So I took Chaos's list to a PPTQ today. Had 33 people, so 6 rounds and T8 cut.
R1 vs Mono R Aggro
I won both games easily, with no siding. I saw Scourge Wolf, Biomat Courier and Sin Prodder as the only creatures...
1-0
R2 vs Temur Tower
These were some really good games.
G1 He mulled to 5 and managed to stall for a bit (drew all my Anguished)
G2 I got hit by a T4 Hydra. I missed the Grasp with energy on the stack play, but he also missed the Attune T3 play to have the 3 energy when he played it. (drew 2 Anguished)
G3 He drew really well and had 2 Towers and backup with my draw no Anguished...
1-1
R3 vs BW Servo (paired down, he was 0-1-1)
This was a bit of a brew. Easy 2-0 with no boarding.
2-1
R4 vs Temur Tower - drew really well this round
G1 He mulls to 5 and stalls for so long!
G2 He runs over me with multiple towers and Helions
G3 I get ahead and my 2nd Glimmer was 2 Hulks (with Negate backup and Sorin on board). He then proceeded to draw 5 lands in a row (21 in deck and hadn't missed a land drop)
3-1
R5 vs Mardu Vehicles
I lost both games quite easily, had mana issues. I died on like T7 or 8 both games with 4 or 5 lands and multiple Hulks in hand. Only play I was iffy on was T5 I went Grasp/Disallow instead of Kalitas, but he had the Disintegration anyway.
3-2
R6 vs 4c Saheeli
I easily won G1 with Gearhulk beats
G2 I'd Quellered both of his Guardians and he drops a Tamiyo ticking up. I made my biggest misplays of the day by not just killing the Tamiyo then over 2 turns with beats. He had the Negate for the Anguished and the Hulked Anguished. He ends up ulting Tamiyo and dropping his hand. I end up wrathing and getting 9 Zombies, but he comboes the next turn through Disallow...
G3 I just get aggroed out and can't deal with the board.
3-3
All in all, I really enjoyed playing the deck and loved the sb strats. Well done with the build Chaos! Finished 15th of 33.
Sorry about the land issue with Mardu Vehicles. That's usually the only way I lose to them, and I often find myself mulling because of the lands I have in hand instead of spells after going to the sideboard.
I definitely feel like 4C Saheeli is pretty brutal. I guess I've been lucky so far in that match. There's another control player (he's on UB though), and we can't really figure it out. I guess that's supposed to our bad match? It's the only deck that has me contemplating Lost Legacy for my sideboard.
eh, it happens. Welcome to mtg haha, but thanks :).
Try out Dampening Pulse, it might be the card you're after (esp the UB player). Have you thought of trying Horribly Awry in your build Chaos?
EDIT: Just had another thought about Pulse, while it's slow at 4 cmc that doesn't deal with the board, it also messes with the crewing of vehicles in the mardu matchup.
I'm experimenting with Dynavolt Tower as a 2-of. I don't like to tap out for it, but once it's down you get to shoot something for 3 every time you cast a Glimmer, including opposing planeswalkers. So far I have found it more consistently impactful than Summonings (I got really tired of dying with a Summonings in hand).
I think dynavolt tower s the way a control deck can try to keep up with the big 2. However, I like tower in R based control decks (I have been playing mostly URx, with some deviations to a seaons pastbrew that didn't quite make it). The reaosns is that you want to have tower as soon as possible (so your spells net you energy), but if you cast it w/out energy, its a 3-mana do-nothing sorcery. i guess this is why temur is the go-to combination for tower decks (tons of early energy generation, so that the tower can come down and do something the turn it ETB)
In Temur it's a 4-of as the core strategy, whereas in my list it's just a 2-of that provides some inevitability in a draw-go shell.
Exactly, in a proper control deck you don't want to slam it immediately turn 3, you hold it and wait until you can cast it AND still have mana left for more answers.
I have been off standard for over a month now, but I played a bit of grixis in the early stages of AER (mainly, to make sure dark intimations was really underpowered as I thought... spoiler: in this metagame, it was). I used ot play Baral as a way to make intimations more cstable (also, I ran like 12 counterspells).
My verdict on baral is that if you have ways to rebuy him from the yard, he is good (dies to removal ALOT). I used ot have 3x liliana the last hope, and it was great. The deck was trash becaue it was too slow, but in the long games the lili-baral interaction was a good endgame. Depending on your meta you might want to consider adding a couple of ways to rebuying baral form te 'yard.
Oh my God! Oh my God! Oh my God! /faint
not sure if we are allowed to discuss new cards here, but yes. That seems like a great card. Tbhe discard could also end up being relevant if there is a good control card that can do things form the yard (worst case scenario, drop your confirm suspicions or other expensive instant in the 'yard for Gearhulk fun later on)
EDIT: I think Bolas, PW will be in the next set, in which case dumping a dark intimations is another potential thing to do with this card's discard.
Does anyone think that the draw'n'go u/b/x deck will see any play after the amonkhet release because it's starting to look like there is a cycling u/b/x deck and also that green, red and white are becoming even more aggresive, so I'm not sure how a control deck can compete especially now with these indestructible gods.
Does anyone think that the draw'n'go u/b/x deck will see any play after the amonkhet release because it's starting to look like there is a cycling u/b/x deck and also that green, red and white are becoming even more aggresive, so I'm not sure how a control deck can compete especially now with these indestructible gods.
IMO, as long as Copy Cat goes, control will be fine. The removal in the format has gotten a lot better recently, and Ahmonket has a few decent additions for control.
Does anyone have any thoughts on a post-Ahmonket build for this deck? I am thinking Anguished Unmaking may find itself playing a big part if the Gods end up being used.
If you stick with Esper control, yes, Anguished Unmaking should already be in your deck. I do think the new cards make Grixis and straight UW control an attractive choice though.
I have not decided. I didn't actually build Esper in the end, mostly because I knew Amonkhet was coming soon. Just looking at my options, really. Any particular new cards that take your fancy, Chaos?
No matter what type of control deck you build, trying to build one for week 1 metagame is a huge roll of the dice. I'd rather be on the aggro side of the equation and keep an eye out for how a control deck should be built.
How exciting. Sphinx tribal, anyone? Glyph Keeper alongside Curator and Final Word. Perhaps I can dream!
I agree with you regards first week. I am simply getting my head around what is available and what may find itself being the best pick. Grixis is surely to pick up as those are the suggested colours for Nicol Bolas, though I do maintain hope that Esper has a future (or U/B control more likely). A late game build around Approach of the Second Sun comes to mind, though I worry it'll simply not see play. It's a massive shame that card can't be cast using Torrential Gearhulk
Post AKH I'm trying a deck that abuses the Gearhulk / Commit//Memory interaction, with metallic summoning. (Gearhulk can target memory since Commit//Memory is an Instant and a Sorcery)
I have 3 flex slots left in SB, looking for a sweeper but best I've come up with is Yaheeni's Expertise. In online testing, eot gearhulk into memory has almost always been a game-winning tempo shift, either pulling me just ahead or pulling me well ahead. Metallic Summoning is there as an alternate wincon to Gearhulk, and the rest of the deck is built to be the best control deck possible without horrible topdecks and lots of card draw. Curator is a great card, the cycle is super relevant early game and the 4/4 flier is pretty sweet late game.
I think that card has the same issue that a lot of other hate does. It gets beat by cards they already play in their main and wont take out after board. I think that keeping them on their toes and having removal plus counter up is perfectly fine.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Wars may come and go but my soldiers, they are eternal."
Standard: Whatever Control is Best
Modern: Nothing
Legacy; Miracles RIP
A list I came across on Twitch.tv that Dinkman78 played List by illWill552 and seem to be doing very well, please comment of any change or opinion you guys might have
R1 vs Mono R Aggro
I won both games easily, with no siding. I saw Scourge Wolf, Biomat Courier and Sin Prodder as the only creatures...
1-0
R2 vs Temur Tower
These were some really good games.
G1 He mulled to 5 and managed to stall for a bit (drew all my Anguished)
G2 I got hit by a T4 Hydra. I missed the Grasp with energy on the stack play, but he also missed the Attune T3 play to have the 3 energy when he played it. (drew 2 Anguished)
G3 He drew really well and had 2 Towers and backup with my draw no Anguished...
1-1
R3 vs BW Servo (paired down, he was 0-1-1)
This was a bit of a brew. Easy 2-0 with no boarding.
2-1
R4 vs Temur Tower - drew really well this round
G1 He mulls to 5 and stalls for so long!
G2 He runs over me with multiple towers and Helions
G3 I get ahead and my 2nd Glimmer was 2 Hulks (with Negate backup and Sorin on board). He then proceeded to draw 5 lands in a row (21 in deck and hadn't missed a land drop)
3-1
R5 vs Mardu Vehicles
I lost both games quite easily, had mana issues. I died on like T7 or 8 both games with 4 or 5 lands and multiple Hulks in hand. Only play I was iffy on was T5 I went Grasp/Disallow instead of Kalitas, but he had the Disintegration anyway.
3-2
R6 vs 4c Saheeli
I easily won G1 with Gearhulk beats
G2 I'd Quellered both of his Guardians and he drops a Tamiyo ticking up. I made my biggest misplays of the day by not just killing the Tamiyo then over 2 turns with beats. He had the Negate for the Anguished and the Hulked Anguished. He ends up ulting Tamiyo and dropping his hand. I end up wrathing and getting 9 Zombies, but he comboes the next turn through Disallow...
G3 I just get aggroed out and can't deal with the board.
3-3
All in all, I really enjoyed playing the deck and loved the sb strats. Well done with the build Chaos! Finished 15th of 33.
EDIT: Spelling
I definitely feel like 4C Saheeli is pretty brutal. I guess I've been lucky so far in that match. There's another control player (he's on UB though), and we can't really figure it out. I guess that's supposed to our bad match? It's the only deck that has me contemplating Lost Legacy for my sideboard.
Try out Dampening Pulse, it might be the card you're after (esp the UB player). Have you thought of trying Horribly Awry in your build Chaos?
EDIT: Just had another thought about Pulse, while it's slow at 4 cmc that doesn't deal with the board, it also messes with the crewing of vehicles in the mardu matchup.
Exactly, in a proper control deck you don't want to slam it immediately turn 3, you hold it and wait until you can cast it AND still have mana left for more answers.
I have been off standard for over a month now, but I played a bit of grixis in the early stages of AER (mainly, to make sure dark intimations was really underpowered as I thought... spoiler: in this metagame, it was). I used ot play Baral as a way to make intimations more cstable (also, I ran like 12 counterspells).
My verdict on baral is that if you have ways to rebuy him from the yard, he is good (dies to removal ALOT). I used ot have 3x liliana the last hope, and it was great. The deck was trash becaue it was too slow, but in the long games the lili-baral interaction was a good endgame. Depending on your meta you might want to consider adding a couple of ways to rebuying baral form te 'yard.
not sure if we are allowed to discuss new cards here, but yes. That seems like a great card. Tbhe discard could also end up being relevant if there is a good control card that can do things form the yard (worst case scenario, drop your confirm suspicions or other expensive instant in the 'yard for Gearhulk fun later on)
EDIT: I think Bolas, PW will be in the next set, in which case dumping a dark intimations is another potential thing to do with this card's discard.
IMO, as long as Copy Cat goes, control will be fine. The removal in the format has gotten a lot better recently, and Ahmonket has a few decent additions for control.
No matter what type of control deck you build, trying to build one for week 1 metagame is a huge roll of the dice. I'd rather be on the aggro side of the equation and keep an eye out for how a control deck should be built.
I agree with you regards first week. I am simply getting my head around what is available and what may find itself being the best pick. Grixis is surely to pick up as those are the suggested colours for Nicol Bolas, though I do maintain hope that Esper has a future (or U/B control more likely). A late game build around Approach of the Second Sun comes to mind, though I worry it'll simply not see play. It's a massive shame that card can't be cast using Torrential Gearhulk
2 Curator of Mysteries
2 Harsh Scrutiny
3 Censor
3 Commit//Memory
3 Torrential Gearhulk
2 Glimmer of Genius
2 Anticipate
1 Pull from Tomorrow
2 Essence Scatter
2 Negate
2 Murder
2 Grasp of Darkness
3 Fatal Push
2 Blighted Fen
4 Choked Estuary
4 Sunken Hollow
5 Island
6 Swamp
2 Negate
2 Essence Scatter
1 Fatal Push
1 Murder
2 Ruinous Path
2 Dispel
2 Transgress the Mind
I have 3 flex slots left in SB, looking for a sweeper but best I've come up with is Yaheeni's Expertise. In online testing, eot gearhulk into memory has almost always been a game-winning tempo shift, either pulling me just ahead or pulling me well ahead. Metallic Summoning is there as an alternate wincon to Gearhulk, and the rest of the deck is built to be the best control deck possible without horrible topdecks and lots of card draw. Curator is a great card, the cycle is super relevant early game and the 4/4 flier is pretty sweet late game.
BG Rock
Modern:
RW Sun & Moon
RBG Dredge
RWG Burn
Legacy:
W Death & Taxes
Standard: Whatever Control is Best
Modern: Nothing
Legacy; Miracles RIP
Standard - Some kind of control
Modern - UB Mill (casual)
EDH - Meren's Grave Shenanigans
3x Censor
2x Disallow
2x Essence Scatter
3x Fatal Push
4x Glimmer of Genius
2x Grasp of Darkness
1x Negate
3x Pull from Tomorrow
1x To the Slaughter
Sorcery (5)
2x Flaying Tendrils
3x Fumigate
Creature (3)
3x Torrential Gearhulk
4x Choked Estuary
2x Concealed Courtyard
2x Evolving Wilds
4x Fetid Pools
2x Irrigated Farmland
3x Island
2x Plains
4x Shambling Vent
2x Swamp
Enchantment (4)
1x As Foretold
3x Cast Out
Planeswalker (2)
1x liliana, death's majesty
1x Sorin, Grim Nemesis
1x Dispel
1x Flaying Tendrils
2x Forsake the Worldly
1x Fumigate
1x Kefnet the Mindful
3x Lay Bare the Heart
2x Negate
3x Scarab Feast
1x Sphinx of the Final Word