Can we afford any spots in the main or side for this? The potential card advantage from each of his effects is so nice. Who has tested it (and do you like or dislike him)?
Used him as a one of in my main last fnm(aya's list from mtgo week of 1/2/12). Played him 4 times in 5 rounds and loved him.
Vs blue white humans drew cards till 7 counters then milled him ten then made him draw 20 and decked my opponent in game 2 for the match. Vs WRR drew me tons of extra cards providing counters/removal till gideon plopped for match. And won me a game one vs grixis just flat out using the zero ability to deck him in three turns. Vs pod i drew 20 cards with him in game 2 for a clutch volition reigns stealing a sheoldred (and holding a counter of course) for a nailbiting win having 6 life to his 2, good times!
So basically he won me the game everytime he resolved.
He is a card that doesn't feel dead in hand and is a good win condition/draw engine.
My only concern for him is that you either cast him REALLY late, or tap out turn 5 for him. My usual turn 5 is either Blade Splicer/O Ring/Liliana with Mana Leak mana open, or draw go with counters and Forbidden Alchemy/Think Twice in hand. Barring that, late Day of Judgment, or perhaps Unburial Rites something I Alchemied earlier, which is unideal but a form of defense. Tapping out for something that doesn't disrupt them or protect me seems risky. Still, if you untap with him still alive, I can see his power. It's definately worth testing. I'm considering putting 2 in sideboard for the mirror and against control.
The problem with running him I think is that it's such an agro meta...
Tapping out for something that doesn't disrupt them or protect me seems risky.
This pretty much sums it up... It has potential for a SB slot, but with all the Humans, Illusians and Township decks running around, I don't see it viable for the MD.
I agree that he's not mainboard for this meta, but I like the idea of sideboard. Going to play around with it, at least, since nobody has yelled at me for mentioning him yet.
I hadn't considered Jace, Memory Adept but wouldn't Karn Liberated be a better sideboard walker to bring against control decks? Karn's threatening, has a high loyalty, and disrupts their hand or their board state. I know he's expensive but the times I've played him I've had in excess of 10 mana. He's really good in those attrition wars that control mirrors eventually turn into.
I run him as a 1-of in the SB; works great against Mirror...
His main problem: he cannot defend himself. JaceB was the same, but his CMC was 3 and I usually didn't care if he died; I just wanted to draw 3 cards at best out of him.
As a 5 CMC plnwk, he's useless against aggro/tempo decks.
--
That say: I'm considering running a 1-of Karn instead.
I agree with darky, Karn is a threat, can take care of himself, does hand disruption, kill other planeswalker... + If your opponent also run Karn, it's a way to get rid of it if you don't have an O-Ring available :).
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I did mill my opponent in a mirror match-up, funny thing is: I had Jace in my hand but didn't play them (he was loaded w/ counters); however: Nephalia Drownyard did the job perfectly!
Going to 15 land, hand full of counters, maybe the issue there was that you don't have enough answers in your deck?
And personally: it'd be very pleased if my opponent try to mill me; for 3W I'd be able to bring any fatty from my graveyard to play (well you have to be careful against SurgExt... still... :))
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EDH Deck: UB Lazavm Dimir Mastermind BU GW Rhys the RedeemedWG WUG Derevi, Epyrial Tactitian GUW WUG Roon of the Hidden RealmGUW WBR Kaliaa of the VastRBW WUB Sydri, Galvanic Genius BUW
I started playing jace this last FNM. When i got him, i thought he was a great sideboard option, i put him mainboard just so i would see him enough to try him out.
Turned out he was a great mainboard card. There are plenty of times that once i gain a stable board position, i'm unable to tap out for a large threat, or i just don't have one in hand. I'm still not sure that delver is a match up i should board out against, but i have found him to be useful once i successfully clear their board. With all their gitaxian probes/ponders and snappy into ponder/probe, they usually have a larger hand advantage by 1 or even 2 cards by the 7-8th turn (mainly due to the fact i don't play think twice).
Once the board is clear and i really am only worrying about moorland haunt, i am able to play jace and start building my hand back up. usually allowing me to keep their pressure down, forcing them to either attack jace, or allow me to build up a much larger hand.
last fnm, i probably saw him 1 out of every 2 games (played 5 + 1 top 8) a lot of times, they were too fast for him to even matter. Other times i drew him late in the game and i was already either in the lead or too far behind for him to matter. But he was an extremely important part of my victory in at least 4 of my games.
Is he a broken card? no
Is he main-deckable? too early to tell
Is he worth the 75? so far i would say 1 main 1 side is worth testing.
i would still really like to hear how people handle Solar Flare i have been surprise intercourse with that for a while now what is your gameplan and what do you sideboard in and out?
Is he worth the 75? so far i would say 1 main 1 side is worth testing.
As much as I like him.
I don't think he suit the solar flare type of deck very well.
He's much better in a UW or UB control type.
It doesn't fit with the solar flare strategy, imho. (and yes I play tested it quite a bit)
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i'm not so sure, in this current meta, he seems pretty boss. vs one of the major decks right now, UW tempo. i have managed to do very well with this card being one of my best cards to generate tempo in my favor.
With a spot removal in hand. Once i successfully day the board, i have some trouble finding something to do against tempo. It's hard to "tap out" for a titan, not being able to hold up any sort of mana leak, or pay for mana leak if need be. I've found that jace is a wonderful card to put out there.
I usually plus him immediately, drawing a card and milling myself a card. By the time i'm able to untap with him on the board, they are stuck in an awkward situation. They can't afford to start attacking jace, and need to put pressure on me. i usually begin to swing ahead in card advantage and take complete control of the game. Many times i manage to land a gideon as well, in which case it's game over as long as my draws aren't complete crapola.
I believe it does fit the solar flare strategy. it builds up your hand as well as your yard. And VS the control mirror, where games almost certainly will go long. you become a heavy favorite with a few drownyards and a jace in play.
I'm still testing jace, and the games where he is a dead card, i can't imagine a card that would have turned the game around that wasn't already in my deck... but that 5 spot isn't meant to be another dissipate or go for the throat anyways. so that doesn't matter.
the games where he is good, he is very good, and i don't think i would have won without him... from top decking an answer to milling them out, jace has proven to me he is worth a spot or 2 in my 75, at least in the current meta.
i would still really like to hear how people handle Solar Flare i have been surprise intercourse with that for a while now what is your gameplan and what do you sideboard in and out?
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Can we afford any spots in the main or side for this? The potential card advantage from each of his effects is so nice. Who has tested it (and do you like or dislike him)?
Cardtag added.
-Sene
Vs blue white humans drew cards till 7 counters then milled him ten then made him draw 20 and decked my opponent in game 2 for the match. Vs WRR drew me tons of extra cards providing counters/removal till gideon plopped for match. And won me a game one vs grixis just flat out using the zero ability to deck him in three turns. Vs pod i drew 20 cards with him in game 2 for a clutch volition reigns stealing a sheoldred (and holding a counter of course) for a nailbiting win having 6 life to his 2, good times!
So basically he won me the game everytime he resolved.
He is a card that doesn't feel dead in hand and is a good win condition/draw engine.
- whhhhhaaat?
Standard Decks:
UBRGrixis ControlRBU
His main problem: he cannot defend himself. JaceB was the same, but his CMC was 3 and I usually didn't care if he died; I just wanted to draw 3 cards at best out of him.
As a 5 CMC plnwk, he's useless against aggro/tempo decks.
--
That say: I'm considering running a 1-of Karn instead.
I agree with darky, Karn is a threat, can take care of himself, does hand disruption, kill other planeswalker... + If your opponent also run Karn, it's a way to get rid of it if you don't have an O-Ring available :).
UB Lazavm Dimir Mastermind BU
GW Rhys the RedeemedWG
WUG Derevi, Epyrial Tactitian GUW
WUG Roon of the Hidden RealmGUW
WBR Kaliaa of the VastRBW
WUB Sydri, Galvanic Genius BUW
Casual decks:
UB Ninja v2.1 BU
GU Simic's Fathom v0.9 UG
RGW Sarkhan's Seasoning v0.80 WGR
WR Chandra's Rebirth v0.3 RW
Mill gets so relevent when we each have 15 lands, hand full of counters and can't play anything.
Thank you DNC for the Sig
Going to 15 land, hand full of counters, maybe the issue there was that you don't have enough answers in your deck?
And personally: it'd be very pleased if my opponent try to mill me; for 3W I'd be able to bring any fatty from my graveyard to play (well you have to be careful against SurgExt... still... :))
UB Lazavm Dimir Mastermind BU
GW Rhys the RedeemedWG
WUG Derevi, Epyrial Tactitian GUW
WUG Roon of the Hidden RealmGUW
WBR Kaliaa of the VastRBW
WUB Sydri, Galvanic Genius BUW
Casual decks:
UB Ninja v2.1 BU
GU Simic's Fathom v0.9 UG
RGW Sarkhan's Seasoning v0.80 WGR
WR Chandra's Rebirth v0.3 RW
Turned out he was a great mainboard card. There are plenty of times that once i gain a stable board position, i'm unable to tap out for a large threat, or i just don't have one in hand. I'm still not sure that delver is a match up i should board out against, but i have found him to be useful once i successfully clear their board. With all their gitaxian probes/ponders and snappy into ponder/probe, they usually have a larger hand advantage by 1 or even 2 cards by the 7-8th turn (mainly due to the fact i don't play think twice).
Once the board is clear and i really am only worrying about moorland haunt, i am able to play jace and start building my hand back up. usually allowing me to keep their pressure down, forcing them to either attack jace, or allow me to build up a much larger hand.
last fnm, i probably saw him 1 out of every 2 games (played 5 + 1 top 8) a lot of times, they were too fast for him to even matter. Other times i drew him late in the game and i was already either in the lead or too far behind for him to matter. But he was an extremely important part of my victory in at least 4 of my games.
Is he a broken card? no
Is he main-deckable? too early to tell
Is he worth the 75? so far i would say 1 main 1 side is worth testing.
As much as I like him.
I don't think he suit the solar flare type of deck very well.
He's much better in a UW or UB control type.
It doesn't fit with the solar flare strategy, imho. (and yes I play tested it quite a bit)
UB Lazavm Dimir Mastermind BU
GW Rhys the RedeemedWG
WUG Derevi, Epyrial Tactitian GUW
WUG Roon of the Hidden RealmGUW
WBR Kaliaa of the VastRBW
WUB Sydri, Galvanic Genius BUW
Casual decks:
UB Ninja v2.1 BU
GU Simic's Fathom v0.9 UG
RGW Sarkhan's Seasoning v0.80 WGR
WR Chandra's Rebirth v0.3 RW
With a spot removal in hand. Once i successfully day the board, i have some trouble finding something to do against tempo. It's hard to "tap out" for a titan, not being able to hold up any sort of mana leak, or pay for mana leak if need be. I've found that jace is a wonderful card to put out there.
I usually plus him immediately, drawing a card and milling myself a card. By the time i'm able to untap with him on the board, they are stuck in an awkward situation. They can't afford to start attacking jace, and need to put pressure on me. i usually begin to swing ahead in card advantage and take complete control of the game. Many times i manage to land a gideon as well, in which case it's game over as long as my draws aren't complete crapola.
I believe it does fit the solar flare strategy. it builds up your hand as well as your yard. And VS the control mirror, where games almost certainly will go long. you become a heavy favorite with a few drownyards and a jace in play.
I'm still testing jace, and the games where he is a dead card, i can't imagine a card that would have turned the game around that wasn't already in my deck... but that 5 spot isn't meant to be another dissipate or go for the throat anyways. so that doesn't matter.
the games where he is good, he is very good, and i don't think i would have won without him... from top decking an answer to milling them out, jace has proven to me he is worth a spot or 2 in my 75, at least in the current meta.