Love Huntmaster so far in testing. Excellent to see 12 copies in the top 8 of a Pro Tour. Less excellent that they'll now be overpriced on Modo next week. Ah, well.
It's not going to be like the GP's lately where they re-seed them just before they start playing, is it?
The pairings are posted on dailymtg; they're straight 1 vs. 8, 2 vs. 7, etc.
Also, they don't "re-seed" GPs. Constructed top 8s should pretty much always be using this system. Draft top 8s seat the players randomly at the draft table, and then pair across (draft seat 1 vs. draft seat 5, 2 vs. 6, etc.).
The pairings are posted on dailymtg; they're straight 1 vs. 8, 2 vs. 7, etc.
Also, they don't "re-seed" GPs. Constructed top 8s should pretty much always be using this system. Draft top 8s seat the players randomly at the draft table, and then pair across (draft seat 1 vs. draft seat 5, 2 vs. 6, etc.).
I really like Finkel's Delver list. It's very surprising to see Dungeon Geists main over Swords though. You'd think Sword would gain even more value with Lingering Souls in the deck. What do I know, he's Jon effin Finkel. He's gotta be right, right?
I really like Finkel's Delver list. It's very surprising to see Dungeon Geists main over Swords though. You'd think Sword would gain even more value with Lingering Souls in the deck. What do I know, he's Jon effin Finkel. He's gotta be right, right?
I am kinda sad that the dungeon geists had their coming out party early. After I got a few in some drafts, I saw the power right away and was ready to buy all of them I could get on MTGO.
But back to the card, it's a fiend hunter, with flying and 2 more power for 1 more mana. That seems like a hell of a trade-off. And with the rare exception, tapping is better than exiling with all the "enters the battlefield" stuff floating around right now.
Dungeon Geists isn't too great and still won't get very high (it's extremely hard for a rare card to do so). It's not a good fit in the faster aggro decks.
However, it is a nice fit in a slower esper build which is already very crowded at the 3 slot anyways. It can be a big swing in a Delver matchup, tap down your opponent's creature and have a big flyer to block/attack (with the captain it's a 4/4 hexproof, which is pretty boss).
I'm not sure on its effectiveness against Wolf Run, yeah it can tap down a big guy AFTER it's played, but dies to slagstorm and is not a very big damage threat.
The swords are common enough where a fair amount of people are maindecking artifact hate, and everyone has it boarded. Playing a sword, equiping and swinging only to get naturalized/whatever and blocked is huge.
The swords are common enough where a fair amount of people are maindecking artifact hate, and everyone has it boarded. Playing a sword, equiping and swinging only to get naturalized/whatever and blocked is huge.
Cheers
This is a good point. I was surprised to see so many Revoke Existence, Ancient Grudge, and Naturalize main decked across the event. Looking at the format it shouldn't be surprising. Basically every deck has artifacts that are worth hitting, from Swords to Birthing Pod to Sphere of the Suns.
Dungeon Geists isn't too great and still won't get very high (it's extremely hard for a rare card to do so). It's not a good fit in the faster aggro decks.
However, it is a nice fit in a slower esper build which is already very crowded at the 3 slot anyways. It can be a big swing in a Delver matchup, tap down your opponent's creature and have a big flyer to block/attack (with the captain it's a 4/4 hexproof, which is pretty boss).
I'm not sure on its effectiveness against Wolf Run, yeah it can tap down a big guy AFTER it's played, but dies to slagstorm and is not a very big damage threat.
If they have a slagstorm at the point that they have cast a titan, the game is over anyway. It comes down on 4 as a 2 for 1 that leaves a decent body for 4 mana. It's good value, especially in a deck that should be winning the turn after he comes down.
It's good value, especially in a deck that should be winning the turn after he comes down.
Winning on turn 5-7? That often does not happen. The esper spirit decks using Dungeon Geists are even slower than the other standard aggro decks. If your deck is designed to win at that point, you probably want a smaller curve with more aggro cards.
The vulnerability to slagstorm is not just relevant when they have slagstorm + titan. I was not linking these events.
Winning on turn 5-7? That often does not happen. The esper spirit decks using Dungeon Geists are even slower than the other standard aggro decks. If your deck is designed to win at that point, you probably want a smaller curve with more aggro cards.
The vulnerability to slagstorm is not just relevant when they have slagstorm + titan. I was not linking these events.
But inherently, they are linked. The point of these guys is to add universal removal, while giving a threat, and not slowing down your clock. If they made it to the point, where they can safely titan, and still have a slagstorm left, then you wouldn't have won anyways, regardless of what card it was.
What it does do if lets you reasonable have a board of a few spirits, maybe a snapcaster, and this guy and have them be lowish on life, and still be able to not autolose to a titan.
And after seeing this deck in action, it might be slower on average, but it is also way more explosive. Saw and heard of many games scooped to a captain and a turn 5 lingering + flashback. 6 2/2 flyers coming at you on turn 6 isn't easy to beat unless you have one of your decks few sweepers.
TLDR: A late game slagstorm kills you already, so Geist is perfectly reasonable.
But inherently, they are linked. The point of these guys is to add universal removal, while giving a threat, and not slowing down your clock. If they made it to the point, where they can safely titan, and still have a slagstorm left, then you wouldn't have won anyways, regardless of what card it was.
What it does do if lets you reasonable have a board of a few spirits, maybe a snapcaster, and this guy and have them be lowish on life, and still be able to not autolose to a titan.
And after seeing this deck in action, it might be slower on average, but it is also way more explosive. Saw and heard of many games scooped to a captain and a turn 5 lingering + flashback. 6 2/2 flyers coming at you on turn 6 isn't easy to beat unless you have one of your decks few sweepers.
TLDR: A late game slagstorm kills you already, so Geist is perfectly reasonable.
I never implied that the deck was bad, I have tested it and seen it played, I know it is strong and has explosive plays.
Maybe you haven't played enough against or watched enough games with Wolfrun, but saying a late slagstorm and dropped titan are inherently linked is just wrong. Saying you cannot recover from a later sweeper is wrong.
They do not always have the Titan, or if you present a mana leak, they may focus on defending until turns 9+ instead of landing the Titan ASAP. Stabilization can be a back and forth thing that goes for several or many turns. Slagstorms are a pretty common occurrence after the point where Dungeon Geist would drop.
Dying to Slagstorm is most definitely a drawback against Wolfrun. Did I say it was backbreaking, decisively so? No. But it is certainly is detrimental, compared to other sweeper-resilient finishers used against Wolfrun, like Hero of Bladehold. You are still stuck with no possible threat on the board after one is played (the builds I see don't run midnight haunting, so I guess you have the one option of flashing in a snapcaster).
do we have a list of the highest winning decks in the standard event? Not the top 8 that incudes draft too, but stictly the standard stuff.
Unless you want it for number crunching purposes the T8 is a good representation
Example:
CFB all came with the Kibler/PV list, it just happens that Kibler and PV were the ones who got sufficiently lucky in standard/draft to make T8
You can use induction to extrapolate that other members of T8 also had team mates piloting identical lists that didn't perform as well in draft or get sufficiently lucky enough in standard
I love all the armchair cardslinging going on here. If anyone on here had a better idea, list, then wouldn't you be playing in Hawaii today? Drop the holier then thou crap and just enjoy some good tech.
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
In case I didn't tell you, I don't care about your opinion I just want your facts. And not the facts that make you seem smart. I want the ones that are actual facts.
People following a competitive event are commentating on what the competitors are doing?
Madness.
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Don't you see that the whole aim of Moderators is to narrow the range of thought? In the end we shall make infractions literally impossible, because there will be no words in which to express it. Every concept that can ever be needed, will be expressed by exactly one word, with its meaning rigidly defined and all its subsidiary meanings rubbed out and forgotten.
Unless you want it for number crunching purposes the T8 is a good representation
Example:
CFB all came with the Kibler/PV list, it just happens that Kibler and PV were the ones who got sufficiently lucky in standard/draft to make T8
You can use induction to extrapolate that other members of T8 also had team mates piloting identical lists that didn't perform as well in draft or get sufficiently lucky enough in standard
But there are always decks that do well that arent in there, like rouge decks. I'm not saying their decks arent good, I just wanted a wider view.
It's not going to be like the GP's lately where they re-seed them just before they start playing, is it?
The pairings are posted on dailymtg; they're straight 1 vs. 8, 2 vs. 7, etc.
Also, they don't "re-seed" GPs. Constructed top 8s should pretty much always be using this system. Draft top 8s seat the players randomly at the draft table, and then pair across (draft seat 1 vs. draft seat 5, 2 vs. 6, etc.).
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Lightning Bolts don't kill creatures. State-based actions kill creatures.
CFB is playing Huntmaster, that's for sure.
Why not?
Ty.
I am kinda sad that the dungeon geists had their coming out party early. After I got a few in some drafts, I saw the power right away and was ready to buy all of them I could get on MTGO.
But back to the card, it's a fiend hunter, with flying and 2 more power for 1 more mana. That seems like a hell of a trade-off. And with the rare exception, tapping is better than exiling with all the "enters the battlefield" stuff floating around right now.
=
"Sup dawg! I herd u like mountains so I equipped a mountain on your mountain so your can swing with land while you swing with land!"
However, it is a nice fit in a slower esper build which is already very crowded at the 3 slot anyways. It can be a big swing in a Delver matchup, tap down your opponent's creature and have a big flyer to block/attack (with the captain it's a 4/4 hexproof, which is pretty boss).
I'm not sure on its effectiveness against Wolf Run, yeah it can tap down a big guy AFTER it's played, but dies to slagstorm and is not a very big damage threat.
Cheers
This is a good point. I was surprised to see so many Revoke Existence, Ancient Grudge, and Naturalize main decked across the event. Looking at the format it shouldn't be surprising. Basically every deck has artifacts that are worth hitting, from Swords to Birthing Pod to Sphere of the Suns.
If they have a slagstorm at the point that they have cast a titan, the game is over anyway. It comes down on 4 as a 2 for 1 that leaves a decent body for 4 mana. It's good value, especially in a deck that should be winning the turn after he comes down.
=
"Sup dawg! I herd u like mountains so I equipped a mountain on your mountain so your can swing with land while you swing with land!"
Winning on turn 5-7? That often does not happen. The esper spirit decks using Dungeon Geists are even slower than the other standard aggro decks. If your deck is designed to win at that point, you probably want a smaller curve with more aggro cards.
The vulnerability to slagstorm is not just relevant when they have slagstorm + titan. I was not linking these events.
But inherently, they are linked. The point of these guys is to add universal removal, while giving a threat, and not slowing down your clock. If they made it to the point, where they can safely titan, and still have a slagstorm left, then you wouldn't have won anyways, regardless of what card it was.
What it does do if lets you reasonable have a board of a few spirits, maybe a snapcaster, and this guy and have them be lowish on life, and still be able to not autolose to a titan.
And after seeing this deck in action, it might be slower on average, but it is also way more explosive. Saw and heard of many games scooped to a captain and a turn 5 lingering + flashback. 6 2/2 flyers coming at you on turn 6 isn't easy to beat unless you have one of your decks few sweepers.
TLDR: A late game slagstorm kills you already, so Geist is perfectly reasonable.
=
"Sup dawg! I herd u like mountains so I equipped a mountain on your mountain so your can swing with land while you swing with land!"
I never implied that the deck was bad, I have tested it and seen it played, I know it is strong and has explosive plays.
Maybe you haven't played enough against or watched enough games with Wolfrun, but saying a late slagstorm and dropped titan are inherently linked is just wrong. Saying you cannot recover from a later sweeper is wrong.
They do not always have the Titan, or if you present a mana leak, they may focus on defending until turns 9+ instead of landing the Titan ASAP. Stabilization can be a back and forth thing that goes for several or many turns. Slagstorms are a pretty common occurrence after the point where Dungeon Geist would drop.
Dying to Slagstorm is most definitely a drawback against Wolfrun. Did I say it was backbreaking, decisively so? No. But it is certainly is detrimental, compared to other sweeper-resilient finishers used against Wolfrun, like Hero of Bladehold. You are still stuck with no possible threat on the board after one is played (the builds I see don't run midnight haunting, so I guess you have the one option of flashing in a snapcaster).
What deck would Hellrider be played in?
Trade List
People are saying it's a 4-of in RG decks. Doesn't look like it's placing anywhere, not sure how many people are running it.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showpost.php?p=10332184&postcount=124
Unless you want it for number crunching purposes the T8 is a good representation
Example:
CFB all came with the Kibler/PV list, it just happens that Kibler and PV were the ones who got sufficiently lucky in standard/draft to make T8
You can use induction to extrapolate that other members of T8 also had team mates piloting identical lists that didn't perform as well in draft or get sufficiently lucky enough in standard
Cockatrice username: Blackcat77
Madness.
But there are always decks that do well that arent in there, like rouge decks. I'm not saying their decks arent good, I just wanted a wider view.
Not everyone is qualified for Pro Tours...
Not sure how useful of commentary it is, but hey it's there. Will be interested to see all the lists.