I've been lurking on this thread for a while now and finally decided to sign up to reply to your post.
I think your thought process behind not "midranging hard enough" in relation to expedition maps/shambling vents is spot on. I never really thought of it so succinctly till i read your post, so thanks for the clarity.
The only thing i disagree with is on the creatures you've actually chosen, I may be wrong though, i haven't received my oath cards yet so i haven't tested properly.
I will say though i fully expect i may cut Kozilek, the Great Distortion and Eldrazi Displacer but i do want to test them. Kozilek especially using the "not midranging hard enough" philosophy
I don't like the Displacer all that much anymore personally. He was great but we got too many other great things. Also for midranging the hardest.. Reality Smasher is fantastic. Even at a full 5 drop he is still a very good creature. I think I may run 1 Kozilek as well in testing. In grindy control matchups, I could see tutoring for him just to refill your hand even if he gets countered. He will always be my second tutor most likely though. You tutor for Newlamog to try and win, they have an answer. You tutor next for Kozilek and refill your hand. If they have an answer for it fine, you probably drew into gas to close out the game. It's an interesting idea for sure.
Hi!
I've been playing Magic since Stronghold. Long story short: I left Legacy a year ago selling all my cards, but some months ago I get trapped by modern. I have an affinity deck and luckily, I've purchased all the expensive cards for this deck before the price explosion and have been testing this deck for some time.
I've read all this thread, good job guys! I've recycled my old account here to finaly post and contribute to the thread.
On topic: I've been trying some versions of this deck (MonoB, Heartless, B/W) and I believe, this is the best of all of them. Path to exile and Lingering souls are great additions to this deck.
I have been making changes to my deck and my last iteration is this one:
The All is Dust is my flex spot. I'm thinking in changing it for an Oblivion Ring, bur AiD comes in handy sometimes. And the SB is not decided yet, but I'm very happy with the rest of the numbers. They have been doing well in testing.
When I get my OGW cards I will be trying it in real tournaments... I can't wait!
Interesting lower to the ground version. I am personally on the fence about it though. There are some decks who will just ignore it and you get no value from it (Infect as an example). I seriously recommend Reality Smasher as a 2-3x and if you go with 2, put the extra into Blight Herder. Most games I win by going as WIDE as possible. This will change if folks start running more actual board clears, at which point Matter Reshapers are totally the go to.
My question about Oblivion Ring is what do you want it for? We have creatures well covered with Path, stranglers and other black removal. Not many people play main deck enchantments, and there are some artifacts we could stand to remove game 1, but I feel it is very specific for decks like Tron and affinity. Planeswalkers may be of concern, but really the only ones we really see are Liliana of the Veil, Karn Liberated and Ugin, the Spirit Dragon. Liliana is combated well through lingering souls, herders and smashers (if you play them). The other 2 are in one of our hardest matchups, which if we survive to go past turn 3, if they play the walker we are already behind.
I like All is Dust much more because creature heavy builds in Zoo, Abzan Company, Kiki-Chord, BW Tokens and fish are problematic when they go wide. They are not uncommon decks at all, and having some way to combat them is important.
Interesting lower to the ground version. I am personally on the fence about it though. There are some decks who will just ignore it and you get no value from it (Infect as an example). I seriously recommend Reality Smasher as a 2-3x and if you go with 2, put the extra into Blight Herder. Most games I win by going as WIDE as possible. This will change if folks start running more actual board clears, at which point Matter Reshapers are totally the go to.
I second this point on the Smashers. I don't think we want a bunch of them, but a big hasty creature is great defense against opposing walkers and can do some surprise close out. In addition when things get to top deck mode, the smasher is almost impossible to kill with out wasting turns. Going wide with heard will close out a lot of games, and it pair so deliciously well with Vault of the Archangel that I doubt I will ever go less than 4 in my deck. Actually won a game today because people swung into my Herder and 3 tokens with a 2/1, 4/4 scooze and 5/6 goyf, but forgot that I can sac my tokens for mana to activate the Vault. Needless to say I 3 for 1'd him and gained a bunch of life.
For me the 1 All is Dust is the minor cost it takes to run it as a 1 of but the MASSIVE gains you can get from a 1 sided boardsweeper for 5 mana. I totally agree on Oblivion Ring. I am also pretty against anything we use that exiles but gives them the card back if they have the answer for it. This is why I like TKS. It gives them a card back but it's a random one off the top. Late game it just becomes a 4/4 beater which is all you need at that point. Unlike Tidehollow and O-ring, it also sits at this perfect place as a bolt-proof, AD proof, Inquisition proof thing as well. 4 power is also a magical number because when you go from trying to kill someone for 20 (which doesn't always happen in Modern) 3 power gets you there in 7 turns, 4 power gets you there in 5 turns, 5 gets you there in 4, as does 6. That 3 power to 4 power turn gap is a HUGE difference in a competitive game.
For me the 1 All is Dust is the minor cost it takes to run it as a 1 of but the MASSIVE gains you can get from a 1 sided boardsweeper for 5 mana. I totally agree on Oblivion Ring. I am also pretty against anything we use that exiles but gives them the card back if they have the answer for it. This is why I like TKS. It gives them a card back but it's a random one off the top. Late game it just becomes a 4/4 beater which is all you need at that point. Unlike Tidehollow and O-ring, it also sits at this perfect place as a bolt-proof, AD proof, Inquisition proof thing as well. 4 power is also a magical number because when you go from trying to kill someone for 20 (which doesn't always happen in Modern) 3 power gets you there in 7 turns, 4 power gets you there in 5 turns, 5 gets you there in 4, as does 6. That 3 power to 4 power turn gap is a HUGE difference in a competitive game.
Totally agree. All is Dust has just flat out won games I should have lost. It is a silver bullet that I want in my deck.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Current Decks
Modern
No idea because my favorite decks keep getting banned or having the rules changed against them
Is there any merit in running 2 All is Dust? What decks would a second copy in the SB come in against?
All the matchups you bring in Languish/Damnation against. They are better because they are cheaper and consistent for turn 4. I think the opportunity cost isn't worth running 2.
Is there any merit in running 2 All is Dust? What decks would a second copy in the SB come in against?
You want board wipes vs.
Boggles (EDIT: Forgot this one)
Small Zoo
Big Zoo
Kiki-Chord
Merfolk
Abzan Collected Company (Persist Combo)
Elves
Infect...I mean if you're not dead yet, and you didn't have the spot removal. Affinity...but All is Dust is just the worst card in the deck vs. them. Junk/Abzan/Jund. Technically board wipes are good here, but we're already at a good matchup there. Plus, manlands are pretty big threats so you rely on your GQ's. Delver? I've played against this deck way more now that Twin's gone. Board Wipes are too slow vs. Delver generally, but sometimes they use Young Pyromancer...so you need a wipe. The delver matchup is quite difficult. They play blood moons, molten rain, & Crumble to Dust in main/side. They can keep countering our removal/stranglers. They can bolt 1/2 Lingering souls so your block isn't lethal.
Is there any merit in running 2 All is Dust? What decks would a second copy in the SB come in against?
You want board wipes vs.
Small Zoo
Big Zoo
Kiki-Chord
Merfolk
Abzan Collected Company (Persist Combo)
Elves
Infect...I mean if you're not dead yet, and you didn't have the spot removal. Affinity...but All is Dust is just the worst card in the deck vs. them. Junk/Abzan/Jund. Technically board wipes are good here, but we're already at a good matchup there. Plus, manlands are pretty big threats so you rely on your GQ's. Delver? I've played against this deck way more now that Twin's gone. Board Wipes are too slow vs. Delver generally, but sometimes they use Young Pyromancer...so you need a wipe. The delver matchup is quite difficult. They play blood moons, molten rain, & Crumble to Dust in main/side. They can keep countering our removal/stranglers. They can bolt 1/2 Lingering souls so your block isn't lethal.
All is Dust is the one you want against Boggles in particular. Clears their board completely. No Totem Armor triggers for you!
Is there any merit in running 2 All is Dust? What decks would a second copy in the SB come in against?
All the matchups you bring in Languish/Damnation against. They are better because they are cheaper and consistent for turn 4. I think the opportunity cost isn't worth running 2.
Not true. You certainly want languish/damnation against affinity, but All is Dust is ***** there. Its actually why Ive moved away from it. Great card, but the deck I want a sweeper against most is affinity, and its just not good there.
Questionable cuts would be one hand disruption spell for a 3rd Lingering Souls. 1 Blight Herder for a Lingering Souls/Relic/25th Land.
Kozilek is a pet card could easily be a 2nd Tendrils
There may need to be another white source in the deck, but I want to be able to cast all my spells through a blood moon so I had to keep a wastes in. Sea Gate Wreckage may prove to be a bust and could become a plains. I only justify running one less white then I would like because I still play with 3 maps.
Interesting lower to the ground version. I am personally on the fence about it though. There are some decks who will just ignore it and you get no value from it (Infect as an example). I seriously recommend Reality Smasher as a 2-3x and if you go with 2, put the extra into Blight Herder. Most games I win by going as WIDE as possible. This will change if folks start running more actual board clears, at which point Matter Reshapers are totally the go to.
I don't like having so much high cost Eldrazis, that's the reason I dropped the Sowers and Herders to 3 each. When I played 4 of them, I got some games with the hand full of expensive cards that I couldn't play. And I think Herders and Sowers are better than the Smasher.
I agree but that is why I am dropping to a 2-4 split for Sowers to Herders. 5 drops are fine in this deck and I have never found them to be "too expensive". Sower has been sorta awkward at times and I'd like to draw less of them. Where my reasoning takes me from the 4/4 list I'm already running is that 4 Herders are fantastic, but #3-4 Sowers are not as good as #1-2 Reality Smasher. He isn't as good but his utility of being a haster cannot be underestimated.
Is there any merit in running 2 All is Dust? What decks would a second copy in the SB come in against?
All the matchups you bring in Languish/Damnation against. They are better because they are cheaper and consistent for turn 4. I think the opportunity cost isn't worth running 2.
Not true. You certainly want languish/damnation against affinity, but All is Dust is ***** there. Its actually why Ive moved away from it. Great card, but the deck I want a sweeper against most is affinity, and its just not good there.
Yeah in that 1 matchup its awful and gets sideboarded out. I am saying typically if you are WANTING to bring in another All is Dust, a Damnation/Languish is just slightly better. It also lets us hit affinity but to be honest... I haven't had a problem with Affinity. Lingering Souls blocks fliers, Colorless Midrange dudes block Etched champion and MB Ghost Quarters kill lands. Usually the match leads to the point I can either stall out til I get an answer for their board (sweep or Stony Silence or Newlamog) or I go wide enough that it doesn't matter (Have so many dudes that Vault of the Archangel gains me more life than they can deal and if they block, we trade. Matchups where I want board sweepers the most are Merfolk, Zoo and Elves.
I've also updated my list. This is more traditional list we're used to, but I'm lowering the number of Sowers.
With midrange almost gone, and Delver/Kiki-Chord/Abzan Coco as the only things I've honestly seen come take its place, Sower is needed less as a ground blocker and Newlamog-mana generator.
Sower is a card that makes me mulligan in this already (somewhat) inconsistent deck. Using cards like Map/Relic/Claws you're spending your turns setting up, but you don't affect the board.
Blight Herder is still the best card to me, and I want to rely on consistently processing for him to win the game.
Lingering Souls is the other best card.
I win most my games with those 2 cards, and way less of tutoring/casting Ulamog.
This format has certainly sped up (post bans/OGW) and I've been accommodating to keep up with it...Valuing early removal and faster more consistent plays.
Living the Turn 3/4 Sower dream isn't something I care much about now. For me, this has simply become my new Abzan grindy deck.
Sure it lacks card advantage or many manlands, but it attacks from a lot of angles, many 2-for-1's, & has game against combo & aggro. The innevitable Ulamog doesn't hurt too much except when you draw him.
I've started seeing more and more Delver decks, and they just get free wins if your hand is even slightly clunky.
They also get free wins from Blood Moon.
Kiki-Chord decks also have a Magus of the Moon they're tutoring for now. Yeah you can kill it, but there's are all reasons I've started pushing the manabase towards Fetchlands.
Trying out the 1 Tendo Ice Bridge over 1 Caves of Koilos, as I think it will pretty often be enabled by Urborg to keep its counter, and I really value the life Caves of Koilos gives away.
Seems like some others are starting to see the value in Matter Reshaper.
I'm really starting to like him.
I went down -1 Bojuka Bog. It's got nice utility and has enabled some plays but added +1 Scrabbling Claws to accomodate for processing.
No mainboard Sweepers for me. If I fell that far behind, I don't want to rely on drawing an expensive 7 drop (even if it's more like a 4/5/6 cost) to recover. If I fell behind it's probably because my hand is filled with Sowers/Ulamog/Non-process Blight Herders.
Somebody else mentioned trying Oblivion Ring and I honestly support it. It's just a universal removal spell that kill random Blood Moon/creatures/Ensnaring Bridge.
I would really like to get a consistent sideboarding guide going. Everyone's running slightly different 75's, that's cool, but our sideboards are similar and I'm always curious when to side in wierd cards like Surgical, or how many disenchants/stony silence and what do you take it more importantly?
I've also updated my list. This is more traditional list we're used to, but I'm lowering the number of Sowers.
With midrange almost gone, and Delver/Kiki-Chord/Abzan Coco as the only things I've honestly seen come take its place, Sower is needed less as a ground blocker and Newlamog-mana generator.
Sower is a card that makes me mulligan in this already (somewhat) inconsistent deck. Using cards like Map/Relic/Claws you're spending your turns setting up, but you don't affect the board.
Blight Herder is still the best card to me, and I want to rely on consistently processing for him to win the game.
Lingering Souls is the other best card.
I win most my games with those 2 cards, and way less of tutoring/casting Ulamog.
This format has certainly sped up (post bans/OGW) and I've been accommodating to keep up with it...Valuing early removal and faster more consistent plays.
Living the Turn 3/4 Sower dream isn't something I care much about now. For me, this has simply become my new Abzan grindy deck.
Sure it lacks card advantage or many manlands, but it attacks from a lot of angles, many 2-for-1's, & has game against combo & aggro. The innevitable Ulamog doesn't hurt too much except when you draw him.
I've started seeing more and more Delver decks, and they just get free wins if your hand is even slightly clunky.
They also get free wins from Blood Moon.
Kiki-Chord decks also have a Magus of the Moon they're tutoring for now. Yeah you can kill it, but there's are all reasons I've started pushing the manabase towards Fetchlands.
Trying out the 1 Tendo Ice Bridge over 1 Caves of Koilos, as I think it will pretty often be enabled by Urborg to keep its counter, and I really value the life Caves of Koilos gives away.
Seems like some others are starting to see the value in Matter Reshaper.
I'm really starting to like him.
I went down -1 Bojuka Bog. It's got nice utility and has enabled some plays but added +1 Scrabbling Claws to accomodate for processing.
No mainboard Sweepers for me. If I fell that far behind, I don't want to rely on drawing an expensive 7 drop (even if it's more like a 4/5/6 cost) to recover. If I fell behind it's probably because my hand is filled with Sowers/Ulamog/Non-process Blight Herders.
Somebody else mentioned trying Oblivion Ring and I honestly support it. It's just a universal removal spell that kill random Blood Moon/creatures/Ensnaring Bridge.
I would really like to get a consistent sideboarding guide going. Everyone's running slightly different 75's, that's cool, but our sideboards are similar and I'm always curious when to side in wierd cards like Surgical, or how many disenchants/stony silence and what do you take it more importantly?
When I first assembled the deck, someone had posted a fantastic sideboarding guide that I still use as a reference. It's usually not a problem of what to bring in but more what to take out. I will try and find it and link it sometime tomorrow. Totally with you that Herder is the best card. It attacks from pretty much all angles and it's my primary reason for exiling cards. With TKS coming in, I think you can do without the Claws. I also don't think you need Slaughter Pact anymore. I removed mine because there were times when it wasn't needed (paying the 3 mana hurt the next turn more than just another kill spell) and the only matchup it was fantastic in was Twin (because they think they'd be safe when you tapped out). I'd recommend 2 Reality Smashers. They can come down early enough against aggroish decks and because of their haste, they help you close the game out faster. Otherwise I think your list is pretty solid.
Initially I wasn't a fan of Flaying Tendrils either but I have a feeling GW Hatebear lists are going to start cropping up since they don't seem awfully placed against some of the other decks. Voice and Finks can be annoying humps to jump over and it gives us a slightly cheaper pseudo clear for elves which helps (requiring them to have 2 lords out for it to be useless). Best yet is the exile clause which fuels exile as well for Blight Herders to come in on Turn 4 and start putting in the work. Only downside will be for those of you running Matter Reshaper as well.
I haven't had a problem with Affinity. Lingering Souls blocks fliers, Colorless Midrange dudes block Etched champion and MB Ghost Quarters kill lands. Usually the match leads to the point I can either stall out til I get an answer for their board (sweep or Stony Silence or Newlamog) or I go wide enough that it doesn't matter (Have so many dudes that Vault of the Archangel gains me more life than they can deal and if they block, we trade. Matchups where I want board sweepers the most are Merfolk, Zoo and Elves.
This exactly mirrors my own experience and opinion.
I would really like to get a consistent sideboarding guide going. Everyone's running slightly different 75's, that's cool, but our sideboards are similar and I'm always curious when to side in wierd cards like Surgical, or how many disenchants/stony silence and what do you take it more importantly?
There are match ups I don't even board against, like say UWR Geist. Here are the matchups I've encountered where I am really looking to see my sideboard cards: Zoo (esp. 1-drop), Merfolk, Elves, Burn, Tron, Scapeshift, Lantern Control, and Affinity, though Affinity feels by far the easiest of these.
So what I need are sweepers, life gain, land destruction, and combo/linchpin card removal.
So here's my deck and sideboard. I only wish I could get more lifegain in the list.
Against fast aggro: IN 4 sweepers, possibly 1-2 lifegain, still experimenting with that. OUT 3 Sowers, Ulamog, possibly my one maindeck Map and Extraction. Looking to sweep/remove as many threats as possible. Sweepers are the key cards.
Against Burn: IN 3 lifegain, 2 EE (for Guide/Swiftspear) OUT 3 Sowers, Ulamog, Extraction. Looking to gain life before dying here. Hard even after board. Rest is the key card.
Against Tron: IN 3 Extraction, 1 Map, 2 Stony. OUT 2 Go for the Throat, 2 Claws, 2 Strangler. There is an anti-synergy with Stony and Map/Relic that can be a problem. Trying to destroy lands with Map-->GQ or take Karn/Stirrings etc. with hand disruption, and either way Extract it to shut down that part of their plan. GQ-->Extraction is the key play.
Against Scapeshift: IN 3 Extraction, 1 Map, 3 Rest for the Weary. OUT targeted removal (Path, GftT), 1 IoK. Looking to steal/destroy and then Extract either Valakut or Scapeshift itself. Also can Extract Steam Vents or Stomping Ground, which leaves them no room for error.
Against Lantern Control: IN 2 Disenchant, 2 Stony, 3 Extraction. OUT targeted removal, 1 Sower. Extracting Ensnaring Bridge is the ideal play here. Stony is anti-synergistic with many cards.
Affinity is an easy IN: 2 Disenchant, 2 Stony, 4 sweepers. OUT: Ulamog, 3 Sower, 2 Claws, 2 GftT. Could maybe add some number of Rest for some number of Relic. Sweepers are great, but Stony is the bomb. Lingering Souls are also what I want to see. Again there is an anti-synergy with Stony and EE/Map/Relic; if I land Stony then that is a lot of dead cards.
That is how I roll. If anyone sees areas for improvement I am all ears. Siding well is challenging for me.
We can also use Infinite Obliteration as a SB card, never saw a comment on it.
There's better cards like Memoricide / Cranial Extraction that do more than Infinite Obliteration, and only require a single black to cast. Infinite Obliteration only hits creatures and that's a big problem in modern. For most decks that you want a Memoricide type effect, you are targetting something other than creatures, such as Scapeshift or Ad Nauseum.
How are people justifying 1-offs in the SB? It's not like we have ways to cantrip or filter, so what's the point of playing 1 copy of a narrow card that you may not ever see?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
I don't like the Displacer all that much anymore personally. He was great but we got too many other great things. Also for midranging the hardest.. Reality Smasher is fantastic. Even at a full 5 drop he is still a very good creature. I think I may run 1 Kozilek as well in testing. In grindy control matchups, I could see tutoring for him just to refill your hand even if he gets countered. He will always be my second tutor most likely though. You tutor for Newlamog to try and win, they have an answer. You tutor next for Kozilek and refill your hand. If they have an answer for it fine, you probably drew into gas to close out the game. It's an interesting idea for sure.
4 Dryad Militant
4 Tidehollow Sculler
4 Matter Reshaper
4 Wasteland Strangler
4 Flickerwisp
3 Kitchen Finks
3 Blight Herder
4 AEther Vial
4 Thoughtseize
4 Path to exile
Lands (22):
4 Caves of Koilos
4 Godless Shrine
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Fetid Heath
1 Shambling Vent
1 Vault of the Archangel
2 plains
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
Just a rough draft here.. But maybe there is some merit to the combo of temporary exiles along side processors?
Draft My Cube!
Interesting lower to the ground version. I am personally on the fence about it though. There are some decks who will just ignore it and you get no value from it (Infect as an example). I seriously recommend Reality Smasher as a 2-3x and if you go with 2, put the extra into Blight Herder. Most games I win by going as WIDE as possible. This will change if folks start running more actual board clears, at which point Matter Reshapers are totally the go to.
I like All is Dust much more because creature heavy builds in Zoo, Abzan Company, Kiki-Chord, BW Tokens and fish are problematic when they go wide. They are not uncommon decks at all, and having some way to combat them is important.
I second this point on the Smashers. I don't think we want a bunch of them, but a big hasty creature is great defense against opposing walkers and can do some surprise close out. In addition when things get to top deck mode, the smasher is almost impossible to kill with out wasting turns. Going wide with heard will close out a lot of games, and it pair so deliciously well with Vault of the Archangel that I doubt I will ever go less than 4 in my deck. Actually won a game today because people swung into my Herder and 3 tokens with a 2/1, 4/4 scooze and 5/6 goyf, but forgot that I can sac my tokens for mana to activate the Vault. Needless to say I 3 for 1'd him and gained a bunch of life.
Totally agree. All is Dust has just flat out won games I should have lost. It is a silver bullet that I want in my deck.
All the matchups you bring in Languish/Damnation against. They are better because they are cheaper and consistent for turn 4. I think the opportunity cost isn't worth running 2.
You want board wipes vs.
Boggles (EDIT: Forgot this one)
Small Zoo
Big Zoo
Kiki-Chord
Merfolk
Abzan Collected Company (Persist Combo)
Elves
Infect...I mean if you're not dead yet, and you didn't have the spot removal.
Affinity...but All is Dust is just the worst card in the deck vs. them.
Junk/Abzan/Jund. Technically board wipes are good here, but we're already at a good matchup there. Plus, manlands are pretty big threats so you rely on your GQ's.
Delver? I've played against this deck way more now that Twin's gone. Board Wipes are too slow vs. Delver generally, but sometimes they use Young Pyromancer...so you need a wipe. The delver matchup is quite difficult. They play blood moons, molten rain, & Crumble to Dust in main/side. They can keep countering our removal/stranglers. They can bolt 1/2 Lingering souls so your block isn't lethal.
All is Dust is the one you want against Boggles in particular. Clears their board completely. No Totem Armor triggers for you!
Not true. You certainly want languish/damnation against affinity, but All is Dust is ***** there. Its actually why Ive moved away from it. Great card, but the deck I want a sweeper against most is affinity, and its just not good there.
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Caves of Koilos
3 Eye of Ugin
2 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
2 Godless Shrine
1 Marsh Flats
1 Fetid Heath
1 Plains
2 Swamp
1 Wastes
2 Ghost Quarter
1 Sea Gate Wreckage
3 Matter Reshaper
3 Thought-Knot Seer
4 Blight Herder
3 Oblivion Sower
2 Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
Planeswalker: 2
2 Liliana of the Veil
Artifact: 6
3 Relic of Progenitus
3 Expedition Map
Instant: 6
2 Warping Wail
4 Path To Exile
Sorcery: 7
2 Thoughtseize
3 Inquisition of Kozilek
2 Lingering Souls
1 Pithing Needle
2 Duress
1 Disfigure
2 Disenchant
2 Lingering Souls
1 Vault of The Archangel
1 Spellskite
1 Liliana of the Veil
2 Memoricide
1 Flaying Tendrils
1 Kozilek, The Great Distortion
What I am playing for Black/white version
Questionable cuts would be one hand disruption spell for a 3rd Lingering Souls. 1 Blight Herder for a Lingering Souls/Relic/25th Land.
Kozilek is a pet card could easily be a 2nd Tendrils
There may need to be another white source in the deck, but I want to be able to cast all my spells through a blood moon so I had to keep a wastes in. Sea Gate Wreckage may prove to be a bust and could become a plains. I only justify running one less white then I would like because I still play with 3 maps.
I agree but that is why I am dropping to a 2-4 split for Sowers to Herders. 5 drops are fine in this deck and I have never found them to be "too expensive". Sower has been sorta awkward at times and I'd like to draw less of them. Where my reasoning takes me from the 4/4 list I'm already running is that 4 Herders are fantastic, but #3-4 Sowers are not as good as #1-2 Reality Smasher. He isn't as good but his utility of being a haster cannot be underestimated.
Yeah in that 1 matchup its awful and gets sideboarded out. I am saying typically if you are WANTING to bring in another All is Dust, a Damnation/Languish is just slightly better. It also lets us hit affinity but to be honest... I haven't had a problem with Affinity. Lingering Souls blocks fliers, Colorless Midrange dudes block Etched champion and MB Ghost Quarters kill lands. Usually the match leads to the point I can either stall out til I get an answer for their board (sweep or Stony Silence or Newlamog) or I go wide enough that it doesn't matter (Have so many dudes that Vault of the Archangel gains me more life than they can deal and if they block, we trade. Matchups where I want board sweepers the most are Merfolk, Zoo and Elves.
With midrange almost gone, and Delver/Kiki-Chord/Abzan Coco as the only things I've honestly seen come take its place, Sower is needed less as a ground blocker and Newlamog-mana generator.
Sower is a card that makes me mulligan in this already (somewhat) inconsistent deck. Using cards like Map/Relic/Claws you're spending your turns setting up, but you don't affect the board.
Blight Herder is still the best card to me, and I want to rely on consistently processing for him to win the game.
Lingering Souls is the other best card.
I win most my games with those 2 cards, and way less of tutoring/casting Ulamog.
This format has certainly sped up (post bans/OGW) and I've been accommodating to keep up with it...Valuing early removal and faster more consistent plays.
Living the Turn 3/4 Sower dream isn't something I care much about now. For me, this has simply become my new Abzan grindy deck.
Sure it lacks card advantage or many manlands, but it attacks from a lot of angles, many 2-for-1's, & has game against combo & aggro. The innevitable Ulamog doesn't hurt too much except when you draw him.
I've started seeing more and more Delver decks, and they just get free wins if your hand is even slightly clunky.
They also get free wins from Blood Moon.
Kiki-Chord decks also have a Magus of the Moon they're tutoring for now. Yeah you can kill it, but there's are all reasons I've started pushing the manabase towards Fetchlands.
4x Blight Herder
2x Matter Reshaper
2x Oblivion Sower
3x Thought-Knot Seer
1x Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
4x Wasteland Strangler
Instant (5)
4x Path to Exile
1x Slaughter Pact
Sorcery (8)
3x Inquisition of Kozilek
4x Lingering Souls
1x Thoughtseize
Artifact (7)
2x Expedition Map
4x Relic of Progenitus
1x Scrabbling Claws
3x Caves of Koilos
4x Eldrazi Temple
2x Eye of Ugin
2x Ghost Quarter
2x Godless Shrine
3x Marsh Flats
2x Plains
1x Shambling Vent
1x Swamp
1x Tendo Ice Bridge
2x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1x Vault of the Archangel
2x Disenchant
1x Dismember
1x Duress
1x Ghost Quarter
2x Languish
1x Memoricide
2x Stony Silence
2x Surgical Extraction
3x Timely Reinforcements
Trying out the 1 Tendo Ice Bridge over 1 Caves of Koilos, as I think it will pretty often be enabled by Urborg to keep its counter, and I really value the life Caves of Koilos gives away.
Seems like some others are starting to see the value in Matter Reshaper.
I'm really starting to like him.
I went down -1 Bojuka Bog. It's got nice utility and has enabled some plays but added +1 Scrabbling Claws to accomodate for processing.
No mainboard Sweepers for me. If I fell that far behind, I don't want to rely on drawing an expensive 7 drop (even if it's more like a 4/5/6 cost) to recover. If I fell behind it's probably because my hand is filled with Sowers/Ulamog/Non-process Blight Herders.
Somebody else mentioned trying Oblivion Ring and I honestly support it. It's just a universal removal spell that kill random Blood Moon/creatures/Ensnaring Bridge.
I would really like to get a consistent sideboarding guide going. Everyone's running slightly different 75's, that's cool, but our sideboards are similar and I'm always curious when to side in wierd cards like Surgical, or how many disenchants/stony silence and what do you take it more importantly?
When I first assembled the deck, someone had posted a fantastic sideboarding guide that I still use as a reference. It's usually not a problem of what to bring in but more what to take out. I will try and find it and link it sometime tomorrow. Totally with you that Herder is the best card. It attacks from pretty much all angles and it's my primary reason for exiling cards. With TKS coming in, I think you can do without the Claws. I also don't think you need Slaughter Pact anymore. I removed mine because there were times when it wasn't needed (paying the 3 mana hurt the next turn more than just another kill spell) and the only matchup it was fantastic in was Twin (because they think they'd be safe when you tapped out). I'd recommend 2 Reality Smashers. They can come down early enough against aggroish decks and because of their haste, they help you close the game out faster. Otherwise I think your list is pretty solid.
Initially I wasn't a fan of Flaying Tendrils either but I have a feeling GW Hatebear lists are going to start cropping up since they don't seem awfully placed against some of the other decks. Voice and Finks can be annoying humps to jump over and it gives us a slightly cheaper pseudo clear for elves which helps (requiring them to have 2 lords out for it to be useless). Best yet is the exile clause which fuels exile as well for Blight Herders to come in on Turn 4 and start putting in the work. Only downside will be for those of you running Matter Reshaper as well.
GXTronGX
RWxBurnRWx
There are match ups I don't even board against, like say UWR Geist. Here are the matchups I've encountered where I am really looking to see my sideboard cards: Zoo (esp. 1-drop), Merfolk, Elves, Burn, Tron, Scapeshift, Lantern Control, and Affinity, though Affinity feels by far the easiest of these.
So what I need are sweepers, life gain, land destruction, and combo/linchpin card removal.
So here's my deck and sideboard. I only wish I could get more lifegain in the list.
4x Caves of Koilos
4x Eldrazi Temple
2x Eye of Ugin
1x Fetid Heath
2x Ghost Quarter
2x Godless Shrine
3x Marsh Flats
2x Plains
1x Swamp
2x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1x Vault of the Archangel
Creature (13)
4x Blight Herder
3x Oblivion Sower
2x Spellskite
1x Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
3x Wasteland Strangler
2x Go for the Throat
4x Path to Exile
1x Surgical Extraction
Sorcery (9)
2x Inquisition of Kozilek
4x Lingering Souls
3x Thoughtseize
Artifact (7)
1x Expedition Map
4x Relic of Progenitus
2x Scrabbling Claws
2x Damnation
2x Disenchant
2x Engineered Explosives
1x Expedition Map
3x Rest for the Weary
2x Stony Silence
3x Surgical Extraction
Against Burn: IN 3 lifegain, 2 EE (for Guide/Swiftspear) OUT 3 Sowers, Ulamog, Extraction. Looking to gain life before dying here. Hard even after board. Rest is the key card.
Against Tron: IN 3 Extraction, 1 Map, 2 Stony. OUT 2 Go for the Throat, 2 Claws, 2 Strangler. There is an anti-synergy with Stony and Map/Relic that can be a problem. Trying to destroy lands with Map-->GQ or take Karn/Stirrings etc. with hand disruption, and either way Extract it to shut down that part of their plan. GQ-->Extraction is the key play.
Against Scapeshift: IN 3 Extraction, 1 Map, 3 Rest for the Weary. OUT targeted removal (Path, GftT), 1 IoK. Looking to steal/destroy and then Extract either Valakut or Scapeshift itself. Also can Extract Steam Vents or Stomping Ground, which leaves them no room for error.
Against Lantern Control: IN 2 Disenchant, 2 Stony, 3 Extraction. OUT targeted removal, 1 Sower. Extracting Ensnaring Bridge is the ideal play here. Stony is anti-synergistic with many cards.
Affinity is an easy IN: 2 Disenchant, 2 Stony, 4 sweepers. OUT: Ulamog, 3 Sower, 2 Claws, 2 GftT. Could maybe add some number of Rest for some number of Relic. Sweepers are great, but Stony is the bomb. Lingering Souls are also what I want to see. Again there is an anti-synergy with Stony and EE/Map/Relic; if I land Stony then that is a lot of dead cards.
That is how I roll. If anyone sees areas for improvement I am all ears. Siding well is challenging for me.
There's better cards like Memoricide / Cranial Extraction that do more than Infinite Obliteration, and only require a single black to cast. Infinite Obliteration only hits creatures and that's a big problem in modern. For most decks that you want a Memoricide type effect, you are targetting something other than creatures, such as Scapeshift or Ad Nauseum.
EDH: Rakdos, Lord of Riots