Card Choices: Driven // Despair - Helps with Storm mostly. Also operates as a pseudo-Overrun effect Horizon Canopy - Can't say whether it's helped or hurt yet. The extra card draw has been useful, but I'm worried about hitting no-red hands. Ghost Quarter MB - Same as above. I believe a list placed well online running 1 in the main a little while back, so I picked it up.
Double Darkblast - With Affinity being on the rise, I feel like being able to snipe Steel Overseer and Signal Pest on turn 1-2 is fairly important.
Recommendations? Also, thoughts on the UW Sideboard plan?
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MTGO: Stillenacht288
Modern:
Footsteps Hulk
Ascendency Combo
Restore Balance
Ad Nauseam
EDH:
Ghave Lands
Narset Combo
I like the 5c manabase over the course of a longer paper tournament, too, because of decision fatigue. You lean very heavily on haunted dead and gnaw to the bone in more matchups with cities and confluences.
Why is the Failure//Comply tech good? I haven't had a chance to test it yet, but I'm curious to know how players know which card to name. I suspect the card is intended for Storm, but how do you know whether to name Past in Flames, Gifts Ungiven, Empty the Warrens, or Grapeshot?
New Dredge player here! I recently picked up the deck and tried it out last Friday at my LGS and went 4-0 with it. There is a lot to the deck but I love how it feels! I have one question: When is the best time to sacrifice a turn 1 Insolent Neonate?? Do I do it during my opponents next turn before their end step in case I trigger a Prized Amalgam? Or another time?
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Decks Modern UGWRB Humans G Mono-Green Tron UWBR Ad Nauseam
We can breath a sigh of relief, the newest Grave Rock (I mean wtf do we call all these artifacts that blow up graves that we get once a block?)completely misses us:
Silent Gravestone 1
Artifact
Cards in graveyards can't be the targets of spells or abilities.
4, t: Exile Silent Gravestone and all cards from all graveyards. Draw a card.
Its actually a cheaper, less colored, slightly worse,Ground Seal, which is a card dredge still uses off and on. The second half is way worse, but gives a nice out to having to restart dredge again... Which still isnt good. But should surgical spells become what people go for, this becomes better. I doubt it, but worth picking up maybe 2 copies in a few months when its worth cents just to have in a box somewhere. Overall, it's only niche would be stopping snapcaster decks while also protecting from Extraction, the day probably won't come we need that.
Pros:
Kills snapcaster
Stops All extraction effects
Stops selective reanimation
Lets us keep flashbacking and their elk.
We can dredge and reanimate still.
Stops Relics slow roll
Cons:
Misses tasigurs
Doesnt stop delve
Doesnt stop Living end
Doesnt stop grave nukes (relic, Tormod's Crypt)
Doesnt stop exile effects (RIP and Leyline
Ran into a interesting situation today on MTGO. My opponent scooped game one on turn one without having done anything. How do you sideboard in those scenarios? I just assumed they would have to be some sort of midrange deck with a bad dredge matchup. So I cut a conflag and my driven despair, most expendable cards and they are likely not combo or they would always have game 1 outs vs a good hand.
Any thoughts?
I do that exact situation all the time playing dredge. If I can expect to lose because I mulled to 3 or something, I mull to 0, then watch them play the game until they have lethal, I have to discard a card, or try to peek my hand or something, and I play 0 things. Sometimes I play a mountain to bluff burn before conceding.
Its pretty rare people do that, but its something that should be done more often. You go into game two with a sideboard, and they dont.
As for what I would do if I was on the receiving end of that? Id likely cut a few of the "extras" and add in stuff like decay, only that. You can assume they are packing a hate card for you, but you'll never be able to narrow it down completely in the blind. No visual clues= Assume they brought in a hate card and bring in the most versatile or the best hate card for the most trending way to hose dredge.
What’s the consensus on what’s better. Dredge or the newer Hollow One Deck? I feel like grave hate kills dredge where it doesn’t totally shut down Hollow One. What does everyone think?
I haven't had any success to brag on yet (same as everyone: 2-3s, 3-2s, and 4-1s in the comp leagues), but I like playing a 5c manabase and 4 Hollow Ones sideboard instead of anti-gravehate. Just awkwardly curve out games 2 and 3 or have the dredge combo-like option.
I haven't had any success to brag on yet (same as everyone: 2-3s, 3-2s, and 4-1s in the comp leagues), but I like playing a 5c manabase and 4 Hollow Ones sideboard instead of anti-gravehate. Just awkwardly curve out games 2 and 3 or have the dredge combo-like option.
Well a 2 mana 2/1 vampire was just spoiled. If you gain life you can cast it from the graveyard.
Not free like we like, but worth mentioning. Basically a discardless haunted dead if you can always enable it.
My guess? Not going to show up at all. If it was punishing fire trigger (when they gain life) id tell everyone to stop the presses and run burning grove with it, but its not free and we dont have much life link or gain aside from gnaw.
Hey guys, been wanting to get Dredge put together for a while and finally had the time and money to do so over the holidays. I took a rather stock list to a very small event (almost didnt fire...) and went 2-1 losing to Death and Taxes. Pretty much smashed Elves and Affinity though thanks to Conflagerate and Dark Blast.
Anyway, I felt my losses to DnT was due to (in part if not mostly) on bad mull decisions. I remember game three specifically mulling away Conflagerate, double Reunion, and four lands and my next mull was all land, then no land, and I kept a bad 4 because going to 3 seems super bad even for Dredge. In hindsight the original 7 seems like it could have worked just fine and I wasn't thinking about it hard enough. I was hoping for some experienced insight on when to mull and how low to actually go.
I played in 2 Modern double ups at Santa Clara and went 3-0 in both. Matchups were Grixis Death Shadow, RG Tron, GW Value Town, Affinity, Lantern, and Titan Shift. I played horribly vs GW Value Town and I should have lost, the guy who was playing the deck had not been playing it for very long and thankfully he misplayed enough to off set mine but I was playing just sloppy....even forgot to discard to faithless looting twice in one turn but I blame that to playing almost exclusively on mtgo. I'm very happy with the deck and I even think I am going to go to GP Phoenix.
Hey guys, been wanting to get Dredge put together for a while and finally had the time and money to do so over the holidays. I took a rather stock list to a very small event (almost didnt fire...) and went 2-1 losing to Death and Taxes. Pretty much smashed Elves and Affinity though thanks to Conflagerate and Dark Blast.
Anyway, I felt my losses to DnT was due to (in part if not mostly) on bad mull decisions. I remember game three specifically mulling away Conflagerate, double Reunion, and four lands and my next mull was all land, then no land, and I kept a bad 4 because going to 3 seems super bad even for Dredge. In hindsight the original 7 seems like it could have worked just fine and I wasn't thinking about it hard enough. I was hoping for some experienced insight on when to mull and how low to actually go.
You made the correct choice to mull. Just because you didnt get a great 6 or 5 doesnt mean that you shouldnt have mulled, it was still the correct choice. In poker you make the choice that is most likely to happen, just because the card didnt flip right on the river doesnt mean you made the wrong choice, it just means that you werent lucky. I am going to use fake numbers here for the sake of the argument but if mulling will give you a better hand 70% of the time, there will still be 30% of the time when it gets worst but it would not be smart to do the thing that is only correct 30% of the time. I hope that makes sense.
Regarding your deck I would throw the basic swamp in the trash and put back the dakmor salvage. If you don't want to play the dakmor salvage then just take out the swamp and play only 20 lands. I would also take out the basic forest and put back the copperline gorge unless your meta is 50% path decks. Also I would cut to 20 lands (taking out a blackcleave or basic swamp) and add in a finisher like Ivg said. I prefer Driven//Despair, I actually run 2 in the 75 and love it.
I didn't notice the swamp in the list. Yeah, that needs to go, same goes for the forest (although you can make a case for the forest) but still.
Yeah I wouldn't play either. I would probably chuck my deck across the room if I ever drew dakmor salvage and a forest as my opening two lands lmao.
Has anyone been testing Tormenting Voice? I picked a playset from my bulk and I am going to -1 Neonate and -1 Darkblast to make room for 2 just to try it.
Also this has nothing to do with gameplay but I just ordered the 7 foil fetches I need (4 wooded foothills and 3 bloodstained mires) so now I am at 63/75 foil.
Also this has nothing to do with gameplay but I just ordered the 7 foil fetches I need (4 wooded foothills and 3 bloodstained mires) so now I am at 63/75 foil.
Im so glad im not the only one who had done this. It's really stunning to have a fully foiled out deck. Life from the loam was the last piece i got. Good luck!
Hello everyone. I have been playing dredge for over a year now, gotta say I LOVE the deck, there is nothing quite like it. Anyways, I had to take a break from playing for a while because of college, but now I'm back and a lot has changed since I fell out some months ago. Just a couple questions really:
1- Why is everyone play Tormenting Voice now? I feel like Mom hug> voice, but is there something I'm missing here?
2- Where did this Hollowed Fountain Failure// Comply package come from, and what is it used for? I keep trying to find a snario where I would want to use it, but I cannot think of one and maybe someone here can enlighten me as to why it's being used.
3- Why is everyone dropping Haunted Dead? Is it because Driven// Despair is better w/ Scourge Devil now? Just wondering because I run Dead in the main and a Driven// Despair in the SB.
Scourge Devil is much much better than Rally. Couple reasons why:
1. Devil is uncounterable. It's VERY important vs Shadow decks and Jeskai/UW.
2. By itself deals 4 dmg - rally 0. Rally gives you more damage if you have 5 or more creatures. If we already he so many we should win no matter which pump spell we use. And that 4 dmg can kill from nowhere or pressure Planeswalkers (useful vs Tron with Karn/Ugin and Jace, Architect of Thought).
3. Devil is better if opponent has removal spells in hand to combat our overrun effect. The most important is vs Shadow and Jeskai. it's better to have more creatures wirh less power than less but bigger creatures. Bolt effects will kill anything, push all our regular creatures (but Devil is immune to Push :p) so it's better to force them to kill more stuff.
4. Devil can return Amalgams from graveyard. It's important vs Surgical decks.
5. It's a creature It can be casted for 5 mana. it can return form Living End. 99% of times It won't pump Goyf (and instant usually does it).
Pro tip - when opponent is at 10 our Bloodghasts gain haste. 2 Ghasts + devil is exectly 10. It's uncounterable way to deal lehtla dmg out from nowhere.
Of course Rally also have some pluses:
1. It's on instant speed so we can force opponent to make bad blocks becouse Rally is fear.
2. Instant speed effect is useful vs Lantern. For example with bridge in play and 1 card in opponent's hand we can attack with Narcomoebas and hardcasted dredges and after declaring attackers we can pump and attack for much more.
3. In lategame with 6 mana we can give our creatures +4+0. hardcast than flashback. Personally did it once, as classic win more ;p
After more than 1000 mathces on MTGO with 65% win ratio I can safely say that Devil is the best "combat trick card" in Dredge. Haunted Dead, Rally the Peasants or even Driven//Despair - they all have some advantages and disadvantages but overall Devil many times showed me that he deserves his slot.
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4 Stinkweed Imp
2 Golgari Thug
1 Haunted Dead
3 Insolent Neonate
4 Bloodghast
4 Prized Amalgam
4 Narcomoeba
Spells (18):
4 Faithless Looting
4 Cathartic Reuinion
2 Darkblast
3 Life from the Loam
3 Conflagrate
2 Driven // Despair
2 Copperline Gorge
1 Blackcleave Cliffs
2 Gemstone Mine
4 Wooded Foothills
2 Stomping Ground
2 Blood Crypt
1 Sheltered Thicket
2 Dakmor Salvage
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Ghost Quarter
2 Mountain
2 Lightning Axe
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Thoughtseize
2 Abrupt Decay
2 Nature's Claim
2 Collective Brutality
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Gnaw to the Bone
Card Choices:
Driven // Despair - Helps with Storm mostly. Also operates as a pseudo-Overrun effect
Horizon Canopy - Can't say whether it's helped or hurt yet. The extra card draw has been useful, but I'm worried about hitting no-red hands.
Ghost Quarter MB - Same as above. I believe a list placed well online running 1 in the main a little while back, so I picked it up.
Double Darkblast - With Affinity being on the rise, I feel like being able to snipe Steel Overseer and Signal Pest on turn 1-2 is fairly important.
Recommendations? Also, thoughts on the UW Sideboard plan?
Footsteps Hulk
Ascendency Combo
Restore Balance
Ad Nauseam
EDH:
Ghave Lands
Narset Combo
Modern
UGWRB Humans
G Mono-Green Tron
UWBR Ad Nauseam
Its actually a cheaper, less colored, slightly worse,Ground Seal, which is a card dredge still uses off and on. The second half is way worse, but gives a nice out to having to restart dredge again... Which still isnt good. But should surgical spells become what people go for, this becomes better. I doubt it, but worth picking up maybe 2 copies in a few months when its worth cents just to have in a box somewhere. Overall, it's only niche would be stopping snapcaster decks while also protecting from Extraction, the day probably won't come we need that.
Pros:
Kills snapcaster
Stops All extraction effects
Stops selective reanimation
Lets us keep flashbacking and their elk.
We can dredge and reanimate still.
Stops Relics slow roll
Cons:
Misses tasigurs
Doesnt stop delve
Doesnt stop Living end
Doesnt stop grave nukes (relic, Tormod's Crypt)
Doesnt stop exile effects (RIP and Leyline
I do that exact situation all the time playing dredge. If I can expect to lose because I mulled to 3 or something, I mull to 0, then watch them play the game until they have lethal, I have to discard a card, or try to peek my hand or something, and I play 0 things. Sometimes I play a mountain to bluff burn before conceding.
Its pretty rare people do that, but its something that should be done more often. You go into game two with a sideboard, and they dont.
As for what I would do if I was on the receiving end of that? Id likely cut a few of the "extras" and add in stuff like decay, only that. You can assume they are packing a hate card for you, but you'll never be able to narrow it down completely in the blind. No visual clues= Assume they brought in a hate card and bring in the most versatile or the best hate card for the most trending way to hose dredge.
Here ya go: www.mtgmintcard.com/articles/writers/zen-takahashi/the-ultimate-dredge-sideboard-guide
What does your sideboard look like?
Not free like we like, but worth mentioning. Basically a discardless haunted dead if you can always enable it.
My guess? Not going to show up at all. If it was punishing fire trigger (when they gain life) id tell everyone to stop the presses and run burning grove with it, but its not free and we dont have much life link or gain aside from gnaw.
Anyway, I felt my losses to DnT was due to (in part if not mostly) on bad mull decisions. I remember game three specifically mulling away Conflagerate, double Reunion, and four lands and my next mull was all land, then no land, and I kept a bad 4 because going to 3 seems super bad even for Dredge. In hindsight the original 7 seems like it could have worked just fine and I wasn't thinking about it hard enough. I was hoping for some experienced insight on when to mull and how low to actually go.
Here is my list, pretty stock but I replaced one Copperline Gorge with a Forest, Dakmor Salvage with a Swamp, and used Duress as a place holder for Thoughtseize:
3 Bloodstained Mire
1 Arid Mesa
3 Wooded Foothills
2 Stomping Ground
2 Copperline Gorge
1 Blood Crypt
2 Blackcleave Cliffs
2 Gemstone Mine
1 Dakmor Salvage
2 Mountain
1 Forest
1 Swamp
4 Insolent Neonate
4 Bloodghast
4 Narcomoeba
3 Golgari Thug
4 Stinkweed Imp
4 Prized Amalgam
1 Haunted Dead
Other:
3 Conflagerate
4 Faithless Looting
1 Darkblast
4 Cathartic Reunion
3 Life from the Loam
3 Collective Brutality
2 Lightning Axe
2 Ancient Grudge
2 Abrupt Decay
3 Duress
2 Darkblast
1 Gnaw to the Bone
Modern Dredge
Budget Dredge
Mardu Pyromancer
Belcher
You made the correct choice to mull. Just because you didnt get a great 6 or 5 doesnt mean that you shouldnt have mulled, it was still the correct choice. In poker you make the choice that is most likely to happen, just because the card didnt flip right on the river doesnt mean you made the wrong choice, it just means that you werent lucky. I am going to use fake numbers here for the sake of the argument but if mulling will give you a better hand 70% of the time, there will still be 30% of the time when it gets worst but it would not be smart to do the thing that is only correct 30% of the time. I hope that makes sense.
Regarding your deck I would throw the basic swamp in the trash and put back the dakmor salvage. If you don't want to play the dakmor salvage then just take out the swamp and play only 20 lands. I would also take out the basic forest and put back the copperline gorge unless your meta is 50% path decks. Also I would cut to 20 lands (taking out a blackcleave or basic swamp) and add in a finisher like Ivg said. I prefer Driven//Despair, I actually run 2 in the 75 and love it.
Yeah I wouldn't play either. I would probably chuck my deck across the room if I ever drew dakmor salvage and a forest as my opening two lands lmao.
Has anyone been testing Tormenting Voice? I picked a playset from my bulk and I am going to -1 Neonate and -1 Darkblast to make room for 2 just to try it.
Also this has nothing to do with gameplay but I just ordered the 7 foil fetches I need (4 wooded foothills and 3 bloodstained mires) so now I am at 63/75 foil.
Modern Dredge
Budget Dredge
Mardu Pyromancer
Belcher
Im so glad im not the only one who had done this. It's really stunning to have a fully foiled out deck. Life from the loam was the last piece i got. Good luck!
Modern:
EDH:
1- Why is everyone play Tormenting Voice now? I feel like Mom hug> voice, but is there something I'm missing here?
2- Where did this Hollowed Fountain Failure// Comply package come from, and what is it used for? I keep trying to find a snario where I would want to use it, but I cannot think of one and maybe someone here can enlighten me as to why it's being used.
3- Why is everyone dropping Haunted Dead? Is it because Driven// Despair is better w/ Scourge Devil now? Just wondering because I run Dead in the main and a Driven// Despair in the SB.
That's all! Thanks for the help in advance!
1. Devil is uncounterable. It's VERY important vs Shadow decks and Jeskai/UW.
2. By itself deals 4 dmg - rally 0. Rally gives you more damage if you have 5 or more creatures. If we already he so many we should win no matter which pump spell we use. And that 4 dmg can kill from nowhere or pressure Planeswalkers (useful vs Tron with Karn/Ugin and Jace, Architect of Thought).
3. Devil is better if opponent has removal spells in hand to combat our overrun effect. The most important is vs Shadow and Jeskai. it's better to have more creatures wirh less power than less but bigger creatures. Bolt effects will kill anything, push all our regular creatures (but Devil is immune to Push :p) so it's better to force them to kill more stuff.
4. Devil can return Amalgams from graveyard. It's important vs Surgical decks.
5. It's a creature
Pro tip - when opponent is at 10 our Bloodghasts gain haste. 2 Ghasts + devil is exectly 10. It's uncounterable way to deal lehtla dmg out from nowhere.
Of course Rally also have some pluses:
1. It's on instant speed so we can force opponent to make bad blocks becouse Rally is fear.
2. Instant speed effect is useful vs Lantern. For example with bridge in play and 1 card in opponent's hand we can attack with Narcomoebas and hardcasted dredges and after declaring attackers we can pump and attack for much more.
3. In lategame with 6 mana we can give our creatures +4+0. hardcast than flashback. Personally did it once, as classic win more ;p
After more than 1000 mathces on MTGO with 65% win ratio I can safely say that Devil is the best "combat trick card" in Dredge. Haunted Dead, Rally the Peasants or even Driven//Despair - they all have some advantages and disadvantages but overall Devil many times showed me that he deserves his slot.