Ob is great either draw what you need or kill a creature or both and people almost always want to kill the planeswalkers, and then pull him back with past if you have a petition in hand. As well as the win con if they can't get rid of him. With Ob ultimate and alms you can do 7 damage per turn set. Pretty quick clock!
In that respect alms seems worse than Pact since pact can do a lot more damage and doesn't do effectively nothing pre loop. And its immune to transgress!
In that respect alms seems worse than Pact since pact can do a lot more damage and doesn't do effectively nothing pre loop. And its immune to transgress!
That makes sense for sure! I like the 3 of and one pact, I thought you had been talking about demonic pact...I was VERY confused to say the least, haha!
Cons:
* Expensive to activate
* Only produces colorless mana
* Bad versus creature-heavy decks
I think you nailed it the downside is much worse and by the time you would need it, you probably can't win the game. This is purely my thoughts in how I decided against running one, however I haven't tested it.
@Demannic - I did want to reiterate the “I think” part. I’m as new to this deck as you are Demannic, so I could be dead wrong. I’m pretty sure that’s what they were using it for… As for Damnable Pact vs Read the Bones… That’s a tough one. On one hand, RtB costs 3, nets you 2 cards with the bonus of getting to scry 2. For that same price, Pact only gets you 1 card, damages you for 1, and has no scry. So, in the early game, it’s not as good. Late game is a better draw for Pact because you can dump your mana into it for great card advantage, or like you pointed out, target your opponent like a Fireball. If it’s being run, I do think that 1 is the right number. Silver bullet spell that is not snagged with Transgress the Mind.
Okay, so I apologize for the hasty post I made yesterday. If I would have taken the time to actually read through the entire posts (which wasn’t that many compared to some Modern threads), I would have seen the history of this deck. It feels like the deck was created with a solid base (One of removalspells, sweepers, some card draw and the Dark Petition/Seasons Past package) and was tweaked a bit in the Pro Tour lists from Finkel & Co. Knowing this, and seeing how little time anyone really had a chance to test the deck, it seems like I jumped the gun asking for people’s opinions on what works and what doesn’t. It seems like we’re all on the ground floor with designing and tweaking the deck.
That being said, I was listening to some commentary and read a few articles about the deck and I feel that people aren’t giving it credit or staying power. A lot of articles said that it might be a metagame deck. The Pantheon designed it to beat the W/WU/GW Humans, Tokens, and other aggro decks, specifically for the Pro Tour. Other authors said that it’s all about the pilot. They pointed out the weak showings everyone playing the deck had, minus John himself who took it to top 8. They said it’s a weak deck in untrained hands.
To this, I say that they’re right and wrong. Yes, this is a complicated control deck with no permission. You need to think turns ahead of yourself to make the right plays and decide what needs to be dealt with right now, and what can wait for later. So, in a way, I feel it IS all about the pilot, rather than the deck itself. It’s easy to slam down goblins and attack, burning anything getting in your way. It’s easy to counter spells, draw cards, and drop Gideon / Dragonlord Ojutai to win. So, I do think that this deck needs a good pilot and a lot of play testing to really know the deck and the lines of play. I don’t think that people can just pick it up and play.
This brings me to an alteration on my previous post. Instead of asking what was changed, I’ll ask: What can be changed? From all the literature I’ve read since the Pro Tour, it seems like Bant Company is the bane of the deck. It doesn’t help that Bant Company is one of the best / most played decks in standard. It seems like BG Seasons has a good handle on a lot of archetypes in the format, and with the tutoring power, it can really load the SB with silver bullets and specialty cards to combat specific decks. I think the reasons Bant Company does so well against us is Instant speed spells. Between Bounding Krasis having flash, Collected Company putting creatures (possibly 4/5s, which are out of reach of our Grasp of Darkness, leaving only Ultimate Price as our lone kill spell) into play at EOT, and the fact that they can run Counterspell backup post board, makes this matchup harder than other midrange / aggro decks.
What are some things we can do to better this matchup? Is the answer more hand disruption? Faster kill spells (more instant speedspot kills)? Adding blue for Negate out of the SB (I actually played around with the mana base, and I think that a BUG version is feasible without altering the deck all that much)? I actually have a BUG mana-base that basically leaves our maindeck unaltered but allows enough blue to access counterspells from the sideboard.
With this configuration, you only take away 2 black sources, add 9 blue sources (if you count Evolving Wilds getting an Island), and leave the green sources unchanged. The only downfall is that Sunken Hollow has the chance to ETB tapped, but with 13 basics, I’d have to say the odds are that it’ll come into play untapped more often than not.
A second land list I have, removes the painland part, adds more basics and still shows good showing for blue:
This version has a drop of 1 in black sources, 1 in green, only adds 7 in blue, but closes the gap a little more with tapped/untapped lands and painlands.
The point of all of this is that it’s manageable to add blue if permission spells out of the sideboard become necessary in matchups.
So, what do you guys think? What are the hardest matchups and how can we combat this?
-Yawg
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From void evolved Phyrexia. Great Yawgmoth, Father of Machines, saw its perfection. Thus The Grand Evolution began. — Phyrexian Scriptures
I agree, I like how it is better at killing a lot of things, but it is a 1 mana removal spell, concoction is also 1 mana for the seasons, but costs 2 in practice, maybe it is better than a grasp?
In that respect alms seems worse than Pact since pact can do a lot more damage and doesn't do effectively nothing pre loop. And its immune to transgress!
In a vacuum one for one your absolutely right. I've found two things in my testing both Pact and Alms. First, alms costs three which its synergy with Petition is just, well, perfect. At this point in the game your casting Petition damn near everysingle turn anyhow.
While Pact doesn't get killed by transgress which is an undeniable benefit, I've hated giving my oppentiing that many cards to see. I mean even a pact for 7, he's putting what ever he needs in the yard for later and keeping a hand full of disruption.
Now, I'm talking strictly of the mirror here. Pact give them fuel in the yard and allows them to rip through their own deck so fast. Idealy you wanna fireball for 10+ after they hopefully Read the bones once or twice, take a hit from something else once or twice ect. But that doesn't always happen right? There are times when you draw into pact, you gotta get it outta your hand for value or they just take it with duress anyhow, so pact for 5/6/7 and your fueling their yard and letting them draw into answers and Renewing next turn anyhow. You dont win with Pact (mirror) unless its a huge fireball for the win.
Thats how's its been for me personally, your milage may vary and I'd be very interested in hearing your own results.
This is the list that I'm working on building. I probably won't have all of the pieces until next week because of the mail (hoping to pick up the Ob Nixilis and a 2nd Season's Past at the LGS this Fri) but my intent is to run it at next Friday's FNM. This deck has gotten me back into magic after a 3 year hiatus...it just does ugly, dumb, brutally powerful things. I don't think it was a fluke. I think that mulliganning is a big deal with this deck (from my goldfished runs) but I think it will be a major player in T2 while it is legal. I went ahead and adjusted to have 3x Transgress the Mind, since they hit pesky 3-mana creatures and spells that Bant Company plays and exile them as opposed to just tossing them in the yard. I've been playing with Ob Nixilis maindeck, and I've got to say that for Turn 5s when you don't have a Dark Petition, he can be pretty cool as a legitimate threat and card drawing engine. With all the removal in this deck, I don't think it's unlikely that he will ultimate fairly regularly which gives you another out in games that go long.
I am having a hard time seeing what's in the deck, I've tried splashing white for Sorin as a finisher, but the problem is that you have to run more than 2 in my testing as world breakers make your world hurt as well as getting rid of lands that you need. After playing that match I left that idea on the back burner. This list looks a lot more Aggro as I can see Sylvan advocates.
I know I might be splitting hairs here, but that GWBlist looks more like a good control deck splashing for Seasons Past, rather than a Seasons Past deck splashing W. I think one of the advantages our deck has is the lack of creatures. So much so, that in games 2 and 3, there’s a good chance that removal was boarded out. In this version, there are LOTS of targets for removal, and the only cards added (in W) are Anguished Unmaking and Sorin, Grim Nemesis. Unmaking brings nothing really new to the deck other than another instant speed removal. Sorin is good, and would probably be good for our deck (with the amount of higher casting costs), but is still just another walker. Honestly, Sorin is a 1cc more version of Ob Nixilis, Reignited. +: Draw a card, -: Kill a creature, -: Win the game. For W more, you get damage off the draw, and lifegain off the kill. So, are the benefits outweighing the problems that come with splashing another color?
Same goes with my U splash for counterspells from the SB. I came up with a UBG manabase (in my last post), but that was for a completely different addition to the deck. The deck has 0 permission, and that was a negative aspect to the deck. It can’t STOP a Collected Company that was topdecked. It can’t STOP a big spell or creature without preemptively discarding it. So, the U splash was to add a completely different aspect to the deck. I feel the W splash is just adding different cards that serve the same function as cards we already run.
-Yawg
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From void evolved Phyrexia. Great Yawgmoth, Father of Machines, saw its perfection. Thus The Grand Evolution began. — Phyrexian Scriptures
What do you all think about splashing white in this deck? In Twoo's facebook group this list took down a PPTQ.
1. Traverse the Ulvenwald is better in creature-heavy toolbox decks, which this deck is not.
2. It looks like he added Sylvan Advocate just to make Shambling Vent better, which isn't necessary. The deck could already effectively beat down with 2-power lands, so Advocate just adds another target for your opponent's removal. Not to mention that he removed the main deck Transgress the Minds for it, which I think is a bad idea.
When I suggested targetting your opponent with pact I meant with a lethal pact. Sorry if that was not clear. You would target yourself with it in basically every other situation. As far as the mirror goes specifically, it is a win condition that cannot be killed with removal, exiled with infinite obliteration, blocked by hissing quagmire, or stopped by anything except pick the brain. But winning in the mirror really just comes down to resolving your tutors better. You don't need to focus on the win condition, it will happen naturally with hissing quagmires 90% of the time if you disrupt your opponent correctly.
About that twoo deck: I hate the inclusion of sylvan advocate. Sylvan advocate has 3 strengths, 1 it can be cast as a reasonable 2 drop, 2 it can be flipped off coco, and 3 it scales into lategame as a reasonable turn 6+ play.
Right off the bat we lose one of the strengths because we are not playing coco, this is the least important one so it isn't that much of a loss. That leaves us with a 2/3 vigilance on turn 2, and a 4/5 vigilance with minor upside on turn 6+. There is then an implied loss of being able to cast it on turn 2 because it turns on every removal spell in our opponent's hand and makes our languishes worse. In the deck as I and many others have it now, there are about 4 creatures. 2 nissa, and 2 kalitas. Nissa hits play and you gain value by searching up a land. It isn't the end of the world if she dies, but most of the time I don't cast her till I run out of lands, or turn 7 when she flips into a walker. Kalitas admittedly feels like a dead card in matchups with removal until I've started looping. I think it is a mistake to make that problem 3xs as big.
The TLDR of this is that we have no/very few creatures, and most of them can wait, so playing 2 drops only serves to grant your opponent card advantage, as if you didn't have them their removal spells would effectively be blank cards. Sylvan advocate only as a turn 6+ 4/5 with vigilance that pumps your manlands is not the best finisher in the world. There are much better options if you take away your ability to cast it early.
One example of this was when I was playing against BW control in round 6 of the 1k I duressed my opponent and saw Gideon, 3 lands, 2 declare in stone, 1 languish and I took the gideon leaving them with effectively nothing but 3 lands in their hand. Decks with creatures can't do that.
I agree with you. That was a more detailed look at what I was trying to say: our deck has the advantage of having little to no creatures that are profitable to kill. There are a lot of games against WB and others (like UR with Fiery Impulse), that will have a LOT of dead cards in hand because we give them no targets for their removal. As for Nissa, I consider her a pseudo-Sakura-Tribe Elder in the early game, and just a Walker in the late game. So, to me, my deck runs 2 creatures. Giving the opponent more targets for their spells is actually a bad thing for our deck. Remember, we go long.
The only thing I’d splash W for would be something like Secure the Wastes. Instant speed tokens that can’t be Transgressed out of my hand… Something like that would be something different to bring to the deck. Sorin’s not bad either.
BTW, was testing last night, and Ob Nixilis is performing pretty well. Unlike your changes Demannic, I took out a Read the Bones for Ob, and left all 4 Grasp of Darkness. And until some stats are posted on the quality of Damnable Pact, I’m leaving that AND Alms of the Vein out of the 75. I AM interested if Pact is as good as you’re theorizing.
The article by Ali was a good read, and the card I’m most interested in testing is Gaea’s Revenge. I think he makes good points, and that creature would be really difficult for WB or Esper control to beat. Yes, you have your sweeps spells to deal with, but that’s why you run discard…
Also, aside from the Mirror Match, when would you guys side in Orbs? I was thinking against GW Tokens, just to stifle the bleeding, but then I thought that there’s better cards to run against them. What deck wins off of targeting other than UR control with Fall of the Titans? Help me better understand the matchups where this card would be good.
-Yawg
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From void evolved Phyrexia. Great Yawgmoth, Father of Machines, saw its perfection. Thus The Grand Evolution began. — Phyrexian Scriptures
I think Dragonmaster Outcast would be really awesome to have. We already want to get to 6 mana, the tokens survive Languish, and a 1 mana investment is practically nothing in this deck.
He's probably not worth it, though. Too bad we don't have an equivalent in BG
They can't. It only hits creatures. If they Pick the Brain, or Invasive Surgery it, I'd just keep playing a tight control game and still do what the deck does. Kill things and get in for damage with what you can. It's not like they stole a wincon. You still have your Quagmires, Paths, Kolitas and walkers... Just roll without GY recursion. Yes, that'd suck to have the thing that makes the deck really tick be removed, but it's not game over because they removed all your tutors or GY recursion.
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From void evolved Phyrexia. Great Yawgmoth, Father of Machines, saw its perfection. Thus The Grand Evolution began. — Phyrexian Scriptures
tried one pick the brain today in place of a main deck trangress, was good. being able to hit den protector, advocate, recruiter etc is really good in my local meta.
I've been struggling against Goggles decks and Tutelage/Visions, I'm testing Reclaiming Vines as an answer that I can run in the main deck that will never be dead. It's a bit slow and competes with Languish/Kalitas for the 4cmc slot but it seems like the best way to have a chance in game 1. With all the manlands in standard, the floor seems like it might be high enough. Even humans decks have Always Watching.
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Standard decks:
Esper Control
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Modern: MartyrProc (Control/Prison) Check out my Primer!
Commander: Karador
Pauper: Ub Reanimator
Legacy: Young Frankenstein/Dredge/The Spanish Inquisition
Casual: 5Color Zendikar Combo
MartyrProc
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twitter: @Dave_Cordeiro
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Pros:
* 0-drop for Seasons Past
* Can't be removed with Duress or Transgress the Mind
* Uncounterable removal for Sphinx of the Final Word and Dragonlord Ojutai
Cons:
* Expensive to activate
* Only produces colorless mana
* Bad versus creature-heavy decks
That makes sense for sure! I like the 3 of and one pact, I thought you had been talking about demonic pact...I was VERY confused to say the least, haha!
I think you nailed it the downside is much worse and by the time you would need it, you probably can't win the game. This is purely my thoughts in how I decided against running one, however I haven't tested it.
Okay, so I apologize for the hasty post I made yesterday. If I would have taken the time to actually read through the entire posts (which wasn’t that many compared to some Modern threads), I would have seen the history of this deck. It feels like the deck was created with a solid base (One of removal spells, sweepers, some card draw and the Dark Petition/Seasons Past package) and was tweaked a bit in the Pro Tour lists from Finkel & Co. Knowing this, and seeing how little time anyone really had a chance to test the deck, it seems like I jumped the gun asking for people’s opinions on what works and what doesn’t. It seems like we’re all on the ground floor with designing and tweaking the deck.
That being said, I was listening to some commentary and read a few articles about the deck and I feel that people aren’t giving it credit or staying power. A lot of articles said that it might be a metagame deck. The Pantheon designed it to beat the W/WU/GW Humans, Tokens, and other aggro decks, specifically for the Pro Tour. Other authors said that it’s all about the pilot. They pointed out the weak showings everyone playing the deck had, minus John himself who took it to top 8. They said it’s a weak deck in untrained hands.
To this, I say that they’re right and wrong. Yes, this is a complicated control deck with no permission. You need to think turns ahead of yourself to make the right plays and decide what needs to be dealt with right now, and what can wait for later. So, in a way, I feel it IS all about the pilot, rather than the deck itself. It’s easy to slam down goblins and attack, burning anything getting in your way. It’s easy to counter spells, draw cards, and drop Gideon / Dragonlord Ojutai to win. So, I do think that this deck needs a good pilot and a lot of play testing to really know the deck and the lines of play. I don’t think that people can just pick it up and play.
This brings me to an alteration on my previous post. Instead of asking what was changed, I’ll ask: What can be changed? From all the literature I’ve read since the Pro Tour, it seems like Bant Company is the bane of the deck. It doesn’t help that Bant Company is one of the best / most played decks in standard. It seems like BG Seasons has a good handle on a lot of archetypes in the format, and with the tutoring power, it can really load the SB with silver bullets and specialty cards to combat specific decks. I think the reasons Bant Company does so well against us is Instant speed spells. Between Bounding Krasis having flash, Collected Company putting creatures (possibly 4/5s, which are out of reach of our Grasp of Darkness, leaving only Ultimate Price as our lone kill spell) into play at EOT, and the fact that they can run Counterspell backup post board, makes this matchup harder than other midrange / aggro decks.
What are some things we can do to better this matchup? Is the answer more hand disruption? Faster kill spells (more instant speed spot kills)? Adding blue for Negate out of the SB (I actually played around with the mana base, and I think that a BUG version is feasible without altering the deck all that much)? I actually have a BUG mana-base that basically leaves our maindeck unaltered but allows enough blue to access counterspells from the sideboard.
3 Evolving Wilds
2 Yavimaya Coast
3 Sunken Hollow
1 Llanowar Wastes
4 Hissing Quagmire
1 Island
4 Forest
8 Swamp
A second land list I have, removes the painland part, adds more basics and still shows good showing for blue:
3 Evolving Wilds
1 Island
1 Llanowar Wastes
4 Hissing Quagmire
5 Forest
3 Sunken Hollow
9 Swamp
The point of all of this is that it’s manageable to add blue if permission spells out of the sideboard become necessary in matchups.
-Yawg
2 Nissa, Vastwood Seer
4 Dark Petition
2 Duress
4 Grasp of Darkness
1 Infinite Obliteration
4 Languish
1 Nissa's Renewal
4 Read the Bones
3 Ruinous Path
2 Seasons Past
1 Sinister Concoction
2 Transgress the Mind
2 Ultimate Price
5 Forest
4 Hissing Quagmire
2 Llanowar Wastes
12 Swamp
1 Clip Wings
3 Dead Weight
2 Duress
2 Gaea's Revenge
1 Infinite Obliteration
1 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
3 Naturalize
1 Ultimate Price
1 Virulent Plague
His changes:
-1 Dead Weight
+1 Sinister Concoction
-1 Orbs of Warding
-1 Virulent Plague
+2 Gaea's Revenge
Modern: MartyrProc (Control/Prison) Check out my Primer!
Commander: Karador
Pauper: Ub Reanimator
Legacy: Young Frankenstein/Dredge/The Spanish Inquisition
Casual: 5Color Zendikar Combo
MartyrProc
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MartyrProc. List citation is incorrect.
tWoo Brew off
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Youtube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/TheBizarroDavid
Agreed. He only figured it was to stop Pyromancer's Goggles (enough of a reason, IMO) and armies of 1/1s, not for the mirror.
I do kind of like the addition of Sinister Concoction, but I'm not sure if it should replace the Dead Weight.
Modern: MartyrProc (Control/Prison) Check out my Primer!
Commander: Karador
Pauper: Ub Reanimator
Legacy: Young Frankenstein/Dredge/The Spanish Inquisition
Casual: 5Color Zendikar Combo
MartyrProc
Daily Digest
MartyrProc. List citation is incorrect.
tWoo Brew off
twitter: @Dave_Cordeiro
Youtube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/TheBizarroDavid
In a vacuum one for one your absolutely right. I've found two things in my testing both Pact and Alms. First, alms costs three which its synergy with Petition is just, well, perfect. At this point in the game your casting Petition damn near everysingle turn anyhow.
While Pact doesn't get killed by transgress which is an undeniable benefit, I've hated giving my oppentiing that many cards to see. I mean even a pact for 7, he's putting what ever he needs in the yard for later and keeping a hand full of disruption.
Now, I'm talking strictly of the mirror here. Pact give them fuel in the yard and allows them to rip through their own deck so fast. Idealy you wanna fireball for 10+ after they hopefully Read the bones once or twice, take a hit from something else once or twice ect. But that doesn't always happen right? There are times when you draw into pact, you gotta get it outta your hand for value or they just take it with duress anyhow, so pact for 5/6/7 and your fueling their yard and letting them draw into answers and Renewing next turn anyhow. You dont win with Pact (mirror) unless its a huge fireball for the win.
Thats how's its been for me personally, your milage may vary and I'd be very interested in hearing your own results.
4x Dark Petition
3x Duress
1x Infinite Obliteration
3x Languish
1x Nissa's Renewal
3x Read the Bones
4x Ruinous Path
2x Seasons Past
3x Transgress the Mind
3x Grasp of Darkness
2x Ultimate Price
3x Evolving Wilds
4x Forest
4x Hissing Quagmire
4x Llanowar Wastes
8x Swamp
1x Gaea's Revenge
2x Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
2x Nissa, Vastwood Seer Flip
Planeswalker (1)
1x Ob Nixilis Reignited
1x Alms of the Vein
1x Clip Wings
1x Damnable Pact
1x Dead Weight
1x Duress
3x Flaying Tendrils
1x Hedonist's Trove
1x Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
2x Naturalize
1x Orbs of Warding
1x Virulent Plague
1x World Breaker
Go Pelakka Wurm!
Standard
UB UB Midrange UB
Modern
GRWUBTribal Flames ZooGRWUB
RUGTemur DelverRUG
Legacy
UW Stoneblade UW
Same goes with my U splash for counterspells from the SB. I came up with a UBG manabase (in my last post), but that was for a completely different addition to the deck. The deck has 0 permission, and that was a negative aspect to the deck. It can’t STOP a Collected Company that was topdecked. It can’t STOP a big spell or creature without preemptively discarding it. So, the U splash was to add a completely different aspect to the deck. I feel the W splash is just adding different cards that serve the same function as cards we already run.
-Yawg
1. Traverse the Ulvenwald is better in creature-heavy toolbox decks, which this deck is not.
2. It looks like he added Sylvan Advocate just to make Shambling Vent better, which isn't necessary. The deck could already effectively beat down with 2-power lands, so Advocate just adds another target for your opponent's removal. Not to mention that he removed the main deck Transgress the Minds for it, which I think is a bad idea.
About that twoo deck: I hate the inclusion of sylvan advocate. Sylvan advocate has 3 strengths, 1 it can be cast as a reasonable 2 drop, 2 it can be flipped off coco, and 3 it scales into lategame as a reasonable turn 6+ play.
Right off the bat we lose one of the strengths because we are not playing coco, this is the least important one so it isn't that much of a loss. That leaves us with a 2/3 vigilance on turn 2, and a 4/5 vigilance with minor upside on turn 6+. There is then an implied loss of being able to cast it on turn 2 because it turns on every removal spell in our opponent's hand and makes our languishes worse. In the deck as I and many others have it now, there are about 4 creatures. 2 nissa, and 2 kalitas. Nissa hits play and you gain value by searching up a land. It isn't the end of the world if she dies, but most of the time I don't cast her till I run out of lands, or turn 7 when she flips into a walker. Kalitas admittedly feels like a dead card in matchups with removal until I've started looping. I think it is a mistake to make that problem 3xs as big.
The TLDR of this is that we have no/very few creatures, and most of them can wait, so playing 2 drops only serves to grant your opponent card advantage, as if you didn't have them their removal spells would effectively be blank cards. Sylvan advocate only as a turn 6+ 4/5 with vigilance that pumps your manlands is not the best finisher in the world. There are much better options if you take away your ability to cast it early.
One example of this was when I was playing against BW control in round 6 of the 1k I duressed my opponent and saw Gideon, 3 lands, 2 declare in stone, 1 languish and I took the gideon leaving them with effectively nothing but 3 lands in their hand. Decks with creatures can't do that.
Modern: MartyrProc (Control/Prison) Check out my Primer!
Commander: Karador
Pauper: Ub Reanimator
Legacy: Young Frankenstein/Dredge/The Spanish Inquisition
Casual: 5Color Zendikar Combo
MartyrProc
Daily Digest
MartyrProc. List citation is incorrect.
tWoo Brew off
twitter: @Dave_Cordeiro
Youtube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/TheBizarroDavid
The only thing I’d splash W for would be something like Secure the Wastes. Instant speed tokens that can’t be Transgressed out of my hand… Something like that would be something different to bring to the deck. Sorin’s not bad either.
BTW, was testing last night, and Ob Nixilis is performing pretty well. Unlike your changes Demannic, I took out a Read the Bones for Ob, and left all 4 Grasp of Darkness. And until some stats are posted on the quality of Damnable Pact, I’m leaving that AND Alms of the Vein out of the 75. I AM interested if Pact is as good as you’re theorizing.
The article by Ali was a good read, and the card I’m most interested in testing is Gaea’s Revenge. I think he makes good points, and that creature would be really difficult for WB or Esper control to beat. Yes, you have your sweeps spells to deal with, but that’s why you run discard…
Also, aside from the Mirror Match, when would you guys side in Orbs? I was thinking against GW Tokens, just to stifle the bleeding, but then I thought that there’s better cards to run against them. What deck wins off of targeting other than UR control with Fall of the Titans? Help me better understand the matchups where this card would be good.
-Yawg
He's probably not worth it, though. Too bad we don't have an equivalent in BG
Standard
UR Control
Modern
Merfolk
Burn
Avacyn did nothing wrong!
Purify Innistrad!
#Purge
Infinite Obliteration only hits creatures.
If they Obliterate away Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet and Nissa, Vastwood Seer, you just slowly beat them down with Hissing Quagmire.
This is what I will be playing the next few days:
2 Nissa, Vastwood Seer
2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
Spells
1 Ob Nixilis Reignited
2 Duress
2 Transgress the Mind
4 Languish
4 Dark Petition
1 Nissa's Renewal
2 Seasons Past
3 Ultimate Price
3 Grasp of Darkness
3 Read the Bones
1 Infinite Obliteration
1 Oblivion Strike
3 Ruinous Path
11 Swamp
5 Forest
1 Blighted Fen
4 Hissing Quagmire
3 Evolving Wilds
2 Llanowar Wastes
2 Naturalize
2 Trangress the Mind
2 Virulent Plague
2 Duress
2 Clip Wings
1 Ultimate Price
1 Infinite Obliteration
2 Gaea's Revenge
1 Orb of Warding
Oblivion Strike is a test. I wanted at least one exile creature effect card in the 75 as a precaution.
Standard: BG Golgari Midrange
Modern: U Merfolk GWUBR 5 Color Humans UBW Esper Gifts GW Bogles
tried one pick the brain today in place of a main deck trangress, was good. being able to hit den protector, advocate, recruiter etc is really good in my local meta.
Esper Control