I'm new to DnT (was a fish player) and I think this deck looks fun. Definitely a lot of card draw, but I wish there was a better finisher or equipments.
Its probably just personal preference but I'm just never fond of lists that just beats down, I think disruption is important past Thalia and Arbiters
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Standard UWUW Spirit FlashUW Modern BWEldrazi and TaxesBW UMono Blue ControlU WURGRestore BalanceWURG Legacy WDeath and TaxesW
I think Craig has put up enough results at this point that we have to take this list seriously. I'm not impressed by Kor Skyfisher from what I've seen of his videos, but everything else looks about right.
I'm new to DnT (was a fish player) and I think this deck looks fun. Definitely a lot of card draw, but I wish there was a better finisher or equipments.
Its probably just personal preference but I'm just never fond of lists that just beats down, I think disruption is important past Thalia and Arbiters
What other disruption would you add?
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Cunning Spark Mage? $0.10
Basilisk Collar? $5.00
Shooting down a baneslayer angel? Priceless
I think Craig has put up enough results at this point that we have to take this list seriously. I'm not impressed by Kor Skyfisher from what I've seen of his videos, but everything else looks about right.
Playing millions of cards every turn... Slowly and systematically obliterating any chance my opponent has of winning... Clicking the multitude of locking mechanisms into place... Not even trying to win myself until turn 10+ once I have nigh absolute control... Watching my opponent desperately trying to navigate the labyrinthine prison that I've constructed... Seeing the light of hope fade and ultimately extinguished in an excruciatingly slow manner... THAT'S fun Magic.
We have 2-3 users that are dramatically making this thread incomprehensible and non-productive for anyone else to possibly join in the discussion. This needs to change.
Every time I see [ktkenshinx] post in here, I get the impression of a stern dad walking in on a bunch of kids trying to do something dumb and just shaking his head in disappointment.
Near Mint: The same as Slightly Played, but we threw some Altoids in the box we stored it in to cover up the scent of dead mice. Slightly Played: The base condition for all MTG cards. This card looks OK, but there’s one minor annoying ding in it that will always irritate and distract you whenever you draw it. Moderately Played: This card looks like it survived the Tet Offensive tucked inside the waistband of GI underwear. It may smell like it, too. Heavily Played: This card looks like the remains of Mohammed Atta’s passport after 9/11. It may be playable if you double-sleeve it to stop the chunks from falling out. The condition formerly known as "Washing Machine Grade" Damaged: This card is the unfortunate victim of a Mirrorweave/March of the Machines/Chaos Confetti/Mindslaver combo.
[M]aking counterfeit cards is the absolute height of dishonesty. Ask yourself this question: Since most people...are totally cool with the use of proxies...what purpose do [high] quality counterfeit cards serve?
When do we sideboard in Gideon as E&T? Against BGx? I'm pretty sketchy on sideboarding in general really.
We usually want to board it in where grinding is key. BGx and Control are good examples, because they have trouble dealing with Gideon, and Gideon can play the long game really well, something we might have trouble doing otherwise.
At least, that's been my experience. Not sure how other people do it.
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I use a lot of usernames for some reason, so if you see this person, it's me: Twitch: Artificier10 MTGO and Discord: PollenProphet
E&T worst matchups are, I do think, BGx midrange and Grixis (specially BGx, they kill all of our creatures with cheap removal and plays really big threats/planeswalkers with cheap mana). I would like to improve my matchup against those (and maybe against elfs) with those 2 free slots, I have tested 2 Lingering Souls but they dont do the job, they are good but are usually chump blockers. Any card for those 2 slots that can battle the big card advantage that those BGx / Grixis decks have, as well as the card advantage that company decks have?
I'm pretty happy with Citadel siege against BGx, grixis and eldrazi. It works really fine. There was a time that I was happy with Heliod, god of the sun too
I figured since I have some time this morning I would show my non-eldrazi base death and taxes list i play about 1/2 the time. I use both decks to pretty consistently to judge which is better in different matches in order to bring best deck to current meta expected. I also make a lot of brews (spirit of lab, max tax, death from above, etc...) but the eldrazi and straight mono white are my two solid decks I run in bigger tournaments and to use as barometer if a brew is worth going further on. I will go over card choices and sideboard choices under the deck.
Reasoning
No One drops- I run one drops meta dependent if they put in enough work (whether it be Dryad Miltant, Judge's Familiar or even Icatian Javelineers) , but in an open meta or wide meta I drop them in favor of more impactful 2 and 3 drops. Currently none of the one drops does enough in my localy meta that has a little bit of everything.
Serra Avenger- Always a hot topic, but with out a decent sized flying beater pushing through damage on a stalled board and going up against lingering souls becomes bad. Many times with tokens etc... we can keep the opponent from attacking favorably but we ourselves cannot attack o the ground since a couple golem tokens blocking a creature will be in out favor when attacking they can eaten up by bigger creatures. Avenger is fine of vial but many times I opt to put a tax in when my vial is on 2 then tick up to 3 where we want to be. Now Serra avenger cannot be played until T4 to me this is fine since on turns 2 and 3 I am usually setting up taxes anyways and probably wouldn't commit the angel to the board even if it didn't have the T4+ clause, what it does do is add a good evasive clock that can play defense and lets us get into 2 spell territory on T4 whether double creature, avenger plus path with thalia etc....
Spellskite- This bounces all over my 75, I currently have it in the main due to the success of death shadow aggro. Not necessarily to fight against it although it does to a lot in that match, but I think many decks are going to be forced to commit a couple more creature removal spells to their side to fight against this type of deck which we get some splash hate from.
Elspeth, Knight-Errant- After playing this card the last few weeks I have gained even or respect for its power than i had in the past (if possible), The amount of resources opponents have to commit to attempt to get her off the field is huge, especially when she gets close to ultimate. when behind she does a lot to catch us back up, when ahead she forces through A LOT of damage, and on empty board or post wrath she takes over the game on her own. She is slowly making it into my core of all my decks.
Restoration angel- In mono-white versions (eldrazi versions I run displacer hands down)I prefer this card over displacer for a few reasons; One, 4 toughness makes angel much harder to kill, natural flash helps when needed to save a creature, where as displacer to save a creature requires a vial on 3 and 3 mana (1 colorless) available or 6 mana up cast opponent knows about the card then have 3 to blink something. It is not without merit, if it lives with a flickerwisp on the board it can take over a game as well, I just prefer the flying 3/4 flash a bit more in mono white builds since I am actively trying to sac 7/10 colorless sources many games.
The rest I consider part of my personal core, both thalia, selfless spirit, aven MC, arbiter, splicer wisp.
Sideboard.
Leyline is great in my current meta with a lot of hand disruption and occasional mill and the like as well as ever present burn. I use more as anti discard than anti-burn since we have more potent burn hate available.
Rest in peace/Grafdigger's cage- obligatory grave hate, and cage for COCO which we have 4+ abzan coco decks at any given time.
Mark of asylum- the meta has a critical enough mass IMO of anger and red removal to go to this over burrenton as well as titan shift decks going to a value creature shell post board and using valakut to kill our creatures.
fiend hunter: Against non-wide big creature decks, death shadow, tasigur, angler etc....
Ghostly prison- helps in bad matches like elves and other go wide decks, also hurts infect, boggles, eldrazi, etc... pinching them on mana so they can't attack and commit to board.
Ratchet bomb is a catch all .
And stony hits enough in affinity, lantern, tron etc.... Kataki is fine as well I currently prefer stony but can see the arguments for kataki build and meta dependent.
Using the article mentioned above, long ago I came up with 12 plains, 1 eiganjo castle 4 gq 3 vsult,3 tec edge and it had queried great. If running a party at of one drops I usually (rest of build dependant) go to 22 lands 4gq 2 tec edge 2 vAult 1 eiganjo castle 13 plains since you really need to drop the 1 drops t1 in absence of vial. If you prefer other colored sources in mono white like horizon canopy, flagstones etc they go in the basic plains slots. Once going to a splash color or the like it's good to have the above mentiined article bookmarked to assure you consistently hit your desired curve. Remember in eldrazi builds you clueless is required, and for my purposes I count gq as .5 a colorless source, since with my play style that's about how often I well sac before being colorless mana.
Here is what I'm thinking for my Wu version. Not drastically different from others, I want to try exhaustion in the side against big mana or tap out decks for more tempo. I agree meets is getting much gridier wich is why I like moorland haunt a well as ephara.
That said: Source: http://www.channelfireball.com/articles/three-new-modern-decks-from-the-mocs-playoff/
WBC Eldrazi & Taxes CBW
UR Keep on Cantripin' (UR Phoenix) RU
WU Surprise! It's not UW Control! (UW Midrange) UW
BG The Rock, Straight BG
U Mono-Blue Fish U
RBW Mardu Pyromancer BWR
RG Rabble! Rabble! (GR Blood Moon Aggro) GR
Legacy
W Death & Taxes W
Modern: Jund Midrange BRG
Legacy: Shardless Bug BUG
Its probably just personal preference but I'm just never fond of lists that just beats down, I think disruption is important past Thalia and Arbiters
UWUW Spirit FlashUW
Modern
BWEldrazi and TaxesBW
UMono Blue ControlU
WURGRestore BalanceWURG
Legacy
WDeath and TaxesW
Legacy: Merfolk U; Shadow UB; Eldrazi Stompy C
Pauper: Delver U
Vintage: Merfolk U
Primers:
What other disruption would you add?
Basilisk Collar? $5.00
Shooting down a baneslayer angel? Priceless
WUDeath&TaxesWG
Legacy
UBRGDredgeUBRG
UHigh TideU
URGLandsURG
WR Card Choice List
WUR American D&T
WUB Esper D&T
The Reserved List
Heat Maps
At least, that's been my experience. Not sure how other people do it.
Twitch: Artificier10
MTGO and Discord: PollenProphet
BWEldrazi and TaxesBW
GWUKnightfallGWU
UBRGrixis ShadowUBR
1 Relic of Progenitus
1 Stony Silence
1 Kataki, War's Wage
2 Blessed Alliance
1 Fatal Push
1 Celestial Purge
1 Orzhov Pontiff
1 Sin Collector
1 Big game hunter
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
E&T worst matchups are, I do think, BGx midrange and Grixis (specially BGx, they kill all of our creatures with cheap removal and plays really big threats/planeswalkers with cheap mana). I would like to improve my matchup against those (and maybe against elfs) with those 2 free slots, I have tested 2 Lingering Souls but they dont do the job, they are good but are usually chump blockers. Any card for those 2 slots that can battle the big card advantage that those BGx / Grixis decks have, as well as the card advantage that company decks have?
Thanks, even big blue control style decks? Cryptic is such a blowout, it seems better to just try to get underneath the counterspells.
Also, what matchups do we remove vial? I just built E&T on MTGO, so I'm really starting to grind some games.
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Leonin Arbiter
2 Serra Avenger
2 Selfless Spirit
1 Spellskite
4 Flickerwisp
4 Blade Splicer
2 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
2 Aven Mindcensor
3 Restoration Angel
4 AEther Vial
4 Path to Exile
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
Lands 23
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Mutavaut
3 Tectonic Edge
1 Eiganjo Castle
12 Plains
3 Leyline of Sanctity
2 Fiend Hunter
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
1 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Mark of Asylum
1 Ratchet bomb
2 Ghostly Prison
Reasoning
No One drops- I run one drops meta dependent if they put in enough work (whether it be Dryad Miltant, Judge's Familiar or even Icatian Javelineers) , but in an open meta or wide meta I drop them in favor of more impactful 2 and 3 drops. Currently none of the one drops does enough in my localy meta that has a little bit of everything.
Serra Avenger- Always a hot topic, but with out a decent sized flying beater pushing through damage on a stalled board and going up against lingering souls becomes bad. Many times with tokens etc... we can keep the opponent from attacking favorably but we ourselves cannot attack o the ground since a couple golem tokens blocking a creature will be in out favor when attacking they can eaten up by bigger creatures. Avenger is fine of vial but many times I opt to put a tax in when my vial is on 2 then tick up to 3 where we want to be. Now Serra avenger cannot be played until T4 to me this is fine since on turns 2 and 3 I am usually setting up taxes anyways and probably wouldn't commit the angel to the board even if it didn't have the T4+ clause, what it does do is add a good evasive clock that can play defense and lets us get into 2 spell territory on T4 whether double creature, avenger plus path with thalia etc....
Spellskite- This bounces all over my 75, I currently have it in the main due to the success of death shadow aggro. Not necessarily to fight against it although it does to a lot in that match, but I think many decks are going to be forced to commit a couple more creature removal spells to their side to fight against this type of deck which we get some splash hate from.
Elspeth, Knight-Errant- After playing this card the last few weeks I have gained even or respect for its power than i had in the past (if possible), The amount of resources opponents have to commit to attempt to get her off the field is huge, especially when she gets close to ultimate. when behind she does a lot to catch us back up, when ahead she forces through A LOT of damage, and on empty board or post wrath she takes over the game on her own. She is slowly making it into my core of all my decks.
Restoration angel- In mono-white versions (eldrazi versions I run displacer hands down)I prefer this card over displacer for a few reasons; One, 4 toughness makes angel much harder to kill, natural flash helps when needed to save a creature, where as displacer to save a creature requires a vial on 3 and 3 mana (1 colorless) available or 6 mana up cast opponent knows about the card then have 3 to blink something. It is not without merit, if it lives with a flickerwisp on the board it can take over a game as well, I just prefer the flying 3/4 flash a bit more in mono white builds since I am actively trying to sac 7/10 colorless sources many games.
The rest I consider part of my personal core, both thalia, selfless spirit, aven MC, arbiter, splicer wisp.
Sideboard.
Leyline is great in my current meta with a lot of hand disruption and occasional mill and the like as well as ever present burn. I use more as anti discard than anti-burn since we have more potent burn hate available.
Rest in peace/Grafdigger's cage- obligatory grave hate, and cage for COCO which we have 4+ abzan coco decks at any given time.
Mark of asylum- the meta has a critical enough mass IMO of anger and red removal to go to this over burrenton as well as titan shift decks going to a value creature shell post board and using valakut to kill our creatures.
fiend hunter: Against non-wide big creature decks, death shadow, tasigur, angler etc....
Ghostly prison- helps in bad matches like elves and other go wide decks, also hurts infect, boggles, eldrazi, etc... pinching them on mana so they can't attack and commit to board.
Ratchet bomb is a catch all .
And stony hits enough in affinity, lantern, tron etc.... Kataki is fine as well I currently prefer stony but can see the arguments for kataki build and meta dependent.
WDeath and TaxesW
RWGBurnGWR
For reference, Craig Wescoe is running 14 white sources and 9 utility lands (4 GQ, 4 Tectonic Edge and 1 Cavern of Souls) in his latest build.
WBC Eldrazi & Taxes CBW
UR Keep on Cantripin' (UR Phoenix) RU
WU Surprise! It's not UW Control! (UW Midrange) UW
BG The Rock, Straight BG
U Mono-Blue Fish U
RBW Mardu Pyromancer BWR
RG Rabble! Rabble! (GR Blood Moon Aggro) GR
Legacy
W Death & Taxes W
WDeath and TaxesW
RWGBurnGWR
Its the reason why i cant stray away from BW E&T, Tidehollows, TKS, Strangler and Displacers
UWUW Spirit FlashUW
Modern
BWEldrazi and TaxesBW
UMono Blue ControlU
WURGRestore BalanceWURG
Legacy
WDeath and TaxesW
3 Thalia, guardian of thraben
4 leonin arbiter
2 selfless spirit
4 flickerwisp
3 blade splicer
3 reflector mage
3 Spell queller
2 geist of Saint traft
2 thalia,heretic cathar
2 restoration angel
1 ephara, god of the polis
4 aether vial
4 path to exile
Lands
4 ghost quarter
2 moorland haunt
4 adarkar wastes
4 hallowed fountain
4 seachrome coast
1 eiganjo castle
1 island
3 plains
2 stony silence
2 spell pierce
2 rest in peace
2 exhaustion
2 ghostly prison
1 engineered explosives
1 Dispel
1 spellskite
1 worship
1 Selfless Spirit
Again not sure about exhaustion bit figured it was worth a shot. No tec edges since the deck needs WU t3 consistently.
WDeath and TaxesW
RWGBurnGWR
3x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4x Leonin Arbiter
3x Selfless Spirit
4x Flickerwisp
4x Reflector Mage
4x Spell Queller
1x Kitchen Finks
1x Aven Mindcensor
1x Thalia, Heretic Cathar
1x Brimaz, King of Oreskos
4x Restoration Angel
4x Aether Vial
Instant (4)
4x Path to Exile
Land (22)
4x Seachrome Coast
4x Hallowed Fountain
1x Adarkar Wastes
4x Flagstones of Trokair
4x Ghost Quarter
1x Eiganjo Castle
3x Plains
1x Island
2x Rest in Peace
2x Stony Silence
2x Detention Sphere
3x Kitchen Finks
1x Linvala, Keeper of Silence
1x Aven Mindcensor
2x Phyrexian Revoker
2x Spreading Seas
I considered using Meddling Mage/Eidolon of Rhetoric in the SB against combo decks but decided to go with Spreading Seas and Phyrexian Revoker instead as they cover more match-ups.