My guess is new Thalia - he's been testing RW Ajani & taxes (Kittyprison?) on MTGO and really wants to try the new Thalia as it's a great curve/combo into Ajani.
Hi folks. Thalia, Heretic Cathar and Selfless Spirit will both get a place in my Mono White DnT Deck. Here is the List I'm considering to play this weekend on a PPTQ. The hate Card choices are with focus on Decks like Jund, Infect, Suicide Zoo and Nahiri Control Decks. Had some thoughts about decreasing the land count to 21 due to the lower curve but will not be playing 31 creatures though, probably could see a Dismember or Gut Shot in the Maindeck therefore. If you have any questions or suggestions I'm here.
Congrats on your results online, out of curiosity, what kind of win rate are you pulling in leagues with your mono white lists?
Well I'm not writing down all Match Results anymore but my feeling currently is about 65%+ win rate overall (Jund 75%, Infect 50%, Suicide Zoo 65%, Affinity 60%, Burn 60%, Dredge and Nahiri Control even with 50%, the worst Matchups by far are Merfolk and Elves and the best Matchup is Living End with a 99% win rate). It's almost impossible to stop some opponents nutdraws if we are on the draw and sometimes the cards don't come together very well, but in general the Deck is very consistent.
I'm still not heading to an other color(less) variant, because I don't need to. With Mono White we have almost the best mana base in the whole Format and we can support 6-7 Land destruction Lands which helps a lot across all these Taxes Effects and alongside the new Thalia.
Looks like you really favor Judge's familiar in your lists. Does the card pull its weight for you? What matchups is this card shinning for you. Ive had a love/hate relationship with the bird for as long as I can remember, but one of the lists I have with Thalia HC plays the full set. So what im thinking is 4 Familiar and 2 spellskite main, or skip the one drops and play 2 selfless spirit and 2 spellskite main. Any thoughts?
Also about the 3 Thalia/ 2 Wingmare split. Ive tested this a little, (not enough to get correct data) but I always felt like I wanted Wingmare to be Thalia when ever I drew it. I didn't get to live the dream and have a Thalia and Wingmare on the battlefield at the same time. I do know the power though, cause when wingmare first came out I tested a 4/3 split.
On the mana base. I feel like one of the main reasons to play Mono white is the ability to play 4 Tec edge. Does mutavault do enough for you to run only two tec edge?
(P.S. Glad to see Mirrin Crusader in your MD, I play 3 in my main too and it has been pulling its weight more then ever in the MTGO Meta)
Hi folks. Thalia, Heretic Cathar and Selfless Spirit will both get a place in my Mono White DnT Deck. Here is the List I'm considering to play this weekend on a PPTQ. The hate Card choices are with focus on Decks like Jund, Infect, Suicide Zoo and Nahiri Control Decks. Had some thoughts about decreasing the land count to 21 due to the lower curve but will not be playing 31 creatures though, probably could see a Dismember or Gut Shot in the Maindeck therefore. If you have any questions or suggestions I'm here.
The list looks like it could be good, but a couple things pop out to me. Do you feel you need 3 crusaders in such a bolt heavy meta? It can be a poor draw against jeskai, which is already a trickier matchup. I think 2 would be fine. 22 lands is probably the lowest you want to go without a MD 4 drop which makes me wonder why you are not running any copies of Resto, especially with 4 wisp, 3 splicer and 2 finks in the board - I think it would be worth running a single copy. Also with linvala and gideon in the board, I think you might want 23 lands - the horizon canopies help a lot with flooding out. And with only 14 white sources, there will likely be games you cannot play any of your 4 familiars on turn 1, or even your crusaders on turn 3.
As far as equipment goes, I might consider running a maindeck copy of basilisk collar - with 11 ish first strikers you would be favored in ground combat.
I like the list though - it's very low to the ground and it's nice to see someone else running wingmares - they do work in air for me almost every time they come out. Speaking of low to the ground and work in the air, I wouldn't mind seeing another serra avenger in there. Good luck this weekend!!
@Manturras RE: Eron's List
Just my guess, but maindeck Skite feels far better positioned than maindeck Spirit in the current meta.
Here's some numbers out of mtgTop8 for Modern decks in the last 2 months. A lot of times both Skite and Spirit will be used to blank some specific removal against one of our key taxes or beaters. Here's the top ten removal spells in the current Modern meta:
Widely Used Spells (Removal)
Name of the Card - Percent of Decks - Average Number - (Optional Note)
Both Skite and Spirit can save Thalia(s) or whoever from Bolts/Terminates/etc. but Skite has a leg up because he can survive taking a Bolt and therefore can sometimes (oftentimes?) do his job more than once. Skite can also take Paths or Dismembers which Spirit can't do anything about. To top it off, Skite also has more flexibility against things like Decay, Kcomm, and Pulse so he can save a Vial or a Sword or something in those weird fringe-cases where that might be relevant.
The main difference between Skite and Spirit is the spells they can stop that aren't targeted removal. Like you mentioned, Spirit can stop boardwipes, and Skite on the other hand can stop targeted pump spells. Here's the breakdown:
The biggest issues to notice are the much larger percentage of decks in the meta running pump spells over boardwipes. Infect and Zooicide are everywhere right now, so you're going to face a lot of decks running Mutagenic Growth and Become Immense. The biggest source of the instant/sorcery boardwipes in the meta are the Nahiri Jeskai decks which are out there but not as large a chunk of the meta as either Infect or Zooicide, let alone both together. The other important thing to note is the number of these cards included in a given deck; wipes tend to be 1-ofs or at most 2-ofs in the main. TL;DR - It seems to me that running Spirit before Skite is really over-preparing for those 1-of maindeck Anger of the Gods and really under-estimating the prevalence of pump aggro.
Additionally, for Eron's list in particular, running 4xFamiliars, 4xWisps, 2xWingmares, 2xMindcensors, and 1xSerra maindeck means he's probably not missing Spirit's evasive-attacker contribution as much as he's liking Skite's defensive contribution.
As for the Mutavault-->Sea-Gate Wreckage question, don't forget he has 3xBlade Splicer (strong first-strike blocking synergy with Mutavault) and 2xHorizon Canopy. The SGW switch would probably be taking out more lines of play than it would bring in.
Hey Eron! I like the look of your mono W list and have brewed up something similar for mono W. I haven't been able to test the new thalia or the spirit yet either, but I do have some thoughts on the new thalia. barring our flickering blade splicer, wouldn't you say the two cards are pretty comparable? splicer makes 4 power on the board, can be flickered and could take two removal spells, but they're both 3 mana creatures that make 3 first strike power. The upside of thalia is hr taxing effect, but in my mind, if I have to make space for her, blade splicer is a card I could see cutting a few of. What's your take on this?
I'm intrigued by your MU stats because I think my own are different. I don't have such a high win rate vs GBX, but have a higher win rate vs infect and dredge. Nahri and the others seem pretty similar. I'm curious about what makes this difference, but seeing as I'm not providing my deck list here (I want to test the new cards first. I'm talking about my list from before) that could be difficult to suss out. However, can you go over what you think makes your GBx winrate so high? I also run MD crusader, but only 2. Do you feel that familiar greatly helps that MU? And I'm curious why your infect winrate is only at 50 with MD skite and 5 old thalia effects. What makes it comparatively low do you think?
Also, would you mind going over your SB a little bit for us? You have a lot of unconventional choices in there and I'm curious when you bring in a lot of those cards like gideon, how JtN has been performing, and if SoWaP has helped your Nahri MU (I assume it's for that MU)?
more of a sidenote, and Eron, you don't have to be the one to answer this, but you guys just compared selfless spirit with spellskite and while I can see the comparison, I feel like in terms of SB, spirit more resembles burrenton forge-tender, but maybe a bit narrower?
Sure the spirit has evasion, more power, and hits more than just red, but it can't block any incoming red creatures for days and it can't save you from a burn spell the way BFT can. The ideal place to use either is against a board sweep, but the only one that comes to mind where spirit does something and BFT doesn't is against supreme verdict.
In my mind BFT can come in against aggro decks and against control decks whereas spirit is pretty much just for control.
Plus BFT only costs 1 mana instead of 2. That's most not relevant, but in terms of tempo trades, it can matter.
Am I missing something here?
Thanks Eron and anybody else with takes on our new spirit!
The Spirit/Forge-Tender comparison is a much closer comparison than Spirit/Skite (especially from the sideboard) but I wouldn't say Spirit looks any narrower- just different.
BFT can chumpblock red creatures for days, SS adds to the clock by being evasive;
BFT can stop Anger of the Gods and Pyroclasm for 1cmc less, SS can stop all that plus Supreme Verdict, Damnation, and Wrath of God;
BFT can help flesh out the deck's 1-drop slot; SS can make the team invincible to save X blockers while serving as the only chumpblocking death.
It's more of a trade/toss-up than anything. I guess we'll see how it plays out when we can get some testing in, but I'm interested in seeing how well trading bodies via chumpblocks might work with Spirit. Attacking with your 8whack team? Oops, my team blocked 1-for-1 and SS took one for the team- guess you lose X-for-1. Attacking with two big Goyfs/etc.? I can block with SS+Thalia, and sacc SS to turn 1-chumpblock into two. I'm not sure where the card advantage shakes out for SS block-enabling becomes better-than-nothing, but there's a chance it comes out ahead of BFT in a number of matchups.
Hi fellas! I'm developing an UW death and Taxes deck, but it looks more like a Tempo and Taxes. I'd like to share the list and hear (read actually) your opinions about it.
I'd like to try Citadel Siege even it costing 5 manas to cast. I think it's too strong to not use as 1 of. And I guess Maindeck Canonist is tricky, but I like her interaction with Spell Queller. Also, Reflector Mage with my new waifuThalia is a sweet tempo combo. What do you guys think?
Quick LGS tournament report. Solid 3-1 finally breaching the 2-2 standings I had for a couple of tournaments.
2-1 vs. Melira Combo:
Game 1 my opponent has no luck in finding the combo pieces, as light disruption in the form of Tidehollow Sculler gets in the way. Post sideboard in comes 2 Rest in Peace and 2 Zealous Persecution out 2 Smashers, the Solemn Sorin and a random dude. Yet again I forget that as I make my curve ridiculously lower I could afford boarding out a land. Game 2 we're on regular attrition and disruption business as he goes for double Collected Company fuelled by an Eternal Witness in the first pick. He finds 2 combo pieces and draws Viscera Seer from the top. Ouch. Game 3 I control him once again. I feel like this matchup is more dependent on my opponent's luck than any other factor. It really doesn't matter striping one card of his hand when he presents Witness, Company and Chord to my face. Picking one is not enough.
2-1 vs. Living End:
Yep, Living End. Game 1 I try to strip my opponent's hand with no luck. He had a healthy amount of lands and cycling creatures only. He eventually finds his cascade spell and Living End on my face. I looked closely as he cascaded to notice he was also packing Scapeshift as an alt-win con. Game 2 I bring in My 3rd Smasher, 3 Thoughtseizes and 2 Rest in Peace. Out goes my 4 Wasteland Stranglers, Solemn Sorin and probably a singleton Flickerwisp or a Vial. The combination of multiple Scullers and Thoughtseizes secured the following games.
2-0 vs. Affinity:
Hell of a matchup that I always respect. The thing is that if my opponent doesn't dump his hand onto the battlefield turn 1 with an interesting clock, say Signal Pest boosting multiple flyers or a Cranial Plating here and there, Eldrazi & Taxes might have a shot at stabilizing for the win. This is exactly what happened game 1 and 2. Flickerwisp was an all-star as usual, Thought-Knot Seer was staring at the Etched Champion and even attacked with ease, and Displacer was at least very (and I mean VERY) annoying to the opponent, often forcing a Galvanic Blast. Sideboarding was easy, just bring in 3 Stony Silence and 2 Zealous Persecution (ridiculously good in this matchup). Out goes 2 Smashers, a Vial, an Arbiter and a Sculler.
0-2 vs. Melira Combo:
Game 1 I disrupt a Chord out of his hand via Sculler with very little impact. He just finds another one, pulls Qasali Pridemage and takes it back, eventually assembling the combo. Game 2 I had the same sideboard plan, and I see 7 cards with enough land, rest in peace, a wasteland strangler and a TKS. It was definitely good enough, but my draws were very poor and consisted mostly of lands. My opponent had a single land and multiple mana dorks, eventually going for collected company and just flooding the board with creatures. I lost to the beatdown plan. This made me think if I should bring in Mirran Crusader to the match. TBH I don't know what I should side out to make room for it, but it feels like worth trying. Another option is bringing additional hand disruption with Thoughtseize. What is your regular sideboard plan for this deck? There are at least 3 people piloting this deck at the store and it also feels like I have the necessary tools to fight Melira Combo, but I can hardly get there.
EDIT: upon reflection, I'm starting to think that old Thalia is underperforming in this matchup. Taxing a single mana isn't a big deal for a deck full of mana dorks and small creatures to convoke with. Multiple cats, thought, is another thing altogether. Perhaps siding out Thalias and in Thoughtseizes could do the trick?
On another note, how's New Thalia looking in a regular BW Eldrazi & Taxes list? Mainboard or sideboard material?
Hi fellas! I'm developing an UW Death and Taxes deck, but it looks more like a Tempo and Taxes. [...] What do you guys think?
Fun fun fun. I can't wait for EMN's blue cards to come out online. I don't have any solid answers, but if you don't mind I'd like to bounce some questions off ya.
1) Citadel Siege - Are you planning on typically choosing Khans to get your tax bears out of Bolt range or Dragons for the reliable Topplegeist effect? It is repeatable+reliable, but I'm worried it isn't particularly efficient at either job. Personal cards can be fun, though; so happy testing.
2) Where are the birds? - The way the list is put together it looks like you're going to be slowing the opponent as much as possible by bouncing/countering their creatures to gain a tempo lead. A few more evasive creatures could probably go a long ways toward putting damage through while you're ahead. RefMage looks like it'll do it's bounce but then just be stuck in the trenches of a very ground-clogged battlefield. Maybe 1x-2x Vryn Wingmare could provide some additional synergy for ThaliaGT and Spell Queller?
3) Too few 1-drops? - I'm a little surprised by 0xJudge's Familiar and/or none of the new Mausoleum Wanderer in the deck. Early they let you take a few pot-shots at the opponent's life total, and later they make it hard for the opponent play around them or tap out.
4) Too few flicker effects? - With all the ETB value you have from TKS, Spell Queller, RefMage, etc. more flicker effects beyond just 4xWisp might be helpful. One or two Disp and/or Resto might go a long ways.
Overall it looks like it'll be fun to test. I'll probably do separate tests of a Queller+ThaliaHC tempo list and a RefMage+ThaliaHC list to see how similar/different the two cards are, though; 3x+3x seems like a lot of overlap for the similar effects.
I haven't read through all the most recent posts, but I'm surprised by no discusion of Repel the Abominable. It seems like a very flexible sb option. I probably will be only running one, but having a card that counters bolt, anger, and Lightning Storm (if cast at the right time). It also stops infect, and can be a combat trick. It seems good and we have plenty of humans so even if it backfires it won't be that bad. It's a little expensive, sure, but it does a whole lot in one card.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Check out my Sales 50% OFF everything for the next 48 hours.
I am going to try her as a two-of--mostly likely one main and one SB and I will move them around accordingly. If I were on G/W (where I think she is best), I would certainly MB three. B/W is just too slow to rely on her that much. This, of course, is just my opinion.
I played with this shell bit today. Seems sweet. Not going into great detail but have to say, it's absolutely worth testing the spirit. The early game feels so much better with so much anti-disruption. Academy is also potentially going to be crazy against hand disruption.
My guess is new Thalia - he's been testing RW Ajani & taxes (Kittyprison?) on MTGO and really wants to try the new Thalia as it's a great curve/combo into Ajani.
Congrats on your results online, out of curiosity, what kind of win rate are you pulling in leagues with your mono white lists?
Legacy: Maverick
WWModern Death And Taxes (w/ Militia Bugler) (JUL '19)
GWModern Maverick (JUL '19)
WBCatmix on Twitch!
WWCatmix on Youtube
Looks like you really favor Judge's familiar in your lists. Does the card pull its weight for you? What matchups is this card shinning for you. Ive had a love/hate relationship with the bird for as long as I can remember, but one of the lists I have with Thalia HC plays the full set. So what im thinking is 4 Familiar and 2 spellskite main, or skip the one drops and play 2 selfless spirit and 2 spellskite main. Any thoughts?
Also about the 3 Thalia/ 2 Wingmare split. Ive tested this a little, (not enough to get correct data) but I always felt like I wanted Wingmare to be Thalia when ever I drew it. I didn't get to live the dream and have a Thalia and Wingmare on the battlefield at the same time. I do know the power though, cause when wingmare first came out I tested a 4/3 split.
On the mana base. I feel like one of the main reasons to play Mono white is the ability to play 4 Tec edge. Does mutavault do enough for you to run only two tec edge?
(P.S. Glad to see Mirrin Crusader in your MD, I play 3 in my main too and it has been pulling its weight more then ever in the MTGO Meta)
The list looks like it could be good, but a couple things pop out to me. Do you feel you need 3 crusaders in such a bolt heavy meta? It can be a poor draw against jeskai, which is already a trickier matchup. I think 2 would be fine. 22 lands is probably the lowest you want to go without a MD 4 drop which makes me wonder why you are not running any copies of Resto, especially with 4 wisp, 3 splicer and 2 finks in the board - I think it would be worth running a single copy. Also with linvala and gideon in the board, I think you might want 23 lands - the horizon canopies help a lot with flooding out. And with only 14 white sources, there will likely be games you cannot play any of your 4 familiars on turn 1, or even your crusaders on turn 3.
As far as equipment goes, I might consider running a maindeck copy of basilisk collar - with 11 ish first strikers you would be favored in ground combat.
I like the list though - it's very low to the ground and it's nice to see someone else running wingmares - they do work in air for me almost every time they come out. Speaking of low to the ground and work in the air, I wouldn't mind seeing another serra avenger in there. Good luck this weekend!!
WWModern Death And Taxes (w/ Militia Bugler) (JUL '19)
GWModern Maverick (JUL '19)
WBCatmix on Twitch!
WWCatmix on Youtube
Just my guess, but maindeck Skite feels far better positioned than maindeck Spirit in the current meta.
A lot of times both Skite and Spirit will be used to blank some specific removal against one of our key taxes or beaters. Here's the top ten removal spells in the current Modern meta:
Widely Used Spells (Removal)
The main difference between Skite and Spirit is the spells they can stop that aren't targeted removal. Like you mentioned, Spirit can stop boardwipes, and Skite on the other hand can stop targeted pump spells. Here's the breakdown:
Widely Used Spells (Pumps)
The biggest issues to notice are the much larger percentage of decks in the meta running pump spells over boardwipes. Infect and Zooicide are everywhere right now, so you're going to face a lot of decks running Mutagenic Growth and Become Immense. The biggest source of the instant/sorcery boardwipes in the meta are the Nahiri Jeskai decks which are out there but not as large a chunk of the meta as either Infect or Zooicide, let alone both together. The other important thing to note is the number of these cards included in a given deck; wipes tend to be 1-ofs or at most 2-ofs in the main.
TL;DR - It seems to me that running Spirit before Skite is really over-preparing for those 1-of maindeck Anger of the Gods and really under-estimating the prevalence of pump aggro.
As for the Mutavault-->Sea-Gate Wreckage question, don't forget he has 3xBlade Splicer (strong first-strike blocking synergy with Mutavault) and 2xHorizon Canopy. The SGW switch would probably be taking out more lines of play than it would bring in.
WWModern Death And Taxes (w/ Militia Bugler) (JUL '19)
GWModern Maverick (JUL '19)
WBCatmix on Twitch!
WWCatmix on Youtube
I'm intrigued by your MU stats because I think my own are different. I don't have such a high win rate vs GBX, but have a higher win rate vs infect and dredge. Nahri and the others seem pretty similar. I'm curious about what makes this difference, but seeing as I'm not providing my deck list here (I want to test the new cards first. I'm talking about my list from before) that could be difficult to suss out. However, can you go over what you think makes your GBx winrate so high? I also run MD crusader, but only 2. Do you feel that familiar greatly helps that MU? And I'm curious why your infect winrate is only at 50 with MD skite and 5 old thalia effects. What makes it comparatively low do you think?
Also, would you mind going over your SB a little bit for us? You have a lot of unconventional choices in there and I'm curious when you bring in a lot of those cards like gideon, how JtN has been performing, and if SoWaP has helped your Nahri MU (I assume it's for that MU)?
more of a sidenote, and Eron, you don't have to be the one to answer this, but you guys just compared selfless spirit with spellskite and while I can see the comparison, I feel like in terms of SB, spirit more resembles burrenton forge-tender, but maybe a bit narrower?
Sure the spirit has evasion, more power, and hits more than just red, but it can't block any incoming red creatures for days and it can't save you from a burn spell the way BFT can. The ideal place to use either is against a board sweep, but the only one that comes to mind where spirit does something and BFT doesn't is against supreme verdict.
In my mind BFT can come in against aggro decks and against control decks whereas spirit is pretty much just for control.
Plus BFT only costs 1 mana instead of 2. That's most not relevant, but in terms of tempo trades, it can matter.
Am I missing something here?
Thanks Eron and anybody else with takes on our new spirit!
4 tectonic edge
4 ghost quarter
2 sea gate wreckage
2 horizon canopy
1 Gemstone Caverns
1 Eiganjo Castle
9 Plains
8 non creature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Selfless Spirit
2 Spellskite
1 Phyrexian Revoker
3 blade splicer
3 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Fiend Hunter
4 Flickerwisp
3 Restoration Angel
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Rest in Peace
2 Stony Silence
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Surgical Extraction
1 Sundering Growth
2 Plains
1 Forest
2 Razorverge Thicket
1 Temple Garden
2 Brushland
3 Horizon Canopy
4 Ghost Quarter
2 stirring wildwood
2 Gavony Township
1 tectonic edge
1 gemstone caverns
10 noncreature spells
4 Path to Exile
4 Aether Vial
2 Collected Company
28 creatures
4 Noble Hierarch
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
2 Scavenging Ooze
2 Spellskite
1 Selfless Spirit
4 Flickerwisp
2 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
2 Courser of Kruphix
1 Eternal Witness
1 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Restoration Angel
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Ghostly Prison
1 Worship
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Caves of Koilos
4 Concealed Courtyard
2 Godless Shrine
1 Shambling Vent
4 Ghost Quarter
4 Eldrazi Temple
1 Vault of the Archangel
2 Plains
1 Gemstone Caverns
8 Noncreature Spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Tidehollow Sculler
4 Leonin Arbiter
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Flickerwisp
4 Eldrazi Displacer
2 Spellskite
2 Selfless Spirit
3 Wasteland Strangler
4 Thought-Knot Seer
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Rest in Peace
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Sin Collector
2 Orzhov Pontiff
2 Blessed Alliance
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Worship
3 Brushland
3 Eldrazi Temple
1 Forest
2 Gavony Township
1 Gemstone Caverns
4 Ghost Quarter
2 Plains
3 Razorverge Thicket
2 Stirring Wildwood
1 Temple Garden
10 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
2 Ancient Stirrings
4 Path to exile
4 Noble Hierarch
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Leonin Arbiter
1 Aven Mindcensor
1 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
1 Spellskite
1 Scavenging Ooze
3 Eldrazi Displacer
4 Flickerwisp
1 Eternal Witness
4 Thought-knot seer
2 Reality Smasher
1 Reclamation Sage
2 Stony Silence
2 Rest in Peace
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Blessed Alliance
1 Worship
1 Spellskite
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
4 Ghost Quarter
1 Hallowed Fountain
4 Seachrome Coast
1 Eiganjo Castle
2 Tectonic Edge
1 Moorland Haunt
2 Mutavault
1 Island
2 Plains
2 Horizon Canopy
1 adarkar wastes
1 flooded strand
9 noncreature spells
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
1 detention sphere
28 creatures
3 Spell Queller
3 Selfless Spirit
3 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 eldrazi displacer
3 Reflector Mage
4 Flickerwisp
2 Phyrexian Revoker
3 leonin arbiter
2 Venser, Shaper Savant
2 spellskite
2 Rest in Peace
2 stony silence
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 ghostly prison
2 burrenton forge-tender
2 Surgical Extraction
1 kira, great glass-spinner
1 blessed alliance
BFT can chumpblock red creatures for days, SS adds to the clock by being evasive;
BFT can stop Anger of the Gods and Pyroclasm for 1cmc less, SS can stop all that plus Supreme Verdict, Damnation, and Wrath of God;
BFT can help flesh out the deck's 1-drop slot; SS can make the team invincible to save X blockers while serving as the only chumpblocking death.
It's more of a trade/toss-up than anything. I guess we'll see how it plays out when we can get some testing in, but I'm interested in seeing how well trading bodies via chumpblocks might work with Spirit. Attacking with your 8whack team? Oops, my team blocked 1-for-1 and SS took one for the team- guess you lose X-for-1. Attacking with two big Goyfs/etc.? I can block with SS+Thalia, and sacc SS to turn 1-chumpblock into two. I'm not sure where the card advantage shakes out for SS block-enabling becomes better-than-nothing, but there's a chance it comes out ahead of BFT in a number of matchups.
4x Aether Vial
3x Path to Exile
1x Vapor Snag
1x Citadel Siege
Creature (28)
1x Ethersworn Canonist
2x Spellskite
4x Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4x Leonin Arbiter
4x Flickerwisp
3x Reflector Mage
3x Spell Queller
3x Thalia, Heretic Cathar
Land (23)
4x Adarkar Wastes
4x Ghost Quarter
4x Hallowed Fountain
1x Nimbus Maze
1x Island
1x Moorland Haunt
3x Plains
4x Seachrome Coast
1x Tectonic Edge
2x Burrenton Forge-Tender
1x Eidolon of Rhetoric
1x Gideon Jura
3x Grafdigger's Cage
1x Hurkyl's Recall
2x Kitchen Finks
1x Rest in Peace
1x Spell Pierce
3x Stony Silence
I'd like to try Citadel Siege even it costing 5 manas to cast. I think it's too strong to not use as 1 of. And I guess Maindeck Canonist is tricky, but I like her interaction with Spell Queller. Also, Reflector Mage with my new
waifuThalia is a sweet tempo combo. What do you guys think?Quick LGS tournament report. Solid 3-1 finally breaching the 2-2 standings I had for a couple of tournaments.
2-1 vs. Melira Combo:
Game 1 my opponent has no luck in finding the combo pieces, as light disruption in the form of Tidehollow Sculler gets in the way. Post sideboard in comes 2 Rest in Peace and 2 Zealous Persecution out 2 Smashers, the Solemn Sorin and a random dude. Yet again I forget that as I make my curve ridiculously lower I could afford boarding out a land. Game 2 we're on regular attrition and disruption business as he goes for double Collected Company fuelled by an Eternal Witness in the first pick. He finds 2 combo pieces and draws Viscera Seer from the top. Ouch. Game 3 I control him once again. I feel like this matchup is more dependent on my opponent's luck than any other factor. It really doesn't matter striping one card of his hand when he presents Witness, Company and Chord to my face. Picking one is not enough.
2-1 vs. Living End:
Yep, Living End. Game 1 I try to strip my opponent's hand with no luck. He had a healthy amount of lands and cycling creatures only. He eventually finds his cascade spell and Living End on my face. I looked closely as he cascaded to notice he was also packing Scapeshift as an alt-win con. Game 2 I bring in My 3rd Smasher, 3 Thoughtseizes and 2 Rest in Peace. Out goes my 4 Wasteland Stranglers, Solemn Sorin and probably a singleton Flickerwisp or a Vial. The combination of multiple Scullers and Thoughtseizes secured the following games.
2-0 vs. Affinity:
Hell of a matchup that I always respect. The thing is that if my opponent doesn't dump his hand onto the battlefield turn 1 with an interesting clock, say Signal Pest boosting multiple flyers or a Cranial Plating here and there, Eldrazi & Taxes might have a shot at stabilizing for the win. This is exactly what happened game 1 and 2. Flickerwisp was an all-star as usual, Thought-Knot Seer was staring at the Etched Champion and even attacked with ease, and Displacer was at least very (and I mean VERY) annoying to the opponent, often forcing a Galvanic Blast. Sideboarding was easy, just bring in 3 Stony Silence and 2 Zealous Persecution (ridiculously good in this matchup). Out goes 2 Smashers, a Vial, an Arbiter and a Sculler.
0-2 vs. Melira Combo:
Game 1 I disrupt a Chord out of his hand via Sculler with very little impact. He just finds another one, pulls Qasali Pridemage and takes it back, eventually assembling the combo. Game 2 I had the same sideboard plan, and I see 7 cards with enough land, rest in peace, a wasteland strangler and a TKS. It was definitely good enough, but my draws were very poor and consisted mostly of lands. My opponent had a single land and multiple mana dorks, eventually going for collected company and just flooding the board with creatures. I lost to the beatdown plan. This made me think if I should bring in Mirran Crusader to the match. TBH I don't know what I should side out to make room for it, but it feels like worth trying. Another option is bringing additional hand disruption with Thoughtseize. What is your regular sideboard plan for this deck? There are at least 3 people piloting this deck at the store and it also feels like I have the necessary tools to fight Melira Combo, but I can hardly get there.
EDIT: upon reflection, I'm starting to think that old Thalia is underperforming in this matchup. Taxing a single mana isn't a big deal for a deck full of mana dorks and small creatures to convoke with. Multiple cats, thought, is another thing altogether. Perhaps siding out Thalias and in Thoughtseizes could do the trick?
On another note, how's New Thalia looking in a regular BW Eldrazi & Taxes list? Mainboard or sideboard material?
BUR Grixis Death's Shadow/Control BUR & WBC Eldrazi & Taxes WBC
EDH:
UG Edric, Spymaster of Goodstuff UG
1) Citadel Siege - Are you planning on typically choosing Khans to get your tax bears out of Bolt range or Dragons for the reliable Topplegeist effect? It is repeatable+reliable, but I'm worried it isn't particularly efficient at either job. Personal cards can be fun, though; so happy testing.
2) Where are the birds? - The way the list is put together it looks like you're going to be slowing the opponent as much as possible by bouncing/countering their creatures to gain a tempo lead. A few more evasive creatures could probably go a long ways toward putting damage through while you're ahead. RefMage looks like it'll do it's bounce but then just be stuck in the trenches of a very ground-clogged battlefield. Maybe 1x-2x Vryn Wingmare could provide some additional synergy for ThaliaGT and Spell Queller?
3) Too few 1-drops? - I'm a little surprised by 0xJudge's Familiar and/or none of the new Mausoleum Wanderer in the deck. Early they let you take a few pot-shots at the opponent's life total, and later they make it hard for the opponent play around them or tap out.
4) Too few flicker effects? - With all the ETB value you have from TKS, Spell Queller, RefMage, etc. more flicker effects beyond just 4xWisp might be helpful. One or two Disp and/or Resto might go a long ways.
Overall it looks like it'll be fun to test. I'll probably do separate tests of a Queller+ThaliaHC tempo list and a RefMage+ThaliaHC list to see how similar/different the two cards are, though; 3x+3x seems like a lot of overlap for the similar effects.
I am going to try her as a two-of--mostly likely one main and one SB and I will move them around accordingly. If I were on G/W (where I think she is best), I would certainly MB three. B/W is just too slow to rely on her that much. This, of course, is just my opinion.
4 leonin arbiter
4 Thalia, guardian of thraben
3 Selfless spirit
3 Thalia, heretic cathar
4 flickerwisp
2 aven mindcensor
4 thought-knot seer
1 fiend hunter
4 path to exile
2 nephalia academy
2 cavern of souls
3 flagstones of trokair
4 ghost quarter
4 tectonic edge
2 godless shrine
2 caves of koilos
4 plains
I played with this shell bit today. Seems sweet. Not going into great detail but have to say, it's absolutely worth testing the spirit. The early game feels so much better with so much anti-disruption. Academy is also potentially going to be crazy against hand disruption.
WWModern Death And Taxes (w/ Militia Bugler) (JUL '19)
GWModern Maverick (JUL '19)
WBCatmix on Twitch!
WWCatmix on Youtube