I disagree with basically everything you say in the OP.
The Simic deck I'm running relies exclusively on flash and playing things on your opponents turn.
Simic is a tempo deck. Simic is not a ramp deck trying to drop into fatties. That is the job for G/r.Prophet of Kruphix has effectively no place in standard right now. She does nothing to affect the board state immediately. It really doesn't matter if you can play everything you have you are going to run out of cards in hand quickly. You would need a reliable card draw engine coupled with a ton of creatures to make Prophet work.
We are looking to drop threats on our opponents turn that stymies there aggression then allows us to swing back. Our power is in the copious amounts of 2 for 1's we can achieve with flash and other tempo plays.
RamboJesus, I agree that Cyclonic Rift is a staple. But I have weeded out things like Boon Satyr and Simic Charm simply for replacement with better cards. Although Charm is a good sideboard choice.
For my deck, Garruk is the draw engine. Also a few Urban Evolutions to round things out. I have honed it down to mostly creatures to optimize Garruk's +1.
It sounds like you just have a different method in mind. Simic Flash is of course tempo-driven. But a Simic ramp is equally effective for different reasons. Most importantly it handles two of the dominant forces in the meta (Blue Devotion and Black Devotion) really well. It's also surprisingly good at toppling Azorius control, and even better against Esper control.
Really the only trouble my version of Simic has is against really fast aggro, like RDW speed aggro. I'm sure yours does too. But if the opponent isn't laying on damage every single turn without fail, it will stabilize before those last few points of life come off.
And with the only decent flash creatures being 2 or less toughness, Boon Satyr included, I'm sure aggro punishes plenty of those plays with Magma Jets and Shocks.
There's an optimal build, and perhaps various solutions, but like I said, at least we agree on Cyclonic Rift
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"There's plenty of Youth in the world. What we need is a fountain of Smart."
I'm actually looking at Quicken to fill any holes I make. I know that sounds weird but it's pretty restricting not being able to do anything with Piggymaker or Evolution on your opponent's turn with Prophet down and no worthwhile/cheap enough creatures to play. It replaces itself. I don't think it'll be horrible in this deck.[/color]
Urban Evolution's bonus land play would be wasted if played on the opponent's turn anyway.
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"There's plenty of Youth in the world. What we need is a fountain of Smart."
I'm more interested in the three more cards. The extra land drop is really just a nicety, especially in a deck with only 22 of them. Even if Jace's Ingenuity was in standard, Quicken would still be on my mind because of how devastating Piggymaker would be during your opponent's combat. It'd be pretty awesome to watch a blue deck spend all its mana on Thassa's ability and go for the alpha strike just to have its army (god included) turned to ham.
I disagree with basically everything you say in the OP.
The Simic deck I'm running relies exclusively on flash and playing things on your opponents turn.
Simic is a tempo deck. Simic is not a ramp deck trying to drop into fatties. That is the job for G/r. Prophet of Kruphix has effectively no place in standard right now. She does nothing to affect the board state immediately. It really doesn't matter if you can play everything you have you are going to run out of cards in hand quickly. You would need a reliable card draw engine coupled with a ton of creatures to make Prophet work.
We are looking to drop threats on our opponents turn that stymies there aggression then allows us to swing back. Our power is in the copious amounts of 2 for 1's we can achieve with flash and other tempo plays.
Does Zegana not count as a ridiculous draw engine?
Does Zegana not count as a ridiculous draw engine?
I'm assuming you didn't read the OP. He did not mention Prime speaker zegana once.
Anyway Prime Speaker is 6cmc and draws you a ridiculous amount of cards assuming you have something that is going to get her a bunch of +1/+1 counters on her. Since we have a bunch of jank in mana dorks (READ 1 POWER or ZERO when we are speaking of Sylvan Caryatid) Anyway we've got to ramp into prophet and then drop something worthwhile (by this time we are already out of cards) Top deck into one of most likely 2 prime speakers... seeing as having 4 would just ruin a deck completely (in my opinion). Then drop it and since we've got mana dorks and prophet on the field we are dropping a 6cmc creature that is probably a 6/6 (I assume our fatty we dropped was something like polukranos) Then we draw 6 cards and we win the game. I don't really consider that a reliable card draw engine. Seems really chancy to me.
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Would Dark Confidant still be good if he punched you in the face for 5 damage a turn?
RamboJesus is right, I didn't mention Zegana once in the OP. For good reason.
No it's not a ridiculous draw engine. RamboJesus pretty much explained exactly why it's not and why it just plain sucks in the deck. I will add that this meta is so full of removal that it's hard enough keeping fatties on the board as it is....much less to enable Zegana's ETB. The only creature I can think of that would be a somewhat fair fit to the deck and possibly be more consistent at getting a little bit of benefit from Prime Speaker is Witchstalker.
But I'm staying with Garruk as my main draw engine, but this week I'm testing the idea of thinning out a couple Urban Evolutions and putting in a couple Give//Take for the drawing tech.
I must be honest with some play testing I am coming around. Prophet of Kruphix isn't as bad as it seems. Garruk, Caller of Beasts is really an all star here though. I'm not sure there is a better feeling than +1 and drawing 3-4 cards and filtering the other stuff to the bottom.
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Would Dark Confidant still be good if he punched you in the face for 5 damage a turn?
I'd probably play zegana and garruk. I think zegana is a strong card than prophet since it doesn't need to stay on the board to get you value and if it does stay it can be a huge beater. I would probably play a deck towards getting value from zegana, which really just means playing big guys.
I'd probably play zegana and garruk. I think zegana is a strong card than prophet since it doesn't need to stay on the board to get you value and if it does stay it can be a huge beater. I would probably play a deck towards getting value from zegana, which really just means playing big guys.
You play Zegana in response they doomblade your fatty. This is why Zegana is really hit or miss. If you do stick her with relevant effect then you were most likely winning already. She is a sort of "win-more" card right now.
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Would Dark Confidant still be good if he punched you in the face for 5 damage a turn?
You play Zegana in response they doomblade your fatty. This is why Zegana is really hit or miss. If you do stick her with relevant effect then you were most likely winning already. She is a sort of "win-more" card right now.
Wanted to say the same. Since she cost six mana having countermagic up is also unlikely.
I must be honest with some play testing I am coming around. Prophet of Kruphix isn't as bad as it seems. Garruk, Caller of Beasts is really an all star here though. I'm not sure there is a better feeling than +1 and drawing 3-4 cards and filtering the other stuff to the bottom.
Yes indeed, and with Garruk's all-star role, it becomes very apparent why it's so important to minimize and optimize the noncreature slots in this deck.
I've simply tested one too many builds where Garruk was sadly under-utilized with clogged-up piles of counterspells, charms and other noncreature cards that simply didn't offer up that satisfaction of a handful of solid creature threats.
So yeah, it's gotta be a creature heavy deck, but I'll tell ya what - Prime speaker didn't make the cut. I have been playtesting Witchstalker since it came to mind in the earlier post above. I gotta say it's not too bad, fits an otherwise absent 3-drop spot, good body, hexproof and benefits from U/B hate. Jury's still out though.
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"There's plenty of Youth in the world. What we need is a fountain of Smart."
Interesting deck, I like the idea of all the big creatures and leaning more toward devotion.
But I am surprised to see Kalonian Hydra didn't make the cut, even in the sideboard. And if you're running Nylea, Mistcutter Hydra becomes so much better in the main deck, whether going against blue or not.
Sylvan Primordial is a staple in my opinion, and my build doesn't even have as many mana dorks as yours. That's just me though.
I also wouldn't want to rely on prime speaker for card draw, especially only two of them. Those are two spots that could otherwise host a couple hyrdas at the very least.
I would definitely go with Witchstalker over Boon Satyr. Satyr has Flash and Bestow. Okay, well Flash isn't too big of a deal if you're using Kruphix, but even if it were... at 3 mana, Satyr is a weak body and will either eat a burn / removal spell or be used as a throw-away blocker. And once you have enough mana to use Bestow, there are lots of other plays you wanna make at that point with that five-six mana.
Witchstalker on the other hand is hexproof - huge advantage in the current meta over Satyr. Not to mention it benefits from blue and black spells on your turn. The 3/3 base stat is solid as well.
Just my 2 cents, but not a bad deck.
I think Simic's main issue is determining how best to handle aggro. It can really struggle with R/W and red devotion, also a few of the faster Gruul decks seem to give Simic a tough time.
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"There's plenty of Youth in the world. What we need is a fountain of Smart."
So after some consideration I've found that Naturalize is a staple in the sideboard of this deck. There are just so many strong targets for it that can ruin the opponent's day especially if they're siding in Pithing Needle, which many decks do.
With the prominence of so many cards that Naturalize can remove, I even thought about putting 1 or 2 in the main deck, but it's just not optimal for Garruk in game one.
Here's the stuff I can think of that make it a worthwhile SB choice in the standard meta:
The important thing about the creatures chosen to go into simic/prophet decks need to meet a number of criteria. Most decks want to maximize Garruk's +1, since outside of Garruk and Prime Speaker, the deck really has no card draw unless you've got a bident out, assuming you're even playing bident in MD or SB. This means the deck tends to feature very few spells, usually just some number of Rifts. In turn, your creatures need to function as spells. This is why Arbor Colossus and Prime Speaker are chosen. The deck has no trouble outclassing most ground creatures, but Arbor Colossus addresses the weakness in the air, which is crucial in an environment where Chandra's Phoenix, Desecration Demon, and Stormbreath all see play. Prime Speaker gives the deck a powerful draw engine. This is also why you see Disciple in the board.
Secondly, all these creatures, despite being in a simic deck, have one thing in common. They're all green. This ensures Garruk can drop in what you need. Monoblue creatures must be exceptionally good to make it in (see Aetherling).
Next we see one another type of creature- the creature that does work if you untap with it. Normally, these cards are pretty fair since your opponent gets a whole main phase to deal with the problem. But with prophet, that fairness goes right out the window, letting you play them at instants with a wide open mana pool every turn. These guys are designed to stem the tides of aggro before boarding in Disciples, forcing your opponent to deal with them before they can get in more damage. We're looking for good bodies that are good to ramp into on T3, solid plays on T4, or game ending behemoths late game as you play Polukranos EOT, and untap with your Nykthos online.
Lastly, you have ramp. Lots of little guys not only help clog the ground, but they power up Nykthos in order to fire off Rift, as well as assisting you in playing your big guys earlier. They also add devotion for Nylea. They're actually the most important cards to the deck, despite being some of the least exciting and smallest bodies.
So your criteria for choosing creatures for the deck looks like this:
Must be green.
Needs to have a spell attached to it, or is terrifying to untap with, or accelerates me somehow.
This deck already plays the best accelerants, Caryatid and Satyr (which is about to become a certain merfolk once in a few weeks), as well as Mystic.
The best cases to make for this deck until Born of the Gods gets here are probably Kalonian Hydra, or maindecking some number of Disciples.
What this deck really needs is Acidic Slime. Sure, there's Sylvan Primordial, but the deck's matchup against fast aggro is already not ideal preboard, but adding Primordial just makes it that much worse.
To be honest, if I'm able to Garruk out Sylvan Primordial, I'm at a point in the game where I'd really just rather have another Rift in my hand that I can probably cast. I mean, I can either hardcast Sylvan, which means I have Rift mana, or I can cheat Sylvan in with Garruk, which means I'm only 1 mana away from Rift mana.....and if I've made it that far, Rift should just cause me to win right there. So I think Sylvan doesn't make the cut, I'd rather find room to play 4 Rifts before I tried to play Sylvan.
I think a better case can be made for the Kalonian Hydra, especially in Prophet. Hydra is a card you want to cast EOT with Prophet, though he can just as happily be cheated in off of Garruk if he happens to be the only guy in your hand when you tap out for Garruk, and he still gets his counters. Or hardcast midgame. He's flexible no matter when you draw him so that's a big plus. He plays really nice with Mistcutter out of the board, and does silly things with Zegana. Win more things, but still, silly things. He also interacts favorably with Polukranos, but the problem is that Polukranos is the spot that he fights for, and Polukranos has one of your deck's few removal spells attached to him.
Polukranos also has a bigger body out of the gate, relevant when you're flashing him in as a blocker. So again, I feel like the Hydra might be a little win-more, but if you want to try him, you might try him as a 1 of, seeing as how that's about all you should really need to stick.
Now here's an interesting thought for those of you playing 4x Garruks. A single Worldspine Wurm.
Hear me out. Unless Nylea is out, one thing this deck does not do well is trample. For godsakes, it's a 15/15. That leaves behind 5/5 Wurms. Maybe I just think it's too hilarious to ignore. Maybe it's because this is one of the few decks that can actually hardcast him. Maybe I really just want to play him at instant speed and untap into a Zegana. Yes, it's dead till you hit Garruk, but out of all the things in the game you don't want your opponent untapping with, Worldspine Wurm is probably the worst. I'm gonna try one, I'll let you guys know how it works out, but it should be hilarious. It might be worth losing a game or two more to aggro, just to pull it out against some poor midrange player.
Lastly, let me address Boon Satyr. Boon Satyr's main issue is that he's redundant. When cast as an aura, there are usually better things for you to be doing instead. I'd rather be putting another body on the ground to help the fight against an aggro player that I've survived this long against. Sure, I can cast him as another body, but it's another body that is just plain terrible in this matchup, as Magma Jet, Lightning Strike, or even the lowly Rackdos Cackler all eat him up. It's nice that he's an instant, but if you're playing Prophet, aren't all of your creatures instants? Reverent Hunter is better here, for 3 mana. It's the body you want to stick before you get to cast Prophet, particularly good if you've played any number of Burning Tree Emissary/mana dorks this game. It's also an enormous creature later in the game as well. It's more easily justified if you're not playing a full set of Prophet, or if you're not playing it at all, but it seems to me that the best simic builds are all Prophet builds.
For the record, I'm playing a nearly identical list to Robert Graves' notable Simic Prophet deck found here.
To be honest, if I'm able to Garruk out Sylvan Primordial, I'm at a point in the game where I'd really just rather have another Rift in my hand that I can probably cast. I mean, I can either hardcast Sylvan, which means I have Rift mana, or I can cheat Sylvan in with Garruk, which means I'm only 1 mana away from Rift mana.....and if I've made it that far, Rift should just cause me to win right there. So I think Sylvan doesn't make the cut, I'd rather find room to play 4 Rifts before I tried to play Sylvan
Huge misconception here, this is really a very narrow view of S.P. in the deck, and as it pertains to Rift. A more common scenario is that your opponent is playing Azorius, just finally tapped out to drop an Elspeth. There's also a Detention Sphere exiling your Prophet. You would really waste a rift on one or two permanents that'll be back next turn, rather than drop your Garruk, cheat the S.P. and destroy the sphere, fetch a land and have enough to Rift EOT next turn since Prophet untaps your stuff?
Just saying, Rift isn't always gonna compete for timing with Primordial, and Rift is an EOT spell (or mid-combat if you're about to take a lethal swing) against a full board. Unless you're about to die or win the game next turn, Primordial is what gets you the advantage on turn 5-6.
I pretty much agree with most of the other stuff you said, especially about Nylea, she can really help with adding Trample. And Worldspine is a good idea, but I've found that a Mistcutter Hydra with Trample is equally scary, especially if attacking alongside a Kalonian and getting doubled. And yes, you see Kalonian in the same light as I, and if you can cast it EOT, it's about to get brutal.
I also disagree with the idea of running Zegana. He just sucks in this deck, period. (For what it's worth, I supplement Garruk with Urban Evolution for early-mid draws)
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"There's plenty of Youth in the world. What we need is a fountain of Smart."
I've always been a Simic/Bant mage. My last two standard decks were UG Splinterfright and Bant Pod and my favorite all-time standard deck was UG Madness back in Odyssey
That said, I've been tinkering with UG Prophet, and I finally have a list I like. You can check it in my sig. I'll be keeping it up to date. This deck is definitely very versatile and meta-dependant. I'm keeping my fingers crossed for a nice 3-drop in BTG
It's a green devotion deck, with red for Planeswalkers and blue for a couple of key creatures.
Progenitor Mimic is a great card, not just for its interactions in the deck (including the Sylvan Primordial soft lock), but because of how many key creatures it can copy from the opponents. The best one is obviously Master of Waves, but there are far more (Pack Rat, Nightveil Specter, Blood Baron of Vizkopa and Desecration Demon just from black decks).
Prime Speaker Zegana, as well as Garruk and Domri, are how you compete with attrition strategies and Supreme Verdict decks. Even when she can only be as big as a 2/2, drawing two cards is still excellent value; the power simply escalates from there. She's basically the Sphinx's Revelation of the deck. With Progenitor Mimic and the new legend rule, you can fearlessly sacrifice your smaller Zeganas for even more cards.
Prophet of Kruphix is one of the more powerful things you can be doing with 5 mana, as most decks don't want you playing two turns worth of spells when they only get one. In a devotion deck, this also means untapping attackers, mana creatures, and Nykthos.
With this build, the Garruks are most important. Without it, you are relying on the individual card power of your monsters to push through a sea of removal and wrath effects. Zegana can only show up in your hand so often. If protected, your Garruk can attain upwards of 8:1 value.
Sylvan Primordial is kind of the end game plan. Even though your Polukranos and Arbor Colossus will grow larger, Primordial is a multi-layered threat. It can come down early via Garruk. It can destroy trouble permanents like Detention Sphere, the Mountains holding Chained to the Rocks, lands holding Underworld Connections, a slew of Planeswalkers, God weapons, Nykthos, and tons more. It can cut off mana, which could be deadly versus 3 color decks. It blocks basically everything, and attacks through most boards. It gets exponentially better in multiples (value, deck thinning and possibly putting your opponent's mana too far behind), and with Progenitor Mimic it creates a soft lock on your opponent's lands. Heck, one time it even fetched me a Breeding Pool so I could cast Zegana.
The deck is very powerful, and the color consistency is not a big issue. Though you won't always be able to bridge the gap to your high end every single game, this fact is greatly mitigated by 8 scry lands and 8 digging tools.
So Born of the Gods is adding some pretty serious gas to the Simic archetype. I have been LOVING on some Courser of Kruphix as well as Kiora, the Crashing Wave. I decided to go with a more creature-centric build after getting waxed routinely by aggro decks. Courser of Kruphix is the real deal here and I'm seriously considering pre-ordering a playset for 20$ because I'm worried that the price will spike upon release.
There's a few UG decks bouncing around in my meta (more G than U), and they are wrecking UW control. They aim to ramp into a Sylvan Primordial. It's interesting how Sylvan punishes the staple removal card of UW: detention sphere.
I disagree with basically everything you say in the OP.
The Simic deck I'm running relies exclusively on flash and playing things on your opponents turn.
Simic is a tempo deck. Simic is not a ramp deck trying to drop into fatties. That is the job for G/r.Prophet of Kruphix has effectively no place in standard right now. She does nothing to affect the board state immediately. It really doesn't matter if you can play everything you have you are going to run out of cards in hand quickly. You would need a reliable card draw engine coupled with a ton of creatures to make Prophet work.In a Simic deck our all stars are things like Simic Charm Boon Satyr and Cyclonic Rift.
We are looking to drop threats on our opponents turn that stymies there aggression then allows us to swing back. Our power is in the copious amounts of 2 for 1's we can achieve with flash and other tempo plays.
For my deck, Garruk is the draw engine. Also a few Urban Evolutions to round things out. I have honed it down to mostly creatures to optimize Garruk's +1.
It sounds like you just have a different method in mind. Simic Flash is of course tempo-driven. But a Simic ramp is equally effective for different reasons. Most importantly it handles two of the dominant forces in the meta (Blue Devotion and Black Devotion) really well. It's also surprisingly good at toppling Azorius control, and even better against Esper control.
Really the only trouble my version of Simic has is against really fast aggro, like RDW speed aggro. I'm sure yours does too. But if the opponent isn't laying on damage every single turn without fail, it will stabilize before those last few points of life come off.
And with the only decent flash creatures being 2 or less toughness, Boon Satyr included, I'm sure aggro punishes plenty of those plays with Magma Jets and Shocks.
There's an optimal build, and perhaps various solutions, but like I said, at least we agree on Cyclonic Rift
Urban Evolution's bonus land play would be wasted if played on the opponent's turn anyway.
Does Zegana not count as a ridiculous draw engine?
I'm assuming you didn't read the OP. He did not mention Prime speaker zegana once.
Anyway Prime Speaker is 6cmc and draws you a ridiculous amount of cards assuming you have something that is going to get her a bunch of +1/+1 counters on her. Since we have a bunch of jank in mana dorks (READ 1 POWER or ZERO when we are speaking of Sylvan Caryatid) Anyway we've got to ramp into prophet and then drop something worthwhile (by this time we are already out of cards) Top deck into one of most likely 2 prime speakers... seeing as having 4 would just ruin a deck completely (in my opinion). Then drop it and since we've got mana dorks and prophet on the field we are dropping a 6cmc creature that is probably a 6/6 (I assume our fatty we dropped was something like polukranos) Then we draw 6 cards and we win the game. I don't really consider that a reliable card draw engine. Seems really chancy to me.
No it's not a ridiculous draw engine. RamboJesus pretty much explained exactly why it's not and why it just plain sucks in the deck. I will add that this meta is so full of removal that it's hard enough keeping fatties on the board as it is....much less to enable Zegana's ETB. The only creature I can think of that would be a somewhat fair fit to the deck and possibly be more consistent at getting a little bit of benefit from Prime Speaker is Witchstalker.
But I'm staying with Garruk as my main draw engine, but this week I'm testing the idea of thinning out a couple Urban Evolutions and putting in a couple Give//Take for the drawing tech.
You play Zegana in response they doomblade your fatty. This is why Zegana is really hit or miss. If you do stick her with relevant effect then you were most likely winning already. She is a sort of "win-more" card right now.
Wanted to say the same. Since she cost six mana having countermagic up is also unlikely.
Yes indeed, and with Garruk's all-star role, it becomes very apparent why it's so important to minimize and optimize the noncreature slots in this deck.
I've simply tested one too many builds where Garruk was sadly under-utilized with clogged-up piles of counterspells, charms and other noncreature cards that simply didn't offer up that satisfaction of a handful of solid creature threats.
So yeah, it's gotta be a creature heavy deck, but I'll tell ya what - Prime speaker didn't make the cut. I have been playtesting Witchstalker since it came to mind in the earlier post above. I gotta say it's not too bad, fits an otherwise absent 3-drop spot, good body, hexproof and benefits from U/B hate. Jury's still out though.
But I am surprised to see Kalonian Hydra didn't make the cut, even in the sideboard. And if you're running Nylea, Mistcutter Hydra becomes so much better in the main deck, whether going against blue or not.
Sylvan Primordial is a staple in my opinion, and my build doesn't even have as many mana dorks as yours. That's just me though.
I also wouldn't want to rely on prime speaker for card draw, especially only two of them. Those are two spots that could otherwise host a couple hyrdas at the very least.
I would definitely go with Witchstalker over Boon Satyr. Satyr has Flash and Bestow. Okay, well Flash isn't too big of a deal if you're using Kruphix, but even if it were... at 3 mana, Satyr is a weak body and will either eat a burn / removal spell or be used as a throw-away blocker. And once you have enough mana to use Bestow, there are lots of other plays you wanna make at that point with that five-six mana.
Witchstalker on the other hand is hexproof - huge advantage in the current meta over Satyr. Not to mention it benefits from blue and black spells on your turn. The 3/3 base stat is solid as well.
Just my 2 cents, but not a bad deck.
I think Simic's main issue is determining how best to handle aggro. It can really struggle with R/W and red devotion, also a few of the faster Gruul decks seem to give Simic a tough time.
With the prominence of so many cards that Naturalize can remove, I even thought about putting 1 or 2 in the main deck, but it's just not optimal for Garruk in game one.
Here's the stuff I can think of that make it a worthwhile SB choice in the standard meta:
Detention Sphere, Elixir of Immortality, Boon Satyr, Madcap Skills, Spear of Heliod, Bident of Thassa, Whip of Erebos, Underworld Connections, Chained to the Rocks, Ethereal Armor, Assemble the Legion and the other occasional non-god enchantment creatures.
Secondly, all these creatures, despite being in a simic deck, have one thing in common. They're all green. This ensures Garruk can drop in what you need. Monoblue creatures must be exceptionally good to make it in (see Aetherling).
Next we see one another type of creature- the creature that does work if you untap with it. Normally, these cards are pretty fair since your opponent gets a whole main phase to deal with the problem. But with prophet, that fairness goes right out the window, letting you play them at instants with a wide open mana pool every turn. These guys are designed to stem the tides of aggro before boarding in Disciples, forcing your opponent to deal with them before they can get in more damage. We're looking for good bodies that are good to ramp into on T3, solid plays on T4, or game ending behemoths late game as you play Polukranos EOT, and untap with your Nykthos online.
Lastly, you have ramp. Lots of little guys not only help clog the ground, but they power up Nykthos in order to fire off Rift, as well as assisting you in playing your big guys earlier. They also add devotion for Nylea. They're actually the most important cards to the deck, despite being some of the least exciting and smallest bodies.
So your criteria for choosing creatures for the deck looks like this:
Must be green.
Needs to have a spell attached to it, or is terrifying to untap with, or accelerates me somehow.
This deck already plays the best accelerants, Caryatid and Satyr (which is about to become a certain merfolk once in a few weeks), as well as Mystic.
The best cases to make for this deck until Born of the Gods gets here are probably Kalonian Hydra, or maindecking some number of Disciples.
What this deck really needs is Acidic Slime. Sure, there's Sylvan Primordial, but the deck's matchup against fast aggro is already not ideal preboard, but adding Primordial just makes it that much worse.
To be honest, if I'm able to Garruk out Sylvan Primordial, I'm at a point in the game where I'd really just rather have another Rift in my hand that I can probably cast. I mean, I can either hardcast Sylvan, which means I have Rift mana, or I can cheat Sylvan in with Garruk, which means I'm only 1 mana away from Rift mana.....and if I've made it that far, Rift should just cause me to win right there. So I think Sylvan doesn't make the cut, I'd rather find room to play 4 Rifts before I tried to play Sylvan.
I think a better case can be made for the Kalonian Hydra, especially in Prophet. Hydra is a card you want to cast EOT with Prophet, though he can just as happily be cheated in off of Garruk if he happens to be the only guy in your hand when you tap out for Garruk, and he still gets his counters. Or hardcast midgame. He's flexible no matter when you draw him so that's a big plus. He plays really nice with Mistcutter out of the board, and does silly things with Zegana. Win more things, but still, silly things. He also interacts favorably with Polukranos, but the problem is that Polukranos is the spot that he fights for, and Polukranos has one of your deck's few removal spells attached to him.
Polukranos also has a bigger body out of the gate, relevant when you're flashing him in as a blocker. So again, I feel like the Hydra might be a little win-more, but if you want to try him, you might try him as a 1 of, seeing as how that's about all you should really need to stick.
Now here's an interesting thought for those of you playing 4x Garruks. A single Worldspine Wurm.
Hear me out. Unless Nylea is out, one thing this deck does not do well is trample. For godsakes, it's a 15/15. That leaves behind 5/5 Wurms. Maybe I just think it's too hilarious to ignore. Maybe it's because this is one of the few decks that can actually hardcast him. Maybe I really just want to play him at instant speed and untap into a Zegana. Yes, it's dead till you hit Garruk, but out of all the things in the game you don't want your opponent untapping with, Worldspine Wurm is probably the worst. I'm gonna try one, I'll let you guys know how it works out, but it should be hilarious. It might be worth losing a game or two more to aggro, just to pull it out against some poor midrange player.
Lastly, let me address Boon Satyr. Boon Satyr's main issue is that he's redundant. When cast as an aura, there are usually better things for you to be doing instead. I'd rather be putting another body on the ground to help the fight against an aggro player that I've survived this long against. Sure, I can cast him as another body, but it's another body that is just plain terrible in this matchup, as Magma Jet, Lightning Strike, or even the lowly Rackdos Cackler all eat him up. It's nice that he's an instant, but if you're playing Prophet, aren't all of your creatures instants? Reverent Hunter is better here, for 3 mana. It's the body you want to stick before you get to cast Prophet, particularly good if you've played any number of Burning Tree Emissary/mana dorks this game. It's also an enormous creature later in the game as well. It's more easily justified if you're not playing a full set of Prophet, or if you're not playing it at all, but it seems to me that the best simic builds are all Prophet builds.
For the record, I'm playing a nearly identical list to Robert Graves' notable Simic Prophet deck found here.
EDH: Grand Arbiter $tax, Freyalise Stompy, Mimeoplasm Death From the Grave
Sylvan Primordial does this, and can even stay alive blocking a monstrous Stormbreath Dragon
Huge misconception here, this is really a very narrow view of S.P. in the deck, and as it pertains to Rift. A more common scenario is that your opponent is playing Azorius, just finally tapped out to drop an Elspeth. There's also a Detention Sphere exiling your Prophet. You would really waste a rift on one or two permanents that'll be back next turn, rather than drop your Garruk, cheat the S.P. and destroy the sphere, fetch a land and have enough to Rift EOT next turn since Prophet untaps your stuff?
Just saying, Rift isn't always gonna compete for timing with Primordial, and Rift is an EOT spell (or mid-combat if you're about to take a lethal swing) against a full board. Unless you're about to die or win the game next turn, Primordial is what gets you the advantage on turn 5-6.
I pretty much agree with most of the other stuff you said, especially about Nylea, she can really help with adding Trample. And Worldspine is a good idea, but I've found that a Mistcutter Hydra with Trample is equally scary, especially if attacking alongside a Kalonian and getting doubled. And yes, you see Kalonian in the same light as I, and if you can cast it EOT, it's about to get brutal.
I also disagree with the idea of running Zegana. He just sucks in this deck, period. (For what it's worth, I supplement Garruk with Urban Evolution for early-mid draws)
That said, I've been tinkering with UG Prophet, and I finally have a list I like. You can check it in my sig. I'll be keeping it up to date. This deck is definitely very versatile and meta-dependant. I'm keeping my fingers crossed for a nice 3-drop in BTG
Standard:
GU Prophet
Legacy:
WBU Shared Fate
Trades
4 Elvish Mystic
4 Sylvan Caryatid
3 Voyaging Satyr
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
3 Polukranos, World Eater
2 Prophet of Kruphix
2 Arbor Colossus
2 Prime Speaker Zegana
2 Progenitor Mimic
3 Sylvan Primordial
3 Domri Rade
3 Garruk, Caller of Beasts
2 Xenagos, the Reveler
Land - 23
4 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
4 Temple of Abandon
4 Temple of Mystery
4 Breeding Pool
4 Stomping Ground
3 Forest
2 Mizzium Mortars
3 Negate
2 Nylea's Disciple
2 Ruric Thar, the Unbowed
2 Flames of the Firebrand
3 Bramblecrush
1 Plummet
It's a green devotion deck, with red for Planeswalkers and blue for a couple of key creatures.
Progenitor Mimic is a great card, not just for its interactions in the deck (including the Sylvan Primordial soft lock), but because of how many key creatures it can copy from the opponents. The best one is obviously Master of Waves, but there are far more (Pack Rat, Nightveil Specter, Blood Baron of Vizkopa and Desecration Demon just from black decks).
Prime Speaker Zegana, as well as Garruk and Domri, are how you compete with attrition strategies and Supreme Verdict decks. Even when she can only be as big as a 2/2, drawing two cards is still excellent value; the power simply escalates from there. She's basically the Sphinx's Revelation of the deck. With Progenitor Mimic and the new legend rule, you can fearlessly sacrifice your smaller Zeganas for even more cards.
Prophet of Kruphix is one of the more powerful things you can be doing with 5 mana, as most decks don't want you playing two turns worth of spells when they only get one. In a devotion deck, this also means untapping attackers, mana creatures, and Nykthos.
With this build, the Garruks are most important. Without it, you are relying on the individual card power of your monsters to push through a sea of removal and wrath effects. Zegana can only show up in your hand so often. If protected, your Garruk can attain upwards of 8:1 value.
Sylvan Primordial is kind of the end game plan. Even though your Polukranos and Arbor Colossus will grow larger, Primordial is a multi-layered threat. It can come down early via Garruk. It can destroy trouble permanents like Detention Sphere, the Mountains holding Chained to the Rocks, lands holding Underworld Connections, a slew of Planeswalkers, God weapons, Nykthos, and tons more. It can cut off mana, which could be deadly versus 3 color decks. It blocks basically everything, and attacks through most boards. It gets exponentially better in multiples (value, deck thinning and possibly putting your opponent's mana too far behind), and with Progenitor Mimic it creates a soft lock on your opponent's lands. Heck, one time it even fetched me a Breeding Pool so I could cast Zegana.
The deck is very powerful, and the color consistency is not a big issue. Though you won't always be able to bridge the gap to your high end every single game, this fact is greatly mitigated by 8 scry lands and 8 digging tools.
So Born of the Gods is adding some pretty serious gas to the Simic archetype. I have been LOVING on some Courser of Kruphix as well as Kiora, the Crashing Wave. I decided to go with a more creature-centric build after getting waxed routinely by aggro decks. Courser of Kruphix is the real deal here and I'm seriously considering pre-ordering a playset for 20$ because I'm worried that the price will spike upon release.
Updated deck list:
7 x Island
4 x Temple of Mystery
4 x Breeding Pool
8 x Forest
4 x Elvish Mystic
4 x Sylvan Caryatid
1 x Kiora's Follower
4 x Courser of Kruphix
2 x Master Biomancer
2 x Polukranos, World Eater
3 x Prognostic Sphinx
4 x Prophet of Kruphix
2 x Prime Speaker Zegana
3 x Sylvan Primordial
4 x Cyclonic Rift
2 x Primeval Bounty
2 x Kiora, the Crashing Wave
Sideboard:
2 x AEtherling
3 x Gainsay
3 x Mistcutter Hydra
3 x AEtherize
2 x Simic Charm
2 x Curse of the Swine
Roon of the Pod People (Roon of the Hidden Realm)
Sydri, Super Genius (Sydri, Galvanic Genius)
Marchesa, the Black Rose
Lazav, Dimir Mastermind
Retired:
Grimgrin's Corpse-Beats (Grimgrin, Corpse-Born) | Jeleva, Nephalia's Scourge | Varolz, the Scar-Striped (1v1) | Glissa, the Traitor