Introduction
This thread covers Grixis Midrange and Energy decks. This archetype builds around powerful and card advantageous creatures and spells. Note that this thread is for a midrange deck. There are decks that have ~5 creatures that are called Grixis Energy, which I consider Grixis Control and should be discussed in our UBx Control thread. Decklists that this thread applies to would more likely have over 10 to 20+ creatures.
After the bannings targeting Temur Energy and Ramunap Red, these decks built on some remaining energy cards and other powerful spells and creatures to be competitive in the new meta. Without a Standard Pro Tour to establish the meta, it is hard to discern the relative strengths of these decks. But Brennan Decandio took a version to second place in the first SCG Open (Team Constructed) and they have been placing in other tournaments, so it is clear that these decks are a strong competitive choice.
This is a new archetype, so try this if:
You like powerful creatures and spells in a very competitive shell with lots of card advantage.
You like being somewhat creative and enjoy choosing from a superabundance of quality cards.
You can live with your greedy manabase killing you occasionally.
Cards Bold indicates core cards.
Indeterminate Walking Ballista: Pro - can snipe other creatures, can go to dome, can hit planeswalkers, grows by itself; Con - under the curve by itself, expensive activated ability. Possible, but never seen in this archetype.
1 Drop
2 Drop Dusk Legion Zealot: Pro - Cantrip, chan even chump and save life; Con - unimpressive body. Seen in some versions Gifted Aetherborn: Pro - lifelink, deathtouch, cheap, just wins races if not removed; Con - hard to cast T2. Glint-Sleeve Siphoner: Pro - card advantage; Con - fragile. One of the biggest draws to an energy build. Play 4 Kitesail Freebooter: disruption stapled onto an evasive body, but not much of a body. Scrapheap Scrounger: Pro - hits hard, can be recurred; Con - doesn't block. Shielded Aether Thief: Pro - Defends, can produce energy and even draw cards if it survives against an aggressive deck; Con - conditional, can't win the game.
3 Drop Champion of Wits: Pro - card selection, then later card advantage; Con - kind of a durdle at 3. Whirler Virtuoso: Pro - great staller, thopters can even get in some chip damage; Con - not offensive, with less energy, fewer thopters.
4 Drop Gonti, Lord of Luxury: Pro - card advantage; Con - slow, in control matchups, the body can be irrelevant. Hostage Taker - Not particularly synergistic and slow, but so much card advantage! Real wants protection. Ravenous Chupacabra: Just good value! Rekindling Phoenix - Evasive, resilient, powerful, matches up really well with Glorybringer
5 Drop Glorybringer: Pro - haste, evasion, removal on a stick; Con - Heart of Kiran, Fumigate, Rekindling Phoenix. The Scarab God: Midrange mirror breaker, resilient but slow, can take over. One of the main reasons to play this archetype, but not necessarily a 4-of.
6 Drop Noxious Gearhulk: Pro - Card advantage, lifegain, two types for Delirium, menace makes it hard to block; Con - expensive, undersized, vulnerable to artifact removal, probably obsolete with the printing of Ravenous Chupacabra. Torrential Gearhulk Solid value in limited numbers
Removal Battle at the Bridge: Exiling removal with lifegain! But expensive and sorcery speed. maybe an answer for Hazoret, but yuk. Fatal Push: Pro - efficient removal; Con - not good against control or 5+ drops, revolt is not necessarily easy to achieve with this deck which makes it hard to hit 3-4 drops. Harnessed Lightning - With Hub and Attune, an energy build can easily splash red, and play this. Given enough energy, able to kill large creatures. Abrade: Pro - Efficient removal for small creatures at instant speed that also hits artfacts like God Pharaoh's Gift and Heart of Kiran; Con - 4 toughness creatures, can't go to dome or planeswalkers. Cut // Ribbons: Pro - hit up to four toughness creatures, Fireball later; Con - sorcery speed. Harnessed Lightning: Pro - instant speed, can hit creatures of arbitrary size given energy; Con - can't hit dome or planeswalkers, energy may not be available. Hour of Glory: Strong, slow removal. Exiles! Never // Return: Pro - sorcery helps Delirium, hits Planeswalkers, Return can be useful for a body and to get rid of Scrapheap Scrounger or Dread Wanderer; Con - expensive, hard to cast. Vraska's Contempt - powerful, versatile and expensive Walk the Plank - efficient, but a sorcery
Anti-Interaction (there has got to be a better name for this category!) Negate: counters sweepers, removal, draw, enchantments, artifacts, planeswalkers. Good catchall against noncreature decks Spell Pierce: An uptempo Negate, hard to play around
Disruption Duress: strong anti-control card, can get under countermagic or provide information before a potentially risky move. Harsh Scrutiny: Pro - cheap, scry; Con - specialized toward decks that we generally do well against anyway. Lay Bare the Heart: Pro - gets rid of many things you really care about, can clear path or draw counter to let you resolve what you really want to; Con - can be a bad topdeck. Often in sideboards to bring in against control and combo. Dispossess: Pro - can hit all copies of Marvel or Torrential Gearhulk, whether in hand or not; Con - Only hits artifacts. Tempo hit. Card disadvantage if they don't have any in hand. Can be awful to draw in multiples. Lost Legacy: Pro - can hit all copies, whether in hand or not; Con - Not hitting artifacts is a big drawback as you really want to be able to name Torrential Gearhulk. Tempo hit. Card disadvantage if they don't have any in hand.
Specialized Hate Sorcerous Spyglass: potential hate that shows opponent's hand, could be powerful
Misc Artifacts Aethersphere Harvester: Pro - Lifelink, Evasion, big butt, can't be targeted by unrevolted Push;Con - Requires another creature to crew.
Sweepers Golden Demise Yahenni's Expertise: Pro - Efficient; Con - not particularly useful against current Tier 1 decks. Hour of Devastation: Pro - deals with indestructible, up to 5 toughness, planeswalkers; Con - .
Aether Hub: Pro - Energy, fixing; Con - inconsistent color source. Canyon Slough: Pro - Fixing, helps Dragonskull Summit and Drowned Catacomb, can mitigate flood; Con - always tapped. Dragonskull Summit: Pro - Great fixing late; Con - needs typed land on battlefield to be untapped. Drowned Catacomb: Pro - Great fixing early; Con - not great topdecked. Evolving Wilds: Pro - Allows better Pushes, improves fixing; Con - comes into play tapped. Field of Ruins Fetid Heath: Pro - Fixing, helps Dragonskull Summit and Drowned Catacomb, can mitigate flood; Con - always tapped. Highland Lake: Always tapped, but what are we doing on turn 1 anyway? Pray for good enemy color duals in Dominaria. Spirebluff Canal: Pro - Great fixing early; Con - not great topdecked.
Great to see the start of a primer. Whilst looking for a shell to play Rekindling Phoenix i've been testing with a Grixis Energy deck as a soup of my new Jund Midrange and my ex Sultai Energy decks. Just taking the best cards from both seems like a good idea.
I'm not sure what I like better yet but i'll sure be following this thread too.
It seems to be a one-of in the sideboard of some of these decks. I've been happy with it in the past in my 4-color concoctions. I wonder whether Angrath is better because he's cheaper. Flipping a counterspell or off the top isn't the greatest. But a Carnage Tyrant would be cool.
Great to see this primer introduced. I’m especially interested in the sideboard which has yet to be filled out with any detail.
Interesting that there seems to be a core of cards that repeatedly appear: magna spray, duress, negate, confiscation coup, chandra’s defeat, aethersphere harvester, all of which have obvious purpose.
However, there is a lot of variety in sideboard choices.
Pilots clearly differ upon whether they prefer to include disruption, card draw, finishers, sweepers, enchantment removal or more removal in their last few sideboard choices. I suppose this is a positive sign as it suggests a broad and healthy meta. At the same time it makes working out a definitive 15 cards nigh on impossible.
All I’ve been able to do so far is work out a few choices that have not worked for me.
Search for azcanta is one example. Too often in my build after flipping it reveals only lands and critters. Though I do see that it has value without ever being flipped.
As sweepers, Yahenni’s expertise and sweltering suns have both failed to impress. Which is not to say that Bontu’s or Hour of Devastation is perfect, but they do feel more useful. Not sure about golden demise yet either. I do feel that a sweeper would be useful as I sometimes feel overwhelmed by the faster decks. Any views?
But I'm having problems with the sideboard since I haven't been able to participate in any events since last bannings. I'm entering a small tournament this Saturday so any help would be really appreciated:
Hey guys, I think that I'm brilliant and insightful. But the reality is that I created this primer for a deck that I haven't played because I thought it needed to exist. I would be happy to aggregate information for inclusion in the primer or pass stewardship of this thread to someone who is playing the deck.
So that is what I been playing and having great succes.
The deck has 18 Red sources, 18 Black sources and 14 Blue sources, so we basically can cast all of our spells 90% of the time (by Karsten analysis). We play 9 "basics" so 8 of our land can enter untap. I prefer playing Canyon over Fetid because of the Phoenix and the Chandras on 4.
Honestly I think Phoenix is too good not to play it, he force Contempt so Scarab God can run free.
-2 Fatal Push
-2 Magma Spray
-4 Harness Lightning
-2 Whirler Virtuoso (If Approach don't play Scarab God I generally take 1 Virtuoso and 1 Contempt out, leaving 2 Contempt for Cats)
+3 Duress
+3 Negate
+2 Glimmer of Genius
+1 Angrath, the Flame-Chained
+1 Nicol-Bolas, God-Pharaoh
So, I am not playing this deck but I did play against it last FNM and last Standard Showdown. AT the SS event I won 2-0 because this deck has too many lands that come in to play tapped so by the time my opp got to 5 mana he was stalled on each of his turns but his land coming into play tapped so I managed to beat him down.
I was playing a R/W aggro deck and when he cast Siphoner I killed it, then the only cards he played in one game were 2 Vraska's Contempts on two of my creatures and I managed to beat him with the other creatures.
Anyway, my point is that this deck needs more mass removal spells such as Hour of devastation main deck or find some way to get better mana using lands or using some artifacts that generate mana.
Also I think that Chandra is very useful even against red aggro decks and shouldn't be taken out after the first game, but Vraska's contempt is a bit too slow against aggro so it's better to have lower casting cost removal spells as a one on one, or more mass removal spells such as Hour of devastation. I think duress and negate are a lot more useful against aggro decks than 4 casting cost removal spells.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"May he who is without mana cast the first spell!"
Check out my Youtube channel where I upload MTG content videos twice a week!
I feel those tapped lands really slow down the deck quite a bit. Fun deck, but it can be very frustrating to me. It's probably just me who sucks though since the deck is performing so well in general.
Also I think this deck needs search for azcanta main deck, at least 3 as well as three magma sprays or pushes.
Not sure that whirler virtuoso is needed at all since the deck plays like a control deck in the first few turns and doesn't want small creatures except for siphoner, after that the next creatures should be the 5 casting cost ones.
Siphoner also works great with search for azcanta to help you get to those answers faster. Of course you don't have to flip search and can keep it online for most of the game, if you need the extra mana then you can flip it.
Looks legit, as I said Search for azcanta is a must for this deck since it's a control deck and I'd probably also play a couple of Negates main board, but I guess having negates in the sideboard and duress is also what I said a couple of days ago.
It is very important to use duress and remove dangerous cards that are not creatures since you don't have many answers to them once they hit the board such as planeswalkers.
I'm not a big fan of whirler virtuoso main deck in this build at all, I'd rather play Gonti main deck since it is a lot stronger or even play more spells instead.
I know nothing. I'm just transferring information.
That said, I understand that Mono-R is the tier 1 deck at the moment. The Whirlers could be defensive, guaranteeing 2 bodies, one of which can appear at instant speed. A card or 2 via Siphoner isn't bad either. I've played Gonti against mono-R and just been overrun.
I’m with Hoser. The mid-range version of this deck has 18 or 19 creatures. That’s too many to get best use out of search for azcanta once flipped.
Negate and duress are for against mid-range and control. Cheap creatures and removal are for enabling the deck to survive until we can clear early threats and drop a Phoenix. A cheap sweeper like sweltering suns helps here if you have space in the board.
Forgive me for my born again newbness but just getting back into Magic after a couple year break and am very interested in this deck. Was looking at something like what Carroll used at the SCG Invitationals recently
I have fiddled with it a bit and swapped the Maindeck Dark Intimations for an Angrath, the Flame-Chained. It feels fine doing a solitaire test and I feel I have a good idea of what it's supposed to start like. The sideboard though feels a lil weird and would making the sideboard more controllish with stuff hoser has up there like Search and Supreme Will be alright?
Like I said before sorry if I am too born-again newb but trying to get this right.
Dropping Whirler virtuoso is a heated debate, a lot of players say it's vital because it can chump block Hazoret decks (since you can create the token at instant speed)or that it fuels Glint-sleeve siphoner (without whirler it becomes weaker), but I can understand perfectly why sometimes it becomes an awful top deck.
Anyways, I found this tournament report in /spikes and felt it was a good reading. I'm not playing any rekindling phoenix right now but hopefully I'll get a set eventually, but going by some 5-0 lists it's not the best card in the deck, yet maybe because of it we need to pack a minimum of 3 Vraska's contempt.
I've been having a lot of success lately with my Grixis Energy deck, going undefeated in several FNMs and Standard Showdowns and taking 3rd place in a 48 person PPTQ. My version is trying to be proactive, with a higher creature count than I've been seeing in most other versions. In particular, I love the removal-on-a-stick creatures like Ravenous Chupacabra and my favorite win condition, Glorybringer. These put you up +2 on creatures vs your opponents and allows you to free up removal slots for blue counters and card draw.
I've had good results in mirror matches and against Gift, Constrictor, UB Control, among others. I've been less successful against Hazoret aggro decks like mono-red and Mardu. The biggest issue I've had with aggro decks is not hitting land drops on curve, and especially not having double red for Chandra and Glorybringer. To help fix this I moved one Gearhulk and on Glimmer to the sideboard, increased my land count to 26, adding more red producing lands, adding Magma Spray. I also added Hour of Devestation to the sideboard as an emergency reset against creature-heavy decks. I'm strongly considering adding 1 or 2 more Sprays instead of Fatal Push, which seems weak in the current meta. I may also add one more Hour if Crested Sunmare starts showing up more, as it is the perfect answer. Lastly, I may try one Angrath, the Flame-Chained, just to see how it goes.
Notes:
Glint-Sleeve Siphoner: usually eats removal, you pretty much win if it goes unchecked. Sometimes cut one or two against more aggressive decks as it's a poor blocker, and you want to preserve your life total more than you want to draw cards. Whirler Virtuouso: Fantastic against mono-red and other small creature decks. Sometime cut 2 for Dreamstealer vs midrange and control decks where you want to attack their hand. Ravenous Chupacabra: Fantastic at building a board advantage, comes out vs Control. Glorybringer: my favorite Standard card, I never take this out. I prefer it over Phoenix because it has an immediate impact. The Scarab God: the single strongest card in Standard, but sometimes overvalued. I often shave one copy vs decks with lots of exile effects. It's too expensive to have it exiled with no activation. I often hold it back until the late game when I have counter back ups, have run down my opponents removal or have enough lands to immediately activate. Chandra, Torch of Defiance: often comes out on the draw vs creature decks Torrential Gearhulk and [Card]Glimmer of Genius]: Comes out vs aggro decks, add in the extra copies vs Control. Deadeye Tracker: I think this is the absolute best card vs Gift decks. You can target all their relevant spells while gaining card advantage and filtering. Also good vs Control.
To answer the questions in the previous post, Profane Procession is an absolute beating vs our deck. The only real answers are to hold up counters vs BW decks, especially post sideboard. Enchantments in general are pretty hard to deal with. I would also be very wary of Ixalan's Binding out of white decks. Carnage Tyrant is best answered with big blockers: Gearhulk, God, God tokens. If you run into it a lot, you could also consider Gifted Aetherborn.
Thanks for the very detailed report moodles. Your list looks very cool!
What would you recommend swapping in if I only have 1 Scarab god, 1 gearhulk and no Chandra?
Use 4 glorybringers, one or two gonti and some more removal or card draw?
I'm on the verge between running sultai snake or this deck at my next FNM (it's on wednesdays at my local store) My brain is saying go Grixis because I got my ass handed to me three fnm's in a row with golgari snake. The snake deck is just my deck hehe, but I suck.
I really like both decks a lot, I just feel the mana is a lot slower in Grixis. The snake deck is very fast and explosive so it's a huge shift in gears playing with the grixis deck.
I like Gonti a lot, and I'd also say take a look at Angrath.
Mana is the number 1 issue with this deck. I tend to favor land heavy hands vs land light ones. In your early turns, you will be more defensive, removing your opponents creatures or setting up blockers like Whirler. You don't really start to turn the corner until you can start dropping your larger threats. This build is a little less controlling, and a little more pro-active, so hopefully you can start to shift gears quicker than with some of the other builds I've seen.
@moodles: Can you explain why you don't play Phoenix? I think the card is really strong and is often a 2x1 or it Vraska's Contempt.
Also, Magma Spray for me have been the MVP of the deck, is really good in this meta, I really considering cutting Fatal Push for 2 more Spray in the main, but with Snake been more prevalent I not sure.
_______________________________
After playing more I made a couple of change to my previous list
To answer the questions in the previous post, Profane Procession is an absolute beating vs our deck. The only real answers are to hold up counters vs BW decks, especially post sideboard. Enchantments in general are pretty hard to deal with. I would also be very wary of Ixalan's Binding out of white decks. Carnage Tyrant is best answered with big blockers: Gearhulk, God, God tokens. If you run into it a lot, you could also consider Gifted Aetherborn.
Just on the subject of profane procession, two options worth mentioning are consign/oblivion and rivers rebuke. Obviously both of these will only work before procession flips.
Once it has become a land, field of ruin is probably the main tool open to us. I have seen a couple of deck lists with a single field in the side.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Introduction
This thread covers Grixis Midrange and Energy decks. This archetype builds around powerful and card advantageous creatures and spells. Note that this thread is for a midrange deck. There are decks that have ~5 creatures that are called Grixis Energy, which I consider Grixis Control and should be discussed in our UBx Control thread. Decklists that this thread applies to would more likely have over 10 to 20+ creatures.
After the bannings targeting Temur Energy and Ramunap Red, these decks built on some remaining energy cards and other powerful spells and creatures to be competitive in the new meta. Without a Standard Pro Tour to establish the meta, it is hard to discern the relative strengths of these decks. But Brennan Decandio took a version to second place in the first SCG Open (Team Constructed) and they have been placing in other tournaments, so it is clear that these decks are a strong competitive choice.
This is a new archetype, so try this if:
Cards
Bold indicates core cards.
Walking Ballista: Pro - can snipe other creatures, can go to dome, can hit planeswalkers, grows by itself; Con - under the curve by itself, expensive activated ability. Possible, but never seen in this archetype.
1 Drop
2 Drop
Dusk Legion Zealot: Pro - Cantrip, chan even chump and save life; Con - unimpressive body. Seen in some versions
Gifted Aetherborn: Pro - lifelink, deathtouch, cheap, just wins races if not removed; Con - hard to cast T2.
Glint-Sleeve Siphoner: Pro - card advantage; Con - fragile. One of the biggest draws to an energy build. Play 4
Kitesail Freebooter: disruption stapled onto an evasive body, but not much of a body.
Scrapheap Scrounger: Pro - hits hard, can be recurred; Con - doesn't block.
Shielded Aether Thief: Pro - Defends, can produce energy and even draw cards if it survives against an aggressive deck; Con - conditional, can't win the game.
3 Drop
Champion of Wits: Pro - card selection, then later card advantage; Con - kind of a durdle at 3.
Whirler Virtuoso: Pro - great staller, thopters can even get in some chip damage; Con - not offensive, with less energy, fewer thopters.
4 Drop
Gonti, Lord of Luxury: Pro - card advantage; Con - slow, in control matchups, the body can be irrelevant.
Hostage Taker - Not particularly synergistic and slow, but so much card advantage! Real wants protection.
Ravenous Chupacabra: Just good value!
Rekindling Phoenix - Evasive, resilient, powerful, matches up really well with Glorybringer
5 Drop
Glorybringer: Pro - haste, evasion, removal on a stick; Con - Heart of Kiran, Fumigate, Rekindling Phoenix.
The Scarab God: Midrange mirror breaker, resilient but slow, can take over. One of the main reasons to play this archetype, but not necessarily a 4-of.
6 Drop
Noxious Gearhulk: Pro - Card advantage, lifegain, two types for Delirium, menace makes it hard to block; Con - expensive, undersized, vulnerable to artifact removal, probably obsolete with the printing of Ravenous Chupacabra.
Torrential Gearhulk Solid value in limited numbers
Battle at the Bridge: Exiling removal with lifegain! But expensive and sorcery speed. maybe an answer for Hazoret, but yuk.
Fatal Push: Pro - efficient removal; Con - not good against control or 5+ drops, revolt is not necessarily easy to achieve with this deck which makes it hard to hit 3-4 drops.
Harnessed Lightning - With Hub and Attune, an energy build can easily splash red, and play this. Given enough energy, able to kill large creatures.
Abrade: Pro - Efficient removal for small creatures at instant speed that also hits artfacts like God Pharaoh's Gift and Heart of Kiran; Con - 4 toughness creatures, can't go to dome or planeswalkers.
Cut // Ribbons: Pro - hit up to four toughness creatures, Fireball later; Con - sorcery speed.
Harnessed Lightning: Pro - instant speed, can hit creatures of arbitrary size given energy; Con - can't hit dome or planeswalkers, energy may not be available.
Hour of Glory: Strong, slow removal. Exiles!
Never // Return: Pro - sorcery helps Delirium, hits Planeswalkers, Return can be useful for a body and to get rid of Scrapheap Scrounger or Dread Wanderer; Con - expensive, hard to cast.
Vraska's Contempt - powerful, versatile and expensive
Walk the Plank - efficient, but a sorcery
Draw, Tutor, Scry
Arguel's Blood Fast - drawing cards is good, right?
Search for Azcanta - Powerful in the late game, but do we have enough targets?
Vance's Blasting Cannon - Seems powerful, but exile three lands in a row
Anti-Interaction (there has got to be a better name for this category!)
Negate: counters sweepers, removal, draw, enchantments, artifacts, planeswalkers. Good catchall against noncreature decks
Spell Pierce: An uptempo Negate, hard to play around
Disruption
Duress: strong anti-control card, can get under countermagic or provide information before a potentially risky move.
Harsh Scrutiny: Pro - cheap, scry; Con - specialized toward decks that we generally do well against anyway.
Lay Bare the Heart: Pro - gets rid of many things you really care about, can clear path or draw counter to let you resolve what you really want to; Con - can be a bad topdeck. Often in sideboards to bring in against control and combo.
Dispossess: Pro - can hit all copies of
Marvel orTorrential Gearhulk, whether in hand or not; Con - Only hits artifacts. Tempo hit. Card disadvantage if they don't have any in hand. Can be awful to draw in multiples.Lost Legacy: Pro - can hit all copies, whether in hand or not; Con - Not hitting artifacts is a big drawback as you really want to be able to name Torrential Gearhulk. Tempo hit. Card disadvantage if they don't have any in hand.
Specialized Hate
Sorcerous Spyglass: potential hate that shows opponent's hand, could be powerful
Misc Artifacts
Aethersphere Harvester: Pro - Lifelink, Evasion, big butt, can't be targeted by unrevolted Push;Con - Requires another creature to crew.
Sweepers
Golden Demise
Yahenni's Expertise: Pro - Efficient; Con - not particularly useful against current Tier 1 decks.
Hour of Devastation: Pro - deals with indestructible, up to 5 toughness, planeswalkers; Con - .
Planeswalkers
Chandra, Torch of Defiance: Pro - fantastic; Con - Glorybringer, Heart of Kiran
Liliana, Death's Majesty: Pro - powerful, can help with delirium; Con - Expensive, Heart of Kiran, Glorybringer, Disallow.
Angrath, the Flame-Chained: Pro - Card advantage can hurt control decks; Con - expensive
Nicol Bolas, God-Pharaoh: Pro - powerful; Con - slow.
[/cards]
Canyon Slough: Pro - Fixing, helps Dragonskull Summit and Drowned Catacomb, can mitigate flood; Con - always tapped.
Dragonskull Summit: Pro - Great fixing late; Con - needs typed land on battlefield to be untapped.
Drowned Catacomb: Pro - Great fixing early; Con - not great topdecked.
Evolving Wilds: Pro - Allows better Pushes, improves fixing; Con - comes into play tapped.
Field of Ruins
Fetid Heath: Pro - Fixing, helps Dragonskull Summit and Drowned Catacomb, can mitigate flood; Con - always tapped.
Highland Lake: Always tapped, but what are we doing on turn 1 anyway? Pray for good enemy color duals in Dominaria.
Spirebluff Canal: Pro - Great fixing early; Con - not great topdecked.
Sideboarding
Decklists
Articles, Videos, Etc.
RNA Standard: Grixis Midrange, Jund Deathwhirler, Sultai Vannifar
GRN Standard: Red Midrange, Mono-Blue Tempo, Wr Aggro, Gruul Experimental Dinosaurs, Sultai Midrange, Jeskai Midrange
Modern: Bant Spirits
Forcing a single archetype in all formats: too many colors, bad mana.
I'm not sure what I like better yet but i'll sure be following this thread too.
Modern: WUBRG Humans - GBW Traverse - GWU Knightfall - GRW Bushwhacker Zoo -
C Long Live Eldrazi C
RNA Standard: Grixis Midrange, Jund Deathwhirler, Sultai Vannifar
GRN Standard: Red Midrange, Mono-Blue Tempo, Wr Aggro, Gruul Experimental Dinosaurs, Sultai Midrange, Jeskai Midrange
Modern: Bant Spirits
Forcing a single archetype in all formats: too many colors, bad mana.
Interesting that there seems to be a core of cards that repeatedly appear: magna spray, duress, negate, confiscation coup, chandra’s defeat, aethersphere harvester, all of which have obvious purpose.
However, there is a lot of variety in sideboard choices.
Pilots clearly differ upon whether they prefer to include disruption, card draw, finishers, sweepers, enchantment removal or more removal in their last few sideboard choices. I suppose this is a positive sign as it suggests a broad and healthy meta. At the same time it makes working out a definitive 15 cards nigh on impossible.
All I’ve been able to do so far is work out a few choices that have not worked for me.
Search for azcanta is one example. Too often in my build after flipping it reveals only lands and critters. Though I do see that it has value without ever being flipped.
As sweepers, Yahenni’s expertise and sweltering suns have both failed to impress. Which is not to say that Bontu’s or Hour of Devastation is perfect, but they do feel more useful. Not sure about golden demise yet either. I do feel that a sweeper would be useful as I sometimes feel overwhelmed by the faster decks. Any views?
4x Aether Hub
2x Canyon Slough
4x Dragonskull Summit
4x Drowned Catacomb
3x Fetid Pools
2x Island
1x Mountain
4x Spirebluff Canal
1x Swamp
2x Abrade
2x Essence Scatter
3x Fatal Push
1x Glimmer of Genius
4x Harnessed Lightning
1x Negate
2x Supreme Will
2x Vraska's Contempt
2x Chandra, Torch of Defiance
Creatures 16
4x Glint-Sleeve Siphoner
2x Glorybringer
1x Gonti, Lord of Luxury
1x Ravenous Chupacabra
2x The Scarab God
2x Torrential Gearhulk
4x Whirler Virtuoso
But I'm having problems with the sideboard since I haven't been able to participate in any events since last bannings. I'm entering a small tournament this Saturday so any help would be really appreciated:
1x Abrade
1x Angrath, the Flame-Chained
2x Deadeye Tracker
1x Dispossess
2x Duress
2x Magma Spray
2x Negate
2x Search for Azcanta
1x Hour of Devastation
1x Sweltering Suns
Other cards I'm considering are:
RNA Standard: Grixis Midrange, Jund Deathwhirler, Sultai Vannifar
GRN Standard: Red Midrange, Mono-Blue Tempo, Wr Aggro, Gruul Experimental Dinosaurs, Sultai Midrange, Jeskai Midrange
Modern: Bant Spirits
Forcing a single archetype in all formats: too many colors, bad mana.
4 Whirler Virtuoso
4 Glint-Sleeve Siphoner
3 The Scarab God
Land
1 Island
2 Mountain
1 Swamp
4 Spirebluff Canal
4 Aether Hub
4 Fetid Pools
4 Canyon Slough
4 Dragonskull Summit
3 Drowned Catacomb
2 Torrential Gearhulk
Instant
2 Magma Spray
4 Harnessed Lightning
2 Glimmer of Genius
2 Fatal Push
4 Vraska's Contempt
Sorcery
3 Doomfall
Planeswalker
3 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
2 Arguel's Blood Fast
3 Negate
2 Abrade
2 Chandra's Defeat
2 Fiery Cannonade
3 Duress
1 Nicol Bolas, God-Pharaoh
So that is what I been playing and having great succes.
The deck has 18 Red sources, 18 Black sources and 14 Blue sources, so we basically can cast all of our spells 90% of the time (by Karsten analysis). We play 9 "basics" so 8 of our land can enter untap. I prefer playing Canyon over Fetid because of the Phoenix and the Chandras on 4.
Honestly I think Phoenix is too good not to play it, he force Contempt so Scarab God can run free.
Generally I sideboard like:
Vs. Mono R.
-2 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
-3 Glint-Sleeve Siphoner
+1 Fatal Push
+1 Abrade
+1 Sweltering Suns
+1 Vraska's Contempt
+1 Hour of Devastation
Vs. U/B/x Control & Approach:
-2 Fatal Push
-2 Magma Spray
-4 Harness Lightning
-2 Whirler Virtuoso (If Approach don't play Scarab God I generally take 1 Virtuoso and 1 Contempt out, leaving 2 Contempt for Cats)
+3 Duress
+3 Negate
+2 Glimmer of Genius
+1 Angrath, the Flame-Chained
+1 Nicol-Bolas, God-Pharaoh
I was playing a R/W aggro deck and when he cast Siphoner I killed it, then the only cards he played in one game were 2 Vraska's Contempts on two of my creatures and I managed to beat him with the other creatures.
Anyway, my point is that this deck needs more mass removal spells such as Hour of devastation main deck or find some way to get better mana using lands or using some artifacts that generate mana.
Also I think that Chandra is very useful even against red aggro decks and shouldn't be taken out after the first game, but Vraska's contempt is a bit too slow against aggro so it's better to have lower casting cost removal spells as a one on one, or more mass removal spells such as Hour of devastation. I think duress and negate are a lot more useful against aggro decks than 4 casting cost removal spells.
Check out my Youtube channel where I upload MTG content videos twice a week!
Mtg Lifestyle
Not sure that whirler virtuoso is needed at all since the deck plays like a control deck in the first few turns and doesn't want small creatures except for siphoner, after that the next creatures should be the 5 casting cost ones.
Siphoner also works great with search for azcanta to help you get to those answers faster. Of course you don't have to flip search and can keep it online for most of the game, if you need the extra mana then you can flip it.
Check out my Youtube channel where I upload MTG content videos twice a week!
Mtg Lifestyle
Contempt is the answer for Hazoret.
2 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
Creatures
4 Glint-Sleeve Siphoner
2 The Scarab God
2 Torrential Gearhulk
4 Whirler Virtuoso
Spells
2 Abrade
2 Essence Scatter
2 Fatal Push
4 Harnessed Lightning
2 Magma Spray
2 Supreme Will
4 Vraska's Contempt
2 Search for Azcanta
4 Aether Hub
3 Canyon Slough
3 Dragonskull Summit
3 Drowned Catacomb
3 Fetid Pools
2 Island
2 Mountain
4 Spirebluff Canal
2 Swamp
1 Essence Scatter
2 Magma Spray
2 Chandra's Defeat
2 Duress
2 Glimmer of Genius
1 Hour of Devastation
1 Liliana, Death's Majesty
4 Negate
RNA Standard: Grixis Midrange, Jund Deathwhirler, Sultai Vannifar
GRN Standard: Red Midrange, Mono-Blue Tempo, Wr Aggro, Gruul Experimental Dinosaurs, Sultai Midrange, Jeskai Midrange
Modern: Bant Spirits
Forcing a single archetype in all formats: too many colors, bad mana.
Looks legit, as I said Search for azcanta is a must for this deck since it's a control deck and I'd probably also play a couple of Negates main board, but I guess having negates in the sideboard and duress is also what I said a couple of days ago.
It is very important to use duress and remove dangerous cards that are not creatures since you don't have many answers to them once they hit the board such as planeswalkers.
I'm not a big fan of whirler virtuoso main deck in this build at all, I'd rather play Gonti main deck since it is a lot stronger or even play more spells instead.
Check out my Youtube channel where I upload MTG content videos twice a week!
Mtg Lifestyle
That said, I understand that Mono-R is the tier 1 deck at the moment. The Whirlers could be defensive, guaranteeing 2 bodies, one of which can appear at instant speed. A card or 2 via Siphoner isn't bad either. I've played Gonti against mono-R and just been overrun.
RNA Standard: Grixis Midrange, Jund Deathwhirler, Sultai Vannifar
GRN Standard: Red Midrange, Mono-Blue Tempo, Wr Aggro, Gruul Experimental Dinosaurs, Sultai Midrange, Jeskai Midrange
Modern: Bant Spirits
Forcing a single archetype in all formats: too many colors, bad mana.
Negate and duress are for against mid-range and control. Cheap creatures and removal are for enabling the deck to survive until we can clear early threats and drop a Phoenix. A cheap sweeper like sweltering suns helps here if you have space in the board.
This was his deck at the one last week:
4 Glint-Sleeve Siphoner
3 Glorybringer
4 Rekindling Phoenix
4 Whirler Virtuoso
1 Gonti, Lord of Luxury
2 The Scarab God
2 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
2 Mountain
2 Swamp
4 Aether Hub
4 Canyon Slough
4 Dragonskull Summit
3 Drowned Catacomb
3 Fetid Pools
4 Spirebluff Canal
3 Fatal Push
4 Harnessed Lightning
3 Vraska's Contempt
1 Cut
1 Dark Intimations
2 Chandra's Defeat
2 Moment of Craving
2 Negate
1 Vraska's Contempt
1 Gonti, Lord of Luxury
1 Angrath, the Flame-Chained
1 Nicol Bolas, God-Pharaoh
3 Duress
1 Hour of Devastation
1 River's Rebuke
I have fiddled with it a bit and swapped the Maindeck Dark Intimations for an Angrath, the Flame-Chained. It feels fine doing a solitaire test and I feel I have a good idea of what it's supposed to start like. The sideboard though feels a lil weird and would making the sideboard more controllish with stuff hoser has up there like Search and Supreme Will be alright?
Like I said before sorry if I am too born-again newb but trying to get this right.
Standard
WBGWBGABZAN AGGROWBGWBG
Anyways, I found this tournament report in /spikes and felt it was a good reading. I'm not playing any rekindling phoenix right now but hopefully I'll get a set eventually, but going by some 5-0 lists it's not the best card in the deck, yet maybe because of it we need to pack a minimum of 3 Vraska's contempt.
4 Glint-Sleeve Siphoner
4 Whirler Virtuoso
2 Ravenous Chupacabra
3 Glorybringer
2 The Scarab God
1 Torrential Gearhulk
Spells (17)
1 Magma Spray
2 Fatal Push
3 Harnessed Lightning
2 Abrade
1 Search for Azcanta
2 Essence Scatter
2 Supreme Will
1 Glimmer of Genius
3 Vraska's Contempt
1 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
Lands (26)
4 Spirebluff Canal
3 Drowned Catacomb
3 Fetid Pools
4 Dragonskull Summit
3 Canyon Slough
1 Island
1 Mountain
2 Swamp
4 Aether Hub
1 Field of Ruin
2 Dreamstealer
2 Negate
2 Duress
1 Torrential Gearhulk
1 Glimmer of Genius
2 Deadeye Tracker
1 Moment of Craving
1 Chandra's Defeat
1 Abrade
1 Magma Spray
1 Hour of Devastation
I've had good results in mirror matches and against Gift, Constrictor, UB Control, among others. I've been less successful against Hazoret aggro decks like mono-red and Mardu. The biggest issue I've had with aggro decks is not hitting land drops on curve, and especially not having double red for Chandra and Glorybringer. To help fix this I moved one Gearhulk and on Glimmer to the sideboard, increased my land count to 26, adding more red producing lands, adding Magma Spray. I also added Hour of Devestation to the sideboard as an emergency reset against creature-heavy decks. I'm strongly considering adding 1 or 2 more Sprays instead of Fatal Push, which seems weak in the current meta. I may also add one more Hour if Crested Sunmare starts showing up more, as it is the perfect answer. Lastly, I may try one Angrath, the Flame-Chained, just to see how it goes.
Notes:
Glint-Sleeve Siphoner: usually eats removal, you pretty much win if it goes unchecked. Sometimes cut one or two against more aggressive decks as it's a poor blocker, and you want to preserve your life total more than you want to draw cards.
Whirler Virtuouso: Fantastic against mono-red and other small creature decks. Sometime cut 2 for Dreamstealer vs midrange and control decks where you want to attack their hand.
Ravenous Chupacabra: Fantastic at building a board advantage, comes out vs Control.
Glorybringer: my favorite Standard card, I never take this out. I prefer it over Phoenix because it has an immediate impact.
The Scarab God: the single strongest card in Standard, but sometimes overvalued. I often shave one copy vs decks with lots of exile effects. It's too expensive to have it exiled with no activation. I often hold it back until the late game when I have counter back ups, have run down my opponents removal or have enough lands to immediately activate.
Chandra, Torch of Defiance: often comes out on the draw vs creature decks
Torrential Gearhulk and [Card]Glimmer of Genius]: Comes out vs aggro decks, add in the extra copies vs Control.
Deadeye Tracker: I think this is the absolute best card vs Gift decks. You can target all their relevant spells while gaining card advantage and filtering. Also good vs Control.
To answer the questions in the previous post, Profane Procession is an absolute beating vs our deck. The only real answers are to hold up counters vs BW decks, especially post sideboard. Enchantments in general are pretty hard to deal with. I would also be very wary of Ixalan's Binding out of white decks. Carnage Tyrant is best answered with big blockers: Gearhulk, God, God tokens. If you run into it a lot, you could also consider Gifted Aetherborn.
What would you recommend swapping in if I only have 1 Scarab god, 1 gearhulk and no Chandra?
Use 4 glorybringers, one or two gonti and some more removal or card draw?
I'm on the verge between running sultai snake or this deck at my next FNM (it's on wednesdays at my local store) My brain is saying go Grixis because I got my ass handed to me three fnm's in a row with golgari snake. The snake deck is just my deck hehe, but I suck.
I really like both decks a lot, I just feel the mana is a lot slower in Grixis. The snake deck is very fast and explosive so it's a huge shift in gears playing with the grixis deck.
Mana is the number 1 issue with this deck. I tend to favor land heavy hands vs land light ones. In your early turns, you will be more defensive, removing your opponents creatures or setting up blockers like Whirler. You don't really start to turn the corner until you can start dropping your larger threats. This build is a little less controlling, and a little more pro-active, so hopefully you can start to shift gears quicker than with some of the other builds I've seen.
Also, Magma Spray for me have been the MVP of the deck, is really good in this meta, I really considering cutting Fatal Push for 2 more Spray in the main, but with Snake been more prevalent I not sure.
_______________________________
After playing more I made a couple of change to my previous list
4 Whirler Virtuoso
4 Glint-Sleeve Siphoner
3 The Scarab God
Land
1 Island
2 Mountain
1 Swamp
4 Spirebluff Canal
4 Aether Hub
4 Fetid Pools
4 Canyon Slough
4 Dragonskull Summit
3 Drowned Catacomb
2 Torrential Gearhulk
Instant
2 Magma Spray
4 Harnessed Lightning
2 Glimmer of Genius
2 Fatal Push
4 Vraska's Contempt
Sorcery
3 Doomfall
Planeswalker
3 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
2 Arguel's Blood Fast
3 Negate
2 Abrade
2 Chandra's Defeat
2 Fiery Cannonade
3 Duress
1 Nicol Bolas, God-Pharaoh
I have a ppptq coming up this weekend, so all suggestion are welcome.
Thank you for the input. Appreciate it a lot! I'm trying to experiment with Commit // Memory as a 'soft-counter' for Carnage Tyrant and to bounce Profane Procession. Additionally, I'm looking at Vizier of Many Faces and / or Dire Fleet Poisoner as other possible options for tyrant. Lots of Bant Approach and Dino players in my town!
Once it has become a land, field of ruin is probably the main tool open to us. I have seen a couple of deck lists with a single field in the side.