naya blitz build or mono red
My sideboard plan would be:
-3 Obzedat, Ghost Council
-1 Orzhov Charm
-2 Farseek?
-2 Unburial Rites
-2 Liliana of the Veil
+2 Abrupt Decay
+2 Trostani, Selesnya's Voice
+1 Murder
+3 Deathrite Shaman
+2 Oblivion Ring
Farseek is actually really bad in this match up. I'd much rather be casting a turn two removal spell like Abrupt Decay or Victim of Night, but I'm not sure if siding them out is the right play. I might just side the other two out and bring in an extra Sever and a Sigarda, just cause she's big and blocks well.
Obzedat, in my opinion is the crux of the deck. Even against aggro, he can just outrace them, if you have a decent degree of stabilization. And he just gives you free wins against Esper and Flash, which I think merits the as a 3-of. I agree that there are better options, but in my opinion, he's just too good for less than 3 in the main.
I do want to find room for Angel of Serenity. Lotleth Troll has been, by far, the worst card in the deck, so I am considering switching that around.
Early in my testing I cut Troll for Gyre Sage. He can get big quick and at worst eats some removal that they would have saved for one of your real threats.
He also has some sick synergy with Obze.
I've also been running Gyre Sage. She's wonderful early game and gets worse the longer the game runs. Unlike Lotleth Troll, however, she's easier to get big late game.
I often am seeing the Gyre Sage as a 4/5 and 5/6 can happen as well. I have found that the sequence of T2 Gyre Sage, T3 Loxodon Smiter, T4 Restoration Angel blink Smiter creates 4/5 Gyre Sages fairly consistently.
3x Deathrite Shaman
4x Strangleroot Geist
4x Loxodon Smiter
4x Centaur Healer
4x Restoration Angel
4x Thragtusk
2x Obzedat, Ghost Council
Spells: 11
4x Farseek
4x Adrupt Decay
3x Oblivion Ring
4x Overgrown Tomb
4x Temple Garden
4x Sunpetal Grove
4x Woodland Cemetary
4x Isolated Chapel
2x Godless Shrine
2x Gavony Township
2x Sigard, Host of Herons
2x Server the Bloodline
2x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2x Liliana of the Veil
2x Garruk, Primal Hunter
2x Unburial Rites
2x Devour Flesh
1x Deathrite Shaman
Any feed back is welcome!
Reping Hometown Hobbies in Huntington, WV
http://hometownhobbies.net/
Blue's Trading Shop
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=8105656#post8105656
When I brought in the Gyre Sage I initially looked for X spells to add. I completely missed Entreat the Angels. I'll have to try out the card. I have to remember too that on 4/4 Angel for 5 cc is still on curve most of the time, so the worst mode still isn't so bad. I'm not sure what I would side out for the card though, my 5 cc cards are pretty full.
I also want to talk to everyone about Farseek. All of the deck lists I'm seeing are playing the card, but with the faster aggro starts I'm finding that if I take time to play Farseek I'm dead soon afterwards. My best starts are playing a creature on 2 or playing removal. Has anyone else come to similar conclusions? What is the general consensus about Farseek? I'm going to do some testing without the card to see if a semblance of consistency remains.
Farseek to me is one of the most important parts of my Junk Midrange deck. The sooner I can start dropping Garruk/Thragtusk/Obz, the better off I am against most of the field.
If you're worried about removal against aggro, I would suggest siding out your farseeks after game 1 and putting in removal. But I run 4 Centaur Healers in my list along with 3 Nighthawks, which pretty much mitigates any early game damage I take (unless it's BTE ->BTE -> BTE ->Lightning Mauler). The combo of Healers, Thrags, and Restos in my build all but guarantees I can come back from early game damage.
List and matches?
Reping Hometown Hobbies in Huntington, WV
http://hometownhobbies.net/
Blue's Trading Shop
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=8105656#post8105656
2-0 Naya Aggro/Blitz
2-0 RDW
2-1 Jund
2-0 Aristocrats
Will post my decklist later.
Is your name A_Webb online? I see a Junk Tokens deck 4-0'd a DE yesterday.
EDIT: Nevermind, I see you said it was today. It's interesting to see Junk lists topping regardless. Good stuff.
Reping Hometown Hobbies in Huntington, WV
http://hometownhobbies.net/
Blue's Trading Shop
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=8105656#post8105656
Here was my deck list.
4 Loxodon Smiter
4 Thragtusk
4 Restoration Angel
3 Obzedat
4 Farseek
3 Lingering Souls
3 Selesnya Charm
3 Orzhov Charm
4 Abrupt Decay
4 Temple Garden
4 Overgrown Tomb
4 Godless Shrine
2 Isolated Chapel
4 Woodland Cemetery
3 Sunpetal Grove
2 Gavony Township
1 Vault of the Archangel
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Oblivion Ring
3 Duress
3 Centaur Healer
2 Rhox Faithmender
3 Tragic Slip
If you notice, there is 63 cards main deck. The 3 lingering souls were not supposed to be there. I pulled them out of my sideboard the last second and accidentally put them into my deck instead of removing them entirely.
2-0 Naya Blitz
2-0 RDW
2-1 Jund
2-0 Aristocrats
My loss against jund consistend of me getting stuck on 3 lands. I'm not sure if I would had won anyways because his draw was pretty good. If you want me to record a game replay and upload it I probably can at request.
Any questions just ask.
Edit: I did a second daily and was 1-0 beating aristocrats. I played Esper my second match. I won 1-0 pretty easily, got to game two and was milled with him getting down to 2 life. I accidentally conceded the match instead of the game (I'm new to MTGO lol) and ragequit the tournament. I'll play a few today and post my results. I'm expecting 3-1's at the worst.
I've really been enjoying the deck and so far I have yet to find a match-up that really just hurts. I need more testing against Esper (it seems aggro and these naya blitz decks are really hating them out).
Witchbane Orb is fantastic against Esper. Also great against Jund if they run Rakdos' Return, Slaughter Games, Bonfire, etc. Another great use for Witchbane Orb is against this new wave of Blood Artist/Zombies decks. Sorry Blood Artist/Geralf's Messenger, no target for you!
I also have 1 or 2 Pithing Needle in the SB for Wolf Run (and possibly any planeswalkers). My biggest issue against Jund is Olivia. She can just absolutely take over the game. I would suggest some more removal...maybe Sever the Bloodline or even Murder in the SB. Sever takes care of any Lingering Souls you may encounter in Esper/Tokens lists as an added benefit.
I've been playing Junk since rotation, and I've always felt it had a really strong matchup against the field. To me, Obzedat has just pushed the deck over the top against control, our worst matchup.
I've tried not to post my decklist until I get it really tuned to where I'm comfortable (plus I'm just lazy), but one thing I would suggest playing around with is Wolfir Silverheart. The deck is already pretty heavy on 5 drops, but having Silverheart as a 2-of in conjunction with the 3 Nighthawks in my build is just an instant win in most cases. Swing 6 flying, gain 6 just off of Nighthawk. Worst case scenario in terms of interaction is swinging with a 9/9 Obzedat and leaving a 4/4 Silverheart behind on your opponent's turn.
I'm not going to go and say something ridiculous like "DoB is the black Sphinxes Revelation" because that's just silly. I will say however that I have gotten into some pretty silly situations against aggro where I have Resto Angel/Unburial Rites to make a single DoB gain/draw about 15 over the course of a game and it starts to feel almost unfair when you get that rolling. I only run him as a 1x but I could see bumping that up to 2-3 because he has great synergy with a lot of cards we like to run.