I am a complete beginner. Probably the most beginner-y beginner there could possibly be. As in, I have never even played a game with any deck other than one of those 30 card tutorial decks that they hand out for free at Wizard's affiliate stores. But, I did buy some cards, and now, this is my first attempt at building a deck. It is completely untested, never been played, I am just posting it up here to get the opinion of far more experienced players than myself, is this deck even remotely viable?
Now, there are some tweaks that I have in mind, but can't really do, because I simply don't have the cards. Like, I'd like to have one or two more Leave in the Dust, for example, as it can be used in a few different situations, to recycle spell and creature effects, like Scrounging Bandar or the Trial of Knowledge, Cartouche of Knowledge combo. That's something I know I should do, but can't. So, most of the advice you guys could give me is probably gonna have to wait til I flesh out my collection a bit more. But don't let that stop you! I want to know how I did for my first attempt, only a few hundred total cards to choose from. Is this something that could actually function somewhat reliably? How can I improve it?
Right, I figured my deck was all over the place. Too much variety, nowhere near enough consistency. So, I am trying to narrow it down quite a bit. Like I said, totally new, so I'm not entirely sure what sort of things to focus on, but I had a good feeling about Leave in the Dust from the beginning, so I think I'll try to load up my deck with a combination of "return to hand" effects and "when [name] enters battlefield" effects. I don't know if recycling one-use effects is a strong enough theme to build an entire deck around, but it's the first thing that came to mind, when using my original shoddy deck as a base. What do you think of something similar to this? Note that I don't actually own most of these cards, this is just an idea.
Greedwarden of Murasa is in this deck largely for the purpose of recycling the recycle spell cards, more than anything else, and Arborback Stomper is for some fast heals. Everything else is just +1/+1 counter abuse. Much more focused than the last deck, but I know this deck is far from perfect. Like, I know I have literally ZERO defense against flying creatures, but I don't know what cards to best to rectify that. Any suggested improvements or fixes?
Good to see your progression since the beginning of this thread !
You deck has a strategy now.
I'm not sure you want to bounce your own +1/+1 creatures with Disappearing Act. You may lose all counters sometimes.
In fact, it is a good idea to abuse ETB effects, but it is not much compatible with +1/+1 counters ^^
Getting black would be nice to get quicker +1/+1 counters with Winding Constrictor
Traditionnaly, U/G decks is good for :
- flash creatures that can be summoned during opponent turn
- spell hate with counter spells and hexproof
- ramp
- infinite combos
Honestly, the best way to build a decent deck is to start out by identifying existing decks that are good and understanding why they are good. The web site mtggoldfish has a section devoted to the metagame where you can find lists that have 5-0ed competitive leagues and done well in tournaments. The web site channelfireball has a lot of video sets of pros playing various decks. If you can find a video of a pro playing a deck that is the kind of deck that you want to play then you can learn a lot from it.
In general, you first want to decide on your basic philosophy of the deck. There are a bunch of different ways to go but I would say the basic archetypes are:
(1) I want to kill my opponent before they can execute their game plan. (aggro)
(2) I want to play cards that overwhelm my opponent's ability to stop me. (midrange)
(3) I want to pull together synergies that go way over the top of anything my opponent can do. (combo)
(4) I want to prevent my opponent from executing their game plan and kill them once they've exhausted their resources. (control)
It looks like your instinct is to go in a midrangey kind of direction. That's definitely viable. There's a long and storied history in magic of playing big dudes and turning them sideways until your opponent is dead. What you really really need to do if you're going with that plan is to make sure that your creatures outclass what your opponents are doing. In this case, the answer is probably no. Take a look at a couple of existing decks that are on a similar plan:
Notice that both of these decks have the creatures skewed towards lower casting costs. They also feature creatures that either hit hard, can run away with the game if left unchecked, come with card advantage built in, or some combination of all three. Your opponent can ignore a Scrounging Bandar for a long time. A Longtusk Cub has to be dealt with immediately or it takes over the game.
Also notice that creatures at the four and five drop slot either resist removal or have a lasting impact on the game even if removed. You have to assume that by the time you are casting something that expensive your opponent is going to be executing their own gameplan.
In general you win games of magic by card advantage and board control (I would argue even hyper aggro decks generate virtual card advantage by ending the game before high casting cost cards are relevant). A midrangey big creature deck controls the board by dropping giant monsters and generates card advantage by forcing the opponent to do awkward things to deal with the giant monster. You want to include a decent number of cheap creatures because you generally can't win if you get too far behind on the board. A control deck can stabilize with a single sweeper like Fumigate, while a five-drop creature can't hold the fort entirely on its own.
You doubly need early pressure if you're planning on some kind of bounce theme. It's very tricky to make a good deck built around bounce spells due to the inherent card disadvantage. Usually the way you want to use them is to establish early pressure and use the bounce component to stop your opponent from stabilizing.
The main competitive deck right now that features big monsters and blue mage trickery is Temur Energy, which uses Elder Deep Fiend tricks in lieu of bouncing:
10 Island
13 Forest
2 Woodland Stream
Spells (14)
1 Cancel
1 Cartouche of Knowledge
1 Containment Membrane
1 Failed Inspection
1 Harvest Season
2 Leave in the Dust
1 Malfunction
1 Oakenform
1 Take Down
1 Trial of Knowledge
1 Tricks of the Trade
1 Vines of the Recluse
1 Wing Snare
1 Air Elemental
1 Angler Drake
3 Arborback Stomper
1 Baloth Pup
2 Druid of the Cowl
1 Garruk's Horde
2 Greater Sandwurm
1 Hidden Herbalists
1 Nimble Innovator
1 Rootwalla
1 Scrounging Bandar
1 Sphinx of Magosi
1 Stalking Tiger
1 Stealer of Secrets
1 Tajuru Pathwarden
1 Vedalken Blademaster
1 Wild Wanderer
Now, there are some tweaks that I have in mind, but can't really do, because I simply don't have the cards. Like, I'd like to have one or two more Leave in the Dust, for example, as it can be used in a few different situations, to recycle spell and creature effects, like Scrounging Bandar or the Trial of Knowledge, Cartouche of Knowledge combo. That's something I know I should do, but can't. So, most of the advice you guys could give me is probably gonna have to wait til I flesh out my collection a bit more. But don't let that stop you! I want to know how I did for my first attempt, only a few hundred total cards to choose from. Is this something that could actually function somewhat reliably? How can I improve it?
4 Woodland Stream
4 Gift of Paradise
10 Forest
7 Island
Spells (12)
4 Leave in the Dust
4 Disappearing Act
4 Disperse
4 Compelling Deterrence
3 Scrounging Bandar
2 Kujar Seedsculptor
2 Rishkar, Peema Renegade
2 Saddleback Lagac
2 Arborback Stomper
2 Verdurous Gearhulk
2 Ridgescale Tusker
2 Greenwarden of Murasa
2 Gladehart Cavalry
Greedwarden of Murasa is in this deck largely for the purpose of recycling the recycle spell cards, more than anything else, and Arborback Stomper is for some fast heals. Everything else is just +1/+1 counter abuse. Much more focused than the last deck, but I know this deck is far from perfect. Like, I know I have literally ZERO defense against flying creatures, but I don't know what cards to best to rectify that. Any suggested improvements or fixes?
Good to see your progression since the beginning of this thread !
You deck has a strategy now.
I'm not sure you want to bounce your own +1/+1 creatures with Disappearing Act. You may lose all counters sometimes.
In fact, it is a good idea to abuse ETB effects, but it is not much compatible with +1/+1 counters ^^
Getting black would be nice to get quicker +1/+1 counters with Winding Constrictor
A cheap bounce spell: Unsummon
Abuse ETB effects: Panharmonicon
Traditionnaly, U/G decks is good for :
- flash creatures that can be summoned during opponent turn
- spell hate with counter spells and hexproof
- ramp
- infinite combos
Nowadays, there is this kind of archetype that may works:
- ermerge with Decimator of the Pronvinces, Elder Deep-Fiend, Lashweed Lurker
- fog ramp with Crush of Tentacles, Haze of Pollen, Part the Waterveil, Hedron Archive
- energy with Bristling Hydra, Longtusk Cub, Highspire Infusion, Rogue Refiner
- cycling (I don't know if it is viable) with Drake Haven, Censor, Shefet Monitor
Just my suggestions, take what you want
Good luck in constructing your deck !
Alex.
In general, you first want to decide on your basic philosophy of the deck. There are a bunch of different ways to go but I would say the basic archetypes are:
(1) I want to kill my opponent before they can execute their game plan. (aggro)
(2) I want to play cards that overwhelm my opponent's ability to stop me. (midrange)
(3) I want to pull together synergies that go way over the top of anything my opponent can do. (combo)
(4) I want to prevent my opponent from executing their game plan and kill them once they've exhausted their resources. (control)
It looks like your instinct is to go in a midrangey kind of direction. That's definitely viable. There's a long and storied history in magic of playing big dudes and turning them sideways until your opponent is dead. What you really really need to do if you're going with that plan is to make sure that your creatures outclass what your opponents are doing. In this case, the answer is probably no. Take a look at a couple of existing decks that are on a similar plan:
4 Walking Ballista
4 Glint-Sleeve Siphoner
4 Longtusk Cub
3 Servant of the Conduit
4 Winding Constrictor
2 Rishkar, Peema Renegade
3 Tireless Tracker
2 Gonti, Lord of Luxury
4 Verdurous Gearhulk
4 Fatal Push
2 Grasp of Darkness
Lands
4 Aether Hub
4 Blooming Mars
5 Forest
4 Hissing Quagmire
7 Swamp
4 Sylvan Advocate
4 Voltaic Brawler
4 Lathnu Hellion
2 Rhonas the Indomitable
2 Khenra Charioteer
1 Rishkar, Peema Renegade
4 Bristling Hydra
3 Glorybringer
4 Harnessed Lightning
3 Magma Spray
4 Game Trail
4 Cinder Glade
7 Forest
6 Mountain
Notice that both of these decks have the creatures skewed towards lower casting costs. They also feature creatures that either hit hard, can run away with the game if left unchecked, come with card advantage built in, or some combination of all three. Your opponent can ignore a Scrounging Bandar for a long time. A Longtusk Cub has to be dealt with immediately or it takes over the game.
Also notice that creatures at the four and five drop slot either resist removal or have a lasting impact on the game even if removed. You have to assume that by the time you are casting something that expensive your opponent is going to be executing their own gameplan.
In general you win games of magic by card advantage and board control (I would argue even hyper aggro decks generate virtual card advantage by ending the game before high casting cost cards are relevant). A midrangey big creature deck controls the board by dropping giant monsters and generates card advantage by forcing the opponent to do awkward things to deal with the giant monster. You want to include a decent number of cheap creatures because you generally can't win if you get too far behind on the board. A control deck can stabilize with a single sweeper like Fumigate, while a five-drop creature can't hold the fort entirely on its own.
You doubly need early pressure if you're planning on some kind of bounce theme. It's very tricky to make a good deck built around bounce spells due to the inherent card disadvantage. Usually the way you want to use them is to establish early pressure and use the bounce component to stop your opponent from stabilizing.
The main competitive deck right now that features big monsters and blue mage trickery is Temur Energy, which uses Elder Deep Fiend tricks in lieu of bouncing:
4 Longtusk Cub
4 Servant of the Conduit
4 Rogue Refiner
4 Tireless Tracker
4 Whirler Virtuoso
2 Bristling Hydra
4 Elder Deep-Fiend
4 Attune with Aether
2 Censor
4 Harnessed Lightning
2 Kozilek's Return
Lands (22)
4 Aether Hub
4 Botanical Sanctum
4 Forest
2 Island
2 Lumbering Falls
2 Mountain
2 Sheltered Thicket
2 Spirebluff Canal
You can watch Gerry Thompson put the non-deep fiend version through its paces on youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WspTjzj37E8