I feel like this deck needs Thing in the Ice, which is a problem, because I think TITI works best when you have 1 drop instants/sorceries. And the only one worth anything is Galvanic Bombardment. Deadlock Trap and Dynavault Tower are probably good here too. He could probably not play that many Gearhulks too and cut on lands
I'd really want to try thing in the ice in the UB shell, but since I already have the grixis cards with me, i'll try it out first before I port it to UB shell. My biggest concern is that the UB shell will be a bit slower as compared to the the grixis builds, but then again we are a control shell.
Hehe will try both out first by this friday's fnm and hopefully settle on a list for gameday weekend
I'm actually going to test TitI over the next couple of weeks. I don't have any Lilianas, so 2-3 may fill that slot quite nicely - an early threat that they need to deal with or it's going to take over the game. Plus, with the only removal likely to kit it being Grasp, we should be in good shape if we get to untap with it. What I found interesting was the singleton To the Slaughter, and lack of Ruinous Path as ways to deal with landed walkers.
So this is what I have been running over the last week. As stated a couple of posts ago, I made 3-1 at FNM, made top 8 in the PPTQ and then 4-1, 4-1 in two competitive leagues in MTGO. The deck feels pretty good, solid vs other control decks and aetherworks decks. Vs aggro is also good, although it is sometimes a toss of the coin. The losses have been : @FNM vs another Esper, @PPTQ: vs RG energy and BG delirium, @MTGOvs. RW tokens and RW aggro. I may have to learn to play the aggro matchup a bit better. In any case, feel free to drop any comments.
The TiTi has been nice so far. We cannot flip it as fast as R/x/y control strategies, but still pretty good. I have also been swapping a the single Liliana with the 4th Void shatter. Still undecided on which way to go though.
Nice job Air! How have you been finding Dead Weight? I've been tossing up between Ruinous vs Slaughter, along with Void Shatter vs Scatter and I'm currently on Path and Scatter, due to awaken and not being able to be countered with rejection. What's your experience been with both?
The dead weight, is really because in T3 vs fast aggro I want to be able to kill a creature (machinist for example) and leave mana open for another removal spell/negate/anticipate. It also feeds the To the slaughter: killing a Gideon and an attacker vs RW feels so good. It is also useful in the RG energy matchup where (on the draw) gives you a solution (that does not require them attacking) to their 2 drop (even if u had to play a tapped land). I do not run Grasp because I think I cannot reliably cast it T2 ... In a pinch it can also be used to turn a 3/3 zombie into a 'harmless" 1/1 without triggering any recursion shenanigans.
It is not ideal, since it does not trigger TiTi. Another option is to run the 2CC flash enchantment that gives -4/0. In any case, I am not sold is the best solution but I have yet to find a better option =( I have also considered running a deathtouch 2CC creature such as Ayli in that spot, or even Dec in Stone for the zombie matchup..but I am still undecided.
Regarding the void shatter, I am a big fan of the exile effect. I think it can be pretty powerful in the BG matchups and to counter Glimmers in the mirror match (so they cannot be recurred by the gearhulk later). That said, I see how the scatter is appealing, so will have to test to give a proper answer.
To the slaughter has been good for me. Gives ouu options vs PWs and is another important sac effect vs RG energy.
Another card that I think is very interesting is the Deadlock trap..it is a bit awkward as a T3 play if u have no TiTi on the field by then, but it seems to be a very flexible answer to both PWs and creatures.
That's fair regarding Dead Weight. I'll have to have another think on if I should run it or not. I've had no issues casting Grasp T2, but I am B based primarily.
I'm also running 2 Descend in my 75 for grave shenanigans.
This is another card I'm looking at (Trap), but can't find room for currently.
Yeah... I have been thinking of going heavier on B and replace some of the Immolating Glares with Grasps. It may be worth it. As it is the mana base has been working perfectly and so I am a bit afraid to change it. What I like about the Immolating glares is that they kill attacking creatures regardless of power (no problems dealing with advocates for example), but of course this implies they have to attack..which is a bit of a problem vs the token generating zombie in grixis aggro for example. I guess heavier B also gives the change to play Essence extraction which is a nice life swing in aggro matchups. I will keep testing my build but look forward to your reports!
In general I feel that Esper colors have a good balance of control elements. The mana base is not the best and there is no really good 1CC removal spell, but the Anguished Unmaking solves a considerable problem that Jeskai and Grixis builds have: a way to deal with PWs and troublesome artifacts/enchantments (Dynavolt tower) at instant speed AND that can be recurred with the Gearhulk engine.
It does get like that haha. I'm unable to play on Games Day due to work and a couple of tests I have to do (for teaching degree) but have convinced one of my mates to run my deck for one of the events (he runs grixis emerge atm). I would love your opinion on the list
I am unsure that the Tendrils is needed, probs be looking at +1 counter spell (probs negate), +1 Summonings in their place, or even Anguished/Slaughter but not 100% yet. The mana has been great.
Tendrils is absolutely a requirement for the extremely low to the ground aggro decks. I don't see the need for another ruinous in the side. You already have 10 pieces of spot removal in the main, so the only reason I assume its there is for walkers. Which negate deals with just fine and gets you the extra counter you are looking for.
Negate requires me to have it prewalker cast, whereas Path doesn't. Not many people are playing aggro at my current store, so that's where I'm coming from regarding that. I'm fine keeping it in with the current meta though.
This is going to be my Game Day list. Couple of quirky cards to point out - the Hedron Alignment is actually a great card in mid-range and control games, as it allows me to dump any spare mana EOT to find the card I need to draw. It also confuses opponents when they see it as they think there's more than one in the deck, and I'm using it as a win-con... Sequestered Stash is still being tested, but it seems to be a nice way to grab back a killed Gearhulk, particularly in control matches. In total, I've got 10 sorcery speed cards, preferring a 2/2 split of ObNix and TITI. I may take out Path from the side, and add in a Deadlock Trap instead, as that's reusable. I may also move Transgress to the side completely, and move (probably) a Tendrils and maybe the Trap to the main, which wouldn't change the number of cards to hit with Gearhulk.
Tendrils is absolutely a requirement for the extremely low to the ground aggro decks. I don't see the need for another ruinous in the side. You already have 10 pieces of spot removal in the main, so the only reason I assume its there is for walkers. Which negate deals with just fine and gets you the extra counter you are looking for.
This. Flaying Tendrils make R/W a lot easier, along with the graveyard decks, as it exiles everything relevant but Amalgam
Since I'm posting two lists I wrapped them in spoiler tags to reduce clutter on screen. The first is the list I will more than likely be taking to FNM and Game Day (if I go). The main changes from my previous list are Jace being removed completely, Kalitas and Lili moving to the side for 4 TITI, and swapping the pair of Transgress for a pair of Tendrils. Overall I really liked how the deck performed and am curious to see if I'm making the right changes.
The second deck is purely speculation on how an all instant speed deck would look. All of the cards, save for the lands, can be played at instant speed. While flexible, the lack of some sorcery cards hurts a lot
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Standard - Some kind of control
Modern - UB Mill (casual)
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Tendrils is absolutely a requirement for the extremely low to the ground aggro decks. I don't see the need for another ruinous in the side. You already have 10 pieces of spot removal in the main, so the only reason I assume its there is for walkers. Which negate deals with just fine and gets you the extra counter you are looking for.
This. Flaying Tendrils make R/W a lot easier, along with the graveyard decks, as it exiles everything relevant but Amalgam
If you have the cards, and the open mana, it's possible to get Tendrils to exile an Amalgam. Cast Tendrils, then cast any spot removal on the Amalgam. The text on Tendrils says "If a creature would die this turn, exile it instead". Doesn't have to be a death from Tendrils to trigger that exiling. Corner case, but I've done it once against an Aristocrats deck during DTK, to much confusion!
So with BW control not being as strong as it used to I figured I might go ahead and change up my deck some. I've wanted to run Esper before and thought this might be an opportunity to at least try it out. I've read through the thread some and looked at Control based articles on SCG and CFB and have a good idea on how I'm wanting it to run. I won't be able to attend Gameday this next weekend but I figure I can at least sleeve up some proxies of what few cards I'm missing to help my friends practice for the weekend and try it out the deck. The mana base worries me but it looks similar to what a lot of others in the thread are running and I'm questioning my numbers on targeted removal and counters. I also really like Stasis Snare but I'm wondering if Murder would just be better to avoid the turn three double white. If anyone would be willing to look it over and critique it would be much appreciated.
So with BW control not being as strong as it used to I figured I might go ahead and change up my deck some. I've wanted to run Esper before and thought this might be an opportunity to at least try it out. I've read through the thread some and looked at Control based articles on SCG and CFB and have a good idea on how I'm wanting it to run. I won't be able to attend Gameday this next weekend but I figure I can at least sleeve up some proxies of what few cards I'm missing to help my friends practice for the weekend and try it out the deck. The mana base worries me but it looks similar to what a lot of others in the thread are running and I'm questioning my numbers on targeted removal and counters. I also really like Stasis Snare but I'm wondering if Murder would just be better to avoid the turn three double white. If anyone would be willing to look it over and critique it would be much appreciated.
I think you're right - trying to get T2 BB, and then T3 1UU AND 1WW is going to hurt, especially seeing as there's not really any other cards that you need to play in white that early. You should already have the BB from Grasp by T3 for Murder, plus you're aiming for it for Tendrils too. I also like Glare as an answer to a T2 Copter when we're on the draw(swinging in on T3 when we have only 2 mana down). Glimmer of Genius is probably the best draw spell we have available to us right now. I'd consider upping your numbers to (probably) 3, so maybe a 2/3 split with Anticipate instead of 4/1?
I think that if you're going to run a lot of walkers, you need to be more of a tap-out deck (which BW tended to be as well), whereas right now your list seems to be hovering between tap-out and draw-go. Have a look at the Shaheen Soorani Esper list in the original post, as that has a "superfriends" mentality to it, and could be close to what you want to do. Notice that there's no Gearhulks in that list, as there are fewer targets for it to flash back. That could be a good place to run Thing in the Ice, as it's another early threat that you can bounce with your low cost spells, and survives your own Tendrils.
So with BW control not being as strong as it used to I figured I might go ahead and change up my deck some. I've wanted to run Esper before and thought this might be an opportunity to at least try it out. I've read through the thread some and looked at Control based articles on SCG and CFB and have a good idea on how I'm wanting it to run. I won't be able to attend Gameday this next weekend but I figure I can at least sleeve up some proxies of what few cards I'm missing to help my friends practice for the weekend and try it out the deck. The mana base worries me but it looks similar to what a lot of others in the thread are running and I'm questioning my numbers on targeted removal and counters. I also really like Stasis Snare but I'm wondering if Murder would just be better to avoid the turn three double white. If anyone would be willing to look it over and critique it would be much appreciated.
I think you're right - trying to get T2 BB, and then T3 1UU AND 1WW is going to hurt, especially seeing as there's not really any other cards that you need to play in white that early. You should already have the BB from Grasp by T3 for Murder, plus you're aiming for it for Tendrils too. I also like Glare as an answer to a T2 Copter when we're on the draw(swinging in on T3 when we have only 2 mana down). Glimmer of Genius is probably the best draw spell we have available to us right now. I'd consider upping your numbers to (probably) 3, so maybe a 2/3 split with Anticipate instead of 4/1?
I think that if you're going to run a lot of walkers, you need to be more of a tap-out deck (which BW tended to be as well), whereas right now your list seems to be hovering between tap-out and draw-go. Have a look at the Shaheen Soorani Esper list in the original post, as that has a "superfriends" mentality to it, and could be close to what you want to do. Notice that there's no Gearhulks in that list, as there are fewer targets for it to flash back. That could be a good place to run Thing in the Ice, as it's another early threat that you can bounce with your low cost spells, and survives your own Tendrils.
Adding to this, Oath of Jace and maybe Lili should probs be in here somewhere.
So with BW control not being as strong as it used to I figured I might go ahead and change up my deck some. I've wanted to run Esper before and thought this might be an opportunity to at least try it out. I've read through the thread some and looked at Control based articles on SCG and CFB and have a good idea on how I'm wanting it to run. I won't be able to attend Gameday this next weekend but I figure I can at least sleeve up some proxies of what few cards I'm missing to help my friends practice for the weekend and try it out the deck. The mana base worries me but it looks similar to what a lot of others in the thread are running and I'm questioning my numbers on targeted removal and counters. I also really like Stasis Snare but I'm wondering if Murder would just be better to avoid the turn three double white. If anyone would be willing to look it over and critique it would be much appreciated.
I think you're right - trying to get T2 BB, and then T3 1UU AND 1WW is going to hurt, especially seeing as there's not really any other cards that you need to play in white that early. You should already have the BB from Grasp by T3 for Murder, plus you're aiming for it for Tendrils too. I also like Glare as an answer to a T2 Copter when we're on the draw(swinging in on T3 when we have only 2 mana down). Glimmer of Genius is probably the best draw spell we have available to us right now. I'd consider upping your numbers to (probably) 3, so maybe a 2/3 split with Anticipate instead of 4/1?
I think that if you're going to run a lot of walkers, you need to be more of a tap-out deck (which BW tended to be as well), whereas right now your list seems to be hovering between tap-out and draw-go. Have a look at the Shaheen Soorani Esper list in the original post, as that has a "superfriends" mentality to it, and could be close to what you want to do. Notice that there's no Gearhulks in that list, as there are fewer targets for it to flash back. That could be a good place to run Thing in the Ice, as it's another early threat that you can bounce with your low cost spells, and survives your own Tendrils.
Adding to this, Oath of Jace and maybe Lili should probs be in here somewhere.
Yeah I figured I was trying to do too much between both a proactive and reactive build. I felt like Dovin, counters, and blue hulk are the reasons to add blue in the first place. I've already changed up the list which I won't post here so I don't clog up the thread but I'll put a link for it into my signature. I cut the MB counters, stasis snare, blue hulk, and glimmer of genius and anticipate is down to 2 copies. Oath of Jace, Murder, and Quarantine Field moved in. I think I'll also build a second list that fits more into a draw-go style as well.
I'll try and get some testing done with my friends soon and put up some FNM results after I get the rest of the cards gathered. Hopefully then I can contribute to the discussion. Thanks for the replies!
That's good to hear. Think you'll make the full switch? Or not?
RE Tendrils: I just haven't drawn them yet in my games vs Scrounger.dek or RW and have gone quite well vs them. I think it's something like 10-3 post board.
I actually switched to them..and the control mirrors have become way more "interesting" =) the ability to get a blocker/attacker, while dodging the new 1CC counter is pretty good.
Also, I went to 3 Anguished unmaking MD and 1 To the slaughter SB.. I loose to RW when they stick a Gideon that I cannot answer. That's pretty much it. So far so good =)
btw..your Kalitas come in against everything aggro right?
Yep. There's not really that much I find I want to Void Shatter anyway. All the zombies come out of the yard after being dumped.
I'm running the Path instead, just due to the life cost. Sure it can't be used again with Gearhulk, but there's no life cost.
Kalitas - yep, also grave based decks (along with Descend), but also if I feel I need more win-cons/in a more attrition based matchups where I have enough things to cut.
It is pre- Pro Tour but I think it is worth checking it out. It is along the same lines as what we have been discussing, except with Kalitas MD. It is pbbly a good call if Grixis and aggro are popular. It is interesting that there is no mass removal in the MD. To be honest sometimes I feel that in G1, Fumigate/Descend are more of a failsafe rather than a necessary card. But then, I put them in the sb and get aggro'd out in the next League =P
What do you guys think?
Cheers
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I think the Void Shatters have to turn into Scatter to the Winds now since Void gets countered by Ceremonious Rejection which I feel at least 1 should be mainboard.
I wonder how the Metalspinner's Puzzleknot played for this individual. I've thought about it before. I feel like Anticipate or Take Inventory would be more playable with Gearhulk.
I feel like this deck needs Thing in the Ice, which is a problem, because I think TITI works best when you have 1 drop instants/sorceries. And the only one worth anything is Galvanic Bombardment. Deadlock Trap and Dynavault Tower are probably good here too. He could probably not play that many Gearhulks too and cut on lands
I'd really want to try thing in the ice in the UB shell, but since I already have the grixis cards with me, i'll try it out first before I port it to UB shell. My biggest concern is that the UB shell will be a bit slower as compared to the the grixis builds, but then again we are a control shell.
Hehe will try both out first by this friday's fnm and hopefully settle on a list for gameday weekend
3 Plains
2 Concealed Courtyard
3 Shambling Vent
2 Evolving Wilds
2 Prairie Stream
1 Swamp
4 Sunken Hollow
3 Island
2 Choked Estuary
3 Aether Hub
1 Summary Dismissal
3 Void Shatter
2 Negate
4 Anticipate
3 Thing in the Ice
2 Fumigate
3 Immolating Glare
2 Anguished Unmaking
1 To the Slaughter
3 Blessed Alliance
1 Jace, Unraveler of Secrets
1 Liliana, the Last Hope
1 Sorin, Grim Nemesis
4 Torrential Gearhulk
2 Negate
2 Transgress the Mind
1 Summary Dismissal
1 Lost Legacy
2 Dead Weight
1 Metallurgic Summonings
2 Flaying Tendrils
1 Blessed Alliance
2 Dispel
1 Anguished Unmaking
The TiTi has been nice so far. We cannot flip it as fast as R/x/y control strategies, but still pretty good. I have also been swapping a the single Liliana with the 4th Void shatter. Still undecided on which way to go though.
Cheers
To the Slaughter can be played off a Torrential Gearhulk; Ruinous Path cannot. I assume that's the reasoning.
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It is not ideal, since it does not trigger TiTi. Another option is to run the 2CC flash enchantment that gives -4/0. In any case, I am not sold is the best solution but I have yet to find a better option =( I have also considered running a deathtouch 2CC creature such as Ayli in that spot, or even Dec in Stone for the zombie matchup..but I am still undecided.
Regarding the void shatter, I am a big fan of the exile effect. I think it can be pretty powerful in the BG matchups and to counter Glimmers in the mirror match (so they cannot be recurred by the gearhulk later). That said, I see how the scatter is appealing, so will have to test to give a proper answer.
To the slaughter has been good for me. Gives ouu options vs PWs and is another important sac effect vs RG energy.
Another card that I think is very interesting is the Deadlock trap..it is a bit awkward as a T3 play if u have no TiTi on the field by then, but it seems to be a very flexible answer to both PWs and creatures.
I'm also running 2 Descend in my 75 for grave shenanigans.
This is another card I'm looking at (Trap), but can't find room for currently.
In general I feel that Esper colors have a good balance of control elements. The mana base is not the best and there is no really good 1CC removal spell, but the Anguished Unmaking solves a considerable problem that Jeskai and Grixis builds have: a way to deal with PWs and troublesome artifacts/enchantments (Dynavolt tower) at instant speed AND that can be recurred with the Gearhulk engine.
3 Torrential Gearhulk
Planeswalkers (6)
2 Liliana, the last hope
1 Dovin Baan
1 jace, unraveler of secrets
1 ob nixilis reignited
1 sorin, grim nemesis
Sorceries (6)
2 transgress the mind
1 ruinous path
2 fumigate
1 descend upon the sinful
Instants (19)
3 Anticipate
2 Blessed Alliance
4 Grasp of Darkness
2 Immolating Glare
1 Anguished Unmaking
3 Scatter to the Winds
3 Glimmer of genius
1 Summary Dismissal
4 Choked Estuary
2 Evolving Wilds
2 Island
1 Plains
4 Prairie Stream
4 Shambling Vent
4 Sunken Hollow
5 Swamp
1 Fragmentize
2 Negate
1 Anguished Unmaking
3 Essence Extraction
2 Flaying Tendrils
1 Ruinous Path
3 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
1 Summary Dismissal
1 descend upon the Sinful
I am unsure that the Tendrils is needed, probs be looking at +1 counter spell (probs negate), +1 Summonings in their place, or even Anguished/Slaughter but not 100% yet. The mana has been great.
1 Aether Hub
1 Blighted Fen
1 Sequestered Stash
2 Evolving wilds
2 Submerged Boneyard
4 Choked Estuary
4 Island
4 Sunken Hollow
7 Swamp
Draw spells (6)
1 Hedron Alignment
2 Anticipate
3 Glimmer of Genius
1 Ceremonious Rejection
1 Negate
1 Summary Dismissal
4 Scatter to the Winds
Removal (13)
1 Engulf the Shore
2 Transgress the Mind
3 Murder
3 Ruinous Path
4 Grasp of Darkness
Walkers and win-cons(8)
2 Thing in the Ice
2 Ob Nixilis Reignited
4 Torrential Gearhulk
1 Lost Legacy
1 Diabolic Tutor
1 Ceremonious Rejection
1 Negate
1 Ruinous Path
1 Summary Dismissal
2 Essence Extraction
2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
2 Transgress the Mind
3 Flaying Tendrils
This. Flaying Tendrils make R/W a lot easier, along with the graveyard decks, as it exiles everything relevant but Amalgam
4 Thing in the Ice
4 Torrential Gearhulk
Instants (20)
4 Anticipate
4 Grasp of Darkness
3 Negate
3 Essence Extraction
3 Scatter to the Winds
3 Fortune's Favor
4 Harsh Scrutiny
2 Flaying Tendrils
Lands (26)
2 Blighted Fen
4 Choked Estuary
2 Evolving Wilds
4 Island
4 Submerged Boneyard
4 Sunken Hollow
6 Swamp
2 Transgress the Mind
1 Flaying Tendrils
2 Liliana, the Last Hope
3 Lost Legacy
2 Ruinous Path
2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
3 Summary Dismissal
4 Spell Queller
4 Torrential Gearhulk
Instants (26)
4 Anticipate
3 Blessed Alliance
4 Negate
3 Anguished Unmaking
3 Essence Extraction
2 Scatter to the Winds
4 Glimmer of Genius
2 Summary Dismissal
1 Confirm Suspicions
4 Aether Hub
4 Evolving Wilds
4 Island
1 Plains
4 Prairie Stream
4 Sunken Hollow
5 Swamp
3 Murder
3 Stasis Snare
2 Engulf the Shore
2 Insidious Will
2 Summary Dismissal
3 Archangel Avacyn
Since I'm posting two lists I wrapped them in spoiler tags to reduce clutter on screen. The first is the list I will more than likely be taking to FNM and Game Day (if I go). The main changes from my previous list are Jace being removed completely, Kalitas and Lili moving to the side for 4 TITI, and swapping the pair of Transgress for a pair of Tendrils. Overall I really liked how the deck performed and am curious to see if I'm making the right changes.
The second deck is purely speculation on how an all instant speed deck would look. All of the cards, save for the lands, can be played at instant speed. While flexible, the lack of some sorcery cards hurts a lot
Standard - Some kind of control
Modern - UB Mill (casual)
EDH - Meren's Grave Shenanigans
If you have the cards, and the open mana, it's possible to get Tendrils to exile an Amalgam. Cast Tendrils, then cast any spot removal on the Amalgam. The text on Tendrils says "If a creature would die this turn, exile it instead". Doesn't have to be a death from Tendrils to trigger that exiling. Corner case, but I've done it once against an Aristocrats deck during DTK, to much confusion!
4 Choked Estuary
2 Concealed Courtyard
3 Evolving Wilds
3 Island
1 Plains
2 Prairie Stream
4 Shambling Vent
4 Sunken Hollow
3 Swamp
Sorcery (5)
2 Flaying Tendrils
1 Fumigate
2 Ruinous Path
Enchantment (2)
2 Stasis Snare
4 Anticipate
1 Glimmer of Genius
4 Grasp of Darkness
2 Immolating Glare
2 Negate
2 Void Shatter
Planeswalker (8)
2 Dovin Baan
1 Jace, Unraveler of Secrets
2 Liliana, the Last Hope
1 Ob Nixilis Reignited
2 Sorin, Grim Nemesis
Creature (4)
2 Noxious Gearhulk
2 Torrential Gearhulk
1 Descend upon the Sinful
2 Fragmentize
2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
2 Lost Legacy
1 Negate
1 Ruinous Path
1 Sphinx of the Final Word
2 Summary Dismissal
3 Transgress the Mind
Modern:WUSpiritsWU, R12 BoltR
Commander:Diamonds are a Girls Best Friend, Ace of Spades, I Love the Night, The Reaper
~Signature by: Miraculous Recovery Signatures~
I think you're right - trying to get T2 BB, and then T3 1UU AND 1WW is going to hurt, especially seeing as there's not really any other cards that you need to play in white that early. You should already have the BB from Grasp by T3 for Murder, plus you're aiming for it for Tendrils too. I also like Glare as an answer to a T2 Copter when we're on the draw(swinging in on T3 when we have only 2 mana down). Glimmer of Genius is probably the best draw spell we have available to us right now. I'd consider upping your numbers to (probably) 3, so maybe a 2/3 split with Anticipate instead of 4/1?
I think that if you're going to run a lot of walkers, you need to be more of a tap-out deck (which BW tended to be as well), whereas right now your list seems to be hovering between tap-out and draw-go. Have a look at the Shaheen Soorani Esper list in the original post, as that has a "superfriends" mentality to it, and could be close to what you want to do. Notice that there's no Gearhulks in that list, as there are fewer targets for it to flash back. That could be a good place to run Thing in the Ice, as it's another early threat that you can bounce with your low cost spells, and survives your own Tendrils.
Adding to this, Oath of Jace and maybe Lili should probs be in here somewhere.
Yeah I figured I was trying to do too much between both a proactive and reactive build. I felt like Dovin, counters, and blue hulk are the reasons to add blue in the first place. I've already changed up the list which I won't post here so I don't clog up the thread but I'll put a link for it into my signature. I cut the MB counters, stasis snare, blue hulk, and glimmer of genius and anticipate is down to 2 copies. Oath of Jace, Murder, and Quarantine Field moved in. I think I'll also build a second list that fits more into a draw-go style as well.
I'll try and get some testing done with my friends soon and put up some FNM results after I get the rest of the cards gathered. Hopefully then I can contribute to the discussion. Thanks for the replies!
Modern:WUSpiritsWU, R12 BoltR
Commander:Diamonds are a Girls Best Friend, Ace of Spades, I Love the Night, The Reaper
~Signature by: Miraculous Recovery Signatures~
I gave the Scatter a try. They are actually reasonable good as in the control mirror they become an extra threat.
I think the Flaying Tendrils is good vs RW, BR and Grixis Graveyard. I have 2 in the SB and they put a lot of work in those matchups.
RE Tendrils: I just haven't drawn them yet in my games vs Scrounger.dek or RW and have gone quite well vs them. I think it's something like 10-3 post board.
Also, I went to 3 Anguished unmaking MD and 1 To the slaughter SB.. I loose to RW when they stick a Gideon that I cannot answer. That's pretty much it. So far so good =)
btw..your Kalitas come in against everything aggro right?
Cheers
I'm running the Path instead, just due to the life cost. Sure it can't be used again with Gearhulk, but there's no life cost.
Kalitas - yep, also grave based decks (along with Descend), but also if I feel I need more win-cons/in a more attrition based matchups where I have enough things to cut.
So I found this list that did well at an IQ.
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/archetype/standard-esper-control-29671#online
It is pre- Pro Tour but I think it is worth checking it out. It is along the same lines as what we have been discussing, except with Kalitas MD. It is pbbly a good call if Grixis and aggro are popular. It is interesting that there is no mass removal in the MD. To be honest sometimes I feel that in G1, Fumigate/Descend are more of a failsafe rather than a necessary card. But then, I put them in the sb and get aggro'd out in the next League =P
What do you guys think?
Cheers