Been following this thread since I saw the 35th place list for Lille. It got all weird and people were brewing with blue cards in the naya ramp thread lol. Finally, a post in regards to the actual deck! I appreciate your new take on the deck, but disagree with some of your card assessments. Given the meta, I think his card choices are actually quite good, although I'm still not sure the merits of azor's gateway in the deck. You undervalue trostani a bit as a way to stabilize the board a bit against mono red and WW(r). Treasure map is just an awesome card from experience and it ramps you so I'm not sure why it was quickly dismissed. I don't really know about Zacama, but it is only a one of. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt though, there is a reason why the big dinosaur gets played in amulet titan. Since the guy made the deck the meta has shifted a little bit to where b/g is a little less prevalent than it was at the beginning of the season. Back when he played he for sure expected a lot more b/g and star of extinction is way better than nova against them, but now that the meta is more steam vent decks as well as white weenie I agree with you on that.
Overall, I think this deck could anti-meta spike the ***** out of a tournament, but will only become really powerful with a few more cards and stomping grounds.
I've updated my first version of the deck and posted my 3x builds in the opening post of the thread.
I still don't think that the deck needs Treasure Map as it is really slow if you're hoping to use it as either ramp or a card draw engine.
For card draw The Immortal Sun is much better and we have plenty of other ramp options.
This is currently what I'm working with. Some of the card choices are due to what I currently own. Let me know what you think. Chromatic lantern and Chamber sentry is quite amazing. Along with fountain of renewal to help stabilize and allow us to draw cards with dawn of hope, while also pumping karn tokens is pretty sweet as well.
Dawn of Hope seems interesting as a mana sink but probaably too slow and only good as a SB option to bring against control decks.
There combination with Fountain is good but a bit slow outside of control or attrition matchups.
It is heavily skewed toward beating aggro decks and thus struggles against control (counters are a nightmare) and midrange (The Eldest Reborn is a huge blowout and Vraska's Contempt cleanly answers Wurm) decks which can just handle every threat I throw at them which leave me hoping to burn them out which isn's the most consistent plan without blue in the deck to find Banefire/Fight with Fire.
Dawn of Hope seems interesting as a mana sink but probaably too slow and only good as a SB option to bring against control decks.
There combination with Fountain is good but a bit slow outside of control or attrition matchups.
It is heavily skewed toward beating aggro decks and thus struggles against control (counters are a nightmare) and midrange (The Eldest Reborn is a huge blowout and Vraska's Contempt cleanly answers Wurm) decks which can just handle every threat I throw at them which leave me hoping to burn them out which isn's the most consistent plan without blue in the deck to find Banefire/Fight with Fire.
Have you ever played against chamber sentry? Clearly you havent if you consider him a chump blocker. Those games where you fold to counter magic and eldest reborn, I laugh with my chamber sentry.I'm not looking to close out games with karn, but I can if I need to. Thaumatic compass is too slow, I'd rather be pumping out Dawn of hope tokens then finding another land. If I was to run another artifact it would be treasure map, but I don't have any ATM so I won't.
I haven't played against Chamber Sentry because no one plays this card, can you explain how you play it and what makes it so good for you ?
All i see here is a card that pretty much requires you to have Chromatic Lantern in play and is a 5/5 for 5 at best and if you want to get it back after it dies you need to spend 5 mana and an additional 5 mana to recast it as a 5/5.
This doesn't scream "efficiency" to me.
What I like about Thaumatic Compass is that it serves multiple functions, early on it lets you find lands and fixes some awkward land/color draws and later on it flips into a land which stops the biggest attacker on the other side and as a topdeck it pretty much turns into a 2-mana ramp spell as it flips immediately.
I haven't played against Chamber Sentry because no one plays this card, can you explain how you play it and what makes it so good for you ?
All i see here is a card that pretty much requires you to have Chromatic Lantern in play and is a 5/5 for 5 at best and if you want to get it back after it dies you need to spend 5 mana and an additional 5 mana to recast it as a 5/5.
This doesn't scream "efficiency" to me.
What I like about Thaumatic Compass is that serves multiple functions, early on it lets you find lands and fixes some awkward land/color draws and later on it flips into a land which stops the biggest attacker on the other side and as a topdeck it pretty much turns into a 2-mana ramp spell as it flips immediately.
First off can I start by saying, no one ever casts their first sentry at 5 mana, unless of course they don't draw into them until they have 5 available lands. He is a great 1-2-3-4 drop. He can be used as a blocker early game and a finisher late game. He can shoot fliers for up to 5, and be brought back to do it again. Mind you we're playing ramp so this is pretty damn feasible to do multiple times. I really think you should try playing with chamber sentry before you knock him. Thaumatic Compass is still too slow. I'm doing other things on turn 3-4-5 that compass will just sit there until I flip it. I don't want to be holding mana up to use compass at EOT.
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Overall, I think this deck could anti-meta spike the ***** out of a tournament, but will only become really powerful with a few more cards and stomping grounds.
I still don't think that the deck needs Treasure Map as it is really slow if you're hoping to use it as either ramp or a card draw engine.
For card draw The Immortal Sun is much better and we have plenty of other ramp options.
3x Chamber Sentry
Planeswalker (3)
3x Karn, Scion of Urza
Instants (1)
1x Insecapable Blaze
Sorcery (13)
1x Banefire
4x Deafening Clarion
1x Fight with Fire
3x Circuitous Route
1x Sylvan Awakening
1x Star of Extinction
2x Lava Coil
Artifact (6)
3x Chromatic Lantern
3x Fountain of Renewal
1x Ixalan's Binding
3x Dawn of Hope
2x Seal Away
3x Gift of Paradise
Land (25)
1x Rootbound Crag
4x Sacred Foundry
4x Temple Garden
4x Sunpetal Grove
3x Clifftop Retreat
4x Forest
3x Mountain
2x Plains
Spending so much mana just to have a chump blocker seems rather expensive.
To make Karn tokens more threatening I'd probably want Treasure Map (over Chamber Sentry).
I'd also play Thaumatic Compass in the deck to have more artifacts.
I'm not a fan of Sylvan Awakening.
Dawn of Hope seems interesting as a mana sink but probaably too slow and only good as a SB option to bring against control decks.
There combination with Fountain is good but a bit slow outside of control or attrition matchups.
I've started testing my updated Naya build:
4x Pelakka Wurm
Sorcery (21)
4x Grow from the Ashes
4x Circuitous Route
4x Fight with Fire
3x Banefire
3x Deafening Clarion
3x Cleansing Nova
Enchantment (4)
4x Gift of Paradise
Artifact (3)
2x Thaumatic Compass
1x The Immortal Sun
4x Rootbound Crag
3x Temple Garden
3x Sacred Foundry
1x Selesnya Guildgate
1x Boros Guildgate
1x Arch of Orazca
5x Forest
4x Mountain
2x Plains
1x Island
4x Negate
4x Deathgorge Scavenger
3x Ixalan's Binding
1x Lyra Dawnbringer
3x Carnage Tyrant
It is heavily skewed toward beating aggro decks and thus struggles against control (counters are a nightmare) and midrange (The Eldest Reborn is a huge blowout and Vraska's Contempt cleanly answers Wurm) decks which can just handle every threat I throw at them which leave me hoping to burn them out which isn's the most consistent plan without blue in the deck to find Banefire/Fight with Fire.
Have you ever played against chamber sentry? Clearly you havent if you consider him a chump blocker. Those games where you fold to counter magic and eldest reborn, I laugh with my chamber sentry.I'm not looking to close out games with karn, but I can if I need to. Thaumatic compass is too slow, I'd rather be pumping out Dawn of hope tokens then finding another land. If I was to run another artifact it would be treasure map, but I don't have any ATM so I won't.
All i see here is a card that pretty much requires you to have Chromatic Lantern in play and is a 5/5 for 5 at best and if you want to get it back after it dies you need to spend 5 mana and an additional 5 mana to recast it as a 5/5.
This doesn't scream "efficiency" to me.
What I like about Thaumatic Compass is that it serves multiple functions, early on it lets you find lands and fixes some awkward land/color draws and later on it flips into a land which stops the biggest attacker on the other side and as a topdeck it pretty much turns into a 2-mana ramp spell as it flips immediately.
First off can I start by saying, no one ever casts their first sentry at 5 mana, unless of course they don't draw into them until they have 5 available lands. He is a great 1-2-3-4 drop. He can be used as a blocker early game and a finisher late game. He can shoot fliers for up to 5, and be brought back to do it again. Mind you we're playing ramp so this is pretty damn feasible to do multiple times. I really think you should try playing with chamber sentry before you knock him. Thaumatic Compass is still too slow. I'm doing other things on turn 3-4-5 that compass will just sit there until I flip it. I don't want to be holding mana up to use compass at EOT.