GU Tempo

  • #1
    I noticed this format seems to be shaping up to be about board attrition with lots of interesting permanents but not much actual CA. All the value is on the board (or in the graveyard). There are surprisingly few haste creatures. It makes me wonder if a tempo deck is practical.

    This is a rough sketch but I think the format is shaping up to be slow enough for it:

    GU TempoMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    Land(24):
    4 Hinterland Harbor
    11 Forest
    9 Island

    Creatures(20):
    4 Birds of Paradise
    2 Llanowar Elves
    2 Snapcaster Mage
    2 Phantasmal Image
    3 Aether Adept
    2 Solemn Simulcrum
    3 Acidic Slime
    2 Frost Titan

    Instants(8)
    4 Mana Leak
    2 Negate
    2 Dismember

    Other(8):
    2 Sword of Feast and Famine
    3 Birthing Pod
    3 Garruk, Primal Hunter



    The only thing that sort of sucks is the mana. It isn't terrible it's just I wish the lands did more.. this might push into ally colors or 3 colors. But seriously if there was a functional land the list would be a bit better. But you can't really complain about having the best CA in the format in Garruk.
    Last edited by ryansolid: 9/23/2011 1:07:10 AM
    Current Decks:
    GRW Naya Monsters Standard
    GWB Melira Pod Modern
    UW Tempo Legacy
    G Berserk Stompy Legacy
    UBG Cobra Gush Vintage
  • #2
    I like the idea of having a pod deck within your deck core. Have you tested it yet? I would think the only problem with a deck like this is that it will end up being midrange without cards like Lotus cobra to help you explode in 1 turn.
  • #3
    Yeah Birthing Pod sort of meets in the middle, between Cobra and Jace. The deck doesn't have as many free wins (ie.. turn 3 Titan), but the other elements play out similarly. In general this seems so far to be a much slower format so even this much ramp is actually pretty fast relatively. There aren't many decks that I've been testing that you have outrace on ramp (elves?). Obviously not nearly as effective as Cobra but given the choice and pacing of the format it doesn't seem bad.

    As for testing I'm just running it through some paces. I put up a small gauntlet of Goblins, Tempered Steel, UW Blade, and Esper Solar Flare and the maindeck has done admirably there. Obviously Red is a bit of a problem most of the time. There is enough value if you can survive long emough. Without Goblin Guides and Ember Haulers Adept is ok here. And Solemn does what you need. Tempered Steel is ok other than the most nut hands since with a bit of bounce it isn't long before you are getting into Acidic Slime range. UW Blade comes down to how quickly they can get a blade down. The permission/removal suite is pretty good here and I find tempoing their Mirran Crusaders/Geist of St... and Hero's pretty easy. Head to head Garruk usually beats Gideon (especially if he can come down earlier). Flyers are Garruk's weakness but I've noticed most lists seem to be primarily on the ground. They want to run DoJ but it's pure CA loss for them. As for Solar Flare I've found the deck pretty slow. Counter a couple early spells and set up the slime/titan lock.. It's a bit like playing against Valakut with minimal CA. The deck has inevitability but it doesn't flow through cards nearly as fast. Countering an early spell here can do even more than countering an early ramp spell against Valakut. Yes some of those spells have flashback but if you attack their mana they can't do anything. Here I use Adept to bounce their reanimated targets back to their hands.. sure they can discard them again if they have the outlet but attacking every turn just kills them.

    I probably should put in a bit more kill, but in general although the mana feels shaky after testing a bunch of decks I have to say we were just spoiled with Preordain. Everyone's mana is shakier and exploiting timing seems really good.

    Originally I tried Lost in Mist. The card is pretty good(better than I expected), but it's expensive on the curve. I started risking hands that were too expensive. Still it was very effective being a hard counter than can bounce a land.. I even Snapcasted it in one game. What the deck really wants is a Remand or even Into the Roil. Pretty much any useful instant effect even if overcosted that draws a card.
    Current Decks:
    GRW Naya Monsters Standard
    GWB Melira Pod Modern
    UW Tempo Legacy
    G Berserk Stompy Legacy
    UBG Cobra Gush Vintage
  • #4
    I'm pretty sure that with 6 manadorks, you'll want more like 14 untapped green sources on T1, as opposed to 11. That shifts your base very green, but keeps your odds of turn 2 leak still p high with 10 blue sources (about 80% of having blue on turn 2, not counting the 1st turn BoP draws.) But, it does make your chances of double-blue on turn 3 a bit too low to be casting Aether Adepts reliably for tempo gains in early turns, though again the BoP will improve your odds a little.

    In some numbers I've been running for a U/R deck I'm working on, I had to abandon Dissipate for that same reason of a poor percentage on double-blue, but Leak and Negate are going to be quite strong depending on your strategy.
  • #5
    Been working on this a bit more. The pod is by far the best tempo move and the Swords generally underperformed. It wasn't so much a matter of keeping mana up as I thought. You just drop a couple early drops and keep beating every turn. I need to figure out a sideboard against aggro but the main deck is starting to gel. Think Twice is very key. It's a great card. I admit this had become more of a Pod deck now but while nothing in the deck looks incredibly strong it surprisingly just gets under. Garruk I usually just ends up being a 5 mana draw 6, but it isn't really anything to complain about since his utility is very good. I have very rarely used his ultimate. There are too many O-Rings around to chance it usually. Negate has been really good. There are less 1 mana answers (no Condemn, Nature's Claim, Spell Pierce) and 1 mana sinks (Preordain, and Ponder is barely playable) so timing wise leaving 2 mana up is quite good and better than 3 mana since the format no longer is dominated by 2 drop creatures. Yes there is Snapcaster Mage but that feels more like walking into a 4 drop counterspell.

    Anyway this is my current main deck:
    GU TempoMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    Land(24):
    4 Hinterland Harbor
    11 Forest
    9 Island

    Creatures(20):
    4 Birds of Paradise
    2 Viridian Emissary
    2 Snapcaster Mage
    2 Phantasmal Image
    2 Aether Adept
    1 Phyrexian Rager
    2 Solemn Simulcrum
    2 Acidic Slime
    3 Frost Titan

    Instants(10)
    4 Think Twice
    4 Mana Leak
    1 Negate
    1 Disperse

    Other(8):
    4 Birthing Pod
    2 Garruk, Primal Hunter



    Still wish I had some inevitability in the land. Ghost Quarter isn't good enough. I'm sure running Bramble Crush might make sense as extra LD. The Negates main definitely are in support of more control based metagaming. Still need an anti-aggro plan, but with Pod that shouldn't be too hard. I moved to Emissary not for the fixing but that if I ever got turn 2 Pod off my 1 drops I had no proactive plan. Same thing with the singleton Deceiver Exarch. I tried Trinket Mage but he really only was grabbing Silver-Inlaid Daggers or Nihil Spellbombs or Voltaic Keys. It was too janky and space intensive main.

    EDIT: Don't really like Deceiver Exarch just isn't worth it. Trying Phyrexian Rager, he's off color but he is what I want there. If I draw him he isn't completely unplayable. Having a hard time finding a 3 drop I really want for a proactive plan (bouncing Aether Adept back to your own hand isn't great).
    Last edited by ryansolid: 9/26/2011 5:33:24 PM
    Current Decks:
    GRW Naya Monsters Standard
    GWB Melira Pod Modern
    UW Tempo Legacy
    G Berserk Stompy Legacy
    UBG Cobra Gush Vintage
  • #6
    Ryan, your original list is very similar to what I have been working on/testing. I feel that Aether Adept is the way to go right now, and the value of returning monsters to thier owners hand (maybe even a reanimated target) is very strong. From my limited experience so far, i feel that pod is not the way to go. I have been using 2 Swords of body and mind and they have been excellent for me. I realize that you do not want to mill 10 cards to some of the new decks from Innistrad, but the Wolf token is amazing in this deck. Another card I love in this deck is Beast Within. I feel that this is the most versitile card printed in a long time for Standard. Does your opponent have one land of a certain color? Own him. Did your opponent play a bomb that you were unable to counter? Own it. Is your opponent attacking you with a 3/3 monster they don't want to lose? Kill your own land and block with the beast token. I have won so many games because of Beast Within (and lost a couple). Just my $.02 I plan on fine tuning this deck for states coming up in a few weeks and it was nice to see another Blue/Green Tempo list in the forums. Good luck.
  • #7
    UG/x Tempo definitely has the tools to be a contender in the upcoming Standard season. Have you tried playing around with White and/or Black splashes? Have you tried running Mayor? I'm Tinkering around with this deck right now too(along with Solar Flare) and have found him to be a bit of an animal.

    Here's what I'm testing currently (Ryan, what store do you play at?)

    Azntron's DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    4 Hinterland Harbor
    3 Seachrome Coast
    3 Razorverge Thicket
    2 Glacial Fortress
    4 Forest
    5 Island
    3 Plains

    3 Mayor of Avabruck
    3 Thrun, the Last Troll
    2 Acidic Slime
    2 Sun Titan
    4 Birds of Paradise
    3 AEther Adept
    2 Phantasmal Image
    1 Frost Titan

    2 Sword of Feast and Famine
    2 Sword of War and Peace
    3 Oblivion Ring
    4 Mana Leak
    3 Ponder
    2 Negate



    (A big thanks to DarkNightCavalier for the sig!)

    LET'S GO CANCUCKS!!
  • #8
    Interesting to see the Mayor in a list, LSV suggested Mayor of Avabruck as an aggro-control card that came down early and then took over the game if you could protect it and run interference for a few turns. It sounds plausible, though I'd hate to tap out turn 2 on the draw for instance, no way you can let them resolve Tempered Steel or Pod on turn 3. Possibly with the manadorks you could have enough mana on turn 3 to deal with that and still have Leak up for their follow-up, otherwise you would have a tough time actually gaining tempo while dealing with their noncreature key spells.
  • #9
    Quote from Azntron
    UG/x Tempo definitely has the tools to be a contender in the upcoming Standard season. Have you tried playing around with White and/or Black splashes? Have you tried running Mayor? I'm Tinkering around with this deck right now too(along with Solar Flare) and have found him to be a bit of an animal.

    Here's what I'm testing currently (Ryan, what store do you play at?)

    ryansolid's DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    4 Hinterland Harbor
    3 Seachrome Coast
    3 Razorverge Thicket
    2 Glacial Fortress
    4 Forest
    5 Island
    3 Plains

    3 Mayor of Avabruck
    3 Thrun, the Last Troll
    2 Acidic Slime
    2 Sun Titan
    4 Birds of Paradise
    3 AEther Adept
    2 Phantasmal Image
    1 Frost Titan

    2 Sword of Feast and Famine
    2 Sword of War and Peace
    3 Oblivion Ring
    4 Mana Leak
    3 Ponder
    2 Negate



    Yeah I think the Mayor wouldn't be bad since you could protect it pretty decently and it powers out the board. I don't know how hard it would be to flip though. No spells on your turn isn't too hard. I very very strongly suggest Think Twice though over Ponder continuing that logic since you can still get ahead without playing it on your turn. Running out Instant Speed is huge especially since you are ahead on mana typically. Running it out EoT feels pretty good, since it feels like drawing 2 cards a turn for a couple turns. Like:
    T1 Birds
    T2 Mayor
    T3 Nothing, Opponents EoT cast Think Twice
    Now you are sitting Turn 4 with tons of option since Mayor's flipped. Do something proactive or simply Flashback Think Twice on your turn (if you hit all your land drops you now have 6 cards in hand) and leave up Mana Leak on theirs.

    Personally I'm not sure if Mayor is what I want.. It is definitely good in a Fish Strategy. 2 Mana is the right cost of a threat. I'm playing more of a stay ahead game, which isn't always doable. Instead of trying to ride out an early threat I attempt to just keep on setting the opponent farther back.

    I've started to Swap up 1 Negate for a Disperse. Works well with Snapcaster Mage and it gives me that hit all I want at instant speed. I can't quite afford the Beast Within draw back all the time. This is beautiful at setting back any plan. It's no Into the Roil but Snapcaster gives it the same utility. Honestly Snapcaster Mage is worth the inclusion. I don't think it's a 4 of in most lists but I think it's definitely a 2 of.

    The format does seem slow enough for Thrun to matter. That card will probably be pretty problematic for a lot of decks. Although I think Mirran Crusader might become one of the most played threats in the format once the Geist hype calms down. If you are at the point of running 3 Thruns you seem to be at Green Sun Zenith threshold. Birds, Mayor, Thrun, Slime seems to have the Utility covered. Maybe not heavy GSZ but even as a 1 of instead of the 3rd Thrun?

    I'm originally from North Van so I've always played out of Big Pete's, but I recently moved to Burnaby so Stronghold is close and I've played a couple events there.
    Current Decks:
    GRW Naya Monsters Standard
    GWB Melira Pod Modern
    UW Tempo Legacy
    G Berserk Stompy Legacy
    UBG Cobra Gush Vintage
  • #10
    Quote from Azntron
    UG/x Tempo definitely has the tools to be a contender in the upcoming Standard season. Have you tried playing around with White and/or Black splashes?


    I've been thinking about the splash.. Black is really hard. Red and White is actually the only really reasonable splash in these colors. You want that early green mana, so you can't give up any T1 G, so Razorverge Thicket or Copplerline Gorge is pretty reasonable. Trading a couple Islands for Sulfur Falls or Glacial Fortress(or Seachrome Coast) finishes up the rest. What would the light splash do though? With a 8 source splash like this I wouldn't want any double mana symbols. I'm just not sure what I would want. A new 3 drop pod target? Ancient Grudge? Oblivion Ring? Venser, the Sojourner? More sideboard options? Honestly Black is probably the splash I'd want more than anything for real removal, but it's unreasonable with early green.

    With this in mind I started working on Sideboard plans to see if I really wanted the other elements. White lifegain seems good since green's is more conditional now. Red removal could be good against Mirran Crusaders. Blue gives us access to the most generic answers(if time sensitive) already so perhaps those aren't needed. The biggest threats right now that get around permission are probably going to be stuff like Dungrove or Geist which you can't target once in play anyway. Image answers Thrun. So I figure since the list has been doing really well against Solar Flare and Control decks I should try to use the board to deal with Aggro and Midrange decks.

    Aggro seems straight forward. You go over them. You outsize their threats and slow their tempo. Since they are a bit slower right now, I think maxing up with Viridian Emissaries and Aether Adepts seem reasonable out of the board. Although it leaves you doing a lot of nothing early it also leaves them doing little as well. Emissaries are best against decks that rely on removal to get through(RDW), and Adepts work best on decks that require setup (Elves, Tempered Steel, WW). Tempered Steel and all in artifact strategies definitely seem a weakness so Creeping Corrosion sounds like a good board option.

    Midrange falls into 2 groups. Big Aggro decks, and Attrition decks. Big aggro are basically green aggro decks that use Ramp to play out bigger threats. Decks like Werewolves are this type. So are a lot of Pod decks and other types of Tempo decks. Aether Adept is good here to get under them, and our own Pod's to Tempo them but more than likely we might be stuck and have to just trump them. I'm thinking since these decks are usually proactive and run less removal something like Primordial Hydra is the move here. Unless they are playing Adept themselves this will probably allow us to play fish and it provides a much faster clock than other options. T1 Birds, T2 Hydra, T3 Adept bouncing their threat.. etc.. Or T1 Birds, T2 Leave up the Leak, Think Twice T3 Solemn, etc.. T4 Frost Titan, Hydra etc.. Basically it gives you options to go under or over. It also helps with the Dungrove issue since you will eventually win this unless they are very removal heavy. Even then it keeps their early Beast Withins off your lands. Attrition decks are trickier but stuff like Viridian Emissary and Slime are our best threats so maybe should shore that up..

    The only other consideration is perhaps graveyard hate so I figure it's a small cost to facilitate. So I'm thinking something like this for my 75:


    GU TempoMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    Land(24):
    4 Hinterland Harbor
    11 Forest
    9 Island

    Creatures(20):
    4 Birds of Paradise
    2 Viridian Emissary
    2 Snapcaster Mage
    2 Phantasmal Image
    2 Aether Adept
    1 Phyrexian Rager
    2 Solemn Simulcrum
    2 Acidic Slime
    3 Frost Titan

    Instants(10)
    4 Think Twice
    4 Mana Leak
    1 Negate
    1 Disperse

    Other(8):
    4 Birthing Pod
    2 Garruk, Primal Hunter

    Current Decks:
    GRW Naya Monsters Standard
    GWB Melira Pod Modern
    UW Tempo Legacy
    G Berserk Stompy Legacy
    UBG Cobra Gush Vintage
  • #11
    Here is my little brew of a G/U tempo deck. The deck is built around playing a land destruction spell turn 3 and Titan turn 4 to lock your opponent out of the game. Failure to land D turn 3 is not the end of the deck, Garruk can easily win the game simply by himself giving you either an army to beat down with or insurmountable card advantage, or a fast army of dungrove elders and phantasmal image copies can put a quick clock on your opponent

    Sneek88's DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    Instants:
    4 Mana Leak
    2 Dismember

    Sorceries:
    4 Rampant Growth
    2 Green Sun's Zenith
    3 Bramblecrush

    Artifacts:
    2 Sword of Feast and Famine

    Planeswalkers:
    3 Garruk, Primal Hunter

    Creatures:
    4 Birds of Paradise
    3 Acidic Slime
    2 Phantasmal Image
    4 Frost Titan
    3 Dungrove Elder

    Land:
    15 Forest
    5 Island
    4 Hinterland Harbor



    I've tried a few different combinations of land destruction spells and the 3/3 split between acidic slime and bramblecrush has been my favorite. Slime can be tutored for with GSZ, is actual card advantage, gives an excellent blocker, can be copied with phantasmal image, but is harder to play on turn 3 due to needing two ramp spells rather than one, and it does not kill planeswalkers.

    Sword of feast and famine is there to make birds of paradise a threat in the late game as well as making Dungrove Elder an almost unstoppable threat. I tested this deck with 3 originally but having 2 swords in your hand is almost never good.

    Dungrove elder is an all star in this deck and provides plenty of reason to stay two colors and commit to heavy green. He is one of the best sword wearers in standard right now, does a great job at protecting Garruk while also being a great target for his soul's majesty ability, puts a really fast clock on any control deck while being an excellent blocker against aggro, and has excellent synergy with phantasmal image.

    The maindeck is very good against slower controlling decks so the sideboard pretty much ignores the control matchups other than the misers Thrun which I am looking to swap for something else at this point.

    The sideboard attempts to remedy the abysmal game one against mono red aggro in particular, and the tempered steel matchup which while more manageable due to the abundance of cards able to deal with the enchantment, still isn't great. The deck also has trouble dealing with Mirran crusader and sword of body and mind/feast and famine so I also added 3 tumble magnets to take care of those cards specifically. The only slot I'm not entirely happy with is the miser Thrun I have for control matchups but for now it has been good enough.

    Any comments/feedback/ideas are appreciated
  • #12
    Quote from Sneek88
    Here is my little brew of a G/U tempo deck. The deck is built around playing a land destruction spell turn 3 and Titan turn 4 to lock your opponent out of the game. Failure to land D turn 3 is not the end of the deck, Garruk can easily win the game simply by himself giving you either an army to beat down with or insurmountable card advantage, or a fast army of dungrove elders and phantasmal image copies can put a quick clock on your opponent

    ryansolid's DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    Instants:
    4 Mana Leak
    2 Dismember

    Sorceries:
    4 Rampant Growth
    2 Green Sun's Zenith
    3 Bramblecrush

    Artifacts:
    2 Sword of Feast and Famine

    Planeswalkers:
    3 Garruk, Primal Hunter

    Creatures:
    4 Birds of Paradise
    3 Acidic Slime
    2 Phantasmal Image
    4 Frost Titan
    3 Dungrove Elder

    Land:
    15 Forest
    5 Island
    4 Hinterland Harbor



    I've tried a few different combinations of land destruction spells and the 3/3 split between acidic slime and bramblecrush has been my favorite. Slime can be tutored for with GSZ, is actual card advantage, gives an excellent blocker, can be copied with phantasmal image, but is harder to play on turn 3 due to needing two ramp spells rather than one, and it does not kill planeswalkers.

    Sword of feast and famine is there to make birds of paradise a threat in the late game as well as making Dungrove Elder an almost unstoppable threat. I tested this deck with 3 originally but having 2 swords in your hand is almost never good.

    Dungrove elder is an all star in this deck and provides plenty of reason to stay two colors and commit to heavy green. He is one of the best sword wearers in standard right now, does a great job at protecting Garruk while also being a great target for his soul's majesty ability, puts a really fast clock on any control deck while being an excellent blocker against aggro, and has excellent synergy with phantasmal image.

    The maindeck is very good against slower controlling decks so the sideboard pretty much ignores the control matchups other than the misers Thrun which I am looking to swap for something else at this point.

    The sideboard attempts to remedy the abysmal game one against mono red aggro in particular, and the tempered steel matchup which while more manageable due to the abundance of cards able to deal with the enchantment, still isn't great. The deck also has trouble dealing with Mirran crusader and sword of body and mind/feast and famine so I also added 3 tumble magnets to take care of those cards specifically. The only slot I'm not entirely happy with is the miser Thrun I have for control matchups but for now it has been good enough.

    Any comments/feedback/ideas are appreciated


    I like it.. Only question is what are the Mental Missteps in the board doing? Stopping opposing Birds, and Goblin Grenades? I can only guess it's mainly for the red matchup. I just wonder if they are that good now. I you don't really get real blockers on board til about turn 3. And if you miss the Dungrove (ie not 3 forests) you are looking more turn 4-5. In so countering a T1 Stromkirk might be worth it. I just wonder if there are better options. Pre rotation I'd be on it, but without as many strong 1CMC plays (Goblin Guide, Grim Lavamancer.. he's still around but a lot weaker, Inquisition, Duress, Preordain, Lightning Bolt, Nature's Claim, Spell Pierce) I don't know if it's the best value right now. But if you have some specific use I'm missing I'm interested definitely.
    Current Decks:
    GRW Naya Monsters Standard
    GWB Melira Pod Modern
    UW Tempo Legacy
    G Berserk Stompy Legacy
    UBG Cobra Gush Vintage
  • #13
    The missteps are all for mono red, I don't board all 4 in against tempered steel but I do board in some for glint hawk/signal pest/hex parasite. Mono red has a variety of options in one drops now even with goblin guide rotating including: Grim lavamancer, furnace scamp, goblin grenade/arsonist/fireslinger, spikeshot elder, kuldotha rebirth, galvanic blast, and stormkirk noble, so misstep will always have a variety of targets, and keeps a hand of turn one guy turn two stormblood berserker from almost auto winning against me. Because the maindeck is pretty focused on beating control I felt like I really needed to dedicate slots to make my terrible matchup vs mono red in particular at least winnable games 2 and 3.
  • #14
    I see you took the "get ahead on tempo" route. Here I'm trying the "slow your opponent" tempo type. The list:

    UG TempoMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    Lands (24):
    4 Hinterland Harbor
    3 Shimmering Grotto
    7 Forest
    10 island

    Creatures (18):
    4 Skinshifter
    4 Snapcaster Mage
    4 Mindshrieker
    3 Acidic Slime
    3 Frost Titan

    Instants (18):
    4 Vapor Snag
    4 Mana Leak
    2 Think Twice
    4 Dissipate
    2 Cackling Counterpart
    2 Frost Breath



    Early plan is to counter/bounce to death, late to threaten opponent's lands.
    It's more fun to slay the dragon, than it is to be the dragon, even though the dragon has more power.


    Currently playing:
    Theros makes me think, finally Smile
  • #15
    I feel Beast Within wants in this deck pretty badly..

    I had something like this in mind:

    FuneralofGod's DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    Creatures:
    4 Birds of Paradise
    3 Viridian Emissary
    2 Oculus
    2 Phantasmal Image
    3 Aether Adept
    3 Solemn Simulacrum
    1 Thrun, the Last Troll
    3 Acidic Slime
    2 Frost Titan

    Artifacts:
    3 Birthing Pod

    Instants:
    4 Mana Leak
    3 Beast Within

    Planeswalkers:
    3 Garruk Relentless

    Lands:
    4 Hinterland Harbor
    11 Forest
    9 Island


    Thanks to DNC at HOTP Studios
    My Trade Binder
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    Chandra Jund RBG
  • #16
    UG TempoMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    Lands (21):
    4 Hinterland Harbor
    3 Inkmoth Nexus
    6 Forest
    8 island

    Creatures (15):
    3 Skinshifter
    4 Snapcaster Mage
    4 Mayor of Avabruck
    4 Delver of Secrets

    Instants (21):
    3 Vapor Snag
    4 Mana Leak
    3 Gut Shot
    3 Beast Within
    2 Psychic Barrier
    4 Gitaxian Probe
    2 Negate

    Socery (2):
    2 Ponder

    1 Sword of Feast and Famine
    1 Sword of War and Peace



    Unlike a lot of builds in this thread, this deck is true tempo. It wants to hit dudes on turn 1 and 2, then use counters and bounce to slow down the opponents plan. Gut Shot is really good here, as it lets you interact from turn 0, and disrupt them without slowing down your development. Gitaxian Probe thins the deck, lets you know when to start leaving up mana leak, and lets you use Tiago as an instant speed Silvergill Adept. Mayor of Avabruck is a can take over the game for 2 mana, and otherwise works well with all the other (human) dorks in the deck. Delver of Secrets is the stones, and commonly gets in for 6-12 damage over the first few turns. It also is very good against 'walkers. Ponder is here as a 2 of, as it adds consistency, helps with Delver, and lets you Snapcaster later in the game to dig for your Swords.
  • #17
    Quote from joehan
    UG TempoMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    Lands (21):
    4 Hinterland Harbor
    3 Inkmoth Nexus
    6 Forest
    8 island

    Creatures (15):
    3 Skinshifter
    4 Snapcaster Mage
    4 Mayor of Avabruck
    4 Delver of Secrets

    Instants (21):
    3 Vapor Snag
    4 Mana Leak
    3 Gut Shot
    3 Beast Within
    2 Psychic Barrier
    4 Gitaxian Probe
    2 Negate

    Socery (2):
    2 Ponder

    1 Sword of Feast and Famine
    1 Sword of War and Peace



    Unlike a lot of builds in this thread, this deck is true tempo. It wants to hit dudes on turn 1 and 2, then use counters and bounce to slow down the opponents plan. Gut Shot is really good here, as it lets you interact from turn 0, and disrupt them without slowing down your development. Gitaxian Probe thins the deck, lets you know when to start leaving up mana leak, and lets you use Tiago as an instant speed Silvergill Adept. Mayor of Avabruck is a can take over the game for 2 mana, and otherwise works well with all the other (human) dorks in the deck. Delver of Secrets is the stones, and commonly gets in for 6-12 damage over the first few turns. It also is very good against 'walkers. Ponder is here as a 2 of, as it adds consistency, helps with Delver, and lets you Snapcaster later in the game to dig for your Swords.


    8 Islands is too few to realiably cast Delver T1 - 10 or more

    Get rid of Inkmoth nexus, I know you're only playing 2 colours, but you need them - Double blue for Psychic Barrier, double blue for Snapcaster - Mana leak - Triple blue for Snapcaster - barrier

    You're an aggro deck, your draws need to be as smooth as possible, you need to win quickly, even the mighty delver gets outclassed in the latter stages - Inkmoth slows you down and makes your mana mana potentially problematic..

    Inkmoth and Swords is never a bad thing, so if you're adamant on keeping them in then 4 Ponders is absolutely necessary - Not only for smoothing out your draws/mana, but for setting up Delver also...

    Skinshifter with swords is a powerhouse, it can also fly and trample -

    Inkmoth isn't actually needed, you have 2 evasive creatures that you can just sit back on and protect, you have a Mayor that will win the game in short order, also creating Wolves for your swords - Inkmoth isn't worth troubling your mana base over...

    Lastly - Snapcaster and Mayor do not like each other....You'll be kicking yourself in the butt playing a full playset of each...

    Just as you've given up a turn to flip Mayor, you're required to snap a spell, you're just out-tempoing yourself, not an efficient use of resources...

    Not all blue decks need to play 4 Snapcaster Mages, in this case it's possibly better to leave them out, or play perhaps one..

    U/R Delver decks play 4 Snapcaster Mages as it's an active part of their win condition..They have mega reach in the form of Burn - Snacaster/Brimstone Volley being an actual corner stone of that deck..

    We are not playing Red so don't have the reach, thus require creature beats to get the job done...Which is why Mayor of Avabruk is a necessity along side Delver...

    Without it, you'd be far to reliant on a t1 devler every game, and then having it flip...Tis not good Magic..

    Playing Snapcaster is anathema to your game plan, Mayor is an essential piece and Snapcaster Dilutes his usefulness - It's like playing Koth in a deck full of forests...

    Legacy RuG decks get to play Snapcaster - One, because it's broken and will get banned. Two, it has Tarmogoyf that isn't in danger of flipping back and becoming useless, the mana is much more friendly and you can play a more spell based deck, you know, coz its legacy and not standard...

    The more you slow yourself with plays such as the one above where you've costed yourself a silly amount of tempo, the more you force the game late..

    Your list can't afford do go late as it's not so well equipped..

    Your creatures will be outclassed, and you have too few lands..

    FNM 4-0

    The List:
    UG DelverMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    Creatures:
    4 Delver of Secrets
    4 Mayor of Avabruk
    4 Phantasmal Image
    2 Skinshifter
    1 Thrun, the Last Troll
    1 Snapcaster Mage

    Instants:
    4 Mana Leak
    3 Dissipate
    1 Negate
    2 Disperse
    1 Vapor Snag
    2 Beast Within
    2 Dismember

    Sorcery:
    4 Ponder
    3 Green Sun's Zenith

    Land
    4 Hinterland Habor
    10 Island
    8 Forest



    Round One - U/W Unburial Rites, all the goodness of Solar Flare without the Mana Issues, and much more removal...2-1

    Game 1 - Don't remember much of this much as it was over in a flash, T1 Delver, T2 Mayor got there in a few turns, The Tribute to Hunger's and Wraths in opponents hands were much to slow...

    Game 2 - Lost this one, was pretty tense...I didn't get the fastest of draws and flooded out..I managed to Mind Control a Wurmcoil which was wrathed, then wrathed again...

    Opponent plopped down sheoldred, I sacced a Wolf, Another Mind Control took it away - Opponent had an O-ring for the Mind Control and a Gideon to follow up...Scooooopsies

    Game 3 - Was Business as usual - I mulled to 6 - But had, Delver, Mayor, Mana leak, 3 lands - Awesome..

    Again over in a flash - Opponent admitted he Sded wrong, bringing in 4 Revoke Exisitence for Mind Control...

    Round 2 - U/G Splinterfright/Mulch/Mindshrieker/Dredge??? 2-1

    Game 1 - 7 Card hand - No Lands - 6 Card Hand - No lands - 5 Card hand, 4 Lands, 1 Image - Keep, but proceed to draw more lands...

    From the Sideboard came, 2 Spellskite and 4 Gut shots

    Game 2 and 3 - Deck did it's normal thing of Play Delver or Mayor and then
    Win

    Round 3 - Against Solar Flare - 2-0

    Game 1 - On the Draw - Pretty Dangerous

    This was a tense match, I was beating down with a lone Skinshifter for most of the game - I know I had an Image in the Grave, just not sure how it got there when my opponent plays Unburial Rites getting back Sun Titan and 2 Lands..

    I get in for 2 fyling with Skinshifter, Zenith for another, Image his Titan, Bringing back Image on his Titan - Things are looking good...

    Opponent plays Elesh Norn - Killing my 2 Shifters and shrinking my 2 Titans--I take 8

    Only 4 outs left in my deck - 2 more Image and 2 Beast Within

    My board - 2 4/4 Sun Titans - Opponents - Elesh Norn and an 8/8 Sun Titan

    Proceed to Top deck an Image Cool I Image his Elesh Norn, both die, Swing with 2 Titans, bringing back, Image on Titan, Skinshifter, Skinshifter

    Pow, on to game 2

    I kept a Strange hand - but immediately top decked 2 Mayor of Avabruks

    The First was Mana Leaked - The Second made it through and won the game in short order - My strange hand was full of permission to keep my Mayor around

    Round 4 - G/B Rock Splashing White for Unburial Rites - I watched this deck in between rounds - It's sooo good, was wrecking face against everything...

    2-1

    I'm on the draw - Lame

    My hand is Solid, but I don't draw a blue Source the entire game -If I had, I had all the support to get there with Mayor

    Game 2 - Triple Delver Draw FTW

    Game 3 - Some Stuff happened - Mayor Wrecked some face - opponent "Stabilized" with Sheoldred - Mind Control FTW :p

    All in all, an epic night - A deck I built 3 days prior and did minimal testing with - Delver is legit

    The one card that my opponents mentioned over and over again to others and myself about how devestating it was, was Mayor of Avabruk..

    This guy is house, will win games by himself, and will win them quickly...

    Changes I would make:

    Not sure yet, Azure mage is probably getting removed from the sideboard as I never wanted it..It's good against control yes, but our entire creature base is good against control, and better than Azure Mage..

    I would probs makes some space for cards to deal with swords and Mirran Crusader...

    Last Note - My store is holding a raffle...If you spent a certain amount of money and bought a booster you got to enter...So I did...

    Foil Delver of Secrets Cool I knew this was gonna be a good night

    Phantasmal Image is really good here...

    You can double up on your flipped Delver or Mayor and end the game stupidly fast...Its cheap so you can do this while keeping up counter magic..

    If the game goes late you can copy your opponent's stuff..As shown in the Solar Flare matchup, I beat an opponent with his own Sun Titan Cool

    You can even do sneaky stuff such as this: Copy Wurmcoil - Bounce Wurmcoil - Counter Wurmcoil on way back up...
    Last edited by Ben Delat: 11/7/2011 7:36:14 AM
  • #18
    Tasa Blue's DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    //Sword Bearers
    4 Birds of Paradise
    4 Llanowar Elves
    3 AEther Adept
    3 Frost Titan
    3 Acidic Slime

    //Das Swords
    2 Sword of Feast and Famine

    //Tricks and such
    4 Rampant Growth
    2 Gitaxian Probe
    2 Ratchet Bomb

    //Permission Goes here
    4 Mana Leak

    //Vindicates
    4 Beast Within
    3 Bramblecrush

    //Land
    4 Hinterland Harbor
    10 Forest
    8 Island



    I want this to almost play like a Ramp-LD deck but it still feels like it's missing something. I'm almost set on Grixis Control, but want to just make sure a sweet Tempo deck (The type of deck that I'm drawn most to) doesn't slip past.

    This list was just sort of randomly put together while at work and if it (or a slight variation) proves good on paper I'll report more later.

    Any ideas would be appreciated.
    "My love for you is like an Elf, Berzerker!"
  • #19
    I'm a big fan of the delver version with a heavy counter suite. I don't prefer to tap out on my turn unless it's to save a threat from instant speed removal. Also, in lieu of phantasmal image, cackling counterpart allows you to leave up counter magic and EoT clone if you need to (or even clone in response to removal if you don't have a counter). Having 7 snapcaster mages is pretty fun too.

    Dreamwalker's DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    Creatures: 12
    4 Delver of Secrets
    4 Mayor of Avabruck
    4 Snapcaster Mage

    Instant/Sorc: 26
    3 Cackling Counterpart
    2 Beast Within
    3 Disperse
    4 Dissipate
    4 Mana Leak
    2 Negate
    4 Ponder
    4 Think Twice

    Land: 22
    7 Forest
    4 Hinterland Harbor
    11 Island



    When you factor in ponder, you have just about a 50% chance to flip delver. I've played games that went turn 1 delver, counter your next 7 spells(literally). Having such a high amount of counter magic makes the wolf-run matchup a joke as well (even if they board in Thrun, it's an easy race for you).
  • #20
    Ju'ib's DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    Critters
    4 Delver of Secrets
    4 Mayor of Avabruck
    1 Phantasmal Image

    Non-Critters
    4 Mana Leak
    2 Negate
    2 Psychic Barrier
    4 Ponder
    2 Beast Within
    3 Cackling Counterpart
    2 Disperse
    3 Vapor Snag
    2 Silver-Inlaid Dagger
    2 Gitaxian Probe
    2 Dismember

    4 Forest
    4 Hinterland Harbor
    15 Island

    1 Psychic Barrier
    2 Disperse
    1 Vapor Snag
    4 Flashfreeze
    2 Mental Misstep
    1 Tree of Redemption
    1 Thrun, the Last Troll
    3 Naturalize



    Here's the list I just posted on the Delver RUG sub. It's untested, but I do think I'd like to take out the daggers, maybe for two Swords if I can get my hands on them. I'm considering Body and Mind, as the wolf tokens keep on the pressure and are boosted by Mayor. I'm not sure Feast and Famine is at its best in here, as you won't often be tapping out. War and Peace may be the best, for the extra damage it gets in. If not Swords, what should go there? Think Twice, maybe?
  • #21
    I'm wondering if anyone is having trouble flipping mayor and keeping him that way? I ran a bunch of games vs puresteel and lost all but one. Delver is a house. I was also testing counterpart and it doesn't seem worth it. I'll test some more but I feel like with the limited amount of creatures we run it's not worth cloning a 1 or 2 drop for 3. Even if it is at instant speed and can't be flipped back. I like counterpart on paper but in game it seemed average i suppose.
    Standard: UB Control
  • #22
    Quote from rawatts
    I'm wondering if anyone is having trouble flipping mayor and keeping him that way? I ran a bunch of games vs puresteel and lost all but one. Delver is a house. I was also testing counterpart and it doesn't seem worth it. I'll test some more but I feel like with the limited amount of creatures we run it's not worth cloning a 1 or 2 drop for 3. Even if it is at instant speed and can't be flipped back. I like counterpart on paper but in game it seemed average i suppose.


    Strangely enough, my experience with Cackling Counterpart is the opposite. Most of my wins are either from a protected Delver or timely Cackling Counterparts targeting Delver or a flipped Mayor. I have seldom been disappointed with it, since we have draw, filtering, and very cheap threats. The instant-speed flashback has even been relevant at times.

    As you said, keeping a Mayor flipped is difficult. It's easy to flip him by not playing spells on your turn, and following that up with a Cackling Counterpart on the opponents turn (usually in response to one or more spells cast) is a great tempo play, I find. IMO, it fits into the deck's gameplan much better than Phantasmal Image.

    I run a list very close to that posted by Dreamwalker, though I chose to omit Snapcasters (which may or may not be correct). This deck has become one of my favorites.
  • #23
    I'm with the above poster. Cackling Counterpart has been very good for me.

    if anyone is interested in checking out my decklist it can be found here http://www.nedermagic.nl/deck_item_pics.asp?deckid=105343
  • #24
    im considering skinshifter, but it goes against my plan pretty hardcore. also, how has gut shot been for you guys?

    anyways, on to my UG(b) tempo deck. ideally, my deck plays a 1 drop accelerator, then stays ahead on mana to counter their stuff till they run out of gas / stutter a bit. at this point, i extend a little bit with a sword of feast and famine to finish my win with pure attrition, and tempo. if this summary sounds a bit appealing, its because it is. this deck is SUPER fun to play, let me tell you.
    UG(b) Tempo Control by tronistMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    Sorcery-Speed (7)
    4 Birds of Paradise
    1 Llanowar Elves
    2 Sword of Feast and Famine

    Instant-Speed (27)
    4 Snapcaster Mage
    4 Mana Leak
    2 Negate
    2 Psychic Barrier
    4 Forbidden Alchemy
    4 Disperse
    1 Dissipate
    2 Think Twice
    1 Dismember
    1 Blue Sun's Zenith
    2 Vapor Snag

    Land (26)
    3 Ghost Quarter
    4 Hinterland Harbor
    2 Drowned Catacomb
    1 Woodland Cemetery
    6 Forest
    10 Island




    **you can get away with 25 or 24 if you are playing paper magic and not MWS or MTGO (not sure how mtgo shuffle works, tbh. i use MWS to play)**

    the deck is pretty straight forward.

    heres my current sideboard. please keep in mind the deck, and the sideboard are a pretty new / raw / untweaked product. i do feel this archetype might have potential, but then again i feel that about a lot of my 'innovations', so i could very well be wrong.

    SIDEBOARD
  • #25
    I went 4-0 at a local tournament last night with this list:

    syc22's DeckMagic OnlineOCTGN2ApprenticeBuy These Cards
    Lands:
    4x Hinterland Harbor
    10x Island
    7x Forest
    2x Ghost Quarter

    Creatures:
    4x Delver of Secrets
    4x Mayor of Avabruck
    3x Phantasmal Image
    2x Skinshifter

    Spells:
    4x Mana Leak
    2x Dissipate
    2x Cancel (Should have been Dissipate, but I didn't have them.)
    4x Think Twice
    2x Ponder
    2x Green Sun's Zenith
    2x Beast Within
    1x Vapor Snag
    1x Disperse
    1x Negate
    1x Cackling Counterpart
    1x Sword of Feast and Famine
    1x Sword of War and Peace



    I played against Solar Flare, RDW, R/W Tokens and G/W Ramp, winning all of my match-ups 2-0 except for G/W Ramp. I should have 2-0'd that match too, but I made a play error that cost me game 2. I'll post more information on my match-ups when I get the chance later today.
    Last edited by syc22: 11/17/2011 8:52:19 AM
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