I like the concept of Mystical Teaching a lot. What about Steam Augury? Fills the yard and can give some very strong card advantage (or miss completely). Only issue I see with it is opponents can take away your combo pieces.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Current Decks
Modern
No idea because my favorite decks keep getting banned or having the rules changed against them
Oh, that's another nice one that did not cross my mind. It makes a lot of sense, actually. Alright! I'll test in three separated weeks the three options: Mystical Teachings, Gifts Ungiven and Steam Augury!
I'm down with the extra Cryptic plan for the lists that want to focus on the longer game. For those that are looking for raw CA, I like Forbidden Alchemy over Augury in Twin. You get to make the decision and can put three in the GY to help fuel Tasi. I've always loved the mind game aspect of Augury though.
I took a very rough Grixis Twin deck for a spin last night and I have to say it was a blast to play. It has been about 18 months since I last play twin and this was certainly the most entertaining version I have played. I went 3-1 on the night losing to Scapeshift but beating Burn, Infect and Elves. The deck itself is basically just a pile of RUB cards I wanted to test:
The Humble Defectors were a mistake, every time I drew them I wished they were something else and I boarded them out in every match, they will most likely some more disruption and Tasigurs once I get my hands on more. Was impressed with the discard, the ability to look at someones hand and take a piece of disruption before combo-ing off felt so much better then playing the guessing game with defensive counter magic. The Forbidden Alchemys weren't amazing but they are solid dig spells.
In regards to Steam Augury; I have played it in WUR control and it was always mediocre, however the mind games are alot easier to play here as I can't imagine many people handing over combo pieces even with 4-1 piles.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
In play: Jund Death Shadow, Grixis Control, Eldrazi Stompy, Ponza
In the yard: RUG Delver, Kiki-Chord, Grixis Twin, Mardu Control, Smallpox, Jeskai Control, Jeskai Delver, Assault Loam, Elves, Deathcloud, Eggs, Storm
In regards to Steam Augury; I have played it in WUR control and it was always mediocre, however the mind games are alot easier to play here as I can't imagine many people handing over combo pieces even with 4-1 piles.
That is kind of my line of thought. Grixis twin can win easily with beats bolts and snaps all the while threatening to just win via combo. Honestly, I think that is the power of twin. My good friend basically has 5+ modern decks, including Junk, UWR control, burn, amulet, delver and POD (RIP), and he always said playing against twin was intense because you never know if they are just going to say oops I win. RUB/RUG do this well because they have other threats that must be handled, all the while the combo is lurking. I do wish Fact or Fiction would enter the modern space though.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Current Decks
Modern
No idea because my favorite decks keep getting banned or having the rules changed against them
Cryptic Command is only card advantage if you counter-draw and that is not always the best line of play. The triple U cost is also an issue.
Forbidden Alchemy is hardly card advantage is this aspect, as you need seven mana to get the extra card. I'm looking for some raw card advantage.
For the RUG versions, has anybody tried out Vines of Vastwood? I know that Mizzium Skin was actually something I have seen played before, in more of the all-in-twin lists though. Vines has a surprisingly more amount of utility than just protecting your own creatures. The pump ability is not irrelevant, especially if you're trying to kill them or sneak damage through. But also keep in mind that it can stop our opponents from doing things to their own creatures. For example, it could stop an opposing Splinter Twin player from comboing, infect from getting one of their pump spells (and it's green, so even if they try to Apostle's Blessing their pump spell will get countered), affinity from moving counters with Arcbound Ravager, among other things.
Not sure if it's too narrow, but it certainly looks interesting enough to me to try out.
People where certainly playing around that exact line of thinking this weekend on the stream. I'd include it in the Tarmo build if there are flex slots.
I had a report due today so I wasn't able to attend my area's Modern tournament of the week Testing with Teachings will be done some time in the future.
Option #2 seems the most correct to me and it's what I'd choose. I'm not comfortable not running Cryptics in my list and I've been trying to figure out a way to go up to 3, actually. My list is less focused on pumping out a turn 2 Tasigur, though.
Option 2 seems the best given your list. Like you said the legend rule makes multiples of Tasi awkward plus you are going to have plenty to do on turn 2 between counters, removal and cantrips.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
In play: Jund Death Shadow, Grixis Control, Eldrazi Stompy, Ponza
In the yard: RUG Delver, Kiki-Chord, Grixis Twin, Mardu Control, Smallpox, Jeskai Control, Jeskai Delver, Assault Loam, Elves, Deathcloud, Eggs, Storm
i'd cut a vendilion for another exarch. this deck's primary plan is always the combo. into the sideboard i'd cut jace or keranos for a blackremoval (murderous cut). or, if you wanna blood moons, i'd cut keranos and a dispel
Careful assuming the deck's primary plan is always the combo.
For those that have SCG Premium, I suggest watching Todd Anderson vs BBD Grixis Twin vs Wilt-leaf Abzan. It shows a lot of the philosophy of playing tempo twin (he plays a list with 3 Pestermite main and 2 Splinter Twin). His main objective is tempo out the opponent based on the fact that he can't really tapout. That's the main plan is spending your mana more efficiently than your opponent
Matter of fact, most times I just beatdown to victory with the deck.
let me say that a list playing 4x splinter twin is not aiming to "tempo out my opponent and then win". yes, a list like that should not play as a straight all in combo. sure. but if you have all the necessary cards in hand you're going with the combo no matter what (of course with all the exceptions: opponents with untapped lands, possible removal spells etc...)
there's always plan b to follow, or better gain tempo and beatdown the opponent with tasi or the small critters. but a list like that will draw a splinter twin quite soon...so, playing tempo means only force the opponent to tap out or waste resources...and then smash twin on the board and win on the spot. otherwise you're not playing 4x splinter twin and 6x combo creatures.
So I suggest looking at the Tier 1 thread. This one is for *Tempo* Twin, not All-in Combo.
let me say that a list playing 4x splinter twin is not aiming to "tempo out my opponent and then win". yes, a list like that should not play as a straight all in combo. sure. but if you have all the necessary cards in hand you're going with the combo no matter what (of course with all the exceptions: opponents with untapped lands, possible removal spells etc...)
there's always plan b to follow, or better gain tempo and beatdown the opponent with tasi or the small critters. but a list like that will draw a splinter twin quite soon...so, playing tempo means only force the opponent to tap out or waste resources...and then smash twin on the board and win on the spot. otherwise you're not playing 4x splinter twin and 6x combo creatures.
So I suggest looking at the Tier 1 thread. This one is for *Tempo* Twin, not All-in Combo.
Is there a way to watch the video of Grixis-twin vs Abzan without having SCG Premium?
I really want to watch this video but i dont want to get myself SCg premium just for that one video
Well, obviously there is not.
Can anybody give me the decklist they are playing there?
All their premium articles go up for free after a few weeks (I can't remember the exact length of time). Unfortunately that is pretty much the only way to see their premium content for free. As for the decklists, someone might be able to post them, I know MTGS does like posting whole articles but they might be okay with decklists.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
In play: Jund Death Shadow, Grixis Control, Eldrazi Stompy, Ponza
In the yard: RUG Delver, Kiki-Chord, Grixis Twin, Mardu Control, Smallpox, Jeskai Control, Jeskai Delver, Assault Loam, Elves, Deathcloud, Eggs, Storm
So I suggest looking at the Tier 1 thread. This one is for *Tempo* Twin, not All-in Combo.
Just don't tell them you play black!
This actually brings up an interesting point, the split from the UR Twin thread was to do with colour not play style. We have a lot of options in black that open up a lot of different builds; I can see RUB Twin decks being a mixture of all-in, tempo and control. Much like the UR Twin thread we might need to decide were we draw certain lines and how we handle different decks. Personally I am happy for this tread to include all versions, at least until we have a primer and clear guidelines. This of course applies to the RUG decks aswell.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
In play: Jund Death Shadow, Grixis Control, Eldrazi Stompy, Ponza
In the yard: RUG Delver, Kiki-Chord, Grixis Twin, Mardu Control, Smallpox, Jeskai Control, Jeskai Delver, Assault Loam, Elves, Deathcloud, Eggs, Storm
2 grixis twin lists day 2d at the open. Todd Anderson was on tarmotwin and just bubbled top 8. Pretty good showing for these twin varieties considering there probably weren't many entered anyways. Anyone know the lists for the 2 grixis builds? The temur one is already up on star city.
Hmm good question, I think they should be up there I'll take a look.
My wife green lighted the purchase of Snapcasters (her words were 'Well if its not getting a reprint it would be a waste of money NOT to buy them!) so I get to put this together in paper as well.
I'll get my list together for critisism but its Tasigur, Thought Scour, Fetch driven and has been working out well so far in learning the ropes of Twin online.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
UW Spirits
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
I took a very rough Grixis Twin deck for a spin last night and I have to say it was a blast to play. It has been about 18 months since I last play twin and this was certainly the most entertaining version I have played. I went 3-1 on the night losing to Scapeshift but beating Burn, Infect and Elves. The deck itself is basically just a pile of RUB cards I wanted to test:
2x Blood Crypt
2x Bloodstained Mire
2x Island
2x Mountain
3x Polluted Delta
3x Scalding Tarn
2x Steam Vents
1x Swamp
2x Watery Grave
1x Blackcleave Cliffs
2x Darkslick Shores
2x Forbidden Alchemy
2x Izzet Charm
3x Lightning Bolt
1x Spell Pierce
3x Terminate
Sorcery (10)
2x Duress
3x Inquisition of Kozilek
1x Rise // Fall
4x Serum Visions
4x Deceiver Exarch
3x Humble Defector
2x Pestermite
2x Snapcaster Mage
2x Tasigur, the Golden Fang
Enchantment (4)
4x Splinter Twin
The Humble Defectors were a mistake, every time I drew them I wished they were something else and I boarded them out in every match, they will most likely some more disruption and Tasigurs once I get my hands on more. Was impressed with the discard, the ability to look at someones hand and take a piece of disruption before combo-ing off felt so much better then playing the guessing game with defensive counter magic. The Forbidden Alchemys weren't amazing but they are solid dig spells.
In regards to Steam Augury; I have played it in WUR control and it was always mediocre, however the mind games are alot easier to play here as I can't imagine many people handing over combo pieces even with 4-1 piles.
In the yard: RUG Delver, Kiki-Chord, Grixis Twin, Mardu Control, Smallpox, Jeskai Control, Jeskai Delver, Assault Loam, Elves, Deathcloud, Eggs, Storm
That is kind of my line of thought. Grixis twin can win easily with beats bolts and snaps all the while threatening to just win via combo. Honestly, I think that is the power of twin. My good friend basically has 5+ modern decks, including Junk, UWR control, burn, amulet, delver and POD (RIP), and he always said playing against twin was intense because you never know if they are just going to say oops I win. RUB/RUG do this well because they have other threats that must be handled, all the while the combo is lurking. I do wish Fact or Fiction would enter the modern space though.
Forbidden Alchemy is hardly card advantage is this aspect, as you need seven mana to get the extra card. I'm looking for some raw card advantage.
Not sure if it's too narrow, but it certainly looks interesting enough to me to try out.
Spirits
In the yard: RUG Delver, Kiki-Chord, Grixis Twin, Mardu Control, Smallpox, Jeskai Control, Jeskai Delver, Assault Loam, Elves, Deathcloud, Eggs, Storm
Careful assuming the deck's primary plan is always the combo.
For those that have SCG Premium, I suggest watching Todd Anderson vs BBD Grixis Twin vs Wilt-leaf Abzan. It shows a lot of the philosophy of playing tempo twin (he plays a list with 3 Pestermite main and 2 Splinter Twin). His main objective is tempo out the opponent based on the fact that he can't really tapout. That's the main plan is spending your mana more efficiently than your opponent
Matter of fact, most times I just beatdown to victory with the deck.
So I suggest looking at the Tier 1 thread. This one is for *Tempo* Twin, not All-in Combo.
Spirits
Just don't tell them you play black!
All their premium articles go up for free after a few weeks (I can't remember the exact length of time). Unfortunately that is pretty much the only way to see their premium content for free. As for the decklists, someone might be able to post them, I know MTGS does like posting whole articles but they might be okay with decklists.
In the yard: RUG Delver, Kiki-Chord, Grixis Twin, Mardu Control, Smallpox, Jeskai Control, Jeskai Delver, Assault Loam, Elves, Deathcloud, Eggs, Storm
This actually brings up an interesting point, the split from the UR Twin thread was to do with colour not play style. We have a lot of options in black that open up a lot of different builds; I can see RUB Twin decks being a mixture of all-in, tempo and control. Much like the UR Twin thread we might need to decide were we draw certain lines and how we handle different decks. Personally I am happy for this tread to include all versions, at least until we have a primer and clear guidelines. This of course applies to the RUG decks aswell.
In the yard: RUG Delver, Kiki-Chord, Grixis Twin, Mardu Control, Smallpox, Jeskai Control, Jeskai Delver, Assault Loam, Elves, Deathcloud, Eggs, Storm
My wife green lighted the purchase of Snapcasters (her words were 'Well if its not getting a reprint it would be a waste of money NOT to buy them!) so I get to put this together in paper as well.
I'll get my list together for critisism but its Tasigur, Thought Scour, Fetch driven and has been working out well so far in learning the ropes of Twin online.
Spirits