The 2 power and first strike kills/deters blocking from most things in the format, but there's not a whole lot of room in the deck, especially at 2cc. The drawback is also pretty huge (can't block), and it dies to pings, Electrickery, etc.
The 2 power and first strike kills/deters blocking from most things in the format, but there's not a whole lot of room in the deck, especially at 2cc. The drawback is also pretty huge (can't block), and it dies to pings, Electrickery, etc.
Seems pretty bad, I'd play any of Mogg Flunkies, Mudbrawler Cohort, or even a non-Goblin in Frostburn Weird in the 2 drop slot before I'd ever want to play this guy. The biggest problem I have with him is that he just bricks himself against half of the format. Delver has Frostburn Weird and Spire Golem, Affinity has Enforcer and Carapace Forger. Even a simple Sea-Gate Oracle out of a Post deck can stop this guy without any help from Sledder/Raider.
A big thanks to you Dromar for keeping this primer up and current! I've really benefited from your suggestions and card analysis. I thought i'd get your opinion on my current Goblins build.
I was wondering also what your opinion of Raid Bombardment and Pyrewild Shaman were? One new card and one old one. It seems to me that the effect of Bombardment is slightly better then Hissing Iguanar though as an enchantment it doesn't empower your cohorts and conscripts.
The repeatable effect of Pyrewild Shaman is nice but seems a bit expensive for such a low mana curve deck. Any other new gatecrash commons look good for gobbos?
Shaman is rare, sadly. Bombardment is very nice against fogs, but I guess you have flaring pain for that already; my concern would be about putting too many non-creatures in and gimping your cohorts/conscripts (and to a lesser extent, denizens).
A big thanks to you Dromar for keeping this primer up and current! I've really benefited from your suggestions and card analysis. I thought i'd get your opinion on my current Goblins build.
I was wondering also what your opinion of Raid Bombardment and Pyrewild Shaman were? One new card and one old one. It seems to me that the effect of Bombardment is slightly better then Hissing Iguanar though as an enchantment it doesn't empower your cohorts and conscripts.
The repeatable effect of Pyrewild Shaman is nice but seems a bit expensive for such a low mana curve deck. Any other new gatecrash commons look good for gobbos?
The problem with Raid Bombardment is it's kind of going to be a winmore card in this deck. If you have a swarm of Goblins out then you're generally already in a very good position, and if you don't have very many Goblins in play it will be the worst card in your deck by a fair margin. Add on the fact that it's a 3 mana card that doesn't do anything on its own or even let Conscripts/Cohort attack and I don't think it's something I'd want to play.
As Tom pointed out the Shaman is a rare.
Unfortunately due to the multicolor nature of DGM there isn't really much that was printed for mono-color decks. Rubblebelt Maaka is probably the closest to playability but he's not a Goblin and Brute Force has existed for ages without seeing much play.
I haven't been playing nearly as much Magic Online as a couple months back mostly just due to being busy but I've been running Goblins as much as possible (after a brief break playing Affinity a month ago) and have been having quite a bit of success. I believe since returning to the deck I've only failed to cash in 2 of the Dailies I've entered (probably around 15 or so by my estimation). Today was another good day going 3-1 (beating Stompy, R/B Tortured Existence, and Fissure Post, losing to another Fissure Post) and 4-0 (beating the mirror, U/R Cloudpost, an opponent who never showed up, and Mono-Blue Delver). A few lucky breaks on my part tonight to be sure (opponent not showing up in round 3 and my U/R Post opponent mulling to 4 in the deciding game being the luckiest spots), but I felt like I also played pretty well for the most part save for the match I lost to Fissure Post in the first Daily where I think some different lines of play on my part may have ended the game in my favor.
For anyone who follows the DE postings you'd know the list I've been running lately is:
I've been pretty satisfied with this list for the most part. The Denizens are sort of mopey against Stompy decks (mostly because of Young Wolf) but other than that I like them quite a bit in this meta. The Flaring Pain can also probably come out of the board now with Simic Post seemingly vanishing from the meta and getting replaced by Fissure Post at this point. Not sure what I'll put in its place but the candidates are probably Flame Jab, a second Sylvok Lifestaff, or maybe a 3rd Electrickery. Something like Pillar of Flame/Magma Spray might also be worthwhile as Young Wolf is pretty annoying for us to play against and with Stompy so popular it will be of use fairly often.
Do you think Akki Blizzard Herder could be useful against posts? It costs 1 red mana 1 colorless, is a 1/1, when he is put into a graveyard each player sacrifices a land.
you can sac it with sledder if you need to destroy a land, otherwise is a 1/1. Unfortunately you can't target the land. Of course i'm suggesting it for sideboard not maindeck.
Do you think Akki Blizzard Herder could be useful against posts? It costs 1 red mana 1 colorless, is a 1/1, when he is put into a graveyard each player sacrifices a land.
you can sac it with sledder if you need to destroy a land, otherwise is a 1/1. Unfortunately you can't target the land. Of course i'm suggesting it for sideboard not maindeck.
Not being able to choose the land it gets is too big of a drawback for it to be playable. Ideally if you're playing some form of land destruction you should be trying to destroy their Cloudpost as that cuts them off of their mana engine. While there are some scenarios where a Blizzard Herder could destroy a Cloudpost (ex. turn 1 Sledder/Raider->turn 2 Blizzard Herder on the play) these won't really be the norm. In pretty much any other scenario I can think of the Herder will just not be good enough.
If you're really interested in a land destruction card for Post matchups you should probably just use Raze. The other good option is Molten Rain but 3 mana makes it a bit iffy to run in a Goblins deck so Raze will typically be better. Personally I find I can beat Post decks just fine without dedicating any sideboard slots to LD though.
i usually don't end up doing too well with goblins, but they are so fun to play i keep trying lol. affinity just gets so boring after a while.
I've been doodling with goblins for about three months now after grinding with U/R post, Goblins certainly isn't the most competitive or easiest deck to play but it certainly is the most fun to win with.
Also one of the most consistent decks I've ever played in any format outside of legacy, I definitely argue that goblins is the most consistent deck in the format, not powerful but consistent.
I've been doodling with goblins for about three months now after grinding with U/R post, Goblins certainly isn't the most competitive or easiest deck to play but it certainly is the most fun to win with.
Also one of the most consistent decks I've ever played in any format outside of legacy, I definitely argue that goblins is the most consistent deck in the format, not powerful but consistent.
I agree, it is a very fun deck to play and i have won some matches with it. i just find that it seems a little underpowered if the game drags out at all.
Excuse me if it has already been covered, but with this being a primer, are there any plans to add a section for paper pauper? I'm curious how Goblin Grenade might affect the deck.
Also, Gorilla Shaman is listed in the sideboard section, yet as far as I'm aware, it isn't available as a common on MTGO. Its only common printing was from Alliances, which was released prior to Mirage. (the cutoff for MTGO) Am I wrong?
Note:
I have made a list of the differences between online and paper, available near the end of this post.
I mean, you ARE in the Magic Online General section of the forums, I wouldn't expect a lot of discussion of paper-only commons.
Gorilla Shaman was printed with common rarity in one of the Coldsnap theme decks, which is enough to qualify.
There isn't a lot of ambiguity as to whether a card is pauper-legal or not on MTGO. The software won't let you play an illegal card.
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Oh, you think the losers' bracket is your ally, but you merely adopted the scrub tier. I was born in it, molded by it. I didn’t 4-0 an FNM until I was already a man; by then, it was nothing to me but an extra pack to sell for store credit!
Excuse me if it has already been covered, but with this being a primer, are there any plans to add a section for paper pauper? I'm curious how Goblin Grenade might affect the deck.
Apologies, but no this primer is for MTGO Pauper primarily and I have no plans of adding anything specifically regarding paper since I don't play it, nor am I familiar with the paper metagame (if one even exists since there aren't really any big paper pauper tourneys to glean info from).
Apologies, but no this primer is for MTGO Pauper primarily and I have no plans of adding anything specifically regarding paper since I don't play it, nor am I familiar with the paper metagame (if one even exists since there aren't really any big paper pauper tourneys to glean info from).
Okay. Paper pauper typically follows the MTGO metagame, it being much more popular. I figured Goblin Grenade would be awesome in this deck, (if legal) but not being a very involved pauper player myself, was curious what else it might affect. I completely understand you not wanting to address it when paper pauper is of no concern to you. Thanks for the quick response, though!
Okay. Paper pauper typically follows the MTGO metagame, it being much more popular. I figured Goblin Grenade would be awesome in this deck, (if legal) but not being a very involved pauper player myself, was curious what else it might affect. I completely understand you not wanting to address it when paper pauper is of no concern to you. Thanks for the quick response, though!
Well I'd assume MBC is a lot more popular in paper due to the legality of Hymn to Tourach and Sinkhole, while online MBC isn't currently very popular at all (it's pretty well outclassed by U/R Post as far as control decks go). I mention this because it is one major way I can see the paper meta deviating from the online one. Anyways Goblin Grenade would probably be playable in Goblins is my educated guess, 5 damage is a ton of reach and it can double as removal for pretty well any played creature in the format outside of Ulamog's Crusher. However having never tested the card in the deck myself I could not tell you in what quantity you would want to be playing it in and what you would be playing it over in the online iterations of Goblins.
I play paper pauper since a year or so, and i always played a burn package of 4 goblin grenades, 4 lightning bolt and 1-2 chain lightning. Grenades are really too good, I have only considered of cutting them to three but i didn't because having two of them is awesome.
I don't play death spark because i don't want to overload the deck with burn spells... i think sparksmith does well the work of death spark, repeatedly killing annoying creatures. If you use death spark to burn your opponent, grenade is hands down better.
I could maybe cut 1 chain lightning and 1 lightning bolt/grenade to play 2 death sparks, and i will test it when i find the sparks that at the moment i don't have.
That said, I always did well with goblins, top-8ing or top-4ing almost all the vent i attended and winning several of them.
I played against a variety of decks: burn,auras,MBC,mono-blue delver and U/R delver,UR post and UB post, U/R kiln fiend, affinity....
sideboard is always in flux. I want to test raze (i have only one at the moment) but my question is : can a deck that plays 17 lands really afford raze ? There are many times in wich we have only two or one land, and playing raze in those circumstances might be a suicide. Maybe Stone Rain would just be better, because when we have only one-two lands we don't want to sac one to raze, and when we have three we can simply cast stone rain without sacrificing anything. The only downside is that we wouldn't cast other goblins in the turn we cast stone rain.
Has anyone tried Jackal Familiar as another 2/2 one drop? I know he's not a goblin, but he's pretty good as a turn 2~3 filler. It does remind me of Mogg Flunkies with a smaller body and more efficient manacost, but the drawback is pretty much the same.
I've been testing this list for a while on paper, mostly to check if those cards are good enough.
Raze is a MUST in sideboard with all those Posts running around, if you can apply pressure with 2~3 goblins, and Raze their first Cloudpost, that's almost a guaranteed win. Molten Rain is there as the fifth slot, as the second best LD in common rarity. Pyroblast is good removal against Delver and Mono Blue Post. Electrickery is also well known in Pauper as being the 1-sided pyroclasm, hot stuff. At last, Gorilla Shaman for affinity's lands and Smash to Smithereens for those Myr Enforcers.
Seriously, give Jackal Familiar a try, he's pretty good.
Has anyone tried Jackal Familiar as another 2/2 one drop? I know he's not a goblin, but he's pretty good as a turn 2~3 filler. It does remind me of Mogg Flunkies with a smaller body and more efficient manacost, but the drawback is pretty much the same.
I've been testing this list for a while on paper, mostly to check if those cards are good enough.
Raze is a MUST in sideboard with all those Posts running around, if you can apply pressure with 2~3 goblins, and Raze their first Cloudpost, that's almost a guaranteed win. Molten Rain is there as the fifth slot, as the second best LD in common rarity. Pyroblast is good removal against Delver and Mono Blue Post. Electrickery is also well known in Pauper as being the 1-sided pyroclasm, hot stuff. At last, Gorilla Shaman for affinity's lands and Smash to Smithereens for those Myr Enforcers.
Seriously, give Jackal Familiar a try, he's pretty good.
I played it before Foundry Street Denizen was released and it was fine but I have a hard time justifying playing it over Denizen and I don't like the idea of cutting Arsonist for it either (a card that I didn't like initially but has grown on me a lot). The biggest strikes against the card are that:
1) You can't play it on turn 1 (well, you can but it won't do much for you)
2) it makes you very susceptible to removal (you attacking with it is dependent on your other creatures actually surviving so your opponent can pick off your other creatures and effectively "kill" Jackal Familiar at the same time)
3) It's not a goblin so you can't sacrifice it to Mogg Raider/Goblin Sledder. Not the end of the world but there are definitely times where this is relevant. Just off the top of my head when your MBC opponent wants to cast Tendrils of Corruption on something you can't stop them from gaining life if they target a Jackal). You also can't do things like sac the Jackal to force through lethal damage if it gets blocked.
Disagree on Raze as well. This deck is so land light it's not uncommon to get stuck on 1 or 2 lands in which case you can't afford to sacrifice any of them. Post decks are very beatable for Goblins without land destruction (well the Simic ones that have Moment's Peace can be really tough but those aren't common) and 4x Pyroblast is generally a sufficient amount of disruption. Raze can be good, but it's definitely not a must. Molten Rain similarly isn't great because you get handcuffed on resources a lot in this deck to the point where you may not even reach 3 mana until turn 6 or 7 (sometimes even later) in some games. Not to mention if you're running it in the same deck as Raze then that's another thing restricting you from actually hitting 3 lands.
The whole point of Raze is that you can destroy their first Cloudpost early, and kill them before they recover. If you can't deliver some Bushwhackers, they usually kill your goblins and stabilize with Glimmerposts. I run the 4/1 split because I usually don't play more than one LD spell in the same game. If you go late against Post you're doing it wrong.
If you keep an average hand against Izzet or Mono U Fissure Post, you're pretty much losing, as they can sculpt with card draw.
Jackal Familiar has those issues you pointed out, but he does bring the beats. Goblin Arsonist has a good synergy with Raider/Sledder and that's it, maybe trading with a X/2 if you're lucky. Jackal Familiar is pretty much another Cohort/Conscripts with a similar drawback, and these two are the one of the reasons why Goblins is viable in Pauper.
The whole point of Raze is that you can destroy their first Cloudpost early, and kill them before they recover. If you can't deliver some Bushwhackers, they usually kill your goblins and stabilize with Glimmerposts. I run the 4/1 split because I usually don't play more than one LD spell in the same game. If you go late against Post you're doing it wrong.
If you keep an average hand against Izzet or Mono U Fissure Post, you're pretty much losing, as they can sculpt with card draw.
Jackal Familiar has those issues you pointed out, but he does bring the beats. Goblin Arsonist has a good synergy with Raider/Sledder and that's it, maybe trading with a X/2 if you're lucky. Jackal Familiar is pretty much another Cohort/Conscripts with a similar drawback, and these two are the one of the reasons why Goblins is viable in Pauper.
Obviously you want to use Raze early, that's not the point I was making. If you only draw 2 lands and want to cast Raze then you are cutting yourself off of actually kicking Goblin Bushwhacker or even just casting a War Marshal for that matter. Yeah sometimes things come together nicely and you draw a 3rd land in time but it's also not unlikely you only see 2 lands over the first 5-6 turns in this 17 land deck and if that's the case the drawback actually is significant. Anyways I have had over a 50% winrate against Post decks after months without Raze in my sideboard so calling it a "must" is just pretty wrong in my experience. It's an option but certainly not a must.
You're also underestimating an important aspect of the Arsonist over Familiar - you can play it on turn 1 and have it actually do something. The same cannot be said about Jackal Familiar. You might argue that this deck has a ton of other 1 drops it can play over Jackal Familiar anyways (which is true), however hands like this example will still come up:
in which case Jackal Familiar is causing you a very significant loss in tempo. You won't be able to attack until turn 3 at the earliest if this is your hand on the play and that is just not remotely acceptable for this deck. I experienced hands like this when I played Familiar in the deck and I usually had to mulligan them. Now if you take that same hand and replace the Familiars with Arsonists then you get a keepable (albeit mediocre) hand. Besides all that though, the flexibility of Arsonist is what I have liked about the card. It can be an early beater, it can trade up with an X/2 on defence (or attack through one on offence), it can function as an additional removal spell in conjunction with Sledder/Raider (useful against Delvers and can keep your opponent off of casting a Spellstutter Sprite), or also act as a 2 damage spell to your opponent in a pinch with either of those cards. That's actually quite a bit of play out of a 1 drop, where Jackal Familiar is a lot more narrow in its uses.
Calling Jackal Familiar another Cohort/Conscripts is misleading as it is a Cohort/Conscripts in base stats/mana cost only. The drawback is actually a lot more significant than that as it can never block on turn 1 and it can only attack on turn 2 if you play a Bushwhacker (which is probably the wrong thing to do unless you draw 3 or 4 of them in your hand). Cohort/Conscripts can always block the first turn against aggro opponents and can almost guaranteed attack on turn 2 if you kept a hand that's halfway decent. Cohort/Conscripts also can not be "shut off" by removal spells on the creatures surrounding them.
@Dromar
Well, some of the Familiar drawbacks are really irrelevant. Not being able to block turn 1 isn't really a deal when Invigorate is banned. The only possible drawback is removal in response to your attack phase, but this deck tends to swarm, so this is relevant only rare times.
@thread
For people who aren't playing Chain Lightning (which might be a mistake), how good this list could be?
Fireblast is pretty good as finishing spell, the ultimate reach against UR Post and control decks that tend to stabilize (my deepest hatred for Fade Away). This deck tends to flood in the long game (I mean 3~4 lands in 10~12 turns), due to lack of library manipulation.
Good enough? Or Chain Lightning is pretty much a staple?
@Dromar
Well, some of the Familiar drawbacks are really irrelevant. Not being able to block turn 1 isn't really a deal when Invigorate is banned. The only possible drawback is removal in response to your attack phase, but this deck tends to swarm, so this is relevant only rare times.
@thread
For people who aren't playing Chain Lightning (which might be a mistake), how good this list could be?
Fireblast is pretty good as finishing spell, the ultimate reach against UR Post and control decks that tend to stabilize (my deepest hatred for Fade Away). This deck tends to flood in the long game (I mean 3~4 lands in 10~12 turns), due to lack of library manipulation.
Good enough? Or Chain Lightning is pretty much a staple?
Not being able to block turn 1 actually is relevant against Stompy decks (and I suppose Delver decks to a very minor extent - a turn 1 Delver or Phantasmal Bear can let them turn 2 Ninja you) which are some of the most popular in the format. Against Stompy you have to take the control role about as often as you take the aggressor role in the matchup (perhaps even more), and being able to trade with/stop their 1 drop from attacking is pretty important, not only because it can keep them off a bloodthirsted Pit-Skulk but also because your life total is actually relevant in the matchup with them possessing the ability to just burn you out with pump spells or grind you down with Rancors. Not to mention that every life point you save is potentially a life point you can spend Sparksmithing down one of their creatures (one of your best ways to grind them out). Being able to block is also incredibly important in the mirror where the goal is often to just trade 1-for-1 as much as possible and pull ahead with cards like Death Spark/Flame Jab and War Marshals. Not that the mirror is overly common but the deck has been on a bit of an upswing in popularity of late so it's more likely to face it right now than ever.
Re: Chain Lightning I only ever play two copies myself and I could conceivably see running none at all. It's one of the first cards I board out in many matchups and perhaps the weakest card stock lists run in their maindeck.
What're the arguments to play this deck over the top tier aggro decks in the format, Affinity & Stompy?
From what I've read on the various threads, Goblins is more consistent than Affinity, which can sometimes lose to itself, and is less affected by SB hate (Ancient Grudge etc) and has a better MBC/MBCu matchup than Stompy. It would also seem to have a better UR Fiend matchup, with maindeck removal & SB Pyroblast.
How does it cope compared to those two decks vs Delver?
Sorry for all the questions, but I'm looking to pick up a deck for casual daily play, and can't decide on one :3
What're the arguments to play this deck over the top tier aggro decks in the format, Affinity & Stompy?
From what I've read on the various threads, Goblins is more consistent than Affinity, which can sometimes lose to itself, and is less affected by SB hate (Ancient Grudge etc) and has a better MBC/MBCu matchup than Stompy. It would also seem to have a better UR Fiend matchup, with maindeck removal & SB Pyroblast.
How does it cope compared to those two decks vs Delver?
Sorry for all the questions, but I'm looking to pick up a deck for casual daily play, and can't decide on one :3
That's mostly accurate, though I'd say it does about as well against MBC as Stompy does. Goblins has more dudes which marginalizes MBCs spot removal more but Stompy has Young Wolf, Safehold Elite, and Ledgewalker all as hard to deal with creatures that can also work to exhaust MBCs removal. Vines of Vastwood is also another way for Stompy to protect their threats against MBC. Goblins mostly has to just swarm and draw enough War-Marshals to combat the stream of removal while hoping Crypt Rats isn't lurking in the opponent's hand a lot of the time. One thing Goblins has going for it that Stompy doesn't so much is the Sledder/Raiders that can counter lifegain removal - Stompy doesn't have much in the way of that outside of the aforementioned Vines.
As for the Delver matchup you're generally quite favored game 1 then things can get tougher games 2 and 3 when they get to bring in 4 Hydroblasts and Serrated Arrows (which are considerably more of a problem to a deck like Goblins than they are to Stompy or Affinity). I'd say Stompy probably has the best matchup against Delver of the 3 decks we're talking about just because Scattershot Archers is such a beating against them. All 3 have reasonable Delver matchups though. I would say it comes down to whether you'd prefer to have a better Nivix-Fiend matchup (Goblins has a pretty good one while Stompy has a pretty bad one) or a much easier Delver matchup (Goblins vs Delver tends to be a lot closer than Stompy vs Delver I have found).
Affinity I wouldn't recommend playing at all, the deck just loses to itself far too much and even though it should on-paper crush Stompy and Goblins by going bigger the consistent nature of those decks, combined with Affinity's own inconsistencies and deadly sideboard hate (hi Gorilla Shaman) are often enough to push the matchup much closer to even than it should be. After that you have a deck that is just okay against Nivix-Fiend (game 1 is tough if you don't draw enough Galv Blasts, games 2 and 3 are a bit better getting Pyroblasts and some extra removal), atrocious against MBC (too slow to get onto the board in most circumstances letting MBC just pick them apart with removal), and reasonably good against Delver.
Anyways though with the bans coming into effect soon I expect to see the meta change a lot. White Weenie will probably make a comeback of some sort and depending on how popular it becomes it could really affect the viability of playing Goblins since the matchup is pretty bad. If Hexproof gets picked up by more people as well that's another pretty bad sign for Goblins. Stompy can get around that deck a bit better thanks to having access to things like Gleeful Sabotage or Serene Heart if they really need it but all Goblins can do is race and try to hold open Electrickery.
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The 2 power and first strike kills/deters blocking from most things in the format, but there's not a whole lot of room in the deck, especially at 2cc. The drawback is also pretty huge (can't block), and it dies to pings, Electrickery, etc.
Legacy Gobbyboogers R
Seems pretty bad, I'd play any of Mogg Flunkies, Mudbrawler Cohort, or even a non-Goblin in Frostburn Weird in the 2 drop slot before I'd ever want to play this guy. The biggest problem I have with him is that he just bricks himself against half of the format. Delver has Frostburn Weird and Spire Golem, Affinity has Enforcer and Carapace Forger. Even a simple Sea-Gate Oracle out of a Post deck can stop this guy without any help from Sledder/Raider.
16 Mountain
1 Teetering Peaks
Creatures
4 Foundry Street Denizen
4 Goblin Arsonist
4 Goblin Bushwhacker
4 Goblin Cohort
4 Goblin Sledder
1 Hissing Iguanar
4 Mogg Conscripts
4 Mogg Raider
4 Mogg War Marshal
2 Sparksmith
2 Dangerous Wager
2 Death Spark
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Electrickery
2 Flame Slash
3 Flaring Pain
3 Molten Rain
4 Smash to Smithereens
1 Sylvok Lifestaff
I was wondering also what your opinion of Raid Bombardment and Pyrewild Shaman were? One new card and one old one. It seems to me that the effect of Bombardment is slightly better then Hissing Iguanar though as an enchantment it doesn't empower your cohorts and conscripts.
The repeatable effect of Pyrewild Shaman is nice but seems a bit expensive for such a low mana curve deck. Any other new gatecrash commons look good for gobbos?
The problem with Raid Bombardment is it's kind of going to be a winmore card in this deck. If you have a swarm of Goblins out then you're generally already in a very good position, and if you don't have very many Goblins in play it will be the worst card in your deck by a fair margin. Add on the fact that it's a 3 mana card that doesn't do anything on its own or even let Conscripts/Cohort attack and I don't think it's something I'd want to play.
As Tom pointed out the Shaman is a rare.
Unfortunately due to the multicolor nature of DGM there isn't really much that was printed for mono-color decks. Rubblebelt Maaka is probably the closest to playability but he's not a Goblin and Brute Force has existed for ages without seeing much play.
For anyone who follows the DE postings you'd know the list I've been running lately is:
4x Goblin Cohort
4x Mogg Conscripts
4x Goblin Sledder
4x Mogg Raider
4x Foundry Street Denizen
3x Goblin Arsonist
4x Goblin Bushwhacker
4x Mogg War Marshal
4x Sparksmith
2x Death Spark
4x Lightning Bolt
2x Electrickery
2x Flame Slash
1x Flaring Pain
3x Gorilla Shaman
4x Pyroblast
2x Smash to Smithereens
1x Sylvok Lifestaff
I've been pretty satisfied with this list for the most part. The Denizens are sort of mopey against Stompy decks (mostly because of Young Wolf) but other than that I like them quite a bit in this meta. The Flaring Pain can also probably come out of the board now with Simic Post seemingly vanishing from the meta and getting replaced by Fissure Post at this point. Not sure what I'll put in its place but the candidates are probably Flame Jab, a second Sylvok Lifestaff, or maybe a 3rd Electrickery. Something like Pillar of Flame/Magma Spray might also be worthwhile as Young Wolf is pretty annoying for us to play against and with Stompy so popular it will be of use fairly often.
you can sac it with sledder if you need to destroy a land, otherwise is a 1/1. Unfortunately you can't target the land. Of course i'm suggesting it for sideboard not maindeck.
Not being able to choose the land it gets is too big of a drawback for it to be playable. Ideally if you're playing some form of land destruction you should be trying to destroy their Cloudpost as that cuts them off of their mana engine. While there are some scenarios where a Blizzard Herder could destroy a Cloudpost (ex. turn 1 Sledder/Raider->turn 2 Blizzard Herder on the play) these won't really be the norm. In pretty much any other scenario I can think of the Herder will just not be good enough.
If you're really interested in a land destruction card for Post matchups you should probably just use Raze. The other good option is Molten Rain but 3 mana makes it a bit iffy to run in a Goblins deck so Raze will typically be better. Personally I find I can beat Post decks just fine without dedicating any sideboard slots to LD though.
I've been doodling with goblins for about three months now after grinding with U/R post, Goblins certainly isn't the most competitive or easiest deck to play but it certainly is the most fun to win with.
Also one of the most consistent decks I've ever played in any format outside of legacy, I definitely argue that goblins is the most consistent deck in the format, not powerful but consistent.
I agree, it is a very fun deck to play and i have won some matches with it. i just find that it seems a little underpowered if the game drags out at all.
Also, Gorilla Shaman is listed in the sideboard section, yet as far as I'm aware, it isn't available as a common on MTGO. Its only common printing was from Alliances, which was released prior to Mirage. (the cutoff for MTGO) Am I wrong?
Note:
I have made a list of the differences between online and paper, available near the end of this post.
Gorilla Shaman was printed with common rarity in one of the Coldsnap theme decks, which is enough to qualify.
There isn't a lot of ambiguity as to whether a card is pauper-legal or not on MTGO. The software won't let you play an illegal card.
Apologies, but no this primer is for MTGO Pauper primarily and I have no plans of adding anything specifically regarding paper since I don't play it, nor am I familiar with the paper metagame (if one even exists since there aren't really any big paper pauper tourneys to glean info from).
I don't play MTGO, and the only rarity I've seen listed for coldsnap theme decks is "special", so that's new information to me. Thanks!
Okay. Paper pauper typically follows the MTGO metagame, it being much more popular. I figured Goblin Grenade would be awesome in this deck, (if legal) but not being a very involved pauper player myself, was curious what else it might affect. I completely understand you not wanting to address it when paper pauper is of no concern to you. Thanks for the quick response, though!
Well I'd assume MBC is a lot more popular in paper due to the legality of Hymn to Tourach and Sinkhole, while online MBC isn't currently very popular at all (it's pretty well outclassed by U/R Post as far as control decks go). I mention this because it is one major way I can see the paper meta deviating from the online one. Anyways Goblin Grenade would probably be playable in Goblins is my educated guess, 5 damage is a ton of reach and it can double as removal for pretty well any played creature in the format outside of Ulamog's Crusher. However having never tested the card in the deck myself I could not tell you in what quantity you would want to be playing it in and what you would be playing it over in the online iterations of Goblins.
I don't play death spark because i don't want to overload the deck with burn spells... i think sparksmith does well the work of death spark, repeatedly killing annoying creatures. If you use death spark to burn your opponent, grenade is hands down better.
I could maybe cut 1 chain lightning and 1 lightning bolt/grenade to play 2 death sparks, and i will test it when i find the sparks that at the moment i don't have.
That said, I always did well with goblins, top-8ing or top-4ing almost all the vent i attended and winning several of them.
I played against a variety of decks: burn,auras,MBC,mono-blue delver and U/R delver,UR post and UB post, U/R kiln fiend, affinity....
This is my list at the moment:
4x sledder
3x mogg raider
4x mogg conscripts
3x goblin cohort
4x mogg war marshal
3x sparksmith
4x foundry street denizen
3x goblin arsonist
4x bushwhacker
2x mudbrawler cohort
4x lightning bolt
4x goblin grenade
1x chain lightning
17x mountain.
sideboard is always in flux. I want to test raze (i have only one at the moment) but my question is : can a deck that plays 17 lands really afford raze ? There are many times in wich we have only two or one land, and playing raze in those circumstances might be a suicide. Maybe Stone Rain would just be better, because when we have only one-two lands we don't want to sac one to raze, and when we have three we can simply cast stone rain without sacrificing anything. The only downside is that we wouldn't cast other goblins in the turn we cast stone rain.
I've been testing this list for a while on paper, mostly to check if those cards are good enough.
17 Mountain
4 Mogg Raiders
4 Goblin Sledder
4 Jackal Familiar
4 Mogg Conscripts
4 Goblin Cohort
4 Foundry Street Denizen
4 Goblin Bushwhacker
4 Mogg War Marshal
3 Sparksmith
4 Chain Lightning
4 Lightning Bolt
1 Molten Rain
3 Pyroblast
3 Gorilla Shaman
1 Smash to Smithereens
3 Electrickery
Raze is a MUST in sideboard with all those Posts running around, if you can apply pressure with 2~3 goblins, and Raze their first Cloudpost, that's almost a guaranteed win. Molten Rain is there as the fifth slot, as the second best LD in common rarity. Pyroblast is good removal against Delver and Mono Blue Post. Electrickery is also well known in Pauper as being the 1-sided pyroclasm, hot stuff. At last, Gorilla Shaman for affinity's lands and Smash to Smithereens for those Myr Enforcers.
Seriously, give Jackal Familiar a try, he's pretty good.
I played it before Foundry Street Denizen was released and it was fine but I have a hard time justifying playing it over Denizen and I don't like the idea of cutting Arsonist for it either (a card that I didn't like initially but has grown on me a lot). The biggest strikes against the card are that:
1) You can't play it on turn 1 (well, you can but it won't do much for you)
2) it makes you very susceptible to removal (you attacking with it is dependent on your other creatures actually surviving so your opponent can pick off your other creatures and effectively "kill" Jackal Familiar at the same time)
3) It's not a goblin so you can't sacrifice it to Mogg Raider/Goblin Sledder. Not the end of the world but there are definitely times where this is relevant. Just off the top of my head when your MBC opponent wants to cast Tendrils of Corruption on something you can't stop them from gaining life if they target a Jackal). You also can't do things like sac the Jackal to force through lethal damage if it gets blocked.
Disagree on Raze as well. This deck is so land light it's not uncommon to get stuck on 1 or 2 lands in which case you can't afford to sacrifice any of them. Post decks are very beatable for Goblins without land destruction (well the Simic ones that have Moment's Peace can be really tough but those aren't common) and 4x Pyroblast is generally a sufficient amount of disruption. Raze can be good, but it's definitely not a must. Molten Rain similarly isn't great because you get handcuffed on resources a lot in this deck to the point where you may not even reach 3 mana until turn 6 or 7 (sometimes even later) in some games. Not to mention if you're running it in the same deck as Raze then that's another thing restricting you from actually hitting 3 lands.
If you keep an average hand against Izzet or Mono U Fissure Post, you're pretty much losing, as they can sculpt with card draw.
Jackal Familiar has those issues you pointed out, but he does bring the beats. Goblin Arsonist has a good synergy with Raider/Sledder and that's it, maybe trading with a X/2 if you're lucky. Jackal Familiar is pretty much another Cohort/Conscripts with a similar drawback, and these two are the one of the reasons why Goblins is viable in Pauper.
Obviously you want to use Raze early, that's not the point I was making. If you only draw 2 lands and want to cast Raze then you are cutting yourself off of actually kicking Goblin Bushwhacker or even just casting a War Marshal for that matter. Yeah sometimes things come together nicely and you draw a 3rd land in time but it's also not unlikely you only see 2 lands over the first 5-6 turns in this 17 land deck and if that's the case the drawback actually is significant. Anyways I have had over a 50% winrate against Post decks after months without Raze in my sideboard so calling it a "must" is just pretty wrong in my experience. It's an option but certainly not a must.
You're also underestimating an important aspect of the Arsonist over Familiar - you can play it on turn 1 and have it actually do something. The same cannot be said about Jackal Familiar. You might argue that this deck has a ton of other 1 drops it can play over Jackal Familiar anyways (which is true), however hands like this example will still come up:
-Jackal Familiar x2, Sparksmith, Mogg War Marshal, Lightning Bolt, 2x Mountain
in which case Jackal Familiar is causing you a very significant loss in tempo. You won't be able to attack until turn 3 at the earliest if this is your hand on the play and that is just not remotely acceptable for this deck. I experienced hands like this when I played Familiar in the deck and I usually had to mulligan them. Now if you take that same hand and replace the Familiars with Arsonists then you get a keepable (albeit mediocre) hand. Besides all that though, the flexibility of Arsonist is what I have liked about the card. It can be an early beater, it can trade up with an X/2 on defence (or attack through one on offence), it can function as an additional removal spell in conjunction with Sledder/Raider (useful against Delvers and can keep your opponent off of casting a Spellstutter Sprite), or also act as a 2 damage spell to your opponent in a pinch with either of those cards. That's actually quite a bit of play out of a 1 drop, where Jackal Familiar is a lot more narrow in its uses.
Calling Jackal Familiar another Cohort/Conscripts is misleading as it is a Cohort/Conscripts in base stats/mana cost only. The drawback is actually a lot more significant than that as it can never block on turn 1 and it can only attack on turn 2 if you play a Bushwhacker (which is probably the wrong thing to do unless you draw 3 or 4 of them in your hand). Cohort/Conscripts can always block the first turn against aggro opponents and can almost guaranteed attack on turn 2 if you kept a hand that's halfway decent. Cohort/Conscripts also can not be "shut off" by removal spells on the creatures surrounding them.
Well, some of the Familiar drawbacks are really irrelevant. Not being able to block turn 1 isn't really a deal when Invigorate is banned. The only possible drawback is removal in response to your attack phase, but this deck tends to swarm, so this is relevant only rare times.
@thread
For people who aren't playing Chain Lightning (which might be a mistake), how good this list could be?
17 Mountains
4 Foundry Street Denizen
4 Goblin Bushwhacker
4 Mogg War Marshal
4 Mogg Conscripts
4 Goblin Cohort
4 Jackal Familiar
4 Mogg Raider
4 Goblin Sledder
4 Sparksmith
4 Lightning Bolt
2 Death Spark
1 Fireblast
4 Pyroblast
3 Electrickery
3 Gorilla Shaman
1 Smash to Smithereens
It's basically -4 Chain Lightning +1 Sparksmith +1 Fireblast +2 Death Spark.
Fireblast is pretty good as finishing spell, the ultimate reach against UR Post and control decks that tend to stabilize (my deepest hatred for Fade Away). This deck tends to flood in the long game (I mean 3~4 lands in 10~12 turns), due to lack of library manipulation.
Good enough? Or Chain Lightning is pretty much a staple?
Not being able to block turn 1 actually is relevant against Stompy decks (and I suppose Delver decks to a very minor extent - a turn 1 Delver or Phantasmal Bear can let them turn 2 Ninja you) which are some of the most popular in the format. Against Stompy you have to take the control role about as often as you take the aggressor role in the matchup (perhaps even more), and being able to trade with/stop their 1 drop from attacking is pretty important, not only because it can keep them off a bloodthirsted Pit-Skulk but also because your life total is actually relevant in the matchup with them possessing the ability to just burn you out with pump spells or grind you down with Rancors. Not to mention that every life point you save is potentially a life point you can spend Sparksmithing down one of their creatures (one of your best ways to grind them out). Being able to block is also incredibly important in the mirror where the goal is often to just trade 1-for-1 as much as possible and pull ahead with cards like Death Spark/Flame Jab and War Marshals. Not that the mirror is overly common but the deck has been on a bit of an upswing in popularity of late so it's more likely to face it right now than ever.
Re: Chain Lightning I only ever play two copies myself and I could conceivably see running none at all. It's one of the first cards I board out in many matchups and perhaps the weakest card stock lists run in their maindeck.
From what I've read on the various threads, Goblins is more consistent than Affinity, which can sometimes lose to itself, and is less affected by SB hate (Ancient Grudge etc) and has a better MBC/MBCu matchup than Stompy. It would also seem to have a better UR Fiend matchup, with maindeck removal & SB Pyroblast.
How does it cope compared to those two decks vs Delver?
Sorry for all the questions, but I'm looking to pick up a deck for casual daily play, and can't decide on one :3
That's mostly accurate, though I'd say it does about as well against MBC as Stompy does. Goblins has more dudes which marginalizes MBCs spot removal more but Stompy has Young Wolf, Safehold Elite, and Ledgewalker all as hard to deal with creatures that can also work to exhaust MBCs removal. Vines of Vastwood is also another way for Stompy to protect their threats against MBC. Goblins mostly has to just swarm and draw enough War-Marshals to combat the stream of removal while hoping Crypt Rats isn't lurking in the opponent's hand a lot of the time. One thing Goblins has going for it that Stompy doesn't so much is the Sledder/Raiders that can counter lifegain removal - Stompy doesn't have much in the way of that outside of the aforementioned Vines.
As for the Delver matchup you're generally quite favored game 1 then things can get tougher games 2 and 3 when they get to bring in 4 Hydroblasts and Serrated Arrows (which are considerably more of a problem to a deck like Goblins than they are to Stompy or Affinity). I'd say Stompy probably has the best matchup against Delver of the 3 decks we're talking about just because Scattershot Archers is such a beating against them. All 3 have reasonable Delver matchups though. I would say it comes down to whether you'd prefer to have a better Nivix-Fiend matchup (Goblins has a pretty good one while Stompy has a pretty bad one) or a much easier Delver matchup (Goblins vs Delver tends to be a lot closer than Stompy vs Delver I have found).
Affinity I wouldn't recommend playing at all, the deck just loses to itself far too much and even though it should on-paper crush Stompy and Goblins by going bigger the consistent nature of those decks, combined with Affinity's own inconsistencies and deadly sideboard hate (hi Gorilla Shaman) are often enough to push the matchup much closer to even than it should be. After that you have a deck that is just okay against Nivix-Fiend (game 1 is tough if you don't draw enough Galv Blasts, games 2 and 3 are a bit better getting Pyroblasts and some extra removal), atrocious against MBC (too slow to get onto the board in most circumstances letting MBC just pick them apart with removal), and reasonably good against Delver.
Anyways though with the bans coming into effect soon I expect to see the meta change a lot. White Weenie will probably make a comeback of some sort and depending on how popular it becomes it could really affect the viability of playing Goblins since the matchup is pretty bad. If Hexproof gets picked up by more people as well that's another pretty bad sign for Goblins. Stompy can get around that deck a bit better thanks to having access to things like Gleeful Sabotage or Serene Heart if they really need it but all Goblins can do is race and try to hold open Electrickery.