So started working on a new sideboard plan for the Grixis matchup. I've started going -2 Abrupt Decay, -1 Noxious Revival, +3 Thoughtseize. The problems I normally have is that they can just hold up their countermagic and play their Snaps at instant speed and pay a single black for Tasigur. By maxing out on discard, I make it so that their hand is crippled, and the Lantern lock should just take it from there. Sure, they're not very good topdecks, but the trick is to try to mull into a Lantern if possible. They normally only have three threats anyways (Tasigur, Snapcasters, Creeping Tar Pit). Tar Pit is pretty easy to take care of, what with Ghost Quarters and Pithing Needles. Snapcasters can be discarded with IoK and TS, or killed with Brutality, so that leaves Tasigur as the threat. If we can discard Tasigur and somehow Surgical him, we should win the game.
Speaking of, the data seems to imply that the only thing worse than a no-Lantern hand (65.02% in wins) is a no-land hand (57.14, 60% if you count Opal as a land). Interesting stuff
Anyone have advice on sideboading for the tron matchups?
I run 1x crucible of worlds maindeck and after sideboading I have access to
4x inquisition
2x thoughtseize
3x ghostquarter
1x crucible
4x pithing needles
4x surgical extraction
2x spellskite
2x welding jar
Is there any other way or cards to make this matchup more favorable? Also is there a good article that talks about sideboarding against various decks as lantern control? A link would be much appreciated thank you!!
CRUGGCCCCCCCGBGBGBCCCCCCCBBUWC MODERN – LANTERN(aka Fateseal or Barbershop) Primer–Subreddit–Facebook–Decklist–Gameplay Thnkr's Content:Gameplay–Datasheet Each eye sees a different possibility for tomorrow. CWUBBCCCCCCCBGBGBGCCCCCCCGGURC
For Tron, I side in 3 Thoughtseize. I also have a Padeem that I want to test in the side for that matchup as well, but I haven't had a chance to test it yet. In the OP I have some tips for various matches.
@crexalbo, Haven't had a chance to test it yet, but it's mainly for Tron, but also figured I'd bring it in against Jund. For Tron, it makes it so that we can go back to the old days of Needle on Karn, O-Stone, and Ugin, no worries about Ulamog and World Breaker any more (and stops those Nature's Claims). For Jund, they usually side out removal anyways, and that means that they have to use Pulse on Padeem if I've got a Leyline or Needle on Lili.
For Tron, I side in 3 Thoughtseize. I also have a Padeem that I want to test in the side for that matchup as well, but I haven't had a chance to test it yet. In the OP I have some tips for various matches.
@crexalbo, Haven't had a chance to test it yet, but it's mainly for Tron, but also figured I'd bring it in against Jund. For Tron, it makes it so that we can go back to the old days of Needle on Karn, O-Stone, and Ugin, no worries about Ulamog and World Breaker any more (and stops those Nature's Claims). For Jund, they usually side out removal anyways, and that means that they have to use Pulse on Padeem if I've got a Leyline or Needle on Lili.
Hm, I'll have to try it out. (If only Darksteel Forge was easier to cast!)
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For Tron, I side in 3 Thoughtseize. I also have a Padeem that I want to test in the side for that matchup as well, but I haven't had a chance to test it yet. In the OP I have some tips for various matches.
@crexalbo, Haven't had a chance to test it yet, but it's mainly for Tron, but also figured I'd bring it in against Jund. For Tron, it makes it so that we can go back to the old days of Needle on Karn, O-Stone, and Ugin, no worries about Ulamog and World Breaker any more (and stops those Nature's Claims). For Jund, they usually side out removal anyways, and that means that they have to use Pulse on Padeem if I've got a Leyline or Needle on Lili.
Hm, I'll have to try it out. (If only Darksteel Forge was easier to cast!)
to be fair if we ever had a way to consistently cheat in Darksteel Forge we would have something banned very quickly
My current sideboard any thoughts comments or suggestions on changes or possible weak matches?
3x leyline of sanctity
2x grafdigger's cage
2x spellskite
2x surgical extraction
1x seal of primodium
1x natures claim
1x lost legacy
1x pithing needle
1x welding jar
1x flaying tendrils
Thinking of burn and maybe wanna add in sun droplet but maybe also wanna keep this for the tron matchup. What's the percentages of the field we would possible be playing against. Thanks for your reply everyone!
A sideboard does no good without your main 60, the event you're tuning for, and the event's expected meta (if it's like a FNM or something).
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My current sideboard any thoughts comments or suggestions on changes or possible weak matches?
3x leyline of sanctity
2x grafdigger's cage
2x spellskite
2x surgical extraction
1x seal of primodium
1x natures claim
1x lost legacy
1x pithing needle
1x welding jar
1x flaying tendrils
Thinking of burn and maybe wanna add in sun droplet but maybe also wanna keep this for the tron matchup. What's the percentages of the field we would possible be playing against. Thanks for your reply everyone!
What is the tendrils for? I don't see any popular matchup where that is worthwhile. If you only have 1 jar in the board I assume you have at least one more main? Otherwise you need a 2nd jar. I personally don't think sun droplet is worthwhile either. It's only really useful against burn and your matchup against them isn't that terrible (assuming you have some collective brutalities main). I would rather add extra collective brutalities to the sideboard to bring in against burn as you can also bring them in against grixis and more combo decks.
So started working on a new sideboard plan for the Grixis matchup. I've started going -2 Abrupt Decay, -1 Noxious Revival, +3 Thoughtseize. The problems I normally have is that they can just hold up their countermagic and play their Snaps at instant speed and pay a single black for Tasigur. By maxing out on discard, I make it so that their hand is crippled, and the Lantern lock should just take it from there. Sure, they're not very good topdecks, but the trick is to try to mull into a Lantern if possible. They normally only have three threats anyways (Tasigur, Snapcasters, Creeping Tar Pit). Tar Pit is pretty easy to take care of, what with Ghost Quarters and Pithing Needles. Snapcasters can be discarded with IoK and TS, or killed with Brutality, so that leaves Tasigur as the threat. If we can discard Tasigur and somehow Surgical him, we should win the game.
Speaking of, the data seems to imply that the only thing worse than a no-Lantern hand (65.02% in wins) is a no-land hand (57.14, 60% if you count Opal as a land). Interesting stuff
IMHO you want to bring in all your discard against grixis or any counter based control deck. I'm amazed though that you seem to be so afraid of Tasigur. It's only really bad for you if they can drop it early and you can't find a bridge, otherwise it's next to useless. The recursion ability is almost never a problem because they will have a whole bunch of junk you can give them back. If they don't, you should just be milling then constantly to make sure you get some crap in there. I'm pretty sure I have NEVER lost a game to a Tasigur activation.
That's a sweet looking list. But really. Why fatal push? especially only one of them. What do you need it for? I can't even imagine you ever wanting to tutor for it since by the time your hand is empty you probably have enough artifacts in play to just get battle for the bridge. Also, as cool a Duskmantle is, why does this build need it any more than the GB version? It just seems like you are wasting sideboard slots by moving the ghost quarters to the sideboard.
That's a sweet looking list. But really. Why fatal push? especially only one of them. What do you need it for? I can't even imagine you ever wanting to tutor for it since by the time your hand is empty you probably have enough artifacts in play to just get battle for the bridge. Also, as cool a Duskmantle is, why does this build need it any more than the GB version? It just seems like you are wasting sideboard slots by moving the ghost quarters to the sideboard.
My idea was having fatal push because the UB version is not as fast in getting hellbent as the BG version is. Therefore having cheap early interaction to not get smashed by a swiftspear or a goblin guide sounded nice. In the list above there are 7 spot removal. Maybe that is too many but UB is newer than BG and tuning has just begun.
UB cannot bring in nature's claim like BG can so stony silence hurts way more, duskmantle mitigates that a bit. And with our colours being UB it makes the activation of duskmantle that much easier.
IMHO you want to bring in all your discard against grixis or any counter based control deck. I'm amazed though that you seem to be so afraid of Tasigur. It's only really bad for you if they can drop it early and you can't find a bridge, otherwise it's next to useless. The recursion ability is almost never a problem because they will have a whole bunch of junk you can give them back. If they don't, you should just be milling then constantly to make sure you get some crap in there. I'm pretty sure I have NEVER lost a game to a Tasigur activation.
It's not so much the activation that I worry about, but that it's their fastest threat, and I can't kill it with Collective Brutality. Between their counters, Kolaghan's Commands, and Cryptic Commands, it's rough getting a Bridge in play and keeping it there. Some lists run discard as well. Feel free to take a look at the replays and let me know if you see if I do anything wrong. I do think that milling them early without a Tasigur already out was no good, as that only lets them play Tasigur sooner.
Hey guys long time Lantern player, Ive seen a lot of different approaches to the lists and wanted to ask everyones opinion.
How do you split Welding Jar vs Mishra's Bauble?
Usually you either use one or the other... sometimes none at all.
I use a 2/1 split of Bauble/Jar in my mainboard, along with three more Jars in the side.
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We reduce the number of outs in our deck, but we do not change the probability of drawing them, as you've agreed.
Also, if we can go all the way to our last card in the deck without dying to find an answer to Stony Silence, it seems to me we don't need to find an answer to stony silence because it didn't do anything relevant anyway.
That's true, only if we have more cards in library than they do and/or we have Academy Ruins. I actually have a few videos where I won with a Stony Silence on the board *because* I never milled myself. I have a match to upload from two days ago where, if I'd milled myself, I would have taken the risk that my opponent would have had more Stony Silence than I had answers, and I would have lost no matter what.
[joke]I've never been killed by a signal pest in the library [/joke]. And since you've agreed that the probability of drawing a specific card is not affected by milling, milling them will not change the number of signal pest you will face in the game (unless you have surgical extraction).
Also, post side, they usually have ancient grudge.
True, but if you look through my Affinity videos, you might find a couple where I milled Signal Pests and Extracted them. I was speaking from experience when I said what I said. I don't like to mill them post-side, due to those Grudges.
Even with no lantern in play (which is the only case we're discussing)?
Yeah. The reason is that we need to have as many answers in our library as threats in theirs. That's the whole concept on which this deck is built - Have more answers to their threats than they have threats to our answers. The best Grixis Control players I've met will save their Scours to mill us or, after we've landed a Lantern, control our draws and/or use it for instant-speed draw. Even if we get Ruins online, if they're smart, they will save Scours to put our target right back. It acts as a Remand for them.
Would you change anything if instead of milling, Codex shredder put the bottom-most card in your library and put it in your graveyard, as in 99% of the time you will not see these cards anyway?
If the correct play is to not mill at all and let the Shredder/Bell sit there, then that's what I'll do. Sometimes the correct action is no action at all.
For the most part, ya. I basically don't count on my ability to recur a card unless I can. I treat recursion as a tool to use if it exists at the time. Until that point, I focus on whether it is more beneficial to mill my opponent, or whether milling at all might be dangerous.
As crexalbo aptly said quite a few posts ago, it's an extremely situational action. I've found that, more often than not, the situation to do so without repercussions doesn't exist. That play style seems to be working out for me.
I don't know if this has ever been brought up before but, now with collective brutality has anyone tried cutting red for white and run Terminus? That would also give us access to Horizon Canopy which is pretty good.
Speaking of, the data seems to imply that the only thing worse than a no-Lantern hand (65.02% in wins) is a no-land hand (57.14, 60% if you count Opal as a land). Interesting stuff
Lantern Control
(with videos)
Uc Tron
Netdecking explained
Netdecking explained, Part 2
On speculators and counterfeits
On Interaction
Every single competitive deck in existence is designed to limit the opponent's ability to interact in a meaningful way.
Record number of exclamation points on SCG homepage: 71 (6 January, 2018)
"I don't want to believe, I want to know."
-Carl Sagan
I run 1x crucible of worlds maindeck and after sideboading I have access to
4x inquisition
2x thoughtseize
3x ghostquarter
1x crucible
4x pithing needles
4x surgical extraction
2x spellskite
2x welding jar
Is there any other way or cards to make this matchup more favorable? Also is there a good article that talks about sideboarding against various decks as lantern control? A link would be much appreciated thank you!!
Mike
MODERN – LANTERN (aka Fateseal or Barbershop)
Primer – Subreddit – Facebook – Decklist – Gameplay
Thnkr's Content: Gameplay – Datasheet
Each eye sees a different possibility for tomorrow.
CWUBBCCCCCCCBGBGBGCCCCCCCGGURC
@crexalbo, Haven't had a chance to test it yet, but it's mainly for Tron, but also figured I'd bring it in against Jund. For Tron, it makes it so that we can go back to the old days of Needle on Karn, O-Stone, and Ugin, no worries about Ulamog and World Breaker any more (and stops those Nature's Claims). For Jund, they usually side out removal anyways, and that means that they have to use Pulse on Padeem if I've got a Leyline or Needle on Lili.
Lantern Control
(with videos)
Uc Tron
Netdecking explained
Netdecking explained, Part 2
On speculators and counterfeits
On Interaction
Every single competitive deck in existence is designed to limit the opponent's ability to interact in a meaningful way.
Record number of exclamation points on SCG homepage: 71 (6 January, 2018)
"I don't want to believe, I want to know."
-Carl Sagan
MODERN – LANTERN (aka Fateseal or Barbershop)
Primer – Subreddit – Facebook – Decklist – Gameplay
Thnkr's Content: Gameplay – Datasheet
Each eye sees a different possibility for tomorrow.
CWUBBCCCCCCCBGBGBGCCCCCCCGGURC
to be fair if we ever had a way to consistently cheat in Darksteel Forge we would have something banned very quickly
3x leyline of sanctity
2x grafdigger's cage
2x spellskite
2x surgical extraction
1x seal of primodium
1x natures claim
1x lost legacy
1x pithing needle
1x welding jar
1x flaying tendrils
Thinking of burn and maybe wanna add in sun droplet but maybe also wanna keep this for the tron matchup. What's the percentages of the field we would possible be playing against. Thanks for your reply everyone!
MODERN – LANTERN (aka Fateseal or Barbershop)
Primer – Subreddit – Facebook – Decklist – Gameplay
Thnkr's Content: Gameplay – Datasheet
Each eye sees a different possibility for tomorrow.
CWUBBCCCCCCCBGBGBGCCCCCCCGGURC
What is the tendrils for? I don't see any popular matchup where that is worthwhile. If you only have 1 jar in the board I assume you have at least one more main? Otherwise you need a 2nd jar. I personally don't think sun droplet is worthwhile either. It's only really useful against burn and your matchup against them isn't that terrible (assuming you have some collective brutalities main). I would rather add extra collective brutalities to the sideboard to bring in against burn as you can also bring them in against grixis and more combo decks.
IMHO you want to bring in all your discard against grixis or any counter based control deck. I'm amazed though that you seem to be so afraid of Tasigur. It's only really bad for you if they can drop it early and you can't find a bridge, otherwise it's next to useless. The recursion ability is almost never a problem because they will have a whole bunch of junk you can give them back. If they don't, you should just be milling then constantly to make sure you get some crap in there. I'm pretty sure I have NEVER lost a game to a Tasigur activation.
I could see myself with a list like that. Let us know how the test goes
@khazhrak:
Yes this list is great against any aggro deck. Infect, dredge, too, death shadow and with effectivly more bridges also abzan/jund
That's a sweet looking list. But really. Why fatal push? especially only one of them. What do you need it for? I can't even imagine you ever wanting to tutor for it since by the time your hand is empty you probably have enough artifacts in play to just get battle for the bridge. Also, as cool a Duskmantle is, why does this build need it any more than the GB version? It just seems like you are wasting sideboard slots by moving the ghost quarters to the sideboard.
My idea was having fatal push because the UB version is not as fast in getting hellbent as the BG version is. Therefore having cheap early interaction to not get smashed by a swiftspear or a goblin guide sounded nice. In the list above there are 7 spot removal. Maybe that is too many but UB is newer than BG and tuning has just begun.
UB cannot bring in nature's claim like BG can so stony silence hurts way more, duskmantle mitigates that a bit. And with our colours being UB it makes the activation of duskmantle that much easier.
It's not so much the activation that I worry about, but that it's their fastest threat, and I can't kill it with Collective Brutality. Between their counters, Kolaghan's Commands, and Cryptic Commands, it's rough getting a Bridge in play and keeping it there. Some lists run discard as well. Feel free to take a look at the replays and let me know if you see if I do anything wrong. I do think that milling them early without a Tasigur already out was no good, as that only lets them play Tasigur sooner.
Lantern Control
(with videos)
Uc Tron
Netdecking explained
Netdecking explained, Part 2
On speculators and counterfeits
On Interaction
Every single competitive deck in existence is designed to limit the opponent's ability to interact in a meaningful way.
Record number of exclamation points on SCG homepage: 71 (6 January, 2018)
"I don't want to believe, I want to know."
-Carl Sagan
How do you split Welding Jar vs Mishra's Bauble?
Usually you either use one or the other... sometimes none at all.
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/trading-post/details/805-w-underground-sea-h-revised-lands
MODERN – LANTERN (aka Fateseal or Barbershop)
Primer – Subreddit – Facebook – Decklist – Gameplay
Thnkr's Content: Gameplay – Datasheet
Each eye sees a different possibility for tomorrow.
CWUBBCCCCCCCBGBGBGCCCCCCCGGURC
That's true, only if we have more cards in library than they do and/or we have Academy Ruins. I actually have a few videos where I won with a Stony Silence on the board *because* I never milled myself. I have a match to upload from two days ago where, if I'd milled myself, I would have taken the risk that my opponent would have had more Stony Silence than I had answers, and I would have lost no matter what.
True, but if you look through my Affinity videos, you might find a couple where I milled Signal Pests and Extracted them. I was speaking from experience when I said what I said. I don't like to mill them post-side, due to those Grudges.
Yeah. The reason is that we need to have as many answers in our library as threats in theirs. That's the whole concept on which this deck is built - Have more answers to their threats than they have threats to our answers. The best Grixis Control players I've met will save their Scours to mill us or, after we've landed a Lantern, control our draws and/or use it for instant-speed draw. Even if we get Ruins online, if they're smart, they will save Scours to put our target right back. It acts as a Remand for them.
If the correct play is to not mill at all and let the Shredder/Bell sit there, then that's what I'll do. Sometimes the correct action is no action at all.
Lantern Control
(with videos)
Uc Tron
Netdecking explained
Netdecking explained, Part 2
On speculators and counterfeits
On Interaction
Every single competitive deck in existence is designed to limit the opponent's ability to interact in a meaningful way.
Record number of exclamation points on SCG homepage: 71 (6 January, 2018)
"I don't want to believe, I want to know."
-Carl Sagan
As crexalbo aptly said quite a few posts ago, it's an extremely situational action. I've found that, more often than not, the situation to do so without repercussions doesn't exist. That play style seems to be working out for me.
Lantern Control
(with videos)
Uc Tron
Netdecking explained
Netdecking explained, Part 2
On speculators and counterfeits
On Interaction
Every single competitive deck in existence is designed to limit the opponent's ability to interact in a meaningful way.
Record number of exclamation points on SCG homepage: 71 (6 January, 2018)
"I don't want to believe, I want to know."
-Carl Sagan
https://www.mtggoldfish.com/price/Coldsnap/Mishras Bauble#paper
[Primer] Dralnu Control/Reanimator BU
[Primer] Jolrael, Empress of Beasts GG
Nath Stax BG | Borborygmos Enraged RG | Ladies of Magic UGW | Aminatou Control UWB | Enduring Ideal Zedruu UWR | Momir Vig Combo UG
Modern
Restore Balance RWUG
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