A new standard season, and with Halloween close, what better time to eat some brains.
Overview
This decks utilizes the powerful Haunted Dead / Prized Amalgam combo, to generate an undying horde of zombies. Said undying zombies can be used to flip Voldaren Pariah to wipe the opponents board, just to bring the zombies back again. This deck is capable to untap with 9 power and 4 bodies on as early as turn 3, but can also play the longer grindier matchup, where you use cryptbreaker and madness spells to generate card advantage.
History
The B/U zombies deck made a splash at pro tour Eldritch Moon to feast on the Bant CoCo decks, however the teams that brought the deck read the meta wrong and it did not preform very well. Running the powerful Prized Amalgam / Hunted Dead combo to generate an undying horde of zombies while utilizing Voldaren Pariah to clear the board of threats and Cryptbreaker both as an enabler and cardadvantage machine. Main Reason for the blue splash was Jace, Vryn's Prodigy since it gave the deck an instantspeed discardoutlet, and some sideboard options with negates and Dragonlord Silumgard.
The deck remained a decent deck throughout the standard period, but it kept evolving and at the starcity game invitational Eric Hawkings piloted a zombie list to first seed, utlilizing Emerge shenanigans with Kozilek's Return in the side (with no red mana to cast it).
Then Kaladesh happened
While still being a powerful deck with sweet synergies it has gotten left in the shadow of the Emerge Decks, as seen at the Star City Indianapolis. And the deck it was built to beat rotated out, as well as losing baby jace some renewal had to be done. Kaladesh gave us some gifts in the form of another undying critter, a bigger tormenting voice and a looter scooter. These changes makes us want to splash red instead of blue, allowing us to play some Zombie Madness.
21 Players brought the B/R Zombie madness deck to Pro Tour Kaladesh, and 15 of them made day two, giving the deck a 70,4% Conversion Rate (Note day one did also include 3 rounds of booster draft). Even though deck missed top 8, its overall performance was better than most of the other big decks at the PT, so that's something atleast:)
At GP Providence B/R Zombie madness made a good showing, being tied with B/G Delirium for the 3rd biggest archetype in day 2.
The New Toys
Smuggler's Copter - Easy replacement for Baby Jace, Cryptbreaker, and haunted dead's spirit friend crews it very easily.
Cathartic Reunion - Super enabler, helps us getting Haunted deads in the grave while drawing us tonnes of cards.
Unlicensed Disintegration - with the inclusion of copter and scoundrel a murder with upside seems decent, helps the race while dealing with problem critters.
Key to the City - another instantspeed discardoutlet, that helps getting damage through and can draw us cards.
Honorable mention
Minister of Inquiries - Great enabler allowing you to mill 6 cards over 2 turns for only U, crews the copter like a boss as well.
Tournament Results
Pro Tour Kaladesh: Brandon Ayers, 8-2
GP Providence: Jackie Wang Top 4, seeded 2nd after swiss rounds. Ryan Leverone 40th place, Zan Syed 43rd place, Manuel Perez 53rd.
I had been kicking around different zombie decks, and for some reason, always liked Noosegraf Mob. I'm not sure why, but I wanted to make it work. Then I found Fabrication Module and Decoction Module. Trying a bit to work around it, and hopefully build up a fair wall of zombies, I have this pile currently in my notebook.
This should definitely at least be in the established section. B/R//Grixis Madness/Zombies had a huge presence at the PT and Grixis Emerge(basically grixis zombies) took 2nd place and would have won week 1 open from SCG had he not had horrible draws. Who cares if it didn't make top 8. You had a bunch of combo and control decks which prey naturally on a mid rangey deck like zombies, and it still did well.
In order to get the explosive draws, you really need Prized Amalgam furthermore I dont think liliana is playable anymore due to Smuggler's Copter:/ I also dont like Sorcery speed removal anymore because of said Copter. And i think that Noosegraft Mob, the modules takes too much space, doesn't win you on the spot, and is very very slow.
I have been playing a pretty stock list of BR zombies, and I am having a really hard time with the GB delirium deck. There creatures are just bigger and when ishkanah comes down I can't get through to do any dmg at all. Any advice? am i supposed to be trying to play the long game or should I try to be more aggressive
I haven't looked at a BR list, but I play a UR list. I don't have much trouble with Delirium decks since I'm mostly flying zombies. Ishkanah can be a serious pain, but bringing in Elder Deep-Fiends and Kozilek's Return is a great way to kill out baby spiders and big momma spider. I'm sure you could do something similar with K's Return and Distended Mindbender. If using DM, I'd recommend stacking the triggers so you can strip their hands of Grapple with the Past before letting K's Return fry everything. You don't want her to just come back on the next turn.
I've been pretty happy with the following deck. Wharf Infiltrator is a nuts card. Just don't forget that it's ability can be used with Geier, Cryptbreaker, Haunted Dead, and Sinister Concoction. I'm not too sure about Weaponcraft Enthusiast, but it's a vessel for Voldaren when in a pinch. Although Advance S. might be better.
Having a lot of trouble with GR energy decks, with my above list, but love the deck and do well in other matchups. Anyone else having troubles with GR energy decks or have tips to disrupt their plans?
I've been trying out the Ayers list. It feels to me like the deck is underpowered if you don't get the amalgam going. Even if you do, there are decks that can get bigger creatures out almost as quickly as we can. With an excellent but not perfect hand you're looking at two amalgams and a haunted dead all ready to attack at the beginning of turn four together with a cryptbreaker token. Meanwhile RG can go Servant of the Conduit -> Hydra and follow up with a Verdurous Gearhulk. Dredge can curve a Grim Flayer into a Tireless Tracker into a Mindwrack Demon.
Do we have anything we can do against somebody who curves out like that besides playing out the Pariah? Because sometimes you don't draw the Pariah and sometimes the mana doesn't work out and overall it's a big ask to get it down and transformed by turn four or five. OTOH Ayers ran it to 8-2 in the pro tour so I assume I'm missing something.
I haven't played it myself, but I've seen it in action a bit and when I saw it in play, it was tearing through the library pretty quick which gives you a better chance to see the Pariah.
Hi guys and gals. I've been testing this deck (B/R madness) and loving it so far. I tried the U/B version, which is sweet, but I found my self playing in a more "slow" pace.
I will try to give my 2 cents about B/R:
1) Cathartic Reunion is huge! Even thought is sorcery speed (U/B have a draw 2, discard 1, 2U card, instant). One of the main reasons to play B/R for me.
2) Access to more removals: disintegration, Fiery Temper, Axe...
3) I'am using 3 Neonate and wondering about the 4th. Since cryptbreaker is more suitable to the mid and late game, I'll try to use 4 Neonate/3 Cryptbreaker. Neonate can activate the Haunted Dead/Amalgam combo on turn 2 (T1: Neonate. T2: attack with neonate. 2nd land. Discard Haunted. Two lands up.
4) I am using one copy of Eternal Scourge. Combining the Scourge with Scrapheap Scrounger we have an "endless" resource to recast the Scrapheap. And if we fall short of creatures we can just cast the Scourge to block attackers.
Has anyone tried out the BU Zombies list that Steve Rubin played to a 4th place finish at the Columbus SCG Standard Classic on Nov. 13? Thiago Sapporito also played it to a top 16 at GP Santiago.
It looks like it might lose a little explosiveness that the BR list has in favor of a little more control and heavier black commitment with cards that might be slightly favored for the BG Delirium, WU Flash, and Vehicles metagame.
Anyone know the best way to use this sideboard against the top decks?
The Rubin deck looks sweet. It does so much at instant speed that it feels like it's well positioned to run Spell Shrivel in the main deck. It doesn't seem right to me to run a grindy long game deck that more or less scoops to Ishkanah.
I found sinister Concoction to be of great value. Almost instant speed. Kills everything, madness enabler, delirium and send a zombie to the graveyard(with lucky).
I played against RB aggro (0-2), UW Flash (2-1), RWb Vehicles (2-0), RB Aggro (2-1), and GB Delirium (0-2) for a 3-2 record overall. Not bad for the first time out. I'm still feeling out the sideboard process.
Matchup notes: I felt like a favorite against RB Aggro. In the first round I lost a game when he was forced to chump with his copter against my abolisher of bloodlines and then spiked a fiery temper. The second matchup I lost a game when a Bloodhall Priest went nuts and none of my answers showed up despite much digging. Overall I felt like I was usually pulling ahead of them.
GB felt miserable. Liliana eats everything. I think I may have sideboarded wrong when I went away from permission and towards more kill spells--killing their creatures in 1-for-1s eventually leads to death by Ishkanah.
UW was fun and competitive. Having counterspells available in time for the inevitable Gideon is wonderful. Just being able to fight them over permission stuff makes things fun. Grasping through Selfless Spirit is also great. They still have a lot of powerful cards and can roll over you sometimes, though.
The Wharf Infiltrator is nutso. He flat out dominated games if he came out early and didn't get answered. The one time I got to live the dream of Crypt Breaker + Infiltrator + 4 mana for two dudes at a time my opponent just scooped. The downside is that he is quite fragile. Still, I think I might go to 4 infiltrators and 3 copters. He's more evasive than the copter against most decks and doesn't need another creature to be useful.
Are there any good candidates to replace Scrounger? I want to have as many cards as possible that discard for value but the Scrounger has been kind of meh for me.
Are there any good candidates to replace Scrounger? I want to have as many cards as possible that discard for value but the Scrounger has been kind of meh for me.
I'm not super excited to discard cards just for the sake of it. I want cards that get value by discarding other cards and also cards that get value from being discarded. Discarding lands to get some value from mana flooding is only so-so. Turn three copter swing, discard Haunted Dead, Turn four reanimate Haunted Dead pitching two lands... not super exciting.
Maybe it's useful for the thread to have a list breaking down both sides of the transaction.
Haunted Dead is useful because it's both a discard outlet and a value discard. However it's not really high on the power curve in either role. Adding more of the same effect that cost more mana (making madness casts harder) doesn't seem great. The blue zombies also don't give you two bodies for the Pariah.
The other cards that want to be discarded are obviously the madness cards. There are some that haven't gotten much attention in this thread that at least seem ok.
Asylum Visitor: Compared to the Scrounger it (a) has to be cast when discarded, (b) doesn't need another body to eat, (c) can't come back after dying, (d) dies to Liliana, and (e) blocks. The ability could also be relevant for quick Haunted Dead rebuys.
Murderous Compulsion: Conditional removal. Possibly ok against aggro. Against UW it misses Avacyn and Gideon and doesn't hit Gisela in a timely fashion. Does kill Spell Queller nicely. Kills Copter crews in general. Stoned by Selfless Spirit. Much better with an instant speed discard outlet. Basically a very inferior Fiery Temper.
Nagging Thoughts: A free card or possibly two seems good. Balances out Sinister Concoction or Cryptbreaker, may be too durdly with Smuggler's Copter or Wharf Infiltrator.
Oh! O though that you were looking for more creatures to be discarded and that can be reanimated from graveyard to interact with Amalgam.
From my point of view, turn 2 Copter is not always the best choice. I do prefer Insolent turn1, hitting on turn 2, discard haunted on opponent main2, reanimate haunted discarding prized and scrapheap or another creature to be reanimated.0
Of course, you have to be playing B and R.
Most of the recurring discard cards are situational anyways. The major problem is to keep the gas after the first and second discard burst.
You could try add one or two Eternal Scourge. You can indefinitely exile him to bring it to the battlefield alongside the scrapheap.
A couple of other cards to maximize discard value could be Bloodhall Priest and Ovalchase Daredevil. I saw these in a 5-0 MTGO list a while back, but have not seen them since.
Daredevil is an interesting option to keep cards in hand for continual use of discard outlets, but I think you would want the full set of Scrounger’s to maximize repeating the return to hand effect.
Scrounger’s are probably best versus control decks (admittedly a small portion of the metagame) and give another option to return the Amalgam’s from the grave.
I like that you are trying Wharf Infiltrator. I thought that it might be poorly positioned due to the prevalence of Liliana and Thraben Inspector, but you have me excited to try it out. I do think that the mana base becomes more strained to accomodate Wharf Infiltrator and main deck counterspells. I am going to try the following:
4x Choked Estuary
4x Sunken Hollow
12x Swamp
2x Island
2x Aether Hub
I think we want more blue sources to have more consistency with on-curve Infiltrator’s and counterspells. Unfortunately, this does drop the consistency of an untapped Sunken Hollow, but it should still be enough basic lands for a consistent untapped Choked Estuary.
Liliana is a beating and a half. I'm trying Harsh Scrutiny over Sinister Concoction to scout out the lay of the land but honestly even if we know Liliana is coming there isn't a ton we can do about it. Switching over to Key as an engine piece over the 1/1s would be more resilient but a lot less powerful.
She's just about single handedly moving me to the RB build, which is kind of sad since I like counterspells to deal with the Marvelworks plague sweeping across modo.
The basic idea is to disrupt the opponent's hand, get an enabler in play, and then do most of your playing during your opponent's end step with the Key or Cryptbreaker. The Infiltrator is in there because he wins games if not answered immediately. I ran this to 3-2 in a friendly league with both losses being hard fought three game matchups (one was to a BG Delirium with maindeck Kalitas and some timely grasps). The matchup with UW in particular feels really good with the hand disruption and the Pariah.
Ruinous Path is in the main deck as a concession to our problems with resolved planeswalkers. It doesn't mesh well with the rest of the deck but it will get Liliana or Gideon off the board.
Harsh Scrutiny has been excellent. It rarely misses, the scry is sweet, looking at your opponent's opener is useful in and of itself, and late game you can usually filter it out somehow.
Key to the City is surprisingly clutch. Smoothing out draws is great and an untapped key always represents the threat of a flashed in Pariah. You can also do the Haunted Dead -> Double Prized Amalgam out of absolutely nowhere on two mana. The fact that you don't have to pay the mana to draw until the next turn works out very nicely.
The deck is susceptible to getting run over by a good aggro draw. It is a little light on removal for resolved threats. Also, being forced to flip a Pariah while the opponent has mana open is an awful feeling. On the other hand it does do a pretty good job of murdering mediocre aggro draws.
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A new standard season, and with Halloween close, what better time to eat some brains.
Overview
This decks utilizes the powerful Haunted Dead / Prized Amalgam combo, to generate an undying horde of zombies. Said undying zombies can be used to flip Voldaren Pariah to wipe the opponents board, just to bring the zombies back again. This deck is capable to untap with 9 power and 4 bodies on as early as turn 3, but can also play the longer grindier matchup, where you use cryptbreaker and madness spells to generate card advantage.
History
The B/U zombies deck made a splash at pro tour Eldritch Moon to feast on the Bant CoCo decks, however the teams that brought the deck read the meta wrong and it did not preform very well. Running the powerful Prized Amalgam / Hunted Dead combo to generate an undying horde of zombies while utilizing Voldaren Pariah to clear the board of threats and Cryptbreaker both as an enabler and cardadvantage machine. Main Reason for the blue splash was Jace, Vryn's Prodigy since it gave the deck an instantspeed discardoutlet, and some sideboard options with negates and Dragonlord Silumgard.
The deck remained a decent deck throughout the standard period, but it kept evolving and at the starcity game invitational Eric Hawkings piloted a zombie list to first seed, utlilizing Emerge shenanigans with Kozilek's Return in the side (with no red mana to cast it).
Then Kaladesh happened
While still being a powerful deck with sweet synergies it has gotten left in the shadow of the Emerge Decks, as seen at the Star City Indianapolis. And the deck it was built to beat rotated out, as well as losing baby jace some renewal had to be done. Kaladesh gave us some gifts in the form of another undying critter, a bigger tormenting voice and a looter scooter. These changes makes us want to splash red instead of blue, allowing us to play some Zombie Madness.
21 Players brought the B/R Zombie madness deck to Pro Tour Kaladesh, and 15 of them made day two, giving the deck a 70,4% Conversion Rate (Note day one did also include 3 rounds of booster draft). Even though deck missed top 8, its overall performance was better than most of the other big decks at the PT, so that's something atleast:)
At GP Providence B/R Zombie madness made a good showing, being tied with B/G Delirium for the 3rd biggest archetype in day 2.
The New Toys
Tournament Results
Pro Tour Kaladesh: Brandon Ayers, 8-2
GP Providence: Jackie Wang Top 4, seeded 2nd after swiss rounds. Ryan Leverone 40th place, Zan Syed 43rd place, Manuel Perez 53rd.
Sample Decklists
4 Scrapheap Scrounger
4 Wailing Ghoul
4 Haunted Dead
4 Mindwrack Demon
4 Prized Amalgam
3 Voldaren Pariah
2 Sinister Concoction
2 Dark Salvation
1 Collective Brutality
3 Grasp of Darkness
3 Smuggler's Copter
15 Swamp
1 Geier Reach Sanitarium
4 Choked Estuary
1 Call the Bloodline
1 Collective Brutality
1 Dark Salvation
3 Distended Mindbender
1 Grasp of Darkness
1 Key to the City
2 Lost Legacy
2 Ruinous Path
1 To the Slaughter
2 Transgress the Mind
2 Insolent Neonate
4 Scrapheap Scrounger
4 Prized Amalgam
4 Haunted Dead
4 Voldaren Pariah
1 Lightning Axe
4 Smuggler's Copter
4 Cathartic Reunion
4 Fiery Temper
2 Unlicensed Disintegration
4 Foreboding Ruins
10 Swamp
5 Mountain
3 Collective Brutality
3 Distended Mindbender
3 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
2 Lightning Axe
4 Transgress the Mind
2 Insolent Neonate
4 Scrapheap Scrounger
4 Prized Amalgam
4 Haunted Dead
4 Voldaren Pariah
1 Lightning Axe
4 Cathartic Reunion
4 Smuggler's Copter
4 Fiery Temper
2 Unlicensed Disintegration
5 Mountain
4 Smoldering Marsh
10 Swamp
2 Call the Bloodline
3 Collective Brutality
3 Distended Mindbender
2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
2 Lightning Axe
3 Transgress the Mind
2 Insolent Neonate
4 Scrapheap Scrounger
4 Prized Amalgam
4 Haunted Dead
4 Voldaren Pariah
4 Cathartic Reunion
2 Lightning Axe
4 Fiery Temper
1 Unlicensed Disintegration
4 Smuggler's Copter
5 Mountain
4 Smoldering Marsh
4 Foreboding Ruins
1 Lightning Axe
2 Unlicensed Disintegration
2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
2 Liliana, the Last Hope
3 Distended Mindbender
2 Transgress the Mind
1 Key to the City
2 Collective Brutality
To be added
card discussion
Matchups
Changelist
10.14 Thread Started
10.16 Minor changes
10.19 Added overview and an PT decklist.
10.24 Added Tournament Results and minor changeds
Id that!
Trade with me, h:Alters and EdhFoils:)
Cards I have altered
Id that!
Trade with me, h:Alters and EdhFoils:)
Cards I have altered
C Long Live Eldrazi C
4 Diregraf Colossus
4 Voldaren Pariah
4 Noosegraf Mob
4 Haunted Dead
3 Fabrication Module
3 Decoction Module
3 Smuggler's Copter
2 Liliana, the Last Hope
4 Grasp of Darkness
1 Dark Salvation
3 Westvale Abbey
2 Transgress the Mind
2 Lost Legacy
2 Ruinous Path
3 Rush of Vitality
2 Eliminate the Competition
2 Collective Brutality
Now I don't think it's competitive by any stretch of the imagination, but I think it could be fun at the very least.
Thoughts?
Id that!
Trade with me, h:Alters and EdhFoils:)
Cards I have altered
4 Choked Estuary
3 Island
2 Sunken Hollow
12 Swamp
1 Geier Reach Sanitarium
1 Westvale Abbey
3 Liliana, the Last Hope
2 Grasp of Darkness
2 Dark Salvation
4 Sinister Concoction
4 Prized Amalgam
4 Relentless Dead
3 Haunted Dead
4 Voldaren Pariah
4 Wharf Infiltrator
3 Weaponcraft Enthusiast
3 Collective Brutality
2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
3 Distended Mindbender
2 Negate
2 Essence Extraction
1 Liliana, the Last Hope
2 Diregraf Colossus
4 Choked Estuary
4 Cryptbreaker
2 Dark Salvation
2 Distended Mindbender
3 Grasp of Darkness
4 Haunted Dead
2 Island
2 Liliana, the Last Hope
1 Murder
1 Ob Nixilis Reignited
4 Prized Amalgam
4 Smuggler's Copter
2 Submerged Boneyard
4 Sunken Hollow
13 Swamp
4 Voldaren Pariah
4 Wharf Infiltrator
2 Ceremonious Rejection
3 Dead Weight
1 Grasp of Darkness
3 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
1 Ob Nixilis Reignited
3 Revolutionary Rebuff
2 Negate
Having a lot of trouble with GR energy decks, with my above list, but love the deck and do well in other matchups. Anyone else having troubles with GR energy decks or have tips to disrupt their plans?
Do we have anything we can do against somebody who curves out like that besides playing out the Pariah? Because sometimes you don't draw the Pariah and sometimes the mana doesn't work out and overall it's a big ask to get it down and transformed by turn four or five. OTOH Ayers ran it to 8-2 in the pro tour so I assume I'm missing something.
Modern: UW Spirits
I will try to give my 2 cents about B/R:
1) Cathartic Reunion is huge! Even thought is sorcery speed (U/B have a draw 2, discard 1, 2U card, instant). One of the main reasons to play B/R for me.
2) Access to more removals: disintegration, Fiery Temper, Axe...
3) I'am using 3 Neonate and wondering about the 4th. Since cryptbreaker is more suitable to the mid and late game, I'll try to use 4 Neonate/3 Cryptbreaker. Neonate can activate the Haunted Dead/Amalgam combo on turn 2 (T1: Neonate. T2: attack with neonate. 2nd land. Discard Haunted. Two lands up.
4) I am using one copy of Eternal Scourge. Combining the Scourge with Scrapheap Scrounger we have an "endless" resource to recast the Scrapheap. And if we fall short of creatures we can just cast the Scourge to block attackers.
What are your thoughts?
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/510625#paper
It looks like it might lose a little explosiveness that the BR list has in favor of a little more control and heavier black commitment with cards that might be slightly favored for the BG Delirium, WU Flash, and Vehicles metagame.
Anyone know the best way to use this sideboard against the top decks?
1x Murder
1x Dead Weight
1x Collective Brutality
1x Negate
1x Lost Legacy
1x Pick the Brain
1x Ruinous Path
2x Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
2x Skysovereign, Consul Flagship
2x Spell Shrivel
2x Distended Mindbender
<Added after original posting>
Steve Rubin wrote an article: http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/article.asp?ID=13635&writer=Steve Rubin&articledate=11-22-2016
Heres a new 5-0 list with no cathartic reunion...
Catalog seems like it could also be useful.
Here's my list for now.
1 Graf Harvest
4 Haunted Dead
6 Mountain
1 Eternal Scourge
3 Voldaren Pariah
4 Prized Amalgam
2 Fiery Temper
4 Insolent Neonate
3 Smuggler's Copter
1 Mindwrack Demon
4 Sinister Concoction
4 Smoldering Marsh
3 Cathartic Reunion
4 Foreboding Ruins
9 Swamp
3 Tormenting Voice
2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
3 Lost Legacy
2 Distended Mindbender
3 Transgress the Mind
2 Lightning Axe
13 Swamp
4 Choked Estuary
4 Sunken Hollow
2 Aether Hub
1 Island
Creatures (22):
4 Cryptbreaker
4 Haunted Dead
4 Prized Amalgam
4 Voldaren Pariah
3 Wharf Infiltrator
3 Scrapheap Scrounger
4 Smuggler's Copter
Spells (10):
4 Grasp of Darkness
2 Revolutionary Rebuff
2 Spell Shrivel
2 Sinister Concoction
2 Dead Weight
2 Murder
2 Pick the Brain
2 Skysovereign, Consul Flagship
2 Transgress the Mind
1 Distended Mindbender
1 Revolutionary Rebuff
1 Spell Shrivel
1 Ruinous Path
1 Sinister Concoction
I played against RB aggro (0-2), UW Flash (2-1), RWb Vehicles (2-0), RB Aggro (2-1), and GB Delirium (0-2) for a 3-2 record overall. Not bad for the first time out. I'm still feeling out the sideboard process.
Matchup notes: I felt like a favorite against RB Aggro. In the first round I lost a game when he was forced to chump with his copter against my abolisher of bloodlines and then spiked a fiery temper. The second matchup I lost a game when a Bloodhall Priest went nuts and none of my answers showed up despite much digging. Overall I felt like I was usually pulling ahead of them.
GB felt miserable. Liliana eats everything. I think I may have sideboarded wrong when I went away from permission and towards more kill spells--killing their creatures in 1-for-1s eventually leads to death by Ishkanah.
UW was fun and competitive. Having counterspells available in time for the inevitable Gideon is wonderful. Just being able to fight them over permission stuff makes things fun. Grasping through Selfless Spirit is also great. They still have a lot of powerful cards and can roll over you sometimes, though.
The Wharf Infiltrator is nutso. He flat out dominated games if he came out early and didn't get answered. The one time I got to live the dream of Crypt Breaker + Infiltrator + 4 mana for two dudes at a time my opponent just scooped. The downside is that he is quite fragile. Still, I think I might go to 4 infiltrators and 3 copters. He's more evasive than the copter against most decks and doesn't need another creature to be useful.
Are there any good candidates to replace Scrounger? I want to have as many cards as possible that discard for value but the Scrounger has been kind of meh for me.
Have you tried Advanced Stitchwing, Stitchwing Skaab and Geralf's Masterpiece?
Maybe it's useful for the thread to have a list breaking down both sides of the transaction.
Recurring discard:
One time discard:
Value from discarding:
The other cards that want to be discarded are obviously the madness cards. There are some that haven't gotten much attention in this thread that at least seem ok.
From my point of view, turn 2 Copter is not always the best choice. I do prefer Insolent turn1, hitting on turn 2, discard haunted on opponent main2, reanimate haunted discarding prized and scrapheap or another creature to be reanimated.0
Of course, you have to be playing B and R.
Most of the recurring discard cards are situational anyways. The major problem is to keep the gas after the first and second discard burst.
You could try add one or two Eternal Scourge. You can indefinitely exile him to bring it to the battlefield alongside the scrapheap.
Daredevil is an interesting option to keep cards in hand for continual use of discard outlets, but I think you would want the full set of Scrounger’s to maximize repeating the return to hand effect.
Scrounger’s are probably best versus control decks (admittedly a small portion of the metagame) and give another option to return the Amalgam’s from the grave.
I like that you are trying Wharf Infiltrator. I thought that it might be poorly positioned due to the prevalence of Liliana and Thraben Inspector, but you have me excited to try it out. I do think that the mana base becomes more strained to accomodate Wharf Infiltrator and main deck counterspells. I am going to try the following:
4x Choked Estuary
4x Sunken Hollow
12x Swamp
2x Island
2x Aether Hub
I think we want more blue sources to have more consistency with on-curve Infiltrator’s and counterspells. Unfortunately, this does drop the consistency of an untapped Sunken Hollow, but it should still be enough basic lands for a consistent untapped Choked Estuary.
She's just about single handedly moving me to the RB build, which is kind of sad since I like counterspells to deal with the Marvelworks plague sweeping across modo.
4 Choked Estuary
4 Sunken Hollow
2 Aether Hub
1 Island
4 Haunted Dead
4 Voldaren Pariah
4 Prized Amalgam
3 Wharf Infiltrator
2 Key to the City
4 Transgress the Mind
2 Harsh Scrutiny
2 Collective Brutality
2 Spell Shrivel
2 Grasp of Darkness
2 Ruinous Path
The basic idea is to disrupt the opponent's hand, get an enabler in play, and then do most of your playing during your opponent's end step with the Key or Cryptbreaker. The Infiltrator is in there because he wins games if not answered immediately. I ran this to 3-2 in a friendly league with both losses being hard fought three game matchups (one was to a BG Delirium with maindeck Kalitas and some timely grasps). The matchup with UW in particular feels really good with the hand disruption and the Pariah.
Ruinous Path is in the main deck as a concession to our problems with resolved planeswalkers. It doesn't mesh well with the rest of the deck but it will get Liliana or Gideon off the board.
Harsh Scrutiny has been excellent. It rarely misses, the scry is sweet, looking at your opponent's opener is useful in and of itself, and late game you can usually filter it out somehow.
Key to the City is surprisingly clutch. Smoothing out draws is great and an untapped key always represents the threat of a flashed in Pariah. You can also do the Haunted Dead -> Double Prized Amalgam out of absolutely nowhere on two mana. The fact that you don't have to pay the mana to draw until the next turn works out very nicely.
The deck is susceptible to getting run over by a good aggro draw. It is a little light on removal for resolved threats. Also, being forced to flip a Pariah while the opponent has mana open is an awful feeling. On the other hand it does do a pretty good job of murdering mediocre aggro draws.