Wait till Marvel and Relentless Dead get banned because WotC's Superman needs to be the top dog.
Speaking (a little bit more) seriously, it's not much of a surprise. Control is dead so the only reliable combo and the only aggro that can consistently match it's speed are the only decks worth playing outside of FNM.
If they pull that stunt I think people will collectively give MtG the finger and finally leave the game for good after all the things that went down the last year or so.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Poor Yuuya. It just came down to a really bad shuffle.
Some great games in the top four and finals though. Quarters were already over by the time I got home from work. Given a few weeks it seems like the meta will shake out better than it was before Guardians ban. Puzzle Quests Sultai Marvel looked really good and I like Yuuya's version of Temur Marvel more than the "regular" version.
The pro tour is just a meta call. Just like how the last pro tour call was copycat, this time it's Mardu Vehicles.
Though if this pro tour is supposed to be indicative of the format until Hour of Devastation, I'm disappointed to see that it still looks pretty stale. At best we're looking at a format comprised of Zombies, Aetherworks Marvel, Mardu Vehicles, B/G Energy, and some control deck (probably U/R); the last two will likely be just a splash and fall behind about halfway through the format.
I wonder if any of the zombie decks tested Throne of the God Pharoah, it turns drawing with cryptbreaker into damage and the tapped zombies that diregraf colossus into play
I took at look at the 7 wins or better standard decks.
And it looks like a three deck format. Aetherworks, Zombies and Mardu vechicals.
U/R control and G/B energy tier 2.
I am not sure if mardu was just played by weaker (non teamed?) players or people weaker at limited but it is still a good deck and it is still a pillar of standard.
Personally I like the zombies deck, it is not doing anything particularly busted it is just a resilant aggro deck. When most of its cards are creatures you can easily attack that. It isn't like Mardu where it is all over the place with card types that are hard to deal with because of the limits of controlling cards and its not RNGing Ulamog like aetherworks.
I think the biggest problem with the zombie decks are the fact that they can dodge Sweltering Suns with all the anthem effects they have or just save them in hand to dodge the Dusk part of Dusk // Dawn. The W/R human decks do this with their anthems as well though they don't put out as much board pressure as zombies.
The Aetherworks decks seem to be beatable removing all the Aetherworks with Dispossess and singling out the Ulamogs.
Why on earth would UR Control teams bring that over Jeskai? UR just folds to resolved Ulamog, and that sometimes will slip through. They must have missed Marvel in their gauntlet... There were like 3 people playing Jeskai Control, best one being 6-4 in standard, but if best players from CFB Ice had white in their control, I'm sure they would do better. I still believe Control is alive, just UR is strict anti-aggro, not at all good...
Thoughts about the format from an amateur wannabe grinder:
- Marvel is the defining deck of the format, the best archetype of the format, and the barometer by which all other decks in the format are checked. I think the Chandra, Flamecaller version is the best version of Marvel. I'm not sure if it will become standard issue, and it will be interesting to see how the Marvel decks evolve, but Chandra does everything the deck has ever wanted (sweeper, alt wincon, way to utilize uncastable Ulamogs) in four deckbuilding slots instead of twelve. The Japanese Bluehulk version is interesting, and the team that built it totally killed the Pro Tour, but I think that version is probably in a bad spot in terms of interactive spells -- enough to dilute energy generation significantly yet not enough in the way of reliable, consistent controlling elements to be a good "Marvel Control" deck.
- For God's sake play four Ulamogs and a way to use ones you drew and can't cast. You can win without hitting Ulamog, but all the versions being conservative with 2-3 copies kept bricking on it when they needed it, while the ones who just played 4 and had some way to use the ones drawn didn't suffer from that problem. I'm biased toward Chandra pitching them over Bounty of the Luxa and/or Nissa's Renewal, but just find some way to use them.
- Zombies is your best bet to fight the menace. BW Zombies outperformed Mono-B against Marvel and in the mirror, but I think on paper Mono-B is better built to fight Marvel despite the data; you want consistent mana so you can curve out with Lords and put them on Ulamog-or-bust. I don't have very strong opinions about this and I'm open to being wrong, especially since the data indicates I am lol.
- Mardu is probably still fine but needs to get lower to the ground. Racing Zombies is your best bet; Zombies has a good matchup against the midrange-look Mardu Vehicles decks because Mardu blocks very poorly and isn't consistently fast enough, but the WR-base versions with Veteran Motorist and even Depala, Pilot Exemplar get closer. These versions are also slightly better equipped to splash blue for Ceremonious Rejection as anti-Marvel tech, since they naturally play Mountains (which turn into Spirebluff Canals) and are better rewarded for playing Cultivator's Caravan.
- Control is still not there, sorry. It's good against Zombies but pretty bad against both Mardu and Marvel.
I agree the Chandra, Flamecaller version of marvel is the best one given zombies are a thing right now. Being able to fish up a board sweep that can kill the opponents board and still stay standing is really good, and she can swing in for 6 if she lives to the following turn. That's better than a 10/10 indestructable titan that at best will exile two things that don't matter to the zombie player. Also, the fact they finally got an alternative way to bring big things into play is making the deck far more reliable than it once was.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I agree the Chandra, Flamecaller version of marvel is the best one given zombies are a thing right now. Being able to fish up a board sweep that can kill the opponents board and still stay standing is really good, and she can swing in for 6 if she lives to the following turn. That's better than a 10/10 indestructable titan that at best will exile two things that don't matter to the zombie player. Also, the fact they finally got an alternative way to bring big things into play is making the deck far more reliable than it once was.
What alternative way are you talking about? I do agree, though, if everybody start playing zombies than Chandra, Flamecaller is much better than torch of defiance. If you play flamecaller you could also play commit // memory and you can discard Ulamog(s) from your hand and shuffle them back to your library with memory.
I agree the Chandra, Flamecaller version of marvel is the best one given zombies are a thing right now. Being able to fish up a board sweep that can kill the opponents board and still stay standing is really good, and she can swing in for 6 if she lives to the following turn. That's better than a 10/10 indestructable titan that at best will exile two things that don't matter to the zombie player. Also, the fact they finally got an alternative way to bring big things into play is making the deck far more reliable than it once was.
What alternative way are you talking about? I do agree, though, if everybody start playing zombies than Chandra, Flamecaller is much better than torch of defiance. If you play flamecaller you could also play commit // memory and you can discard Ulamog(s) from your hand and shuffle them back to your library with memory.
Some of the decks added a few mana ramp cards to the sideboard, but I'm not sure if I saw those in the Top 8 decks.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I agree the Chandra, Flamecaller version of marvel is the best one given zombies are a thing right now. Being able to fish up a board sweep that can kill the opponents board and still stay standing is really good, and she can swing in for 6 if she lives to the following turn. That's better than a 10/10 indestructable titan that at best will exile two things that don't matter to the zombie player. Also, the fact they finally got an alternative way to bring big things into play is making the deck far more reliable than it once was.
What alternative way are you talking about? I do agree, though, if everybody start playing zombies than Chandra, Flamecaller is much better than torch of defiance. If you play flamecaller you could also play commit // memory and you can discard Ulamog(s) from your hand and shuffle them back to your library with memory.
Some of the decks added a few mana ramp cards to the sideboard, but I'm not sure if I saw those in the Top 8 decks.
I play 2 bounty of the luxa and it's been overperforming against midrange and control.
I agree the Chandra, Flamecaller version of marvel is the best one given zombies are a thing right now. Being able to fish up a board sweep that can kill the opponents board and still stay standing is really good, and she can swing in for 6 if she lives to the following turn. That's better than a 10/10 indestructable titan that at best will exile two things that don't matter to the zombie player. Also, the fact they finally got an alternative way to bring big things into play is making the deck far more reliable than it once was.
What alternative way are you talking about? I do agree, though, if everybody start playing zombies than Chandra, Flamecaller is much better than torch of defiance. If you play flamecaller you could also play commit // memory and you can discard Ulamog(s) from your hand and shuffle them back to your library with memory.
Some of the decks added a few mana ramp cards to the sideboard, but I'm not sure if I saw those in the Top 8 decks.
I play 2 bounty of the luxa and it's been overperforming against midrange and control.
Yeah, that is the card I was thinking of. A couple of the marvel decks have been running those in the sideboard.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
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If they pull that stunt I think people will collectively give MtG the finger and finally leave the game for good after all the things that went down the last year or so.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Some great games in the top four and finals though. Quarters were already over by the time I got home from work. Given a few weeks it seems like the meta will shake out better than it was before Guardians ban. Puzzle Quests Sultai Marvel looked really good and I like Yuuya's version of Temur Marvel more than the "regular" version.
Though if this pro tour is supposed to be indicative of the format until Hour of Devastation, I'm disappointed to see that it still looks pretty stale. At best we're looking at a format comprised of Zombies, Aetherworks Marvel, Mardu Vehicles, B/G Energy, and some control deck (probably U/R); the last two will likely be just a splash and fall behind about halfway through the format.
And it looks like a three deck format. Aetherworks, Zombies and Mardu vechicals.
U/R control and G/B energy tier 2.
I am not sure if mardu was just played by weaker (non teamed?) players or people weaker at limited but it is still a good deck and it is still a pillar of standard.
Personally I like the zombies deck, it is not doing anything particularly busted it is just a resilant aggro deck. When most of its cards are creatures you can easily attack that. It isn't like Mardu where it is all over the place with card types that are hard to deal with because of the limits of controlling cards and its not RNGing Ulamog like aetherworks.
Pioneer:UR Pheonix
Modern:U Mono U Tron
EDH
GB Glissa, the traitor: Army of Cans
UW Dragonlord Ojutai: Dragonlord NOjutai
UWGDerevi, Empyrial Tactician "you cannot fight the storm"
R Zirilan of the claw. The solution to every problem is dragons
UB Etrata, the Silencer Cloning assassination
Peasant cube: Cards I own
The Aetherworks decks seem to be beatable removing all the Aetherworks with Dispossess and singling out the Ulamogs.
- Marvel is the defining deck of the format, the best archetype of the format, and the barometer by which all other decks in the format are checked. I think the Chandra, Flamecaller version is the best version of Marvel. I'm not sure if it will become standard issue, and it will be interesting to see how the Marvel decks evolve, but Chandra does everything the deck has ever wanted (sweeper, alt wincon, way to utilize uncastable Ulamogs) in four deckbuilding slots instead of twelve. The Japanese Bluehulk version is interesting, and the team that built it totally killed the Pro Tour, but I think that version is probably in a bad spot in terms of interactive spells -- enough to dilute energy generation significantly yet not enough in the way of reliable, consistent controlling elements to be a good "Marvel Control" deck.
- For God's sake play four Ulamogs and a way to use ones you drew and can't cast. You can win without hitting Ulamog, but all the versions being conservative with 2-3 copies kept bricking on it when they needed it, while the ones who just played 4 and had some way to use the ones drawn didn't suffer from that problem. I'm biased toward Chandra pitching them over Bounty of the Luxa and/or Nissa's Renewal, but just find some way to use them.
- Zombies is your best bet to fight the menace. BW Zombies outperformed Mono-B against Marvel and in the mirror, but I think on paper Mono-B is better built to fight Marvel despite the data; you want consistent mana so you can curve out with Lords and put them on Ulamog-or-bust. I don't have very strong opinions about this and I'm open to being wrong, especially since the data indicates I am lol.
- Mardu is probably still fine but needs to get lower to the ground. Racing Zombies is your best bet; Zombies has a good matchup against the midrange-look Mardu Vehicles decks because Mardu blocks very poorly and isn't consistently fast enough, but the WR-base versions with Veteran Motorist and even Depala, Pilot Exemplar get closer. These versions are also slightly better equipped to splash blue for Ceremonious Rejection as anti-Marvel tech, since they naturally play Mountains (which turn into Spirebluff Canals) and are better rewarded for playing Cultivator's Caravan.
- Control is still not there, sorry. It's good against Zombies but pretty bad against both Mardu and Marvel.
GW ~ Angels ~ WG
Modern:
RBW ~ Shadowmancer ~ WBR
Legacy:
BUG ~ Shadow Delver ~ GUB
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Some of the decks added a few mana ramp cards to the sideboard, but I'm not sure if I saw those in the Top 8 decks.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Yeah, that is the card I was thinking of. A couple of the marvel decks have been running those in the sideboard.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!