3 resto 1 P&K wouldn't be a bad idea, and the deck definitely has room for 1-2 slayers strongholds.
In other news, went 4-0 at Thursday night magic with mono white. Managed to play vs. decks that don't like Thalia being cast: infect, reanimator, 8-rack and mono blue turns.
Hi, I'm decently new to the forum and am almost done building my BW eldrazi & taxes and am wondering what cards i should consider for SB and MB in a very jund heavy meta. I've noticed a lot of people on here recommending elspeth, crusader, and leyline of sanctity and was wondering if any of those should be considered for maindeck or if there are any other cards that work well in that match up. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Hi, I'm decently new to the forum and am almost done building my BW eldrazi & taxes and am wondering what cards i should consider for SB and MB in a very jund heavy meta. I've noticed a lot of people on here recommending elspeth, crusader, and leyline of sanctity and was wondering if any of those should be considered for maindeck or if there are any other cards that work well in that match up. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
It depends on which axis you're trying to fight their deck.
I'm in a BGx-heavy metagame (although not always Jund), and I maindeck Mirran Crusader. Crusader is vulnerable to Jund's discard and Bolts, but it stops or attacks through every creature in their deck. I highly recommend it, but I've also never played WB E&T. I'm playing a different D&T variant (WGx), so I have access to Crusader on two. Generally speaking, Jund hates Crusader, so I know the plan is working.
Leyling of Sanctity is probably the worst to maindeck, because it's only useful against a handful of strategies (Jund, Burn, Storm, etc.) and it doesn't swing for damage. There's nothing wrong with Leyline in the sideboard, but I wouldn't recommend it in the maindeck.
Elspeth, Knight-Errant is capable of stalling Jund by pumping out tokens and it's capable of giving something flying for value (just throwing it out there that giving a Mirran Crusader +3/+3 and flying is nuts). Elspeth is definitely playable, although I'm not sure I'd call it anti-Jund tech. It's just a good value card that helps give your guys evasion and it gives you things to sacrifice to Liliana of the Veil. It's certainly playable in the maindeck, but typically only as a singleton. The casting cost can be hard to reach sometimes, because your Thalias will tax it.
I think one really good card that you missed is Lingering Souls, and that's definitely maindeckable. Lingering Souls is essentially immune to discard, and it floods the board with little creatures that swing over everything and to keep Liliana under control.
If you're really committed to beating Jund, you might consider running a few copies of Nephalia Academy. I've never seen that card been run before in this deck, but people also don't usually ask for Jund-specific hate. Nephalia Academy won't help you T1 on the draw, but it works pretty well on the play into an Aether Vial, and because you're piloting E&T, you can actually use the colorless mana.
If I had to recommend only one of those things for your deck, I would go with Lingering Souls.
Playing millions of cards every turn... Slowly and systematically obliterating any chance my opponent has of winning... Clicking the multitude of locking mechanisms into place... Not even trying to win myself until turn 10+ once I have nigh absolute control... Watching my opponent desperately trying to navigate the labyrinthine prison that I've constructed... Seeing the light of hope fade and ultimately extinguished in an excruciatingly slow manner... THAT'S fun Magic.
We have 2-3 users that are dramatically making this thread incomprehensible and non-productive for anyone else to possibly join in the discussion. This needs to change.
Every time I see [ktkenshinx] post in here, I get the impression of a stern dad walking in on a bunch of kids trying to do something dumb and just shaking his head in disappointment.
Near Mint: The same as Slightly Played, but we threw some Altoids in the box we stored it in to cover up the scent of dead mice. Slightly Played: The base condition for all MTG cards. This card looks OK, but there’s one minor annoying ding in it that will always irritate and distract you whenever you draw it. Moderately Played: This card looks like it survived the Tet Offensive tucked inside the waistband of GI underwear. It may smell like it, too. Heavily Played: This card looks like the remains of Mohammed Atta’s passport after 9/11. It may be playable if you double-sleeve it to stop the chunks from falling out. The condition formerly known as "Washing Machine Grade" Damaged: This card is the unfortunate victim of a Mirrorweave/March of the Machines/Chaos Confetti/Mindslaver combo.
[M]aking counterfeit cards is the absolute height of dishonesty. Ask yourself this question: Since most people...are totally cool with the use of proxies...what purpose do [high] quality counterfeit cards serve?
I have tried Lingering souls (especially with the jund matchup in mind) and I disliked the dis-synergy with rest in peace (and to a lesser extend Vial and Thalia). But Souls is a controversial card, just try it out for yourself. I really like Rip out of the board in this matchup.
Imo Elspeth (more of a Sb card), Mirran Crusader and Blade Splicer are decent options. Even Brimaz is pretty good in a midrange meta (he holds back a single goyf as well, because racing is impossible agianst vigilance tokens. And he survives bolt). And there is also wall of resurgence
Interesting read agua_benta, thx. (In the uw spirits thread they are brewing something between DnT and Spirits if anybody is interested in reading it.)
wheel of sun and moon: Isn't the ability to empty an existing gy super important though? (besides costing just a single white mana)
Hi, my name is Túlio and I live in Brazil. I have been plaied for a long time with MonoWhite DaT and next week I'll play a champ here and this is my actual list. What do you think? Any sugestions?
PS.: The metagame here in my city have Jeskai Nahiri; Naya Zoo; Burn; 8Rack (discart); Abzan; Bant Eldrazi; Bant Coralhelm; B-Tron; TitanShift.
I'm playing with this deck for a long time and it is working... but the match against Grixis Control is hard (this version has no counters, blue is for Snapcaster Mage, Jace, Vryn's Prodigy and cantrips (Thought Scour, Serum Visions)... the deck is almost a rakdos, has a lot of removals and discard... Bolt, IoK, Kommand, Terminate, Collective Brutality and other cards like it... It kills with Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet, Tasigur, the Golden Fang, Pia and Kiran Nalaar, Olivia Voldaren or Creeping Tar Pit. I'd say that it is a Jund with Snapcaster Mage, Jace, Vryn's Prodigy Thought Scour and Serum Visions of green slots. How could I get a better match against it?
Any suggestions?
EDIT: My metagame is really miscellaneous.
It has:
Mono Green Stompy
Naya Burn
TitanShift
Lantern Control
UR Delver
Grixis Control
Dirtty Red
BW DnT (Ekdrazi or not)
UW Control
Jeskai Control
Living End
Mono White Human
Grixis Delver
Abzan CoCo (Melira Combo or not)
MonoRed Goblins
Merfolks
Skred Red
Jeskai Delver
UR Storm
Elves
Infect
Some Rogue Decks
Hi, my name is Túlio and I live in Brazil. I have been plaied for a long time with MonoWhite DaT and next week I'll play a champ here and this is my actual list. What do you think? Any sugestions?
PS.: The metagame here in my city have Jeskai Nahiri; Naya Zoo; Burn; 8Rack (discart); Abzan; Bant Eldrazi; Bant Coralhelm; B-Tron; TitanShift.
What do you guys think of Spreading Seas in the main-board for Blue white DnT, and is it worth it to go with 1-3 Vendilion Clique for hand disruption or a lighter blue splash possibly including tech edge to have as much possible land hate.
@Metalgun, I wrote a detailed piece about beating jund/junk about 20 pages back with lots of contributions from other posters in the following pages. I'll sum up a few of the key points but track down that post.
You need to think of two words to beat jund; value and redundancy. They want to remove everything you play on a one for one basis and beat you with fatties. Play value creatures like wall of resurgence and blade splicer. Wasteland strangler is great for killing confidants and has strong synergy with the graveyard hate you need to make goyf manageable. Also, take them off red if you can. It's the weak point in the manabase.
@d90dennis, wall of resurgence is most definitely not a cute card. It's a nightmare for jund. If they spend removal on a land then they're already far ahead or circling the drain. In any type of even game it's a big problem for them. Dnc, broke wall at the beginning of eldrazi winter and many of us, myself included, had the same criticisms that you had. We were wrong.
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Your success in playing dnt/hatebears is determined largely by your ability to read and prepare for the meta that you will be playing in. Furthermore, it has an absolutely brutal learning curve. Expect to lose; a lot.
In other news, went 4-0 at Thursday night magic with mono white. Managed to play vs. decks that don't like Thalia being cast: infect, reanimator, 8-rack and mono blue turns.
I'm in a BGx-heavy metagame (although not always Jund), and I maindeck Mirran Crusader. Crusader is vulnerable to Jund's discard and Bolts, but it stops or attacks through every creature in their deck. I highly recommend it, but I've also never played WB E&T. I'm playing a different D&T variant (WGx), so I have access to Crusader on two. Generally speaking, Jund hates Crusader, so I know the plan is working.
Leyling of Sanctity is probably the worst to maindeck, because it's only useful against a handful of strategies (Jund, Burn, Storm, etc.) and it doesn't swing for damage. There's nothing wrong with Leyline in the sideboard, but I wouldn't recommend it in the maindeck.
Elspeth, Knight-Errant is capable of stalling Jund by pumping out tokens and it's capable of giving something flying for value (just throwing it out there that giving a Mirran Crusader +3/+3 and flying is nuts). Elspeth is definitely playable, although I'm not sure I'd call it anti-Jund tech. It's just a good value card that helps give your guys evasion and it gives you things to sacrifice to Liliana of the Veil. It's certainly playable in the maindeck, but typically only as a singleton. The casting cost can be hard to reach sometimes, because your Thalias will tax it.
I think one really good card that you missed is Lingering Souls, and that's definitely maindeckable. Lingering Souls is essentially immune to discard, and it floods the board with little creatures that swing over everything and to keep Liliana under control.
If you're really committed to beating Jund, you might consider running a few copies of Nephalia Academy. I've never seen that card been run before in this deck, but people also don't usually ask for Jund-specific hate. Nephalia Academy won't help you T1 on the draw, but it works pretty well on the play into an Aether Vial, and because you're piloting E&T, you can actually use the colorless mana.
If I had to recommend only one of those things for your deck, I would go with Lingering Souls.
WUDeath&TaxesWG
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WR Card Choice List
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Imo Elspeth (more of a Sb card), Mirran Crusader and Blade Splicer are decent options. Even Brimaz is pretty good in a midrange meta (he holds back a single goyf as well, because racing is impossible agianst vigilance tokens. And he survives bolt). And there is also wall of resurgence
Wheel Of Sun And Moon
DnT! I'm a power-load
DnT! Watch me Explode
wheel of sun and moon: Isn't the ability to empty an existing gy super important though? (besides costing just a single white mana)
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/512905
Really solid list with a very low mana curve, altough IMO i'd change the 1-0f athreos and tweak the SB
PS.: The metagame here in my city have Jeskai Nahiri; Naya Zoo; Burn; 8Rack (discart); Abzan; Bant Eldrazi; Bant Coralhelm; B-Tron; TitanShift.
1 Eiganjo Castle
2 Mutavault
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Tectonic Edge
4 Aether Vial
4 Path to Exile
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Flickerwisp
3 Restoration Angel
3 Blade Splicer
3 Selfless Spirit
3 Kitchen Finks
2 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
2 Vryn Wingmare
2 Aven Mindcensor
2 Sundering Growth
2 Kor Firewalker
2 Kataki, War's Wage
1 Ghostly Prison
2 Rest in Peace
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Celestial Purge
1 Mirran Crusader
1 Blessed Alliance
1 Valorous Stance
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Blade Splicer
3 Restoration Angel
3 Selfless Spirit
2 Aven Mindcensor
2 Kitchen Finks
2 Serra Avenger
2 Vryn Wingmare
1 Spellskite
4 Path to Exile
1 Dismember
10 Plains
4 Ghost Quarter
3 Tectonic Edge
2 Mutavault
1 Eiganjo Castle
1 Flagstones of Trokair
1 Sea Gate Wreckage
2-3 Sundering Growth
0-1 Dismember
1-2 Mark of Asylum
0-3 Rest in Peace
2 Ghostly Prison
1-3 Mirran Crusader
0-1 Linvala, Keeper of Silence
0-3 Kor Firewalker
0-2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
0-1 Spellskite
0-3 Stony Silence (I dont use it anymore, there is no need on my metagame)
3 Mirran Crusader
3 Kor Firewalker
2 Ghostly Prison
2 Sundering Growth
2 Rest in Peace
1 Mark of Asylum
1 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Dismember
Any suggestions?
EDIT: My metagame is really miscellaneous.
It has:
Mono Green Stompy
Naya Burn
TitanShift
Lantern Control
UR Delver
Grixis Control
Dirtty Red
BW DnT (Ekdrazi or not)
UW Control
Jeskai Control
Living End
Mono White Human
Grixis Delver
Abzan CoCo (Melira Combo or not)
MonoRed Goblins
Merfolks
Skred Red
Jeskai Delver
UR Storm
Elves
Infect
Some Rogue Decks
Lantern Control
(with videos)
Uc Tron
Netdecking explained
Netdecking explained, Part 2
On speculators and counterfeits
On Interaction
Every single competitive deck in existence is designed to limit the opponent's ability to interact in a meaningful way.
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I think Vryn Wingmare and Aven Mindcensor doesn't make the cut anymore (old days ah...).
In order to beat your meta, my changes would be:
MAINDECK
-2 Aven Mindcensor
-2 vryn wingmare
+1 selfless spirit
+1 thalia, heretic cathar
+2 eldrazi displacer
SIDEBOARD
-2 Kataki, War's Wage
-1 Blessed Alliance
-1 Valorous Stance
-1 Ghostly Prison
-1 Mirran Crusader
+3 Runed Halo
+1 sundering growth
+2 chalice of the void
+2 stony Silence
-2 Kor Firewalker
Better grab any pieces you need before prices potentially jump due to the SaffronOlive effect.
WB Ayli, Eternal Pilgrim | WBR Queen Marchesa | WUBR Breya, Etherium Shaper
Modern:
/ Death and Taxes | W/ Soul Sisters | Spirits | U Faeries | Tempered Steel Affinity
It is way too cute and situational and getting your land removed isn't great.
Kitchen Finks and Blade Splicer would be better instead imho.
You need to think of two words to beat jund; value and redundancy. They want to remove everything you play on a one for one basis and beat you with fatties. Play value creatures like wall of resurgence and blade splicer. Wasteland strangler is great for killing confidants and has strong synergy with the graveyard hate you need to make goyf manageable. Also, take them off red if you can. It's the weak point in the manabase.
@d90dennis, wall of resurgence is most definitely not a cute card. It's a nightmare for jund. If they spend removal on a land then they're already far ahead or circling the drain. In any type of even game it's a big problem for them. Dnc, broke wall at the beginning of eldrazi winter and many of us, myself included, had the same criticisms that you had. We were wrong.
So, my creatures are:
4x Arbiter
4x Sculler
3x Thalia GoT
4x Flickerwisp
4x Displacer
3x Strangler
4x Seer
I have 3 free creature slots, 2x Splicer 1x Wall? 3x Wall? 3x Splicer? Your thoughts?