No sense in adding a turn 3 creature drop when your general turn 4 is a board wipe.
You get no value out of nighthawk.
I thought about ratchet bomb, but not completely sure.
If i tend to come across a blink deck, i think ill be alright. Our late game is the best you could ask for in standard and if you can get there, youll probably win.
Also, running 1 mainboard Elixer is soooo beneficial.
No sense in adding a turn 3 creature drop when your general turn 4 is a board wipe.
You get no value out of nighthawk.
I thought about ratchet bomb, but not completely sure.
If i tend to come across a blink deck, i think ill be alright. Our late game is the best you could ask for in standard and if you can get there, youll probably win.
Also, running 1 mainboard Elixer is soooo beneficial.
Ratchet wins bs oblivion ring and tokens so I would say total shoe in. And the less creatures the better if you run 4x mutilate/ Xx bsz. That's why I'm running gravecrawlers and lashwrithe.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Bound by hell-forged chains and fate-haunted circumstance. Well, then--let it be thus so--and men will have cause to tremble and flee when they hear the names of Elric of Melinbone and Stormbringer, his sword. We are two of a kind--produced by an age which has deserted us. Let us give this age cause to hate us!”
The thing about nighthawk is its usually a trigger to get your opponent to overextend to negate the lifeline. When that happens you get the cue to mutilate and gain additional card advantage. Nighthawk can also just win on his own and negate the loss of life from Sign in Blood. Not to mention Deathtouch body in the air. He literally does everything mono black wants to be doing.
4 Black Sun's Zenith
2 Duress
2 Go for the Throat
4 Ichor Wellspring
2 Mycosynth Wellspring
4 Pristine Talisman
4 Sorin's Vengeance
1 Spine of Ish Sah
2 Throne of Geth
Sideboard:
2 Barter in Blood
3 Curse of Death's Hold
2 Diabolic Revelation
2 Doom Blade
2 Duress
2 Mutilate
2 Tormod's Crypt
Playtested my MBC deck above on MWS and was 12-1, only loss the MonoBlack Zombies 1-2. Did not draw enough sweepers. People usually wasted their Manaleaks on Nighthawks or Solemns, Duress got rid of the rest. This clears the way for Sorin Combo. Any deck without Counterspells is screwed. Pristine Talisman is a beast against Aggro. Most ran out of gas around turn 5-7.
Went against the following decks, mostly without SBing:
UG Splinterfright
MonoBlack Zombies
BR Zombie/Vampire
UB Zombies
Red Deck Wins
UR Delver
UB Delver
UW Delver
BUG Pod (My favorite match: opp at 35 life via Thragtusk+Image+Metamorph. At 7 life, I BSZ into Sorin into Vengeance. #PlayerLost)
UW Venser Control
W Humans
UR Mill
BR Control (I think)
I agree, just because you have a three mana costed lifelinking, deathtouching, beatstick doesn't mean he comes down on turn 3 everytime, no exceptions. Most of the time you know you are going to be board wiping on turn 4, I see much more production, as far as getting to the late game better, in using the third turn to Sign In Blood and Duress, or increase non creature board position. Any time I have ever ran MBC, the only creature that ever got dropped before turn 5 was Ravenous Rats.
Spread: Where's Trading Post in your list? It's sooo good with wellsprings/spine.
I like Throne of Geth over Trading Post since I don't need mana to use it. There aren't too many creatures in the deck to sac. Costs 4, so I wouldn't be able to sac wellspring until turn 4 with a Pristine Talisman. I'd rather play Throne turn 2 and start accelerating out of the gate.
The freed up mana of Throne is good, however you don't exactly have a lot of targets for proliferating. Not getting the best usage out of it where as for extra mana you get more out of post than you would Throne. I think Post is better personally but it's more of an investment required initially and over time. I find it funny how now all these artifacts are competitive at the end of their life cycle when it was always there for them to flourish. Now they get some time to shine. Kinda sad. This shows the game needs more deckbuilders and less netdeckers. I'm not blaming it soley on net decking that would be absurd, but it did play a part in it.
The freed up mana of Throne is good, however you don't exactly have a lot of targets for proliferating. Not getting the best usage out of it where as for extra mana you get more out of post than you would Throne. I think Post is better personally but it's more of an investment required initially and over time. I find it funny how now all these artifacts are competitive at the end of their life cycle when it was always there for them to flourish. Now they get some time to shine. Kinda sad. This shows the game needs more deckbuilders and less netdeckers. I'm not blaming it soley on net decking that would be absurd, but it did play a part in it.
If you end up BSZ for 1 or 2 and don't take out all of their creatures. Throne will help get you there. I used Throne in my Infect decks in the past. It is an easy Pay 2: Target player gets one poison counter. Especially when every poison counter counts.
I agree with you that people need to focus on deckbuilding instead of netdecking. Lazy people are like that. The same goes for "posers" and "biters" and "copycats" in other areas of life. Creativity rules!
In other news: Tested Trading Post and it is very slow and not there when you need it. By the time I can cast it, I need to cast BSZ instead, or even better Solemn. Maybe when Ravnica is released it will be an option. We shall see.
3 Nihil Spellbomb
4 Sign in Blood
2 Doom Blade
2 Go for the Throat
4 Pristine Talisman
4 Mutilate
2 Batterskull
Sideboard:
4 Distress
3 Ratchet Bomb
3 Hex Parasite
3 Liliana of the Veil
1 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Sorin Markov
I think it could use some work. In my testing I'm about a coin flip against delver decks and zombies, a big favorite against green based creature decks, and a big dog against r/g ramp and esper control decks.
Why BSZ over Mutilate? BSZ doesn't hit hexproof and pro, Mutilate does.
I'm not sure why he's running BSZ over mutilate, but BSZ does hit hexproof and pro. It also puts permanent -1/-1 counters which could be useful if you draw more than one and don't have the mana to take something out in one turn. I have survived solar flare sun titan phantasmal images onslaught by BSZ for 5 one turn, then one the next, but that's very rare. BSZ also reshuffles so you increase your chances of drawing it as you go through your deck, even after you play it. I still think MBC would rather run mutilate most of the time.
Whats up guys. I played this deck tonight at FNM ( I know its only FNM) with some really good success. Mutialte is a BOSS! It completely hoses creature based decks. I didnt play against delver so I dont know how the match up was. I made it to the top 4 tonight and them we spilt the packs (and got a promo alchemy!) Things I want to point out are :
1. I already said this but I cant stess it enough. Mutilate is a BOSS!
2. DO NOT underestimate the work that pristine tailsman does. It saved me so many games it was crazy! I am only running 3 but I have to move it to 4 for sure.
3. Sorrin Markov is freaking INSANE! He won me at least 3 games tonight, I ran 2 in the MD ( I wouldnt go anymore, the number was perfect!) On a side note I ran 1 sorrin vengence MD to be cute. It won me a game but I dont know if it belongs there.
4. My only loss tonight was to a miracle control deck. Which leads me to start my questions for my fellow MBC players. Is there anything, and I mean I will try anything to kill a planeswalker in MBC? Please dont say consume spirit, it just doesnt fit in the 75. I had 10 dead cards against this guy because he had no creatures! He cast a tamiyo and it got to the ultimate because I could not find a creature to kill it. I was at 18 and he was at 20. He ultimates tamyio and cast gut shot 9 fricking times. It cost him 18 life to cast them all but he killed me! If I wasnt so pissed, I would have thought that was a pretty cool way to kill someone!
Anyway, if I could have killed her or gideon the turn before I might of had a chance. ANyone have any ideas on how to deal with walkers???
@ PJ - Witchbane Orb. It's critical vs the mirror, or other mostly creature-less decks and makes most planeswalkers useless. It also works wonders against zombies (Geralf's, Blood Artist), red for burn and goblins, and mill, to name a few
@ Garroth, I dont get it. WAIT! If they cant target me, they cant target my cards right! For instance can Tamiyo tap target permanent still? like one of my lands? She isnt targeting me so it would still be good right? Also Speaking of orbs, I used torpor orb today and NOBODY saw it coming. No messenger trigger, no resotation trigger, no image trigger, etc. It worked awesome. I was at 4 life playing zombies and I was using BSZ and mutilate on his messengers all day long with no effect. It was great. Sorin lord of innistrad is bad for us too. Does mana leak work with that? Counter target spell?
Pj Ratchet Bomb is about it, or carry got shots yourself to hold off ultimates or get lucky if they drop loyalty early to within kill shot area. Least those cards have multiple uses. GL
I thought of that Bishop but way too slow. I might just have to get lucky. I also main deck 4 duress and side in 4 despise but even then it wasnt enough. You have to hope they havee the cards in thier hand ya know. Its tough.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Thanks to xeno for the sig and avvy!!!
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
You get no value out of nighthawk.
I thought about ratchet bomb, but not completely sure.
If i tend to come across a blink deck, i think ill be alright. Our late game is the best you could ask for in standard and if you can get there, youll probably win.
Also, running 1 mainboard Elixer is soooo beneficial.
Ratchet wins bs oblivion ring and tokens so I would say total shoe in. And the less creatures the better if you run 4x mutilate/ Xx bsz. That's why I'm running gravecrawlers and lashwrithe.
Standard:
Glissa and Friends:symg::symb:
Modern:
Budget Jund:symg::symb::symr:
Commander:
Jor Kadeen Voltron:symw::symr:
By: GeronimusPrime
Type II
Archive: http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/deck.asp?deck_id=1026352
Main Deck:
4 Solemn Simulacrum
3 Sorin Markov
4 Vampire Nighthawk
4 Black Sun's Zenith
2 Duress
2 Go for the Throat
4 Ichor Wellspring
2 Mycosynth Wellspring
4 Pristine Talisman
4 Sorin's Vengeance
1 Spine of Ish Sah
2 Throne of Geth
1 Buried Ruin
2 Ghost Quarter
4 Phyrexia's Core
17 Swamp
Sideboard:
2 Barter in Blood
3 Curse of Death's Hold
2 Diabolic Revelation
2 Doom Blade
2 Duress
2 Mutilate
2 Tormod's Crypt
Playtested my MBC deck above on MWS and was 12-1, only loss the MonoBlack Zombies 1-2. Did not draw enough sweepers. People usually wasted their Manaleaks on Nighthawks or Solemns, Duress got rid of the rest. This clears the way for Sorin Combo. Any deck without Counterspells is screwed. Pristine Talisman is a beast against Aggro. Most ran out of gas around turn 5-7.
Went against the following decks, mostly without SBing:
UG Splinterfright
MonoBlack Zombies
BR Zombie/Vampire
UB Zombies
Red Deck Wins
UR Delver
UB Delver
UW Delver
BUG Pod (My favorite match: opp at 35 life via Thragtusk+Image+Metamorph. At 7 life, I BSZ into Sorin into Vengeance. #PlayerLost)
UW Venser Control
W Humans
UR Mill
BR Control (I think)
#NowPlaying:
:SymB::SymB::SymB: MonoBlack Control :SymB::SymB::SymB:
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=299420
Not really but you could run something better instead of Lil 3.0.
I like Throne of Geth over Trading Post since I don't need mana to use it. There aren't too many creatures in the deck to sac. Costs 4, so I wouldn't be able to sac wellspring until turn 4 with a Pristine Talisman. I'd rather play Throne turn 2 and start accelerating out of the gate.
But I will test it.
#NowPlaying:
:SymB::SymB::SymB: MonoBlack Control :SymB::SymB::SymB:
4 Inkmoth Nexus
20 Swamp
Creatures:
1 Wurmcoil Engine
1 Nefarox, Overlord of Grixis
4 Solemn Simulacrum
Planeswalkers:
2 Sorin Markov
2 Liliana of the Dark Realms
Spells:
2 Ichor Wellspring
2 Trading Post
1 Batterskull
4 Pristine Talisman
1 Demonic Rising
4 Sign in Blood
3 Mutilate
2 Black Sun's Zenith
1 Sever the Bloodline
2 Murder
1 Doom blade
1 Go for the Throat
2 Sorin's Vengeance
3 Duress
3 Despise
3 Surgical Extraction
1 Black Sun's Zenith
2 Griselbrand
1 Memoricide
2 Witchbane orb
so, this is what I'm building for tomorrow. I have a lot of red decks in my meta, which is why the Orbs.
If you end up BSZ for 1 or 2 and don't take out all of their creatures. Throne will help get you there. I used Throne in my Infect decks in the past. It is an easy Pay 2: Target player gets one poison counter. Especially when every poison counter counts.
I agree with you that people need to focus on deckbuilding instead of netdecking. Lazy people are like that. The same goes for "posers" and "biters" and "copycats" in other areas of life. Creativity rules!
In other news: Tested Trading Post and it is very slow and not there when you need it. By the time I can cast it, I need to cast BSZ instead, or even better Solemn. Maybe when Ravnica is released it will be an option. We shall see.
#NowPlaying:
:SymB::SymB::SymB: MonoBlack Control :SymB::SymB::SymB:
Main Deck:
22 Swamp
2 Buried Ruin
2 Vampire Nighthawk
4 Solemn Simulacrum
2 Wurmcoil Engine
2 Grave Titan
2 Liliana of the Dark Realms
3 Karn Liberated
3 Nihil Spellbomb
4 Sign in Blood
2 Doom Blade
2 Go for the Throat
4 Pristine Talisman
4 Mutilate
2 Batterskull
Sideboard:
4 Distress
3 Ratchet Bomb
3 Hex Parasite
3 Liliana of the Veil
1 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Sorin Markov
I think it could use some work. In my testing I'm about a coin flip against delver decks and zombies, a big favorite against green based creature decks, and a big dog against r/g ramp and esper control decks.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=299420
I'm not sure why he's running BSZ over mutilate, but BSZ does hit hexproof and pro. It also puts permanent -1/-1 counters which could be useful if you draw more than one and don't have the mana to take something out in one turn. I have survived solar flare sun titan phantasmal images onslaught by BSZ for 5 one turn, then one the next, but that's very rare. BSZ also reshuffles so you increase your chances of drawing it as you go through your deck, even after you play it. I still think MBC would rather run mutilate most of the time.
The old posts here are antiquated hehehe
Black Sun's Zenith doesn't target anything, to target something it has to be specifically chosen. Black Sun's Zenith hits everything on the field.
The way to know if something targets or not, is whether it says the word "target".
1. I already said this but I cant stess it enough. Mutilate is a BOSS!
2. DO NOT underestimate the work that pristine tailsman does. It saved me so many games it was crazy! I am only running 3 but I have to move it to 4 for sure.
3. Sorrin Markov is freaking INSANE! He won me at least 3 games tonight, I ran 2 in the MD ( I wouldnt go anymore, the number was perfect!) On a side note I ran 1 sorrin vengence MD to be cute. It won me a game but I dont know if it belongs there.
4. My only loss tonight was to a miracle control deck. Which leads me to start my questions for my fellow MBC players. Is there anything, and I mean I will try anything to kill a planeswalker in MBC? Please dont say consume spirit, it just doesnt fit in the 75. I had 10 dead cards against this guy because he had no creatures! He cast a tamiyo and it got to the ultimate because I could not find a creature to kill it. I was at 18 and he was at 20. He ultimates tamyio and cast gut shot 9 fricking times. It cost him 18 life to cast them all but he killed me! If I wasnt so pissed, I would have thought that was a pretty cool way to kill someone!
Anyway, if I could have killed her or gideon the turn before I might of had a chance. ANyone have any ideas on how to deal with walkers???
Thanks to xeno for the sig and avvy!!!
Thanks to xeno for the sig and avvy!!!
-Bishop
Thanks to xeno for the sig and avvy!!!