Just wondering what decks and archetypes does this decks have favorable and unfavorable match-ups against? What cards wreck this deck? Can someone give me a real brief overview without me having the read 195 pages of info? Thanks
Favorable match-ups are almost any aggro decks, except tempered steel if they get their pump stuff out first
Unfavorable match-ups are UB control and UW control I think because our threats are countered fairly easily. I may be wrong though, cause this is just my experience with deck.
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Quote from Kiln Fiend »
I shout out YOLO every time I fetch for an untapped shockland.
my experience with control decks is that some of your threats are greatly devalued (6 mana fatties, very vulnerable to countermagic and spot removal) while other threats are that much better (Koth, Kuldotha Phoenix). an early Koth is probably an outright game win but there's little else the deck can do that is nearly as effective against control. most scenarios are bad and the matchup is unfavorable on the whole.
if the metagame shifts significantly towards control i would almost certainly want to play a different deck. this deck is basically a form of midrange deck so its only natural that it should beat up aggro and beat up decks with consistency problems, while being very soft to control. thats the expected archetype performance and i'm not seeing a way to get around it.
Shrine of burning Rage is a good sideboard for control. Since they almost always have almost no way to react to it. Same story with Batterskull, if you leave mana open for Mana Leak. They'll almost always board in flashfreeze, so your colorless threats pack that much more of a punch. Their man-lands beat your face, so Tectonic edge is usually great, because "YOU CAN'T COUNTER A LAND!!!1!"
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Quote from Kiln Fiend »
I shout out YOLO every time I fetch for an untapped shockland.
I have found that our control matchup not to be that bad. Although I haven't tested it extensively yet. From my recent testing against u/b though I find we have many must counter/answer threats. Eventully you'll get somthing to stick. There realitvily low threat count (no more jace) means we can hang with them into the late game. Again my deck is playing 2 mb karn also (a house in the control mu), and main deck slagstorms ( good against grave titans dudes).
I don't see how this deck should just fold to control,however my cawblade match-up was apprently much worse than the norm for mrc. Maybe its just in the builds.
2-0 vs Valakut
With the downfall of Caw, people flocked back to valakut exactly as i had suspected. It helps that al of them didn't play it before this week, and make many misplays. Early koth game 1 led to batterskull beats and an easy win. Game 2 he stuck a primetime that never got to swing, as the previous turn's Urabrask led my Inferno Titan right past him for a nice finish.
2-0 vs Elves
Elves die to burn game 1, not much to say about it really. Game 2 I got cocky and kept a hand with 5 Mountains, a galvanic blast, and 1 inferno titan. i drew into 2 more inferno titans and an urabrask, which stalled vengevines until he got hit by a brittle effigy. Triple inferno titan is still hard for elves though.
2-1 Vs RDW
Game 1 he got me to 2, then i swung in with a wurmcoil and he never recovered. I sided in the third wurmcoil, and proceeded to have my ass handed to me by a shrine that i didnt see game 1. Game 3 i added the crushes, and it was easy from there.
2-0 vs U/B control
Hand disruption slows me down a turn, but red decks don't typically have cards in hand anyway. Batterskull wins it for me both games.
2-0 vs U/B Tezz
Game 1 lasted 45 minutes, with me again on 2 life, this time staring down 2 tumble magnets, 1 creeping tar pit and a myr battlesphere and all 4 tokens. my own 2 tumble magnets stalled while an inferno titan and urabrask were tapped down repeatedly. Koth emblem from turn 4 picked off the 4 myr tokens, galvanic blast from the last red source ( sphere of the suns) killed a tarpit, tumble magnet kept the sphere down, and i swung or the win after his magnets were empty.
Game 2 was much easier, crush sort of destroys tezz decks, especially when they cant find a fourth land. Koth emblem wins it, never stuck a creature.
Ended up taking first out of 30~ people, got 10 packs and opened a foil vorinclex, voice of hunger. Pretty lousy packs overall, but I loved the way the deck performs now.
Most deck lists don't use enough red spells to warrant a shrine. It's a horrid top deck card and leaving 3 mana open the entire game isn't an option for this deck, since it has consistent turn 2, 3, 4, and 5 spells (unless you want to sit the entire game with 6 cards in hand and no threats on the field).
Control will happily allow you 19 turns then kill you before shrine has a chance or they'll just into the roil, divine offering, naturalize, or hexmage when you tap out to play something. I'd say shrine is good for aggro decks, but it's just a waste of a slot in this deck. I'd rather have any one of the reoccurring phoenix, which stand a much better chance against control in the long run. There are much better cards to have SB against control. Kargan and Ruinblaster come to mind, which are early threats that require an answer.
2-0 vs Valakut
With the downfall of Caw, people flocked back to valakut exactly as i had suspected. It helps that al of them didn't play it before this week, and make many misplays. Early koth game 1 led to batterskull beats and an easy win. Game 2 he stuck a primetime that never got to swing, as the previous turn's Urabrask led my Inferno Titan right past him for a nice finish.
2-0 vs Elves
Elves die to burn game 1, not much to say about it really. Game 2 I got cocky and kept a hand with 5 Mountains, a galvanic blast, and 1 inferno titan. i drew into 2 more inferno titans and an urabrask, which stalled vengevines until he got hit by a brittle effigy. Triple inferno titan is still hard for elves though.
2-1 Vs RDW
Game 1 he got me to 2, then i swung in with a wurmcoil and he never recovered. I sided in the third wurmcoil, and proceeded to have my ass handed to me by a shrine that i didnt see game 1. Game 3 i added the crushes, and it was easy from there.
2-0 vs U/B control
Hand disruption slows me down a turn, but red decks don't typically have cards in hand anyway. Batterskull wins it for me both games.
2-0 vs U/B Tezz
Game 1 lasted 45 minutes, with me again on 2 life, this time staring down 2 tumble magnets, 1 creeping tar pit and a myr battlesphere and all 4 tokens. my own 2 tumble magnets stalled while an inferno titan and urabrask were tapped down repeatedly. Koth emblem from turn 4 picked off the 4 myr tokens, galvanic blast from the last red source ( sphere of the suns) killed a tarpit, tumble magnet kept the sphere down, and i swung or the win after his magnets were empty.
Game 2 was much easier, crush sort of destroys tezz decks, especially when they cant find a fourth land. Koth emblem wins it, never stuck a creature.
Ended up taking first out of 30~ people, got 10 packs and opened a foil vorinclex, voice of hunger. Pretty lousy packs overall, but I loved the way the deck performs now.
1.) Tezz misplayed, by the way. Galvanic blast wouldn't have killed Sphere, even if it was turned into a 5/5 creature. And it doesn't sound like you had blockers.
2.) Why do people refuse to run spellskite? I mean, I'm hoping it was in your SB at least. It shuts RDW down completely, and that's the dominating deck right now (though Splinter Twin is slightly better, and more popular in some regions).
On the control Matchup:
A bad control matchup? Uh...okay I guess. I'll take your word for it, but it's been my experience that we do well against U/B and U/W. U/B is a very permission build, with few wincons. L-bolts and Galvanic Blasts hit their Man-lands, this matchup is almost entirely why I conceded to how good Kuldotha Phoenix is (it starts the clock. A Spellskite/Everflowing Chalice or two, a tumble magnet, let's get rolling). U/W...I'm not entirely sure that exists as a thing right now. It will be when M12 hits shelves (O-ring), but...they lost JTMS, and Gideon. My friends that played Caw either changed decks, or altered it (with terrible records. 1-3 seems to be the average).
So uh, Tempered Steel is probably our hardest matchup, as said earlier in the thread.
So uh, Tempered Steel is probably our hardest matchup, as said earlier in the thread.
I haven't played Tempered Steel yet. Does big red last long enough to get out a hoard smelter or other artifact hate? It kinda sucks that there are no answers for enchantments in red.
I wonder if slag fiend would do well? Or maybe I can say I finally killed someone with magnetic mine
On the control Matchup:
A bad control matchup? Uh...okay I guess. I'll take your word for it, but it's been my experience that we do well against U/B and U/W. U/B is a very permission build, with few wincons. L-bolts and Galvanic Blasts hit their Man-lands, this matchup is almost entirely why I conceded to how good Kuldotha Phoenix is (it starts the clock.
you got it exactly. Kuldotha Phoenix is a champ against UB control and so is Koth. thats how you're gonna win and almost nothing else works. thats why its kind of a bad matchup. not attrocious. not unwinnable no matter what. but really hinging heavily on Phoenix to get alot of work done. i'm only running 2 Phoenix in the main so game 1 is pretty rotten. for awhile i had taken them out of the sideboard completely but i'm playing the other 2 boarded again now and it helps. still, 4 cards out of 60 is a bit scary. you're right that UB won't kill you quickly so you have time to find them, but its possible for the birds to just never show up. its a variance problem i guess. the matchup against control is very winnable but not as consistently winnable as i'd like.
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edit: Re: Tempered Steel matchup
only hard if they draw a Tempered Steel. the deck gets picked apart by spot removal otherwise. really no problem. their nut draw will just friggin kill you and there's nothing you can do about it though, so i guess if your opponent is lucky its a bad beat. i'm not taking consistent losses to it though. my win ratio is above 60% against this deck, but the games I lose I had no chance at all. because of this i concluded its not even worth trying to board for it, at least not any more than you would against any traditional aggro deck (bring in sweepers, etc.). just pray they don't draw a TS early and you'll win easily.
1.) Tezz misplayed, by the way. Galvanic blast wouldn't have killed Sphere, even if it was turned into a 5/5 creature. And it doesn't sound like you had blockers.
2.) Why do people refuse to run spellskite? I mean, I'm hoping it was in your SB at least. It shuts RDW down completely, and that's the dominating deck right now (though Splinter Twin is slightly better, and more popular in some regions).
The Gavanc Blast hit a tar pit, I don't know how you thought it was aimed at anything else. And I do have 2 Spellskites in SB.
@ Zelderex: If you read carefully, he says he Blasted the Tarpit and tapped down the Sphere until his opponent's Magnets were empty.
Also, Spellskite is an amazing card but it really isn't the end-all-be-all card that you make it out to be. I strongly advocate it but there are plenty of answers available to Red to deal with RDW and Splinter Twin. I've won games against Twin without needing Spellskite. As long as you know what you are playing just hold 4+ damage in hand and make sure you have the lands to play them. I agree that Spellskite is good because it takes a lot of weight off of your plays when you don't need to worry about holding up burn. I guess what I'm getting at is that you don't need to berate everyone who posts on here and their list doesn't use it. I think it is pretty obvious that the deck is capable of winning without it. Let people put it in if it makes sense to them.
Sorry to rant like that. As far as the conversation that's going on is concerned, what is the consensus on Batterskull? I'm hearing that it is either awesome or just terrible. I would be willing to try it as a one-of in my deck but I'm not sure how it'll fit in. Any suggestions? My deck list is here. Thanks in advance.
my experience with control decks is that some of your threats are greatly devalued (6 mana fatties, very vulnerable to countermagic and spot removal) while other threats are that much better (Koth, Kuldotha Phoenix). an early Koth is probably an outright game win but there's little else the deck can do that is nearly as effective against control. most scenarios are bad and the matchup is unfavorable on the whole.
if the metagame shifts significantly towards control i would almost certainly want to play a different deck. this deck is basically a form of midrange deck so its only natural that it should beat up aggro and beat up decks with consistency problems, while being very soft to control. thats the expected archetype performance and i'm not seeing a way to get around it.
After playing several hundreds of games I agree with this. Online my biggest problem has been U/B control. Not sure how it responds to the rest of the meta but I think that is the best deck in the meta and makes up a significant portion of it....at least online.
Kind of disappointing since I've finally found a way to beat the arch nemesis of valkut.
I haven't played Tempered Steel yet. Does big red last long enough to get out a hoard smelter or other artifact hate? It kinda sucks that there are no answers for enchantments in red.
I wonder if slag fiend would do well? Or maybe I can say I finally killed someone with magnetic mine
either you t3 slagstorm or you die. They will bring in spell pierce ready for it. Hope they dont have it. I would know, I play the deck.
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Modern:
Affinity
EDH:
Rhys (Tokens)
Karrthus (Dragons)
Bruna (Auras OP)
After playing several hundreds of games I agree with this. Online my biggest problem has been U/B control. Not sure how it responds to the rest of the meta but I think that is the best deck in the meta and makes up a significant portion of it....at least online.
Kind of disappointing since I've finally found a way to beat the arch nemesis of valkut.
Yeah, Valakut isn't as good anymore. Dunno why.
We should start considering ways to deal with U/B control. Wurmcoil Engine sort of helps, The Bird wins it. I'm hoping the Simulacrum will help us deal with control much more effectively. I think most of us are planning to run 2-3 mb/sb anyway. We should be able to keep our U/B matchup around 50%, which is good since it's not popular in paper (yet).
As said before, it gets taken down by Shrine, Koth and Phoenix.
If you expect UB to be common in your meta, pack shrine in the sb.
Because I don't run tec edge (I feel its a drawback more than an advantage) I side in Combust to deal with the tarpits.
I dont see alot of UB controll (any in fact) in my meta so i wouldnt know about the shrine/koth/pheonix thing, but ive been seeing issues with tec edge as well. its just not as good as it needs to be.... idk ive been thinking about dropping them to the side/all together for a while now, so i will go ahead and second that point.
Ohh k so everybody feels that the u/b match is not so great, now besides shrines, phoenix and koth, what are other cards that help improve the match up? I feel that if it's the decks worst match up is arguably the most played deck then big red isn't a great choice at all in the current meta. Which sucks since u/b is big in my meta and this deck looks like a lot of fun
I kid you not. I did this after joking with my friend who wanted to play it in a Bant-Pod deck he built, but didn't have space for. I ran one copy and when he stuck, it was over. UB Control doesn't have a lot of counters, nor a lot of kill spells to handle the sheer density of threats they play. Resolving a late Titan with mana for attaching the Deathmantle, I kept him in check for simply swinging with an 8/8 BLACK Titan, and had the ability to resurrect him if he managed to kill it.
Edit: Also, been playing this deck for nearly three months now. Longest I've ever stuck with a deck. It's just feels that good.
I kid you not. I did this after joking with my friend who wanted to play it in a Bant-Pod deck he built, but didn't have space for. I ran one copy and when he stuck, it was over. UB Control doesn't have a lot of counters, nor a lot of kill spells to handle the sheer density of threats they play. Resolving a late Titan with mana for attaching the Deathmantle, I kept him in check for simply swinging with an 8/8 BLACK Titan, and had the ability to resurrect him if he managed to kill it.
Edit: Also, been playing this deck for nearly three months now. Longest I've ever stuck with a deck. It's just feels that good.
while that post was almost completely unintelligible, Death Mantle I can maybe see in the SB. It's way too slow for a lot of matchups, and requires too much mana for anything that DOESN'T already make us keep untapped lands.
while that post was almost completely unintelligible, Death Mantle I can maybe see in the SB. It's way too slow for a lot of matchups, and requires too much mana for anything that DOESN'T already make us keep untapped lands.
I respectfully disagree. I was only offering my advice, and testing, of what makes the UB matchup winnable. I've never looked back from the equipment, and it doesn't matter the speed. It's a mid-game card, and I don't expect a good Big Red player to try and land it T2 over a Chalice or Sphere. The UB Control matchup is ultimately a battle of attrition, and when you have a resource that allows you to maintain a threat, it only tipped the scales in your favor.
Goal being to use chandra's -2 ability and twincast Destructive Force while still having enough mana artifacts to not cripple yourself. Think it's worth trying to make it work?
Goal being to use chandra's -2 ability and twincast Destructive Force while still having enough mana artifacts to not cripple yourself. Think it's worth trying to make it work?
Seriously, a single D-Force will cripple someone hard enough if you have a Titan or Chandra 3.0 on the board. No need to waste the effort and resources to double the effect, seeing how you'll be killing your creatures in the end. Why not just cripple with a massive dude in play?
Favorable match-ups are almost any aggro decks, except tempered steel if they get their pump stuff out first
Unfavorable match-ups are UB control and UW control I think because our threats are countered fairly easily. I may be wrong though, cause this is just my experience with deck.
if the metagame shifts significantly towards control i would almost certainly want to play a different deck. this deck is basically a form of midrange deck so its only natural that it should beat up aggro and beat up decks with consistency problems, while being very soft to control. thats the expected archetype performance and i'm not seeing a way to get around it.
I don't see how this deck should just fold to control,however my cawblade match-up was apprently much worse than the norm for mrc. Maybe its just in the builds.
Into the roil
Divine Offering
Its actually terrible against control.
Modern:
Affinity
EDH:
Rhys (Tokens)
Karrthus (Dragons)
Bruna (Auras OP)
sac in response?? obv this forces you to always leave mana open. (which is the most reasonable strategy against control).
still, its not a solid SB card as Richochet Trap against control.
Manabards is a little bit slow, and Reverberate is useless against Flashfreeze.
Demonfire anyone?
3 Inferno Titan
2 Wurmcoil Engine
1 Batterskull
4 Everflowing Chalice
2 Sphere of the Suns
4 Tumble Magnet
1 Karn Liberated
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Galvanic Blast
3 Slagstorm
4 Tezzeret's Gambit
1 Mystifying Maze
3 Tectonic Edge
2-0 vs Valakut
With the downfall of Caw, people flocked back to valakut exactly as i had suspected. It helps that al of them didn't play it before this week, and make many misplays. Early koth game 1 led to batterskull beats and an easy win. Game 2 he stuck a primetime that never got to swing, as the previous turn's Urabrask led my Inferno Titan right past him for a nice finish.
2-0 vs Elves
Elves die to burn game 1, not much to say about it really. Game 2 I got cocky and kept a hand with 5 Mountains, a galvanic blast, and 1 inferno titan. i drew into 2 more inferno titans and an urabrask, which stalled vengevines until he got hit by a brittle effigy. Triple inferno titan is still hard for elves though.
2-1 Vs RDW
Game 1 he got me to 2, then i swung in with a wurmcoil and he never recovered. I sided in the third wurmcoil, and proceeded to have my ass handed to me by a shrine that i didnt see game 1. Game 3 i added the crushes, and it was easy from there.
2-0 vs U/B control
Hand disruption slows me down a turn, but red decks don't typically have cards in hand anyway. Batterskull wins it for me both games.
2-0 vs U/B Tezz
Game 1 lasted 45 minutes, with me again on 2 life, this time staring down 2 tumble magnets, 1 creeping tar pit and a myr battlesphere and all 4 tokens. my own 2 tumble magnets stalled while an inferno titan and urabrask were tapped down repeatedly. Koth emblem from turn 4 picked off the 4 myr tokens, galvanic blast from the last red source ( sphere of the suns) killed a tarpit, tumble magnet kept the sphere down, and i swung or the win after his magnets were empty.
Game 2 was much easier, crush sort of destroys tezz decks, especially when they cant find a fourth land. Koth emblem wins it, never stuck a creature.
Ended up taking first out of 30~ people, got 10 packs and opened a foil vorinclex, voice of hunger. Pretty lousy packs overall, but I loved the way the deck performs now.
Most deck lists don't use enough red spells to warrant a shrine. It's a horrid top deck card and leaving 3 mana open the entire game isn't an option for this deck, since it has consistent turn 2, 3, 4, and 5 spells (unless you want to sit the entire game with 6 cards in hand and no threats on the field).
Control will happily allow you 19 turns then kill you before shrine has a chance or they'll just into the roil, divine offering, naturalize, or hexmage when you tap out to play something. I'd say shrine is good for aggro decks, but it's just a waste of a slot in this deck. I'd rather have any one of the reoccurring phoenix, which stand a much better chance against control in the long run. There are much better cards to have SB against control. Kargan and Ruinblaster come to mind, which are early threats that require an answer.
1.) Tezz misplayed, by the way. Galvanic blast wouldn't have killed Sphere, even if it was turned into a 5/5 creature. And it doesn't sound like you had blockers.
2.) Why do people refuse to run spellskite? I mean, I'm hoping it was in your SB at least. It shuts RDW down completely, and that's the dominating deck right now (though Splinter Twin is slightly better, and more popular in some regions).
On the control Matchup:
A bad control matchup? Uh...okay I guess. I'll take your word for it, but it's been my experience that we do well against U/B and U/W. U/B is a very permission build, with few wincons. L-bolts and Galvanic Blasts hit their Man-lands, this matchup is almost entirely why I conceded to how good Kuldotha Phoenix is (it starts the clock. A Spellskite/Everflowing Chalice or two, a tumble magnet, let's get rolling). U/W...I'm not entirely sure that exists as a thing right now. It will be when M12 hits shelves (O-ring), but...they lost JTMS, and Gideon. My friends that played Caw either changed decks, or altered it (with terrible records. 1-3 seems to be the average).
So uh, Tempered Steel is probably our hardest matchup, as said earlier in the thread.
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I haven't played Tempered Steel yet. Does big red last long enough to get out a hoard smelter or other artifact hate? It kinda sucks that there are no answers for enchantments in red.
I wonder if slag fiend would do well? Or maybe I can say I finally killed someone with magnetic mine
you got it exactly. Kuldotha Phoenix is a champ against UB control and so is Koth. thats how you're gonna win and almost nothing else works. thats why its kind of a bad matchup. not attrocious. not unwinnable no matter what. but really hinging heavily on Phoenix to get alot of work done. i'm only running 2 Phoenix in the main so game 1 is pretty rotten. for awhile i had taken them out of the sideboard completely but i'm playing the other 2 boarded again now and it helps. still, 4 cards out of 60 is a bit scary. you're right that UB won't kill you quickly so you have time to find them, but its possible for the birds to just never show up. its a variance problem i guess. the matchup against control is very winnable but not as consistently winnable as i'd like.
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edit: Re: Tempered Steel matchup
only hard if they draw a Tempered Steel. the deck gets picked apart by spot removal otherwise. really no problem. their nut draw will just friggin kill you and there's nothing you can do about it though, so i guess if your opponent is lucky its a bad beat. i'm not taking consistent losses to it though. my win ratio is above 60% against this deck, but the games I lose I had no chance at all. because of this i concluded its not even worth trying to board for it, at least not any more than you would against any traditional aggro deck (bring in sweepers, etc.). just pray they don't draw a TS early and you'll win easily.
The Gavanc Blast hit a tar pit, I don't know how you thought it was aimed at anything else. And I do have 2 Spellskites in SB.
Also, Spellskite is an amazing card but it really isn't the end-all-be-all card that you make it out to be. I strongly advocate it but there are plenty of answers available to Red to deal with RDW and Splinter Twin. I've won games against Twin without needing Spellskite. As long as you know what you are playing just hold 4+ damage in hand and make sure you have the lands to play them. I agree that Spellskite is good because it takes a lot of weight off of your plays when you don't need to worry about holding up burn. I guess what I'm getting at is that you don't need to berate everyone who posts on here and their list doesn't use it. I think it is pretty obvious that the deck is capable of winning without it. Let people put it in if it makes sense to them.
Sorry to rant like that. As far as the conversation that's going on is concerned, what is the consensus on Batterskull? I'm hearing that it is either awesome or just terrible. I would be willing to try it as a one-of in my deck but I'm not sure how it'll fit in. Any suggestions? My deck list is here. Thanks in advance.
After playing several hundreds of games I agree with this. Online my biggest problem has been U/B control. Not sure how it responds to the rest of the meta but I think that is the best deck in the meta and makes up a significant portion of it....at least online.
Kind of disappointing since I've finally found a way to beat the arch nemesis of valkut.
calling liberals loons=not okay
The standard to which the forum moderators apply the rules here.
either you t3 slagstorm or you die. They will bring in spell pierce ready for it. Hope they dont have it. I would know, I play the deck.
Modern:
Affinity
EDH:
Rhys (Tokens)
Karrthus (Dragons)
Bruna (Auras OP)
Yeah, Valakut isn't as good anymore. Dunno why.
We should start considering ways to deal with U/B control. Wurmcoil Engine sort of helps, The Bird wins it. I'm hoping the Simulacrum will help us deal with control much more effectively. I think most of us are planning to run 2-3 mb/sb anyway. We should be able to keep our U/B matchup around 50%, which is good since it's not popular in paper (yet).
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I dont see alot of UB controll (any in fact) in my meta so i wouldnt know about the shrine/koth/pheonix thing, but ive been seeing issues with tec edge as well. its just not as good as it needs to be.... idk ive been thinking about dropping them to the side/all together for a while now, so i will go ahead and second that point.
RR(P/U)Big Red(P/U)RR 24-8-2 (un-retired)
RWR BorosRWR 21-7 (retired)
Modern Lists:
Boros
Kithkin
I kid you not. I did this after joking with my friend who wanted to play it in a Bant-Pod deck he built, but didn't have space for. I ran one copy and when he stuck, it was over. UB Control doesn't have a lot of counters, nor a lot of kill spells to handle the sheer density of threats they play. Resolving a late Titan with mana for attaching the Deathmantle, I kept him in check for simply swinging with an 8/8 BLACK Titan, and had the ability to resurrect him if he managed to kill it.
Edit: Also, been playing this deck for nearly three months now. Longest I've ever stuck with a deck. It's just feels that good.
Retired Player
while that post was almost completely unintelligible, Death Mantle I can maybe see in the SB. It's way too slow for a lot of matchups, and requires too much mana for anything that DOESN'T already make us keep untapped lands.
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I respectfully disagree. I was only offering my advice, and testing, of what makes the UB matchup winnable. I've never looked back from the equipment, and it doesn't matter the speed. It's a mid-game card, and I don't expect a good Big Red player to try and land it T2 over a Chalice or Sphere. The UB Control matchup is ultimately a battle of attrition, and when you have a resource that allows you to maintain a threat, it only tipped the scales in your favor.
Retired Player
4 Chandra, the Firebrand
3 Koth of the Hammer
Sorcery 9
4 Destructive Force
1 Red Sun's Zenith
4 Slagstorm
2 Furyborn Hellkite
4 Kuldotha Phoenix
Artifacts 18
4 Manalith
2 Sphere of the Suns
4 Everflowing Chalice
1 Mox Opal
3 Tumble Magnet
4 Temple Bell
20 Mountains
Goal being to use chandra's -2 ability and twincast Destructive Force while still having enough mana artifacts to not cripple yourself. Think it's worth trying to make it work?
I see an obvious problem where you have Furyborn Hellkite instead of Inferno Titan.
Seriously, a single D-Force will cripple someone hard enough if you have a Titan or Chandra 3.0 on the board. No need to waste the effort and resources to double the effect, seeing how you'll be killing your creatures in the end. Why not just cripple with a massive dude in play?
Retired Player