Hey guys, so I'm making this post because of a discussion that opened up over on the Lantern Control subreddit.
The basics of the discussion are as follows:
1. I make the point that one way to not worry about accumulating a large number of draws is to make game 1 last the entirety of the 50 minutes you have for each round. Obviously I don't advocate slow play, but if opponent's won't concede, I feel it's just better to control them until the time is dead instead of aggressively milling them to win the game.
2. The user I am replying to asks if there is a difference between a 1-0 and 2-0 match record with concerns to calculating tie breakers.
Here are my findings:
First and foremost, the rules on how tiebreakers work for DCI tournaments can be found here. I am taking this information and combining it with the information given to me by a local TO and a L2 Judge in the area.
Opponents' Match Win Percentage
This is the first thing that is checked after comparing match points. In this aspect, there is nothing we can do about this. For the purposes of the OMWP there is no difference between a 1-0 or 2-0 win since either of them counts as a loss for each of our opponents' OMWP. We're fine so far.
Game-Win Percentage
Now here is where things get sticky. The GWP takes into account the total number of games you have played, not just how many rounds you've played. So for this let's make some test data:
4 Round Tournament
We're going to assume we're playing a 4 Round tournament. We're going to end the tournament with a 3-1 record, having lost round 4 0-2. One set of data will have each win a 1-0 win, while the other set has them as 2-0 wins. Is there a difference?
Holy cow that's quite a difference! I think from looking at this we can conclude that it is better to aim for finishing games going 2-0, and I'm sure some of you are looking at this going, "Of Course!" but for those of us (like me) who enjoys using numbers to find the truth, it is a thing I am glad to know.
CLASS DISMISSED
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Modern Decks: UBG Lantern Control GBU BRG Bridge-Vine GRB
Commander Decks UBG Muldrotha, Value Elemental GBU BRG Windgrace Real-Estate Ltd. GRB
#PayThePros
Personally, I'm strongly against trying to let the round go to time. I feel that it is unsportsmanlike. Sure, I've had opponents that try this, and in some cases they succeeded, but I feel that this sort of behavior is a blemish on our character as being unsportsmanlike. If an opponent feels like trying to use time limits, and their slow play (which is what this is, no doubt about it), to avoid a loss, then that's on them being unsportsmanlike. It's their quality of character they are sacrificing. Playing at a slower pace than necessary for the sole sake of avoiding a loss is exactly that - slow play. While many people may not be able to perceive it, I feel that I am aware of how quickly I am capable of playing. I would know, and that would be enough for me to not want to adopt that sort of behavior. I would feel ashamed of myself.
Essentially, it's not something that I would be proud of. It's not something that I would encourage my son (or my daughter, if she decides to play Magic as well) to do. Sure, we might be able to get away with it, but how we behave is what defines our character, and just because we might be able to get away with something doesn't make it right.
I don't believe in slow play either. What I was alluding to was let's say you have 4 mill rocks in play as you have the lock in place. I would not intentionally use every mill rock every turn cycle unless I was required to. Honestly this isn't slow playing. Rather I'm doing my best to keep the lock gripped on my opponent as tightly as possible. Honestly I did word it rather poorly.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Modern Decks: UBG Lantern Control GBU BRG Bridge-Vine GRB
Commander Decks UBG Muldrotha, Value Elemental GBU BRG Windgrace Real-Estate Ltd. GRB
#PayThePros
Ah, I can understand that. So you'd be playing it to a degree where you are playing it so safe that the opponent has no choice but to recognize that you will not allow them to draw any relevant card, no matter what. "Turning the thumbscrews", so to speak.
CRUGGCCCCCCCGBGBGBCCCCCCCBBUWC MODERN – LANTERN(aka Fateseal or Barbershop) Primer–Subreddit–Facebook–Decklist–Gameplay Thnkr's Content:Gameplay–Datasheet Each eye sees a different possibility for tomorrow. CWUBBCCCCCCCBGBGBGCCCCCCCGGURC
Hey guys, so I'm making this post because of a discussion that opened up over on the Lantern Control subreddit.
The basics of the discussion are as follows:
1. I make the point that one way to not worry about accumulating a large number of draws is to make game 1 last the entirety of the 50 minutes you have for each round. Obviously I don't advocate slow play, but if opponent's won't concede, I feel it's just better to control them until the time is dead instead of aggressively milling them to win the game.
2. The user I am replying to asks if there is a difference between a 1-0 and 2-0 match record with concerns to calculating tie breakers.
Here are my findings:
First and foremost, the rules on how tiebreakers work for DCI tournaments can be found here. I am taking this information and combining it with the information given to me by a local TO and a L2 Judge in the area.
Opponents' Match Win Percentage
This is the first thing that is checked after comparing match points. In this aspect, there is nothing we can do about this. For the purposes of the OMWP there is no difference between a 1-0 or 2-0 win since either of them counts as a loss for each of our opponents' OMWP. We're fine so far.
Game-Win Percentage
Now here is where things get sticky. The GWP takes into account the total number of games you have played, not just how many rounds you've played. So for this let's make some test data:
4 Round Tournament
We're going to assume we're playing a 4 Round tournament. We're going to end the tournament with a 3-1 record, having lost round 4 0-2. One set of data will have each win a 1-0 win, while the other set has them as 2-0 wins. Is there a difference?
Holy cow that's quite a difference! I think from looking at this we can conclude that it is better to aim for finishing games going 2-0, and I'm sure some of you are looking at this going, "Of Course!" but for those of us (like me) who enjoys using numbers to find the truth, it is a thing I am glad to know.
CLASS DISMISSED
I really don't think you need to worry about this too much. Game win % is only used as a secondary tiebreaker if two people have the same score and the same opponent match win percentage. Unless its a 3 or 4rd event having the same match % is incredibly rare. When playing in a 15rd gp i can't imagine it would ever happen. Its not something you really need to worry about.not to mention you cant expect all of those 1-0 victories to translate to 2-0 if you played them out.
That said i would advise against playing out game 1 to time because a savvy opponent can alwaya scoop g1 when they realise there is only enoigh time left for them to manage 2 wins but not for you to manage a 2nd win if they slow play out game 3.
I'm stuck trying to figure out what to cut. It's almost certainly going to be a GQ, ruins or duskmantle, but I'm also considering cutting a Mox Opal in favor of a land. I see way too many hands with double mopal where they're just dead or too many spells and mopal without metalcraft etc. These are all painful cuts for different reasons. The third GQ I'm finding is hell on tron and makes the alternate mana denial strategy a lot more consistent in general. The ninth mill rock is something I've come to appreciate, especially with 2/2 on pyxis and bell. Ruins feels the least crucial in terms of redundancy but I definitely want to see one at some point in basically every matchup. Mopal can make the difference between being hellbent on bridge and dying and provides a lot of crazy openers. Does anyone have any insight (teehee) on this?
So I've been fiddling around with my Whir list, and honestly thnkr's comments on Spellskite not being that great right now kind of got me thinking about a few changes. So here's what I'm thinking of using the next time I go out to play Modern. Let me know what you guys think:
I actually don't see all that much tron. But even so I like the option to destabilize my opponents' mana, make them shuffle or landlock them for a slightly quicker concession. Its also relevant against scapeshift/titan which I see fairly frequently.
What matchup guide on the main post would be closest to Tooth and Nail decks? I'm struggling a lot mainly because they have 5 or 6 mainboard ways to remove bridge (and quickly thanks to their ramp), none of which can be targetted with IOK (Primal Command and Acidic Slime, at least in the deck I'm facing). Brutality hits command but I only seem to be able to mill/thoughtseize the slime, which hasn't been consistent enough. Parallel to that, even if I do land a bridge if I ever get a card stuck in hand they can still insta-gib me with Kessig Wolf Run on one of their one power untappers. Postboard is slightly better with Padeem, welding jar, and more Thoughtseize, but they bring in more artifact hate as well as Fracturing Gust. What's our best line of attack for this deck?
I think that may just be a bad matchup. You just have to lock them down fast and hope they dont have slime/command in their opener or you draw a discard that deals with it. If you play against it a lot in your local meta i would suggest maindecking more thoughtseizes over inquisitions. After board you have lost legacy as an extra out and Graffdigger's cage can at least take care of TnN.
@Skitzafreak, I run 3 Ghost Quarter, too I also use them against Affinity, although that is already a good matchup. I was also able to successfully use it against Death's Shadow to cut them off of white.
For Tooth and Nail, our Collective Brutality does a lot of work here. It can take out the small creatures and/or discard a Tooth and Nail or Primal Command. Inquisition can also take out their early mana ramp. They do have Acidic Slime, but they have to save those for Bridge. I only see one video of play against Tooth and Nail that I have, but it's from 2015, but it's a 2-1.
As for the shirt, it was $24 for mine, plus $5 shipping.
Playing the SCG Open tomorrow. Got one flax spot open in my Main. Third copy of Surgical or third copy of Needle? I'm expecting Tron to be popular so both are a good option.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Standard: GR Pummeler
Modern: Mono-Red Control, Lantern Control, Eldrazi Taxes, Skred Infect
Pauper: Affinity
EDH: Gaddock Teeg Kithkin Tribal, Meren
Legacy: 8 Rack, Omnitell (Both in progress)
So vs big mana decks, having more thoughtseize is usually what I want. With brutality main and fair/marsh removing some of the tax on our life, I think it is worthwhile revisiting the iok/thoughtseize split. I'm at 3-3 and have considered running the full set of seizes at times.
The basics of the discussion are as follows:
1. I make the point that one way to not worry about accumulating a large number of draws is to make game 1 last the entirety of the 50 minutes you have for each round. Obviously I don't advocate slow play, but if opponent's won't concede, I feel it's just better to control them until the time is dead instead of aggressively milling them to win the game.
2. The user I am replying to asks if there is a difference between a 1-0 and 2-0 match record with concerns to calculating tie breakers.
Here are my findings:
First and foremost, the rules on how tiebreakers work for DCI tournaments can be found here. I am taking this information and combining it with the information given to me by a local TO and a L2 Judge in the area.
Opponents' Match Win Percentage
This is the first thing that is checked after comparing match points. In this aspect, there is nothing we can do about this. For the purposes of the OMWP there is no difference between a 1-0 or 2-0 win since either of them counts as a loss for each of our opponents' OMWP. We're fine so far.
Game-Win Percentage
Now here is where things get sticky. The GWP takes into account the total number of games you have played, not just how many rounds you've played. So for this let's make some test data:
4 Round Tournament
We're going to assume we're playing a 4 Round tournament. We're going to end the tournament with a 3-1 record, having lost round 4 0-2. One set of data will have each win a 1-0 win, while the other set has them as 2-0 wins. Is there a difference?
1-0 Wins
Round 1: 1-0 = 3
Round 2: 1-0 = 3
Round 3: 1-0 = 3
Round 4: 0-2 = 0
Total Games Played = 5
3 + 3 + 3 + 0 = 9 / (5 * 3) = 60%
2-0 Wins
Round 1: 2-0 = 6
Round 2: 2-0 = 6
Round 3: 2-0 = 6
Round 4: 0-2 = 0
Total Games Played: 8
6 + 6 + 6 + 0 = 18 / (8 * 3) = 75%
Holy cow that's quite a difference! I think from looking at this we can conclude that it is better to aim for finishing games going 2-0, and I'm sure some of you are looking at this going, "Of Course!" but for those of us (like me) who enjoys using numbers to find the truth, it is a thing I am glad to know.
CLASS DISMISSED
Modern Decks:
UBG Lantern Control GBU
BRG Bridge-Vine GRB
Commander Decks
UBG Muldrotha, Value Elemental GBU
BRG Windgrace Real-Estate Ltd. GRB
#PayThePros
Essentially, it's not something that I would be proud of. It's not something that I would encourage my son (or my daughter, if she decides to play Magic as well) to do. Sure, we might be able to get away with it, but how we behave is what defines our character, and just because we might be able to get away with something doesn't make it right.
Lantern Control
(with videos)
Uc Tron
Netdecking explained
Netdecking explained, Part 2
On speculators and counterfeits
On Interaction
Every single competitive deck in existence is designed to limit the opponent's ability to interact in a meaningful way.
Record number of exclamation points on SCG homepage: 71 (6 January, 2018)
"I don't want to believe, I want to know."
-Carl Sagan
I don't believe in slow play either. What I was alluding to was let's say you have 4 mill rocks in play as you have the lock in place. I would not intentionally use every mill rock every turn cycle unless I was required to. Honestly this isn't slow playing. Rather I'm doing my best to keep the lock gripped on my opponent as tightly as possible. Honestly I did word it rather poorly.
Modern Decks:
UBG Lantern Control GBU
BRG Bridge-Vine GRB
Commander Decks
UBG Muldrotha, Value Elemental GBU
BRG Windgrace Real-Estate Ltd. GRB
#PayThePros
Lantern Control
(with videos)
Uc Tron
Netdecking explained
Netdecking explained, Part 2
On speculators and counterfeits
On Interaction
Every single competitive deck in existence is designed to limit the opponent's ability to interact in a meaningful way.
Record number of exclamation points on SCG homepage: 71 (6 January, 2018)
"I don't want to believe, I want to know."
-Carl Sagan
Modern Decks:
UBG Lantern Control GBU
BRG Bridge-Vine GRB
Commander Decks
UBG Muldrotha, Value Elemental GBU
BRG Windgrace Real-Estate Ltd. GRB
#PayThePros
Just had to put this here. lol
MODERN – LANTERN (aka Fateseal or Barbershop)
Primer – Subreddit – Facebook – Decklist – Gameplay
Thnkr's Content: Gameplay – Datasheet
Each eye sees a different possibility for tomorrow.
CWUBBCCCCCCCBGBGBGCCCCCCCGGURC
Lantern Control
(with videos)
Uc Tron
Netdecking explained
Netdecking explained, Part 2
On speculators and counterfeits
On Interaction
Every single competitive deck in existence is designed to limit the opponent's ability to interact in a meaningful way.
Record number of exclamation points on SCG homepage: 71 (6 January, 2018)
"I don't want to believe, I want to know."
-Carl Sagan
Love the sentiment but not a fan of the design. Might make my own though with just the phrase.
I really don't think you need to worry about this too much. Game win % is only used as a secondary tiebreaker if two people have the same score and the same opponent match win percentage. Unless its a 3 or 4rd event having the same match % is incredibly rare. When playing in a 15rd gp i can't imagine it would ever happen. Its not something you really need to worry about.not to mention you cant expect all of those 1-0 victories to translate to 2-0 if you played them out.
That said i would advise against playing out game 1 to time because a savvy opponent can alwaya scoop g1 when they realise there is only enoigh time left for them to manage 2 wins but not for you to manage a 2nd win if they slow play out game 3.
I'm really thinking about ordering one of those to be honest.
Modern Decks:
UBG Lantern Control GBU
BRG Bridge-Vine GRB
Commander Decks
UBG Muldrotha, Value Elemental GBU
BRG Windgrace Real-Estate Ltd. GRB
#PayThePros
4 Lantern of Insight
2 Ghoulcaller's Bell
2 Pyxis of Pandemonium
4 Codex Shredder
4 Ensnaring Bridge
4 Mox Opal
2 Pithing Needle
3 Mishra's Bauble
Instant
3 Surgical Extraction
2 Abrupt Decay
Land
2 Academy Ruins
1 Swamp
3 Ghost Quarter
4 Blooming Marsh
2 Spire of Industry
2 Inventors' Fair
2 Glimmervoid
1 Duskmantle, House of Shadow
2 Thoughtseize
2 Collective Brutality
4 Inquisition of Kozilek
4 Ancient Stirrings
1 Infernal Tutor
1 Pithing Needle
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Welding Jar
1 Crucible of Worlds
3 Leyline of Sanctity
1 Quiet Disrepair
1 Surgical Extraction
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Abrupt Decay
2 Collective Brutality
I'm stuck trying to figure out what to cut. It's almost certainly going to be a GQ, ruins or duskmantle, but I'm also considering cutting a Mox Opal in favor of a land. I see way too many hands with double mopal where they're just dead or too many spells and mopal without metalcraft etc. These are all painful cuts for different reasons. The third GQ I'm finding is hell on tron and makes the alternate mana denial strategy a lot more consistent in general. The ninth mill rock is something I've come to appreciate, especially with 2/2 on pyxis and bell. Ruins feels the least crucial in terms of redundancy but I definitely want to see one at some point in basically every matchup. Mopal can make the difference between being hellbent on bridge and dying and provides a lot of crazy openers. Does anyone have any insight (teehee) on this?
Modern Decks:
UBG Lantern Control GBU
BRG Bridge-Vine GRB
Commander Decks
UBG Muldrotha, Value Elemental GBU
BRG Windgrace Real-Estate Ltd. GRB
#PayThePros
4x Glimmervoid
3x Botanical Sanctum
3x Darkslick Shores
2x Inventors' Fair
2x Spire of Industry
1x Academy Ruins
1x Blooming Marsh
1x Island
Artifact - 24
4x Codex Shredder
4x Ensnaring Bridge
4x Lantern of Insight
4x Mox Opal
3x Pithing Needle
2x Ghoulcaller's Bell
1x Pyxis of Pandemonium
1x Sword of the Meek
1x Thopter Foundry
3x Whir of Invention
2x Abrupt Decay
Sorceries - 14
4x Ancient Stirrings
4x Inquisition of Kozilek
2x Battle at the Bridge
2x Collective Brutality
2x Thoughtseize
3x Leyline of Sanctity
2x Abrupt Decay
2x Ghost Quarter
2x Welding Jar
1x Crucible of Worlds
1x Grafdigger's Cage
1x Pithing Needle
1x Sun Droplet
1x Tormod's Crypt
1x Witchbane Orb
Modern Decks:
UBG Lantern Control GBU
BRG Bridge-Vine GRB
Commander Decks
UBG Muldrotha, Value Elemental GBU
BRG Windgrace Real-Estate Ltd. GRB
#PayThePros
I think that may just be a bad matchup. You just have to lock them down fast and hope they dont have slime/command in their opener or you draw a discard that deals with it. If you play against it a lot in your local meta i would suggest maindecking more thoughtseizes over inquisitions. After board you have lost legacy as an extra out and Graffdigger's cage can at least take care of TnN.
Omg
Hope shipping is decent for this. Would totally buy it.
Do you know if its a limited run?
Lantern Control
Bogles (RIP)
Living Belcher (RIP)
For Tooth and Nail, our Collective Brutality does a lot of work here. It can take out the small creatures and/or discard a Tooth and Nail or Primal Command. Inquisition can also take out their early mana ramp. They do have Acidic Slime, but they have to save those for Bridge. I only see one video of play against Tooth and Nail that I have, but it's from 2015, but it's a 2-1.
As for the shirt, it was $24 for mine, plus $5 shipping.
Lantern Control
(with videos)
Uc Tron
Netdecking explained
Netdecking explained, Part 2
On speculators and counterfeits
On Interaction
Every single competitive deck in existence is designed to limit the opponent's ability to interact in a meaningful way.
Record number of exclamation points on SCG homepage: 71 (6 January, 2018)
"I don't want to believe, I want to know."
-Carl Sagan
Modern: Mono-Red Control, Lantern Control, Eldrazi Taxes, Skred Infect
Pauper: Affinity
EDH: Gaddock Teeg Kithkin Tribal, Meren
Legacy: 8 Rack, Omnitell (Both in progress)