This has potential. Right now though it needs some kind of way to recur threats. A repeatable disentomb of some sort. I would personally up the whip to 3, because of how powerful it is in this deck.
I remember Sam Black drafted dredge right after Theros was released. I didn't really think it would cross over to constructed, but now that I look again, it might be able to pull it off.
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Lycanthropy Awareness Day.
Hoping for a cure, or at least an outbreak.
I've been playing this deck since I saw the list from Conley. Really fun, has potential, but it needs to stay fringe. Conley mentioned this yesterday, if it becomes mainstream it has problems. Rest in Peace only being one of them.
Why is rip a problem? The win con is definitely not whipping back creatures to attack, more often than not I rather leave my creatures in the graveyard for the nemesis, jarad and nighthowler. Whip becomes powerful when you can whip back and sac the creature with jarad which makes rip quite useless
Why is rip a problem? The win con is definitely not whipping back creatures to attack, more often than not I rather leave my creatures in the graveyard for the nemesis, jarad and nighthowler. Whip becomes powerful when you can whip back and sac the creature with jarad which makes rip quite useless
Huh? You can't whip anything if RIP is in play.
Is there anyone here who is interested in writing a primer for this deck? Preferably this would be someone who has done testing and seen some positive results with it.
Why is rip a problem? The win con is definitely not whipping back creatures to attack, more often than not I rather leave my creatures in the graveyard for the nemesis, jarad and nighthowler. Whip becomes powerful when you can whip back and sac the creature with jarad which makes rip quite useless
i've messed around with the deck a little bit. I'd say it's biggest strength is being able to play creatures like nighthowler and nemesis of mortals as gigantic threats for relatively little mana.
Basically you just dump a crapload of cards into your graveyard and play 2 mana 5/5s and 3 mana gigantors. salvage and commune are your engines to both find as many copies of these creatures as you can and fuel them at the same time. I'm not really sure how to play drown in filth. Part of me wants to say it's a removal spell with dig attached, but sometimes you just want to dig with it and you don't care if it really kills something.
I don't agree with whip being at more than 2 copies. you really don't want to draw multiples and it's more for late-game staying power than it is an integral part of the engine. Whip and jarad are the late-game cards, with jarad generally being another undercosted monster, but it has the ability to just start flinging dudes at your opponent's face.
Personally I'd like to see more shadowborn demon in the deck or possibly even slum reaper. I feel like the deck just gets ran over by devotion decks and having a few more ways to keep the board under control would be nice. I don't think jarad really needs to be a 3-of, so I could easily see dropping one for another MD demon/reaper.
It's not terrible. Conley Woods (the guy who ran it at the GP) did a few rounds of play testing on channel fireball without. The rather obvious problem is rest in peace, but since no one is actually running it (or no serious lists are anyway) you'll be fine there. The only real GY hate being played is ScOoze and he's not exactly brimming with amazing.
It's not terrible. Conley Woods (the guy who ran it at the GP) did a few rounds of play testing on channel fireball without. The rather obvious problem is rest in peace, but since no one is actually running it (or no serious lists are anyway) you'll be fine there. The only real GY hate being played is ScOoze and he's not exactly brimming with amazing.
yea scavenging ooze seems like he would wreck this deck. conley was probably pretty bummed to get to the gp and see so many people playing kibbler's GB deck.
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Big thanks to DarkNightCavalier from heroes of the planes studios for the sig!
I'm really excited to see how this deck progresses. Nothing sounds more fun than swinging with a 10/10 Nemesis that you paid 4 total mana for, then flinging it for 10 life loss with Jarad.
Unfortunately, I really don't see this becoming an actual competitive deck with the current card pool. The deck just wants to ramp into huge, unevasive, unprotected threats that are easily dealt with by the current top-tier decks. This will more than likely just be my FNM fun deck.
I'm really excited to see how this deck progresses. Nothing sounds more fun than swinging with a 10/10 Nemesis that you paid 4 total mana for, then flinging it for 10 life loss with Jarad.
Unfortunately, I really don't see this becoming an actual competitive deck with the current card pool. The deck just wants to ramp into huge, unevasive, unprotected threats that are easily dealt with by the current top-tier decks. This will more than likely just be my FNM fun deck.
yea the deck folds to several strategies and to say that it's somewhat inconsistent is being nice. That said, it can do some powerful things, it's cheap, and it's a blast to play with.
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I want to first say that I have not tested this at all, neither the original list or this one. This is purely theorycrafting. I won't be able to play around with this until tomorrow when I get off work.
I basically traded out the Deathrite Shamans for Lotleth Trolls. I feel at 19 lands, it will not reliably be a mana source, and even then, it basically screws over your only real removal spell (apart from the Demon). Lotleth Troll provides much needed reach. Without it, our entire deck can just be chump blocked with Elspeth tokens. Also, the Troll makes for an excellent Nighthowler Bestow target.
I traded the Voyaging Satyr with Axebane Guardians. While it is 1 CMC more, it's a slightly better blocker against aggression and can provide more mana than the Satyr. This might be a completely wrong move here, as maybe getting out the dork turn 2 is more important than at 3.
I don't agree that "Jarad does absolutely nothing if you don't have big guys on the field..."
The majority of the time he's a massive creature himself, that's also a recurring threat. I do miss the lack of evasion though, and I think the deck needs another Shadowborn Demon MB. They key is hitting your one drops early, and making sure you prioritize your tutoring with Commune with the Gods and Grisly Salvage correctly.
I like using Manaweft Sliver in Voyaging Satyr's slot. You give up a point of toughness but get actual manafixing. It's not like we've got any Nythos shenanigans going on anyway. Arguments can be made for Axebane Guardian because of the 3 toughness, but I like that Manaweft costs less and doesn't have defender so you can bestow it with Nighthowler or just get in for an incidental point of damage here and there.
I like using Manaweft Sliver in Voyaging Satyr's slot. You give up a point of toughness but get actual manafixing. It's not like we've got any Nythos shenanigans going on anyway. Arguments can be made for Axebane Guardian because of the 3 toughness, but I like that Manaweft costs less and doesn't have defender so you can bestow it with Nighthowler or just get in for an incidental point of damage here and there.
Good call on the Manaweft Sliver, I see no reason not to play it over Voyaging Satyr. The extra one toughness is not relevant at all, Conley must have overlooked the Sliver.
The one extra toughness is not irrelevant. It means you won't trade with tokens or mystics and the odds of needing the fixing more than the 1 toughness just aren't that great.
The one extra toughness is not irrelevant. It means you won't trade with tokens or mystics and the odds of needing the fixing more than the 1 toughness just aren't that great.
From play testing this deck, having access to that fixing is much more relevant than taking 1dmg 99% of the time, or you don't care trading. Not only that, Satyrs life is mostly spent feeding your demon, or their Desecration Demons. But having access to G/B with Manaweft in a deck that starves for lands is important. I like it.
I would rather play a bestowed Nighthowler that can take 1 removal, than a Jarad without any sac targets, because he usually gets killed pretty fast. He's a big guy, but like the others.. he gets chump blocked. I think the key to playing him with all ramp is just have 7 mana and hard cast / whip him and then sac him. I also use the graveyard effect frequently.
I would rather play a bestowed Nighthowler that can take 1 removal, than a Jarad without any sac targets, because he usually gets killed pretty fast. He's a big guy, but like the others.. he gets chump blocked. I think the key to playing him with all ramp is just have 7 mana and hard cast / whip him and then sac him. I also use the graveyard effect frequently.
jarad only sacrifices other creatures
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Conley did some playtesting on twitch tonight. Tried one version that played 4 Temple Gardens to run 4 Sin Collectors in the sideboard instead of Thoughseize to keep the creature count high. The other version was with 4 Lotleth Trolls mainboard. He did run Manaweft Sliver in both versions, and also had moved one Whip to the sideboard. Wasn't too successful tonight, but the video is available on twitch if you want to check it out.
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4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Elvish Mystic
3 Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
4 Nemesis of Mortals
4 Nighthowler
2 Shadowborn Demon
4 Sylvan Caryatid
2 Voyaging Satyr
4 Commune with the Gods
4 Grisly Salvage
4 Drown in Filth
Artifacts (2)
2 Whip of Erebos
Lands (19)
9 Forest
6 Swamp
4 Overgrown Tomb
1 Deadbridge Chant
2 Gift of Orzhova
2 Golgari Charm
3 Lifebane Zombie
2 Shadowborn Demon
3 Thoughtseize
This popped up in the GP and I was interested to see if it had a future.
I remember Sam Black drafted dredge right after Theros was released. I didn't really think it would cross over to constructed, but now that I look again, it might be able to pull it off.
Hoping for a cure, or at least an outbreak.
Level 1 Judge (yay)
Mine is like this
Huh? You can't whip anything if RIP is in play.
Is there anyone here who is interested in writing a primer for this deck? Preferably this would be someone who has done testing and seen some positive results with it.
What? Do you even know what Rest in Peace does?
Basically you just dump a crapload of cards into your graveyard and play 2 mana 5/5s and 3 mana gigantors. salvage and commune are your engines to both find as many copies of these creatures as you can and fuel them at the same time. I'm not really sure how to play drown in filth. Part of me wants to say it's a removal spell with dig attached, but sometimes you just want to dig with it and you don't care if it really kills something.
I don't agree with whip being at more than 2 copies. you really don't want to draw multiples and it's more for late-game staying power than it is an integral part of the engine. Whip and jarad are the late-game cards, with jarad generally being another undercosted monster, but it has the ability to just start flinging dudes at your opponent's face.
Personally I'd like to see more shadowborn demon in the deck or possibly even slum reaper. I feel like the deck just gets ran over by devotion decks and having a few more ways to keep the board under control would be nice. I don't think jarad really needs to be a 3-of, so I could easily see dropping one for another MD demon/reaper.
Modern:
Twinning End
Commander:
Mayael the Anema
Oh sorry my bad, for some reason I was thinking about blind obedienc
yea scavenging ooze seems like he would wreck this deck. conley was probably pretty bummed to get to the gp and see so many people playing kibbler's GB deck.
Modern:
Twinning End
Commander:
Mayael the Anema
Unfortunately, I really don't see this becoming an actual competitive deck with the current card pool. The deck just wants to ramp into huge, unevasive, unprotected threats that are easily dealt with by the current top-tier decks. This will more than likely just be my FNM fun deck.
yea the deck folds to several strategies and to say that it's somewhat inconsistent is being nice. That said, it can do some powerful things, it's cheap, and it's a blast to play with.
Modern:
Twinning End
Commander:
Mayael the Anema
I basically traded out the Deathrite Shamans for Lotleth Trolls. I feel at 19 lands, it will not reliably be a mana source, and even then, it basically screws over your only real removal spell (apart from the Demon). Lotleth Troll provides much needed reach. Without it, our entire deck can just be chump blocked with Elspeth tokens. Also, the Troll makes for an excellent Nighthowler Bestow target.
I traded the Voyaging Satyr with Axebane Guardians. While it is 1 CMC more, it's a slightly better blocker against aggression and can provide more mana than the Satyr. This might be a completely wrong move here, as maybe getting out the dork turn 2 is more important than at 3.
4 Elvish Mystic
4 Sylvan Carytid
2 Axebane Guardian
4 Lotleth Troll
4 Nighthowler
4 Nemesis of Mortals
3 Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
2 Shadowborn Demon
4 Commune with the Gods
4 Grisly Salvage
4 Drown in Filth
Artifacts (2)
2 Whip of Erebos
Lands (19)
9 Forest
6 Swamp
4 Overgrown Tomb
1 Deadbridge Chant
2 Gift of Orzhova
2 Golgari Charm
3 Lifebane Zombie
2 Shadowborn Demon
3 Thoughtseize
I don't agree that "Jarad does absolutely nothing if you don't have big guys on the field..."
The majority of the time he's a massive creature himself, that's also a recurring threat. I do miss the lack of evasion though, and I think the deck needs another Shadowborn Demon MB. They key is hitting your one drops early, and making sure you prioritize your tutoring with Commune with the Gods and Grisly Salvage correctly.
Good call on the Manaweft Sliver, I see no reason not to play it over Voyaging Satyr. The extra one toughness is not relevant at all, Conley must have overlooked the Sliver.
Because the list plays four Sylvan Caryatids already.
From play testing this deck, having access to that fixing is much more relevant than taking 1dmg 99% of the time, or you don't care trading. Not only that, Satyrs life is mostly spent feeding your demon, or their Desecration Demons. But having access to G/B with Manaweft in a deck that starves for lands is important. I like it.
You can not sac Jarad to himself unfortunately.
jarad only sacrifices other creatures
Modern:
Twinning End
Commander:
Mayael the Anema