Going back up to 24 lands definitely feels right. Debating whether that 24th land should be an extra Blooming Marsh(don't have a 4th Blackcleave Cliffs right now) or an extra fetch even instead of the Kessig Wolf Run I currently have there. The added pain from an extra fetch is outweighed by the main deck life gain I'm playing I'd wager so it doesn't seem too crazy. Thoughts?
Very happy with where my sideboard is at right now. It complements my main deck very nicely.
I'm also looking at the 2nd Abrupt Decay or the 2nd K-Command and thinking I might cut one of them for an extra Lightning Bolt or a Thoughtseize. If I don't switch one of them out for a Thoughtseize, maybe change to a 3/3 IoK/TS split? IoK being 3cmc or less comes up far too often, especially if you top deck discard in the late game. I'd welcome some input on this ofc.
Going back up to 24 lands definitely feels right. Debating whether that 24th land should be an extra Blooming Marsh(don't have a 4th Blackcleave Cliffs right now) or an extra fetch even instead of the Kessig Wolf Run I currently have there. The added pain from an extra fetch is outweighed by the main deck life gain I'm playing I'd wager so it doesn't seem too crazy. Thoughts?
Very happy with where my sideboard is at right now. It complements my main deck very nicely.
I'm also looking at the 2nd Abrupt Decay or the 2nd K-Command and thinking I might cut one of them for an extra Lightning Bolt or a Thoughtseize. If I don't switch one of them out for a Thoughtseize, maybe change to a 3/3 IoK/TS split? IoK being 3cmc or less comes up far too often, especially if you top deck discard in the late game. I'd welcome some input on this ofc.
Pretty standard list from what I can tell except the Basilisk Collars which I just can't agree with. I also agree with the 3:3 IoK:TS instead of 4:2. The times when TS is needed instead of IoK, it REALLY matters. The times when you'd rather have the extra IoK instead are far fewer and you get the option of just not casting TS as well.
Going back up to 24 lands definitely feels right. Debating whether that 24th land should be an extra Blooming Marsh(don't have a 4th Blackcleave Cliffs right now) or an extra fetch even instead of the Kessig Wolf Run I currently have there. The added pain from an extra fetch is outweighed by the main deck life gain I'm playing I'd wager so it doesn't seem too crazy. Thoughts?
Very happy with where my sideboard is at right now. It complements my main deck very nicely.
I'm also looking at the 2nd Abrupt Decay or the 2nd K-Command and thinking I might cut one of them for an extra Lightning Bolt or a Thoughtseize. If I don't switch one of them out for a Thoughtseize, maybe change to a 3/3 IoK/TS split? IoK being 3cmc or less comes up far too often, especially if you top deck discard in the late game. I'd welcome some input on this ofc.
I think a Blooming Marsh is safer than the Wolf Run in a deck as color intensive as Jund. If you're looking for cards to cut for another Bolt I'd probably start with the Basilisk Collar, Jund wants good topdecks and the Collar seems like a pretty bad topdeck IMO.
Heh, the moment you realize you know who someone is online. I know we talked about Hazoret a ton and she definitely is the four drop that lets you punish people the hardest and I think should be in the main. I'm surprised you weren't on 24 lands but preference, I guess. The good part of Hazoret and 24 lands is the flood while Hazoret is out doesn't hurt you nearly as much.
I don't think the meta page is quite right since the placing page says there were five Jund lists and I only see four on the pie. I know it got the Elf totals right (myself being one for 13th) so the chart isn't 100% correct but probably close enough to use for conversation.
Anyway, good job on 12th. Are you going to run it back on Thursday with Hazoret this time?
I may or may not make it to modern tonight at Shanes in Renton, or MBH on Thurs/Fri (got 2 new puppies I am house training at home so I'm a bit distracted during the week) but I am going to the MBH 1k this saturday and I am essentially running it back with Hazoret in the main and hopefully I can find that 4th Bob amongst my stuff.
I make no secret as to who I am, and frequently stream and post here and on Reddit under this username. It's always good to chat details on Jund with folks. Grats on getting 13th!
Isn't the 1k not this Saturday but the one after (the 16th)?
Anyway, update if you get to play with Hazoret as I love hearing success stories with her.
Going back up to 24 lands definitely feels right. Debating whether that 24th land should be an extra Blooming Marsh(don't have a 4th Blackcleave Cliffs right now) or an extra fetch even instead of the Kessig Wolf Run I currently have there. The added pain from an extra fetch is outweighed by the main deck life gain I'm playing I'd wager so it doesn't seem too crazy. Thoughts?
Very happy with where my sideboard is at right now. It complements my main deck very nicely.
I'm also looking at the 2nd Abrupt Decay or the 2nd K-Command and thinking I might cut one of them for an extra Lightning Bolt or a Thoughtseize. If I don't switch one of them out for a Thoughtseize, maybe change to a 3/3 IoK/TS split? IoK being 3cmc or less comes up far too often, especially if you top deck discard in the late game. I'd welcome some input on this ofc.
I think a Blooming Marsh is safer than the Wolf Run in a deck as color intensive as Jund. If you're looking for cards to cut for another Bolt I'd probably start with the Basilisk Collar, Jund wants good topdecks and the Collar seems like a pretty bad topdeck IMO.
I'm keeping the collars in for now. They've been performing very well for me so far. I was wondering how to parcel out my removal slots mostly. I.e if I should remove one 2-3 mana removal spell for the sixth 1-mana removal spell.
Heh, the moment you realize you know who someone is online. I know we talked about Hazoret a ton and she definitely is the four drop that lets you punish people the hardest and I think should be in the main. I'm surprised you weren't on 24 lands but preference, I guess. The good part of Hazoret and 24 lands is the flood while Hazoret is out doesn't hurt you nearly as much.
I don't think the meta page is quite right since the placing page says there were five Jund lists and I only see four on the pie. I know it got the Elf totals right (myself being one for 13th) so the chart isn't 100% correct but probably close enough to use for conversation.
Anyway, good job on 12th. Are you going to run it back on Thursday with Hazoret this time?
I may or may not make it to modern tonight at Shanes in Renton, or MBH on Thurs/Fri (got 2 new puppies I am house training at home so I'm a bit distracted during the week) but I am going to the MBH 1k this saturday and I am essentially running it back with Hazoret in the main and hopefully I can find that 4th Bob amongst my stuff.
I make no secret as to who I am, and frequently stream and post here and on Reddit under this username. It's always good to chat details on Jund with folks. Grats on getting 13th!
Isn't the 1k not this Saturday but the one after (the 16th)?
Anyway, update if you get to play with Hazoret as I love hearing success stories with her.
I guess it is. According to the website that tracks all the local events it had it listed as the 9th but there site says otherwise.
Yeah, was wandering if twilight mire was worth revisiting, but figured probably not since we want coloured mana on turn 1 more than ever before. And thus it could hurt us if you have a hand with like ravine and mire as lands.
On another note I am still surprised by the high number of greedy 23 land lists lurking around here. The only way I can see a 23 land list work is by cutting the third ravine. And thats not what we want to do right now.
And to summarize again and I said it multiple times already: it does not depend on the curve or 4drop count if we want 23 or 24 lands. Like at all. Its about coloured mana requirements (see frank karstens article on that) and untapped lands requirements. Missing landdrops hurts us probably more than most other decks in the format. And if you topdeck a ravine after missing a landdrop, then maybe its time to reconsider the landbase. For me its clear though. 24 lands or max 23 land with only 2 ravine.
I was iffy on the Wolf Run to begin with so I'm going to agree with you all and remove it in favour of something else. Fetch #10 or Blooming Marsh #2 though? Given that I am going to keep the Basilisk Collars for now I'm leaning towards the fetchland and the associated perfect fixing they provide. When you're up to 10 fetches the deck thinning also starts being quite significant, improving what I perceive to be our single biggest problem - flooding in the late game. Like we've discussed extensively lately(and I'm increasingly on the same page as FlyingDelver here, shout out to our wise Primer-arch ) you want to play 24 lands to double spell and consistently activate Raging Ravine in a timely manner. 24 land lists in the current metagame are few and far between compared with a year back however. The "new kids on the block" are all playing 18-22 landers and somehow getting away with it. We can't. So using fetches to "effectively" play 20 lands or even less depending on your draws is very attractive.
Edit: I've only been playing Magic since late February/early March and didn't start looking into serious constructed formats right away obviously and took a look at Standard before buying into Modern. So I've only been playing Modern Jund since...start of September really. No wonder my opinions are in flux. Anyway, point was to say thank you to all of you fellow players. This thread(really the people on it) is a great resource and a big help.
I personally use Surgical as extra hate against Big Mana basically, since I don't want to dismiss it completely. It wokrs against Storm as well, which is nice. I feel that 3 Oozes and 1 Spellbomb and 1 Cage is right now enough GY hate for me. But that Surgical can totally be a spellbomb if you feel like it.
Anyone considered running Boil in the SB for Titanshift? Obv bring it in against blue-based control in general and only play it if it's relevant there too. But if they play prismatic omen and you Boil them...it's game over.
Anyone considered running Boil in the SB for Titanshift? Obv bring it in against blue-based control in general and only play it if it's relevant there too. But if they play prismatic omen and you Boil them...it's game over.
I don't think it's worth it unless you see multiple Omens. Most lists are only running 1 and I'd rather not bring in a completely dead card. Additionally some sideboard it out since it grows goyfs if yanked early and is an awful topdeck against a deck that tends to get you empty handed.
This would be absolutely not worth it, even if they run 4 Omens. It would be a sideboard card against at max 4 cards, which is generally not a thing you would do. Its like if I would board in artifact hate against Aether Vial decks. Its not worth it. Most of the time you dont die to Omens anyway, against us its a winmore card rather. They really don't need them to kill us, and even if its a blowout if they still play it, its too situational. And some players might even board them out due to Decay. I think this would not be a good idea for that matchup.
Before I boil I would rather Slaughter Games for Titan or something.
Was uncertain whether huntmaster is good enough or not. Basically it came down to the terminate count, am not sure if 2 is sufficient. And I dont want to go below 13 creatures generally.
@Flying Delver:
You seem the only one playing Ghost Quarter. In theory it seems like a good card, but how often do you have to mulligan because the colorless source in hour opening hand isn't a Blooming Marsh?
Is 3x Ooze MB justified? I have played more Abzan, where I always play 2 copies and that feels like a valid amount. Looking to convert my list to Jund someday, but I always feel that 3x Ooze is just too much, i.e. I'd much rather see another 4-drop in your list FlyingDelver instead of the third Ooze. It feels really sad to have a 2/2 vanilla Ooze on the board that is to be bolted/CB-ed any moment. Because often times there is simply not enough to eat from the graveyard. I know eating spells is really good against certain decks. But in the end you want Ooze to go in as a 5/5 or potentially bigger. What's your take on this?
Well historically, we did run 3 Oozes maindeck, and usually, when there is a decent amount of creature based decks dictating the meta, then Ooze is good. If you play 3 copies of a card, that basically means that usually you want to see it once per game. If you play less then you would not see it every game on average. Right now, I feel that its good to see it every game. Many decks are creature based right now. I also think Ooze is decent vs. Affinity for example. Multiples hurt sometimes, true, but its powerlevel should be good enough to justify 3 copies. However, its not a go-to do thing I would say, its fine to run 2 copies.
@Flying Delver:
You seem the only one playing Ghost Quarter. In theory it seems like a good card, but how often do you have to mulligan because the colorless source in hour opening hand isn't a Blooming Marsh?
If I would run any other land than GQ, I would probably run Twilight Mire or a fourth basic, I don't like more potentially tapped lands than the 7 we have. Speaking of GQ, I am currently still testing it, and haven't decided yet if its good enough. There have been situations where it did hurt my mana a bit I have to say. So well see on that one.
So tomorrow I take the plane for Grand Prix Madrid in Team Modern Unified, my Merfolck team mate will finally play Humans instead of his fishes.
Humans / Affinity / Jund (2 agressive decks and 1 midrange).
Here what I've tested a lot during last weekd and what I'll play this week-end : Jund Moon
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/my-modern-jund-midrange-marvel/
Going back up to 24 lands definitely feels right. Debating whether that 24th land should be an extra Blooming Marsh(don't have a 4th Blackcleave Cliffs right now) or an extra fetch even instead of the Kessig Wolf Run I currently have there. The added pain from an extra fetch is outweighed by the main deck life gain I'm playing I'd wager so it doesn't seem too crazy. Thoughts?
Very happy with where my sideboard is at right now. It complements my main deck very nicely.
I'm also looking at the 2nd Abrupt Decay or the 2nd K-Command and thinking I might cut one of them for an extra Lightning Bolt or a Thoughtseize. If I don't switch one of them out for a Thoughtseize, maybe change to a 3/3 IoK/TS split? IoK being 3cmc or less comes up far too often, especially if you top deck discard in the late game. I'd welcome some input on this ofc.
Pretty standard list from what I can tell except the Basilisk Collars which I just can't agree with. I also agree with the 3:3 IoK:TS instead of 4:2. The times when TS is needed instead of IoK, it REALLY matters. The times when you'd rather have the extra IoK instead are far fewer and you get the option of just not casting TS as well.
I think a Blooming Marsh is safer than the Wolf Run in a deck as color intensive as Jund. If you're looking for cards to cut for another Bolt I'd probably start with the Basilisk Collar, Jund wants good topdecks and the Collar seems like a pretty bad topdeck IMO.
Isn't the 1k not this Saturday but the one after (the 16th)?
Anyway, update if you get to play with Hazoret as I love hearing success stories with her.
I'm keeping the collars in for now. They've been performing very well for me so far. I was wondering how to parcel out my removal slots mostly. I.e if I should remove one 2-3 mana removal spell for the sixth 1-mana removal spell.
I guess it is. According to the website that tracks all the local events it had it listed as the 9th but there site says otherwise.
On another note I am still surprised by the high number of greedy 23 land lists lurking around here. The only way I can see a 23 land list work is by cutting the third ravine. And thats not what we want to do right now.
And to summarize again and I said it multiple times already: it does not depend on the curve or 4drop count if we want 23 or 24 lands. Like at all. Its about coloured mana requirements (see frank karstens article on that) and untapped lands requirements. Missing landdrops hurts us probably more than most other decks in the format. And if you topdeck a ravine after missing a landdrop, then maybe its time to reconsider the landbase. For me its clear though. 24 lands or max 23 land with only 2 ravine.
Edit: I've only been playing Magic since late February/early March and didn't start looking into serious constructed formats right away obviously and took a look at Standard before buying into Modern. So I've only been playing Modern Jund since...start of September really. No wonder my opinions are in flux. Anyway, point was to say thank you to all of you fellow players. This thread(really the people on it) is a great resource and a big help.
I don't think it's worth it unless you see multiple Omens. Most lists are only running 1 and I'd rather not bring in a completely dead card. Additionally some sideboard it out since it grows goyfs if yanked early and is an awful topdeck against a deck that tends to get you empty handed.
Before I boil I would rather Slaughter Games for Titan or something.
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Bloodstained Mire
1 Wooded Foothills
4 Blackcleave Cliffs
3 Raging Ravine
2 Overgrown Tomb
1 Blood Crypt
1 Stomping Ground
2 Swamp
1 Forest
1 Ghost Quarter
Creatures [13]
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Dark Confidant
3 Scavenging Ooze
1 Grim Lavamancer
1 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Thoughtseize
3 Fatal Push
3 Lightning Bolt
3 Terminate
4 Liliana of the Veil
2 Kolaghan's Command
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Abrupt Decay
2 Fulminator Mage
2 Goblin Rabblemaster
1 Surgical Extraction
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Nihil Spellbomb
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Collective Brutality
1 Anger of the Gods
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
1 Liliana, the Last Hope
How do you guys feel about the UW Breach deck that keeps popping up now? I am not sure whether its a very bad matchup or quite manageable.
You seem the only one playing Ghost Quarter. In theory it seems like a good card, but how often do you have to mulligan because the colorless source in hour opening hand isn't a Blooming Marsh?
Well historically, we did run 3 Oozes maindeck, and usually, when there is a decent amount of creature based decks dictating the meta, then Ooze is good. If you play 3 copies of a card, that basically means that usually you want to see it once per game. If you play less then you would not see it every game on average. Right now, I feel that its good to see it every game. Many decks are creature based right now. I also think Ooze is decent vs. Affinity for example. Multiples hurt sometimes, true, but its powerlevel should be good enough to justify 3 copies. However, its not a go-to do thing I would say, its fine to run 2 copies.
If I would run any other land than GQ, I would probably run Twilight Mire or a fourth basic, I don't like more potentially tapped lands than the 7 we have. Speaking of GQ, I am currently still testing it, and haven't decided yet if its good enough. There have been situations where it did hurt my mana a bit I have to say. So well see on that one.
Well I wouldnt go that far as calling it our best card main. Its decent right now, but not our best card.
Humans / Affinity / Jund (2 agressive decks and 1 midrange).
Here what I've tested a lot during last weekd and what I'll play this week-end : Jund Moon
2 Swamp
1 Forest
4 Blackcleave Cliffs
1 Blood Crypt
4 Bloodstained Mire
1 Overgrown Tomb
3 Raging Ravine
1 Stomping Ground
4 Verdant Catacombs
2 Wooded Foothills
Creatures
4 Dark Confidant
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Tarmogoyf
2 Goblin Rabblemaster
1 Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
4 Liliana of the Veil
1 Liliana, the Last Hope
Instants
3 Fatal Push
3 Lightning Bolt
2 Abrupt Decay
3 Terminate
1 Kolaghan's Command
Sorceries
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
3 Thoughtseize
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Huntmaster of the Fells
2 Nihil Spellbomb
4 Blood Moon
1 Ancient Grudge
3 Collective Brutality
2 Anger of the Gods
1 Damnation
1 Shatterstorm
Our other teams are :
- Jund DS / Burn / Elves
- Eldra Tron / BW Smallpow / Grixis Reanimator (classic Reanimator but with Kiki-jiki combo and Blood Moon in SB too)
We'll see wich one go the farest
Gus