The lack of Drogskol Captain... is kind of strange... Ok, so it's not technically Spirit tribal, but it's quite close.
I know what you mean. Seems like Captain could do a lot toward protecting Queller in addition to making all Mauzzys into 2/2 double-Cursecatchers (and that's ignoring any spirit-ETBs).
My best bet is that Captain just doesn't make the cut because the slots are so full already. The core of 4xArbiter, 4xWisp, 3xThalia is there. Running 4xQueller makes upping to 4xResto smart (strong flicker-enabler while providing top-end beats), and 4xWanderer provides a disruptive 1-drop (especially for synergy lines involving Queller). All that is left are the 6x slots between Reflector, Image and Skite- and those Reflectors just help versus the ever-present creature threat far too much to be cut. (I've been mulling over some Esper-drazi brew ideas, but keep running into similar "what gets cut?" conundrums.)
Captain might work in a list that goes more full-on into spirits, but it'd probably look more like an aggro flying-spirit WU-Hatebears deck than a controlling flicker-shenanigans WU-D&T deck.
Captain doesn't do anything on its own, if you don't draw quellers or wanderers it's just a 2/2 for 1WU and that is the worst. If you want to play that card you have to play tribal.
I don't really think he put a lot of work before playing the deck. The SB looks very sketchy 3 of 5 cards, to make it simple and quick. I also don't like the lack of 4th Thalia/1st Wingmare, Mirran Crusaders and Burrenton Forge-Tender. I think this is just another hype deck tech to get people to buy new cards.
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In Lorwyn's brief evenings, the sun pauses at the horizon long enough for a certain species of violet to bloom with the fragrance of mischief.
Playing millions of cards every turn... Slowly and systematically obliterating any chance my opponent has of winning... Clicking the multitude of locking mechanisms into place... Not even trying to win myself until turn 10+ once I have nigh absolute control... Watching my opponent desperately trying to navigate the labyrinthine prison that I've constructed... Seeing the light of hope fade and ultimately extinguished in an excruciatingly slow manner... THAT'S fun Magic.
We have 2-3 users that are dramatically making this thread incomprehensible and non-productive for anyone else to possibly join in the discussion. This needs to change.
Every time I see [ktkenshinx] post in here, I get the impression of a stern dad walking in on a bunch of kids trying to do something dumb and just shaking his head in disappointment.
Near Mint: The same as Slightly Played, but we threw some Altoids in the box we stored it in to cover up the scent of dead mice. Slightly Played: The base condition for all MTG cards. This card looks OK, but there’s one minor annoying ding in it that will always irritate and distract you whenever you draw it. Moderately Played: This card looks like it survived the Tet Offensive tucked inside the waistband of GI underwear. It may smell like it, too. Heavily Played: This card looks like the remains of Mohammed Atta’s passport after 9/11. It may be playable if you double-sleeve it to stop the chunks from falling out. The condition formerly known as "Washing Machine Grade" Damaged: This card is the unfortunate victim of a Mirrorweave/March of the Machines/Chaos Confetti/Mindslaver combo.
[M]aking counterfeit cards is the absolute height of dishonesty. Ask yourself this question: Since most people...are totally cool with the use of proxies...what purpose do [high] quality counterfeit cards serve?
This thread has discussed fetchlands/no fetchlands too many times to count. Run the fetchlands.
Any "pro" that disagrees needs a lesson in math.
Then maybe I shoudl throw away my degree in Statistics and Simmulation, that clearly shows me that the chance of you wasting the arbiter effect or mana that could be used elsewhere is orders of magnitude larger than the chance of the fetch "filtering" helping you.
This thread has discussed fetchlands/no fetchlands too many times to count. Run the fetchlands.
Any "pro" that disagrees needs a lesson in math.
Then maybe I shoudl throw away my degree in Statistics and Simmulation, that clearly shows me that the chance of you wasting the arbiter effect or mana that could be used elsewhere is orders of magnitude larger than the chance of the fetch "filtering" helping you.
People that REALLY know math .. know it.
Sigh.
People don't uses fetchlands in this deck for filtering. People use fetchlands for two reasons:
1) It gives you additional outs against nonbasiclandhate
2) When combined with shocklands, you have the choice of only losing 1 life as opposed to 3, depending on when you need to crack the fetch.
By contrast, painlands require that you lose a life every time you need access to colored mana, and that's a real problem in multiples. Anyone who has ever run multiple Canopies has experienced this. Double Canopy hands on the curve make for a bad game.
In the end, the difference between using painlands or a shockland/fetchland combination comes down to two questions:
1) How resilient do you want to be to Blood Moon?
2) Which gives you the lower expected value for life loss over the course of a game: painlands or fetchlands/shocklands?
There is room for analysis in the second one, but with proper fetching and sequencing, I tend to think that the latter is less bad. If (2) were the only thing that mattered, I would understand why Wescoe opted for a playset of painlands over some combination of shocks and fetches. But in light of (1), I just can't understand the decision.
No one in this thread believes that fetchland "filtering" makes a statistically significant impact relative to things like "damage taken over the course of a game." Your degree is nice and I'm sure it looks good on a wall, but there really is no substitute for just Google searching this thread.
Playing millions of cards every turn... Slowly and systematically obliterating any chance my opponent has of winning... Clicking the multitude of locking mechanisms into place... Not even trying to win myself until turn 10+ once I have nigh absolute control... Watching my opponent desperately trying to navigate the labyrinthine prison that I've constructed... Seeing the light of hope fade and ultimately extinguished in an excruciatingly slow manner... THAT'S fun Magic.
We have 2-3 users that are dramatically making this thread incomprehensible and non-productive for anyone else to possibly join in the discussion. This needs to change.
Every time I see [ktkenshinx] post in here, I get the impression of a stern dad walking in on a bunch of kids trying to do something dumb and just shaking his head in disappointment.
Near Mint: The same as Slightly Played, but we threw some Altoids in the box we stored it in to cover up the scent of dead mice. Slightly Played: The base condition for all MTG cards. This card looks OK, but there’s one minor annoying ding in it that will always irritate and distract you whenever you draw it. Moderately Played: This card looks like it survived the Tet Offensive tucked inside the waistband of GI underwear. It may smell like it, too. Heavily Played: This card looks like the remains of Mohammed Atta’s passport after 9/11. It may be playable if you double-sleeve it to stop the chunks from falling out. The condition formerly known as "Washing Machine Grade" Damaged: This card is the unfortunate victim of a Mirrorweave/March of the Machines/Chaos Confetti/Mindslaver combo.
[M]aking counterfeit cards is the absolute height of dishonesty. Ask yourself this question: Since most people...are totally cool with the use of proxies...what purpose do [high] quality counterfeit cards serve?
I like keeping in vials vs Merfolk because we utilize them for a lot more tricks, Stony is one of those cards I wasn't using because I didn't feel the need too, BW has lingering souls for affinity which is practicaly what stony is for, and playing Thalia turn 2 or arbiter turn 2 is what you want vs tron, not stony imo.
Don't leave us Jendo. I changed my build to less 3 drops and took out snapcasters and it worked pretty well. Got me the fnm win against the locals.
I still feel there is a lot to improve and will discuss more when I feel I have something.
All I can say is, I am standing behind vapor snags, cliques, quellers and meddling mage in the side as I try to move forward.
This thread has discussed fetchlands/no fetchlands too many times to count. Run the fetchlands.
Any "pro" that disagrees needs a lesson in math.
Then maybe I shoudl throw away my degree in Statistics and Simmulation, that clearly shows me that the chance of you wasting the arbiter effect or mana that could be used elsewhere is orders of magnitude larger than the chance of the fetch "filtering" helping you.
People that REALLY know math .. know it.
Are you grinding every modern GP with this deck or playing once a week at FNM?
One thing I notice is how everybody is worried about jund dealing with our threats.. but no one is worried how we deal with their assets? I find specially annoying to deal with kalitas ( considering we have only 4 path)
B/W has a lot of tricks and can try to grind out Jund, but I think G/W and W have to play the matchup more aggressively. Like you said, you can't answer creatures well, so if they develop their board, you don't have good ways to catch up. Your outs against big ground creatures are flickerwisp flying over their blockers and displacer getting to active multiple times a turn. Without hand disruption it's hard to deal with Kalitas + removal. Sometimes in magic you just need to turn your dudes sideways and hope they draw poorly.
Looking at the list you posted 6 days ago, I think there's a few ways you can improve your Jund matchup. You could add a little more beef, cutting Wingmares, Mindcensors, or Thalias for something bigger (Loxodon Smiter, Voice of Resurgence maybe new thalia? Scavenging Ooze seems like a great card to add, it can get huge while shrinking goyfs and keeping them from getting creatures back with command. I think all G/W builds should play at least 2, it is a very hateful bear (especially against dredge).
Yeah, my meta is all creatures now, i feel it is time for me to go back to good ol' abzan. Not sayin g/w isn't good but there are way too much elves and such, so i need tidehollow sculler and wasteland strangler again. This deck is about adapting, so i will.
EDIT: so i was watching Craig wescoe's video with u/w and i got the idea for this list, going esper:
So i take advanteg of wanderer with selfless spirit as additional spirits, which protects sculler and queller. Total of 18 flyers, 8 removal (strangler and path), 8 counter (wanderer and queller), lots of process enabler and lots of flicker targets. Seems like a lot of angles are covered, trading off the mana denial aspect. All colored lands so mana screw is unlikely. Tar-pit to finish the job.
People don't uses fetchlands in this deck for filtering. People use fetchlands for two reasons:
1) It gives you additional outs against nonbasiclandhate
2) When combined with shocklands, you have the choice of only losing 1 life as opposed to 3, depending on when you need to crack the fetch.
By contrast, painlands require that you lose a life every time you need access to colored mana, and that's a real problem in multiples. Anyone who has ever run multiple Canopies has experienced this. Double Canopy hands on the curve make for a bad game.
I may have RUSHED my response given that 99% someone says fetch are good because of math they are up to that filtering nonsense.
Even so, not all decks will need or want fetchs for these aspects that you cited (That are really valid concerns). Specially when you consider that if you have 8 fetchs your chance of drawing a fetch on the turn after you put arbiter in game (that will be optimally turn 2) is 12.2%. If you factor the 4th turn s well ( I consider 3rd and 4th turn to be the most critical turns) it goes to over 15%. That is a pretty high chance of time walking yourself. If your color requirements away from white are very small you can try to use fast lands and a very few other (and maybe a very few fetchs).
Anyway I am on the wagon of not liking at all the chance of transforming one of our best possible openers into a self time walk.
People that use painlands are mostly people that did not understood that most of the lists that use dthem were because of eldrazi displacer activation cost (so they eneded the colorless mana). That is the problem with so many people copying things without thinking on why.
One thing I notice is how everybody is worried about jund dealing with our threats.. but no one is worried how we deal with their assets? I find specially annoying to deal with kalitas ( considering we have only 4 path)
B/W has a lot of tricks and can try to grind out Jund, but I think G/W and W have to play the matchup more aggressively. Like you said, you can't answer creatures well, so if they develop their board, you don't have good ways to catch up. Your outs against big ground creatures are flickerwisp flying over their blockers and displacer getting to active multiple times a turn. Without hand disruption it's hard to deal with Kalitas + removal. Sometimes in magic you just need to turn your dudes sideways and hope they draw poorly.
Looking at the list you posted 6 days ago, I think there's a few ways you can improve your Jund matchup. You could add a little more beef, cutting Wingmares, Mindcensors, or Thalias for something bigger (Loxodon Smiter, Voice of Resurgence maybe new thalia? Scavenging Ooze seems like a great card to add, it can get huge while shrinking goyfs and keeping them from getting creatures back with command. I think all G/W builds should play at least 2, it is a very hateful bear (especially against dredge).
I have been adjusting that list. Reducing a bit the number of displacers since they are not very useful in doubles. Also changed my grave hate for jutun grunts. I tested a bit agaisnt my own dredge deck and they work almost as well as rest in peace, just not being as good on the nut draw of dredge that puts 12+ points of power on seconds turn. The 4/4 body is also strong agaisnt red removals and it usually defeats the goys (if you select wisely what to eat from graveyard).
The wingmares and 4 thalias are there mostly because my meta is hellish infested with 2 things infect and the fiend hunter + nivmagus elemental deck. The ensurance of a +1 cost to spells help a lot with these.
The scavenging ooze is indeed an interesting possibility.... might be worth a slot or 2, including part of the jutun slots since jutuns tends to not work in pairs (except against dredge where they do have enough food).
Are you grinding every modern GP with this deck or playing once a week at FNM?
math is non temporal, absolute and independent of events in the world...
even so.. there is no moern GP in my country,.. in fact.. no GPs at all this year (not all people have easy life as USA people that can walk out of the door and find a large magic tournament) but I do attend to all GPTs (That we tend to organize even for the GPs that obviously out of reach for anyone due to distance.)
Are you grinding every modern GP with this deck or playing once a week at FNM?
math is non temporal, absolute and independent of events in the world...
even so.. there is no moern GP in my country,.. in fact.. no GPs at all this year (not all people have easy life as USA people that can walk out of the door and find a large magic tournament) but I do attend to all GPTs (That we tend to organize even for the GPs that obviously out of reach for anyone due to distance.)
If you are grinding every competitive event you can then don't play fetches, if not play them. That's my analysis on the entire thing.
For a control deck the shock fetch is much better, but for a deck that really wants to play on curve and close games out fairly quickly I don't see a ton of difference.
It basically comes down to would you rather be resilient to blood moon, or would you rather be resilient to your own deck? You are much more likely to get messed up from the arbiter than a blood moon unless every single opponent is playing moon.
Specially when you consider that if you have 8 fetchs your chance of drawing a fetch on the turn after you put arbiter in game (that will be optimally turn 2) is 12.2%. If you factor the 4th turn s well ( I consider 3rd and 4th turn to be the most critical turns) it goes to over 15%. That is a pretty high chance of time walking yourself. If your color requirements away from white are very small you can try to use fast lands and a very few other (and maybe a very few fetchs).
You're right that playing 8xFetch Lands in a D&T build running 4xLeonin Arbiter would trip all over itself far too often. However, this is the D&T thread, so no one here is advocating the use of fetches in a Jund-like 9xFetches-cherrypicking-from-5xDuals sort of way. When you hear "play the fetches" here it should be assumed to mean "go ahead and use a couple fetches, sparingly" in a 2x-4x sort of way, and never to mean "go fetch crazy like a Modern tri-color deck" sort of way. Like your parenthesis sidenote implies, a very few can be decent.
(The reason I'm assuming the previous posters were advocating a ballpark number of 2x-4x fetches is due to the posted sample decklist utilizing 4x, and some past fetch discussions in the previous thread(s).)
Hey everyone! So I have a PPTQ coming up next week, and I've been practicing with Mono-White D&T to get ready for it. I just can't seem to settle on a list that I like. I'm unsure if I want to keep the curve lower, leaving our Resto Angels, or drop Judge's Familiar and go slightly bigger. For reference, this is pretty close to the list I've been practicing with:
I've been wanting to mess around with Serra Avenger, has anyone had any success with her? Any tips or advice on my list would be appreciated as I don't have much time to work on it before the PPTQ. Thanks in advance for any suggestions!
Hey everyone! So I have a PPTQ coming up next week, and I've been practicing with Mono-White D&T to get ready for it. I just can't seem to settle on a list that I like. I'm unsure if I want to keep the curve lower, leaving our Resto Angels, or drop Judge's Familiar and go slightly bigger. For reference, this is pretty close to the list I've been practicing with:
I've been wanting to mess around with Serra Avenger, has anyone had any success with her? Any tips or advice on my list would be appreciated as I don't have much time to work on it before the PPTQ. Thanks in advance for any suggestions!
Serra Avenger is a great card, but I don't think you're list wants or needs it. Avenger can still have its place but any slots I would want Avenger in I would rather have Selfless Spirit. I like all the protection this list provides for its taxers. No advice though cause the list looks great. Good luck!
I'm planning on building Eldrazi & Taxes once I get my Aether Vials in. Would it be considered important to get some fetch lands in there, too? Sorry if I don't want to sift through the earlier argument to get an answer. :s
I've been wanting to mess around with Serra Avenger, has anyone had any success with her?
Some poking around on mtgTop8 shows that she pops up in about 64 of 224 D&T lists (usually as a 2x-3x). If you cut out WG lists (only 1 of 94 use her) and WB lists (8 of 48 use her) and even WU lists (1 of 3 use her) you're left seeing that 54 of 79 WW lists ran her; so, yeah, she's definitely had success over the years.
She doesn't do anything for our taxing or synergy plans, but has always served as a decent bit of muscle (especially in mono-W). A flying vigilance 3/3 for 2cmc has been good for the deck especially off vial. However, Selfless Spirit is a new tool that (potentially) competes for her slot, trading away some muscle for the flexibility of some new Skite-like and BFT-like protection plays. I say potentially competes for the 2cmc slot because its still pretty early to say how most lists will shake out. Max Hersch made top 4 of SCG Columbus in late July with a list that ran 0xSerra and 4xSpirit, but SlayItWithRoses just posted a MTGO league 5-0 the other day with a list running 3xSerra and 4xSpirit.
All that said, I agree with what Topdeck_tech says about your list not really needing her. You already have Brimaz for muscle, and you're pretty well set up with 2cmc fliers thanks to 4xSpirit. If you really want to give her a test drive, though, it wouldn't be too horrible sliding 1x-2x into some slots currently held by Familiar, Spirit, Brimaz#2, or Thalia#4.
I'm planning on building Eldrazi & Taxes once I get my Aether Vials in. Would it be considered important to get some fetch lands in there, too? Sorry if I don't want to sift through the earlier argument to get an answer. :s
In BW eldrazi its best to play pain lands because they act like Tri-Color lands. No need to get into the debate about fetch lands in D&T because Eldrazi and Taxes probably cant make room for them. I wouldn't want to cut my Shambling Vents and a basic swamp to try and fit them in.
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Captain doesn't do anything on its own, if you don't draw quellers or wanderers it's just a 2/2 for 1WU and that is the worst. If you want to play that card you have to play tribal.
I don't really think he put a lot of work before playing the deck. The SB looks very sketchy 3 of 5 cards, to make it simple and quick. I also don't like the lack of 4th Thalia/1st Wingmare, Mirran Crusaders and Burrenton Forge-Tender. I think this is just another hype deck tech to get people to buy new cards.
Any "pro" that disagrees needs a lesson in math.
WUDeath&TaxesWG
Legacy
UBRGDredgeUBRG
UHigh TideU
URGLandsURG
WR Card Choice List
WUR American D&T
WUB Esper D&T
The Reserved List
Heat Maps
Then maybe I shoudl throw away my degree in Statistics and Simmulation, that clearly shows me that the chance of you wasting the arbiter effect or mana that could be used elsewhere is orders of magnitude larger than the chance of the fetch "filtering" helping you.
People that REALLY know math .. know it.
People don't uses fetchlands in this deck for filtering. People use fetchlands for two reasons:
1) It gives you additional outs against nonbasic land hate
2) When combined with shocklands, you have the choice of only losing 1 life as opposed to 3, depending on when you need to crack the fetch.
By contrast, painlands require that you lose a life every time you need access to colored mana, and that's a real problem in multiples. Anyone who has ever run multiple Canopies has experienced this. Double Canopy hands on the curve make for a bad game.
In the end, the difference between using painlands or a shockland/fetchland combination comes down to two questions:
1) How resilient do you want to be to Blood Moon?
2) Which gives you the lower expected value for life loss over the course of a game: painlands or fetchlands/shocklands?
There is room for analysis in the second one, but with proper fetching and sequencing, I tend to think that the latter is less bad. If (2) were the only thing that mattered, I would understand why Wescoe opted for a playset of painlands over some combination of shocks and fetches. But in light of (1), I just can't understand the decision.
No one in this thread believes that fetchland "filtering" makes a statistically significant impact relative to things like "damage taken over the course of a game." Your degree is nice and I'm sure it looks good on a wall, but there really is no substitute for just Google searching this thread.
Man, I feel you. This thread has seen brighter days.
WUDeath&TaxesWG
Legacy
UBRGDredgeUBRG
UHigh TideU
URGLandsURG
WR Card Choice List
WUR American D&T
WUB Esper D&T
The Reserved List
Heat Maps
Don't leave us Jendo. I changed my build to less 3 drops and took out snapcasters and it worked pretty well. Got me the fnm win against the locals.
I still feel there is a lot to improve and will discuss more when I feel I have something.
All I can say is, I am standing behind vapor snags, cliques, quellers and meddling mage in the side as I try to move forward.
Are you grinding every modern GP with this deck or playing once a week at FNM?
B/W has a lot of tricks and can try to grind out Jund, but I think G/W and W have to play the matchup more aggressively. Like you said, you can't answer creatures well, so if they develop their board, you don't have good ways to catch up. Your outs against big ground creatures are flickerwisp flying over their blockers and displacer getting to active multiple times a turn. Without hand disruption it's hard to deal with Kalitas + removal. Sometimes in magic you just need to turn your dudes sideways and hope they draw poorly.
Looking at the list you posted 6 days ago, I think there's a few ways you can improve your Jund matchup. You could add a little more beef, cutting Wingmares, Mindcensors, or Thalias for something bigger (Loxodon Smiter, Voice of Resurgence maybe new thalia? Scavenging Ooze seems like a great card to add, it can get huge while shrinking goyfs and keeping them from getting creatures back with command. I think all G/W builds should play at least 2, it is a very hateful bear (especially against dredge).
EDIT: so i was watching Craig wescoe's video with u/w and i got the idea for this list, going esper:
4 path to exile
artifacts: 4
4 Æther vial
creatures: 30
4 mausoleum wanderer
4 thalia, guardian of thraben
4 tidehollow sculler
4 selfless spirit
4 flickerwisp
4 wasteland strangler
4 spell queller
2 restoration angel
4 flooded strand
4 marsh flats
2 hallowed fountain
1 godless shrine
1 watery grave
3 plains
1 swamp
3 seachrome coast
1 isolated chapel
2 creeping tar pit
2 burrenton forge-tender
2 meddling mage
2 spellskite
2 rest in peace
2 orzhov pontiff
2 sin collector
1 linvala, keeper of silence
1 kalitas, traitor of ghet
1 shriekmaw
So i take advanteg of wanderer with selfless spirit as additional spirits, which protects sculler and queller. Total of 18 flyers, 8 removal (strangler and path), 8 counter (wanderer and queller), lots of process enabler and lots of flicker targets. Seems like a lot of angles are covered, trading off the mana denial aspect. All colored lands so mana screw is unlikely. Tar-pit to finish the job.
Thoughts?
I may have RUSHED my response given that 99% someone says fetch are good because of math they are up to that filtering nonsense.
Even so, not all decks will need or want fetchs for these aspects that you cited (That are really valid concerns). Specially when you consider that if you have 8 fetchs your chance of drawing a fetch on the turn after you put arbiter in game (that will be optimally turn 2) is 12.2%. If you factor the 4th turn s well ( I consider 3rd and 4th turn to be the most critical turns) it goes to over 15%. That is a pretty high chance of time walking yourself. If your color requirements away from white are very small you can try to use fast lands and a very few other (and maybe a very few fetchs).
Anyway I am on the wagon of not liking at all the chance of transforming one of our best possible openers into a self time walk.
People that use painlands are mostly people that did not understood that most of the lists that use dthem were because of eldrazi displacer activation cost (so they eneded the colorless mana). That is the problem with so many people copying things without thinking on why.
I have been adjusting that list. Reducing a bit the number of displacers since they are not very useful in doubles. Also changed my grave hate for jutun grunts. I tested a bit agaisnt my own dredge deck and they work almost as well as rest in peace, just not being as good on the nut draw of dredge that puts 12+ points of power on seconds turn. The 4/4 body is also strong agaisnt red removals and it usually defeats the goys (if you select wisely what to eat from graveyard).
The wingmares and 4 thalias are there mostly because my meta is hellish infested with 2 things infect and the fiend hunter + nivmagus elemental deck. The ensurance of a +1 cost to spells help a lot with these.
The scavenging ooze is indeed an interesting possibility.... might be worth a slot or 2, including part of the jutun slots since jutuns tends to not work in pairs (except against dredge where they do have enough food).
math is non temporal, absolute and independent of events in the world...
even so.. there is no moern GP in my country,.. in fact.. no GPs at all this year (not all people have easy life as USA people that can walk out of the door and find a large magic tournament) but I do attend to all GPTs (That we tend to organize even for the GPs that obviously out of reach for anyone due to distance.)
If you are grinding every competitive event you can then don't play fetches, if not play them. That's my analysis on the entire thing.
It basically comes down to would you rather be resilient to blood moon, or would you rather be resilient to your own deck? You are much more likely to get messed up from the arbiter than a blood moon unless every single opponent is playing moon.
(The reason I'm assuming the previous posters were advocating a ballpark number of 2x-4x fetches is due to the posted sample decklist utilizing 4x, and some past fetch discussions in the previous thread(s).)
4 Selfless Spirit
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
2 Brimaz, King of Oreskos
1 Aven Mindcensor
3 Blade Splicer
4 Flickerwisp
1 Restoration Angel
4 Path to Exile
13 Plains
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Tectonic Edge
1 Mutavault
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Eiganjo Castle
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Mirran Crusader
2 Kor Firewalker
2 Spellskite
2 Dismember
2 Stony Silence
3 Rest in Peace
I've been wanting to mess around with Serra Avenger, has anyone had any success with her? Any tips or advice on my list would be appreciated as I don't have much time to work on it before the PPTQ. Thanks in advance for any suggestions!
WB Ayli, Eternal Pilgrim | WBR Queen Marchesa | WUBR Breya, Etherium Shaper
Modern:
/ Death and Taxes | W/ Soul Sisters | Spirits | U Faeries | Tempered Steel Affinity
She doesn't do anything for our taxing or synergy plans, but has always served as a decent bit of muscle (especially in mono-W). A flying vigilance 3/3 for 2cmc has been good for the deck especially off vial. However, Selfless Spirit is a new tool that (potentially) competes for her slot, trading away some muscle for the flexibility of some new Skite-like and BFT-like protection plays. I say potentially competes for the 2cmc slot because its still pretty early to say how most lists will shake out. Max Hersch made top 4 of SCG Columbus in late July with a list that ran 0xSerra and 4xSpirit, but SlayItWithRoses just posted a MTGO league 5-0 the other day with a list running 3xSerra and 4xSpirit.
All that said, I agree with what Topdeck_tech says about your list not really needing her. You already have Brimaz for muscle, and you're pretty well set up with 2cmc fliers thanks to 4xSpirit. If you really want to give her a test drive, though, it wouldn't be too horrible sliding 1x-2x into some slots currently held by Familiar, Spirit, Brimaz#2, or Thalia#4.
In BW eldrazi its best to play pain lands because they act like Tri-Color lands. No need to get into the debate about fetch lands in D&T because Eldrazi and Taxes probably cant make room for them. I wouldn't want to cut my Shambling Vents and a basic swamp to try and fit them in.