So, I seem to have this problem. I've been playing in standard tournaments off and on for about 2 years now. I've played at Opens, PTQs, IQs, FNMs and stuff like that. During my two years I've only gone to a draw because of time maybe once or twice at most. Now what really grinds my gears is how pushy some people get about time in matches. At most big events I go to I meet at least one person who says "You're playing too slow, you need to speed up," when there is literally like almost 40 minutes left on the clock. I play at the pace I do because I don't like to make play mistakes, and often after these very ballsy people say this to me, I get flustered and irritated and then I actually make dumb play mistakes. Half the time this happens I end up actually playing really sloppy and losing the match, and then I look up the clock as I'm packing up my mat and see that I now have 25-30 minutes to twiddle my thumbs before end of round. I guess I just get easily flustered, but I don't want this to stop me from playing in competitive settings. I really don't know how to respond in a respectful manor to people that do this and sometime I say nothing for fear of having an overreaction. I mean if I have strong reaction they'll probably call a judge on me and then I'll have whole other problem. Game one of a match is fairly critical because no one has sideboarded yet, so I really don't like rushing through it just to get to game two.
So I guess I'm asking you guys if you've had this problem and how you've dealt with it or how you might deal with it. I thought about keeping a stop watch so I could keep my play time similar to how it is kept on mtgo, but yea I don't know. I just don't think I should have to do that to not have people complaining at me and threatening to call a judge every two seconds.
So, I seem to have this problem. I've been playing in standard tournaments off and on for about 2 years now. I've played at Opens, PTQs, IQs, FNMs and stuff like that. During my two years I've only gone to a draw because of time maybe once or twice at most. Now what really grinds my gears is how pushy some people get about time in matches. I swear every event I go to I meet at least one person who says "You're playing too slow, you need to speed up," when there is literally like almost 40 minutes left on the clock. I play at the pace I do because I don't like to make play mistakes, and often after these very ballsy people say this to me, I get flustered and irritated and then I actually make dumb play mistakes. Half the time this happens I end up actually playing really sloppy and losing the match, and then I look up the clock as I'm packing up my mat and see that I now have 25-30 minutes to twiddle my thumbs before end of round. I guess I just get easily flustered, but I don't want this to stop me from playing in competitive settings. I really don't know how to respond in a respectful manor to people that do this and sometime I say nothing for fear of having an overreaction. I mean if I have strong reaction they'll probably call a judge on me and then I'll have whole other problem. Game one of a match is fairly critical because no one has sideboarded yet, so I really don't like rushing through it just to get to game two.
So I guess I'm asking you guys if you've had this problem and how you've dealt with it or how you might deal with it. I thought about keeping a stop watch so I could keep my play time similar to how it is kept on mtgo, but yea I don't know. I just don't think I should have to do that to not have people complaining at me and threatening to call a judge every two seconds.
I would preemptively call a judge myself. There are a lot of time whiners in magic who think you have to do everything super fast. But if you watch top players play on SCG and such they all spend around ten seconds (often more) in between every decision. There are a bunch of players who take the game too seriously and whine a lot. It's always better to just get a judge and explain that every time you spend more than a moment deciding what to do the other player is hassling you and making it harder to play your turn. That kind of player will love waiting for the judge, too.
I havent experienced people rushing me, but i agree about people speaking up in the game, and then making a bad descision because they said something. What i get is people prompting me as to whether its their turn or not yet. Asking me "Are you done yet?" Results in my play mistakes. Shoot, forgot to +1 planeswalker and play a creature on my second main phase. As if there is turn end directly after battle. I hav lost many games because i am nice and go "yeah ok" before realizing no, im not done my turn yet. I know its all on me, but i dont feel people should be allowed to prompt you and rush you. Its just distracting. Like wait, what was i about to do? Sure go ahead.
I would say if you are playing at events with a lot of people you don't know and are worried about this happening wear headphones. Music will help you stay focused and it will drown out your surroundings.
You have someone saying you should speed up at every tournament? That seems like a fairly unusual experience. I've seen some extremely slow players plod along game after game after game and frequently draw without anyone telling them to speed up. Are you sure your turns aren't taking a lot longer than you think?
Ya. First thing I would ask is "is it true?" 10-20 sec between actions is ok.. 40s to a min, ya that's a problem.
However, I agree with the calling a judge on time harassment. The reason peeps do that is to intimidate you. You should take the control away from them.
I havent experienced people rushing me, but i agree about people speaking up in the game, and then making a bad descision because they said something. What i get is people prompting me as to whether its their turn or not yet. Asking me "Are you done yet?" Results in my play mistakes. Shoot, forgot to +1 planeswalker and play a creature on my second main phase. As if there is turn end directly after battle. I hav lost many games because i am nice and go "yeah ok" before realizing no, im not done my turn yet. I know its all on me, but i dont feel people should be allowed to prompt you and rush you. Its just distracting. Like wait, what was i about to do? Sure go ahead.
Get in the habit of announcing Combat, Second Main and Pass. Those are when all the major actions happen as the active player. And it also tells your opponent that you notified him of steps and passing priorities. It will make you a better technical player also.
IMO, every tourney player should learn to announce those steps.
I agree with stalling to intentionally take advantage of time. But what if that person just plays a little slow naturally. Do they warn someone for being natural? That does not seem within the spirit of the game state.
Ya. First thing I would ask is "is it true?" 10-20 sec between actions is ok.. 40s to a min, ya that's a problem.
However, I agree with the calling a judge on time harassment. The reason peeps do that is to intimidate you. You should take the control away from them.
I've never had anyone tell me to speed up ever, not even in GP Trials or GPs. If this happens to the OP "constantly" than chances are he/she truely is playing at a very slow pace and actually needs to speed up. I'm pretty sure most people don't use "speed up your game please" to "intimidate" people, at least it has never happened to me anywhere ever.
Just try not to get flustered and answer in a calm manner if you truely disagree about playing too slowly.
The idea about wearing headphones only works between rounds. During rounds, you're supposed to be listening to your opponent since he/she will announce triggers/targets/actions and ask you about unclear game states like cards in hand/looking at your graveyard/how much mana open etc.
If you cannot communicate with me because you're listening to loud music during the match (which is extremely inpolite, btw.), I will ask you once to please stop doing so because we need to be able to communicate during the match - if you insist on continuing listening to music, I would call a judge over almost immediately.
Tl;dr: You (OP) actually might be the problem - if not, stay calm and state that you think you're playing fast enough. Don't be an impolite . . . person out of fear people might want to "intimidate" you.
I find that I frequently have people tell me to speed not when I'm taking a long time to do things, but when there are a lot of things to do.
Just as an example, when RTR and Theros was first was first out, Heliod, God of the Sun + Assemble the Legion + Sphere of Safety + Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx + pacifism-style cards in one deck was something I tried, and it created a lot to do - keep a count of devotion, keep a count of enchantments, remember the soldier trigger, make Heliod tokens at the start of attack step... People would often tell me to hurry up even though I was actively doing something every moment of every turn.
At a decently sized event I went to turns and missed an ATL trigger with a judge watching and my opponent telling me to hurry up... both of them said nothing... (Didn't change the game outcome, but still...)
In my opinion people get all uptight about speed when they perceive a game will take a while, not when you, the player, are actually playing slowly.
Thanks everyone for the responses. This hasn't happened to me in every tournament I've ever been to, that was an exaggeration on my part, but it does happen to me frequently. I am a slow player, never said I wasn't. I don't make lightning quick decisions when I have a lot of options in front of me, because then I make a lot of mistakes. I think if you are not a slow player, or if you play mostly aggro, you are not going to run into this response very often. I always play brews at major tournaments, this may also add as an irritant when I'm taking a little longer, because people may just feel that it should be an auto-win or they're annoyed that they are playing a deck that they have no knowledge of.
I think I am just going to start telling people to call a judge if they think I am playing too slow. I play slow, but I don't play so slow that it would cause us to go to a draw. It would not bother me if people were telling me to speed up late in the match, but doing it with well over half the time left bothers me and often feels like intimidation whether it is or not. Recently I've been trying to play decks with less to keep track of for this reason. Either way thanks for the responses everybody.
I can't express to you enough how in competitive settings above FNM the whiners. If someone is vocally harassing you on your turn call judge. Its a game loss because they shouldnt be doing that. Secondly, don;t ferget to change your sleeves often.
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I would say if you are playing at events with a lot of people you don't know and are worried about this happening wear headphones. Music will help you stay focused and it will drown out your surroundings.
Sadly we are no longer allowed to wear headphones in Competative REL events or use ANY electronic devices during a game anymore. It's made more than a few people upset. You can wear headphones between games while shuffling and sideboarding (technically), but not during the game.
It's quite simple. If I have to think for a while I verbally express to my opponent that I need to take more time than usual on a specific decision. Its also worth mentioning that your familiarity with your deck as well as the field you're playing against will in theory speed up your play. If the other player keep on insisting I'm playing slow, I tell them to slow their roll before I call a judge and we waste more time.
Your oponent should just call a judge over because you slow play. Self regulating in a tournament is not good. Or your opoent is rude for no reason. Hard to tell withouth being there.
I would also like to point out that macking the right plays in a reasenable amount of time is a test of your skill level as well. Time is a factor in how good a player is. If a player is taking to long is taking time from his oponent.
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Thanks everyone for the responses. This hasn't happened to me in every tournament I've ever been to, that was an exaggeration on my part, but it does happen to me frequently. I am a slow player, never said I wasn't. I don't make lightning quick decisions when I have a lot of options in front of me, because then I make a lot of mistakes. I think if you are not a slow player, or if you play mostly aggro, you are not going to run into this response very often. I always play brews at major tournaments, this may also add as an irritant when I'm taking a little longer, because people may just feel that it should be an auto-win or they're annoyed that they are playing a deck that they have no knowledge of.
I think I am just going to start telling people to call a judge if they think I am playing too slow. I play slow, but I don't play so slow that it would cause us to go to a draw. It would not bother me if people were telling me to speed up late in the match, but doing it with well over half the time left bothers me and often feels like intimidation whether it is or not. Recently I've been trying to play decks with less to keep track of for this reason. Either way thanks for the responses everybody.
piloting a deck that requires a "lot of thinking" isn't an excuse to play slow, mind you. Everyone is expected to play at a reasonable pace at competitive tournaments and you should play decks you know well enough so that your turns don't take unusually long.
I do think calling the judge is the right call. There *are* people who complain about slow play for no good reason and I don't think they should get away with being rude to others.
That's an interesting article. I think the author comes off a little abrasive, but I thought the numbers were very interesting to look at. I might actually consider bringing a stop watch with me to events, just to get a realistic time frame. I'm not certain I agree that it equates to skill level though. I would be willing to bet though that people who are less familiar with the decks they are playing take more time to make decisions, probably especially during sideboarding as the article suggests.
There are also people who do play "aggresively" and use this to try and prod their opponents into making mistake on purpose, and there are plenty of ppl that play slow on purpose to annoy their opponent (but most are just tryingto make sure they arent screwing up).
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From my experience at standard FNM and Pre-release, almost 90% of the time when I see slow play it is used to gain advantage. Where I play there was 2 players who loved to slow play with rev decks, it was to the point that every match they played in a 5 round FNM never made it to game 3. This happened weeks on end. I play my turns fast, so this was never really an issue for me, but for newer players this is really annoying and for everyone else who as to wait an extra 15-20 minutes to start a new round because of players slow playing.
This game isn't hard to play, most turns shouldn't take over 20 seconds to play, if someone takes over a minute for a single turn without huge combat math, 99% of the time they are slow playing.
I've never had an opponent ask me to play faster and during turns which I know I will take long (game-deciding turn, or complicated combat) I will tell my opponent that I might need a minute or two to think. I play pretty fast to begin with and I don't even use up my share of the 50 minutes so I've never had an opponent object to me taking my time on an important turn.
I think slow-playing is a big problem and there are no valid excuses for it at Competitive REL +. Unfamiliarity with a deck or format is your problem, not your opponents, and your opponent should not have his time cut into because you failed to do your homework. I really wish it were viable to use a chess clock.
If you have one or two people tell you you're playing slow, maybe they are wrong. But once you have five or six people tell you the same thing, I think the chances are pretty good that at least one of them is right.
As ridiculous as this sounds two Saturdays ago I had an opponent tell me I'm not playing fast enough when I was the first one done in each match up to him and even when our game concluded (he still lost) I was still the first person done. I'm pretty sure they're not really annoyed about how "Fast" or "Slow" you're playing but an attempt to aggravate you. I say this because if I was going any faster I think my cards would have flew out of my hand.
I wouldn't let it bother you too much. Let your opponent say whatever they want. As long as you're not making slow plays don't let it get to your head.
Your oponent should just call a judge over because you slow play. Self regulating in a tournament is not good. Or your opoent is rude for no reason. Hard to tell withouth being there.
I would also like to point out that macking the right plays in a reasenable amount of time is a test of your skill level as well. Time is a factor in how good a player is. If a player is taking to long is taking time from his oponent.
They should use chess timers and just make the IRL version like MTGO where the first person to run out of time loses.
Your oponent should just call a judge over because you slow play. Self regulating in a tournament is not good. Or your opoent is rude for no reason. Hard to tell withouth being there.
I would also like to point out that macking the right plays in a reasenable amount of time is a test of your skill level as well. Time is a factor in how good a player is. If a player is taking to long is taking time from his oponent.
They should use chess timers and just make the IRL version like MTGO where the first person to run out of time loses.
If they did this they would unban cards in other formats. But, it would put a lot more pressure on players because the game should have freedom of thought. Magics a hard game, and even the pros have to stop, take a breath and think for a minute.
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Your oponent should just call a judge over because you slow play. Self regulating in a tournament is not good. Or your opoent is rude for no reason. Hard to tell withouth being there.
I would also like to point out that macking the right plays in a reasenable amount of time is a test of your skill level as well. Time is a factor in how good a player is. If a player is taking to long is taking time from his oponent.
They should use chess timers and just make the IRL version like MTGO where the first person to run out of time loses.
If they did this they would unban cards in other formats. But, it would put a lot more pressure on players because the game should have freedom of thought. Magics a hard game, and even the pros have to stop, take a breath and think for a minute.
How does it impede freedome of thought? You get 25 minutes, or whatever, to play your entire set of match-turns. If you want to take a breath and think about a move for 2 minutes, that's your call.
It would alleviate your opponent getting mad, since you're putting your time on the line and not his.
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So I guess I'm asking you guys if you've had this problem and how you've dealt with it or how you might deal with it. I thought about keeping a stop watch so I could keep my play time similar to how it is kept on mtgo, but yea I don't know. I just don't think I should have to do that to not have people complaining at me and threatening to call a judge every two seconds.
I would preemptively call a judge myself. There are a lot of time whiners in magic who think you have to do everything super fast. But if you watch top players play on SCG and such they all spend around ten seconds (often more) in between every decision. There are a bunch of players who take the game too seriously and whine a lot. It's always better to just get a judge and explain that every time you spend more than a moment deciding what to do the other player is hassling you and making it harder to play your turn. That kind of player will love waiting for the judge, too.
However, I agree with the calling a judge on time harassment. The reason peeps do that is to intimidate you. You should take the control away from them.
Get in the habit of announcing Combat, Second Main and Pass. Those are when all the major actions happen as the active player. And it also tells your opponent that you notified him of steps and passing priorities. It will make you a better technical player also.
IMO, every tourney player should learn to announce those steps.
Seems like it's ok to ask once for your opponent to hurry up.
I agree with stalling to intentionally take advantage of time. But what if that person just plays a little slow naturally. Do they warn someone for being natural? That does not seem within the spirit of the game state.
A little better definition is in order IMO.
I find that I frequently have people tell me to speed not when I'm taking a long time to do things, but when there are a lot of things to do.
Just as an example, when RTR and Theros was first was first out, Heliod, God of the Sun + Assemble the Legion + Sphere of Safety + Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx + pacifism-style cards in one deck was something I tried, and it created a lot to do - keep a count of devotion, keep a count of enchantments, remember the soldier trigger, make Heliod tokens at the start of attack step... People would often tell me to hurry up even though I was actively doing something every moment of every turn.
At a decently sized event I went to turns and missed an ATL trigger with a judge watching and my opponent telling me to hurry up... both of them said nothing... (Didn't change the game outcome, but still...)
In my opinion people get all uptight about speed when they perceive a game will take a while, not when you, the player, are actually playing slowly.
I think I am just going to start telling people to call a judge if they think I am playing too slow. I play slow, but I don't play so slow that it would cause us to go to a draw. It would not bother me if people were telling me to speed up late in the match, but doing it with well over half the time left bothers me and often feels like intimidation whether it is or not. Recently I've been trying to play decks with less to keep track of for this reason. Either way thanks for the responses everybody.
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GR Ulasht, the Hate Seed RG
Sadly we are no longer allowed to wear headphones in Competative REL events or use ANY electronic devices during a game anymore. It's made more than a few people upset. You can wear headphones between games while shuffling and sideboarding (technically), but not during the game.
http://www.channelfireball.com/articles/silvestri-says-its-time-to-stamp-out-slow-play/
Your oponent should just call a judge over because you slow play. Self regulating in a tournament is not good. Or your opoent is rude for no reason. Hard to tell withouth being there.
I would also like to point out that macking the right plays in a reasenable amount of time is a test of your skill level as well. Time is a factor in how good a player is. If a player is taking to long is taking time from his oponent.
piloting a deck that requires a "lot of thinking" isn't an excuse to play slow, mind you. Everyone is expected to play at a reasonable pace at competitive tournaments and you should play decks you know well enough so that your turns don't take unusually long.
I do think calling the judge is the right call. There *are* people who complain about slow play for no good reason and I don't think they should get away with being rude to others.
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This game isn't hard to play, most turns shouldn't take over 20 seconds to play, if someone takes over a minute for a single turn without huge combat math, 99% of the time they are slow playing.
I think slow-playing is a big problem and there are no valid excuses for it at Competitive REL +. Unfamiliarity with a deck or format is your problem, not your opponents, and your opponent should not have his time cut into because you failed to do your homework. I really wish it were viable to use a chess clock.
If you have one or two people tell you you're playing slow, maybe they are wrong. But once you have five or six people tell you the same thing, I think the chances are pretty good that at least one of them is right.
I wouldn't let it bother you too much. Let your opponent say whatever they want. As long as you're not making slow plays don't let it get to your head.
They should use chess timers and just make the IRL version like MTGO where the first person to run out of time loses.
With all of the priority changes in a MTG game, this is completely infeasible.
If they did this they would unban cards in other formats. But, it would put a lot more pressure on players because the game should have freedom of thought. Magics a hard game, and even the pros have to stop, take a breath and think for a minute.
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GR Ulasht, the Hate Seed RG
How does it impede freedome of thought? You get 25 minutes, or whatever, to play your entire set of match-turns. If you want to take a breath and think about a move for 2 minutes, that's your call.
It would alleviate your opponent getting mad, since you're putting your time on the line and not his.