MTG Salvation

I'm testing out going down to 3 Ravings. I went -1 Ravings, -2 Geistflame and -1 Snapcaster to add in +4 Gitaxian Probe

We'll see how it works at FNM tonight.

Also consider 3 incinerate 1 past in flames. Or 2 and 2.

Humm, thinking of something else. Slimmed down on some #s to add in more Flashback. Lost incinerate for it basically. Not sure if this build can survive like the former one can though

Just got back from FNM, went 4-0 and drew the 5th round with the person who was also 4-0.

It worked beautifully, like an intricate swiss watch.

Some thoughts:

4 Brimstone Volley is too much. I may go 3 Incinerate/2 Volley. I am doing so much on every turn that the extra mana for Volley was a hinderance.

Desperate Ravings is amazing in this deck.

Gitaxian Probe was very helpful, knowing when I can drop things or when I need to hold back and counter. That and Snapcaster + 2 life = shenanigans!

I'll work on the list and let you guys know what I come up with in 2.0.

MAN its fun to play. (But its very intricate, it's a thinking man's deck.)

EDIT:

My Matches:

Round 1: vs Black/Red burn
Round 2: vs Green/White Token
Round 3: vs Red/Green Beats (He G-waves for 4 and got 2 pheonixes and 2 hero of oxid ridge. Nuts!)
Round 4: vs Mono-Black Liliana Control

Draw vs Mono Red Koth.

Played 4 color vengeance at FNM tonight, went 3-1 after I punted match one. I took some liberties with the deckname. >_>


Round 1 vs. UR sword deck with some interesting inclusions.

Game 1: I don't remember much except slowly killing all his creatures with geistflames and dismember. He grinds me down with Chandra's Phoenix and then hit's me for a devil's play for 7 to finish me.

+2 Negate, +1 Surgical, +2 Dissipate. -3 Dismember, -2 Geistflame. (All I see game one is phoenix and invisible stalker so I opt to board out most of my single target removal for more counters and a surgical for phoenix).

Game 2: He leads on double invisible stalker, for which I have slagstorm. He plays a few swords that get ancient grudged. I win the game several turns later with triple vengeance out.

Game 3: He leads on double delver of secrets (wtf?) and double mind shrieker(first one gets leaked). Delvers flip on turn 3 and he mills my slagstorm off the top with mind shrieker. I die on turn 5 holding snapcaster to flashback the slagstorm. I punt here because I fail to play my burning vengeance on turn 3(opting to hold up counter magic instead), which would have allowed me to go geistflame, play snapcaster targerting geistflame and flashback for one to kill both of his 3/2 fliers. Oh well.

Round 2 vs. RUG vengeance.

Game 1: I keep a two land, think twice hand on the draw and don't find a third land until he has 8 lands in play. We eventually both get burning vengeance on the table, but he's able to race me better with more mana.

+3 Surgical, +2 Negate, +2 Dissipate, +2 Beast Within. -4 Dismember, -2 Slagstorm, -2 Ancient Grudge, -1 Geistflame.

Game 2: He plays a turn 3 desperate ravings at the end of my turn. I let it resolve and then try to surgical extraction it. He responds by casting memorys journey on it to shuffle it back in. A few turns of draw go commence and he tries to extract my extraction. I respond with negate, which he mana leaks. I let the mana leak resolve(couldn't pay anyways with only 2 mana up), I play Cap't Snaps targeting surgical extraction and extract his mana leaks. I see a hand of flashfreeze, incinerate, snapcaster and lands. Some more draw go commences and I draw my second inferno titan. I cast the first one to bait out the flashfreeze, which he does and I'm able to resolve the second one with negate backup. Inferno goes the distance

Game 3: All I can remember is several turns of draw go with think twice and desperate ravings resolving. He eventually gets two burning vengeance out to my one. I'm able to EoT beast within one and then slagstorm to wipe the board. I get a second burning vengeance out and my desperate ravings chain into each other for the win. Both of my inferno titans get flash freezed this game.

Round 3 vs. some kind of infernal plunge red deck.

Game 1: I remember geistflaming a one drop, he plays a shrine on turn 2 and I cringe and hope for ancient grudge. I have to play a hinterland harbor tapped on turn 2. His turn 3 is kuldotha rebirth saccing shrine, infernal plunge, koth. My mana leak in my hand taunts me. I'm able to eventually kill koth with burning vengeance but 1/1s finish the job with slagstorm nowhere in sight.

+3 Vulshok Refugee, +2 negate. -2 Inferno Titan, -3 Dismember. (He's running a wienie stragety so dismember seems poor and inferno is too slow).

Game 2: Triple Vulshok Refugee gets there.
Game 3: He plays a more traditional goblin gameplan, but double geistflame stops any early pressure and I get double vengeance out and play around burn with negate and snapcaster in hand.

Round 4 vs. Mono black infect.

Game 1: double geistflame stops any early presure. I have ancient grudge for his swords and dismember for his crusader.

+2 Beast Within, -1 ancient grudge, -1 mana leak.

Game 2: Much of a repeat of game 1 except he get some early poison in and is able to proliferate it but not nearly fast enough to race inferno titan.

I don't see brimstone as a problem. Yeah there are times when it slows you down but it closes out a game faster then any other spell. The only cards that come close are day and naw to the bone. Neither are good for us though

Ok I asked this in a thread that was apparently a copy of this one.

I know that snapcaster mages are the bees knees in this deck, but are they absolutely necessary? I am working on getting a set of them together, but could I possibly try and get together the deck minus them, and what success do you guys think I would fare without them.

Well, Snapcaster doesn't make a deck. It does make a deck a lot better. You should never let not having a playset stop you from building a deck, but your deck will almost always be better from running some number between 2 and 3, occasionally 4.

In what little testing I've done of this deck I find that Snapcasters make it possible to recover from a poor start. It just offers an amazing amount of flexibility that you can't really replicate with other cards; that said it's by no means integral to the deck. I've heard people talking about stuff like Dream Twist that might perform similarly but never as well.

To be honest I cut Snapcaster mages out completely and I found it ran smoother. The only cards it was really useful with was with dismember/incinerate and mana leak. However I realized Geistflame was superior in this metagame to incinerate and I would rather play dissipate over mana leaks 5-8. So out went Snapcaster and incinerate and in came Geistflame and Dissipate and I havent looked back since.

So, on the drive back from States I got to thinking about a new build involving Snappy and Burning vengeance. What I did think was to add in heartless summoning... What? why? Well, snappy then becomes a 1 drop that instantly dies and enables morbid spells. Furthermore, adding B to the build enables me to also include Sheoldred, whispering one (which is now cheaper to cast from the Summonings). Sheoldred will get snappy back for burning vengeance action off the flashback. And this will allow me to naturally recast Forbidden Alchemy's flashback cost. With that being said, here is the initial setup of my design. It is still big, but...

"Heartburn"Magic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
Dudes 4x Snapcaster Mage 2x Sheoldred, Whispering One 1x Consecrated Sphinx Enchantments 4x Burning Vengeance 3x Heartless Summoning	Spells 3x Mana Leak 3x Think Twice 2x Visions of Beyond 2x Dissipate 3x Forbidden Alchemy 4x Brimstone Volley 3x Arc Trail 3x Slagstorm 1x Past in Flames 1x Runic Repetition	25 Land

Obviously this build is too big (needs trimming) and has a super cool name. This is just an idea at this point. I thought I would drop it on the community to see what other people think.

Oh and in testing how have people fared against Solar Flare? I am coming away from that build, but I am curious if it poses a problem.

EDIT: another thought that I had was to dredge into past in flames and then chain gun your opponent with nothing but phyrexian mana costed and 1 drop spells (ie gitaxian probe, surgical extraction, ponder, etc). Do you feel that this could also be viable?

Here's the new list I've been working with..



EDIT:

Above - Love the "Heartburn" concept. I cut Forbidden Alchemy simply because I couldn't naturally flash it back.

I piloted this deck to 1-1-1 night last night:

Round 1: Puresteel

Not a great Puresteel deck but my first match with this deck, made some crucial play mistakes that lost it for me. 1-2

0-1

Round 2: UW Blade

Game 1: Slow game where I keep trying to sneak vengeance out there one at a time. He Orings a couple but I eventually stick two and go to town.

Game 2: Had a misplay (played Vengeance into a counter when I should'nt have and he gets two SoFaF onto a snappy

Game 3: Barely start it before turns and we end up drawing

0-1-1

Round 3: Werewolves

Basically Vengeance feeds on this deck and it was a very easy 2-0 win

1-1-1


Overall loved playing the deck and have already thought about some changes I would like to make MD. Snappy was a bit slow most of the time and I think I will test two instead of three and then get a Wurmcoil or Constipated Sphinx in there as a one of for some diversity of threats and add and extra wincon to the deck.

The SB is very experimental. Have the sixes in there to side in for Vengeance if I run into a lot of Enchantment hate or something. Loved Flashfreeze. WHo likes the Vulshok Refugee in here? Seems like it could be really good. ANy other SB suggestions?

Lastly, has anyone considered Noxious Revival in here? Not sure if there's really space for it but I think it could be really good as a one or two of. Might start testing that for kicks to see what happens.

Thoughts and suggestions are welcome! I think this deck as a lot of promise!

Using the list above I went 4-2 to a 3rd place finish. My losses were to Wolf Run Ramp and to a janky Zombie deck that managed to get me in game 3. (Main deck curse of oblivion... ? Seriously?!)

Quote from monkeysammich

Here's what I've got going so far....

Darkbrew's DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
CREATURES: 7 1 Consecrated Sphinx 1 Inferno Titan 4 Snapcaster Mage 1 Wurmcoil Engine DRAW: 11 4 Think Twice 4 Desperate Ravings 3 Forbidden Alchemy BURN: 8 4 Geistflame 4 Brimstone Volley	COUNTER: 4 4 Mana Leak OTHER: 2 2 Ancient Grudge ENCHANTMENT: 4 4 Burning Vengeance LAND: 24 3 Hinterland Harbor 7 Island 6 Mountain 4 Rootbound Crag 4 Sulfur Falls	SIDEBOARD: 3 Slagstorm 2 Memory's Journey 2 Torpor Orb 1 Surgical Extraction 2 Negate 2 Flashfreeze 2 Bramblecrush 1 Tree of Redemption

Hey i really like what you did here. Mind if i use this as a base to start from? Its my first constructed deck.
The problem i see with your build is lack of any slagstorms maindeck. With no creatures to speak of can you really afford to have none maindeck? I would think tokens, RDW and tempered steel would all be too fast without some board sweepers, as you are really counting on winning games 2 and 3 with only 3 sweepers. Plus slagstorm can nug the opponent in the face if need be. I guess having not played it maybe im wrong about it being weak against really fast decks? Maybe some arc trails instead of brimstone volley? Tree definitely seems great in this deck against aggro buying you enough time to finish them or stabilize.
One more thing... bramblecrush seems a bit risky because if you need it and can't get ahold of 2 of your 7 green sources its dead in your hand. I really think the 2 big problems for this deck are nihl spellbomb(obviously) and spellskite. What does bramblecrush really solve that grudge doesn't? O-ring? Any big creature should be leaked/dissipated.

This is the build I've been kicking around lately on MTGO.



The deck digs for Burning Vengeance while dumping cheap/free cards into the graveyard then casts Past in Flames and flashbacks cheap/free spells for the win.
It can afford to play such few land by playing Caravan Vigil, Ponder, and Mulch to find the few lands needed to play your spells. Caravan Vigils in the graveyard allow you to go off for big damage on as little as 5 mana with Burning Vengeance, Past in Flames, a couple Forests left in your library, and a few free spells in the graveyard.
Noxious Revival allows you to dig with Mulch and Desperate Ravings without worry of losing your Burning Vengeance. It also counters Surgical Extraction.

If we use Chandra's second ability to copy a spell that was flashbacked, does the copy trigger burning veangance's ability?

Quote from littlereddevil

If we use Chandra's second ability to copy a spell that was flashbacked, does the copy trigger burning veangance's ability?

9/22/2011: When the delayed trigger resolves, it creates a copy of a spell. You control the copy. That copy is created on the stack, so it's not "cast." Abilities that trigger when a player casts a spell won't trigger. The copy will then resolve like a normal spell, after players get a chance to cast spells and activate abilities.

here is my current list with DKA cards. let me know what you guys think! its a pretty rough draft, and i have no idea what im doing so keep that in mind.