I've actually been pleasantly surprised with this deck. It's been running really well.
24 lands has not been a problem in the 10 or so games I've played and if you watch those Kibler videos posted on the first page. Kibler states this deck wants more lands. Albeit that's what the BoP are there for, I am running a slightly higher curve with +2 acidic Slime.
I just tossed an extra land in there to see how it would feel and so far 24 has been working great.
About Strangleroot Geist not finding the graveyard, trust me, it finds the graveyard. Yes Geist is a very resilient threat that has undying, but your opponent will want to kill it or they will just die to it. Geist is also an excellent blocker.
Strangleroot Geist finds the graveyard in other ways too. 4x Screeching Skaab, 4x Armored Skaab, 4x Splinterfright and 4x Tracker's Instincts. That's 16 ways to dump creatures into the yard. All while running 32 creatures.
I don't think the question is whether or not Strangleroot Geist fits in this deck. I think it's whether or not the mana base can handle it.
Dream Twist might be an option though, I haven't tested it.
In the old thread people advocated him a while back, and I didn't understand it... until I got into a game where I needed him. That one game was enough to make me understand. Stonehorn Dignitary/Venser locks are impossible for us otherwise. Same with a good Havenguul Lich deck. We need that ready-fire 4 damage. One is probably also enough, assuming we can get a Buried Ruin out.
What frustrates me is that complete meltdown our deck can have against W/x Token decks. I'd kill for a reprint of Silklash Spider, for example, or something like it. But that's why some sideboards run Ezuri's Archers. Not the most elegant of answers, but it works. We need something better, though, especially with the angelic theme that's coming...
It's nice to know that other people have had success with the Masticore. Late game it is a must answer threat and very difficult to remove if we have the mana open. I do have a problem landing Buried Ruin reliably with two in my deck, but the way I see it, it's better than no insurance policy at all.
Against Tokens you should be using Ratchet Bombs. If the token player is smart he or she may slow roll their tokens, relying on just two or four tokens with anthem effects to beat you down. This way they avoid your Ratchet Bomb wiping out their entire army. That's when it's a good time to bring in Ray of Revelation. Now you're hitting them from two directions--blowing up their tokens with the bombs and if they slow roll, destroying their anthems with Ray.
Tip: Do not side out your Artful Dodge against W/x tokens. Many of these decks use planeswalkers as a second wincon. You need to be able to pounce on them with unblockable creatures and wipe them out. If you find that their planeswalkers are a bigger problem than their anthems, then side in Beast Within instead of Ray of Revelation.
I'm looking for ways to deal with Poison. Many of our early creatures flat out die to Virulent Wound and we have little in the way of creatures that can block early fliers aside from Ezuri's Archers.
Not to mention that an infect deck that gets to resolve a Skithiryx is going to beat us. We might be able to chump with Dungeon Geists for a turn or two, but eventually Skithiryx will get through. Also, Skithiryx's ability to regenerate means that it can survive any removal we bring in (Beast Within, Corrosive Gale).
Infect isn't big in my meta, but there are some rogue infect decks (usually mono black) that I have to watch out for.
I played against infect last night and you just have to outrace them.
Its not terribly hard. Bring in ruinators and revolve your play style around those instead of splinterfright.
I have a question, how are you able to run spells like Beast Within and Corrosive Gale? With all the milling this deck does the odds of milling your spell is very high. How effective is a Beast Within sitting in your yard?
I would say that humans is probably our worst matchup.
You need gnaw to the bones and your enchantment killers.
Running gale and beast within is the best way to deal with a bunch of stuff.
If it gets milled it gets milled. I normally always see a gale when i need it tho running 3.
Beast within goes in as a third ray or grudge.
Also dungeon geists will move to a 4 of in my deck once rotation hits and i lose metamorph.
Dungeon Geists has been great for me, it's Tumble Magnet on a 3/3 Flyer for 1 extra mana.
The problem is with 4x Strangleroot Geist, I made a heavy commitment to green. So now the cmc of 2UU for Dungeon Geists is harder to achieve.
Despite all that, I have been thinking of adding a 3rd Dungeon Geists because it is not necessary to drop it on turn 4, unlike Strangleroot Geist who really wants to be down on turn 2.
Vs Humans, it's just a race. Enchantment removal is good vs them. I use Acidic Slime.
I think the right way to go with this deck is similar to a Birthing Pod build. You want creatures that double as removal, like: Dungeon Geists and Acidic Slime. You can't run spells without flashback and expect to be consistent. Unless you're running Mystic Retrieval.
I run ray of revelation and ancient grudge in my side board for enchantment/artifact hate.
I still choose dungeon geists over strangleroot. My turn 2 is more concerned with getting creatures in the yard for a turn 3 splinterfright or ruinator.
I dropped a turn 3 ruinator on someon last night and it was GG.
I'm testing this deck online as I browse the Forums and I just played a game Vs Humans. I figured I'd post the details to help you out with your match up.
Game 1: On the play. 2x Strangleroot + 1 Acidic Slime are enough to erase his 20 points of life.
Game 2: On the draw. He drops a turn 3 Mirran Crusader who I find out first hand just how hard it is to deal with. I just took the hits from it, while building up my board presence and my graveyard with Armored Skaab, Tracker's Instincts and a Splinterfright on board. I milled 2 Gnaw to the Bones that I sided in and they saved the day. Eventually I had 3 13/13 Splinterfrights, 1 Ghoultree and a handful of blue creatures that I was able to trample enough damage while using Gnaw to pump up my life.
So I think the plan is to side in Acidic Slime if your not running it main and also +3 Gnaw to the Bone. Gnaw is really good in an aggro match up. I hope this helps
This deck's biggest weakness is to flying creatures. That's one of the biggest problems we have with Tokens. It's not so much their proliferation but their flight that gets us. That you can sometimes get a Destiny on a Mirran Crusader is just unfair. So many of our biggest threats are made worthless by that card/combo.
Dungeon Geists, normally our best answer, can only lock down one creature at a time. That's great against a single Skithiryx or Crusader, but against swarms of tokens + anthem (or multiple Crusaders), it gets in trouble quickly. Some have tried to answer with Corrosive Gale. Others use Ezuri's Archers. I've been using Skaab Ruinator lately, and testing online with an additional pair of Stitched Drakes (to not-awful results, actually).
Flying is just a weakness, a known weakness, of this deck. Maybe we'll get some good green flyers, anti-flyers, or Reachers in the next set. We'll need it.
The rotation will remove a lot of the stronger competition.
Then again, in a few weeks we'll see lots more competition rise to take its place. It's just too early to say, but the pieces are there, and the possibilities are there. As is, the deck is strong. It just needs a few pieces.
The sad part is that it's not strict MonoW build, it runs 8 Oblivion Ring effects, and a single Mirran Crusader can kill me. I hope that Dungeon Geists and Ruinators will provide some help here.
As enchantment and artifact hate, i'm running 3 Sylvok Replica and 2 Acidic Slime, so they are not useless when milled. I want to add 4 Beast Within to the board, even with the risk of it getting milled, it's just too good to be able to kill almost everything with one card.
You're right that the only spells we want to run are those with flashback. In MB I run 4 Instincts, 2 GttB and 2 Artful Dodges. The only spell without flashback will be Beast Within SB. I think that they are too great not to run them. Even without flashback.
I find against humans that they overpower our removal. Leonin Relic Warder, Fiend Hunter, and Oblivion Ring add up to a lot of removal. The first thing you put down capable of stopping a Mirran Crusader will eat removal, and against an opponent that knows what they're doing a turn 3 replica will be removed before it can destroy something. The requirement of needing 4 mana upfront is a reason I'm seriously considering dropping my replicas. It's just too weak against humans.
This deck's biggest weakness is to flying creatures. That's one of the biggest problems we have with Tokens. It's not so much their proliferation but their flight that gets us. That you can sometimes get a Destiny on a Mirran Crusader is just unfair. So many of our biggest threats are made worthless by that card/combo.
I'm a fan of Daybreak Ranger against fliers. He answers a lot of problems, and his flip side is brutal. The red mana is a bit of a problem though and being 3 mana plus using a tap effect he's more of a mid-late game answer than something early on.
I would rather play armored skaab or screeching skaab instead of geist to block crusader.
By trying to form your early game around geist is just pointless for the rest of the deck.
This is not a late game deck.
A turn 3 ruinator will go a long way against humans if they dont have removal the next turn, which chances are those pansies do
White is my most hated color.
The rotation will remove a lot of the stronger competition.
Then again, in a few weeks we'll see lots more competition rise to take its place. It's just too early to say, but the pieces are there, and the possibilities are there. As is, the deck is strong. It just needs a few pieces.
Here's what we're losing when we hit rotation.
Main Board: Phyrexian Metamorph:Phantasmal Image is a poor replacement, but at least it kills Legendary creatures.
Sideboard Tech: Beast Within: Ouch...this one really hurts. Ratchet Bomb: Tokens will be even more obnoxious and prolific. Ezuri's Archers: A great answer to an early Delver and vs. flying threats from infect and tokens. Pulls double duty against ground aggro as well. Mental Misstep: This card answer a whole host of our weaknesses as it can counter: Nihil Spellbomb, Grafdiggers Cage, Delver, Champion of the Parish, Tragic Slip, First turn mana dork, Surgical Extraction, etc. Thrun, the Last Troll: Awesome against control. Corrosive Gale: A solid answer to Tokens or Delver, if seldom used. Sylvok Replica: Yes it takes 4 mana to summon and activate, but it doesn't require any colored mana to summon and it has a good sized body. Phyrexian Revoker:A good answer to Nihil Spellbomb and Planeswalkers. Spellskite: There hasn't been much testing around this creature, but it has great potential since it must be removed before they can get to our threats. Molten-tail Masticore: A great siege breaker that adds much needed inevitability to our deck.
Miscellaneous:
A ton of great artifact creatures. There is a lot of potential power we haven't explored in Scars block. Trespassing Souleater is an aggressive creature that can answer Planeswalkers. Neurok Replica is a strong defensive creature that can save a fatty from a board wipe or bounce an opposing creature on demand. Perilous Myr offers pseudo removal and another body in the yard.
What our enemies lose: Nihil Spellbomb: Thank goodness. Wish they lost more, though. Surgical Extraction: This one is even bigger than Nihil in my opinion. It hits all of our Tracker's everywhere the first time we cast one. Tracker's is our main engine and losing all four (8 with Flashback castings) is a blow that I have never been able to recover from. Without it we are stuck top decking in a deck that has few viable game winners.
If you've ever been hit by both in one game, you know true pain.
I'll be really interested to see where we land when Scars rotates out. Granted--our opponents lose two very nasty pieces of hate against us, but we lose more of our answers to combating other archetypes.
Here's what we're losing when we hit rotation.
[snip]
What our enemies lose: Nihil Spellbomb: Thank goodness. Wish they lost more, though. Surgical Extraction: This one is even bigger than Nihil in my opinion. It hits all of our Tracker's everywhere the first time we cast one. Tracker's is our main engine and losing all four (8 with Flashback castings) is a blow that I have never been able to recover from. Without it we are stuck top decking in a deck that has few viable game winners.
If you've ever been hit by both in one game, you know true pain.
I'll be really interested to see where we land when Scars rotates out. Granted--our opponents lose two very nasty pieces of hate against us, but we lose more of our answers to combating other archetypes.
You forget one of the biggest changes our opponents might lose that we won't post-rotation: the Scars fast lands. It'll be a nice balancing point for enemy color decks, finally.
And yes, our sideboard will need a massive overhaul, but isn't that to be expected? There will be a whole new meta at that point, and we'll just have to adapt. I think we're actually quite well positioned for that transition, since the majority of our deck is from the Innistrad block. I'm just worried that AVR might not offer us much.
For now, we need better answers to flying creatures and Humans. Anyone else have ideas? I want to push Competitive, not just Developing. So let's be honest: to do that, we need to routinely beat Delver.
I'm tempted to try re-adding Garruk, but I just don't know if he's worth it.
You forget one of the biggest changes our opponents might lose that we won't post-rotation: the Scars fast lands. It'll be a nice balancing point for enemy color decks, finally.
And yes, our sideboard will need a massive overhaul, but isn't that to be expected? There will be a whole new meta at that point, and we'll just have to adapt. I think we're actually quite well positioned for that transition, since the majority of our deck is from the Innistrad block. I'm just worried that AVR might not offer us much.
For now, we need better answers to flying creatures and Humans. Anyone else have ideas? I want to push Competitive, not just Developing. So let's be honest: to do that, we need to routinely beat Delver.
I'm tempted to try re-adding Garruk, but I just don't know if he's worth it.
Sadly, AVR won't have much to offer us. They've already stated that there will be no more Flashback spells and no more cards that interact with the graveyard. What we can hope for are creature in our colors that have good abilities (reach, deathtouch, flying, undying) or ETB triggers or LTB triggers.
Right now our answers to humans involve removing artifacts and enchantments. Yes--Fiend Hunter is a pain. Mirran Crusader is nasty. However, all of their major threats are quite easily handled if they're not backed up by Swords and anthems. We have solid answers with Ray of Revelation, Sklvok Replica and Acidic Slime. The first two come down faster and can help us stabilize. Acidic Slime can eat a sword or anthem but can also nuke a Gavony Township. I haven't seen a turn 4 Angelic Destiny on a turn 3 Mirran Crusader yet, so I don't know how bad it can get, but certainly some of the cards I mentioned should help.
As for Delver, we can play Mental Misstep (countering a turn one Delver on the draw is entirely possible).We can bring in Ezuri's Archers which will stall them until they get a powered up Pike. We can also remove the pike with Sklvok Replica, or neuter it with our own Nihil Spellbomb (which helps us against Frites and Zombies too). Vapor Snags are trivial when our biggest beaters can be replayed often the turn we summoned them (Splinterfright and Ghoultree). If they bring Geist of Saint Traft, we can answer with Phyrexian Metamorph. Playing around Delver's Mana Leaks is the hardest part as our deck mills a lot of its own land and we have a low land count.
I know I'm making it sound simple, but I just wanted to quickly list off our most competitive answers to both Humans and Delver. We might even have to consider board wipes in the case of aggressive ground based decks like Humans and RG beatdown. Maybe Kessig Cagebreakers is the answer since we can get an obscene amount of token creatures if it is able to swing.
I see FNM reports in these threads but to ask a question, do you guys think this deck has any future at competitive events?
Are there any reports of anybody at least Day 2'ing or any other good result at big events with it?
Kibler of course, seems to be our pro poster boy if you will (or at least he was 2 months ago), but to put it a different way...do we have any other advocates for this deck at the highest level?
You forget one of the biggest changes our opponents might lose that we won't post-rotation: the Scars fast lands. It'll be a nice balancing point for enemy color decks, finally.
And yes, our sideboard will need a massive overhaul, but isn't that to be expected? There will be a whole new meta at that point, and we'll just have to adapt. I think we're actually quite well positioned for that transition, since the majority of our deck is from the Innistrad block. I'm just worried that AVR might not offer us much.
For now, we need better answers to flying creatures and Humans. Anyone else have ideas? I want to push Competitive, not just Developing. So let's be honest: to do that, we need to routinely beat Delver.
I'm tempted to try re-adding Garruk, but I just don't know if he's worth it.
Except with the next block they'll almost inevitably gain another set of duals to cancel out the loss of fastlands. And seeing as how fastlands aren't really all that good anyways (and that the speculation is on the return of shocklands) I would say they're gaining more from land rotation than they're losing.
Something that helps us a little is running board wipes, but I've found they get milled more often than not and that even with 8 duals, 4 birds, and 4 pilgrims the double white still doesn't happen sometimes. If there were a way to make getting it a little more reliable I would say Nevermore would be worth considering for humans, as well as a few other decks. It can stop Zombies from having Gravecrawler or Geralfs, it can keep Phyrexian Obliterators out of the game, it can stop Geist or Vapor Snag from being used or make every Mana Leak a dead card, and stop equipment. There's quite a few other things that can be stopped as well.
A random idea I had to give white more value, but I don't think it would work since there's too many cards involved. What if we ran Auramancers, and 2 of's a few enchantments as sideboard material. Nevermore is a real strong card as I noted above, Oblivion Ring functions as removal, and Wreath of Geists would become playable.
Acidic Slime here works better than Replicas, but still... it's 5 mana. And it is a lot in that MU.
Again, I think that in this mu Strangleroot Geist could actually help a lot to stop early pressure (besides Crusader which has to be stopped by Ruinator or DGeists)
My answer is the same as everyone elses right now. Enchantment destruction and hope they have a bad enough hand that we can deal with it. It's a very bad matchup. They out aggro and out control us.
I see FNM reports in these threads but to ask a question, do you guys think this deck has any future at competitive events?
Are there any reports of anybody at least Day 2'ing or any other good result at big events with it?
Kibler of course, seems to be our pro poster boy if you will (or at least he was 2 months ago), but to put it a different way...do we have any other advocates for this deck at the highest level?
I think this is a big issue. I personally have no time for the bigger tournaments of late, especially due to RL concerns. That's not to say I won't in the future, but for now I'm severely limited, only going to even 1 FNM a month. It's been a drag to cut back so much, but... restrictions. I'd love to get someone playing this that can routinely go to the bigger games. But those types of people are also less likely to play such a random deck, I've found. They don't want to try something unless it's established, and decks don't get established until they're tried, so the circle continues, etc.
We need to recruit someone that can hit PTQs and GPs with frequency!
In my opinion this should be a 4 of in the deck, since you really want this card to be in your graveyard.
XU and you either mill X or double of X. I know the X never gets to be super high but I think it would be useful.
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I've actually been pleasantly surprised with this deck. It's been running really well.
24 lands has not been a problem in the 10 or so games I've played and if you watch those Kibler videos posted on the first page. Kibler states this deck wants more lands. Albeit that's what the BoP are there for, I am running a slightly higher curve with +2 acidic Slime.
I just tossed an extra land in there to see how it would feel and so far 24 has been working great.
About Strangleroot Geist not finding the graveyard, trust me, it finds the graveyard. Yes Geist is a very resilient threat that has undying, but your opponent will want to kill it or they will just die to it. Geist is also an excellent blocker.
Strangleroot Geist finds the graveyard in other ways too. 4x Screeching Skaab, 4x Armored Skaab, 4x Splinterfright and 4x Tracker's Instincts. That's 16 ways to dump creatures into the yard. All while running 32 creatures.
I don't think the question is whether or not Strangleroot Geist fits in this deck. I think it's whether or not the mana base can handle it.
Dream Twist might be an option though, I haven't tested it.
It's nice to know that other people have had success with the Masticore. Late game it is a must answer threat and very difficult to remove if we have the mana open. I do have a problem landing Buried Ruin reliably with two in my deck, but the way I see it, it's better than no insurance policy at all.
Against Tokens you should be using Ratchet Bombs. If the token player is smart he or she may slow roll their tokens, relying on just two or four tokens with anthem effects to beat you down. This way they avoid your Ratchet Bomb wiping out their entire army. That's when it's a good time to bring in Ray of Revelation. Now you're hitting them from two directions--blowing up their tokens with the bombs and if they slow roll, destroying their anthems with Ray.
Tip: Do not side out your Artful Dodge against W/x tokens. Many of these decks use planeswalkers as a second wincon. You need to be able to pounce on them with unblockable creatures and wipe them out. If you find that their planeswalkers are a bigger problem than their anthems, then side in Beast Within instead of Ray of Revelation.
Also, Kibler was absolutely terrible in playing this deck IMO
Dream twist has helped immensely. My decklist is in my signature.
I have only not top 3d in 1 out of the many times ive played it.
Not to mention that an infect deck that gets to resolve a Skithiryx is going to beat us. We might be able to chump with Dungeon Geists for a turn or two, but eventually Skithiryx will get through. Also, Skithiryx's ability to regenerate means that it can survive any removal we bring in (Beast Within, Corrosive Gale).
Infect isn't big in my meta, but there are some rogue infect decks (usually mono black) that I have to watch out for.
Any tips?
Its not terribly hard. Bring in ruinators and revolve your play style around those instead of splinterfright.
Its hard for them to deal with big creatures.
I have a question, how are you able to run spells like Beast Within and Corrosive Gale? With all the milling this deck does the odds of milling your spell is very high. How effective is a Beast Within sitting in your yard?
You need gnaw to the bones and your enchantment killers.
Running gale and beast within is the best way to deal with a bunch of stuff.
If it gets milled it gets milled. I normally always see a gale when i need it tho running 3.
Beast within goes in as a third ray or grudge.
Also dungeon geists will move to a 4 of in my deck once rotation hits and i lose metamorph.
The problem is with 4x Strangleroot Geist, I made a heavy commitment to green. So now the cmc of 2UU for Dungeon Geists is harder to achieve.
Despite all that, I have been thinking of adding a 3rd Dungeon Geists because it is not necessary to drop it on turn 4, unlike Strangleroot Geist who really wants to be down on turn 2.
Vs Humans, it's just a race. Enchantment removal is good vs them. I use Acidic Slime.
I think the right way to go with this deck is similar to a Birthing Pod build. You want creatures that double as removal, like: Dungeon Geists and Acidic Slime. You can't run spells without flashback and expect to be consistent. Unless you're running Mystic Retrieval.
I still choose dungeon geists over strangleroot. My turn 2 is more concerned with getting creatures in the yard for a turn 3 splinterfright or ruinator.
I dropped a turn 3 ruinator on someon last night and it was GG.
Game 1: On the play. 2x Strangleroot + 1 Acidic Slime are enough to erase his 20 points of life.
Game 2: On the draw. He drops a turn 3 Mirran Crusader who I find out first hand just how hard it is to deal with. I just took the hits from it, while building up my board presence and my graveyard with Armored Skaab, Tracker's Instincts and a Splinterfright on board. I milled 2 Gnaw to the Bones that I sided in and they saved the day. Eventually I had 3 13/13 Splinterfrights, 1 Ghoultree and a handful of blue creatures that I was able to trample enough damage while using Gnaw to pump up my life.
So I think the plan is to side in Acidic Slime if your not running it main and also +3 Gnaw to the Bone. Gnaw is really good in an aggro match up. I hope this helps
Dungeon Geists, normally our best answer, can only lock down one creature at a time. That's great against a single Skithiryx or Crusader, but against swarms of tokens + anthem (or multiple Crusaders), it gets in trouble quickly. Some have tried to answer with Corrosive Gale. Others use Ezuri's Archers. I've been using Skaab Ruinator lately, and testing online with an additional pair of Stitched Drakes (to not-awful results, actually).
Flying is just a weakness, a known weakness, of this deck. Maybe we'll get some good green flyers, anti-flyers, or Reachers in the next set. We'll need it.
Currently Working On: Jund Ramp (RTR Block)
GR My Blog RG (Std)
The rotation will remove a lot of the stronger competition.
Then again, in a few weeks we'll see lots more competition rise to take its place. It's just too early to say, but the pieces are there, and the possibilities are there. As is, the deck is strong. It just needs a few pieces.
Currently Working On: Jund Ramp (RTR Block)
GR My Blog RG (Std)
I find against humans that they overpower our removal. Leonin Relic Warder, Fiend Hunter, and Oblivion Ring add up to a lot of removal. The first thing you put down capable of stopping a Mirran Crusader will eat removal, and against an opponent that knows what they're doing a turn 3 replica will be removed before it can destroy something. The requirement of needing 4 mana upfront is a reason I'm seriously considering dropping my replicas. It's just too weak against humans.
I'm a fan of Daybreak Ranger against fliers. He answers a lot of problems, and his flip side is brutal. The red mana is a bit of a problem though and being 3 mana plus using a tap effect he's more of a mid-late game answer than something early on.
By trying to form your early game around geist is just pointless for the rest of the deck.
This is not a late game deck.
A turn 3 ruinator will go a long way against humans if they dont have removal the next turn, which chances are those pansies do
White is my most hated color.
Here's what we're losing when we hit rotation.
Main Board:
Phyrexian Metamorph:Phantasmal Image is a poor replacement, but at least it kills Legendary creatures.
Sideboard Tech:
Beast Within: Ouch...this one really hurts.
Ratchet Bomb: Tokens will be even more obnoxious and prolific.
Ezuri's Archers: A great answer to an early Delver and vs. flying threats from infect and tokens. Pulls double duty against ground aggro as well.
Mental Misstep: This card answer a whole host of our weaknesses as it can counter: Nihil Spellbomb, Grafdiggers Cage, Delver, Champion of the Parish, Tragic Slip, First turn mana dork, Surgical Extraction, etc.
Thrun, the Last Troll: Awesome against control.
Corrosive Gale: A solid answer to Tokens or Delver, if seldom used.
Sylvok Replica: Yes it takes 4 mana to summon and activate, but it doesn't require any colored mana to summon and it has a good sized body.
Phyrexian Revoker:A good answer to Nihil Spellbomb and Planeswalkers.
Spellskite: There hasn't been much testing around this creature, but it has great potential since it must be removed before they can get to our threats.
Molten-tail Masticore: A great siege breaker that adds much needed inevitability to our deck.
Miscellaneous:
A ton of great artifact creatures. There is a lot of potential power we haven't explored in Scars block. Trespassing Souleater is an aggressive creature that can answer Planeswalkers. Neurok Replica is a strong defensive creature that can save a fatty from a board wipe or bounce an opposing creature on demand. Perilous Myr offers pseudo removal and another body in the yard.
What our enemies lose:
Nihil Spellbomb: Thank goodness. Wish they lost more, though.
Surgical Extraction: This one is even bigger than Nihil in my opinion. It hits all of our Tracker's everywhere the first time we cast one. Tracker's is our main engine and losing all four (8 with Flashback castings) is a blow that I have never been able to recover from. Without it we are stuck top decking in a deck that has few viable game winners.
If you've ever been hit by both in one game, you know true pain.
I'll be really interested to see where we land when Scars rotates out. Granted--our opponents lose two very nasty pieces of hate against us, but we lose more of our answers to combating other archetypes.
Could you post your decklist please. I'm very curious with all the instant and sorceries you seem to be running. I'd like to take it for a spin.
@BluishGreen1.8T
You say "I would rather play armored skaab or screeching skaab instead of geist to block crusader."
Geist is not instead of those 2, it is in addition to them.
4x Geist
4x Armored Skaab
4x Screeching Skaab
My decklist is pretty standard fare. I was simply pointing out what we're losing post rotation. The only spells I use currently are:
MB:
Tracker's Instincts
Artful Dodge
Gnaw to the Bone
SB:
Mental Misstep
Beast Within
Ray of Revelation
If you're still interested I can post my list.
You forget one of the biggest changes our opponents might lose that we won't post-rotation: the Scars fast lands. It'll be a nice balancing point for enemy color decks, finally.
And yes, our sideboard will need a massive overhaul, but isn't that to be expected? There will be a whole new meta at that point, and we'll just have to adapt. I think we're actually quite well positioned for that transition, since the majority of our deck is from the Innistrad block. I'm just worried that AVR might not offer us much.
For now, we need better answers to flying creatures and Humans. Anyone else have ideas? I want to push Competitive, not just Developing. So let's be honest: to do that, we need to routinely beat Delver.
I'm tempted to try re-adding Garruk, but I just don't know if he's worth it.
Currently Working On: Jund Ramp (RTR Block)
GR My Blog RG (Std)
Tokens would be too devastating to let any token hate go unnoticed
Sadly, AVR won't have much to offer us. They've already stated that there will be no more Flashback spells and no more cards that interact with the graveyard. What we can hope for are creature in our colors that have good abilities (reach, deathtouch, flying, undying) or ETB triggers or LTB triggers.
Right now our answers to humans involve removing artifacts and enchantments. Yes--Fiend Hunter is a pain. Mirran Crusader is nasty. However, all of their major threats are quite easily handled if they're not backed up by Swords and anthems. We have solid answers with Ray of Revelation, Sklvok Replica and Acidic Slime. The first two come down faster and can help us stabilize. Acidic Slime can eat a sword or anthem but can also nuke a Gavony Township. I haven't seen a turn 4 Angelic Destiny on a turn 3 Mirran Crusader yet, so I don't know how bad it can get, but certainly some of the cards I mentioned should help.
As for Delver, we can play Mental Misstep (countering a turn one Delver on the draw is entirely possible).We can bring in Ezuri's Archers which will stall them until they get a powered up Pike. We can also remove the pike with Sklvok Replica, or neuter it with our own Nihil Spellbomb (which helps us against Frites and Zombies too). Vapor Snags are trivial when our biggest beaters can be replayed often the turn we summoned them (Splinterfright and Ghoultree). If they bring Geist of Saint Traft, we can answer with Phyrexian Metamorph. Playing around Delver's Mana Leaks is the hardest part as our deck mills a lot of its own land and we have a low land count.
I know I'm making it sound simple, but I just wanted to quickly list off our most competitive answers to both Humans and Delver. We might even have to consider board wipes in the case of aggressive ground based decks like Humans and RG beatdown. Maybe Kessig Cagebreakers is the answer since we can get an obscene amount of token creatures if it is able to swing.
Are there any reports of anybody at least Day 2'ing or any other good result at big events with it?
Kibler of course, seems to be our pro poster boy if you will (or at least he was 2 months ago), but to put it a different way...do we have any other advocates for this deck at the highest level?
Except with the next block they'll almost inevitably gain another set of duals to cancel out the loss of fastlands. And seeing as how fastlands aren't really all that good anyways (and that the speculation is on the return of shocklands) I would say they're gaining more from land rotation than they're losing.
Something that helps us a little is running board wipes, but I've found they get milled more often than not and that even with 8 duals, 4 birds, and 4 pilgrims the double white still doesn't happen sometimes. If there were a way to make getting it a little more reliable I would say Nevermore would be worth considering for humans, as well as a few other decks. It can stop Zombies from having Gravecrawler or Geralfs, it can keep Phyrexian Obliterators out of the game, it can stop Geist or Vapor Snag from being used or make every Mana Leak a dead card, and stop equipment. There's quite a few other things that can be stopped as well.
A random idea I had to give white more value, but I don't think it would work since there's too many cards involved. What if we ran Auramancers, and 2 of's a few enchantments as sideboard material. Nevermore is a real strong card as I noted above, Oblivion Ring functions as removal, and Wreath of Geists would become playable.
My answer is the same as everyone elses right now. Enchantment destruction and hope they have a bad enough hand that we can deal with it. It's a very bad matchup. They out aggro and out control us.
I think this is a big issue. I personally have no time for the bigger tournaments of late, especially due to RL concerns. That's not to say I won't in the future, but for now I'm severely limited, only going to even 1 FNM a month. It's been a drag to cut back so much, but... restrictions. I'd love to get someone playing this that can routinely go to the bigger games. But those types of people are also less likely to play such a random deck, I've found. They don't want to try something unless it's established, and decks don't get established until they're tried, so the circle continues, etc.
We need to recruit someone that can hit PTQs and GPs with frequency!
Currently Working On: Jund Ramp (RTR Block)
GR My Blog RG (Std)
ive just been holding back because ive needed to save up to move.
im pretty confident in this deck as it sits.
Delver really isnt that bad of a matchup at all...if you can land anything to block it down...you are good to go.
What do you think of Increasing Confusion?
In my opinion this should be a 4 of in the deck, since you really want this card to be in your graveyard.
XU and you either mill X or double of X. I know the X never gets to be super high but I think it would be useful.