In this experimental commander variant, each player starts with 60 life instead of 40 and begins the game with three basic lands from his or her deck on the battlefield. Decks may include nonland cards with converted mana cost 4 or greater as well as lands, but cannot include nonland cards with converted mana cost 3 or less.
Hyper Commander Rules 2.0:
Each player starts with 60 life.
Before the start of the game, each player chooses three basic lands from his or her deck and sets them aside. That player begins the game with those basic lands on the battlefield.
Each nonland card must have a converted mana cost of 4 or greater. symbols in mana costs count as 0 for this purpose (for example, Empty the Pits has a CMC of 4 while Rolling Thunder has a CMC of 2). Split cards may be included only if both of their halves would be legal independently. Double-faced cards are legal if their default half is legal.
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
Here's a deck I'm building to test this format out. The cards are listed with the adjusted mana curve rather than their true cmc. It needs about three more cards.
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
We tested the format last night. The cost reduction to all spells is decidedly broken, as it results in a player being able to dump their hand ridiculously fast. My brother suggested an alternative: Each player starts the game with three lands from their deck already on the battlefield. I suggested restricting the options to basic lands, any three playable within the deck's colors, as I feel it makes the opening game more even. Let's see how it goes.
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
As long as you do not get rid of the cmc<4 ban.
If I play something like this or this we are talking a turn 3 win if you don't continue that part of the rules.
I'm rather curious what would happen if you kept the cmc ban, but made it so that all spells/abilities have convoke and convoke branches out to typing "permanents" instead of just "creatures" (as far as paying for mana. Obviously one cannot convoke for a planeswalker ability).
sounds obscenely busted. I think UG will be the strongest color combination between access to Explosive Growth effects, and blue combos. Black gets the mikeaus + triskellion combo for 6 mana instead of 12, and diabolic revalation searches for 3 cards at 5 mana. Riku value decks will also be significanlty stronger because of the ease of casting him on turn 2. Finally, Sharuum...
As long as you do not get rid of the cmc<4 ban.
If I play something like this or this we are talking a turn 3 win if you don't continue that part of the rules.
I'm rather curious what would happen if you kept the cmc ban, but made it so that all spells/abilities have convoke and convoke branches out to typing "permanents" instead of just "creatures" (as far as paying for mana. Obviously one cannot convoke for a planeswalker ability).
Well of course the 4< cmc rule is still in effect, part of the reason I created the format was to give players a break from all those 3> cmc cards.
I recall the three basic lands option working better. We'll try again soon and I'll post further results.
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
This does sound interesting...
How does it balance so far? On one side, it gets rid of most decks dedicated towards infinite combos (B/W Teysa Combo is all <4), but still allows decks that have infinite combos that cost a bit more. It also gets rid of most tutors except for like one or two, which is awesome.
Here's my suggestions...
1. Put the life total back down to 40. Then, do increments of 10 until you find a fine line.
2. Consider messing around with the total deck size. A format like this seems like the speed would be mostly maintained (commander often uses high mana costs for important things, save for infinite combo/slowdown decks which are <4), but because the cards are ONLY CMC >4, bigger cards get put out more often. A deck size of 80 (singleton) might be the best bet, while a deck size of 200 (singleton) might be the best! You never know until you try. You could even attempt how well it would work as a 200 card deck but allowing 2 of each card to popped into the deck, or more, or less.
Me and my group would be more than happy to test this in the future.
Currently we're working with 60 life. 80 took too long, and 40 depletes too fast thanks to the bigger creatures and spells.
The 100-card deck size works fine as is.
Land removal concerns me; Demolish can be used as early as turn 1, and it's possible to fall below your starting mana count if your opponents get too aggressive with LD. To rectify this slippery slope, my brother and I have proposed several possible catch-up rules, like:
1. As long as you control two or fewer lands, you may draw an additional card during your draw step.
2. As long as you control two or fewer lands, you may play an additional land on each of your turns.
3. As long as you control three or fewer lands, lands you control have indestructible.
However, a lot of these feel arbitrary and not particularly flavorful. I'm also cautious about opening the doors to potential exploitation.
Certain land removal cards need to be outright banned, like Boil and Boiling Seas. Ruination needs to be watched as it's harsh on Taplands.
I'm thinking of another decklist for this format, this time focused on multicolor. The deck needs about six more cards.
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
I honestly think going 60-70 card singleton is your best bet. It allows for a lot more consistency, and takes away from the ability to splash in random cards for no reason. With 65 card singleton (middle-ground here) a deck can focus on one specific archetype. Demolish is certainly sucky to deal with, but with 65 card deck, I'd probably be pumping out better artifacts, faster. And having less cards means a guy can't stick 15-20 cards that go against a specific archetype without sacrificing a huge chunk of his deck's strategy.
What you could do is make it so that if you have less than 3 lands, you can play as many lands on your turn as you want, up to 3. So if they destroy all my islands, on my turn, I can simply play 3 islands from my hand in one turn. Though, blue is likely to be able to counter anyway, so boil and boiling seas aren't that bad.
The point is variety, not consistency. If Hyper Commander were trying harder to be the opposite of Tiny Leaders, then it would call for more than 100 cards, but 100 is about the maximum that can be conveniently shuffled.
How would a blue deck with three lands on the field counter Boil? Force of Will? Not every blue player would have access to that. Most feasible counterspell options in the format cost 4+ like everything else. And even without LR as harsh as Boil, three red players could gang up on any single player with Craterize, Demolish, Melt Terrain, and plenty others besides. This is the equivalent of red being able to Stone Rain you turn 1 in Constructed or Tiny Leaders, only you can't Envelop or Spell Pierce the spell in response and you can easily fall below 0 mana with possibly no chance of ever catching up.
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
Well, I think it's important we talk *in context* for a second here.
In EDH, the same exact thing could happen and does happen. I've personally seen my friend run a mono-blue lockdown EDH deck, only to have a card played on him that made it so he couldn't cast blue spells (or tap for blue mana, I forget which). I've also seen said blue player have his lands destroyed by two other players. It happens. In a casual variant like EDH, other players usually take pity on them and go after the person being the D-I to the Clark Kent. What he did, eventually, to try and save himself from being screwed over is run cards that could help him untap, such as Teferi, Temporal Archmage. You're looking too far into it without realizing that there are probably tons of ways to deal with it that we simply don't know of ourselves, but others would.
Also, I just want to say one thing. If A = Variety, B = High Mana cost, and C = Balance, it MIGHT not be that A+B=C. Sometimes there are some things that will inevitably break balance, and you end up having to choose to sacrifice one or the other.
Besides, a player should be able to splash in random cards if they want, it's their deck to build. The primary reason I created this format was so players could enjoy playing their bigger and more expensive creatures and spells without having to worry about all the hyper-aggressiveness of 1-3 mana spells that seem to dominate even regular Commander. As a plus, they can fill the slots that cheaper cards normally would with more of the expensive ones. Reducing the deck size misses the point.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
Now, one way to remove consistency is to add cards to the deck size, and another is to remove cards from the format. You remove a lot of tutors, a lot of counterspells, a lot of draw spells, a lot of ramp cards, etc. You are getting rid of a TON of archetypes here. You've killed off a lot of infinite combo decks, ramp decks, and control decks in one fell swoop. So there is no way to plug in consistency like draw cards and tutor cards currently do in EDH. So that 100 card deck in EDH that you can tutor and draw through is now, in this format, just a 100 card deck without either of those. Cutting down the deck size to 60, 70, 75, even 80 can help tremendously.
In my opinion, having 100 cards, and 20 of them being fluff, is not variety.
There are still many options for card drawing and tutoring, counterspells, and ramp. Try a Gatherer search specifying ">= 4" for the CMC. Here are a decent number of examples, though by no means an exhaustive list:
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
I'll see if I can, by the end of the month, print and sleeve proxies for me and 4 other friends to give the format a-go. We can really experiment with the deck size and what-not to see what works and what doesn't work.
More importantly, we can decide if it's fun or not.
Can I ask one favor of you? Make some mono-colored decks for us. If you can get all 5, great, if not, no problems. Reason I wish to do this is to sort of experiment with how the colors in this format do compared to other colors. Green seems to have access to most draw and ramp cards (most are colorless though), but at least blue does have access to some counterspells, and green has the least access to tutors. It'll be interesting to see how they fare.
I'll be more than happy to provide decklists. My brother has volunteered to help. These decklists aren't yet complete, but they all have a decent number of cards to start with. I'll update them over time.
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
I had a format like this, except I didn't have the lands already in play idea. You would just start with 4 basic lands in your hand. And x spells were allowed but you couldn't cast them for less than 4.
The banned list was any card that destroys more than one land
I have an idea of how to mitigate early land removal.
Land Preservation Rule: As long as a player controls four or fewer lands, if an effect an opponent controls would cause a land that player controls to be put into a graveyard from the battlefield, that land's controller may pay 1 life. If he or she does, that land returns to the battlefield.
This way, single-target land removal like Craterize basically becomes a 1-damage burn spell. Boil effectively deals up to 3 damage to a given player.
Or, there could be a different, simpler rule: Starting lands can't leave the battlefield and can't be controlled by any player except their owner. This means they can't be destroyed, bounced, tucked, exiled, or stolen.
However, this rule presents a danger of allowing starting lands to be turned into unanswerable threats by effects like Awaken. So there needs to be an additional rule to keep starting lands in check: Starting lands can't attack, block, or deal damage and can't have or gain any abilities except their default mana ability.
My brother suggested an alternative: The starting lands begin the game in your command zone, stay there for the duration of the game, and can be tapped for mana.
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
Whenever a starter land leaves the battlefield, its owner returns it to the battlefield.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
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Hyper Commander Rules 2.0:
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
2 Odric, Master Tactician
Creatures
1 Abzan Battle Priest
1 Akroan Horse
1 Goldnight Commander
1 Healer of the Pride
1 Paragon of New Dawns
1 Restoration Angel
1 Rhox Faithmender
1 Stonehorn Dignitary
1 Wall of Reverence
2 Hundred-Handed One
2 Archangel of Thune
2 Patron of the Valiant
2 Shattered Angel
3 Steel Hellkite
3 Sentinel of the Eternal Watch
3 Angelic Skirmisher
3 Captain of the Watch
3 Evangel of Heliod
3 Goldnight Redeemer
3 Urbis Protector
3 Voice of the Provinces
3 Victory's Herald
4 Luminate Primordial
4 Resolute Archangel
4 Angel of Serenity
5 Colossus of Akros
1 Deathrender
1 Moonsilver Spear
1 Seer's Sundial
1 Well of Lost Dreams
2 Norn's Annex
2 Conjurer's Closet
2 Gilded Lotus
2 Meteorite
3 Caged Sun
3 Staff of Nin
Enchantments
1 Angelic Accord
1 Cradle of Vitality
1 First Response
1 Suppression Bonds
2 Sphere of Safety
2 Martial Law
2 Dictate of Heliod
2 Sigil of the Empty Throne
3 True Conviction
Instants
1 Divine Verdict
1 Smite the Monstrous
3 Banishing Stroke
1 Ajani Steadfast
3 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
Sorceries
2 Angelic Edict
2 Wrath of God
2 End Hostilities
3 Plea for Guidance
3 Vanquish the Foul
4 Mass Calcify
2 Decree of Justice
Land
1 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
39 Plains
Here's the deck my brother's using to test the format. It needs about twelve more cards.
2 Yeva, Nature's Herald
1 Nylea, God of the Hunt
Creature
1 Ivy Lane Denizen
1 Karametra's Acolyte
1 Krosan Drover
1 Mold Shambler
1 Ondu Giant
2 Garruk's Packleader
2 Thragtusk
2 Polukranos, World Eater
2 Acidic Slime
2 Silklash Spider
2 Nessian Game Warden
3 Soul of New Phyrexia
3 Steel Hellkite
3 Kalonian Twingrove
3 Bane of Progress
3 Rampaging Baloths
3 Soul of Zendikar
3 Arbor Colossus
4 Avenger of Zendikar
4 Garruk's Horde
4 Gaea's Revenge
4 Naya Soulbeast
4 Elderscale Wurm
4 Hornet Queen
4 Pelakka Wurm
5 Archetype of Endurance
5 Craterhoof Behemoth
2 Gilded Lotus
2 Meteorite
3 Caged Sun
3 Staff of Nin
Enchantments
1 Market Festival
2 Dictate of Karametra
3 Death's Presence
Instants
1 Artisan's Sorrow
1 Blunt the Assault
2 Slice in Twain
Planeswalkers
2 Nissa, Worldwaker
Sorcery
1 Desecration Plague
1 Explosive Vegetation
1 Peregrination
1 Ranger's Path
1 Seek the Horizon
1 Tempt with Discovery
2 Bramblecrush
2 Harmonize
3 Rain of Thorns
1 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
39 Forest
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
If I play something like this or this we are talking a turn 3 win if you don't continue that part of the rules.
I'm rather curious what would happen if you kept the cmc ban, but made it so that all spells/abilities have convoke and convoke branches out to typing "permanents" instead of just "creatures" (as far as paying for mana. Obviously one cannot convoke for a planeswalker ability).
Well of course the 4< cmc rule is still in effect, part of the reason I created the format was to give players a break from all those 3> cmc cards.
I recall the three basic lands option working better. We'll try again soon and I'll post further results.
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
How does it balance so far? On one side, it gets rid of most decks dedicated towards infinite combos (B/W Teysa Combo is all <4), but still allows decks that have infinite combos that cost a bit more. It also gets rid of most tutors except for like one or two, which is awesome.
Here's my suggestions...
1. Put the life total back down to 40. Then, do increments of 10 until you find a fine line.
2. Consider messing around with the total deck size. A format like this seems like the speed would be mostly maintained (commander often uses high mana costs for important things, save for infinite combo/slowdown decks which are <4), but because the cards are ONLY CMC >4, bigger cards get put out more often. A deck size of 80 (singleton) might be the best bet, while a deck size of 200 (singleton) might be the best! You never know until you try. You could even attempt how well it would work as a 200 card deck but allowing 2 of each card to popped into the deck, or more, or less.
Me and my group would be more than happy to test this in the future.
The 100-card deck size works fine as is.
Land removal concerns me; Demolish can be used as early as turn 1, and it's possible to fall below your starting mana count if your opponents get too aggressive with LD. To rectify this slippery slope, my brother and I have proposed several possible catch-up rules, like:
1. As long as you control two or fewer lands, you may draw an additional card during your draw step.
2. As long as you control two or fewer lands, you may play an additional land on each of your turns.
3. As long as you control three or fewer lands, lands you control have indestructible.
However, a lot of these feel arbitrary and not particularly flavorful. I'm also cautious about opening the doors to potential exploitation.
Certain land removal cards need to be outright banned, like Boil and Boiling Seas. Ruination needs to be watched as it's harsh on Taplands.
I'm thinking of another decklist for this format, this time focused on multicolor. The deck needs about six more cards.
5 Keranos, God of Storms
6 Niv-Mizzet, Dracogenius
Creatures
4 Clone
4 Archaeomancer
4 Clever Impersonator
4 Dack's Duplicate
4 Stormchaser Chimera
5 Mnemonic Wall
5 Perplexing Chimera
5 Prognostic Sphinx
5 Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs
5 Seismic Elemental
5 Stoneshock Giant
5 Stormbreath Dragon
5 Mercurial Chemister
5 Scourge of Valkas
6 Steel Hellkite
6 Archetype of Imagination
6 Ætherling
6 Deadeye Navigator
6 Inferno Titan
7 Diluvian Primordial
7 Molten Primordial
8 Utvara Hellkite
4 Deathrender
4 Hedron Archive
4 Bident of Thassa
5 Gilded Lotus
5 Meteorite
5 Seal of the Guildpact
6 Caged Sun
6 Dreamstone Hedron
Enchantments
5 Dictate of the Twin Gods
5 Possibility Storm
5 Future Sight
6 Warstorm Surge
Instants
4 Fact or Fiction
4 Mindstatic
4 Scatter Arc
4 Countermand
4 Rewind
4 Into the Core
4 Essence Backlash
4 Steam Augury
5 Mystic Confluence
5 Riddle of Lightning
5 Prophetic Bolt
6 Overwhelming Intellect
4 Jace, Architect of Thought
Sorceries
4 Foresee
4 Rite of Replication
4 Cerebral Eruption
6 Interpret the Signs
6 Blast of Genius
Land
1 Command Tower
1 Forgotten Cave
1 Izzet Boilerworks
1 Izzet Guildgate
1 Lonely Sandbar
1 Reliquary Tower
1 Remote Isle
1 Smoldering Crater
1 Steam Vents
1 Swiftwater Cliffs
15 Island
15 Mountain
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
What you could do is make it so that if you have less than 3 lands, you can play as many lands on your turn as you want, up to 3. So if they destroy all my islands, on my turn, I can simply play 3 islands from my hand in one turn. Though, blue is likely to be able to counter anyway, so boil and boiling seas aren't that bad.
How would a blue deck with three lands on the field counter Boil? Force of Will? Not every blue player would have access to that. Most feasible counterspell options in the format cost 4+ like everything else. And even without LR as harsh as Boil, three red players could gang up on any single player with Craterize, Demolish, Melt Terrain, and plenty others besides. This is the equivalent of red being able to Stone Rain you turn 1 in Constructed or Tiny Leaders, only you can't Envelop or Spell Pierce the spell in response and you can easily fall below 0 mana with possibly no chance of ever catching up.
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
In EDH, the same exact thing could happen and does happen. I've personally seen my friend run a mono-blue lockdown EDH deck, only to have a card played on him that made it so he couldn't cast blue spells (or tap for blue mana, I forget which). I've also seen said blue player have his lands destroyed by two other players. It happens. In a casual variant like EDH, other players usually take pity on them and go after the person being the D-I to the Clark Kent. What he did, eventually, to try and save himself from being screwed over is run cards that could help him untap, such as Teferi, Temporal Archmage. You're looking too far into it without realizing that there are probably tons of ways to deal with it that we simply don't know of ourselves, but others would.
Also, I just want to say one thing. If A = Variety, B = High Mana cost, and C = Balance, it MIGHT not be that A+B=C. Sometimes there are some things that will inevitably break balance, and you end up having to choose to sacrifice one or the other.
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
In my opinion, having 100 cards, and 20 of them being fluff, is not variety.
I have yet another WIP decklist to try:
5 General Tazri
Creatures
4 Talus Paladin
4 Clone
4 Chasm Guide
4 Goblin Freerunner
4 Tuktuk Scrapper
4 Joraga Bard
4 Clever Impersonator
4 Ondu Champion
4 Dack's Duplicate
4 Mina and Denn, Wildborn
4 Munda, Ambush Leader
5 Hero of Goma Fada
5 Munda's Vanguard
5 Sea Gate Loremaster
5 Seascape Aerialist
5 Hagra Diabolist
5 Malakir Soothsayer
5 Kazuul Warlord
5 Resolute Blademaster
Artifacts
4 Door of Destinies
4 Hedron Archive
4 Seer's Sundial
4 Bident of Thassa
5 Meteorite
6 Dreamstone Hedron
6 Obelisk of Urd
4 Retreat to Emeria
4 Call to the Kindred
4 Bear Umbra
7 Zendikar Resurgent
Instants
4 Ætherize
4 Comparative Analysis
4 Learn from the Past
4 Rewind
4 Overwhelming Denial
4 Utter End
6 Austere Command
Planeswalkers
4 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Jace, Architect of Thought
Sorceries
4 Distant Melody
4 Explosive Vegetation
4 Peregrination
4 Seek the Horizon
4 Exploding Borders
5 Bring to Light
5 Urban Evolution
6 Plea for Guidance
Land
1 Ally Encampment
1 Arid Mesa
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Command Tower
1 Exotic Orchard
1 Flooded Strand
1 Mana Confluence
1 Marsh Flats
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Polluted Delta
1 Prairie Stream
1 Reflecting Pool
1 Reliquary Tower
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Windswept Heath
1 Wooded Foothills
4 Plains
4 Island
4 Swamp
4 Mountain
4 Forest
This one needs about 12 more nonland cards and 3 more land cards.
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
More importantly, we can decide if it's fun or not.
Can I ask one favor of you? Make some mono-colored decks for us. If you can get all 5, great, if not, no problems. Reason I wish to do this is to sort of experiment with how the colors in this format do compared to other colors. Green seems to have access to most draw and ramp cards (most are colorless though), but at least blue does have access to some counterspells, and green has the least access to tutors. It'll be interesting to see how they fare.
4 Odric, Master Tactician
Creatures
4 Akroan Horse
4 Solemn Simulacrum
4 Heliod, God of the Sun
4 Paragon of New Dawns
4 Steelshaper Apprentice
4 Taj-Nar Swordsmith
5 Knight-Captain of Eos
5 Stonehewer Giant
5 Sunscorch Regent
6 Soul of New Phyrexia
6 Steel Hellkite
6 Captain of the Watch
6 Crovax, Ascendant Hero
6 Darien, King of Kjeldor
6 Evangel of Heliod
6 Soul of Theros
6 Sun Titan
6 Purity
7 Myr Battlesphere
7 Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite
7 Luminate Primordial
8 Colossus of Akros
8 Avacyn, Angel of Hope
4 Assault Suit
4 Deathrender
4 Font of Mythos
4 Hedron Archive
4 Moonsilver Spear
4 Shield of Kaldra
4 Sword of Kaldra
5 Norn's Annex
5 Conjurer's Closet
5 Gilded Lotus
6 Caged Sun
Enchantments
4 Angelic Accord
4 Faith's Fetters
4 Armored Ascension
4 Martial Law
5 Mystic Barrier
5 Sphere of Safety
5 Dictate of Heliod
6 True Conviction
4 Faith's Reward
Planeswalkers
4 Ajani Steadfast
4 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
5 Nahiri, the Lithomancer
6 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
8 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon
Sorceries
6 Plea for Guidance
6 Austere Command
7 Mass Calcify
Land
1 Drifting Meadow
1 Emeria, the Sky Ruin
1 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
1 Reliquary Tower
1 Secluded Steppe
35 Plains
6 Arcanis the Omnipotent
Creatures
4 Phyrexian Metamorph
4 Solemn Simulacrum
4 Master of Waves
4 Paragon of Gathering Mists
4 Braids, Conjurer Adept
4 Sakashima the Impostor
5 Icefall Regent
5 Azami, Lady of Scrolls
6 Soul of New Phyrexia
6 Steel Hellkite
6 Ethereal Usher
6 Sharding Sphinx
6 Guile
7 Sphinx of the Final Word
8 Colossus of Akros
8 Lorthos, the Tidemaker
10 Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur
10 Deep-Sea Kraken
4 Assault Suit
4 Font of Mythos
4 Hedron Archive
4 Shield of Kaldra
4 Bident of Thassa
5 Gilded Lotus
6 Caged Sun
Enchantments
5 Future Sight
7 Thought Reflection
Instants
4 Ætherize
4 Mindstatic
4 Scatter Arc
4 Bone to Ash
4 Dismiss
4 Last Word
4 Rewind
4 Overwhelming Denial
4 Cryptic Command
5 Contradict
5 Desertion
5 Jace's Ingenuity
4 Jace, Architect of Thought
5 Tamiyo, the Moon Sage
5 Tezzeret the Seeker
6 Teferi, Temporal Archmage
8 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon
Sorceries
4 Whelming Wave
Land
1 Lonely Sandbar
1 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
1 Reliquary Tower
1 Remote Isle
36 Island
7 Sheoldred, Whispering One
Creatures
4 Solemn Simulacrum
4 Dimir House Guard
4 Erebos, God of the Dead
4 Gray Merchant of Asphodel
4 Paragon of Open Graves
4 King Macar, the Gold-Cursed
4 Phyrexian Obliterator
5 Sidisi, Undead Vizier
6 Soul of New Phyrexia
6 Steel Hellkite
6 Netherborn Phalanx
6 Champion of Stray Souls
6 Harvester of Souls
6 Ascendant Evincar
6 Geth, Lord of the Vault
6 Grave Titan
6 Ink-Eyes, Servant of Oni
6 Dread
7 Deathbringer Regent
7 Rune-Scarred Demon
7 Sepulchral Primordial
4 Assault Suit
4 Deathrender
4 Font of Mythos
4 Hedron Archive
4 Scythe of the Wretched
4 Shield of Kaldra
4 Whip of Erebos
5 Gilded Lotus
6 Caged Sun
Enchantments
4 Greed
4 Grave Pact
5 Dictate of Erebos
7 Grave Betrayal
Planeswalkers
5 Liliana Vess
5 Ob Nixilis of the Black Oath
6 Sorin Markov
8 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon
4 Ancient Craving
4 Gild
4 Diabolic Tutor
5 Brainspoil
5 Dark Petition
5 Diabolic Revelation
Land
1 Barren Moor
1 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
1 Polluted Mire
1 Reliquary Tower
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
35 Swamp
4 Purphoros, God of the Forge
Creatures
4 Solemn Simulacrum
4 Fanatic of Mogis
4 Paragon of Fierce Defiance
4 Archwing Dragon
4 Krenko, Mob Boss
4 Thunderbreak Regent
5 Embermaw Hellion
5 Heartless Hidetsugu
5 Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs
5 Siege-Gang Commander
5 Stormbreath Dragon
5 Urabrask the Hidden
5 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
5 Scourge of Valkas
6 Soul of New Phyrexia
6 Steel Hellkite
6 Godo, Bandit Warlord
6 Inferno Titan
6 Moonveil Dragon
7 Imperial Hellkite
7 Spawn of Thraxes
8 Colossus of Akros
8 Utvara Hellkite
4 Assault Suit
4 Font of Mythos
4 Hedron Archive
4 Shield of Kaldra
4 Sword of Kaldra
5 Conjurer's Closet
5 Gilded Lotus
6 Caged Sun
Enchantments
4 Flameshadow Conjuring
4 Splinter Twin
4 Furnace of Rath
5 Dictate of the Twin Gods
6 Warstorm Surge
Instants
4 Geosurge
5 Savage Beating
Planeswalkers
4 Koth of the Hammer
5 Sarkhan, the Dragonspeaker
6 Chandra, Flamecaller
8 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon
5 Mass Mutiny
8 Insurrection
Land
1 Forgotten Cave
1 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
1 Reliquary Tower
1 Smoldering Crater
36 Mountain
4 Yeva, Nature's Herald
Creatures
4 Solemn Simulacrum
4 Drumhunter
4 Forgotten Ancient
4 Nylea, God of the Hunt
4 Ondu Giant
4 Oracle of Mul Daya
4 Paragon of Eternal Wilds
4 Polukranos, World Eater
4 Fangren Firstborn
5 Garruk's Packleader
5 Acidic Slime
5 Nessian Game Warden
6 Soul of New Phyrexia
6 Steel Hellkite
6 Brutalizer Exarch
6 Deadwood Treefolk
6 Elvish Aberration
6 Bane of Progress
6 Kamahl, Fist of Krosa
6 Pathbreaker Ibex
6 Primordial Sage
6 Sakiko, Mother of Summer
6 Soul of the Harvest
6 Soul of Zendikar
6 Vigor
7 Avenger of Zendikar
7 Gaea's Revenge
7 Garruk's Horde
7 Regal Force
8 Colossus of Akros
8 Terastodon
8 Vorinclex, Voice of Hunger
11 Worldspine Wurm
4 Assault Suit
4 Font of Mythos
4 Hedron Archive
4 Shield of Kaldra
5 Gilded Lotus
6 Caged Sun
Enchantments
4 Defense of the Heart
4 Parallel Lives
4 Abundance
4 Primitive Etchings
4 Rowen
5 Primal Vigor
5 Dictate of Karametra
5 Shamanic Revelation
6 Wild Pair
7 Zendikar Resurgent
Planeswalkers
5 Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury
5 Nissa, Worldwaker
6 Garruk, Caller of Beasts
8 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon
Sorceries
4 Explosive Vegetation
4 Harmonize
4 Hunting Wilds
4 Peregrination
4 Ranger's Path
4 Tempt with Discovery
5 Nissa's Expedition
5 Tranquil Path
5 Primal Command
7 Nissa's Renewal
7 Tooth and Nail
9 The Great Aurora
1 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
1 Oran-Rief, the Vastwood
1 Reliquary Tower
1 Slippery Karst
1 Tranquil Thicket
35 Forest
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
Born Again Christian. Novice Mage.;)
The banned list was any card that destroys more than one land
Land Preservation Rule: As long as a player controls four or fewer lands, if an effect an opponent controls would cause a land that player controls to be put into a graveyard from the battlefield, that land's controller may pay 1 life. If he or she does, that land returns to the battlefield.
This way, single-target land removal like Craterize basically becomes a 1-damage burn spell. Boil effectively deals up to 3 damage to a given player.
Or, there could be a different, simpler rule: Starting lands can't leave the battlefield and can't be controlled by any player except their owner. This means they can't be destroyed, bounced, tucked, exiled, or stolen.
However, this rule presents a danger of allowing starting lands to be turned into unanswerable threats by effects like Awaken. So there needs to be an additional rule to keep starting lands in check: Starting lands can't attack, block, or deal damage and can't have or gain any abilities except their default mana ability.
My brother suggested an alternative: The starting lands begin the game in your command zone, stay there for the duration of the game, and can be tapped for mana.
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.