Anything y'all would change? Celestial Purge is more or less a 4th Path AND 2nd Pulse. Spellskite in the side comes in win I want to protect hate pieces, but can become irrelevant if overloaded.
@EpicLevelCommoner I'd rather have Walking ballista instead of Rhonas, as in my LGS affinity and burn used to be overplayed. I used to play it so I had a better match against grixis DS, but I find the match slightly favored even without it (I could be missreading the signs, though). At last, the only difference besides Ballista for Rhonas is that I now use 2 Renegade Rallier's instead of yours Flickerwisp + Qasali Pridemage.
I trained against a friend of mine yesterday, and he managed to EOT echoing truth my Eidolon of Rhetoric and then combo, twice. He is also using 4 copies of Remand, which makes me think that both Ad Nauseam and Storm have a much easier time comboing, while our strenght reins in our versatility.
What should the sideboard plan against Storm, Ad Nauseam and Titanshift be? ... I need help.
I went for Naya with a Tomb to splash Seer and Pulse from the SB. I chose to run 2 Nihil Spellbombs because it serves two purposes, against Dredge its an efficient 1 mana GY hoser since the MU is not about value and vs UW/ Grixis DS for example I have the option to pay the black for value. Before going into the tournament I tried to fit in an Ethersworn Canonist but decided I had no space and would highly likely only need it 1-2 matches throughout the tournament. I did not face a single grindy MU and only 1 Bant Eldrazi, had I known this beforehand the Canonist would surely replace either Tracker or the Magus.
The Knights were actually a last minute addition, I decided that, since I was running a 1 of Gavony due to its insane sinergy with Finks, I'd try them out as a 2-of MD in the Trial over the 4th Finks, and they seriously overperformed.
@EpicLevelCommoner
Iirc Yixlid Jailer does not stop PiF since the cards gain Flashback afterwards. Same thing goes for Snapcaster v Yixlid Jailer, not that boarding him in v Snapcaster decks is a good idea
Iirc Yixlid Jailer does not stop PiF since the cards gain Flashback afterwards. Same thing goes for Snapcaster v Yixlid Jailer, not that boarding him in v Snapcaster decks is a good idea
Not when PiF is cast from the hand, no, but if they cast Gifts Ungiven to tutor for it while Jailer is on the field, you can put it in the yard and it will not have Flashback until they remove Jailer.
@Pokken: 3rd Temple would either be a Shrine or a 2nd Tomb (leaning towards the latter).
What would recommend over Healiana though?
@buda: Don't get me wrong: I prefer Ballista more so than Rhonas, especially since it can suicide itself for Witness shenanigana. However, against non-linear decks I feel Rhonas is a more viable option.
EDIT: Regarding Titanshift and Ad Nauseum, would Aegis of the Gods/True Believer be viable means to not die from Scapeshift/Lightning Storm?
What do you guys think about a single fauna shaman in the deck?
Fauna shaman is one of those cards (in my experience anyway) that you want in large numbers or not at all. It's gross when you can just overload removal and then let it control the game by tutoring over and over again. It's not as good when you chord one up and it dies to bolt immediately and you coulda chorded for Witness like a boss.
I want to use the shaman as a tutor for pieces only, no way im gonna chord for that dude. just a mean to improve consistency against uninteractive decks.
Still quite slow. I'd be playing Eldritch Evolution out of the board for more speed before adding in the Shaman.
Match 1 (1-2): J on Kikki Moon
-Game 1: Early Blood Moon can't stop infinite mana into Rhonas . , .
-Game 2 and 3: . . . but Worship and Linvala can make it sputter long enough for him to get past infinite life Game 2 and grimd me out Game 3. Especially noteworthy is that Noble Hierarch instead of Arbor Elf would have allowed me to cast Flickerwisp on Linvala, providing a window for me to go infinite somehow.
Match 2 (2-0): A on Phenax Mill
-Game 1: Combo out fairly quickly.
-Game 2: Eidolon of Rhetoric rsally bogs the game down against a control list like his, but somehow I manage to swing through Fog Bank for lethal with 7/8 Birds of Paradise (thanks Township Edit: and Rhonas!).
Match 3 (2-0): K on Lantern Control
-Game 1: Combo'd out via Rhonas and flew under the Ensaring Bridge. Of note the opponent had a turn 1 Pithing Needle, but named Ballista instead of Rhonas.
-Game 2: Similar ending; no bridge or needle though.
Match 4 (ID): E on Eldrazi and Taxes
-ID right away but I knew what he was on since he was nearby Match 3.
I was actually thinking of Kikki-Resto for Naya Versions. Unfortunately both pieces are a nonbo with CoCo, and the prohibitive mana cost of Kiki may be difficult to cast without moon effects
http://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=16578&f=MO
Another unusual version of the deck using Nahiri. I like it a lot, except for the 2 magus of the moon. Also the simian spirit guides. I'd like to try nahiri/emrakul but maybe with wall of omen instead of SSG's...
The SSGs and Magus of the Moons are literally the entire point of that build haha. The idea is that Nahiri and Magus sometimes effectively win you the game on T2 if you land them that early, hence SSG -- it's also trying to maximize the deck's ability to combo early. That guy posted a thread about the deck on reddit if you're looking for more info on it.
I've been playing Vizier Company for a few months now at my local FNM events and I've really been enjoying it. Right now it's just a stock list with various chord options that's tuned to my local meta. I'm happy with my results so far (either 2-2 or 3-1 for the last few weeks), but obviously would like those numbers to go up.
Regarding sideboarding- what is the overall game plan- most of the time I pull my chord options (Tireless Tracker, etc) and can replace them in a one of situation (For example Kataki, but other time's I struggle if I have to replace more than four cards. Is it OK to dilute the overall gameplan and go on big beats/silver bullets? Is there ever a time you want to drop Chords/CoCo or early ramp creatures?
I've been playing Vizier Company for a few months now at my local FNM events and I've really been enjoying it. Right now it's just a stock list with various chord options that's tuned to my local meta. I'm happy with my results so far (either 2-2 or 3-1 for the last few weeks), but obviously would like those numbers to go up.
Regarding sideboarding- what is the overall game plan- most of the time I pull my chord options (Tireless Tracker, etc) and can replace them in a one of situation (For example Kataki, but other time's I struggle if I have to replace more than four cards. Is it OK to dilute the overall gameplan and go on big beats/silver bullets? Is there ever a time you want to drop Chords/CoCo or early ramp creatures?
The deck is pretty much a combo with a beat down secondary play. In my list I've jammed as many combos as possible and only side a few Grindy cards. Chord into arbor is probably the only time I'll use it.
I have never sideboarded out a collected company and doubt I would ever recommend it.
I will cut as many as all 4 chords when bringing in non-creature sideboard cards like fiery justice or path. As strong as chord is sometimes it really bites to get blown out by a 1 mana counterspell or have it rot in your hand against burn.
I've been trying to sideboard fewer cards lately in general though. It's super easy to over-sideboard with this deck and wind up with a grip of bricks.
I know this may very well be jank, but talk of Nahiri lists has me thinking of running 1-2 Lightning Mauler in addition to the Kor Planeswalker and the Vizier combo.
Let's put it this way: as long you have two of three 2-drops (Druid, Vizier, Mauler) in hand with appropriate mana open, Nahiri ready to pop for the third, and a way to get your win-con, you win then and there barring no interaction fron your opponent; even with them removing Druid prior to comboing out, Mauler turns each one after that into a hasty instant combo piece.
Shaper's Sanctuary is certainly neat looking. Costs 1 less and the effect is free from then on. The advantages are pretty clear, but I think it has a few more misses than hits.
First of all it doesn't help against sweepers, one of our biggest enemies; Leap even helps against Anger of the Gods. Sanctuary does not give payoffs for blocking unfavorably; paying G to sac your Birds before a Colonnade or Shadow crushes it is generally pretty useful. Leap allows you to dodge exile when an important piece is in jeopardy and you're looking to Witness or Rallier it back. And finally, is "draw a card" really better than "draw a creature"? Look at what the deck does, how it operates, and what it wants to do; "draw a card" can be a land, but "draw a creature" is at worst a blocker.
Don't get me wrong, Sanctuary looks pretty good. Probably great in conjunction with Leap, but I think Leap is still going to be more useful. It certainly has some tempo applications as well, maybe better than Leap vs burn, but I don't see it being a massive staple. I might go 2 Leap, 1 Sanctuary in the board, but I wouldn't go lower than 2 Leap.
I've been toying around and tweaking my list for several weeks now, however, I still feel like the deck is missing something. I was thinking of maybe cutting a basic forest to add either an extra Duskwatch Recruiter, Anafenza, Viscera, or Rhonas.
Good point about the dorks, I think i'll do 21 land and play an extra Duskwatch recruiter to dump my infinite mana into. Maybe also do -1 Vizier and +1 Anafenza. Thoughts?
3 Horizon Canopy
3 Gavony Township
3 Forest
1 Plains
4 Windswept Heath
3 Temple Garden
1 Overgrown Tomb
4 Verdant Catacombs
Creatures (30)
1 Flickerwisp
1 Scavenging Ooze
2 Noble Hierarch
4 Devoted Druid
1 Anafenza, Kin-Tree Spirit
1 Selfless Spirit
2 Duskwatch Recruiter
3 Vizier of Remedies
4 Birds of Paradise
1 Viscera Seer
4 Eternal Witness
4 Kitchen Finks
1 Rhonas the Indomitable
1 Qasali Pridemage
4 Chord of Calling
4 Collected Company
1 Yixlid Jailer
1 Kataki, War's Wage
1 Pharika, God of Affliction
1 Liliana, Heretical Healer
1 Eidolon of Rhetoric
1 Spellskite
2 Sin Collector
2 Stony Silence
3 Path to Exile
1 Celestial Purge
1 Maelstrom Pulse
Anything y'all would change? Celestial Purge is more or less a 4th Path AND 2nd Pulse. Spellskite in the side comes in win I want to protect hate pieces, but can become irrelevant if overloaded.
Avatar and Signature by XenoNinja via Heroes of the Plane Studios
I trained against a friend of mine yesterday, and he managed to EOT echoing truth my Eidolon of Rhetoric and then combo, twice. He is also using 4 copies of Remand, which makes me think that both Ad Nauseam and Storm have a much easier time comboing, while our strenght reins in our versatility.
What should the sideboard plan against Storm, Ad Nauseam and Titanshift be? ... I need help.
Flip Lily seems ambitious with your manabase. Probably should be something else.
Seems fairly likely the third tg should be a shrine but ymmv
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
3 Horizon Canopy
1 Gavony Township
2 Kessig Wolf Run
2 Forest
1 Plains
4 Windswept Heath
2 Temple Garden
1 Overgrown Tomb
4 Wooded Foothills
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Stomping Ground
Creatures 30
4 Birds of Paradise
3 Noble Hierarch
4 Devoted Druid
1 Duskwatch Recruiter
4 Vizier of Remedies
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Viscera Seer
4 Eternal Witness
4 Kitchen Finks
1 Rhonas the Indomitable
1 Selfless Spirit
1 Spellskite
1 Knight of the Reliquary
4 Chord of Calling
4 Collected Company
1 Kataki, War's Wage
2 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Eidolon of Rhetoric
3 Path to Exile
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Magus of the Moon
1 Tireless Tracker
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Reclamation Sage
1 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Eidolon of Rhethoric
I went for Naya with a Tomb to splash Seer and Pulse from the SB. I chose to run 2 Nihil Spellbombs because it serves two purposes, against Dredge its an efficient 1 mana GY hoser since the MU is not about value and vs UW/ Grixis DS for example I have the option to pay the black for value. Before going into the tournament I tried to fit in an Ethersworn Canonist but decided I had no space and would highly likely only need it 1-2 matches throughout the tournament. I did not face a single grindy MU and only 1 Bant Eldrazi, had I known this beforehand the Canonist would surely replace either Tracker or the Magus.
The Knights were actually a last minute addition, I decided that, since I was running a 1 of Gavony due to its insane sinergy with Finks, I'd try them out as a 2-of MD in the Trial over the 4th Finks, and they seriously overperformed.
@EpicLevelCommoner
Iirc Yixlid Jailer does not stop PiF since the cards gain Flashback afterwards. Same thing goes for Snapcaster v Yixlid Jailer, not that boarding him in v Snapcaster decks is a good idea
Not when PiF is cast from the hand, no, but if they cast Gifts Ungiven to tutor for it while Jailer is on the field, you can put it in the yard and it will not have Flashback until they remove Jailer.
@Pokken: 3rd Temple would either be a Shrine or a 2nd Tomb (leaning towards the latter).
What would recommend over Healiana though?
@buda: Don't get me wrong: I prefer Ballista more so than Rhonas, especially since it can suicide itself for Witness shenanigana. However, against non-linear decks I feel Rhonas is a more viable option.
EDIT: Regarding Titanshift and Ad Nauseum, would Aegis of the Gods/True Believer be viable means to not die from Scapeshift/Lightning Storm?
Avatar and Signature by XenoNinja via Heroes of the Plane Studios
If you want it to do the same thing as Lily (card adv.) then I'd suggest Tireless Tracker.
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
Fauna shaman is one of those cards (in my experience anyway) that you want in large numbers or not at all. It's gross when you can just overload removal and then let it control the game by tutoring over and over again. It's not as good when you chord one up and it dies to bolt immediately and you coulda chorded for Witness like a boss.
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
MTGO/MTGA: Tyclone
My Primers ~ GWx Vizier Company ~ Knightfall ~ RG Eldrazi ~ Green's Sun's Zenith
More Brews ~ Modern Four Horsemen ~ Gitrog Dredge
4 Birds of Paradise
2 Arbor Elf
4 Devoted Druid
3 Vizier of Remedies
2 Duskwatch Recruiter
1 Rhonas, the Indomitable
4 Kitchen Finks
1 Viscera Seer
1 Anafenza, Kin-Tree Spirit
4 Eternal Witness
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Selfless Spirit
1 Flickerwisp
4 Collected Company
4 Chord of Calling
Land (22)
4 Windswept Heath
4 Verdant Catacombs
2 Temple Garden
2 Overgrown Tomb
2 Forest
1 Plains
1 Swamp
3 Gavony Township
2 Brushland
1 Grim Backwoods
3 Path to Exile
1 Anguished Unmaking
1 Beast Within
2 Stony Silence
1 Kataki War's Wage
1 Yixlid Jailer
1 Eidolon of Rhetoric
1 Spellskite
1 Aegis of the Gods
2 Sin Collector
1 Pharika God of Affliction
Match 1 (1-2): J on Kikki Moon
-Game 1: Early Blood Moon can't stop infinite mana into Rhonas . , .
-Game 2 and 3: . . . but Worship and Linvala can make it sputter long enough for him to get past infinite life Game 2 and grimd me out Game 3. Especially noteworthy is that Noble Hierarch instead of Arbor Elf would have allowed me to cast Flickerwisp on Linvala, providing a window for me to go infinite somehow.
Match 2 (2-0): A on Phenax Mill
-Game 1: Combo out fairly quickly.
-Game 2: Eidolon of Rhetoric rsally bogs the game down against a control list like his, but somehow I manage to swing through Fog Bank for lethal with 7/8 Birds of Paradise (thanks Township Edit: and Rhonas!).
Match 3 (2-0): K on Lantern Control
-Game 1: Combo'd out via Rhonas and flew under the Ensaring Bridge. Of note the opponent had a turn 1 Pithing Needle, but named Ballista instead of Rhonas.
-Game 2: Similar ending; no bridge or needle though.
Match 4 (ID): E on Eldrazi and Taxes
-ID right away but I knew what he was on since he was nearby Match 3.
Avatar and Signature by XenoNinja via Heroes of the Plane Studios
Avatar and Signature by XenoNinja via Heroes of the Plane Studios
I've been playing Vizier Company for a few months now at my local FNM events and I've really been enjoying it. Right now it's just a stock list with various chord options that's tuned to my local meta. I'm happy with my results so far (either 2-2 or 3-1 for the last few weeks), but obviously would like those numbers to go up.
Regarding sideboarding- what is the overall game plan- most of the time I pull my chord options (Tireless Tracker, etc) and can replace them in a one of situation (For example Kataki, but other time's I struggle if I have to replace more than four cards. Is it OK to dilute the overall gameplan and go on big beats/silver bullets? Is there ever a time you want to drop Chords/CoCo or early ramp creatures?
2 Forest
2 Gavony Township
1 Godless Shrine
2 Horizon Canopy
2 Overgrown Tomb
1 Plains
1 Swamp
2 Temple Garden
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Windswept Heath
Creatures
4 Birds of Paradise
4 Devoted Druid
2 Duskwatch Recruiter
2 Eternal Witness
1 Fiend Hunter
4 Kitchen Finks
3 Noble Hierarch
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Rhonas the Indomitable
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Spellskite
1 Tireless Tracker
1 Viscera Seer
4 Vizier of Remedies
1 Walking Ballista
4 Chord of Calling
4 Collected Company
1 Aven Mindcensor
1 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Eidolon of Rhetoric
1 Kataki, War's Wage
1 Linvala, Keeper of Silence
1 Orzhov Pontiff
4 Path to Exile
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Selfless Spirit
2 Voice of Resurgence
The deck is pretty much a combo with a beat down secondary play. In my list I've jammed as many combos as possible and only side a few Grindy cards. Chord into arbor is probably the only time I'll use it.
I will cut as many as all 4 chords when bringing in non-creature sideboard cards like fiery justice or path. As strong as chord is sometimes it really bites to get blown out by a 1 mana counterspell or have it rot in your hand against burn.
I've been trying to sideboard fewer cards lately in general though. It's super easy to over-sideboard with this deck and wind up with a grip of bricks.
UW Ephara Hatebears [Primer], GB Gitrog Lands, BRU Inalla Combo-Control, URG Maelstrom Wanderer Landfall
Let's put it this way: as long you have two of three 2-drops (Druid, Vizier, Mauler) in hand with appropriate mana open, Nahiri ready to pop for the third, and a way to get your win-con, you win then and there barring no interaction fron your opponent; even with them removing Druid prior to comboing out, Mauler turns each one after that into a hasty instant combo piece.
Avatar and Signature by XenoNinja via Heroes of the Plane Studios
First of all it doesn't help against sweepers, one of our biggest enemies; Leap even helps against Anger of the Gods. Sanctuary does not give payoffs for blocking unfavorably; paying G to sac your Birds before a Colonnade or Shadow crushes it is generally pretty useful. Leap allows you to dodge exile when an important piece is in jeopardy and you're looking to Witness or Rallier it back. And finally, is "draw a card" really better than "draw a creature"? Look at what the deck does, how it operates, and what it wants to do; "draw a card" can be a land, but "draw a creature" is at worst a blocker.
Don't get me wrong, Sanctuary looks pretty good. Probably great in conjunction with Leap, but I think Leap is still going to be more useful. It certainly has some tempo applications as well, maybe better than Leap vs burn, but I don't see it being a massive staple. I might go 2 Leap, 1 Sanctuary in the board, but I wouldn't go lower than 2 Leap.
"Reveal a Dragon"
I've been toying around and tweaking my list for several weeks now, however, I still feel like the deck is missing something. I was thinking of maybe cutting a basic forest to add either an extra Duskwatch Recruiter, Anafenza, Viscera, or Rhonas.
Thoughts / suggestions?
4x Birds of Paradise
4x Devoted Druid
2x Duskwatch Recruiter
4x Eternal Witness
4x Kitchen Finks
3x Noble Hierarch
1x Renegade Rallier
1x Scavenging Ooze
1x Selfless Spirit
1x Viscera Seer
4x Vizier of Remedies
1x Walking Ballista
4x Chord of Calling
4x Collected Company
Land (22)
3x Forest
2x Gavony Township
1x Godless Shrine
1x Horizon Canopy
1x Overgrown Tomb
1x Plains
2x Razorverge Thicket
1x Swamp
2x Temple Garden
4x Verdant Catacombs
4x Windswept Heath
1x Abrupt Decay
1x Burrenton Forge-Tender
1x Dusk / Dawn
1x Eidolon of Rhetoric
1x Kataki, War's Wage
1x Linvala, Keeper of Silence
1x Orzhov Pontiff
3x Path to Exile
1x Qasali Pridemage
1x Sigarda, Host of Herons
3x Sin Collector
RWG Burn
GW Abzan Company
RWG Burn
GW Abzan Company