This is about as good as any list. My list differs by three cards in the mainboard (I play 27 lands and the third Hive Mind, and two of my lands are different). If you go around looking at lists, you'll notice a few variations. Best advice I have is that you want to pick one with Ancient Stirrings, since it's much easier to learn with the added consistency it offers.
To see the world in a grain of sand, and to see heaven in a wild flower, hold infinity in the palm of your hands, and eternity in an hour. - William Blake
It was not delight, not wonder that arose among us, it was the peace of heaven. He who has thought most deeply loves what is most alive. - Friedrich Holderlin
3 seal of primordium is odd. Wouldnt you prefer natures claim as it's an instant? and the lifegain is negligible. I'm doing a 2-1 split personally
This is something I've been wondering. Seal of primordium just seems crude and clunky compared to nature's claim. What's the reason for playing the slower more expensive card? You can't float mana in response to a blood moon and drop seal, but you can cast claim. Also claim hits twin. It just seems weird?
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Modern: G Tron, Vannifar, Jund, Druid/Vizier combo, Humans, Eldrazi Stompy (Serum Powder), Amulet, Grishoalbrand, Breach Titan, Turns, Eternal Command, As Foretold Living End, Elves, Cheerios, RUG Scapeshift
3 seal of primordium is odd. Wouldnt you prefer natures claim as it's an instant? and the lifegain is negligible. I'm doing a 2-1 split personally
This is something I've been wondering. Seal of primordium just seems crude and clunky compared to nature's claim. What's the reason for playing the slower more expensive card? You can't float mana in response to a blood moon and drop seal, but you can cast claim. Also claim hits twin. It just seems weird?
Because you can cast Seal of Primordium ahead of time and dodge counters? Once your Seal is in play, most decks have to accept you have an answer. Sure, they play around it now, but you're the proactive deck and you're quite okay with that. Nature's Claim works well, don't get me wrong, but they can counter it or they can play the card when you might not have the mana up. You might combo on turn 3 and not have Nature's Claim up in some scenarios, but you could perhaps have played the turn 2 Seal.
Seal of Primordium is fire-and-forget. You cast it, then it just sits there, ready to stop them if they try anything funny. You don't have to hold mana up every turn, which is important because this deck plays 0 fetches, so you can't use the "keep an uncracked fetch to cast a 1-mana spell" trick against Deceiver Exarch.
It's a lot like Spellskite or Defense Grid in that regard (if you've ever played another deck with SBed Spellskites/Grids). Coincidentally, they are all Spell Snare bait.
Given those responses above, would you guys suggest not even bothering with Natures claim?
I play Nature's Claim over it, actually. You tend to be holding up mana to use against Blood Moon if you haven't combo'd, and if you have, you can fetch your basic Forest if you're scared. If I attack with a hasty Titan and single Amulet, I can fetch something like Simic Growth Chamber + Tolaria West, bounce Tolaria West, leaving me with two mana (to bluff my Swan Song as well), or just even double Gemstone Mine. I think there are enough ways to keep up that mana.
also if you have a hive mind out they can kill your hive with your claim, this has come up for me more than once.
(ive never played claim, but If I had it would have come up when I was casting a seal)
seal lets you use your mana more efficiently, you can just cast it whenever. claim makes you have to keep it up and sometimes you will have a swan song to and want to keep up 2 mana every turn. with seal just let it be unless you are scared of cryptic bounce > blood moon but you know. that's tough
To see the world in a grain of sand, and to see heaven in a wild flower, hold infinity in the palm of your hands, and eternity in an hour. - William Blake
It was not delight, not wonder that arose among us, it was the peace of heaven. He who has thought most deeply loves what is most alive. - Friedrich Holderlin
Kanister. you were saying somewhere how you don't have to pay for pact on YOUR upkeep? not sure how could someone please explain..
also how is your board plan for ad nauseam? MU should be easy,but just lost a match to them cause I was overload'd on seal of primordiums. he also had a godhand.
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To see the world in a grain of sand, and to see heaven in a wild flower, hold infinity in the palm of your hands, and eternity in an hour. - William Blake
It was not delight, not wonder that arose among us, it was the peace of heaven. He who has thought most deeply loves what is most alive. - Friedrich Holderlin
1) What are the Grixis control and Merfolk matches like? In our favor or not?
2) Is Simian guide there just for a turn 1 win potential, or to speed up the combo? If so i feel like Dromoka would be better in case all your titans die (which isnt uncommon against UWR). Thoughts?
1) What are the Grixis control and Merfolk matches like? In our favor or not?
2) Is Simian guide there just for a turn 1 win potential, or to speed up the combo? If so i feel like Dromoka would be better in case all your titans die (which isnt uncommon against UWR). Thoughts?
Depends on what Grixis deck. Twin is bad because they have counters and clock us. In general, you can out-race every deck that clocks you because you're a turn 2 deck, but you can't race decks that clock you with counters. Some of the new Grixis Control decks are easier because they play fewer counters. The less ways to stop my combo, the better for me.
Merfolk hasn't been good for me. Cursecatcher stops early combos as well as shuts down Hive Mind completely (sac Cursecatcher targeting my copy, don't pay). They're also fast since we don't have much disruption, and can kill us on 4. Spreading Seas also really punishes your slow opening hands that have you playing a bounceland on turn 2 and passing.
SSG is to speed up your clock. Your turn 2s become turn 1s, your turn 3s become turn 2s, etc. One mana makes a surprising amount of difference. That said, it's an inconsistent card, because it requires all the other pieces already. You won't turn 1 people very often and even if you could, you'd generally be accepting of a turn 2.
How much consistency loss would we suffer if we swapped a gruul turf for a Boros garrison?
All the reading I've done on the deck suggests that a lack of red/white can cripple the deck in quite a few situations. Is our need for green so much that we'll cause such a problem?
As such a critical land I'd like to know why we rely so much on vesuva and don't run a second copy. Is it purely an opening-hand-consistency issue? I can imagine running into situations where your garrison gets ghost-quartered or equivalent, and then you feel pretty stupid.
Is there any room for an Ugin in the sideboard? Seems like an interesting play to the extent you don't draw any of the actual win-cons early.
edit - never mind I see that at least at one point Ugin was slotted in as a one-of on the sideboard. I suppose testing shows there are better alternatives?
Thinking about 1-2 Crumble to Dust in the SB for Tron match ups. Surgical extraction for lands? yes please. Might be a little expensive though.
I was wondering this myself.
Coming from being a tron player, I always thought amulet was a hard matchup. I think amulet has a distinct "quick clock" advantage.
But obviously, if tron gets a good start it can go either way.
So what's the game-plan?
GWU Eldrazi
BRG Living End
WBG JunkFit
This is about as good as any list. My list differs by three cards in the mainboard (I play 27 lands and the third Hive Mind, and two of my lands are different). If you go around looking at lists, you'll notice a few variations. Best advice I have is that you want to pick one with Ancient Stirrings, since it's much easier to learn with the added consistency it offers.
Grixis Death's Shadow, Jund, UW Tron, Jeskai Control, Storm, Counters Company, Eldrazi Tron, Affinity, Living End, Infect, Merfolk, Dredge, Ad Nauseam, Amulet, Bogles, Eldrazi Tron, Mono U Tron, Lantern, Mardu Pyromancer
GWU Eldrazi
BRG Living End
WBG JunkFit
4 Primeval Titan
2 Pact of Negation
1 Slaughter Pact
4 Summoner's Pact
4 Amulet of Vigor
3 Ancient Stirrings
4 Serum Visions
4 Summer Bloom
2 Hive Mind
1 Boros Garrison
1 Forest
4 Gemstone Mine
1 Golgari Rot Farm
1 Khalni Garden
1 Mana Confluence
1 Radiant Fountain
1 Selesnya Sanctuary
4 Simic Growth Chamber
1 Slayers' Stronghold
1 Sunhome, Fortress of the Legion
3 Tolaria West
1 Vesuva
3 Gruul Turf
1 Island
1 Temple of Mystery
3 Sleight of Hand
1 Cavern of Souls
2 Swan Song
3 Seal of Primordium
3 Leyline of Sanctity
1 Hornet Queen
3 Pyroclasm
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Slaughter Pact
1 Ghost Quarter
thinking of a 3rd swan song.
It was not delight, not wonder that arose among us, it was the peace of heaven. He who has thought most deeply loves what is most alive. - Friedrich Holderlin
1907 Constructed Rating on Magic Online.
RWG Burn
GW Abzan Company
This is something I've been wondering. Seal of primordium just seems crude and clunky compared to nature's claim. What's the reason for playing the slower more expensive card? You can't float mana in response to a blood moon and drop seal, but you can cast claim. Also claim hits twin. It just seems weird?
Grixis Death's Shadow, Jund, UW Tron, Jeskai Control, Storm, Counters Company, Eldrazi Tron, Affinity, Living End, Infect, Merfolk, Dredge, Ad Nauseam, Amulet, Bogles, Eldrazi Tron, Mono U Tron, Lantern, Mardu Pyromancer
It's a lot like Spellskite or Defense Grid in that regard (if you've ever played another deck with SBed Spellskites/Grids). Coincidentally, they are all Spell Snare bait.
| Ad Nauseam
| Infect
Big Johnny.
RWG Burn
GW Abzan Company
Grixis Death's Shadow, Jund, UW Tron, Jeskai Control, Storm, Counters Company, Eldrazi Tron, Affinity, Living End, Infect, Merfolk, Dredge, Ad Nauseam, Amulet, Bogles, Eldrazi Tron, Mono U Tron, Lantern, Mardu Pyromancer
(ive never played claim, but If I had it would have come up when I was casting a seal)
seal lets you use your mana more efficiently, you can just cast it whenever. claim makes you have to keep it up and sometimes you will have a swan song to and want to keep up 2 mana every turn. with seal just let it be unless you are scared of cryptic bounce > blood moon but you know. that's tough
It was not delight, not wonder that arose among us, it was the peace of heaven. He who has thought most deeply loves what is most alive. - Friedrich Holderlin
1907 Constructed Rating on Magic Online.
also how is your board plan for ad nauseam? MU should be easy,but just lost a match to them cause I was overload'd on seal of primordiums. he also had a godhand.
It was not delight, not wonder that arose among us, it was the peace of heaven. He who has thought most deeply loves what is most alive. - Friedrich Holderlin
1907 Constructed Rating on Magic Online.
1) What are the Grixis control and Merfolk matches like? In our favor or not?
2) Is Simian guide there just for a turn 1 win potential, or to speed up the combo? If so i feel like Dromoka would be better in case all your titans die (which isnt uncommon against UWR). Thoughts?
RWG Burn
GW Abzan Company
Merfolk hasn't been good for me. Cursecatcher stops early combos as well as shuts down Hive Mind completely (sac Cursecatcher targeting my copy, don't pay). They're also fast since we don't have much disruption, and can kill us on 4. Spreading Seas also really punishes your slow opening hands that have you playing a bounceland on turn 2 and passing.
SSG is to speed up your clock. Your turn 2s become turn 1s, your turn 3s become turn 2s, etc. One mana makes a surprising amount of difference. That said, it's an inconsistent card, because it requires all the other pieces already. You won't turn 1 people very often and even if you could, you'd generally be accepting of a turn 2.
Grixis Death's Shadow, Jund, UW Tron, Jeskai Control, Storm, Counters Company, Eldrazi Tron, Affinity, Living End, Infect, Merfolk, Dredge, Ad Nauseam, Amulet, Bogles, Eldrazi Tron, Mono U Tron, Lantern, Mardu Pyromancer
All the reading I've done on the deck suggests that a lack of red/white can cripple the deck in quite a few situations. Is our need for green so much that we'll cause such a problem?
As such a critical land I'd like to know why we rely so much on vesuva and don't run a second copy. Is it purely an opening-hand-consistency issue? I can imagine running into situations where your garrison gets ghost-quartered or equivalent, and then you feel pretty stupid.
Any comment about this would help a great deal.
edit - never mind I see that at least at one point Ugin was slotted in as a one-of on the sideboard. I suppose testing shows there are better alternatives?