Hi guys, i'm glad to report I was able to enter my first ever Top 8 using the deck below and was able to reach 4th place. Still didn't know how to sideboard but I just winged it since no replied here. lol. Anyway, I have a few question:
1. What creatures do we remove against Jund & Junk? I was able to win with a timely Tidehollow, Strangler and on the back of RIP, wasn't able to draw Gideon to know if he carries his weight against this deck.
2. Against Merfolk and Elves, what do we do? lol. I actually switched out Wrath of god for Gideon, but when I was playing against Elves and was able to draw Gideon (not sure why I inserted him against them. lol), wished it was *** instead. @_@
Hope someone replies, and could someone freaking make a thread for specifically Eldrazi Taxes?? I'm not that experienced to make one myself but I really think a thread of its own would be nice.
Congrats on top 8!
Some players like to remove their vials against them in an effort to have better topdecks. I'm not a huge fan of that personally though. In your list, I'd probably go for something along the lines of +1 gideon +3 rip for something along the lines of -1 tks, -2 arbiter (this is mroe dependent on if you're on the play or draw. I like arbiter more on the play and less on the draw). and -1 strangler. This way your curve is similar, you have a great grindy top end and they lose a lot of resources from the GY. You might consider bringing in sin collector and or blessed alliance, but it's dependent on what you saw and play vs draw.
E&T should have the best MU of any D&T variant against creature decks like those you listed. I've never found merfolk to be too tough, regardless the splash, but elves is can be near unwinnable. Against merfolk, I like to bring in cards like ghostly prison and worship. Essentially, save removal for lords and use what firststrike you have to lead to bad combat steps for them. It's similar against elves, although it's harder because they can ramp and even if we keep them off lords, they seem to always find a coco and then just win. orzhov pontiff effects are phenomenal here.
I couldn't agree more with chalupacabra. Making a separate thread merely fractures the deck and the community. I don't play any splash exclusively (altho I probably play GW the most). Which thread would you have me in? All of them? I understand why you might feel frustrated about E&T posts getting lost in the other decks that are pulled up, but your questions weren't specific to E&T. Yes, your deck changes how you interact a bit, but my strategy against a deck like merfolk doesn't change from splash to splash. In fact, if you had a separate thread, even if I wanted to be a part of all of them, it would be difficult for me to do so and might mean that your question wouldn't be answered. That hardly seems preferable. Most of your SB will be similar even and even then, there are a ton of options. I know for instance that if you gave deathandcatmix and I the very same deck in the same meta, we'd make a different SB and we're two of the players who've been here a long time and have a stupid amount of hours under our respective belts with a huge variety of splashes. Furthermore, E&T made a big splash in the pond when it first came about, but has since dwindled in popularity. I wouldn't consider it to be different enough in card pool, player base, or power level to have its own thread.
Hope someone replies, and could someone freaking make a thread for specifically Eldrazi Taxes?? I'm not that experienced to make one myself but I really think a thread of its own would be nice.
One of the keys to doing well with this deck is understanding that, unlike most decks in the format, there is not now, nor will ever be, an optimized list.
It doesn't work that way.
Whether you call it D&T, E&T, W/X Flicker, or Bobo the Wonder Snake; all of the decks are built on the same core concepts and fundamental principles. This is why an E&T thread or Spirits&Taxes thread makes no sense to those who know the deck. It would be like calling every different options package of a car by a different model name. It didn't work for Alfa Romeo, and it won't work for us.
In fact, it's exactly this kind of splintering that hurts the deck. Constant renaming and reclassification of the deck has made information gathering and assessment of its meta position nearly impossible.
The best advice for people new to the archetype is to try a traditional white build for a few, then splash, trim, and substitute to your heart's content until you find a build that you feel addresses both the meta and your playstyle.
I couldn't agree more with chalupacabra. Making a separate thread merely fractures the deck and the community. I don't play any splash exclusively (altho I probably play GW the most). Which thread would you have me in? All of them? I understand why you might feel frustrated about E&T posts getting lost in the other decks that are pulled up, but your questions weren't specific to E&T. Yes, your deck changes how you interact a bit, but my strategy against a deck like merfolk doesn't change from splash to splash. In fact, if you had a separate thread, even if I wanted to be a part of all of them, it would be difficult for me to do so and might mean that your question wouldn't be answered. That hardly seems preferable. Most of your SB will be similar even and even then, there are a ton of options. I know for instance that if you gave deathandcatmix and I the very same deck in the same meta, we'd make a different SB and we're two of the players who've been here a long time and have a stupid amount of hours under our respective belts with a huge variety of splashes. Furthermore, E&T made a big splash in the pond when it first came about, but has since dwindled in popularity. I wouldn't consider it to be different enough in card pool, player base, or power level to have its own thread.
I'm just going to go on record agreeing with Chalupacabra and Spider.
While I understand your (@Mr_Bote) frustrations, there is so much variation in the builds and playstyles that it's very difficult to create different threads for each and every one. Ultimately, all of the decks that operate on the same strategic principles should exist in once place, even if there are ~15 flex slots in the maindeck.
You're going to want this thread, which was created for reasons that I can't explain without receiving a warning for trolling. But you'll get more advice for that specific build there.
Playing millions of cards every turn... Slowly and systematically obliterating any chance my opponent has of winning... Clicking the multitude of locking mechanisms into place... Not even trying to win myself until turn 10+ once I have nigh absolute control... Watching my opponent desperately trying to navigate the labyrinthine prison that I've constructed... Seeing the light of hope fade and ultimately extinguished in an excruciatingly slow manner... THAT'S fun Magic.
We have 2-3 users that are dramatically making this thread incomprehensible and non-productive for anyone else to possibly join in the discussion. This needs to change.
Every time I see [ktkenshinx] post in here, I get the impression of a stern dad walking in on a bunch of kids trying to do something dumb and just shaking his head in disappointment.
Near Mint: The same as Slightly Played, but we threw some Altoids in the box we stored it in to cover up the scent of dead mice. Slightly Played: The base condition for all MTG cards. This card looks OK, but there’s one minor annoying ding in it that will always irritate and distract you whenever you draw it. Moderately Played: This card looks like it survived the Tet Offensive tucked inside the waistband of GI underwear. It may smell like it, too. Heavily Played: This card looks like the remains of Mohammed Atta’s passport after 9/11. It may be playable if you double-sleeve it to stop the chunks from falling out. The condition formerly known as "Washing Machine Grade" Damaged: This card is the unfortunate victim of a Mirrorweave/March of the Machines/Chaos Confetti/Mindslaver combo.
[M]aking counterfeit cards is the absolute height of dishonesty. Ask yourself this question: Since most people...are totally cool with the use of proxies...what purpose do [high] quality counterfeit cards serve?
Hi guys, i'm glad to report I was able to enter my first ever Top 8 using the deck below and was able to reach 4th place. Still didn't know how to sideboard but I just winged it since no replied here. lol. Anyway, I have a few question:
1. What creatures do we remove against Jund & Junk? I was able to win with a timely Tidehollow, Strangler and on the back of RIP, wasn't able to draw Gideon to know if he carries his weight against this deck.
2. Against Merfolk and Elves, what do we do? lol. I actually switched out Wrath of god for Gideon, but when I was playing against Elves and was able to draw Gideon (not sure why I inserted him against them. lol), wished it was *** instead. @_@
Hope someone replies, and could someone freaking make a thread for specifically Eldrazi Taxes?? I'm not that experienced to make one myself but I really think a thread of its own would be nice.
Congrats on top 8!
Some players like to remove their vials against them in an effort to have better topdecks. I'm not a huge fan of that personally though. In your list, I'd probably go for something along the lines of +1 gideon +3 rip for something along the lines of -1 tks, -2 arbiter (this is mroe dependent on if you're on the play or draw. I like arbiter more on the play and less on the draw). and -1 strangler. This way your curve is similar, you have a great grindy top end and they lose a lot of resources from the GY. You might consider bringing in sin collector and or blessed alliance, but it's dependent on what you saw and play vs draw.
E&T should have the best MU of any D&T variant against creature decks like those you listed. I've never found merfolk to be too tough, regardless the splash, but elves is can be near unwinnable. Against merfolk, I like to bring in cards like ghostly prison and worship. Essentially, save removal for lords and use what firststrike you have to lead to bad combat steps for them. It's similar against elves, although it's harder because they can ramp and even if we keep them off lords, they seem to always find a coco and then just win. orzhov pontiff effects are phenomenal here.
I couldn't agree more with chalupacabra. Making a separate thread merely fractures the deck and the community. I don't play any splash exclusively (altho I probably play GW the most). Which thread would you have me in? All of them? I understand why you might feel frustrated about E&T posts getting lost in the other decks that are pulled up, but your questions weren't specific to E&T. Yes, your deck changes how you interact a bit, but my strategy against a deck like merfolk doesn't change from splash to splash. In fact, if you had a separate thread, even if I wanted to be a part of all of them, it would be difficult for me to do so and might mean that your question wouldn't be answered. That hardly seems preferable. Most of your SB will be similar even and even then, there are a ton of options. I know for instance that if you gave deathandcatmix and I the very same deck in the same meta, we'd make a different SB and we're two of the players who've been here a long time and have a stupid amount of hours under our respective belts with a huge variety of splashes. Furthermore, E&T made a big splash in the pond when it first came about, but has since dwindled in popularity. I wouldn't consider it to be different enough in card pool, player base, or power level to have its own thread.
Thanks for the information on what to SB. So I'll remove Aven Mindcensor to accommodate Orzhov (once I buy it, again) and -1 Blessed Alliance for Worship? In most of the matches, I've been boarding out Dark Confidant (the MUs I faced were, Jund Scapeshift Affinity Elves Merfolk), what MUs do we keep him in?
It's not that I am saying it is stronger, has a bigger player base or card pool, more of I just get frustrated that specific post on specific variants sometimes get lost/drowned/swallowed up by talks of the different variants, I just find it more clean and easier if what I said were to happen.
The truth is it benefits from combining aspects of multiple versions of the deck.
I have benefitted from multiple styles being in the thread and players of multiple styles can benefit from seeing lists like this. Start splitting hairs over differences and that cross-pollination ceases to occur.
Edit: Was too long, shortened to get to the point.
“Modern has provided us a non-rotating format that is far more accessible than Legacy or Vintage, but still retains many of the qualities that people enjoy in those formats—such as a more stable metagame, the ability to play and tweak the same deck week after week, and simply a much more powerful card pool than Standard.”
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
How are you liking geist right now? I've been off him for some time, but perhaps it's his time to shine again.
I like reflector mage much more than splicer in this build. It moves dudes out of the way for geist and accomplishes a similar goal to splicer in an anti creature fashion, but better imo. Have you tried venser, shaper savant? I've absolutely fallen in love with this card for WU.
Have you tested ceremonious rejection at all? I've really liked it in the board. It hits a lot of decks and is unconditional if it's going to hit something (i.e. not pay 2 or countered).
Also, I think you might want fecthes and much less hallowed fountain. I do this to reduce the amount of islands in my deck because merfolk is a thing and it goes from favorable to unfavorable when you give them auto unblockablitiy.
Personally I live geist, he is a one man threat, that if need be wr have tools to push through. Versus control many times he forces a wrath on his own so you don't have to Over-commit and if not discarded is s nightmare for bgx decks to deal with. I have become fond of reflector mage, but in some matches he is a bit if a dead card which is why I run 3. I cut splicer to 2, so good at gumming up the ground but need for 4 is gone with tempo plays that blue offers.
Edit, merfolk can get you islands pretty easy either way, we can be then pretty regularly in my experience with combat tricks etc and removing our lands if need be. I would rather be slightly weaker to Meryl rather than play off curve due to arbiter, again is my personal views, I may swith one fountain out for mystic gate, but will likely not run fetches. Post board ghostly prison screws fish pretty hard along with engineered explosives. Must times versus fish it comes down (preboard) to them making a mass attack, me gq or tec my "island" wisp and maybe pay less and demolish with first strike.
Thanks for the information on what to SB. So I'll remove Aven Mindcensor to accommodate Orzhov (once I buy it, again) and -1 Blessed Alliance for Worship? In most of the matches, I've been boarding out Dark Confidant (the MUs I faced were, Jund Scapeshift Affinity Elves Merfolk), what MUs do we keep him in?
It's not that I am saying it is stronger, has a bigger player base or card pool, more of I just get frustrated that specific post on specific variants sometimes get lost/drowned/swallowed up by talks of the different variants, I just find it more clean and easier if what I said were to happen.
Sure thing. I'm not telling you these cards are absolutely the way to go, but rather that I see them to be good. I think that BA isn't great right now. And I also am not sure BW E&T needs stony, but that's my take.
I would for sure keep confidant in against jund. That's the perfect MU for it. I'd be temped to keep it in against scapeshift, although then you might put yourself in a more killable range, but I'd probably risk it for the acceleration and hope I can kill them first.
I understand. My point is that it seems better to get lost in a wealth of information than to ask the same questions in different places, making results harder to pull up and more confusing for someone who might not be playing your specific splash.
Thanks for the information on what to SB. So I'll remove Aven Mindcensor to accommodate Orzhov (once I buy it, again) and -1 Blessed Alliance for Worship? In most of the matches, I've been boarding out Dark Confidant (the MUs I faced were, Jund Scapeshift Affinity Elves Merfolk), what MUs do we keep him in?
It's not that I am saying it is stronger, has a bigger player base or card pool, more of I just get frustrated that specific post on specific variants sometimes get lost/drowned/swallowed up by talks of the different variants, I just find it more clean and easier if what I said were to happen.
Sure thing. I'm not telling you these cards are absolutely the way to go, but rather that I see them to be good. I think that BA isn't great right now. And I also am not sure BW E&T needs stony, but that's my take.
I would for sure keep confidant in against jund. That's the perfect MU for it. I'd be temped to keep it in against scapeshift, although then you might put yourself in a more killable range, but I'd probably risk it for the acceleration and hope I can kill them first.
I understand. My point is that it seems better to get lost in a wealth of information than to ask the same questions in different places, making results harder to pull up and more confusing for someone who might not be playing your specific splash.
Yeah, actually lost the semi-finals to Scapeshift even after having 28 life since I kept drawing B/W lands, wishing it was GQs. He got his payback after I beaten him in R1 of the swiss. A bit misplay on Sculler and TKS of what to get but learned my lesson. Yeah, Stony is still a blast against Affinity, T2 drop of it still devastate them and I think it is there for other MUs like Ad Nauseun and Lanterns I think?
How about Bant Eldrazi, any advice on the SB?
Yeah, I understand, well, nothing I can do about it with anyway since I'm not that experience to make one. I'll just do my best to filter useful knowledge. Thanks for being easy to talk too and not taking the stance of a know it all, not that I am saying others are.
Decided to play a competitive league the other day and I managed to pull off a 5-0! The list was similar to Craig's MOCs deck but with 2 main deck crusaders and way more plains than horizon canopys.
I don't usually play competitive leagues and I feel like I got really lucky a few times, especially in the last turn of the last match. I've thrown the replays onto youtube at 1.5x speed if anyone wants to check it out:
In light of the previous discussion about Wescoe's list and variations, I've decided to focus my list in on disruptive creatures. Trying to cut out creatures that are "just" creatures. I'm not trying to play white weenie over here
I'm not sure if this deck has what it takes to close out games, but I like that every single creature contributes beyond the value of beating up the opponent (most obvious example of this is that I cut 2x Serra Avenger)
Playing this deck makes me yearn for Stoneforge Mystic. I keep the Sword of Fire and Ice around so every once in a while I can feel what this deck *could* be. SFM would really help add that explosive power the deck is missing to take advantage of the disruption.
I haven't disappeared from the face of the earth! I've just been on a mtg hiatus.
Anyway, seeing MM17 spoilers has reminded me that Venser, Shaper Savant is a thing. Would he be potentially a good choice for a UW version of this deck that also runs Eldrazi? You could bounce a spell or permanent back to their hand with Venser and TKS it away, and keep some pressure on their hand by repeating the process with Eldrazi Displacer or Flickerwisp (with a little less control, since you wouldn't necessarily be able to bounce spells that way).
@CharonsObol
LOL, thank you, though I can't imagine you getting a warning for trolling after several years of seeing you post on every flavor of DnT, so you must have some juicy word for that one!
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"I'm a lead farmer... !" Quote ruined due to policy.
Inspector doesn't seem that bad if you want to play with 1 drops, being able to vial it in turn 2 and crack the clue on their end step comes up, and the clues are nice when you are facing a grindy deck like grixis. I'm going to have to check the replay but I think in the match vs tron that's missing I play a turn 1 inspector into either Thalia or Arbiter and my tron opponent uses their mana to kill the clue, which was fantastic because I played a stony silence on the next turn.
@CharonsObol
LOL, thank you, though I can't imagine you getting a warning for trolling after several years of seeing you post on every flavor of DnT, so you must have some juicy word for that one!
I just meant that the deck seems like a cross between E&T and Eldrazi Stompy, both of which have their own dedicated threads in the Modern subforum. In my humble opinion, that particular archetype didn't need a thread of its own and it should probably have gone into one of the two aforementioned threads (but probably this one).
The person who made the primer for that deck felt strongly like it needed its own thread, so now when anyone (like yourself) asks about it, we end up having to point him or her to a different thread. The upside is that you'll get more specialized advice over there, but the downside is that you'll lose a lot of diverse discussion over here.
It seems like a net negative to me, but MTGS (rightfully) won't let me police the forums.
Playing millions of cards every turn... Slowly and systematically obliterating any chance my opponent has of winning... Clicking the multitude of locking mechanisms into place... Not even trying to win myself until turn 10+ once I have nigh absolute control... Watching my opponent desperately trying to navigate the labyrinthine prison that I've constructed... Seeing the light of hope fade and ultimately extinguished in an excruciatingly slow manner... THAT'S fun Magic.
We have 2-3 users that are dramatically making this thread incomprehensible and non-productive for anyone else to possibly join in the discussion. This needs to change.
Every time I see [ktkenshinx] post in here, I get the impression of a stern dad walking in on a bunch of kids trying to do something dumb and just shaking his head in disappointment.
Near Mint: The same as Slightly Played, but we threw some Altoids in the box we stored it in to cover up the scent of dead mice. Slightly Played: The base condition for all MTG cards. This card looks OK, but there’s one minor annoying ding in it that will always irritate and distract you whenever you draw it. Moderately Played: This card looks like it survived the Tet Offensive tucked inside the waistband of GI underwear. It may smell like it, too. Heavily Played: This card looks like the remains of Mohammed Atta’s passport after 9/11. It may be playable if you double-sleeve it to stop the chunks from falling out. The condition formerly known as "Washing Machine Grade" Damaged: This card is the unfortunate victim of a Mirrorweave/March of the Machines/Chaos Confetti/Mindslaver combo.
[M]aking counterfeit cards is the absolute height of dishonesty. Ask yourself this question: Since most people...are totally cool with the use of proxies...what purpose do [high] quality counterfeit cards serve?
Yeah, actually lost the semi-finals to Scapeshift even after having 28 life since I kept drawing B/W lands, wishing it was GQs. He got his payback after I beaten him in R1 of the swiss. A bit misplay on Sculler and TKS of what to get but learned my lesson. Yeah, Stony is still a blast against Affinity, T2 drop of it still devastate them and I think it is there for other MUs like Ad Nauseun and Lanterns I think?
How about Bant Eldrazi, any advice on the SB?
Yeah, I understand, well, nothing I can do about it with anyway since I'm not that experience to make one. I'll just do my best to filter useful knowledge. Thanks for being easy to talk too and not taking the stance of a know it all, not that I am saying others are.
How do you feel against scapeshift now? We can lose to them, but should be pretty favored.
The number one card I've found that just straight beats bant eldrazi is worship as they just can't deal with it. But it's also a MU that I think can be favorable if you're experienced with it. I tend to try to keep them off colorless if I can at all.
Yeah, actually lost the semi-finals to Scapeshift even after having 28 life since I kept drawing B/W lands, wishing it was GQs. He got his payback after I beaten him in R1 of the swiss. A bit misplay on Sculler and TKS of what to get but learned my lesson. Yeah, Stony is still a blast against Affinity, T2 drop of it still devastate them and I think it is there for other MUs like Ad Nauseun and Lanterns I think?
How about Bant Eldrazi, any advice on the SB?
Yeah, I understand, well, nothing I can do about it with anyway since I'm not that experience to make one. I'll just do my best to filter useful knowledge. Thanks for being easy to talk too and not taking the stance of a know it all, not that I am saying others are.
How do you feel against scapeshift now? We can lose to them, but should be pretty favored.
The number one card I've found that just straight beats bant eldrazi is worship as they just can't deal with it. But it's also a MU that I think can be favorable if you're experienced with it. I tend to try to keep them off colorless if I can at all.
I train a lot against valakut decks and I don't think it's a good MU at all. We have cards to combat, but 1 ttb to emrakul is game. Anger of the gods is annoying too. Again, they have tools and so do we. It's always close imo, when your opponent is a bit better than any regular player and knows how to fight dnt
Hello everyone. This is a forum I've been watching for only about a week now, but I've seen so many different kinds of lists posted. As this is a style of deck I am looking to build, I was curious if there is a known "strongest variant?" I know that a lot of lists hold similar potential (Because they share many cards), and at this point, it comes down to sheer preference. I've also noticed a lot of experimenting with different colors than those traditionally known to work with the white shell. I ask this because I like the way this archetype works and want something along these lines that will perform well in tournament play (I am considering a D&T list for GP Vegas a couple months down the road). To those that have watched how the different styles perform in events, which deck shows up the most often do you think and why? Thanks in advance for feedback; anything is appreciated. ^-^
Hello everyone. This is a forum I've been watching for only about a week now, but I've seen so many different kinds of lists posted. As this is a style of deck I am looking to build, I was curious if there is a known "strongest variant?" I know that a lot of lists hold similar potential (Because they share many cards), and at this point, it comes down to sheer preference. I've also noticed a lot of experimenting with different colors than those traditionally known to work with the white shell. I ask this because I like the way this archetype works and want something along these lines that will perform well in tournament play (I am considering a D&T list for GP Vegas a couple months down the road). To those that have watched how the different styles perform in events, which deck shows up the most often do you think and why? Thanks in advance for feedback; anything is appreciated. ^-^
This varies wildly depending on who you ask. Honestly, our question to you should be two-prong.
1. Do you have experience with the deck? Without it, it doesn't matter which splash you're on; this isn't an easy deck to master and takes time to know proper lines and see them all.
2. Do you know anything about what will be played at the event? If you can predict the meta, you can better select a splash and cards in it to take it down.
In terms of what's the "strongest splash" just based on overall results, you're going to find that GW has the most tournament results historically and that WB E&T has the best results in the semi recent past. Mono W is probably next in line.
I'll try to break down our whole archetype in a nutshell, splash by splash;
GW is strong because it has mana acceleration in the form of noble hierarch which can enable some more "unfair" and explosive plays like T2 arbiter +GQ or T2 Big thalia. There are also value cards like eternal witness, collected company, and loxodon smiter which help to make traditionally difficult MUs like GBx more doable.
WB E&T does well because it has eldrazi temple for its own mana acceleration and has more disruption than many of the other variants in the form of handdisruption paired with additional removal.
Having said that, each splash has their own allure. WR lets your play addition LD in the form of magus of the moon and fulminator mage/ avalanche riders, WU has some great tempo plays and can interact with spells in a way other splashs can't with cards like reflector mage, spell queller, and Venser, shaper savant, finally, mono W lets you really focus your game plan and have the most consistent mana base with more land shenanigans like extra manlands and LD Lands.
If you haven't played the deck at all before, I'd recommend starting with mono W and then branching out to whatever splash and style of play calls your name the most.
I train a lot against valakut decks and I don't think it's a good MU at all. We have cards to combat, but 1 ttb to emrakul is game. Anger of the gods is annoying too. Again, they have tools and so do we. It's always close imo, when your opponent is a bit better than any regular player and knows how to fight dnt
I suppose it depends on your list and theirs with the through the breach + simian spirit guides & anger of the gods being the hardest by far, but I'd certainly consider it in general to be one of our best MUs. All of our taxers are live, LD is great, wisp shenanigans are great. If you're on a splash, cards like queller/venser and sculler/TKS are great. If not, mono W gets extra LD. I'm not saying that the MU is an absolute buy, but I'm confidant that if you looked at my win % here, it'd be quite high.
Congrats on top 8!
Some players like to remove their vials against them in an effort to have better topdecks. I'm not a huge fan of that personally though. In your list, I'd probably go for something along the lines of +1 gideon +3 rip for something along the lines of -1 tks, -2 arbiter (this is mroe dependent on if you're on the play or draw. I like arbiter more on the play and less on the draw). and -1 strangler. This way your curve is similar, you have a great grindy top end and they lose a lot of resources from the GY. You might consider bringing in sin collector and or blessed alliance, but it's dependent on what you saw and play vs draw.
E&T should have the best MU of any D&T variant against creature decks like those you listed. I've never found merfolk to be too tough, regardless the splash, but elves is can be near unwinnable. Against merfolk, I like to bring in cards like ghostly prison and worship. Essentially, save removal for lords and use what firststrike you have to lead to bad combat steps for them. It's similar against elves, although it's harder because they can ramp and even if we keep them off lords, they seem to always find a coco and then just win. orzhov pontiff effects are phenomenal here.
I couldn't agree more with chalupacabra. Making a separate thread merely fractures the deck and the community. I don't play any splash exclusively (altho I probably play GW the most). Which thread would you have me in? All of them? I understand why you might feel frustrated about E&T posts getting lost in the other decks that are pulled up, but your questions weren't specific to E&T. Yes, your deck changes how you interact a bit, but my strategy against a deck like merfolk doesn't change from splash to splash. In fact, if you had a separate thread, even if I wanted to be a part of all of them, it would be difficult for me to do so and might mean that your question wouldn't be answered. That hardly seems preferable. Most of your SB will be similar even and even then, there are a ton of options. I know for instance that if you gave deathandcatmix and I the very same deck in the same meta, we'd make a different SB and we're two of the players who've been here a long time and have a stupid amount of hours under our respective belts with a huge variety of splashes. Furthermore, E&T made a big splash in the pond when it first came about, but has since dwindled in popularity. I wouldn't consider it to be different enough in card pool, player base, or power level to have its own thread.
4 tectonic edge
4 ghost quarter
2 sea gate wreckage
2 horizon canopy
1 Gemstone Caverns
1 Eiganjo Castle
9 Plains
8 non creature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Selfless Spirit
2 Spellskite
1 Phyrexian Revoker
3 blade splicer
3 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
3 Restoration Angel
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Rest in Peace
2 Stony Silence
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Sundering Growth
2 Plains
1 Forest
2 Razorverge Thicket
1 Temple Garden
2 Brushland
3 Horizon Canopy
4 Ghost Quarter
2 stirring wildwood
2 Gavony Township
1 tectonic edge
1 gemstone caverns
10 noncreature spells
4 Path to Exile
4 Aether Vial
2 Collected Company
28 creatures
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Scavenging Ooze
2 Spellskite
1 Selfless Spirit
4 Flickerwisp
2 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
2 Courser of Kruphix
1 Eternal Witness
1 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Restoration Angel
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Caves of Koilos
4 Concealed Courtyard
2 Godless Shrine
1 Shambling Vent
4 Ghost Quarter
4 Eldrazi Temple
1 Vault of the Archangel
2 Plains
1 Gemstone Caverns
8 Noncreature Spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Tidehollow Sculler
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Flickerwisp
4 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Spellskite
2 Selfless Spirit
3 Wasteland Strangler
4 Thought-Knot Seer
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Rest in Peace
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Sin Collector
2 Orzhov Pontiff
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Worship
3 Brushland
3 Eldrazi Temple
1 Forest
2 Gavony Township
1 Gemstone Caverns
4 Ghost Quarter
2 Plains
3 Razorverge Thicket
2 Stirring Wildwood
1 Temple Garden
10 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
2 Ancient Stirrings
4 Path to exile
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Leonin Arbiter
1 Aven Mindcensor
1 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
1 Spellskite
1 Scavenging Ooze
3 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Flickerwisp
1 Eternal Witness
4 Thought-knot seer
2 Reality Smasher
1 Reclamation Sage
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
1 Worship
1 Spellskite
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Ghost Quarter
1 Hallowed Fountain
4 Seachrome Coast
1 Eiganjo Castle
2 Tectonic Edge
1 Moorland Haunt
2 Mutavault
1 Island
2 Plains
2 Horizon Canopy
1 adarkar wastes
1 flooded strand
9 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
1 detention sphere
28 creatures
3 Spell Queller
3 Selfless Spirit
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 eldrazi displacer
3 Reflector Mage
4 Flickerwisp
2 Phyrexian Revoker
3 leonin arbiter
2 Venser, Shaper Savant
2 spellskite
2 Rest in Peace
2 stony silence
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 ghostly prison
2 burrenton forge-tender
2 Surgical Extraction
1 kira, great glass-spinner
1 blessed alliance
2 Spellskite
4 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Reality Smasher
4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Thought-Knot Seer
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
Lands 25
6 Plains
1 Wastes
4 Battlefield Forge
1 Blinkmoth Nexus
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Ghost Quarter
1 Mutavault
1 Eiganjo Castle
3 Gemstone Caverns
4 Chalice of the Void
1 Smuggler's Copter
3 Dismember
1 Basilisk Collar
3 Rest in Peace
3 Stony Silence
1 Worship
1 Celestial Purge
3 Path to Exile
1 Warping Wail
2 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
Tempo
Modern
Eldrazi and Staxes
Whir Prison
Legacy
5c Humans
DnT
"I'm a lead farmer... !" Quote ruined due to policy.
While I understand your (@Mr_Bote) frustrations, there is so much variation in the builds and playstyles that it's very difficult to create different threads for each and every one. Ultimately, all of the decks that operate on the same strategic principles should exist in once place, even if there are ~15 flex slots in the maindeck.
And in that spirit... You're going to want this thread, which was created for reasons that I can't explain without receiving a warning for trolling. But you'll get more advice for that specific build there.
WUDeath&TaxesWG
Legacy
UBRGDredgeUBRG
UHigh TideU
URGLandsURG
WR Card Choice List
WUR American D&T
WUB Esper D&T
The Reserved List
Heat Maps
Thanks for the information on what to SB. So I'll remove Aven Mindcensor to accommodate Orzhov (once I buy it, again) and -1 Blessed Alliance for Worship? In most of the matches, I've been boarding out Dark Confidant (the MUs I faced were, Jund Scapeshift Affinity Elves Merfolk), what MUs do we keep him in?
It's not that I am saying it is stronger, has a bigger player base or card pool, more of I just get frustrated that specific post on specific variants sometimes get lost/drowned/swallowed up by talks of the different variants, I just find it more clean and easier if what I said were to happen.
4 Caves of Koilos
4 Concealed Courtyard
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Godless Shrine
2 Plains
1 Swamp
Creatures (27)
2 Aven Mindcensor
3 Dryad Militant
2 Eldrazi Displacer
3 Flickerwisp
3 Leonin Arbiter
2 Restoration Angel
3 Selfless Spirit
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Thought-Knot Seer
3 Wasteland Strangler
3 Aether Vial
2 Relic of Progenitus
Instants (4)
4 Path to Exile
Sorceries (2)
2 Lingering Souls
3 Auriok Champion
2 Blessed Alliance
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Grafdigger's Cage
3 Stony Silence
2 Surgical Extraction
The truth is it benefits from combining aspects of multiple versions of the deck.
I have benefitted from multiple styles being in the thread and players of multiple styles can benefit from seeing lists like this. Start splitting hairs over differences and that cross-pollination ceases to occur.
Edit: Was too long, shortened to get to the point.
- Sam Stoddard, “Developing Modern” (June 21, 2013) (by means of Sheridan Lardner, "Fixing Modern: Defining Format Mission (March 16, 2016))
How to Use Spoiler Tags
Starting Over: The Origins of the Mulligan Rule
Practical Approach to Slow Play
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 2: SWARM and TOOLBOX
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 3
THE Guide to Aggro, Part 4
These videos are by MTG Salvation Moderator Lantern!
Introduction to Tempo
Controlling Tempo
Elements of Tempo
Roadblocks to Tempo
How Not To Build A Deck - Tempo
Learn How To Sideboard, Dammit!
Mulligan's Island
The Art of the Mulligan
The Art of the Mulligan: Eight Case Studies
Fundamentals: The Mulligan
Some Mulligan Exercises
A Mulligan Is Worth Three Cards
The Mulligan Debate
Common Sense: The Art of the Mulligan
Who's The Beatdown?
3 Caves of Koilos
3 Eldrazi Temple
2 Fetid Heath
3 Godless Shrine
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Plains
3 Shambling Vent
2 Tectonic Edge
Artifacts (4):
4 Æther Vial
4 Path to Exile
Creatures (29):
3 Aven Mindcensor
3 Eldrazi Displacer
3 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
4 Serra Avenger
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Thought-Knot Seer
3 Tidehollow Sculler
3 Wasteland Strangler
3 Chalice of the Void
2 Dismember
2 Oblivion Ring
2 Rest in Peace
3 Stony Silence
3 Surgical Extraction
3 Flooded Strand
6 Island
3 Polluted Delta
3 Steam Vents
3 Sulfur Falls
Creatures (16):
4 Delver of Secrets
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Snapcaster Mage
4 Stormchaser Mage
2 Gut Shot
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Mutagenic Growth
3 Spell Pierce
3 Twisted Image
3 Vapor Snag
Sorceries (8):
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Serum Visions
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Blood Moon
2 Dispel
1 Forked Bolt
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Repeal
2 Roast
1 Spell Snare
2 Spellskite
1 Vapor Snag
4 Bloodstained Mire
1 Clifftop Retreat
1 Copperline Gorge
5 Mountain
3 Sacred Foundry
2 Stomping Ground
4 Wooded Foothills
Creatures (14):
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Goblin Guide
2 Grim Lavamancer
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Atarka's Command
4 Boros Charm
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Lightning Helix
3 Searing Blaze
Sorceries (8):
4 Lava Spike
4 Rift Bolt
2 Deflecting Palm
4 Destructive Revelry
2 Kor Firewalker
2 Path to Exile
2 Rending Volley
3 Skullcrack
19 Forest
3 Treetop Village
Creatures (24):
4 Avatar of the Resolute
4 Dryad Militant
2 Dungrove Elder
4 Experiment One
4 Leatherback Baloth
2 Scavenging Ooze
4 Strangleroot Geist
4 Rancor
Instants (10):
3 Aspect of Hydra
4 Vines of Vastwood
3 Dismember
2 Choke
2 Gut Shot
2 Deglamer
2 Feed the Clan
2 Oxidize
2 Relic of Progenitus
2 Skylasher
1 Unravel the Æther
Personally I live geist, he is a one man threat, that if need be wr have tools to push through. Versus control many times he forces a wrath on his own so you don't have to Over-commit and if not discarded is s nightmare for bgx decks to deal with. I have become fond of reflector mage, but in some matches he is a bit if a dead card which is why I run 3. I cut splicer to 2, so good at gumming up the ground but need for 4 is gone with tempo plays that blue offers.
Edit, merfolk can get you islands pretty easy either way, we can be then pretty regularly in my experience with combat tricks etc and removing our lands if need be. I would rather be slightly weaker to Meryl rather than play off curve due to arbiter, again is my personal views, I may swith one fountain out for mystic gate, but will likely not run fetches. Post board ghostly prison screws fish pretty hard along with engineered explosives. Must times versus fish it comes down (preboard) to them making a mass attack, me gq or tec my "island" wisp and maybe pay less and demolish with first strike.
WDeath and TaxesW
RWGBurnGWR
Sure thing. I'm not telling you these cards are absolutely the way to go, but rather that I see them to be good. I think that BA isn't great right now. And I also am not sure BW E&T needs stony, but that's my take.
I would for sure keep confidant in against jund. That's the perfect MU for it. I'd be temped to keep it in against scapeshift, although then you might put yourself in a more killable range, but I'd probably risk it for the acceleration and hope I can kill them first.
I understand. My point is that it seems better to get lost in a wealth of information than to ask the same questions in different places, making results harder to pull up and more confusing for someone who might not be playing your specific splash.
4 tectonic edge
4 ghost quarter
2 sea gate wreckage
2 horizon canopy
1 Gemstone Caverns
1 Eiganjo Castle
9 Plains
8 non creature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Selfless Spirit
2 Spellskite
1 Phyrexian Revoker
3 blade splicer
3 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
3 Restoration Angel
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Rest in Peace
2 Stony Silence
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Sundering Growth
2 Plains
1 Forest
2 Razorverge Thicket
1 Temple Garden
2 Brushland
3 Horizon Canopy
4 Ghost Quarter
2 stirring wildwood
2 Gavony Township
1 tectonic edge
1 gemstone caverns
10 noncreature spells
4 Path to Exile
4 Aether Vial
2 Collected Company
28 creatures
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Scavenging Ooze
2 Spellskite
1 Selfless Spirit
4 Flickerwisp
2 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
2 Courser of Kruphix
1 Eternal Witness
1 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Restoration Angel
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Caves of Koilos
4 Concealed Courtyard
2 Godless Shrine
1 Shambling Vent
4 Ghost Quarter
4 Eldrazi Temple
1 Vault of the Archangel
2 Plains
1 Gemstone Caverns
8 Noncreature Spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Tidehollow Sculler
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Flickerwisp
4 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Spellskite
2 Selfless Spirit
3 Wasteland Strangler
4 Thought-Knot Seer
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Rest in Peace
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Sin Collector
2 Orzhov Pontiff
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Worship
3 Brushland
3 Eldrazi Temple
1 Forest
2 Gavony Township
1 Gemstone Caverns
4 Ghost Quarter
2 Plains
3 Razorverge Thicket
2 Stirring Wildwood
1 Temple Garden
10 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
2 Ancient Stirrings
4 Path to exile
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Leonin Arbiter
1 Aven Mindcensor
1 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
1 Spellskite
1 Scavenging Ooze
3 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Flickerwisp
1 Eternal Witness
4 Thought-knot seer
2 Reality Smasher
1 Reclamation Sage
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
1 Worship
1 Spellskite
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Ghost Quarter
1 Hallowed Fountain
4 Seachrome Coast
1 Eiganjo Castle
2 Tectonic Edge
1 Moorland Haunt
2 Mutavault
1 Island
2 Plains
2 Horizon Canopy
1 adarkar wastes
1 flooded strand
9 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
1 detention sphere
28 creatures
3 Spell Queller
3 Selfless Spirit
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 eldrazi displacer
3 Reflector Mage
4 Flickerwisp
2 Phyrexian Revoker
3 leonin arbiter
2 Venser, Shaper Savant
2 spellskite
2 Rest in Peace
2 stony silence
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 ghostly prison
2 burrenton forge-tender
2 Surgical Extraction
1 kira, great glass-spinner
1 blessed alliance
Yeah, actually lost the semi-finals to Scapeshift even after having 28 life since I kept drawing B/W lands, wishing it was GQs. He got his payback after I beaten him in R1 of the swiss. A bit misplay on Sculler and TKS of what to get but learned my lesson. Yeah, Stony is still a blast against Affinity, T2 drop of it still devastate them and I think it is there for other MUs like Ad Nauseun and Lanterns I think?
How about Bant Eldrazi, any advice on the SB?
Yeah, I understand, well, nothing I can do about it with anyway since I'm not that experience to make one. I'll just do my best to filter useful knowledge. Thanks for being easy to talk too and not taking the stance of a know it all, not that I am saying others are.
I don't usually play competitive leagues and I feel like I got really lucky a few times, especially in the last turn of the last match. I've thrown the replays onto youtube at 1.5x speed if anyone wants to check it out:
In light of the previous discussion about Wescoe's list and variations, I've decided to focus my list in on disruptive creatures. Trying to cut out creatures that are "just" creatures. I'm not trying to play white weenie over here
4x Aether Vial
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
Creature:
2x Aven Mindcensor
4x Dark Confidant
4x Flickerwisp
4x Leonin Arbiter
2x Mirran Crusader
2x Selfless Spirit
4x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2x Thalia, Heretic Cathar
4x Tidehollow Sculler
4x Path to Exile
Land:
4x Concealed Courtyard
4x Ghost Quarter
4x Godless Shrine
6x Plains
2x Shambling Vent
1x Swamp
2x Tectonic Edge
2x Burrenton Forge-Tender
2x Leonin Relic-Warder
2x Oblivion Ring
2x Rest in Peace
3x Stony Silence
2x Fatal Push
2x Zealous Persecution
I'm not sure if this deck has what it takes to close out games, but I like that every single creature contributes beyond the value of beating up the opponent (most obvious example of this is that I cut 2x Serra Avenger)
Playing this deck makes me yearn for Stoneforge Mystic. I keep the Sword of Fire and Ice around so every once in a while I can feel what this deck *could* be. SFM would really help add that explosive power the deck is missing to take advantage of the disruption.
Anyway, seeing MM17 spoilers has reminded me that Venser, Shaper Savant is a thing. Would he be potentially a good choice for a UW version of this deck that also runs Eldrazi? You could bounce a spell or permanent back to their hand with Venser and TKS it away, and keep some pressure on their hand by repeating the process with Eldrazi Displacer or Flickerwisp (with a little less control, since you wouldn't necessarily be able to bounce spells that way).
WB Ayli, Eternal Pilgrim | WBR Queen Marchesa | WUBR Breya, Etherium Shaper
Modern:
/ Death and Taxes | W/ Soul Sisters | Spirits | U Faeries | Tempered Steel Affinity
LOL, thank you, though I can't imagine you getting a warning for trolling after several years of seeing you post on every flavor of DnT, so you must have some juicy word for that one!
Tempo
Modern
Eldrazi and Staxes
Whir Prison
Legacy
5c Humans
DnT
"I'm a lead farmer... !" Quote ruined due to policy.
The person who made the primer for that deck felt strongly like it needed its own thread, so now when anyone (like yourself) asks about it, we end up having to point him or her to a different thread. The upside is that you'll get more specialized advice over there, but the downside is that you'll lose a lot of diverse discussion over here.
It seems like a net negative to me, but MTGS (rightfully) won't let me police the forums.
WUDeath&TaxesWG
Legacy
UBRGDredgeUBRG
UHigh TideU
URGLandsURG
WR Card Choice List
WUR American D&T
WUB Esper D&T
The Reserved List
Heat Maps
How do you feel against scapeshift now? We can lose to them, but should be pretty favored.
The number one card I've found that just straight beats bant eldrazi is worship as they just can't deal with it. But it's also a MU that I think can be favorable if you're experienced with it. I tend to try to keep them off colorless if I can at all.
Check out my SBing guide I made up
No problem!
4 tectonic edge
4 ghost quarter
2 sea gate wreckage
2 horizon canopy
1 Gemstone Caverns
1 Eiganjo Castle
9 Plains
8 non creature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Selfless Spirit
2 Spellskite
1 Phyrexian Revoker
3 blade splicer
3 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
3 Restoration Angel
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Rest in Peace
2 Stony Silence
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Sundering Growth
2 Plains
1 Forest
2 Razorverge Thicket
1 Temple Garden
2 Brushland
3 Horizon Canopy
4 Ghost Quarter
2 stirring wildwood
2 Gavony Township
1 tectonic edge
1 gemstone caverns
10 noncreature spells
4 Path to Exile
4 Aether Vial
2 Collected Company
28 creatures
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Scavenging Ooze
2 Spellskite
1 Selfless Spirit
4 Flickerwisp
2 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
2 Courser of Kruphix
1 Eternal Witness
1 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Restoration Angel
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Caves of Koilos
4 Concealed Courtyard
2 Godless Shrine
1 Shambling Vent
4 Ghost Quarter
4 Eldrazi Temple
1 Vault of the Archangel
2 Plains
1 Gemstone Caverns
8 Noncreature Spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Tidehollow Sculler
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Flickerwisp
4 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Spellskite
2 Selfless Spirit
3 Wasteland Strangler
4 Thought-Knot Seer
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Rest in Peace
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Sin Collector
2 Orzhov Pontiff
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Worship
3 Brushland
3 Eldrazi Temple
1 Forest
2 Gavony Township
1 Gemstone Caverns
4 Ghost Quarter
2 Plains
3 Razorverge Thicket
2 Stirring Wildwood
1 Temple Garden
10 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
2 Ancient Stirrings
4 Path to exile
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Leonin Arbiter
1 Aven Mindcensor
1 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
1 Spellskite
1 Scavenging Ooze
3 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Flickerwisp
1 Eternal Witness
4 Thought-knot seer
2 Reality Smasher
1 Reclamation Sage
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
1 Worship
1 Spellskite
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Ghost Quarter
1 Hallowed Fountain
4 Seachrome Coast
1 Eiganjo Castle
2 Tectonic Edge
1 Moorland Haunt
2 Mutavault
1 Island
2 Plains
2 Horizon Canopy
1 adarkar wastes
1 flooded strand
9 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
1 detention sphere
28 creatures
3 Spell Queller
3 Selfless Spirit
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 eldrazi displacer
3 Reflector Mage
4 Flickerwisp
2 Phyrexian Revoker
3 leonin arbiter
2 Venser, Shaper Savant
2 spellskite
2 Rest in Peace
2 stony silence
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 ghostly prison
2 burrenton forge-tender
2 Surgical Extraction
1 kira, great glass-spinner
1 blessed alliance
On Scapeshift? A favorable MU but should still be attentive on how to play our creatures in order, learned that the hard way.
Thanks, will read on it.
This varies wildly depending on who you ask. Honestly, our question to you should be two-prong.
1. Do you have experience with the deck? Without it, it doesn't matter which splash you're on; this isn't an easy deck to master and takes time to know proper lines and see them all.
2. Do you know anything about what will be played at the event? If you can predict the meta, you can better select a splash and cards in it to take it down.
In terms of what's the "strongest splash" just based on overall results, you're going to find that GW has the most tournament results historically and that WB E&T has the best results in the semi recent past. Mono W is probably next in line.
I'll try to break down our whole archetype in a nutshell, splash by splash;
GW is strong because it has mana acceleration in the form of noble hierarch which can enable some more "unfair" and explosive plays like T2 arbiter +GQ or T2 Big thalia. There are also value cards like eternal witness, collected company, and loxodon smiter which help to make traditionally difficult MUs like GBx more doable.
WB E&T does well because it has eldrazi temple for its own mana acceleration and has more disruption than many of the other variants in the form of hand disruption paired with additional removal.
Having said that, each splash has their own allure. WR lets your play addition LD in the form of magus of the moon and fulminator mage/ avalanche riders, WU has some great tempo plays and can interact with spells in a way other splashs can't with cards like reflector mage, spell queller, and Venser, shaper savant, finally, mono W lets you really focus your game plan and have the most consistent mana base with more land shenanigans like extra manlands and LD Lands.
If you haven't played the deck at all before, I'd recommend starting with mono W and then branching out to whatever splash and style of play calls your name the most.
4 tectonic edge
4 ghost quarter
2 sea gate wreckage
2 horizon canopy
1 Gemstone Caverns
1 Eiganjo Castle
9 Plains
8 non creature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Selfless Spirit
2 Spellskite
1 Phyrexian Revoker
3 blade splicer
3 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
3 Restoration Angel
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Rest in Peace
2 Stony Silence
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Sundering Growth
2 Plains
1 Forest
2 Razorverge Thicket
1 Temple Garden
2 Brushland
3 Horizon Canopy
4 Ghost Quarter
2 stirring wildwood
2 Gavony Township
1 tectonic edge
1 gemstone caverns
10 noncreature spells
4 Path to Exile
4 Aether Vial
2 Collected Company
28 creatures
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Scavenging Ooze
2 Spellskite
1 Selfless Spirit
4 Flickerwisp
2 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
2 Courser of Kruphix
1 Eternal Witness
1 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Restoration Angel
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Caves of Koilos
4 Concealed Courtyard
2 Godless Shrine
1 Shambling Vent
4 Ghost Quarter
4 Eldrazi Temple
1 Vault of the Archangel
2 Plains
1 Gemstone Caverns
8 Noncreature Spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Tidehollow Sculler
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Flickerwisp
4 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Spellskite
2 Selfless Spirit
3 Wasteland Strangler
4 Thought-Knot Seer
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Rest in Peace
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Sin Collector
2 Orzhov Pontiff
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Worship
3 Brushland
3 Eldrazi Temple
1 Forest
2 Gavony Township
1 Gemstone Caverns
4 Ghost Quarter
2 Plains
3 Razorverge Thicket
2 Stirring Wildwood
1 Temple Garden
10 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
2 Ancient Stirrings
4 Path to exile
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Leonin Arbiter
1 Aven Mindcensor
1 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
1 Spellskite
1 Scavenging Ooze
3 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Flickerwisp
1 Eternal Witness
4 Thought-knot seer
2 Reality Smasher
1 Reclamation Sage
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
1 Worship
1 Spellskite
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Ghost Quarter
1 Hallowed Fountain
4 Seachrome Coast
1 Eiganjo Castle
2 Tectonic Edge
1 Moorland Haunt
2 Mutavault
1 Island
2 Plains
2 Horizon Canopy
1 adarkar wastes
1 flooded strand
9 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
1 detention sphere
28 creatures
3 Spell Queller
3 Selfless Spirit
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 eldrazi displacer
3 Reflector Mage
4 Flickerwisp
2 Phyrexian Revoker
3 leonin arbiter
2 Venser, Shaper Savant
2 spellskite
2 Rest in Peace
2 stony silence
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 ghostly prison
2 burrenton forge-tender
2 Surgical Extraction
1 kira, great glass-spinner
1 blessed alliance
I suppose it depends on your list and theirs with the through the breach + simian spirit guides & anger of the gods being the hardest by far, but I'd certainly consider it in general to be one of our best MUs. All of our taxers are live, LD is great, wisp shenanigans are great. If you're on a splash, cards like queller/venser and sculler/TKS are great. If not, mono W gets extra LD. I'm not saying that the MU is an absolute buy, but I'm confidant that if you looked at my win % here, it'd be quite high.
4 tectonic edge
4 ghost quarter
2 sea gate wreckage
2 horizon canopy
1 Gemstone Caverns
1 Eiganjo Castle
9 Plains
8 non creature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Selfless Spirit
2 Spellskite
1 Phyrexian Revoker
3 blade splicer
3 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
3 Restoration Angel
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Rest in Peace
2 Stony Silence
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Sundering Growth
2 Plains
1 Forest
2 Razorverge Thicket
1 Temple Garden
2 Brushland
3 Horizon Canopy
4 Ghost Quarter
2 stirring wildwood
2 Gavony Township
1 tectonic edge
1 gemstone caverns
10 noncreature spells
4 Path to Exile
4 Aether Vial
2 Collected Company
28 creatures
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Scavenging Ooze
2 Spellskite
1 Selfless Spirit
4 Flickerwisp
2 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
2 Courser of Kruphix
1 Eternal Witness
1 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Restoration Angel
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Caves of Koilos
4 Concealed Courtyard
2 Godless Shrine
1 Shambling Vent
4 Ghost Quarter
4 Eldrazi Temple
1 Vault of the Archangel
2 Plains
1 Gemstone Caverns
8 Noncreature Spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Tidehollow Sculler
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Flickerwisp
4 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Spellskite
2 Selfless Spirit
3 Wasteland Strangler
4 Thought-Knot Seer
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Rest in Peace
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Sin Collector
2 Orzhov Pontiff
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Worship
3 Brushland
3 Eldrazi Temple
1 Forest
2 Gavony Township
1 Gemstone Caverns
4 Ghost Quarter
2 Plains
3 Razorverge Thicket
2 Stirring Wildwood
1 Temple Garden
10 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
2 Ancient Stirrings
4 Path to exile
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Leonin Arbiter
1 Aven Mindcensor
1 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
1 Spellskite
1 Scavenging Ooze
3 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Flickerwisp
1 Eternal Witness
4 Thought-knot seer
2 Reality Smasher
1 Reclamation Sage
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
1 Worship
1 Spellskite
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Ghost Quarter
1 Hallowed Fountain
4 Seachrome Coast
1 Eiganjo Castle
2 Tectonic Edge
1 Moorland Haunt
2 Mutavault
1 Island
2 Plains
2 Horizon Canopy
1 adarkar wastes
1 flooded strand
9 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
1 detention sphere
28 creatures
3 Spell Queller
3 Selfless Spirit
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 eldrazi displacer
3 Reflector Mage
4 Flickerwisp
2 Phyrexian Revoker
3 leonin arbiter
2 Venser, Shaper Savant
2 spellskite
2 Rest in Peace
2 stony silence
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 ghostly prison
2 burrenton forge-tender
2 Surgical Extraction
1 kira, great glass-spinner
1 blessed alliance