I tried Avacyn's Judgment in an early test deck with a lot of 1-ofs to get a feel for cards. I tried it, Courier, Fleetwheel, and a couple other things just to see how they went. Courier over-performed. Fleethweel was mediocre. Avacyn's Judgment was unfortunately pretty bad. It was one I had high hopes for as a 1 or 2-of, since I felt like I needed more madness payoff spells. However, I only needed to draw it a few times to realize how little it did in most games. This deck just doesn't run enough lands for it ever to be much better than the "front" side. 4 mana and you get an Arc Lightning. It doesn't even work with Chandra very well, since often you are casting it in combat off Copter loot. That being said, I agree that Collective Brutality is likely a very good option for the Black splash.
Another idea I've been toying with is bringing in Eternal Scourge in the BR variant. It helps fuel Scrapheap Scrounger and even if exiled can be cast again to help pilot or just beat face, but I feel that bringing it in probably goes away from the original theme. Albeit, I love the idea of having recurring threats that render most removal useless. Eternal Scourge may also have synergy with Bomat Courier and makes having Lost Legacy as a sideboard card more attractive, since it can be used to draw into a better hand by naming eternal scourge on yourself to draw cards or get a valuable 3/3 to cast later. It's still tough to say no to Pia Nalaar, though.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Eternal Scourge sounds interesting. It seems a bit slow, so I'm not sure I like it main. Pia is much better as a 3 mana aggressive play generally. However against a grindy matchup, perhaps having access to Scourge in the side would be pretty good. I'm thinking the Kozelik Return matchups where Pia is worse, and we want more recursion. Lost Legacy is cute, but I think the double black will be too hard to cast since the deck is Red primary.
Eternal Scourge sounds interesting. It seems a bit slow, so I'm not sure I like it main. Pia is much better as a 3 mana aggressive play generally. However against a grindy matchup, perhaps having access to Scourge in the side would be pretty good. I'm thinking the Kozelik Return matchups where Pia is worse, and we want more recursion. Lost Legacy is cute, but I think the double black will be too hard to cast since the deck is Red primary.
The primary reason I'd include Lost Legacy is to kill emrakul, the promised End or other end game bombs before they ever get a chance to play them. I agree, both Scourge and Legacy are sideboard more than mainboard until we see how the meta shakes up. Also, I haven't seen it mentioned, but black has Olivia's Dragoon as a discard outlet as well. Furyblade Vampire trades better with the field, though. What I don't like about the later is that we only get to do the discarding on our combat phase instead of whenever we want.
By the way, has anyone figured out how Scourge works with Bomat Courier? It sounds like we'd be able to play the Eternal Scourge as it is exiled, but because it's face down I'm not really sure. I know it works wonders with Chandra, Torch of Defiance.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Doesn't work with Bomat. Cards stay face down even if it is killed. No one can look at those cards, so there is no way to know if a Scourge is exiled. Fairly sure it wouldn't matter even if we knew.
I got done proxying up the version posted with a black splash and like the results. One of the problems with a lot of WR lists running around is that they are very easy for UWx tempo and control decks to shut down. Spirits just murders dwarves because the second they have to tap to pilot a vehicle, they can tap down the vehicle itself since it's now a creature through using Nebelgast herald, or set everything back by bouncing it using Unsubstantiate. Since our deck doesn't rely on the vehicles as much we can strait attack in with value and just capitalize on madness.
Also, there's three cards that fit the 4 cmc slot (mentioned in the primer up top I believe): Collective Defiance, Flame Lash, and Chandra, Torch of Defiance. The first seems like a better choice in a fast version since it lets you do two things at once: Clear a creature and burn to the face. The middle card is a budget answer to the first if someone can't afford the playset and wants to go cheap (as cheap as someone can get with the price of copters going up) and for a budget answer it still does a lot of what we want. It lets you do 4 strait to a planeswalker, which can shut down 3 mana walkers and possibly shut down 4 mana walkers, can take down most creatures including Kolitas, Traitor of Ghet, and can do 4 to the face at instant speed. The last choice of Chandra, Torch of Defiance works better in a mid-range build that aims to use Skysovereign, Consul Flagship, Noxious Gearhulk, or Combustible Gearhulk. She can still do a pseudo Flame Lash against creatures, but is less effective against enemy walkers and her primary benefit is the extra 2 red mana that can be used to combo her with a smaller card for value on the play, or boosting into 6-7 cmc creatures the following turn. So in essence she acts like a slow collective card.
I agree that in the fast version we don't need Eternal Scourge and should use Pia Nalaar. Also mono-red the Scourge Wolf is deceptively strong. However, I think going with Chandra means we want to push more mid-range.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Yeah, I've been impressed with Wolf, but then again I was pretty impressed with Scrounger too. I've liked Chandra in the 4-drop spot, but then again I am likely biased there.
I ran some more test games with the Black Splash version. I liked Scrounger and Alms, so I'm pretty happy where the mainboard is right now. The main thing was that the mana was really clunky. I was running a full set of Smoldering Marsh and Foreboding Ruins. Ruins was fine, but Marsh often was just a tap land. Getting to 12 sources is difficult without making the mana worse. Evolving Wilds or lots of basic Swamps doesn't feel like the answer. Aether Hub feels risky but so far has done alright as a 2-of. Perhaps cutting a few Smoldering Marshes and loading up on Aether Hub is correct.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Edit: The nuts on the play is turn 1 Village Messenger swing, opponent doesn't have 1 drop. Turn 2 Swing, Ravenous Bloodseeker. Turn 3 Swing, Discard Distemper of the Blood to the Bloodseeker, Built to Smash on Bloodseeker (now it is an 8/6 trample) Discard Fiery Temper and hit blocker or opponent, now Bloodseeker is 10/4, then if all damage is going to opponent(either no turn 2 play or even better opponent didn't block) discard your last card to make it a 12/2 + 3 from Fiery Temper + 2 from Village Messenger + 3 from turns 1 & 2.
The more appropriate is turn 1 - 1 drop. Turn 2 - 2 drop. Turn 3 1 drop swing activate madness or 1 drop Bushwhacker swing.
2nd Edit: Another play on this is to splash blue to run Fevered Visions in the deck.
I get it, this deck has to do a ton of damage in the first 3-4 turns then rely on the Copter or Fiery Temper to finish if you don't get there by turn 4. The Bloodseeker survives all the sorcery speed -2 sweepers and Liliana. Kozileks has to catch it while swinging and down to 1 toughness which probably won't happen very often when swinging into 3 open mana with part of it red. The apprentice can also be brought in to survive if a copter is out, and Incendiary Flow is another direct damage spell. There are decks that this will just fizzle to, like Esper Control. But there are lots of ways this deck hits hard on turns 3 & 4. 3/4 1 drops and a Bushwhacker in the first 3 turns hits hard also. Furyblade Vampire, Fiery Temper madness cast along with another creature or 2 swinging even after 1 has been removed.
Now deck transforms between games. Take out the 4 Gorgers, 2 Couriers, 2 Furyblades, 1 Built to Smash, and the 3 Bushwackers. Throw in 4 Lathnu, 4 Collective Defiance, 2 Incendiary Flow, and 2 Blood Mist.
Still want to keep Distemper of the Blood in because it grants trample and is not only madness cast from the Vampires, but keeps Copters draw/discard ability from being merely cycling. Against super control decks throw in the extra 2 Incendiary Flow. Not sure what to do with 15th sideboard spot since don't really want to run more than 2 Blood Mist. I haven't really looked but want something else that does direct damage to opponent.
Makes Bushwhacker a lot less appealing to play. I don't see Authority being that widely played though. I think Thalia in general is going to be a better option for that effect.
Not too much less though. The Bushwhacker only does 2 damage himself, the big boon is the +1 he gives to everything already on the board. You do usually have to wait until turn 4 to play him though so you get more creature presence in the first 3 turns and you have more options on spells to cast rather than creatures before casting the Bushwhacker.
Being able to deploy a creature or two before Bushwhacker is exactly what makes him a good card. I.e. He gives haste. It's a moot point though, since I don't see Authority being played very much.
Hey reddies. Posted this deck in the RW vehicles thread since I didn't really go with the madness package, but it's sort of halfway between this deck and that. Figured it might help. It's worth nothing that while I went 4-0-1 (0 games dropped) I didn't play against anything with a lot of sweepers. I assume they'll be harder for me.
Andrew Jessup is 8-1 and 3rd in the standings at the SCG Open with the RB version of the Copter deck running Scrounger, Apprentice, Gorger, Bomat Courier, Pia Nalaar, Fiery Temper, Unlicensed Disintegration, Chandra (in side).
Andrew Jessup is 8-1 and 3rd in the standings at the SCG Open with the RB version of the Copter deck running Scrounger, Apprentice, Gorger, Bomat Courier, Pia Nalaar, Fiery Temper, Unlicensed Disintegration, Chandra (in side).
Andrew Jessup is 8-1 and 3rd in the standings at the SCG Open with the RB version of the Copter deck running Scrounger, Apprentice, Gorger, Bomat Courier, Pia Nalaar, Fiery Temper, Unlicensed Disintegration, Chandra (in side).
Copter is good.
very interested in his list
Indeed. Right now it seems like I'm having to mostly buy up all the lands I missed picking up the first time around.
Private Mod Note
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Eric Hawkins was also running another version of RB. I believe he went 7-2, so should also day two. His version included Alms of the Vein and Bloodhall Priest. The priest looked especially good against other aggressive decks.
I was thinking - what about Stromkirk Occultist inn the 3 drop slot for a mono-red Copter deck? On an ideal curve of T2 Copter, T3 Occultist, T4 Chandra, that means that we'd be able to cycle through three extra cards a turn (assuming we +1 Chandra and get damage through from Occultist), which would be amazing acceleration and get burn to the face a lot quicker...
I'd also appreciate thoughts on the sideboard too... I've not been able to get out in the new meta yet, so not sure what to expect. The plan is basically to go more controlling on creature heavy/aggro decks, have card replacement against control, and steal anything that gets big (Temur-ge, Delirium, etc.).
He punted hard multiples times in the 3rd game of the semi-finals match vs Van Meter. Disappointing, because I think R/B is the better Copter deck and probably has the edge in the matchup.
Take away is that Chandra was evidently not as strong for the Meta as her versatility would imply. Though, considering the high performance of the Mono Red deck, I think people are writing her off too quickly. She did appear in most of the sideboards of the R/B lists. I think that in this hyper aggressive meta, Chandra is not what you want on the top end of your curve. She wants to be played against slower Midrange decks where she can come down, kill their threat, and then stick around a few turns gaining card advantage. Vs a lot of go wide strategies like W/R Humans, W/R Vehicles, and the Dredge decks, she gets a lot worse. I think she has a role in the deck, but perhaps only int he sideboard, at least until the meta shifts.
Other observations. Fleetwheel Cruiser was solid, showing up in several lists. Key to the City was also very good, showing up in almost all of the R/B lists. Inventors Apprentice and Bomat Courier both very good. Apprentice is much better in these lists running 14 T1-2 artifacts and even more when considering Pia and Fleetwheel. The fact that Declaration in Stone was one of the more popular removals in the White decks made Apprentice even stronger.
I'm going to do up a Karsten style aggregate decklist to nail down a "stock" list and update the primer.
Copter obviously was the card of the Tournament, with a huge number of copies in the top 8 and top 32. It fit into multiple archetypes. Even a few GW decks were running it. Scrapheap Scrounger and Pia Nalaar are the real deal in R/B. Almost every deck played a full set of both cards. Fiery Temper and Incendiary Flow were pretty much a given. Interestingly, none of the decks played Collective Defiance.
Evidently going the more Artifact Aggro centric route was better. Apprentice, Bomat Courier were the preferred 1-drops by a vast margin. Eric Hawkins was the only one who played Gorger and Neonate, though he did place pretty highly as well. Take a look at his deck for an alternate build. He took advatnage of Alms of the Vein. I can imagine that his build is better suited for a heavier RU Fevered Visions meta (which underperformed this weekend).
Key to the City was a sleeper that performed extremely well in the deck. Every single deck played at least 2 copies. It served in several roles. It turned on Apprentice T2. It enabled Fiery Temper. It filtered our deck like a one sided Geier Reach Sanitarium. It provided unblockability to our Copters and Scroungers to finish out the game.
I'm somewhat surprised to see Bushwhacker show up in such force. A lot of that was just in the sideboard, but there were a few that ran some number main as well.. It would seem to be the go-to to get even more aggressive.
Fleetwheel was the preferred curve topper. Likely just better in this aggro meta. However, Chandra was in most of the sideboards and I imagine came in against the slower decks like B/W, that just want to power how single powerful threats like Kalitas one at a time. Collective Brutality did get a little bit of play, but if the meta stays aggressive and RU Visions decks continue to underperform, I think the heavy Weaver of Lightning package will be better.
Call of the Bloodline is a really cool tech against the Visions deck anyway, which is probably better than Brutality if it can be resolved. There are a lot of good sideboard options that appeared. I like Bloodhall Priest as one of the spicier ones against other aggressive decks. Have a look at the raw numbers below to see some of the other cards.
I've weighted the Top8 decklists 3x, the 9-32th decklists 2x, and the 33-64th decklists 1x. I use Karsten's method for the mainboard spells. For manabase, I merely look at simple averages across the decklists. Sideboard, I total the number of copies between all decklists, and then weight that by the frequency of appearances (i.e. number of lists that ran the card), and sort by weighting. Then I take an average number of copies (averaging amongst only the decklists that ran that card) and use those numbers to fill out a sideboard.
Another idea I've been toying with is bringing in Eternal Scourge in the BR variant. It helps fuel Scrapheap Scrounger and even if exiled can be cast again to help pilot or just beat face, but I feel that bringing it in probably goes away from the original theme. Albeit, I love the idea of having recurring threats that render most removal useless. Eternal Scourge may also have synergy with Bomat Courier and makes having Lost Legacy as a sideboard card more attractive, since it can be used to draw into a better hand by naming eternal scourge on yourself to draw cards or get a valuable 3/3 to cast later. It's still tough to say no to Pia Nalaar, though.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Modern: R Skred -- WBG Melira Co -- URW Nahiri Control
Legacy: R Mono Red Burn -- UWB Stoneblade
Commander: R Krenko, Mob Boss -- WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon -- WUBRG Maze’s End
Other: R No Rares Red (Standard) -- URC Izzet Tron (Pauper)
The primary reason I'd include Lost Legacy is to kill emrakul, the promised End or other end game bombs before they ever get a chance to play them. I agree, both Scourge and Legacy are sideboard more than mainboard until we see how the meta shakes up. Also, I haven't seen it mentioned, but black has Olivia's Dragoon as a discard outlet as well. Furyblade Vampire trades better with the field, though. What I don't like about the later is that we only get to do the discarding on our combat phase instead of whenever we want.
By the way, has anyone figured out how Scourge works with Bomat Courier? It sounds like we'd be able to play the Eternal Scourge as it is exiled, but because it's face down I'm not really sure. I know it works wonders with Chandra, Torch of Defiance.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Modern: R Skred -- WBG Melira Co -- URW Nahiri Control
Legacy: R Mono Red Burn -- UWB Stoneblade
Commander: R Krenko, Mob Boss -- WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon -- WUBRG Maze’s End
Other: R No Rares Red (Standard) -- URC Izzet Tron (Pauper)
Also, there's three cards that fit the 4 cmc slot (mentioned in the primer up top I believe): Collective Defiance, Flame Lash, and Chandra, Torch of Defiance. The first seems like a better choice in a fast version since it lets you do two things at once: Clear a creature and burn to the face. The middle card is a budget answer to the first if someone can't afford the playset and wants to go cheap (as cheap as someone can get with the price of copters going up) and for a budget answer it still does a lot of what we want. It lets you do 4 strait to a planeswalker, which can shut down 3 mana walkers and possibly shut down 4 mana walkers, can take down most creatures including Kolitas, Traitor of Ghet, and can do 4 to the face at instant speed. The last choice of Chandra, Torch of Defiance works better in a mid-range build that aims to use Skysovereign, Consul Flagship, Noxious Gearhulk, or Combustible Gearhulk. She can still do a pseudo Flame Lash against creatures, but is less effective against enemy walkers and her primary benefit is the extra 2 red mana that can be used to combo her with a smaller card for value on the play, or boosting into 6-7 cmc creatures the following turn. So in essence she acts like a slow collective card.
I agree that in the fast version we don't need Eternal Scourge and should use Pia Nalaar. Also mono-red the Scourge Wolf is deceptively strong. However, I think going with Chandra means we want to push more mid-range.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I ran some more test games with the Black Splash version. I liked Scrounger and Alms, so I'm pretty happy where the mainboard is right now. The main thing was that the mana was really clunky. I was running a full set of Smoldering Marsh and Foreboding Ruins. Ruins was fine, but Marsh often was just a tap land. Getting to 12 sources is difficult without making the mana worse. Evolving Wilds or lots of basic Swamps doesn't feel like the answer. Aether Hub feels risky but so far has done alright as a 2-of. Perhaps cutting a few Smoldering Marshes and loading up on Aether Hub is correct.
4 Foreboding Ruins
2 Smoldering Marsh
2 Swamp
4 Aether Hub
9 Mountains
Sideboard, I've tinkered around with some ideas. Hard to tell until we see meta develop.
2 Collective Brutality
3 Unlicensed Disintegration
2 Eternal Scourge
3 Filigree Familiar
2 Ruinous Gremlin
Added a couple of Eternal Scourge. Not sure on the Bombardments, but having some cheap burn to bring in vs other aggressive decks seemed appropriate.
Modern: R Skred -- WBG Melira Co -- URW Nahiri Control
Legacy: R Mono Red Burn -- UWB Stoneblade
Commander: R Krenko, Mob Boss -- WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon -- WUBRG Maze’s End
Other: R No Rares Red (Standard) -- URC Izzet Tron (Pauper)
1 Combustible Gearhulk
4 Eternal Scourge
4 Insolent Neonate
2 Ravenous Bloodseeker
4 Scrapheap Scrounger
Burn Suite
4 Fiery Temper
4 Incendiary Flow
2 Alms of the Vein
4 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
3 Skysovereign, Consul Flagship
4 Smuggler's Copter
Lands
4 Foreboding Ruins
4 Smoldering Marsh
2 Inventors' Fair
6 Swamp
8 Mountain
2 Transgress the Mind
2 Lost Legacy
Manabase is a WIP. Chandra ramp into combustible gearhulk is pretty sweet for late game CA or burn.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
4x Village Messenger
4x Bomat Courier
4x Ravenous Bloodseeker
4x Furyblade Vampire
4x Smuggler's Copter
3x Reckless Bushwhacker
4x Distemper of the Blood
3x Built to Smash
20x Mountain
2x Geier Reach Sanitarium
2x Blood Mist
4x Lathnu Hellion
4x Collective Defiance
4x Incendiary Flow
Edit: The nuts on the play is turn 1 Village Messenger swing, opponent doesn't have 1 drop. Turn 2 Swing, Ravenous Bloodseeker. Turn 3 Swing, Discard Distemper of the Blood to the Bloodseeker, Built to Smash on Bloodseeker (now it is an 8/6 trample) Discard Fiery Temper and hit blocker or opponent, now Bloodseeker is 10/4, then if all damage is going to opponent(either no turn 2 play or even better opponent didn't block) discard your last card to make it a 12/2 + 3 from Fiery Temper + 2 from Village Messenger + 3 from turns 1 & 2.
The more appropriate is turn 1 - 1 drop. Turn 2 - 2 drop. Turn 3 1 drop swing activate madness or 1 drop Bushwhacker swing.
2nd Edit: Another play on this is to splash blue to run Fevered Visions in the deck.
Now deck transforms between games. Take out the 4 Gorgers, 2 Couriers, 2 Furyblades, 1 Built to Smash, and the 3 Bushwackers. Throw in 4 Lathnu, 4 Collective Defiance, 2 Incendiary Flow, and 2 Blood Mist.
Still want to keep Distemper of the Blood in because it grants trample and is not only madness cast from the Vampires, but keeps Copters draw/discard ability from being merely cycling. Against super control decks throw in the extra 2 Incendiary Flow. Not sure what to do with 15th sideboard spot since don't really want to run more than 2 Blood Mist. I haven't really looked but want something else that does direct damage to opponent.
Wrecks haste
C Long Live Eldrazi C
Modern: R Skred -- WBG Melira Co -- URW Nahiri Control
Legacy: R Mono Red Burn -- UWB Stoneblade
Commander: R Krenko, Mob Boss -- WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon -- WUBRG Maze’s End
Other: R No Rares Red (Standard) -- URC Izzet Tron (Pauper)
Modern: R Skred -- WBG Melira Co -- URW Nahiri Control
Legacy: R Mono Red Burn -- UWB Stoneblade
Commander: R Krenko, Mob Boss -- WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon -- WUBRG Maze’s End
Other: R No Rares Red (Standard) -- URC Izzet Tron (Pauper)
Copter is good.
Modern: R Skred -- WBG Melira Co -- URW Nahiri Control
Legacy: R Mono Red Burn -- UWB Stoneblade
Commander: R Krenko, Mob Boss -- WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon -- WUBRG Maze’s End
Other: R No Rares Red (Standard) -- URC Izzet Tron (Pauper)
very interested in his list
Indeed. Right now it seems like I'm having to mostly buy up all the lands I missed picking up the first time around.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Modern: R Skred -- WBG Melira Co -- URW Nahiri Control
Legacy: R Mono Red Burn -- UWB Stoneblade
Commander: R Krenko, Mob Boss -- WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon -- WUBRG Maze’s End
Other: R No Rares Red (Standard) -- URC Izzet Tron (Pauper)
Something like this:
2 Geier Reach Sanitarium
21 Mountain
Creatures (18)
3 Bomat Courier
4 Falkenrath Gorger
4 Insolent Neonate
4 Smuggler's Copter
3 Stromkirk Occultist
3 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
4 Collective Defiance
4 Fiery Temper
4 Incendiary Flow
4 Oath of Chandra
2 Bedlam Reveler
2 Hijack
2 Kozilek's Return
2 Ruinous Gremlin
3 Harnessed Lightning
4 Galvanic Bombardment
I'd also appreciate thoughts on the sideboard too... I've not been able to get out in the new meta yet, so not sure what to expect. The plan is basically to go more controlling on creature heavy/aggro decks, have card replacement against control, and steal anything that gets big (Temur-ge, Delirium, etc.).
W/R Vehicles put more copies in the Top 8 and won, however R/B put 9 copies in the top 64 vs the 6 W/R Vehicles decks.
We also had a deck in the Top 8 of SCG Open Indianapolis.
4 Bomat Courier
4 Scrapheap Scrounger
4 Inventor's Apprentice
1 Reckless Bushwhacker
4 Pia Nalaar
Lands (23)
11 Mountain
4 Swamp
4 Aether Hub
4 Foreboding Ruins
2 Fleetwheel Cruiser
2 Key to the City
4 Smuggler's Copter
4 Fiery Temper
4 Unlicensed Disintegration
4 Incendiary Flow
1 Reckless Bushwhacker
2 Call the Bloodline
4 Galvanic Bombardment
2 Lightning Axe
2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
4 Transgress the Mind
He punted hard multiples times in the 3rd game of the semi-finals match vs Van Meter. Disappointing, because I think R/B is the better Copter deck and probably has the edge in the matchup.
4 Bomat Courier
4 Scrapheap Scrounger
4 Inventor's Apprentice
4 Pia Nalaar
Lands (23)
11 Mountain
4 Swamp
4 Aether Hub
4 Foreboding Ruins
3 Fleetwheel Cruiser
2 Key to the City
4 Smuggler's Copter
4 Fiery Temper
4 Unlicensed Disintegration
4 Incendiary Flow
4 Reckless Bushwhacker
4 Weaver of Lightning
2 Lightning Axe
2 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
1 Collective Brutality
2 Magmatic Chasm
4 Bomat Courier
4 Scrapheap Scrounger
4 Inventor's Apprentice
4 Pia Nalaar
Lands (23)
11 Mountain
4 Swamp
4 Aether Hub
4 Foreboding Ruins
3 Fleetwheel Cruiser
2 Key to the City
4 Smuggler's Copter
4 Fiery Temper
4 Unlicensed Disintegration
4 Incendiary Flow
4 Reckless Bushwhacker
4 Weaver of Lightning
2 Lightning Axe
2 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
1 Collective Brutality
2 Magmatic Chasm
4 Bomat Courier
4 Scrapheap Scrounger
4 Falkenrath Gorger
4 Insolent Neonate
4 Inventor's Apprentice
Lands (20)
10 Mountain
2 Swamp
4 Foreboding Ruins
4 Smoldering Marsh
4 Key to the City
4 Smuggler's Copter
4 Fiery Temper
4 Unlicensed Disintegration
4 Alms of the Vein
2 Bloodhall Priest
2 Lightning Axe
2 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
2 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
2 Collective Brutality
1 Hijack
1 Murderous Compulsion
2 Transgress the Mind
1 Swamp
4 Bomat Courier
2 Lupine Prototype
4 Scrapheap Scrounger
4 Inventor's Apprentice
2 Reckless Bushwhacker
4 Pia Nalaar
Lands (22)
10 Mountain
4 Swamp
4 Aether Hub
4 Foreboding Ruins
2 Key to the City
4 Smuggler's Copter
4 Fiery Temper
4 Unlicensed Disintegration
4 Incendiary Flow
3 Fleetwheel Cruiser
2 Call the Bloodline
1 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
2 Liliana, the Last Hope
1 Harsh Scrutiny
2 Hijack
2 Ruinous Path
2 Transgress the Mind
4 Bomat Courier
4 Scrapheap Scrounger
3 Bloodhall Priest
4 Inventor's Apprentice
2 Reckless Bushwhacker
3 Pia Nalaar
Lands (22)
10 Mountain
4 Swamp
4 Aether Hub
4 Smoldering Marsh
2 Key to the City
4 Smuggler's Copter
4 Fiery Temper
4 Unlicensed Disintegration
4 Incendiary Flow
1 Deadlock Trap
2 Impetuous Devils
1 Reckless Bushwhacker
3 Harnessed Lightning
2 Lightning Axe
2 Collective Brutality
3 Harsh Scrutiny
1 Hijack
4 Bomat Courier
2 Lupine Prototype
4 Scrapheap Scrounger
4 Inventor's Apprentice
2 Reckless Bushwhacker
4 Pia Nalaar
Lands (22)
10 Mountain
4 Swamp
4 Aether Hub
4 Foreboding Ruins
2 Key to the City
4 Smuggler's Copter
4 Fiery Temper
4 Unlicensed Disintegration
4 Incendiary Flow
3 Fleetwheel Cruiser
2 Harnessed Lightning
2 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
2 Liliana, the Last Hope
2 Hijack
1 Ruinous Path
3 Transgress the Mind
4 Bomat Courier
4 Scrapheap Scrounger
4 Inventor's Apprentice
1 Reckless Bushwhacker
4 Pia Nalaar
Lands (23)
11 Mountain
4 Swamp
4 Aether Hub
4 Foreboding Ruins
2 Fleetwheel Cruiser
2 Key to the City
4 Smuggler's Copter
4 Fiery Temper
4 Unlicensed Disintegration
4 Incendiary Flow
2 Reckless Bushwhacker
3 Weaver of Lightning
2 Call the Bloodline
2 Lightning Axe
2 Collective Brutality
4 Transgress the Mind
4 Bomat Courier
4 Scrapheap Scrounger
4 Inventor's Apprentice
3 Pia Nalaar
Lands (23)
11 Mountain
4 Swamp
4 Aether Hub
4 Foreboding Ruins
4 Fleetwheel Cruiser
2 Key to the City
4 Smuggler's Copter
4 Fiery Temper
4 Unlicensed Disintegration
4 Incendiary Flow
3 Reckless Bushwhacker
4 Weaver of Lightning
2 Call the Bloodline
4 Galvanic Bombardment
2 Lightning Axe
There was even a Mono Red Deck with Chandra! (well sort of, since he splashes blue for Fevered Visions in the side.
3 Bomat Courier
4 Scrapheap Scrounger
4 Falkenrath Gorger
4 Inventor's Apprentice
3 Pia Nalaar
Planeswalkers (3)
3 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
Lands (22)
13 Mountain
4 Aether Hub
1 Hanweir Battlements
4 Spirebluff Canal
4 Smuggler's Copter
1 Stitcher's Graft
4 Fiery Temper
2 Lightning Axe
2 Collective Defiance
4 Incendiary Flow
3 Goblin Dark-Dwellers
4 Fevered Visions
4 Galvanic Bombardment
1 Lightning Axe
1 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
2 Wandering Fumarole
Take away is that Chandra was evidently not as strong for the Meta as her versatility would imply. Though, considering the high performance of the Mono Red deck, I think people are writing her off too quickly. She did appear in most of the sideboards of the R/B lists. I think that in this hyper aggressive meta, Chandra is not what you want on the top end of your curve. She wants to be played against slower Midrange decks where she can come down, kill their threat, and then stick around a few turns gaining card advantage. Vs a lot of go wide strategies like W/R Humans, W/R Vehicles, and the Dredge decks, she gets a lot worse. I think she has a role in the deck, but perhaps only int he sideboard, at least until the meta shifts.
Other observations. Fleetwheel Cruiser was solid, showing up in several lists. Key to the City was also very good, showing up in almost all of the R/B lists. Inventors Apprentice and Bomat Courier both very good. Apprentice is much better in these lists running 14 T1-2 artifacts and even more when considering Pia and Fleetwheel. The fact that Declaration in Stone was one of the more popular removals in the White decks made Apprentice even stronger.
I'm going to do up a Karsten style aggregate decklist to nail down a "stock" list and update the primer.
Modern: R Skred -- WBG Melira Co -- URW Nahiri Control
Legacy: R Mono Red Burn -- UWB Stoneblade
Commander: R Krenko, Mob Boss -- WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon -- WUBRG Maze’s End
Other: R No Rares Red (Standard) -- URC Izzet Tron (Pauper)
4 Bomat Courier
4 Scrapheap Scrounger
4 Inventor's Apprentice
4 Pia Nalaar
1 Reckless Bushwhacker
Vehicles (6)
4 Smuggler's Copter
2 Fleetwheel Cruiser
2 Key to the City
Spells (12)
4 Fiery Temper
4 Incendiary Flow
4 Unlicensed Disintegration
Lands (23)
11 Mountains
4 Swamp
4 Aether Hub
4 Foreboding Ruins
2 Lighting Axe
2 Reckless Bushwhacker
3 Transgress the Mind
2 Chandra, Torch of Defiance
4 Weaver of Lightning
2 Call of the Bloodline
Copter obviously was the card of the Tournament, with a huge number of copies in the top 8 and top 32. It fit into multiple archetypes. Even a few GW decks were running it. Scrapheap Scrounger and Pia Nalaar are the real deal in R/B. Almost every deck played a full set of both cards. Fiery Temper and Incendiary Flow were pretty much a given. Interestingly, none of the decks played Collective Defiance.
Evidently going the more Artifact Aggro centric route was better. Apprentice, Bomat Courier were the preferred 1-drops by a vast margin. Eric Hawkins was the only one who played Gorger and Neonate, though he did place pretty highly as well. Take a look at his deck for an alternate build. He took advatnage of Alms of the Vein. I can imagine that his build is better suited for a heavier RU Fevered Visions meta (which underperformed this weekend).
Key to the City was a sleeper that performed extremely well in the deck. Every single deck played at least 2 copies. It served in several roles. It turned on Apprentice T2. It enabled Fiery Temper. It filtered our deck like a one sided Geier Reach Sanitarium. It provided unblockability to our Copters and Scroungers to finish out the game.
I'm somewhat surprised to see Bushwhacker show up in such force. A lot of that was just in the sideboard, but there were a few that ran some number main as well.. It would seem to be the go-to to get even more aggressive.
Fleetwheel was the preferred curve topper. Likely just better in this aggro meta. However, Chandra was in most of the sideboards and I imagine came in against the slower decks like B/W, that just want to power how single powerful threats like Kalitas one at a time. Collective Brutality did get a little bit of play, but if the meta stays aggressive and RU Visions decks continue to underperform, I think the heavy Weaver of Lightning package will be better.
Call of the Bloodline is a really cool tech against the Visions deck anyway, which is probably better than Brutality if it can be resolved. There are a lot of good sideboard options that appeared. I like Bloodhall Priest as one of the spicier ones against other aggressive decks. Have a look at the raw numbers below to see some of the other cards.
I've weighted the Top8 decklists 3x, the 9-32th decklists 2x, and the 33-64th decklists 1x. I use Karsten's method for the mainboard spells. For manabase, I merely look at simple averages across the decklists. Sideboard, I total the number of copies between all decklists, and then weight that by the frequency of appearances (i.e. number of lists that ran the card), and sort by weighting. Then I take an average number of copies (averaging amongst only the decklists that ran that card) and use those numbers to fill out a sideboard.
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
26
27
28
29
30
31
32
33
34
35
36
37
-----
38
39
40
41
42
43
44
45
46
47
48
49
50
51
52
53
54
55
56
57
58
59
60
61
62
63
64
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
100%
87%
87%
87%
87%
87%
87%
87%
73%
60%
60%
53%
------
33%
27%
20%
20%
13%
13%
13%
13%
13%
13%
13%
13%
13%
13%
13%
13%
13%
13%
7%
7%
7%
7%
0%
0%
0%
0%
0%
Bomat Courier 1
Bomat Courier 2
Bomat Courier 3
Bomat Courier 4
Scrapheap Scrounger 1
Scrapheap Scrounger 2
Scrapheap Scrounger 3
Scrapheap Scrounger 4
Inventor's Apprentice 1
Inventor's Apprentice 2
Inventor's Apprentice 3
Inventor's Apprentice 4
Key to the City 1
Key to the City 2
Smuggler's Copter 1
Smuggler's Copter 2
Smuggler's Copter 3
Smuggler's Copter 4
Fiery Temper 1
Fiery Temper 2
Fiery Temper 3
Fiery Temper 4
Unlicensed Disintegration 1
Unlicensed Disintegration 2
Unlicensed Disintegration 3
Unlicensed Disintegration 4
Pia Nalaar 1
Pia Nalaar 2
Pia Nalaar 3
Incendiary Flow 1
Incendiary Flow 2
Incendiary Flow 3
Incendiary Flow 4
Pia Nalaar 4
Fleetwheel Cruiser 1
Fleetwheel Cruiser 2
Reckless Bushwhacker 1
-------------------------------
Fleetwheel Cruiser 3
Reckless Bushwhacker 2
Lupine Prototype 1
Lupine Prototype 2
Falkenrath Gorger 1
Falkenrath Gorger 2
Falkenrath Gorger 3
Falkenrath Gorger 4
Insolent Neonate 1
Insolent Neonate 2
Insolent Neonate 3
Insolent Neonate 4
Key to the City 3
Key to the City 4
Alms of the Vein 1
Alms of the Vein 2
Alms of the Vein 3
Alms of the Vein 4
Bloodhall Priest 1
Bloodhall Priest 2
Bloodhall Priest 3
Fleetwheel Cruiser 4
Reckless Bushwhacker 3
Reckless Bushwhacker 4
Bloodhall Priest 4
Lupine Prototype 3
Lupine Prototype 4
10.6
3.7
4.0
4.0
0.0
Mountain
Swamp
Aether Hub
Foreboding Ruins
Smoldering Marsh
24
25
27
16
23
14
---
12
16
9
10
8
9
6
5
5
5
4
2
2
2
1
12
10
9
9
6
7
---
8
4
6
5
4
3
3
3
3
2
2
2
2
1
1
288
250
243
144
138
98
-----
96
64
54
50
32
27
18
15
15
10
8
4
4
2
1
2.0
2.5
3.0
1.8
3.8
2.0
-----
1.5
4.0
1.5
2.0
2.0
3.0
2.0
1.7
1.7
2.5
2.0
1.0
1.0
2.0
1.0
Lightning Axe
Reckless Bushwhacker
Transgress the Mind
Chandra, Torch of Defiance
Weaver of Lightning
Call of the Bloodline
------------------------------
Collective Brutality
Galvanic Bombardment
Hijack
Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
Magmatic Chasm
Fleetwheel Cruiser
Liliana, the Last Hope
Harsh Scrutiny
Ruinous Path
Harnessed Lightning
Bloodhall Priest
Murderous Compunction
Land
Impetuous Devils
Deadlock Trap
Modern: R Skred -- WBG Melira Co -- URW Nahiri Control
Legacy: R Mono Red Burn -- UWB Stoneblade
Commander: R Krenko, Mob Boss -- WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon -- WUBRG Maze’s End
Other: R No Rares Red (Standard) -- URC Izzet Tron (Pauper)